Do we not own digital games?

According to americans, you don't own anything you buy; you only get a permission of the owner to use it.

>>375996709
You do not "own" a single piece of commercial software that has been released to market since the late 1980s. Software licensing became the norm, and that is all you own. Every EULA under the sun says that they have the right to revoke your license at any time.

Even with a disc you do not own the game. You own the right to play the game which can be revoked by seller by any of the reasons listed in the ToS which you agreed to as soon as you started up the game in your console.

Of course they can't destroy your copy of the game so even if for some reason a dev decides that costumers would no longer have access to their game you cans still play it.

>>375996709
>Even with a disc you do not own the game. You own the right to play the game
Disc broke, if I still have a right where do I get a new disc for free since I already paid?

Digital and online only content is licensed and not sold, so if the host stops allowing access (discontinued, banned, PT) you can sue them for stealing from you.

>>375996709

You never ever owned anything

Not even physical consoles or the physical carts, discs

They were never yours, the digital product is the same, you DO NOT OWN IT and IT CAN BE REVOKED ANY TIME.

>>375997301
*Can't

You don't own the games, even physical. You own a "license" to the game, physically it's just a license for that specific physical copy. The difference is that if the company you paid money to goes under for a digital copy, or if your account gets banned for any reason, you lose everything. Think of it like a massive flood except not a single thing can be salvaged.

You don't technically own your physical games either, it's just harder for companies to fuck you out of them

>>375997358
The right to play a physical game has never been revoked though.

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>>375997358

>>375997290
You don't, but that's why making copies isn't illegal unless you distribute them.

>>375997358
>>375997380
this desu senpai

>>375997469
it may theoretically happen though

>>375997469

You better download this fucking update you stupid goy or you can't use your system. Oh you wanted to play that game well too fucking bad its been removed and just for complaining i'm going to brick your console.

I'll see you in court fagget.

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>>375997469
Yet.

>>375997498
Don't most ToS explicitly disallow archival copies now?

>pretty much this >>375997301
In some cases where digital licensing is sold but taken off the market later on (Castle of Illusion, MvC2 HD, JJBA HD, Duke Nukem 3D megaton edition Steam), the company that owns that product, or 'did' own that product is forbidden by law to revoke access to it unless terms and conditions are broken or if the company issues full refunds.
source: im an autistic student that likes law and hentai

>>375997556
You're welcome to research, develop and manufacture your own console if you don't like it, commie.

>>375997469

The guy made the jailbreak for playstation had to send all his playstation games, consoles and PC back to Sony. So yes, through court order everything can be taken back.

>>375997593
Don't know, I don't read them and I don't think anyone ever does.

>>375997301
What about paragraph in every tos about them having the right to discontinue the service at any time.

>>375996709
If you "buy" something, you "buy" special rights.

Not every time you "buy" all rights. For digital games you only buy the right to play the game. The right to sell/modify/etc. are not included.

If you buy a stone for example, you can do with the stone what you want. I said stone, because If you buy a gun for example you don't have the right to sell the gun to any person you want. Or If you "buy" your ID card, you don't have the right to sell or modify your ID card.

>>375997764

That too, but that's only for online. Nintendo, for example, could stop you from playing offline too for cheating in a game if they really wanted to screw you.

>>375997839

Stone is property of the owner of the land you never owned that stone, removing that stone is stealing and because you were illegally trespassing on private land that's a felony.

>>375997685
Not that anon, but listen pal, I love capitalism, I would shed my blood for it. But we are transitioning/living in a corporatocratic world which is an aberration and a corruption of true capitalism.

In real capitalism there's actual competition, in a corporatocratic society there's corporations who snuff out competition, bleed out the consumers and divide amongst themselves the market.

>>375997843
Yeah, seeing how PS3 stopped production, soon you wont be able to play your games anyway.
Just as with psx and ps2.

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>>375997358
Everything in life is ephemeral you never really own anything.

>>375998074

True, you don't even own your life, its illegal to kill yourself.

>>375998073
Well, not online play once the servers are down. I doubt Sony will remove access to already downloaded games offline as it would butcher their already strained PR.

>>375998028
In real capitalism people who get ahead try to snuff out their competition. In fake capitalism the state (((regulates))) competition.

Well if they wanna come over here and fight me so they delete the games I have saved on my machines I have prepared several clever booby-traps and hidden them along the path to my room.

>>375998074
It must be so satisfying to wipe that shit away

Anyone who pays for digital games is pathetic.

When you purchase a digital game, you're buying a license stating you're allowed to download games from the servers of the service from which you bought the game (and no other, which is why you don't buy a game on PS4 and get it on xbone, for example), and can play the game so long as you abide by the rules set forth in the ToS/EULA you agreed to when making an account for said service (ingame bans are something else entirely).

Yes, if the services went down, you'd lose access. You can't access the PSN on PSPs in most of the world, anymore, meaning if you bought PSP games, and have no vita, all those games are gone, never able to be played again, at least, the copies you bought.

People always say "there would be tons of shouting and riots!" but the PSP situation is an excellent example of how it will actually go. the wii/DS servers were another one. Granted you didn't lose access to the entire game systems of things like mario kart wii/ds or what have you, you can't play them online without going through alternative methods to connect to fan servers.

You don't "own" it in the sense that you can do whatever you want to it. You don't even own it to a point where you can play it whenever you want, but physical games are very similar nowadays, very often you're buying the physical disc with a base amount of media on it, and as games get larger and larger, the amount of media on that disc is smaller and smaller to keep costs low, as they ship core, sometimes critical updates to be distributed digitally. Tony Hawks Pro Skater 5 is an excellent example. The game you get on disc is just a handful of gig (8 gigs I think) and contains only the intro to the game, and the tutorial, which is horrendously buggy. To play the rest of the game you paid full price for, you had to download the day 1 update digitally.

It's insane. But it's already happened, and no one complained as it was happening, and now it's too late.

>>375998486
actual good games which have physical copy work just fine tho without any updates

>>375998248
There needs to be some regulation, a completely free market is nothing but a fevered dream, in reality you wouldn't even be able to trust that the medicine you buy isn't just water with colorants and artificial flavor.

The key is some regulation, lots of regulation is actually a mark of a corporatocracy because it makes it impossible for competitors to enter a market.

Nah you wont be able to download it from their site. There's nothing stopping you from playing the games you've already got.

>>375998598
how long will that last though, is the question. I mean, PC is a great example, you don't find physical copies of games anymore. I literally cannot think of the last time I saw a non-shovelware title physical in a store, that didn't say ****box contains code for steam download**** on it. PS4, I went and bought prey a few hours ago and it has a pretty sizable first day patch, and plays just as shit as the demo did without it. Say that's my fault for getting it on PS4 but I wasn't gonna risk it being shit like dishonored 2.

>>375998706
dunno, if shit will go down, I have infinity backlog.
but yeah PC and Steam especially is source of this problem. Steam killed physical media single-handedly. Fuck it.
Just remember how good PC game boxes were before this.
Sure patches and buggy releases happened all the time, but still.
Shit is sad.

>>375998856
>I have infinity backlog.
Until your drive fails.

>>375999076
>implying I play only on PC
I have shitload of roms in varios flashcards (SD2SNES, GBA, DS, PC-Engine, MegaEverdrive, Everdrive 64) + roms/games on hacked consoles - Xbox, PSP, Wii + physical releases of 7-8 gen games + shitload of old PC jewel discs.
So even if I'll be cut from the net completely, and for example PS4/Wii U get updated to stop playing physical games - I'll still have enough stuff to keep going for decades.

>>375996709
On PS3 you own every digital you have even after refund it.

I hate that everything is tied to your account. Purchases and online play should be separate, One shouldn't suffer because of the other.
If you get banned online for some silly shit you lose all access to everything I've purchased and thats insane.

>>376000507
What, care to elaborate on that?

>>376000782
don't get banned. its pretty easy to not get banned.

>>376001067
Yeah, I know, Ive been playing online for like 17 years and I've never been banned or even warned.
But the thought is always there, back in my head. The fear of being banned for some silly shit. Saying something stupid online in the heat of the moment. Making swastikas with bullet holes. Having a questionable picture of Hitler as your avatar. Or just putting the 14 words in your profile description.
Bam! and suddenly, you are banned.

>>376000979
On PS3 Sony cannot delete the game or stop your accessing psn after you refund the game. So it's eternally yours.

>>375999076
It's called backups.

Anytime you buy any type of IP you don't make a full purchase, as that would imply the right to reproduction. This isn't unique to games, it applies to all IP.

This licence is usually lifetime, but bound by certain terms of use. For most IP, those TOS are hard to violate for a consumer. In games, particulary multiplayer games, those TOS may include good conduct. If violated, the licence may be revoked. The issuer still needs good cause to do so, or they'd be open to fraud lawsuits.

>>376001596
Can you still re download it though? Cant they just remove it from you download history?

>>375997021
>Every EULA under the sun says that they have the right to revoke your license at any time.
IF you break the EULA and even then the EULA isn't law so it often gets ignored by courts.

>>375997290
Bit of a long story here... But a friend of mine was threatened by an ISP, then late threatened by some music company that he'd be taken to court for downloading music illegally.

This friend comes from a family of lawyers so they pretty much sent a "threat" legal document back to the company stating that he had already paid for the music (they had no proof, but said if the matter went to court, the receipts for the items would be found and presented as evidence) and downloading it via peer to peer transfer wasn't illegal. They never heard anything more on the matter