Why do ex-TF2 pros dislike Overwatch so much? I just watched

tf2 players in general are colossal nostalgiafags with a severe case of "it came after my game so it sucks dick". they're not really the most grounded or trustworthy people in any case.

Can you link that interview?

>>375496050
because it's shallow as fuck and full of aggravating MMO mechanics like stuns and AoEs that don't belong in an FPS

>>375496371
https://youtu.be/R8Dj12swWYE?t=7640

2:07:20

The movespeed is way too low because consoles and there's little room for creativity.

>>375496050
I feel so bad for all old TF2 players who were forced to jump into Overwatch.. I mean theres really no fucking other choice. They must play it even if they dont like it unless they want to start actually working.

>>375497013
https://youtu.be/R8Dj12swWYE?t=7838

>we had arguably the best medic from TF2, pure
>we had clockwork, who everyone regarded as the best scout player

Is this true TF2 bros?

the highest level strat in the game is "fall back and group up. compared to games like quake or tfc the movement in tf2 was pretty basic but you still had options and could be creative. any advanced movements in tf2 were gimped in OW, assigned a button and given a cooldown. once you learn to aim there is nothing left to get better at in OW.

OW is TF2 for retards. Much like TF2 is Quake for retards.

>>375497331
TF2 plays very differently than Quake.

One is 1on1 item control game and one is objective team based game.

>>375496050
Salty that Valve took the best part of a fucking decade to add competitive to TF2 and now it's dead

>>375497584
Yea sure competitive mode and lootboxes fix everything?

Go kill yourself.

Because it is.

TF2 had gameplay mechanics and required a decent amount of skill. Overwatch has no gameplay mechanics and requires barely any skill. There are barely any characters in OW that actually require precise aim and only one of them has been consistently relevant in the meta. Ults are the biggest offender, though. There's also just the anger they have against Valve. You know how when you call a game shit, people always ask for rank and shit? This is them doing that and then saying the game is shit to try and get that point across. If Valve wasn't a piece of fucking shit and cared about comp TF2 and put money into it they would go back to TF2 in an instant.

OW bores the shit out of me and honestly whenever I play it these days I just want to meme and run Torb. I can't take it seriously and it's just not fun if I'm not shitting on people as Torb.
>>375497307
>>we had arguably the best medic from TF2, pure
Debatable.
>>we had clockwork, who everyone regarded as the best scout player
Yes. He played like a bot for the last few seasons he played and still shit on everyone.
>>375497584
They don't give a shit about TF2 MM, no one does, they fucked up and it's trash. What they are salty about is Valve not supporting them or even the base game. TF2 has 5 (FIVE) fucking devs working on it while the rest fuck off to VR shit. Also the game still has the same numbers.

>>375497584
It still boggles my mind that Valve have two wildly popular competitive scenes in CS:GO and Dota 2, yet they still aren't really trying to capitalize on that in TF2.

Shouldn't they see a competitive TF2 scene as an avenue for growth? I'm sure they want to keep the game "casual" but striking a balance between casual and competitive is not that hard.

I think we can all agree that OW is pushing this diversity stuff but why is it that the biggest tournament (OW World Cup) is for national teams only? Isn't that some contradiction?

>>375497667
Are you fucking retarded? Learn to read the thread, OP asked why ex-TF2 pros are salty Overwatch is better

What the fuck do lootboxes have to do with anything you mongoloid?

>>375497694
>Ults are the biggest offender, though
Forgot to add to this, but TF2 had Ubers, which usually resulted in slower gameplay. Now imagine having 12 ubers at the same time instead of 2. Also keep in mind that Ults don't require much outside of some minor positioning and pressing Q at the right time, whereas ubers could be stopped, stalled, or avoided.

It's just boring as fuck that the game devolves to pressing Q. Also it's only a matter of time before the NA scene dies because the Koreans are shitting on all the other teams. OW will become Korean only outside of NA only events.

>>375497694
This guy knows it all. It's really sad how quickly TF2 turned into complete shitfest.

>>375497908
>It's just boring as fuck that the game devolves to pressing Q
Are you guys just bad?

>>375497993
Who cares if using ults effectively depends on timings and positions. It's still way less involved than anything in TF2.

>>375498092
There's also plenty of gameplay around the ults. If you only perform well when your ult is charged you're probably just not good at the game.

>>375497908
forcing the uber or better yet killing the medic (and therefore the uber) added a lot of meta to tf2 matches giving it depth

it is a pain in the ass but it's also what drives a push or decides the winner

>>375497993
I don't even need Q, I just play Pharah and literally shit on everyone

>>375497908
no offense, but there's literally heroes in ow that can eat or block ultimates completely, so you can't just say 'press q to win' in any rank below diamond almost

some fights can be decides by group ults, but more often than not a single ult will get shut down

there's hardly any established pro teams yet, one of the best ones is korean, the other are euro white dudes

ow's 'competitive' era if it has one will be decided when they release that overwatch league thing they're trying to do

with that defending aside, it can absolutely be an aids game, it is shitty as hell to solo at times, it's unbelievable how bad some people can be, you can even watch streams of gm-top 500 players and see one team basically crush the other

although most of it seems to be communication, it's amazing how badly some people communicate at higher ranks, and the best is when people complain about their team not talking yet they don't say a single fucking word either

>>375498151
>There's also plenty of gameplay around the ults
And all of that takes less skill and knowledge than TF2. That's the point you fucking moron.

>>375498235
There's much more going on in Overwatch at any given moment than there is in TF2 though

>>375497908
>Also it's only a matter of time before the NA scene dies because the Koreans are shitting on all the other teams. OW will become Korean only outside of NA only events.
It would be great if Korea dominated and it negatively affects viewership.

It doesn't seem to have stopped mobas from being wildly popular but one can hope.

>>375498309
Yes it's a complete clusterfuck game

>>375496050
I think overwatch is a worthy team based shooter for tf2 fans to move on to, but it will never be as good as peak tf2. The overwatch pros ramp this difference way up because obviously they care about tf2 so much while overwatch is seen as the replacement.

>>375498842
ex-tf2 pros, i mean

>>375496050
Maybe not the same reasons as a lot of other people, but I think another point is Overwatch's general presentation and tone. It's an annoyingly saccharine game, where everyone is pretty one-note and heroic because we're told they are. The character writing is flat and banter between the classes is virtually non-existent. You hear the same two or three fucking tradeoffs of dialouge every time, and again it's this clean, kid friendly prattling. Sprays are all pre made and sanitized too.

Compare this to TF2- the game knew it was a game all about killing each other, and the characters were all a bunch of psychopaths with outlandish, erratic personalities with a wealth of character in voice lines, animations, and their general loadouts. TF2 played into the nature of the combat by pushing rivalries, dominations, slaughtering the losers, and all the smack talk. Plus the freedom to make your spray whatever you wanted contributed to the anarchy when you're plastering dickgirls all over walls.

And yes, TF2 was M while Overwatch is T so I know there are limitations, but that's kind of the problem. TF2 embraced the nature of being a shooter and the violent, aggressive impulses that we go to indulge when we play FPS. Overwatch on the other hand seems to try really hard to ignore or censor anything mean spirited in killing people online and try to paint itself as the next Disney.

Didn't stop me from playing OW for a while, but it's something I still find grating every time I get some stupid exchange between Reaper and Winston or the like.

>>375496050
>>375497013
That's steel, a banned CSGO pro, and the only reason he stopped playing OW is because he's trash and gets triggered to the point of *autistic screeching* when he loses.

Why are you spreading lies, TF2 pro's prefer OW

I like some things in TF2 but OverWatch is just a better game in general. Both to play and as a spectator.

>>375496626
>full of aggravating MMO mechanics like stuns

This is my biggest beef with the game.

>>375499012
>this much fan headcanon
You can't be fucking serious.

TF2
>better game
>zero prize money
>no support from valve

OW
>decent game
>good prize money
>good support from blizz

I'm happy to see players like a_seagull, Harbleu, TviQ, Zebbosai, Knoxx, Mangachu, Zappis, Hymzi, and a TON of other ex TF2 players that I've missed actually get some money and recognition for doing what they do. Valve didn't give a shit about competitive and the TF2 community carried the game on it's back (WITH ITS OWN MONEY) for TEN FUCKING YEARS

200% mad.

>>375496050
>all his ex-TF2 teammates think OW is shit compared to TF2 and they only play OW for the cash-grab
there you go

>>375499191
cool downs on movement abilities will forever be the biggest con for me
pair it up with unlimited ammo so its always mindless spam

>>375499165
>because he's trash
yea he said that along with blizzard's opinion of him made him quit. you seem uninformed

You can master OW in less than 50h. Way less if you only pick the classes that are actual useful.
You can be the best player in the world and still easily lose if you're in a mediocre team playing against a good one.
Personal skill in this game means fuckall.

>>375498309
That's the same argument people use to defend HL over 6s and still even many top HL players admit 6s is more skillful than HL.

"shit going on" is not the same thing as "skillful things going on". McCree pressing Q to use his aimbot is not skill.

>>375499262
Literally where?

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>>375496050

1st of all, (you). That said, i'll bite anyway.

>become good at game that requires a lot of skill
>try another game
>you lose not because people are outplaying you, but because they play braindead heros (some of which are meta)

>>375499325
Anytime Harb mentions TF2 he says he enjoyed but wouldn't go back, but that's a load of shit. If TF2 had the same money in it he would jump ship right back. Playing le Hookman and Zarya all day would eat me alive inside, especially if I used to main soldier and medic. The gameplay is night and day

I wish OW was just more fun. They are pushing this competitive meme so hard and it's just not a very good competitive game. I'd rather they went the TF2 route and made it more of a "party game with some competitiveness in there".

My laptop can't run OW, somehow it manages TF2 flawlessly.

Ok... More than that, the number of heroes makes me kind of intimidated to learn them all, just like I couldn't pick up DOTA 2 or League because it's tough for somebody to say they lock down a particular choice.

Youtube shekels. Nobody watches TF2 videos anymore, so they switch to the latest meme game so they can afford their catgirl hentai commissions.

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>>375496050
>ex-TF2 pros

>>375500975
Don't worry, you are only allowed to play like 4 of them anyways because the game is so badly balanced.

>>375496050
it rewards players for being mediocre with crutches

>>375501087

Yeah, and that was the problem. If I found a hero that I liked if I kept playing it probably wouldn't have been meta enough for me to enjoy playing because I'd have a boatload of people trying to make me feel otherwise.

>>375497908
ubers are countered by the pyros right click

>>375496050
I mean, they're not wrong, but it's not like TF2 isn't shit in its own way.

But anon, both games fucking suck.

>>375499892
This is my biggest problem with OW. You are at the mercy of your team in so many situations. This also fucks up placements big time. I did placements a few days ago at about level 37 and stomped until the 6th game, when I was matched with diamonds and some masters. My team just fought and yelled at each other and we lose despite 2 of us (Zarya and Soldier) keeping it from being a total steamroll. Then it starts matching me with golds and some silvers, which do NOT want to cooperate apparently. I placed 2200s and right now I'm 2623 climbing fairly steadily. Platinum has some better teamwork SOMETIMES but people are so pissy. We wanted a dive comp, so we asked our Rein to play a Winston, so he switches to Winston and jumps to his death over and over the whole match.

Does Star hate Overwatch?

Imagine being forced to play the same fucking shit game all day while you preached how this is better than TF2.

And then you realize it's something even worse.

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>>375499165
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsH0ZXWeZZs

You can't ad hominem everyone. TF2 pros prefer the game that actually takes skill, and are only in OW for the money. They freely bitch out how shallow OW is at any opportunity.

Except Muma. He's in OW because he can't roll out and Reinhardt is much easier

>>375497694
thats exactly it, we're all extremely pissed valve fucked us on the competitive.

They're both shit games so who cares?

>>375501908
TF2 is shit in ways not related to gameplay that can be muted or modded out. OW can't even be modded.

>Does Star hate Overwatch?

Judging by how fucking dead his voice is in every stream, yes. He does this as a job now. He's sick of TF2 too, though.

>>375496050
But that's wrong. Almost every ex-TF2 pro has made the switch and love the game.

>>375502341
Ster likes Overwatch when it's actually good, so every fifth game. Ster also hates everything, he's a very grumpy guy.

>>375502341
meant to quote in >>375502519

Overwatch is to shooters what WoW was to MMOs. An incredibly simple, easy to take up game that caters to people who are new to the genre, but ultimately provides very little to those already familiar with it.

It doesn't do anything well enough to stand out.
>The gunplay is basic
>The movement options are basic for 99% of the cast
>The maps are simple rooms, corridors and open areas, for the most part, very few of them have any nuance and advanced strategies beyond "ok, let's hold them at the chokepoint now"

There is almost no individuality, all heroes are essentially shit by themselves, in that there's always going to be a hard counter that you won't be able to comfortably deal with, no matter how good you are.
If you take a look at something like Quake, for instance - weapons have counters, a railgun will always be better at range than a shotgun for instance, but this is alleviated by the fact that a player can acquire ALL weapons, meaning that you're going pick your fights, get certain weapons and swap weapons mid-combat in order to match their arsenal and so on. Even this little thing alone ensure that there's just so much potential depth to every encounter, Overwatch has none of that, even at the highest levels of play.

>>375501703
I really like playing Sombra, as she is kind of like an offensive support character. But picking her makes your team hate you because her relative skill floor is too high for her to be meta. If you do well, they'll quiet down, but they'll never say "Sombra was a good choice after all". And, given the nature of the game, she really isn't - something else would likely bring more to the table.

>>375496050
Both modern TF2 and Oyveywatch are fucking trash, garbage game full of trash, garbage players.

>>375502547
dude what, almost every tf2 pro has said they would go back to tf2 if it had the same popularity and support as overwatch does.

>>375502547
>Almost every ex-TF2 pro has made the switc
Not almost every, just some, for financial reasons
>and love the game
fucking lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsH0ZXWeZZs

>>375496050
What are you talking about? Tons of the top players in overwatch are the fucking top people from tf2. Seagull for example and that guy that sucked dicks.

>>375502735
nothing you said contradicts the OP

>>375502586
>Overwatch is to shooters what WoW was to MMOs.

Killing off a genre?

honestly what i love the most is how humbling overwatch has been for some of the top tf2 players

most of them arent as good as they thought they were. especially ruwin, i love seeing that little faggot get his ass kicked by people better than him constantly

alright bois,

I may not have the time/luck to get both before the event ends, so:

>Blackwatch Genji
or
>Chief Engineer Lindholm
?

>>375502845
I don't think Overwatch will be even close to the financial success that WoW was, and probably won't last half as long as WoW, even though that's not saying much.

>>375496626
>aoe
>stun
>dont belong in fps
Sandman
madmilk
jarate
every explosive weapon and their aoe
shield
aoe heal
buff from soldier

How retarted are you ? Saying that something "belongs" to one genre is the most retarted fuckshit i've ever read on this board
Kill yourself please

>>375497908
>ults can't be stopped, stalled or avoided
Now I know you're retarded

>>375503082
sandman was banned for years until very recent retarded changes

as was madmilk

as was 90% of the unlocks

you're actually retarded and have never played comp tf2 in your life

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>>375497694
>Scout, Soldier, Pyro, Engineer, Heavy, Demo require very little aim skill to be effective.
>Spy backstab still broken as fuck, never been fixed.
>Advanced manoeuvrability is exclusive to Soldier rocket jumping. Beyond that its Demo sticky jumping once and scout having a double jump.
>Heavy is slow and monotonous at best.
>Sniper takes aim skill but is useless beyond that.
>No stand of breaker mechanics outside of uber/kritz which is poor.
>Positioning hardly ever matters.
I could go on but fuck that. I played the game for years and even I can say its bland in comparison to Overwatch as well as buggier despite having a decade over Overwatch to fix its shit out. The Valve fanboys need to just stop getting mad that something eventually came along to wrestle the arena shooter crown of TF2's head.

>>375503209
And now even valve got it that adding those items gives variety to all games.
You're a fucking nostalgia fag that can't get over the fact his fav game changed in a good way you can't comprehend

>>375503316
>its bland in comparison to Overwatch
Confirmed for being a sub-Masters scrub. The ladder in Overwatch is the blandest, most stale shit I've ever experienced, every match is nearly identical.

>>375502661
>Clockwork
Haven't watched the interview, but I'd wager the reason this guy is salty about the OW scene compared to TF2 is that he outright has had way less success in OW.

>can't hack it on NRG
>gets benched
>now on a tier 3 NA team going nowhere

I'd be longing for the TF2 glory days too.

>>375496626
>the problem is stuns
No the problem is no fucking cleanses

Hades is incredibly more mechanically effective than reaper yet he can be cleansed so hes literally ass.

Reaper cant into mechanics so hes ass even without cleanses.

>>375503440
valve doesnt even understand why 6v6 works so well

they know fuckall about their own game, and them wanting unlocks and a different format than 6v6 is the reason why the scene never amounted to anything.

their fanbase figured out what took the most mechanical skill very early on, and valve refused.

>>375496050
For several reasons.
>No community made content.
>Maps are fucking horrible.
>Little advanced movement hurts the skill cap.
>Everyone moving at the same speed hurts the skill cap. Especially with ults.
>Stunfest.

>>375497908
>Cant be stopped.
Genji reflect, Dva Matrix, Zenyatta transcendance, Lucio ult as well as a whole host of other abilities that can cancel or nulify enemy ults.

>Stalled
It's called playing better. yes, eventually the enemy team will have ults but so will you and the better team will have their ults faster and be able to use them more.

>Avoided
Nearly every hero in OW has something to combat getting caught out. Whether it's manoeuvrability, an ability, an ult or even a team mate using their ability to save you.

Your entire argument makes you sound like an inane fan boy who hasn't even touched OW. It's so incredibly different from what you are describing.

>>375500056
You just used literally the worst ult in the game as a example way too show you don't play the game or know what your talking about

>>375502634
Take your meds

>>375503764
Also adding to this.
>You can't stop a ult from happening because it persist even after death unless they switch heroes. So the meta will always involve those characters that can eat ults.
>You can't carry because the skill cap is low for most heroes mechanically. This may seem like a good thing because "TEAM GAME LEL XD" but it's not because all random matchmaking has it's fair share of bad team placements.

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>>375498235
>And all of that takes less skill and knowledge than TF2.

Nine characters. Three of which have hitscan spread weapons, two have explosive based weapons that is spammable, a fire based attacker and an instant kill mechanic that is bugged after ten years of patches. Oh, and manoeuvrability beyond WASD and jumping is limited to two of those characters.

>>375496050
>OW is shit compared to TF2 and they only play OW for the cash-grab

Well, he's not wrong.

>>375499012
whoa there buddy. even bismuth doesnt have so many edges

>>375504035
You can stop ult from happening you fucking shitter

>>375496050
Because TF2 is fucking dead. The only updates we've got are hats and shitty cosmetics.

>>375503082
>explosives are aoe

>>375504149
It's not really edgy anon. Tf2's lore and tone mirror the gameplay of itself while OW tries to have it's lore seperate from the gameplay as a pixar fest. The problem is that in game allot of the characters seem EXTREMELY sociopathic.
Tracer has no problem with blowing Winston's brains out and just spouts "cheers love the cavaleries here!" Like she just took down Reaper.

Tf2 characters are lunatics and the game knows this. A sane person isn't going to detonate a bomb under his feet while pushing a bomb into a pit containing nothing but barrels or gravel.

>>375503523
6v6 two scouts soldier demo medic every game on the same maps we've been playing for ten years!

-or-

6v6 with 26 characters each with their own unique abilities and ultimates which can be switched up to suit fighting the enemy effectively on new and unique maps in a game thats only been out a year. Oh, and new characters, maps and events are being released as time goes by.

Yup, you're sure right anon.
Also, I've been to mid masters.
Confirmed for having never played the game.

>>375504081
Compare that to OW. Which has several characters with hitscan, a giant gorrilla that's basically Pyro, several explosive based classes that are even more spammable because everyone has infinite ammo and reloads their entire clip at the same time, and everyone in the game has a uber with all the movement options having laughably low depth to them outside of strategy.

>>375504401
Are you trying to say junkrat is sane with your last part there though

>>375503082
splash damage from projectiles isn't the same thing as radiating-from-the-player no falloff AoE damage, you fucking moron

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My biggest problem with Overwatch is that nearly every character only has one weapon with infinite ammo. It really encourages spamming down hallways and chokepoints.

>>375504552
Tell me what's Reinhardt hogs McGee's torbs anas syms bastion mei uber or mobility?

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>>375496050
Don't a good bit of the top NA teams have at least 1 ex-TF2 pro?

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>>375503316
>its bland in comparison to Overwatch
>>375503604
WATCH THE INTERVIEW BEFORE POSTING, DUMB FUCK. THIS IS HIS OPINION IN THE BETA

>>375504643
What does this in OW?

>>375504663
Mine is no fall damage. What a dumb decision.

>>375504542
>26 characters
>in mid-masters

Sure you have, buddy. Are you an ESEA champion, as well?

>>375504671
>Reinhardt.
>Earthshatter that causes a large ass stun in a cone infront of him. His mobility is a uninteresting charge that can't even be used for trimping.
>Hogs ultimate is pressing Q and having a minigun that causes a ton of knockback. Mobility is arguably a hook.
>Mcgee's ultimate is pressing Q, marking several characters for death if they're in his sight line, and then instant killing them unless something blocks the bullets. Mobility is a roll.
>Torb's ult upgrades his turret to level 3 and he doesn't have a mobility.
>Ana puts her ally on steriods and has a glide.
>Sym doesn't have a mobility and two ults. One a tele and the other a shield generator.
>Bastion doesn't have mobility unless you count blast jumping with his tank ultimate.
>Mei has her icewall and a ultimate that freezes anyone near a radius once she lays down her robot.
Is that all you wanted to know? Because I honestly don't know why any of that is relevant.

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>>375504552
>Still comparing uber to ultimates.

Except those hit scans require actual aim as well as involving spread, headshot mechanics outside of snipers and positioning.

Winston does marginally less damage than a Pyro and his kills are based around his ability to manoeuvre, flank and position as well as syncing up with his team.

There are two explosion based classes out of 26 heroes compares to two explosion based classes out of 9. On top of that, a six v six in Overwatch will feature one to none of these on average match to match where as a TF2 6v6 usually has three of them because of how effective and easy to use they are

>Ults
>No strategy
Yeah, trying going into a match with that mentality. You can tell me what bronze is like.

>>375505065u
>,actually implying mcrees ultimate or roll are good
Thanks for proving you haven't played mate

>>375505231
>my game is so badly balanced 90% of the roster is unviable at any given time

You sure showed him bucko!

>>375496050

.>TF2 Pros

lmao

>>375505109
>Except those hit scans require actual aim
Everyone moves at the exact same speed and movement abilities are very predictable as to where they're going.
>Involving spread.
You mean like weapons in tf2?
>Headshot mechanics
You mean like the sniper and the ambassador? besides crits are cancer in tf2 so crit on headshot for everyclass would just be pure stupidity that would be impossible to balance.
>Positioning.
Your acting like OW somehow invented this concept. You need positioning in funny fort fellas 2 just as much as you need it in OW for the sake of good flanking routes and any other tactical advantage positioning would give you in Overkek you nigger.
>Winston does marginally less damage than a Pyro and his kills are based around his ability to manoeuvre, flank and position as well as syncing up with his team.
And somehow Pyro is considered fucking useless in comp because everything he does can be done better by other classes due to Valve not knowing how to balance him.
Also Pyro can't just run straight at a enemy with half a brain cell and expect a kill, he needs to flank around to get that close in the first place or ambush the enemy. And he can also position and sync up with his team to become even more effective because this isn't something exclusive to OW.
>There are two explosion based classes out of 26 heroes compares to two explosion based classes out of 9.
And they're still pure cancer due to no damage falloff and reloading their entire clip at once.
>On top of that, a six v six in Overwatch will feature one to none of these on average match to match where as a TF2 6v6 usually has three of them because of how effective and easy to use they are
Or maybe it's because their are characters that are have a giant fuck off shield or a defense matrix that is very anti-spam when it's easier to just use characters that don't rely on spam due to how many abilities can counter it without using ults.

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>>375505048
>I made an assumption and was wrong. Better insult him with sarcasm!
>I can't see the viability in each hero in given situations.
Spoken like a true silver.

>MFW when communicating and waiting for the perfect moment to bust out my Sombra ult in perfect unison with a perfectly placed Dva and Zarya ult to wipe the entire enemy and advance from Diamond into Masters.

Compare that to "I have uber. So Ill use it on Demo to push for a short while. No, wait, the enemy Pyro right clicked a few times and completely negated it all"
Fucking riveting stuff son!

>>375505231
>>,actually implying mcrees ultimate or roll are good
I never said it was good you stupid nigger. I just said what it was.

>>375496050
It's got a low skill ceiling. It's no surprise professional players don't want play casual games where their skill is blunted.

>>375505554
>your

Post discarded

>>375505554
>Everyone moves at the exact same speed
Jesus you just keep making yourself out too be wrong there are three movement speeds
Tracer lucio Genji stealth sombra spiriting solider
Rest of the cast
MCree Zen Bastion hog being the slowest.
On top of everyones movement options all the environmental cover and barriers.


>And they're still pure cancer due to no damage falloff and reloading their entire clip at once.
Are you saying you can't dodge time delayed bombs thats only move at 1m pre fucking second? If you can't do that how the fuck did you play tf2?

>>375505109
>>Ults
>>No strategy
When you compare that to a uber and how many things can go wrong with it, yes it does have no strategy.
Also just to add on to all this shit, your game features a hard counter system. Tf2 has a soft counter system.

>>375502389
lel i remember sideshow trying his hardest to defend OW a month after it came out

>You can only play a tiny portion of the roster otherwise people will start throwing the game just because you aren't playing "on meta"
That's about when I gave up with OW comp. Same reason I don't like 6's, to be fair. I just don't like modes/metas that cut out large portions of the games options. And no, telling me that once every 1000 years on specific maps someone might offclass to a different class for 15 minutes does not mean that 6's has class variety.

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>>375505959
I know you're just a shit posting faggot but that's wrong right now is considered "the golden age" because every single team comp is viable from triple dps triple tank all the way to 4 dps dps 1 tank 1 dps even at diamond and masters level.

>>375505732
>Tracer lucio Genji
Tracer and Genji move so slow that it's hardly fucking noticeable. And Lucio is also fairly slow without his speed boost. So if you've ever played Tf2 before hitting them just isn't a problem.
>stealth Sombra
As soon as she's out of stealth she goes back to being slow.
>Sprinting soldier
That can't attack while sprinting and again, isn't moving that fast compared to say, a Scout in tf2. It's still fairly simple.
>Mcree zen bastioon hog are the slowest.
Doesn't the game have EVERYONE move at the same pace? I'm not even meming. Last I checked all the movement stats for each character were exactly the same.
>Everyone's movement options
Which is the only reason why anything takes in a slight amount of skill to hit in the slightest. Not to mention these abilities are on a cooldown so they use them once, then you use them and after that it just comes down to who can aim better.

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>>375502889
Gengu. Torb is shit. Also not getting the stuff I want, so I'm goldbuying Hatmercy and Selfie.VA.

>>375506082
>Doesn't the game have EVERYONE move at the same pace? I'm not even meming.
No Zen mcree bastion are literally slower.

>>375505554
>Mixing gradual weapon spread up with wide spread shotguns
>Moving ever so slightly faster makes them harder to hit some how!
>Still brings up sniper despite mentioning that in the previous post.
>Soldier rocket jumping ever so slightly from the left or right counts as flanking.
>Implying having no dmg fall off in a game with multiple shields, barriers, counters is a bad thing on top of multiple characters having 300+ health and much wide open maps.
>"These characters are pure cancer!"
>"Those exact same characters are not cancer because of how useless they are!"

Holy shit you are fucking terrible at this. You literally contradicted yourself one gibbering point after another. At least you can admit Valve can't balance their game though.

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>>375506049
>every single team comp is viable
>in a rock, paper, scissors holy trinity FPS MOBA

>>375506147
Well last time I saw movement stats everyone went slow as shit.
And even if they are slower, the characters themselves are still fairly slow on their own without those kinds of comparisons. So it's really just not hard to hit them, especially when nobody in this game can airstrafe.
That being said I would absolutely love it if OW got a market gardener type hero.
May even get me to go back to the game but right now it's just uninteresting.
Also hard counter system.

>>375505732
>spiriting solider
You can't conduct actions while "spiriting".

>>375506315
You can literally cancel it instantly that is how solider has rocket umps

>>375506049
>every single team comp is viable
OH MY FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCK HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>375505791
>Soft counters
Not even close but I'll bite
A counter system that every good player ignores for the standard scouts, soldiers demo and medic.

Also, plenty can go wrong with ults. There are a thousand ways an ult can be countered or nullified in OW if you are good enough.

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Here is current Overwatch pro seagull playing HL2DM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFVglShDUAA

Here he is playing TF2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19LZzAD5ZeI

Now here he is playing Overwatch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VShuf4AqWQ

Why the fuck would any pro with a history of playing FPS games like Overwatch? Mechanically as an FPS it is a console game through and through. It is slow. Maps are claustrophobic. Map design in general is really uninspired, quite a few maps lack verticality unless you have an ability to gain the high ground.

It doesn't surprise me at all that pros see Overwatch for what it is. Behind all the polish and the rule34 it's quite a boring entry as a team-based shooter.

>>375503082
I'm pretty sure I'm not alone when I say all of the items beyond what the original game offered are shit that doesn't belong. I wasn't even a TF2 pro either. The default game before they decided to shit out hats and a bunch of other dumb shit was the best.

>>375506429
>>375506265
>Shitposts because they can't refute it
Every time you can go from triple tank on payload to Dive comp on hybird to 4 dps on KOTH. It depends on the map now you fucking shitters

>>375506459
>Why the fuck would any pro with a history of playing FPS games like Overwatch?
Genji is one of the complex characters in FPS history and has one of the highest skill caps

>>375506178
>>Mixing gradual weapon spread up with wide spread shotguns
I never did anon. You just said weapon spread.
>>375506178
>Moving ever so slightly faster makes them harder to hit some how!
Yes anon, different movement speeds can throw off someone's aim. Especially when nearly every Tf2 character runs faster than OW characters.
>Still brings up sniper despite it being said in the post.
To be fair I only read "headshot mechanics" and assumed you were going full retard like the rest of your post seemed to be doing.
>Soldier rocket jumping slightly to the le-
Okay stop, because you've obviously never seen the type of shit a good soldier can do with things like gunboats or a rollout.
>Implying having no dmg fall off in a game with multiple shields, barriers, counters is a bad thing
And in exchange those things makes playing these characters annoying. Not to mention it doesn't take allot of skill to know how to bring up a barrier.
>>"These characters are pure cancer!"
>"Those exact same characters are not cancer because of how useless they are!"
There's a difference between how annoying a character can be in casual compared to comp anon.
Granted I really should have clarified more.

>>375506551
>Genji is one of the complex characters in FPS history and has one of the highest skill caps

LMAO
M
A
O

>>375506668
Try to refute it nigger

>>375506459
>HL2DM
man that takes me back. Is it still alive enough to find games?

>>375505579
You should turn this post I nto a comic just to make it even more generic 'me cool vs you dumb'

>>375506459
>Mechanically better.
>Maps are bigger than than the vast majority of TF2 maps.
>Map design is unique from map to map and more visually interesting.
>Almost every map features vertical placements which can be obtained by almost everyone through pathing and flanking.
>Lying about "pros"hating OW.

Holy shit, either the salt has built up so high that you can't see past it anymore or you may just be the worst troll of all time. Hell, that high ground part rings truer for TF2 than OW.

>>375506647
Besides I've never said they were useless. I just said that other characters are easier to use.

>>375506551
>shit that never happens in master/gm

Good story my silver friend

>>375506804
>>Maps are bigger than than the vast majority of TF2 maps.
BWHAHAHHAAHAHHA
>Map design is unique from map to map and more visually interesting.
Who gives a shit? You're playing a video game not watching a bloody movie.
>>Almost every map features vertical placements which can be obtained by almost everyone through pathing and flanking.
You mean that thing Tf2 also has?

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>>375506862
>silver
3952 senpai but nice projecting

They're just salty Valve left their game to die while OW will continue to be supported for years to come

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>>375506551
>Genji is one of the complex characters in FPS history

>>375505579
Mate, you can overcompensate however much you like, the mere fact that you think there's any character variety in Masters tells me you're probably not even Diamond. Once you get there, you will see Rein, Ana, Lucio and S76 in EVERY match.

I honestly don't give that much shit about TF2, because I stopped playing it 5 years ago. But sure - keep deluding yourself that Overwatch is a godsend of a game because it dethroned a half-dead f2p title from 2007, lmao.

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I quit TF2 because they nerfed the fun sidegrade weapons into the dirt and shoehorned everyone that wants to play somewhat seriously into vanilla.
RIP bfb I will always miss you

>>375506965
>Just a samefagging shit poster
Come on anon no need to be upset becuase OW is 30 mil strong but your brony hat simulator isn't.

>>375506936
>I'm 3952
>no proof posted
Epic, my silver brother.

>>375506551
His unique ability is literally a pyro airblast with training wheels.

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>>375506647
No anon, you should have just gave up.
>I don't know what movement abilities are.
>I didn't read everything but here, have an insult instead of refuting the point.
>I saw a pro soldier get a drop on someone so it must be effective all the time.
>I don't know what character switching is.
>I'm now switching the goal posts.

I'm out man, I'm actually embarrassed for you at this point.

>>375496050
You know, it's funny. Blizzard were failures of decade when they lost dota. All they had to do was refine it and include as a mode into WC3. But they decided against because they were afraid of giving money and attention to dota devs, since it would phase their own games away. Basically, lost opportunity.

And now Valve does exactly same mistake. I mean come on - TF2 was not just abandoned, it was mismanaged beyond comprehension. If TF2 Team wasn't part of Valve, they'd already make a run for it. If same amount of money and manpower would be used on TF2, it would be gaming titan size of Dota, or maybe even larger. But alas, Valve seemingly hate their old games now, and actively try to forget they existed.

>>375507167
How is dragon blade or swifte strike like air blast?

>>375507234
Fine, COD knife on training wheels

>>375507281
so you have no point?

>>375507081
>anyone who disagrees with me is samefagging
you could try having evidence or an actual argument first, that might help

>>375507329
He's literally just a braindead version of stuff we see in faster FPSs. How is any of that complex?

>>375507139
Give him a few minutes, he has to go through some lists to find an account to post.

>>375507234
He was talking about the deflect

>>375506929
>I shall now all caps laugh at you despite being wrong, that sure showed him!
>I brought up map design but now I realise I'm wrong so who cares anymore right?
>I pointed out that OW lacks vertical positioning but then realised I was wrong again so now I'll just say that TF2 has it like that proves him wrong.

Do you have selective memory? Did you literally forget the original post that was being replied to?

>>375506459
Even though source has its faults, air strafing, surfing and explosive jumping make TF2 infinitely more fun to move around in.
I’d rather get stuck on every prop and door than have Overwatch’s horrible floaty gameplay

>>375496050
>TF2 pro
How can i achieve such a pathetic tag?

>>375506936
Anyone can post numbers on 4chan, but your lack of upper level game knowledge seals the deal. You may not be silver, but you're definitely not even higher than plat at best.

>>375507036
>they completely blocked custom skins just because people started figuring out wallhacks and shit with them (IIRC)
>instead of taking a day or two blacklisting changes to the elements that made such things possible
I still have my old TF2 folder with all the great high quality skins I'd built up over literal years lying around somewhere

>>375499325
tfw i played tf2 since 2008 to shortly after f2p was introduced and never heard of competetive tf2
feels bad

>>375507432
An extremely limited use ability you can use once that you need to time perfectly to be effective vs a spammable right click? Which of these is training wheels now?

6v6 isn't fun.

>>375506804
>mechanically better
if you think porting over a shit ton of dota abilities into an fps game makes overwatch 'mechanically better' than traditional fps games then by your logic paladins should be 'mechanically better' than overwatch.

overwatch doesn't even have fucking airstrafing.

>maps are bigger
wrong

>map design is unique from map to map
wrong.

>more visually interesting
overwatch is pretty. the maps visually are polished. thing is overwatch doesn't even have custom maps from the community so its already tiny pool of maps feels even smaller. overwatch maps also have a lot of needless clutter purely for visuals which otherwise detract from the maps. also many areas of maps are dark as fuck, again affecting readability which is already a problem in overwatch.

>almost every map features vertical placements
quite a few don't. i am thinking of a number of the koth ones.

>>375507193
>>I don't know what movement abilities are.
You mean those things that I already talked about in other post? Abilites neat yes but they're very easy to predict because nobody can airstrafe. The only exceptions would be Tracer and Lucio.
>I didn't read everything but have a insult
Because I already explained that crit on headshot would be cancer in Tf2 and that it's impossible to balance.
But to clarify further the reason why it would be cancer is simply because crits deal a shit ton of damage so a mechanic like that would lower the death timer by allot and make it less of what Tf2 is, a casual game.
>I saw a pro soldier do it o-
Just go watch a basic and advanced rocket jumping tutorial.
>I don't know what character switching is.
Annoying. Because since there's a hard counter system I can't just carry with someone like Reaper, even if he's one of the very few characters I actually like in this game. So if my counter is on the other team is have to try and get one of my teammates to switch or switch myself.
This might be fine in comp, because following the meta is exactly what you expect and why characters like Junk isn't cancer in it.
But spam characters are annoying in casual because you always feel obligated to pick up a shield character even if you don't want too because you're not always going to have a team that likes playing shields

If you would compare TF2 and OW head to head, i would say that TF2 takes the cake. Problem is that i played it already for 5 years straight and got bored. And it's not helping that Valve abandoned it. They just don't care about it, then why should i? Blizzard at least cares about OW.

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>>375496050
While maybe not top pro I was in the Steel League Highlander and did well enough. I played TF2 pretty much exclusively for nearly a decade. I dropped it the second Overwatch launched. TF2's lack of updates that weren't cosmetic changes only. I loved getting my hands on new weapons and testing them out, learning their counters and whatnot. There hasn't been a new weapon since 2014 because TF2 is run by like three interns who just sit around and play the game between encouraging the players to purchase keys and make cosmetic items so they don't even have to make any models for themselves.

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>>375507815
>bug that lets you move change direction mid-air for no reason
>i-its a feature!!!!

>>375507643
>ability that works on almost everything barring a handful of characters' weaponry, with an extremely generous window of time and effect and range that only needs a short cooldown
vs
>something that needs to be timed precisely, only works on non-hitscan projectiles, and uses up a finite ammo supply whose pool it shares with the character's primary weapon

>>375507643
I feel like the timing on pyro's airblast as well as the fact that it can only reflect certain projectiles makes it more skill intensive in my opinion. I also feel that Genji's reflect is far more than a panic button and needs to be timed well.

>>375508043
it's not really a bug though is it if it was purposefully put into the source engine.

i'll put it into blizzard terms for your fanboy ass. sc1 became a goliath of gaming because of the bugs its engine had. and when blizzard made sc2 and didn't include any of the sc1 engine quirks it fell flat on its ass and is already dead.

>>375507693
This.
That and:
>Dude I wonder what OW comp is like there must be tons of interesting choi-
DUDE SAME GAME EVERY MATCH LMAO

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>>375496050
>Why do ex-TF2 pros dislike Overwatch so much?
because their game doesn't have top tier waifus.

>>375507465
>>I shall now all caps laugh at you despite being wrong, that sure showed him!
Okay you clearly deluded yourself into thinking OW maps are good.
They're not, they're complete chokepoint fest and even people who like the game criticize it on how bad the maps are. There's little flank routes and what flank routes you do have often just go right back to the choke.
>Map design.
When he was talking about map design I assumed he meant how the maps were actually made looking at them mechanically.
Not to mention regardless if the map aesthetic is good or bad in the slightest, that doesn't change that they're dog shit mechanically. The first taste is with the eye yes but you have to get the mouth involved at some point.
>Map vertical
Lad I wasn't even the guy you were responding too. I just pointed out "Yes OW maps have vertical to them, but Tf2 has it as well".

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>>375508238
>dead
so is tf2 LUL
now this is the point where you frantically run to the steam stat page and post the number of trade bots and brs currently in game

>>375507815
The maps are bigger though. Even comparing KOTH maps, the smallest for both games tells you that.

Map design is as unique as any TF2 map is map to map.

Which maps? Oasis is vertical heavy on all three points, Nepal has handy vertical accessibility for two of its parts and the one that isn't, sanctum, still has a wide open middle space for fliers. Ilios has height dotted around the points in all three sections but Ill admit Lijang Tower is limited in its height points. Control Centre has some but those aren't really very effective unless ulting.

>>375508349
>Game doesn't have dull as dirt fapbait for 12 year old Koreans

HOW WILL TF2 EVER RECOVER

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>>375508072
>air blast
>timed precisly

>>375508489
>TF2 ever recovering

>>375508472
>they're all bots

[citation needed]

>>375496050
Because in TF2 individual skill had way more impact in the result of the match, while in OW even if you are the best player around if your team is shit you will lose

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>>375503082
Heres the difference though, in tf2 go around parading that you use the Sandman and you'll get made fun of and called a faggot. The community openly hates weapons like the Reserve Shooter because its lowskill combo stun trash.

Meanwhile, Overwatch fully embraces the Reserve Shooter and makes it into its own lowskill character, Roadhog. Play him and people will like you.

>>375496050

I'm was raised on Q3 then TF2 then tried OW, OW was fun for a while but grew old and too team based. Quake Champions will be the game I go to when it's released. The beta is amazing.

>>375508478
>The maps are bigger though
thing is overwatch maps have SO MUCH USELESS SPACE. there are entire areas of overwatch maps that people don't go near during the entirety of the round. they are so out of the way they might as well not exist for all the tactical advantage they offer. so much for your good map design dude.

>w-which m-maps d-don't have verticality???
>proceeds to list the maps which don't have verticality
>'having a character float around in the air is verticality'

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why is this allowed?

>>375508839
>Heres the difference though, in tf2 go around parading that you use the Sandman and you'll get made fun of and called a faggot.
no you won't

the only reason people don't get called out for playing lowskill stuff in overwatch is because lowskill stuff is the entire premise of the game.

>>375508914
To be fair it kinda is if you have a high ceiling.
The problem is that EVERY map has a high ceiling so by that logic every map has vert.

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>>375509001
>DEFEAT

>>375509082
>m-muh medals
git gud kiddo

>>375509056
Except vert in Overwatch doesn't present the same advantages and disadvantages as it does in other games. Because Overwatch has zero advanced movement (no rocket jumping or cooldown-less sticky jumping for instance) all heroes like Mercy and Pharah can do is just float lethargically in the air waiting for a Mcree to shoot them out of the sky. Being aerial in Overwatch is just a straight disadvantage because the game is designed with consoles in mind and console players can't execute proper rocket jumps with tank controls.

>>375509082
>group bonus

Maybe ditch your shitty friends.

>>375496050
>TF2 pros

lmao

>>375509302
this desu

shitty friends or you were in a stack of 4 or more, which is usually a death sentence

>>375509450
playing with 1 friend teams are literally retarded at this rank

>>375508618
Most of them aren't actually bots, but the overwhelming majority of TF2 gameplay across all players is in trade , achievement, Orange, and CTF (aka not playing the actual game).

>>375499456
wait what did blizzard say about steel?

>>375504575
compared to the tf2 cast yeah.

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>>375509242
>that player on your team with no medals who tries to save face from the other team by saying "gg my team is shit" in all chat.
>when the enemy team responds by telling him that he's garbage and how you were the only good one on the team

My face, every time.

>>375509532
>but the overwhelming majority of TF2 gameplay across all players is in trade , achievement, Orange, and CTF (aka not playing the actual game).

[citation needed]

>>375509532
To be fair that's still people playing.
Trade is at least tolerable, as long as people are actually trading.
Achievement can be a bit enjoyable depending on the map. Besides there are weps where you need achieves to get them so I can see why they would exist.
Orange is just fun because it's constant crits and feels hectic. But that's honestly my opinion.
Nothing wrong with CTF as a casual experience, especially when it lets you practice your mechanical skills all day. There's a reason why allot of people play 2fort, it's basically team death match and there's nothing wrong with that because it's fun to kill in Tf2.

>>375496050
Overwatch is really not that good. Lacks variety. The team with the better synergy wins every time. Individual skill is hardly involved, almost every game you can tell whether you'll from the characters your team picks at the beginning, and whether you're attacking or defending.
Beyond that, the lack of characters contributes to how bland it is. At least TF2 had different pieces of equipment for its roster, sometimes changing the way the characters play entirely.

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>>375509082
I especially like how overwatch doesn't have its own scoreboard system so you can't call people out for this shit.

Everyone just pretends to have golds all the time so they can keep instant locking DPS.

>>375507815
> thing is overwatch doesn't even have custom maps from the community so its already tiny pool of maps feels even smaller
You are aware that TF2 only had six maps when released, right? Overwatch had twelve at launch and has added two (three if you count Watchpoint: Antarctica)

>console-oriented FPS
>bad
Imagine that.
The game will live on a bit longer due to the Blizzard effect and tumblr shipping/headcanon wars. This time next year we'll have forgotten about it.

>>375503082
all of those are why TF2 sucks compared to other fortress games

>>375497424
He clearly means TF and the other variants on the Quake engine

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>>375497202
>>375496050
>>375506459
>be person that enjoys playing video games
>dawn of mass market streaming arrives mid-to-late '00s
>people making livable wages, even modest fortunes just recording themselves playing video games somehow(seriously who is giving these people and money and why?)
>If you get a job you love, you'll never work a day in your life
>Overwatch happens
>because you are technically entertainment industry, have to follow the money to what's popular
>forced to play a game that's a shallow mockery of the stuff it apes
>energetic and vibrant streamers now sound shiftless and lethargic

It's like a really stupid episode of Black Mirror, but it actually happened.

>>375510039
Even if you remove the part that maybe 2 of those are good and the other ones are unbearable.
You could, and most of us did, play custom maps on tf2 since launch.
That's the whole point. OW is locked to what blizzard wants and god knows they are the least capable people to make changes on their own games.

How much better would Overwatch be if ultimates didn't exist?

>>375502389
>Trash players in bad teams blame the game for their bad performance

>>375503082
Those weapons mainly require skill disbarring the soldier and shield. OW has no skill cap

>>375510248
>look at top streamers
>most are annoying hyperactive autists that get their views by being lel so wacky xDD
>the rest are genuinely done with this shit and have been dead inside for years but they pass it off as irony, see imaqtpie

I'm glad I never tried to make it big streaming. I enjoy watching speedrunners though.

>>375510248
It's not like this matters anymore. With advertisers pulling money from online content creators like this soon this whole streaming business will die for 99% of the streamers that are not sponsored by companies

>>375510248
>energetic and vibrant streamers now sound shiftless and lethargic
this actually just seems to be part of the iconic streamer image now for some reason.
>20s/early 30s white male
>sound and look completely bored and lethargic, nothing but sarcastic humor
>occasionally get extremely excited and overcompensate for how dull you are
>act like you couldn't care less about the chat despite being a donation whore
any streamer that isn't like this eventually becomes like this. nearly all the most popular streamers of all games fit this profile

>>375510421
No ultimates, add part of that functionality to another weapon in the kit.
No inf ammo
Ability to play on community created maps and mods
there fixed most of OW

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>you have to have a Reinhardt on your team on payload maps
You should never be forced to have a character on your team.

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>>375510421
Lets see:
>Wouldn't have to mirror Reinhardt to counter Reinhardt, or just lose to his broken ultimate
>No playnig Hide n Seek with mercy, only to have her res her team from spawn anyway
>Teams would actually have to learn to fight so secure picks, rather than play footsies behind a tank at choke

a lot better. But it still wouldn't put a lot of depth in the game, it would just make a broken character like Roadhog run more so he can get starting picks. Also with no ult feeding he literally has no downside to speak of.

>>375503316
>Demo require very little aim skill to be effective
if you're planning to post shit, actually make yourself believable

>>375510730
no you don't,
how bronze are you?

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>>375510248
>energetic and vibrant streamers now sound shiftless and lethargic

Hello you called me?

>>375510806
Reinhardt isn't needed because of his ultimate, he's needed because of his shield.

>>375508914
>there are entire areas of overwatch maps that people don't go near during the entirety of the round
Yeah, at your skill level everyone just takes the middle road despite there being three ways to enter every choke. When you're just starting the game and playing with new comers like yourself none of them understand how taking high ground in a situation would make it helpful.

11 characters have vertical moving skills meaning they can go from the ground to the shelf with ease to avoid getting blasted on the ground.

While a third (maybe one more if you include a Quick-Fix medic) of the TF2 cast can use vertical movement two of them need to hurt themselves doing it and the other needs an Atomizer (which may hurt a little) and a Force of Nature.

>>375496050
Well there's one thing you don't understand: TF2 is based on Quake's original multiplayer, the speed, accuracy and weapon mechanics are all from there. That's why it is still considered extremely fun because the iD guys got the multiplayer part really nailed well.

Overwatch is slow, ripoff copy of TF2. It has more limited maps and the gameplay is ultimately based on the character's super abilities...

It's not bad but it's just nothing great either. Overwatch is shallow.

>>375510907
>Enemy Reinhardt Presses Q.
>You're all stunned because no counter rein, no there are no viable counters to earth shatter other than Reinhardt
>Enemy team instagibs all the stunned players


This is the main reason why Reinhardt is viewed as mandantory, not running him means free pushes if he just presses Q. There are SOME things that block earth shatter, but they're on such high cooldowns and easy enough to just wait out that they're not reliable.

There are so many things wrong with overwatch where do I even fucking begin?
>Artstyle is an inconsistent mess, enemies blend in with the background and come in many different sizes
>Hard counter system makes half the characters in the game unviable no matter how good you are
>DPS characters can't do shit because tanks have absurdly high health and have just as good damage
>Writing is cringy and annoying to listen too, to this day I still wish I could fucking mute tracer and mei
>Movement is incredibly bland, everybody moves extremely slowly and movement abilities are gimped
>Terrible hitboxes that don't make any goddamn sense like Meis freeze gun can completely miss the player and still hit and genjis deflect hitbox being three times bigger than his fucking body
>Ults in general are cancer, too many are stuns or aoes or used to just win 1v1s. Not lost on death and no way to track them
>Map design is terrible, every map looks like TF2s dustbowl with one big choke and a long timer. Maps have no consistent theme or style and have clutter everywhere
>Every hero has a low skill ceiling and can be learned in a few hours. No secondaries and unlimited ammo just makes things worse
>Meta is boring as fuck, both teams grind ult then spam them all at once and see who comes out on top
>Very few weapons that do splash damage and those that do have a very small blast radius so deathballing is encouraged
>No scoreboard so you can't call out shitters who aren't pulling their weight or even keep track of your own stats
>No modding, dedicated servers, and settings are limited
>Matchmaking adds long down times between games that aren't necessary

>>375496050
didnt the tf2/cs pros got ranked on gold-platinum?

>>375510421
You also have to basically get rid of everything that shuts down game momentum besides the ultimates
>Reinhardt, D.va, Orisa, Winston's shields(Zarya's is an exception because of how short it lasts and because it's tied to her weapon), Genji's deflect, etc.

Ultimates are basically there to inject temporary bouts of speed into slowpaced slugfests. Once you get rid of the ultimates you have to start really paring every hero down to more basic essentials.

>>375510950
Name a viable counter to Earth shatter that isn't Reinhardt.

Anything with a long cooldown can simply be waited out.

>>375510963
>When you're just starting the game and playing with new comers like yourself
Nice projecting faggot I ain't even gonna read the rest of your post, sad you wasted your time typing it up.

>>375497694

TF2 doesn't require that much skill. It has a much shorter skill ceiling than TF1/TF:C. Tribes puts all of them to shame.

IMO, TF2 and Overfail have about the same overall skill ceiling despite what retarded fans say otherwise.

Pharah = Soldier in terms of skill ceiling with different approaches.

Scout = Genji in terms of skill ceiling with almost identical tactics (hit fast and hard and use your superior mobility to get out of trouble)

>>375510931
Just hearing Kripp talk makes me feel sad.

>>375506708
>>375507081
>make a claim, but provide no evidence to support it
>prove me wrong xD
Eat shit.
Prove that Genji is "is one of the complex characters in FPS history and has one of the highest skill caps" first, faggot.

>>375497697

Because TF2 has past its time. The masses don't give a flying shit about it. Deal with it.

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>>375506551

>Genji is one of the complex characters in FPS history and has one of the highest skill caps

>braindead 2s duration airblast that has virtually 360º coverage which is also a get out of jail card
>1/4 hp of non tanks dash that resets and don't require any aiming, it's even easier to land than Hog hook, granted not nearly as retarded
>ulti literally doesn't require you to aim and is pretty much just a flowchart decision making for you to get high value out of it
>BBC tier hitbox that can also do critical damage on its right click on a hero that has a kit designed to be on your face half of the time

Genji is a balanced Hog. They're both equally braindead. Inb4 but muh sub GM players can't play him, that means he requires two everests of skill.

>>375497102
TF2 is on console

>>375511073

> Nostalgic-fag who doesn't realize that most of that is also applicable to TF2.

>>375497013
>guy throws a match for fucking skins
>gets banned
>act like he is the smartest motherfucker in the earth but he just cant prove himself because he got banned
>hides the fact he never actually achieved anything
>ow comes out
>tries to get in
>gets btfo

the entire life of that dude is sad as fuck

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>>375511145
I'm sorry, I didn't realize you had Widowmaker's Noir skin like me. You do, right?

It's less of an FPS and more of a strategy game

>>375511512
It was released on console but wasn't designed for console.

Overwatch is console through and through.

>>375510508
This. I remember having a discussion a few years back where some of my friends thought I was retarded for saying that the youtube bubble was going to burst, and now look, a fuckload of people have switched to streaming. The bubble might not be burst, but it's definitely deflating, with Youtube themselves seeming to enjoy sticking pins in it as well. The same will happen to streaming, mark my words. Like >>375510602 says it's already becoming homogenised and samey. Describe that "aloof and apathetic, uses lots of sarcastic and 'ironic meme' humour, acts like their chat are all plebs and that they don't care but is constantly shouting out donations and has the messages on text to speech with a "funny" sound clip set to play when someone subs" to almost anyone and I'm betting they'll be able to pick out people they watch that do it. It's becoming oversaturated just like what happened to youtube, where everyone has to act the same way because that's what pulls in the donations.

>>375496050
It's too simple.

My only beef with TF2 is no friendly headshots with Crusaders Crossbow.

I mean you know, other than the whole shitstorm that was hats.

>>375511553
Fucking idiot.

I preordered the Origins Edition because I thought Overwatch would be my new TF2. Instead I played it for a week and stopped playing because I was really, really uninteresting. Now Overwatch is all my 13 year old sister plays while I have gone back to TF2.

Overwatch was a waste of money.

>>375511553
>buy game at launch for pre order skin
>dont play for a year
>come back
>"look guys im a pro"

>>375506551
>Genji is one of the complex characters in FPS history and has one of the highest skill caps
wew

What's with the overwatch fanbase being in denial that it's essentially a tf2 clone?

I mean half the heroes are just tf2 classes with a certain item equipped.

You need to have reached SR 3800 at least ONCE before being able to talk about game mechanics and team compositions in this thread

cut here
8< ----------------------------------

>>375511895
8=>

fixed

>>375511756

You realize that almost every FPS since COD cancer has been dumbing down on game mechanics?

TF2 also suffers from it as well. They dumb-down every class from TF1/TF:C

>>375511881
They are called Blizzdrones for a reason.
They are basically cult members.

>>375497307
pyyyour was alright at tf2, in overwatch he seems to be lacking

clockwork was incredibly good at scout, and i think thats because he genuinely loved playing tf2. he doesn't like overwatch and it really showed in his play, he just doesnt give a fuck.

>>375511881

Overfail is a multi-class FPS team-based clone where the genre is older than some /v/tards.

>>375511060
>375511060

Once you get out of diamond you learn to sense when Rein and Zarya are gonna ult. It's common sense to keep a mind timer on their ults and watch how aggressive they are. A good zarya can block the enemy's earthshatter for their ENTIRE team

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Reminder if you hit diamond at all last season you were better than 92% of players in the game.

>>375511262
Pharah isnt even close to Soldier, sorry matey. If they gave her forward propulsion and could use her rockets, not just concussion blast, to influence her flight path, then maybe.

>>375510480
This. The effects in tf2 require some sort of skill. The stun from a sandman won't do shit if you don't hit it from a certain distance, have an arc you must take notice of and since you're a scout the best you could do is get full meatshots, while mccree stuns gives you a whole second to hit the hero in the head and kill pretty much half of the roster.
The jarate and madmilk requires the class to hit the enemy afterwards while they still have the same mobility.

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Am I retarded or does Hanzo not fit into Overwatch

the game is beyond baby tier, but even Hanzo's skill floor is oddly demanding with respect to everything else in the game

Even though he's always unoptimal, having a good Hanzo match is one of the only tangibly rewarding feelings in this game

>>375512319
>generic shooter babbies cant into projectiles

Whodathunkit

>>375512319
from what ive managed to gather from overwatch

tracer, hanzo, genji, pharah, junkrat, dva, and roadhog are the best heroes to play if you want the game to feel like an actual fps, and not an fps-moba hybrid

>>375512319

You kidding? Hanzo's arrows have the same hitbox as Pharah's rockets, and the scattershot is a Roadhog hook at long distance. Hanzo and Hog are the heroes for people with no skill. Just wait for your cooldown and pray you can oneshot someone. Especially hog, the hitbox on the hook is so big it's ridiculous. What other game has a tank that can ONESHOT 70% OF THE ROSTER AT LONG RANGE?

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>>375506551
>Genji is one of the complex characters in FPS history and has one of the highest skill caps
Genji's fucking skillcap is still about 1/10th that of Pyro. Who is regarded as the easiest tf2 class

>>375506708
Sure I'll take this challenge Overbaby

>Absolutely no timing needed on Reflect, just press the button and its up for 2 seconds.
>Get out of jail free dash that also resets if you kill someone, meanwhile in tf2 its up to you to disengage with high skill movement options. Enemy team can do little to stop you from just pressing your dodge button and getting out.
>Barely capable of dodging anything if his dodge button is on cooldown, as overwatch design ususally goes. No, he is not fast, he is very easy to track due to how everyone in overwatch moves at slug speed.
>Press M2 at point blank to do damage, or just stand really far back and spam m1s to get ulti charge.
>Ultimate is literally just holding m1 in general directions and clicking shift every time you get a kill so you can close space


He actually reminds me a lot of D.Va except in the DPS category. But whatever.

>>375511982
Of course, but I think for a lot of people OW just hit that point where it felt too much like the LoL of FPS in the way they approach things, so they crossed the invisible border in their minds.

I'm not a TF2 'pro' though, I casually enjoy both games.

>>375511262
easy to see people who play TF2 nothing but casually or have barely played the game at all
saying that TF2 has the same skill ceiling as OW is like saying that chess is as easy as checkers

>>375512517
>the only characters Hog can't kill with a Hook + M1 at full health are Orisa (barely), Rein, Winston, D. Va, and himself

Horse. Shit. He should be moved out of Tank and into Offense.

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>>375511835
Look guys I'm a pro!

>>375496050
I'm a huge tf2 and just didn't like overwatch that much when it came out. It has nothing to do with me being a tf2 fag. Reinhardt was fun to play

Why are TF2fags so salty?

>>375511531
Like fucking what? Even with silly hats tf2 was built on a solid consistent artstyle and players are easy to recognize.

All classes have use and you can stomp with them if you're good. Yes even pyro.

Heavy is the only tank in TF2 and is easily countered by sniper, spy, and demo with the first two ignoring health and demo having extremely high dps

TF2s writing is great and the voice lines fit the game. You have a bunch of lunatic mercenaries killing each other all day and the dialogue reflects that.

Movement in TF2 is incredibly complex and one of the hardest skills to master

Competitive meta is just as complex with rollouts, uber trades, baiting, forcing uber, sniper/spy picks, sticky traps, kiting, back caps, pack control, damage calling, uber tracking, crit heals etc etc.

Old fags. Simple enough. There are people who put too much time and effort into a game to be able to admit something else just as good, or better, has come along. There are people who are still devoted to HL2DM or people who refuse to move from CS:S to CS:GO. Nothing you can do will ever please these people, the game was perfect on release before all the updates! The game is perfect and we don't need a new game!

>>375512875
Roadhog has no downsides in that game, he's blatantly overpowered to the point of making McCree or Reaper near worthless.


I don't think blizzard really cares either. For a counterpick game, he doest actually have a direct 1v1 counter. Unless himself counts.

>>375512875

He can kill himself though. His hitbox is so big you can just blindly right click at another hog and only then hook him. Easy kill.

The only, ONLY drawback to Hog is that he's so big he's basically a walking ult piñata. But good hogs realize this and play flankers or only move out of cover to grab.

I'm a 3900 SR main soldier/zarya and roadhog is in all my nightmares. I can basically 1v1 ANYONE except for hog. If he has at least 2 brain cells he can oneshot me without a second thought.

>>375512479
Not junrat and pharah at least. In fps rocket and nade launchers have very few ammo to work with while there's unlimited ammo in overwatch, this allows for the gigantic spam.

>>375512803

I wanna see you play OW then, pls reach Grandmaster as easy as you make it to be. Can't wait to see you spouting dumb fucking excuses when you get trashed at low plat.

>>375513340
LMAO

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>>375512895
>if you play a lot you're good
You're as bad as the rest of them, anon.

>>375513163
I'm a reaper man and roadhogs are just free ult charges for me.
Shift through his hook and he's dead in two shots. 99% of roadhogs hook the second they see you

>>375513416
>I'm a reaper man
You must be over 18 to post here.

in TF2, you could stand out by being good at any specific class, regardless of skill level

in Overwatch, you can do that up until like plat, then it stops because the opposing team will start actually countering your hero picks

>>375513219
>>375513163
When it's Hog v Hog you have to play a dance to ensure one of you hooks second for the kill and ebfore the hooking land enough damage beforehand to ensure death. Everyone Zarya and lower you just hook and shoot.

>>375511982
Removing conc jumps and grenades and leaving bomb jumping to Soldier and Demo is disappointing in terms of game speed, but I always felt it was an acceptable concession to cut down on spam, as well as revamping things like Civilian Escort into Payload.

Sometimes less is more and the final product of the nine classes in TF2 I think are mechanically interesting and avoid redundancy(e.g. compare TFC Medic v Scout). It also makes the skirmishes personally more thrilling, but I can see where you might be disappointed if you trend towards the highflying antics of something like Tribes.

>no ability for custom maps
>no community servers (meaning both no servers you can frequent with friendly people and also no ability to find a server to frequent which fits your approximate skill level)
>everything is 6v6; can never have more even for casual play because the maps are designed around 6 so even something like 9v9 would make all the chokes into Dustbowl
>skillful FPS plays are subservient to a sub-task of building ult and avoiding feeding ult
>everyone is slow and lacks forward momentum
So many of the game's common complaints would be solved if they designed maps that could reasonably sustain larger than 6v6s in casual play. Instalock widow? No worries, they're just one of 9 or 12 or something, rather than half of your team's primary damage output.

>>375497756
How is it a contradiction?

>>375513115

TF2 art direction without the stupid hats is just 1950s-1960s comic serials. The 2010 and newer hats/cosmetics completely threw out of that out. It is Reddit-tier garbage

TF2 movement is not that complex (You probably never played Tribes) and it is almost the same as overfail. The only major difference is rocket jumping and grenade/sticky jumping spam for Solder/Demoman with the Scout and his double jump + FAN jumping. Everybody has pretty much the same movement overall at slightly different rates.

TF2 writing has been dead since MvM. Valve has pretty much abandoned TF2. It is just a handful of junior staff tending to it doing basic patching.

>>375513525
I don't like the character but he's good at flanking

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>>375513340
I'm willing to bet I'm a higher SR than you are kid.

Doubt you'd believe me if I screen capped it.

>>375513814

Go ahead please.

>>375513163
>>375513219
Widowmaker, Hanzo, Bastion, Pharah, Zenyatta and Soldier can all stay out of Roadhogs range and kill him with no problems. Hell, so can D.Va outside of her mech.

All the characters in this game are overpowered. If there's anything I learned from Syndrome it's that when everyone is super no one is.

>>375496050
>Why do ex-TF2 pros dislike Overwatch so much?

Because the character used is a bigger determinate as to just how good a player can do. So while player skill is still a thing sure it is taken less into account when it comes to reaching a skill ceiling.

So the characters used take up just way to much of the equation for somes tastes when it comes to determine how good one can be. Simple as that and for those who have played and gotten good at something needing more player skill regardless of class/character choices can easily feel this.

>>375513528

Actually, Overwatch depends on team compensation and team skill if you want to go Master and beyond.

>ITT: try-hard fags eternally butthurt that they can't single-handily carry games. A competent team can easily shut them down.

>Tons of stuns in the game
>Every 2 weeks they add a new character or try to re-balance the game
>Always ends up more broken with every update
>Dumb copies of characters from other series like roadhog
>No high skill gameplay

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>>375514019

>roadhogs out in the open past diamond

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I have two real problems with Overwatch, and my main one is the fact that if it wasn't a Blizzard game, nobody would touch it.

Say what you will about the game itself, it'd be regarded on the same tier as Battleborn if not for who made it.

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>>375496050

Because TF2 "pros" are garbage players who could never hope to compete in a real game that requires actual coordination, teamwork, and skill. So they bitch endlessly when they realize how out of place they are playing Overwatch. They desperately wish they could go back to TF2 so they can continue to pretend like they're actually good at something, even though being good at TF2 might be the most meaningless skill in all of professional gaming.

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>>375513814
>my rank in a shitty video game is higher than your rank in a shitty video game

>>375514261
Professional gaming in general is a waste of space.

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>TF2
>Pros

Pick one. Most classes in TF2 are cheap garbage. Only scout, sniper, and engineer are non trash classes.

>>375514261
Almost all of the top OW players came from TF2. Are you not reading or are you not capable of that?

>>375514261
>Overwatch
>Skill
Infinite ammo and ults make even retards do good at the game

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>>375514261
>overwatch requires more skill
Kek'd. It sure is difficult to press a button and instakill heroes

A group of people move from a comp scene nobody gives a shit about to another comp scene nobody gives a shit about. Really scratches the cerebellum.

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>>375513385
I was satirizing your quote. I'm not great at video games, I'll be the first to admit it. Playing second player to my brother (who even in Overwatch is Master and has five silver stars) just made me kinda shitty at games my whole life. The only thing I can do is learn as much as I can about mechanics, counters, strategies and just hope my aim is at least alright that day. My only point was that I play this game a lot. It's not about being omniscient, it's just being there for so long that you can count the cooldowns of your enemies and watch behaviors and time to predict when an ult is being used.

>>375514261
My sides. OW babies on suicide watch.

>>375514395
Holy shit I haven't seen arby n the chief in years.

>>375513634
>TF2 art direction without the stupid hats is just 1950s-1960s comic serials. The 2010 and newer hats/cosmetics completely threw out of that out. It is Reddit-tier garbage
Having an art style is better than none at all even if you don't like it and even with hats tf2 characters are always easily identifiable and recognizable by their team colors. map colors and lighting are designed to make them stand out from the scenery. Why do you think so many maps use muted colors like brownish orange and gray? It makes red and blue stand out.

>TF2 movement is not that complex (You probably never played Tribes)
Fast != Complex
Also
>What is air strafing, bunny hopping, trickstabs, surfing, wrangler jumping
And yes bunny hopping still exists and is needed to get to some spots and is also useful for MG soldiers
>rocket jumping and grenade/sticky jumping spam for Solder/Demoman
>Downplaying skills that take hundreds of hours to master and many different ways to use them
I'd like to see you fucking air pogo with stickies or ctap jump across mid

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>tfw most of the best maps in TF2 were fan-made and you'll never get anything like that for Overwatch

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>>375514280
Fucking stupid isn't it?

Guy can't even defend his own opinion of Genji so he starts attacking skill rating of people who question him.

>>375513918
I placed 3800 and haven't played since, because I don't play games I dont like. Its decayed to 3k by now.

>>375514815
SOI SOI SOI SOI SOI SOI SOI SOI SOI

>>375514837
Whoops meant that for >>375513768

Also
>TF2 writing has been dead since MvM.
And somehow this makes all the other lines nonexistant? I'd rather listen to demos drunken rambling than "CHEERS LUV XDDD" for the hundredth goddamn time.

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>>375513525
I'm 25 and reaper is one of my mains.

Bite me waifufaggot.

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>>375515214
Just goes to show Blizzdrones have the mindset of 12 year olds.

>>375496050
OW, by design, doesn't require an immense amount of skill.
That's not fun to people who play TF2.

>>375514837

The same can be said for Overfail, unless you are color-blind.

TF2 is not that movement has never been complex retard. Trickstabs are just exploiting Source engine's shitty hitboxes and hit detection. Overfail isn't exactly any better in this regard. I

exploitations =! complexity

It doesn't take that long to master either skill. It is nearly brain-dead easy if you are using macros (90-95% of so called "elite" Soldiers/Demoman depend on them).

>>375515349
>Proceeds to post anime garbage.

Kill yourself m4risa wannabe.

By the way, i don't really like overwatch, i play it because it's what my friends are playing.

I'm more of a Quake/Unreal person.
Also played TF2 for 10 years and was one of the best hitscanners in the game.

>>375515473

TF2 doesn't require that much skill either by design. It has causalized TF1:TF:C so much that the die-hard TF1/TF:C fans made their own third-party Source made called Fortress Forever.

>>375503316
>Spy backstab still broken as fuck, never been fixed.

wasn't there a bug where you could backstab someone by doing a 180 really fast mid-stab animation, i seem to remember having to do that a lot for some reason

>>375515480
please link me to the macro that allows me to air pogo with stickies.

>>375515615

It is a fucking bug a.k.a game engine/hitbox exploitation.

The Spy was never meant to do facestabs.

>>375515613
Fortress Forever was being developed as a Source mod before the TF2 as we even knew it debuted, and before we know how TF2 played.

Hell, Fortress Forever came out BEFORE the TF2 Orange Box beta.

>>375504643
>radiating-from-the-player no falloff AoE damage

who the fuck does this in OW? Reaper's ult? TOP KEK