Puella Magi Madoka Magica: Dat Ass Edition

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Great taste in theme OP.

>>2113624
>Kyubina
Is that... Is that an album poster?

Thinking of rewatch of series + rebellion.

Since I have watched the TV version before, should I go for the movie version this time? What does it add/miss?

>>2113664
Pluses:
-Better animation
-More refined voice acting
-Different OST. Not necessarily better
-A nice KyouHomu scene after Kyouko's death
-Other little touches
-New op "Luminous"
-Extended Magia ed

Minuses
-Movie 1 is Ep1-8 in one 2 hours movie, so pacing issues for the first film
-Naked space hug is replaced with cosmic dresses (which makes it slightly lewder)

General
-Mami's back story was cut
-Homura doesn't attempt to kill Sayaka

If you haven't seen it and you're a fan, there's no reason not to see it.

>>2113673
Perfect summary. Thanks anon. Going to see it.

>>2113673
Pretty much spot on. Just missing the lack of opening scene at the start of first movie, since the scene happens later.

Only OST change I felt was strictly better was the new (I think?) track that plays during Sayaka's last moments. Been a long time though, not sure what all gets changed.

Besides the few cut scenes the biggest con for me is the lack of OP/ED, which is especially important due to ep3, 10, and the KyouSaya ED. 2nd movie OP also spoils Homura's role a bit. But none of that really matters if you have already seen the show obviously.

Also apparently the dub is actually very good in the movies, but I can't be bothered to confirm that myself.

previous post
SFW MamiKyo Doujin raw

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B01Dn3kBTNnuOEJHYzhfX1ROcUE

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>>2113673
>dresses are lewder than naked
What?

>>2113733
Oh yeah, it's definitely a rewatch thing. I wouldn't recommend doing a movie only run on first watch. Forget taking out I'm home, Connect is shoehorned right there into the middle of movie 2.

>>2113756
They're pretty much topless as it's pretty see thru.

>Caffecino
>Homu-chu
We Tumblr now!

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C90 looking great.

>>2113756
Revealing clothes are more sexy then simply being naked.

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Since last thread went down so soon after posting I'll post it again.

SFW MamiKyo Doujin

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B01Dn3kBTNnuOEJHYzhfX1ROcUE

So any domdoka fics?

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>>2113812
~samples

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>>2113812
2/3

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>>2113812
3/3

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>>2113812
Thanks anon. Would be happy to typeset if this gets translated.

>>2113823
Cool, thanks.
I have a translator I've been paying for some of the scans. If you are offering to typeset, I'll just ask him for a script on this one which will be a lot cheaper.

If there's any other scans you want to do this for let me know and I could see about getting scripts for those too.

Here's an email you can contact me through: [email protected]

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>>2113843
Not gonna lie, paying for/being paid for scanlation work turns me off. But who am I to tell you how to live your life? I'll shoot you an e-mail.

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>>2113866
Well, it's either that or learn Japanese myself which I don't plan on doing anytime soon. I can afford it, so why not?

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>>2113875
Just personal reservations. But I admi that such things are pretty pointless since I'm a filthy scanlator pirate anyway.

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>>2113811
I don't know.
Homura crying into Madoka's breasts was pretty intimate

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>>2113624
Gentle loving MadoHomu is better than aggressive dominating MadoHomu

>>2113886
>implying gentle dom madohomu isn't the best madohomu

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>>2113886
One of the only western artists that is any good

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>>2113886
Madoka is always gentle.

>>2113882
Now imagine her pressing her face into he chest while wearing a thin, white dress. Her tears staining the clothes, turning them transparent, perhaps her movements might make a nipple slip out. Think about it.

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I don't trust Mami here

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>>2113893
What the fuck is gentle dom?

>>2113916
Mami-san is a pedophile and keeps Nagisa quiet with cheese.

>>2113958
>What the fuck is gentle dom?
Exactly what it says on the tin.

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>>2113958
>What the fuck is gentle dom?
Forceful snuggling?

>>2113638
Is that like canon material? Looks like the official posters though. Or just one talented artist haha.

>>2114101
It really is great art. I'm not judging the pair since people like different things, but has MamiKyo ever been so much as implied in the show? I don't see the chemistry at all.

>>2114110
In TDS you could say it's somewhat implied, if you are up for a little creative interpretation. Even there though, they are not cast as a pair, there is just a close enough relationship presented for some people to ship it.
Unlike the Sayaka X Homura ship which make absolutely no sense whatsoever, I guess that one is based purely off aesthetic appeal, black and blue does look pretty good together.

>>2114101
Why did this post get deleted? There shouldn't be anything wrong with giving something criticism, provided it doesn't involve telling other posters to slit their throats and die.

>>2114110
They don't interact once on the series, 'cept for that brief moment after Madoka makes her wish and she's discussing with Kyouko and Mami.
However, it's implied they at least knew each other by the name simply because of the magical girl territorial system.
The pair mostly grew due to Memories of You and The Different Story.
It should be non-existent but people would pair Any character up with so much as said characters looking at each other.

That post was removed? Are we not allowed to comment something negative here? I feel this board is a hugbox compared to other boards here.

>>2114126
>memories of you
Fuck, my bad. Meant Farewell Story.

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>>2114126
>They don't interact once on the series, 'cept for that brief moment after Madoka makes her wish and she's discussing with Kyouko and Mami.
Mami did die pretty early though, and before Kyoko made it to Mitakihara. Then when Sayaka says "Mami is dead because of magical girls like you" Kyoko seems to take particular offence to it, instantly go from some slight bullying to "OK now that pisses me off" and seriously trying to hurt Sayaka.

>>2114139
You've misunderstood that, it's really not hard to since Kyouko's blows should've put Sayaka on a comatose state but due to Sayaka's healing ability allowing her to take heavy damage and still get back up.
Kyouko gets ticked off.
It's funny how constantly this argument is brought up, and how easy it is to debunk it by simply what Kyouko literally says.

>>2114099
Just one talented artist!

>>2114142
I dunno, tie that to Mami's statement about how she knows girls who have made wishes for other people and it's enough to imply Mami and Kyouko knew each other. Kyouko even makes statements about Mami later after that fight.

>>2114142
True, and if the series is taken alone it couldn't mean anything at all. If you factor in their list friendship from tds and kyokos inability to deal with grief and sadness (instead opting for violence and anger) it makes sense that Sayakas words may have hurt her on a somewhat deeper level then she was willing to reveal

>>2114146
>Mami's statement about how she knows girls who have made wishes for other people and it's enough to imply Mami and Kyouko knew each other. Kyouko even makes statements about Mami later after that fight.
I'll admit, I'm a bit rusty on this since it's been a while that I've seen the series. Frankly, I don't recall Mami implying she ever knew Kyouko outside of her name.
Kyouko was also just trying to trigger Sayaka by insulting Mami.
>>2114147
I'm just arguing with what was factually stated in the series by the character herself. Outside material has no relevance.

>From /meduka/
>Mami, Kyouko, Wraithdoka got defeated, most probably killed by the "witch" that is a conglomerate of tons of wraiths with creepy familiars who have Homura's face cut in half.
>Semi-coma Homura awakes by watching Wraithdoka got defeated.
>Narrator suddenly implies that all the things were caused by Homura's buckler in the end of chapter.

Looks like they're going to rewind and Homura's "heart" will stay dead.

Wraith arc shouldn't have happened. It carries nothing to the plot and it's just another spin-off with wasted potential.

>>2114167
What else were they going to do? Worth it all for Wraithdoka desu

>>2114175
It could've actually been good. Could've been believably a prequel to Rebellion.
Wraith-doka wasn't necessary either.

>>2114175
This. Wraithdoka made everything worth it.

>>2114183
Homura forgets Madoka, despairs, and Kyubey traps her gem in the isolation field. That's all they had to work with from the Rebellion guide books. It wasn't great, but there really wasn't much to be done outside of Homu despairing.

>>2113958
Madoka tenderly showing Homu just how much she loves her.

>>2114163
Homura's heart or feelings / emotions whatever you call it can't remain dead because the canon (Rebellion) shows her with her soul gem totally full and her bow. Also, if Homura can't have all her soul back by the end of Wraith arc then Rebellion wouldn't have happened, since Homura's love for Madoka and desire to keep her happy is why Rebellion ending exists. I bet Wraith Arc Homura will get her "heart" back in a likely stupid or ilogical way but well, this manga shows Hanokage should keep drawing and nothing else. All the drama was irrelevant

>>2114264
>Homura's heart or feelings / emotions whatever you call it can't remain dead because the canon (Rebellion) shows her with her soul gem totally full and her bow.

She'll get all her feelings back. Except Ai, who has yet to arrive.

>>2114267
Ai is herself , look at her dress and description which say Ai looks good being all by herself, is a demon and the other claras support her. Again, if Homura lacks love, Rebellion can't exist.

>>2114276
Plus Rebellion also shows Ai dressed ad magical girl Madoka

>>2114276
Homura didn't feel love because the thing she loved was gone and she thought she made it up.

>Homura: Because I remembered why I repeated time and suffered over and over again; my feelings for Madoka, they run so deep that even pain has become precious to me. And as for my Soul Gem? A curse isn't what's tainted it.
>Homura: Something you can't understand, Incubator. It is the pinnacle of all human emotion. More passion than hope, much deeper than despair. Love!

She didn't "feel" love until that point.

>>2114286
Cont.

Unrelated but I have no clue how someone reads that platonically.

>>2114286
Homura has loved Madoka since the first timeline until wraiths ate her emotions. In Rebellion, due to her being brainwashed like everybody else, she forgot about everything, but in her barrier she shows again to be much more close to Madoka than to the others. When she said "Because I remembered everything", she means all the timelines, not something else. It's clear Homura never forgot Madoka during Wraith Arc, she just convinced herself those memories were fake. Even though Madoka stopped existing, Homura's feelings for her remained the same until fucking wraiths defeated her. So yes , she was able to love someone who didn't exist

>>2114289
Definitely not platonic or friendly , people who says that are homophobic dicks

>>2114289
It just cannot be platonic or friendly. Who refers to her love for her friend like that?

>>2114296
I agree with you, I just interpret that her general love and that emotion "love" are separate things, if that makes sense.

>>2114319
TDS is based on CD Drama 3 , written by Urobuchi so yeah it is canon. You can say TDS is not canon, but the past Mami snd Kyoko shared is official.

>>2114319
Sorry hypotheticals offend you so much. And I think an officialy produced manga has at least a little more credibility than a random fan made fic.

What's with mods deleting things whenever someone is at a disagreement with each other? Are we not aloud to discuss the series with each other? Is /u/ ONLY suppose to be an image dump bored? Should we just take this to /a/? What's going on here?

>>2114330
Probably because they called someone "retarded".

>>2114325
>TDS is based on CD Drama 3 , written by Urobuchi so yeah it is canon
Actually, Farewell Story was witten by Masaki Hiramatsu, who also wrote TDS and adapted the CD3 into the first volume.
Please so your research before spreading fallacies on this thread.
>>2114325
>You can say TDS is not canon, but the past Mami snd Kyoko shared is official.
It's official in some side material, sure. But it's not canon to the story because there are no implications that support it.

>>2114330
Because that's the state we're in. There are so many fucking trolls and spergs that I'm not even sure when an anon has a legitimate disagreement/alternative view or is just being a dick.

>>2114336
Everybody calls each other "retard" all the time in /u/, what's new?

>>2114341
Honestly, the moderation here is just biased.
Anything they don't approve of is removed for their own personal reasons rather than actually enforcing rules.
I tend to notice that when I visit here.

>>2114338
>It's official in some side material, sure.
I'm willing to believe that due to it's popularity, it was made canon retroactively. In Homura's barrier, Kyouko states that Mami invited her to Mitakihara. There was no reason for her to say that or for Homura to incept that memory other than as a nod. Considering Rebellion was done after FWS/TDS and the PSP game (which Butcher actually did work on and which had that plot line included), it's possible he liked the idea of it and included it. It also just kinda works: Mami being their mentor is the one thing all the girls have in common.

>>2114330
It is because Richard Nixon basically lives here. Presumably some of these "waaah mods deleted muh opinion" posts are him as well since he has a personal vendetta with certain mods.

If you lurk enough you will usually be able to tell at glance which posts are his, but there are always people in every thread too new to know so he never goes away. If you want to be sure you can post an image to trigger him but in this case there is no need, since he was the 13th post in the thread. (now deleted)

Mentioning TDS is one of the things that sets him off, because they believe it is crack and/or supports people's arguments for crack and crack is worse than genocide to him.

The one sentence post that was deleted only has like a 50% chance of being his but whatever, mods are probably tired of banning him multiple times a day every day for over a year and just don't give a shit. I wouldn't have done it but I don't blame them.

>>2114319 was deleted before I could see it but it sounds like at least that was him for sure.

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1/3
It's implied Mami and Kyouko have history. But only a sperg would get offended by the fact two girls used to work together.

Kyouko's first spoken line was in reference to Mami.

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>>2114360
2/3
That also implies history. And no, she did not get angry because Sayaka wouldn't back down. Her face changes right at the mention of Mami. That doesn't imply they fucked, but it certainly implies they knew each other.

>>2114360
I'm sure TDS haters are kyosaya fags

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>>2114361
3/3
>Bad things happen to girls who make wishes for other people
Why would Mami know this? Oh yeah, because Kyouko was one of those girls.

It's more likely that the material that became Farewell Story just ended up on the cutting room floor because they couldn't find a place to throw it in there.

>>2114363
But why? TDS is barely MamiKyou. Are they that fucking insecure in their ship? Kyouko resolves to die with Sayaka. Kyouko chooses to die over staying with Mami. It is still KyouSaya.

>>2114365
In TDS since Mami is alive after Kyoko arrives, Kyoko has to choose whether die with Oktavia to "be by her side" or stay alive and be with Mami. She chooses to kill Oktavia , then used her grief seed on Mami to keep her alive and then Kyoko died fighting another witch because her soul gem was very tainted after two fights (Mami and Oktavia ) and she really needed a grief seed. So there's way more KyoMami in TDS than KyoSaya, and even shows Mami is more important to her Sayaka. Of course there is no yuri, Mami is like her sister and Kyoko was crying after she killed Oktavia, but KyoSaya is mere friendship too.

>>2114382
Mami is more important to her than Sayaka* fixed it, a word was missing

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>>2114380
The girls at school are teasing Mami because she has a boyfriend. Little do they know she has a "magical girl friend". TDS is littered with that.

>>2114382
Literally Kyouko's dying thoughts in her last moments.

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>>2114389
As long as they aren't being Charlie and visciously attacking anyone that ships the canon pairings and who doesn't ship crack then is it really an issue? No matter what anyone says, it isn't going to change the fact MadoHomu and KyouSaya (MamiNagi to a much lesser extent) are the actual pairings of the series. If someone wants to pretend that MamiKyou used to be a thing, then why are we going to waste time dispelling those harmless delusions?

>>2114398
I don't ship them, but it's obvious what the author was teasing. And that's all it was: teasing.

>>2114389
You sure are butthurt about other ships existing, ACK.

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I will never understand why ACK is so angry at this ship, I guess it's jealousy.

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>>2114420
You sure got a lot of pent-up anger there.

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>>2114411
>It's a drag arguing with kyoumamifags constantly here with the same recycled argument over and over.

That is a lot of autism over the sanctity of chinese cartoon lesbians. Not sure anyone in the history of /u/ ever cared this much about anything.

>>2114427
Why are you here?

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>>2114441
It's a yuri board, for yuri images. I don't see why we should hold back on posting pairings just because one person flies off the handle over some pairings. They can just reign themselves in a bit.

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It's a sequel to the Christmas story from Madokami's perspective!

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>>2114454

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>>2114655
HNNNGGGGG

>>2114656
Odd, the Goddess and a Clara Doll.... You know The Devil can't be happy about that.

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>>2114680
The agreement in the previous doujinshi was that Devil Homura and human Madoka get to spend the next 100 years together as humans. At the end of the doujinshi, Madokami is shown with Ai watching over them. This one is the B track, showing Madokami meeting Ai.

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>>2114684
From the previous doujinshi "A Century in Your Silver Garden"

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Sutema A6 from Kirara 6 in english, while we wait for Wraith Arc.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/e173k19vbej8d2q/%5BSGT%5D_Kirara_Magica_Vol_6_-_Sutema%21_I_found_a_magical_girl_A_%28Yamada_Ishito%29.zip

>>2114684
I don't think I like the idea that Madoka and Madokami are separate entities.
I don't think it's true.

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>>2114687
Mami is going to give Hitomi some forbidden love.

>>2114688
Obviously it isn't because it's doujinshi.

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>>2114688
>I don't think I like the idea that Madoka and Madokami are separate entities.
Also, better get used to it.

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Wraithdoka BTFO

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I like Wraithdoka because she's Homura's gay incarnate.

>>2114701
But that's just metaphorical.

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>>2114711
Just saying, you might as well get used to it. Lizard girl kidnapped the human half of the goddess and brought it to earth after all.

>>2114708
Homura must be gay only with Madoka, not even with a fake who looks and acts like Madoka, just with Madoka. I don't approve this

>>2114729
In Homu's defense, Wraithdoka was gay at her, not with her.

>>2114744
sorry bro, english is not my first language so sometimes I fuck up there trying to difference on , in , at , etc

>>2114755
You were right, anon was not correcting your grammar

>>2114764
Then I didn't understand what anon meaned

>>2114777
Basically they're saying that it wasn't mutual love. Wraithdoka was taking Homura's memories of Madoka, then acting like a gayer Madoka to sort of manipulate her. It wasn't something mutual and cute like, say, Luminous.

>>2114805
manipulate her? I thought everything she said was actually how Homura really felt but didn't want to admit. Sure, it's a wraith (her enemy), but is one that was born from Homura's emotions so...
btw I don't see how Wraithdoka was gay towards her. Imho she acted like the real Madoka who somentimes got too friendly with Homura in the past timelines

>>2114884
There's a difference between having negative thoughts and having somebody exploit and reinforce those negative thoughts.

One can have suicidal thoughts but never act on them or make them known. However if one has suicidal thoughts and a malicious actor reinforces those thoughts and causes the person to commit suicide, then the malicious actor is responsible for a crime. The Wraiths are explicitly the later.

Homura having doubts and fears would be a normal part of being human (Mami regretting not saving her parents or Kyouko regretting her fighting with Sayaka are similar). In this instance, MadoWraith is a malicious actor because it took on the form purposely and behaviour meant to exploit Homura's (and the other girls) weaknesses. Unlike Mami, who had already come to accept her parents deaths and knew theyd be proud of the person she became, and Kyouko, who knew Sayaka would never be so cruel and underhanded as the wraith, Homura had no way to verify that Madoka existed and prove the wraith wrong, thus could only have those doubts reinforced.

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Are autistic Kyoumamifags sperging out again?

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>>2114963
Not as austistics as KyoSayafags

But things aside, it appears THIS is the main antagonist of Wraith Arc

Not the Wraith, not Kyubey, not even Wraithdoka, but Homura' Shield

>>2114963
I love how butthurt you keep being. You're the gift that keeps on giving.

>>2114993
it is moksha wraith

>>2114993
COULD THIS GET ANY MORE RETARDED?! God, this is just making me angry now.

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>>2114993
>Homura's magical girl outfit and sheild
>No leggings
Come on, Hanokage. I am honestly just going edit and cut out everything that wasn't MadoWraith and Homura interaction and just pretend this series was about a lewd Wraith-chan trying to seduce and snuggle up with the goddess's beloved.

>>2115008

Have there been any evil nuts? Have any of the girls turned out to be clones?

>>2115019
>Clones
My god, it does reek of Hiramatsu all over, doesn't it? No nuts though.

>>2114684
Well that makes no real sense... The Devil is The Goddess opposite. Regardless of what Homura assumes to be true, they will always be in conflict abet indirectly. I don't believe that there is a world where the two will ever manage to come into contact... They are defined by the Law of Cycles themselves (The Devil moreso), and as such remain on the opposite side of a coin

Granted, that doesn't matter for yuri. But that would make this pure crack-fic.

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>>2115026
>Doesn't dualistic monism
It's all entry level Taoism. Two inherently different concepts bring balance to the universe by being in harmony rather than imbalance through conflict.

>>2114142
The "why the fuck won't you go down" and the "bitch don't tell me what Mami would do" reactions were two different parts, sis. The former came after Kyouko smacked Sayaka around for the latter.

Kyouko was /pissed/ at Sayaka bringing up Mami during that fight.

>>2115008
>Symbol of Homura's bloody minded purpose and back biting wish reflexively kicking into gear
>Homulilly has back biting Shield familiars in Rebellion, symbolizing the negative repercussions of her wish
>Strands of fate, consistently shown as a symbol of Homura's suffering, propping up her gear
>Shit kicks in as Homura flips out over not being able to save Madoka again as her memories return, even if it's a lewd pink fake

Are you sure you aren't the retarded one here, sis?

>>2115057
There's a difference between metaphor and symbolism and something as hamfisted as this. That is why it's retarded. As you said, this was already addressed by the imagery in the series. This was already addressed by the imagery in Rebellion. The repercussions of this were already shown in Rebellion. Wraith Arc is literally making wish the wish a villain. It's insulting to the reader.

>>2115065
Yes wraith arc is shit but at least there was a little kyomami in this chapter

>>2113733
>Also apparently the dub is actually very good in the movies, but I can't be bothered to confirm that myself.
Can confirm that the voice acting in the movies are a lot better than in the series. Character VA's who may have had some issues here and there are practically null at this point.

>>2115000
Really no one is quite as butthurt as the Kyoumamifags who can't accept that Kyousaya is the canon pairing.

>>2115149
There is no proof it's canon. Kyoko died for Sayaka in the anime and for Mami in TDS. And friends hold hands as well. I don't know what other arguments you have to call it canon, you asshole

>>2115153
This.

>>2115153
TDS literally never happened. Like it was negated. Kyouko remembers none of it. Sayaka might know, but Sayaka isn't going to tell because that would cause problems for her and Cheese Louise.

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I want them to make beautiful music together.

>>2115153
I can't believe someone on /u/ is saying that the handholding scene had 0 romantic connotations.

>>2115218
Some posted earlier that YinYang was crack. I really don't know what's wrong with this thread. It's either bait or /u/ really did go to shit.

>>2115221
The only shit is the fact that /u/ is full of threads about subtext animes like this one and retards who claim pairings like Kyoko and Sayaka are canon. Go on, ship whatever you want, but don't call canon to something is not

>>2115223
Why come here and start shit? You're starting shit with KyouSayafags over your non-existent ship.
>B-but TDS
If we include spin-off manga, than Kyouko and Sayaka are already 100% gay. "Mutual Lovers" is their damn Shipping Pentagram event. KyouMami is non-existent in there and that game pandered hard to shippers.

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>>2115065
Are you honestly bootyblasted about symbolic consistency between works? I've honestly never seen that before.

Also stop responding to ACK or whoever this cocksucker is.

>>2115240
Im just anally annihilated by the presentation and how off the rails it's getting.

>>2115218
The true is that there is and there isn't. Hand-holding isn't a sure fire sign of one's affection to another, there is a great deal of context of a relationship that is missing.

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Why can't we all just get along?

Mami likes the both of them in TDS, not just Kyouko.

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>>2115364
Maitake knows what's up.

>>2115364
Mami is just a girl crazy lesbian who keeps going after younger and younger girls.

>>2115400
>good person
>tells others which opinios are the "correct" opinions
>feeling rewarded about posting on an image board

>>2115418
Don't argue with crazy, they are incapable of understanding what is and isn't real.

>>2114360
>>2114361
>>2114364
Kyouko and Mami have history together.
In "The Different Story" (spinoff manga) Mami is the main character and it's shown how exactly Kyouko becomes the girl she is now.
Timelines and all, but I'm guessing the same thing happenened in this one too, which means that Mami is Kyouko's senpai. She taught her everything she knows.
Kyouko just decided that "she wasn't good enough to be Mami's friend", as Mami is always this perfect character.

Also explains why Mami broke down crying and explaining how weak she is to Madoka in the uh 3rd episode in the anime.

>>2115462
I... uh... hm?

it's actually my first time posting in this thread, I just, uh, lurk /u/.
t-thanks

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>>2115462
can you just shut the fuck up and post yuri pls

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>>2115482
This

>>2115475
Don't take it personally. Crack-kun is just like that.

Ignore and report.

>>2113958
>pedophile
They're only like 5 years apart, at most.

>>2115544
Still a pedo. As long as you are an adolescent or older attracted to a child or children you are a pedophile.

Not saying anything about it morally, that is just the literal definition. This also assumes they don't have just a mother/daughter relationship obviously.

If we are talking about how legal their relationship is then it would depend on where they are. No idea what japan's laws are for that but in burgerland it is all over the place and would be like 50/50, and some times the type of sex being had is just as important as the age. Oddly enough their relationship would swing in and out of being illegal like every other year in most places too.

Homura will get her huge powers back and defeat this wraith. There is no clear evidence that Mami and Kyouko has died at all.

>>2115613
>There is no clear evidence that Mami and Kyouko has died at all.
Their gems are severely blackened. Homura will either force a reset or it will rain grief cubes when she kills it. I'm more concerned about how they'll wrap things up. We only have one chapter left.

>>2115617
But how she'll reset everything? She doesn't have time manipulation powers now

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I hope in the next project Sayaka ends up in bed with Kyouske.
A heart broken Kyoko goes back to her old senpai for comfort. and she and Mami fall in love all over again. They join Homura in destroying the goddess and her LOC lackeys.

Human Madoka later enters for ballet at the Olympics. She comes very close to bringing home the gold medal for Japan but alas only ends up with a silver. Still, she thanks Homura in her acceptance speech for all those late nights helping her train.

On the drive back home she asks Homura. "Do you think I'll get gold in the next Olympics?"
Homura responds. "Sure." Dramatic close up. "It's only a matter of TIME."

Roll credits.

>>2115694
>Implying this story is in any way restricted by logic
The shield is right there.

>>2115708
Pure kino right there.

>>2115708
violinbwoy can barely be with Hitomi without severely neglecting her in favor of his instrument. I doubt he'd try for an affair.

>>2115708
Did you actually think this was a good post when you made it.

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>>2115708
>Human Madoka later enters for ballet at the Olympics.

I think it'd be better if the Holy Sextet formed an ice hockey team. But that's just me.

>>2115773
>Holy Sextet formed an ice hockey team
BasedWaifuBrettFavre?

>>2115773
I'm pretty sure Madoka and Sayaka don't have it in them to play Ice Hockey.

>>2115776
Sadly, no. I'm waiting for my AOO account to go through so I can message them. Once that happens, I'll ask yall for questions to give to them

>>2115800
I take it you haven't read the "best" fanfic on the net?
>Madoka Kaname has superstar potential as a playmaking center, Homura Akemi's only interaction with magic is the nickname of her childhood idol, "Magic Man" Pavel Datsyuk, Tiro Finale is a cute nickname for Mami Tomoe's slap shot, "Good and bad have to balance out" was Kyoko Sakura's excuse for her crappy plus/minus rating and when Sayaka Miki was trying to convince her mother to let her skip school and watch Game 5 of the 2010 Eastern Conference Quarterfinal between the Washington Capitals and her beloved Montreal Canadiens, she blurted out "Magic and miracles are real! The Habs are gonna win today!"
>With dreams of making the NHL, a whole lot of growing up to do and a lot of stuff to discover, this journey begins with a single stride.
>So make a contract with me, and play for my team.

>>2115760
Not really. No.

>>2115828
I don't understand it, but I can't stop reading it

And the new doujin from citron. I hope it will be scanned fast.
Forest village seems like doesn't draw Madoka anymore.

>>2115828
This reminds me of that post-rebellion fanfic where Madoka picked up smoking and drinking before becoming addicted to math. Math, not meth.

Then Gandhi was their school teacher for some reason and ranted about the ubermench in front of Homura and got Madoka addicted to civilization games.

I felt a very strange sadness when I realized that fic was left unfinished.

>>2115945
That sounds like the plot of a dream you had. The random mashing together of concepts just fits the dream pattern. Is that fanfic real? Can you link.

>>2115966
Took me awhile but I found it.

http://archiveofourown.org/works/2293748/chapters/5043755

I was deeply confused at first because I kept finding deleted links to fanfics and accidently found a different fic with Madoka and Gandhi. Thought I might have really dreamed it.

Not sure why there are so many. I remember a few Madoka+Civ quest threads on tg forever ago too. I assume it is because the Madoka mod for civ5 is really really good.

>>2116000
Literally what the fuck?

>>2116000
Hmm, this kind of thing is manufactured absurdity so it isn't fun. It's trying too hard to be weird. Something like Leave it on the Ice, however, is just naturally bad and is influenced by how the author doesn't understand anything outside of hockey terms so dense that the only people who can understand what's going on in those matches are people who play high-level hockey themselves.

>>2115269
I think you answered your own question. If you only had the handhoding without any sort of context besides the fact that they're handholding just because then I would have agreed that there isn't anything deep to that scene. But the thing that makes it yuri-esque in my opinion is what Sayaka says during the handhod, yes you can deny it all you want but I think it's obvious that the intention of that scene was to push forward Kyouko and Sayaka's relationship

>>2116000
Is this autism?

>>2116425
The Magical Quartet teases a lot. So there is a lot to read into...
I think that the biggest thing that imply any sort of relationship happens to be what a person does when the other is distressed. And Kyouko goes out of her way to attempt to ease Sayaka's suffering, something that (by Rebellion) Sayaka appreciates and values.
There are things that are said in both periods that could mean several things depending on the emotion context and that is something that the Magical Quartet seems to work around of (despite the fact that the group wouldn't mind) with both Kyouko and Sayaka. On a emotional level, the Quartet have not been clear on how Kyouko or Sayaka view of the other.


Personally, I view it as a relationship in a somewhat romantic context. If only because a lot of how they interact seem to point in that direction. There is a sense of personal space and banter that seems to imply that regardless of the situation they are comfortable with each other. And for me, it serves as a foil to Madoka and Homura... there is no power dynamic that complicates matters with Kyouko and Sayaka.

I'd say the biggest thing working against animated onscreen canonization of KyouSaya is how little a romantic relationship between them changes the plot. Rebellion ensured Homura homosexuality, reciprocated or not, will be a major plot point and Madoka returning Homura's love on screen dramatically effects how the story plays out.

KyouSaya is a more important pairing than MamiNagi, but I don't believe romantic KyouSaya changes the plot any more than coded language "best friend" KyouSaya with overtones. It's certainly more canon than KyouMami though.

>>2116567
I think that it what is so interesting about if there is a romantic context to everything that happened between the two. They more or less are just good natured friends that (if correct) simply grow into loving each other.
I find a story like that kind of cute, and given everything else in Puella Magi Madoka Magica... kind of therapeutic.

Again, that is *if* there is anything. Magical Quartet remain rather vague on that from all the official media (which doesn't mean a whole lot) they have amassed and you are right... If this turns out to be something of a red herring, it's doesn't change the nature of their interactions and relationship by much.


>Rebellion ensured Homura homosexuality, reciprocated or not, will be a major plot point...

That has more to do with the fact that Homura is central to the plot, and given the emotion turmoil that she is in after Rebellion is it hard to have a plot-line after that that simply doesn't address her and her emotions. It's the Neon Pink Elephant in the room.

Does that mean "Madoka returning Homura's love on screen dramatically effects how the story plays out" has to happen? Not really, no.

>>2116567
>Rebellion ensured Homura homosexuality
wasn't that obvious from the tv show?

>>2116567
Counterpoint: Kyousaya acts as the beta couple of the series. Their relationship can act as a foil to Madohomu and balance out the story so it isn't JUST about about Madoka and Homura being idiots about trying to bone one another.

Before I respond, I want to clarify that the only saying that the only reason where KyouSaya wouldn't get an unambigous confirmatiom would be because it's not central or very important to the plot, whereas the main relationship between Madoka and Homura has been central to the plot and franchise and at this point can't not be addressed. My view of official material is that KyouSaya is undoubtlely a thing, so before KyouSayafags get ass mad, I am just saying this would be the only reason I can see that it would stay strongly implied or all but said aloud.

>>2116939
>Simply grew to love each other
They used the same plot device Madoka and Homura did. Sayaka and Madoka didn't notice the actions of the one's who were reaching out for them, only more so on Madoka's end.

>That has more to do with the fact that Homura is central to the plot
Co-protagonist and driving force of the plot gets spot light. Imagine that.

>Does that mean "Madoka returning Homura's love on screen dramatically effects how the story plays out" has to happen? Not really, no.

It concludes a franchise long plot point and the answer cements the state that their relationship and the franchise concludes on. The either answer alters the outcome and thematic direction of the story. To pretend otherwise is stupid. If your saying Quartet can have her avoid this conversation, then you are significantly less likely to see any romantic KyouSaya interaction.

>>2116957
Subtextually yes, openly no. Homura actually saying she has love for Madoka makes her openly gay. Madoka has yet to give us an onscreen answer beyond Madoka loving to dry hump Homura in alleys and mount Homura on boats. Personally, it was obvious Homura was gay, but unambiguous animated material is what I'm referring to.

>>2116973
I completely agree with this.

>>2117022
Edit
>and at this point can't not be addressed. I'm taking Butcher's style of fast paced, relatively focused stories into account. My view of official material is that KyouSaya is undoubtlely a thing,

>>2117022
>>2117024
And before I forget, these posts were aimed at the KyouMami shipper who said KyouSaya only had subtext, not at KyouSaya.

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Anyone have any fanart of the Oriko Magica couple?

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>>2117464
There's not much. Madoka spinoffs don't get as much attention as the main series.

>>2115566
But only men can be pedophile.

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Well then, it's KiriOri time.

>>2118159
>>2118158
>>2118157
>>2118156
>>2118155
>>2118153
>>2118152
>>2118151
Who are these strange megucas?

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>>2118304
Best megucas.

>>2118304
The only ones to call Homura on her shit.

>>2118144
>only men can be pedophile.
Oh far from it, women pedophiles do (sadly) exist. That said, do to the rather large sigma for the victims, most female pedophiles largely go unreported... which is stupid beyond belief.

>>2118304
The first actual lesbian couple in Madoka.

>>2118312
Is that a doujin ? Or whatever it is link please

>>2118332
It's canon. Puella Magi Oriko Magica, one of the spinoff manga.

Oriko was right and did nothing wrong

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>>2118332
>Is that a doujin ?
Nah, it's official which only makes the very thick subtext in it more fun. Noisy Citrine was one of those extra chapters to Oriko Magica published in the old volumes of Kirara.
http://www.mediafire.com/download/fzx24v6faz8ikqk/

>>2118342
Thick subtext? I recall Kirika out right stating she loves Oriko.

>>2118342
Subtext? This is more canon than Homura's love for Madoka. In fact they are the only gay couple in Madoka franchise

>>2118344
They literally cut it off right before she says Oriko's name. Running the razor edge of yuri.

>>2118352
I literally just checked. When that witch interrupts their tea, Kirika shouts out "I love you" while she's talking to Oriko.

>>2118352
I think it's chapter 4 of PMOM. One of Kirika's crazy speeches.

>>2118344
>>2118349
Yeah, she does state that. She also talks to Kyubey about a "confession" and "romance" and reads yuri (presumably) manga in school in Noisy Citrine. Can't be more obvious than that.
But it is unknown whether Oriko returned her feelings in any of the timelines. They weren't ever shown being in an actual relationship, were they? Oriko always had something bigger, global even, on her mind and put her own feelings aside. Because of that she felt bad for Kirika in PMOM (as she knew she was using her trust and devotion).

>>2118342
>very thick subtext
What subtext? Kirika makes it clear and rather expletive that she wants into Oriko skirt, among other things.

In a way, she is kind of a proto-Homura, in that there is little to nothing that Kirika will not do should Oriko ask for it and that she manage to have Oriko as the centre of her little world. Elements that prove to be corrupting to the both of them.

>>2118371
We also have to consider that they're both insane, so Oriko may love Kirika, but still consider it okay to use her as a tool.

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By the way, does anyone have that little comic where Madoka already was a magical girl, so she and Homura just fucked that was in a few threads ago?

>>2118374
That's not immanent. In the timelines of the extras, where Oriko's path never crosses Homura's, they both act like normal megucas.

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>>2118372

>>2113624
I really, really, really like this picture.

>>2118349
How is it more canon? It sounds like every other ship in tbe series: gay magical girl dedicates themselves to a magical girl that is always looking in the other direction and doesn't care if their feelings are reciprocated. As >>2118371
stated, Oriko knows she's using Kirika's feelings. There has yet to be a two sided confirmation of feelings in a non-parody manga beyond subtext.

>>2118395
Well, Oriko does die trying to protect Kirika's corpse, which she wouldn't have done if she didn't care at all.

>>2118396
They also reunite in some kind of afterlife.

I want to read the other spin offs of Oriko but I can't find them

>>2118396
I don't doubt she loves Kirika. But on the canon end, it's still subtextual.

>>2118398
I'm a fan of those post-death segements from the early mangas. Poor Mami-san still dies forever alone in the series manga though.

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>>2118436
Fan scanlations had been available at silvergardentl.blogspot.com before the series got licensed. I suggest you contact them.

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>>2118387

>>2118398
I'm sure Kirika would rewrite the universe for Oriko if given the chance just like Homura did

>>2118460
Kirika takes on a lot of weird parallels with Homura with full Rebellion hindsight.

Though, notably in contrast to Madoka and Homura's relationship, Kirika is much more deferential to Oriko, while Homura ignores Madoka's own goals and intent to focus on saving her. So I wonder if, in an Orikami situation, Kirika wouldn't just go along with it until she got heaven'd.

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>>2118361
I think what the anon above meant was the ending of Noisy Citrine (see pic).
>>2118352
Makes me wonder what would the possible outcome of her confession be like. Would Oriko just keep on acting unaware and continue inquiring what Kirika means by that until the latter stumbles over her own words (and then tease her endlessly about this attempt) or would she accept her in the end? It's not like either Madoka or Homura contracted in the timeline, so until Walpurgisnacht she would have a plenty of time to come to a decision about herself and Kirika.

>>2118465
Kirika would be a zealous preacher swearing that this girl no one else has heard of is god.

>>2115708
>Silver medal
>Acceptance speech
It's not like she won an Emmy or something.

>>2118496
I also wonder if Kirika loves Oriko as much as Homura loves Madoka ... one kills magical girls and the other rewrote the universe

>>2118569
Orikiri is pretty clearly written as a counterpoint to Madohomu. Oriko is Madoka, but manipulative instead of innocent and proactive instead of reactive, while Kirika is Homura if her obsession was about "helping" rather than "saving".

Homuhomu is pretty high on the loveometer, though. Kirika's biggest feat of love is probably staying loyal to Oriko even after witching out, though whether that's the maximum is a different question.

>>2118581
I think Kirika's love is bigger than Homura's but in a yandere, twisted way. Homura wouldn't kill other magical girls even if Madoka asks her to, I think. After all, the reason Homura loves Madoka is because of her kindness. But Kirika did turn into a witch to protect her beloved just like Homura did, so it's not surprising that she would rewrite the universe if given the chance to.

>>2118636
Honestly, I'd think they're similarly twisted, but in a different way.

Homura might not have killed someone if Madoka asked her, but Homura's love isn't about what Madoka wants or needs Homura to do; Homura's focused on protecting her, regardless of what Madoka herself wants. I doubt Homura would bat an eye at killing other magical girls if she thought it would keep Madoka alive.

>>2118640
She could kill any maho shoujo , but I don´t think she would kill innocent people like Kirika did, especially Mami and Kyoko-

I think part of Kirika being so crazy in PMOM proper is that's the personality Oriko needed her to have. She's much more stable in the spinoffs when she's just hunting witches, so maybe Kirika's wish has something to do with it?

It's a shame that there's not much material with them. I'm not one to say no to more MadoHomu or KyouSaya but a few doujins with the peripheral megucas would be nice

>>2118444
Pre-Rebellion, Mami-san is everyone's side bitch, sis.

>>2118699
>maybe Kirika's wish has something to do with it?
Yeah, I got the impression that her wish was to be whatever Oriko wanted.
She hated who she was before.

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>>2118699
>a few doujins with the peripheral megucas would be nice
There is one, "Girls and the End of the World", with a rather fancy drawing style.
They can also eventually be seen in fanfiction. PMHM,however much it is disliked, clearly wins the prize for the best and the closest to canon depiction of them.

>>2118569
>I also wonder if Kirika loves Oriko as much as Homura loves Madoka ... one kills magical girls and the other rewrote the universe

Love might not be the word for it, there is definitely an attraction and lust on Kirika's end and much of Homura actions (both before and after rebellion) can be defined similarly. That said both suffer from an obsession with the object of their affection... how it works pans out differently based on the power dynamic that each character puts in place.

Kirika is willingly dependant on Oriko. Not only is Oriko the centre of Kirika's world, she practically defines it. Kirika at one point states that the only reason that she is a magical girl and does what she does is to be the kind of manic pixie dream girl Oriko can use. She wished for that much.
Something that racks Oriko with guilt, since she knows that she is abusing this to get what she wants out of Kirika and she would rather not need to manipulate her like this at all.

Homura... isn't like that at all. For her, what Madoka want means nothing to her. As long as she is "safe," that is all that matters. That is something that Homura will not allow Madoka to define either, if Rebellion has shown anything it is that. That said, you can't doubt that Madoka does means the world to her and, like Kirika with Oriko, practially defines her actions. It is just that there is a defining line when it comes to control. Homura does feel that she needs to control Madoka to some degree to get her to do what she wants, she lements at such in the series when Madoka doesn't fall into that while Rebellion... speaks volumes to how far that does go. It's vast.
And Madoka has NO IDEA of all of that, not until it is too late.

>>2118699
> so maybe Kirika's wish has something to do with it
Yes and no... It very much as something to do with it, because it is still defined by Oriko. She likely still wished to be a MG for the same reasons as PMOM proper. The difference is Oriko.... she is not targeting Kriemhild Gretchen (and by extention, Madoka), it's Walpurgisnacht and because of that she doesn't need to do much of what happens in PMOM proper.

>>2118786
>For her, what Madoka want means nothing to her.
Flower field scene. And yes, while Madoka has a very incomplete understanding of the circumstances, there is this to consider: if Madoka had an alternative to wishing herself into conceptuality, what decision would she have made? It's not so much that she wanted to make her wish, but rather that she had no other means to break the cycle of suffering, and was willing to bear the sacrifice it entailed because of the net good generated. In Homura's mind, she forced Madoka to bear that burden, when Homura should have been to bear it, and while she can't outright undo Madoka's wish, she can more-or-less assume Madoka's place as "god" and bear her burden instead, allowing Madoka to live a normal life. The "controlling" aspect only comes into play when Homura HAS to prevent certain actions which would unravel everything.

>>2118857
> Flower field scene
Again, yes and no.
That scene, more or less, demonstrates how much Homura and Madoka don't understand each other and again the gulf between them is VAST. Homura doesn't really care about anything outside of Madoka and almost all her concerns she shows for anyone else is view through a lens of what that means to Madoka, which is as true for the series as it is for rebellion itself. Almost everything that happened in Rebellion comes from the warped view that she MUST do what she does lest Madoka finds herself unhappy. However, that comes from her own interpretation, and Homura herself seems to view herself as the only one that can see fit to make Madoka happy. Unless Madoka is a docile, dependant shell of herself that does everything that Homura wants, "Madoka is unhappy".
This is despite Madoka saying otherwise. There is some regret over the need that the sacrifice had to happen. If she could avoid the situation that brought that about, she would likely do so. That said, if given the same situation, no matter how much power it gives her and no matter how unreachable it makes her, she's do it again. Madoka has no real sense of self, she'll do what she needs to survive but if a sacrifice is need to correct a massive wrong or make others happy, she'll do it. She always sees the needs of others greater than her own.

It is why I honestly think that Love isn't something that defines that relationship. Power does, however, in that Homura always sees herself as the lesser of the two. Everything that she has worked for, in both the Series and Rebellion, is an attempt to close that gap between them before Madoka sacrifices just about everything and manages to gain power beyond her.

>>2118857
> The "controlling" aspect only comes into play when Homura HAS to prevent certain actions which would unravel everything.
Not really, the controlling aspect comes into play the moment that Homura begins to realize that Madoka will always sacrifice herself. I think it's Episode 8 or 9, where an exasperated Homura (after putting bullet holes in the little white shit called Kyuubey) tearfully screams out as much wondering WHY she NEVER does what Homura wants or says. It would seems that at some point in Homura travels, she has at least come to understand that part of Madoka's nearly completely selfless nature but, like Kyuubey with humanity on a whole on the subject of emotions, has no real idea where this comes from.
Once Homura makes that realization, note how much trouble she goes through to keep Madoka out of the Magical Girl business. Homura has already decided what the best course of action against this is, and that is to give Madoka a wide enough birth from the business so she doesn't need to do anything. Part of what she does in Rebellion is, more or less, an extension of this thinking. If Madoka is normal, she must be "happy" because she doesn't need to sacrifice anything. Which again is contrary to what Madoka (even when de-powered) thinks on the same matter.

>>2118907
>Unless Madoka is a docile, dependant shell of herself that does everything that Homura wants, "Madoka is unhappy".
No. Homura doesn't care what Madoka does so long as it's not selfless to the point of near-suicidality (literal or metaphorical). Homura doesn't micromanage her; she's simply trying to steer Madoka away from ending her life.
And you more or less reiterated my point-- that Madoka would sacrifice herself every time it was necessary, because no positive alternative exists. This is exactly why Homura creates that alternative retroactively when she is able to do so.

>Power does, however, in that Homura always sees herself as the lesser of the two
For one, Homura has a deep-rooted and long-running sense of self-hatred in addition to putting Madoka on a pedestal to the point of basically worship. Secondly, Homura is at her happiest when she is submissive to Madoka.
However, Homura cannot bear to watch Madoka self-sacrifice while Homura "should" (in her own mind) be the one making that sacrifice for Madoka. The problem is that Madoka is unwilling so sacrifice anything for the greater good, except for herself, while Homura is unwilling to allow that sacrifice to fall upon Madoka-- anything else is fine. Since Madoka logically cannot be happy in a damned world, Homura makes an elaborate reconstruction to create a new sort of world order that falls upon herself to operate.

>>2118908
>the controlling aspect comes into play the moment that Homura begins to realize that Madoka will always sacrifice herself
Which directly leads into everything unraveling as I mentioned. This is notably twofold: Homura ends up betraying their promise, and Madoka ends up razing the planet as a witch. Homura simply cannot allow that, and has to use extreme preventative measures.

>If Madoka is normal, she must be "happy" because she doesn't need to sacrifice anything
While Madoka does have some degree of ennui, all things considered, she does have a very happy life. She's in the midst of a sort-of existential crisis, but that's normal, and moreover, she'd be able to move past it thanks to a supportive environment; it's a stage in growing up. Unless some terrible tragedy befell her, she would grow up happy.

>>2118907
I disagree with your reading on that scene anon. I do agree that it shows how Madoka and Homura don't understand each-other. However, I'm personally quite attracted to the idea that Madoka represents self-destructive selflessness, and Homura represents self-preservating selfishness. Themes of selfishness and selflessness are extremely common in Urobuchi's works after all. While he usually tends to be somewhat harsh on selfless characters (though often for other/additional reasons), I'd say Madoka overall presents it in the more positive light of the two, but that's neither here nor there.

Point I'm trying to make is, the flower scene demonstrate the gulf not between them as people, but rather in their beliefs. For Homura, Madoka is not merely selfless - she is self-destructive. She gives her self entirely for others. This kind of idealism is something fairly commonly criticized in media really, the idea that most people are likely to glorify selflessness in a general sense, but end up hating it when embodied by someone they're close to because it DOES hurt the people you love.

I could write a ton about it but word limit etc. To me, Homura's reaction in and from the flower scene doesn't indicate a need for control or love or ownership - it's rather her catalyst for seeing Madoka as someone who needs to be saved from herself.

Of course, even if we accept this theory, it doesn't mean I agree with Homura on that. But I definitely think there are good criticisms of selflessness that can be applied to Madoka (the character).

>>2118935
Well, Homura was never meant to be truly "right", despite what the meme would suggest. Justified, sure, but not righteous. By that same token, Rebellion also shows that at the same time, this also holds true for Madoka. Although, as I mentioned before, Madoka does not have an alternative option. The main point is that Madoka's wish was not the "golden solution" and that Homura's actions are a necessary step in realizing the best possible ending, which even so will be by no means perfect. At least, that's what I'd hope from the new project.

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>>2118907
>Homura doesn't really care about anything outside of Madoka and almost all her concerns she shows for anyone else is view through a lens of what that means to Madoka, which is as true for the series as it is for rebellion itself.
I get you don't like Homu, but this is a bald faced lie. Homura tries to stop Mami from dying and is saddened by her death. She tries to stop Kyouko from dying and mourns when Kyouko dies. Homura doesn't have to be friends with Sayaka and their dislike is mutual, but Sayaka's animosity to Homura is stronger than Homura's toward her.

In Rebellion, Homura still gives everyone a happy end and there's no reason to believe this is underhanded in nature. Even the fucking loli that Madoka doesn't even know is there.

>Homura herself seems to view herself as the only one that can see fit to make Madoka happy
This is never implied at all. Homura doesn't even involve herself in Madoka's personal world unless it related to becoming a magical girl. At no point does Homura even claim to be the one who makes Madoka happy.

>Power does, however, in that Homura always sees herself as the lesser of the two.

A promise to save Madoka from becoming a magical girl/dying defined their relationship. Reminder that only one of Madoka's wishes wasn't a complete waste.

>>2118908
>Not really, the controlling aspect comes into play the moment that Homura begins to realize that Madoka will always sacrifice herself.
If Madoka becomes a magical girl any time after timeline 3, the world would be destroyed within 10 days. It was a necessity that Homura prevent Madoka from contracting under any circumstance.

>>2118935
>This kind of idealism is something fairly commonly criticized in media really, the idea that most people are likely to glorify selflessness in a general sense, but end up hating it when embodied by someone they're close to because it DOES hurt the people you love.
>Rune translation: They glorify death

>>2118970
Homura doesn't give a fuck about the world being destroyed or herself dying. Rebellion proved that. If she has to die to protect Madoka she will do it. So she continues to reset time because she wants to save Madoka, not because she is concerned about the world being destroyed if Madoka contracts.

>>2118983
>Homura doesn't give a fuck about the world being destroyed
How the hell is Madoka supposed to live a happy life in a doomed world? She HAS to care for the world in order to ensure Madoka's happiness. Sure, she holds the world in disdain in an emotional sense, put out of pragmatism, she needs to ensure its stability. If it was as easy as giving up her life to protect Madoka, Homura would have done it with a smile on her face.

>>2118983
>Homura doesn't give a fuck about the world being destroyed
Obviously she's soulless and evil.

>Rebellion proved that
Where's that part where she said she'd be cool with the world being destroyed? And don't even bring up the Sayaka baiting.

> If she has to die to protect Madoka she will do it.
That's assumed. That still doesn't mean she willingly puts people in danger.

>So she continues to reset time because she wants to save Madoka, not because she is concerned about the world being destroyed if Madoka contracts.
They're two in the same. She has more reason to stop her from contracting because of that.

>>2118988
How is it assumed ? She became a witch and thought she would be killed and still accepted it because that way Madoka would be saved by Kyubey in Rebellion.

> I think anon means that Homura doesn't care about the world if Madoka is not in it (?) Sure Wraith Arc showed Homura doesn't think high of being saved or protect the world if Madoka doesn't exist. Madoka did not exist in wraiths world but Homura continued to protect the world for her and longed for seeing her again someday, once she convinced herself Madoka is not real she stopped caring about the world and her soul finding peace

>>2118991
> saved from Kyubey I fucked up there

>>2118991
It's assumed that Homura was willing to die for Madoka. But she'd die if it meant something (killing Walpurgisnacht), not for fun or anything.

>She became a witch and thought she would be killed and still accepted it because that way Madoka would be saved by Kyubey in Rebellion.
I don't see where we're in disagreement.

> think anon means that Homura doesn't care about the world if Madoka is not in it (?) Sure Wraith Arc showed Homura doesn't think high of being saved or protect the world if Madoka doesn't exist. Madoka did not exist in wraiths world but Homura continued to protect the world for her and longed for seeing her again someday, once she convinced herself Madoka is not real she stopped caring about the world and her soul finding peace
The world wasn't in danger from anything at that point. If Madoka didn't exist and she had no idea what she wished for, then her point of being a magical girl and dying for the sake of the universe didn't mean anything. Her existential crisis took precedence over the non-existent threat to the universe at that point in time

>>2119004
cont

Rather than assumed, I should have said " a given".

>>2118935
This ain't Eva, sis: I don't believe miscommunication has that much of a bearing on things by Rebellion. Wot I see it as, since it is a Butch Gen joint, is a conflict of ideals and the folly of zealotry. See also: KyouSaya.

Madoka and Homura are incredibly similar people at the jump: self-loathing, meek, nebbish types who desperately need self-actualization. Madoka internalizes it as self effacing selflessness, while Homu externalizes it as bloody-minded, fuck the world determination. At the end of the day though, they're both willing to sacrifice everything to make people happy; Madoka just thinks a lot bigger.

The Friendzoned By God scene and the Flower Field scene, in my reading, is the presentation that Madoka totally gets how similar they are, which is why she loves Homu for Homu. She knows Homura has always looked out for her and lets Homu be her protector forever more (end of series), then praises Homu for her hard work/thanks her for the vacation from being a concept (flower field).

Cont'd

>>2119018
Now the problem is when Homu's faith wavers, she panics and does crazy shit. Wraith Arc, from reading with my limited Moon, seems to be this as much as it is getting away with making a Madoka who is truly Lewd Pink. Homu starts doubting Madoka ever existed or if she really loved her, which makes her struggles meaningless. In Rebellion, the Flower Field scene makes Homu doubt Madoka becoming a concept was a good idea and if she really protected Madoka from shit. Also note, Homura doesn't fully Witch out and become Homulilly until Coobs reveals his mad scientist scheme to anal probe Madokami. Until Madoka is deliberately and directly threatened. Her desire to protect Madoka overrides all, so she defaults to fuck the world determination with VERY OBVIOUS suicidal self-destructive overtones.

Also note, Madokami's side bitch Sallaka deliberately calls out Homu on this twice in Rebellion: Once cryptically after the Mami fight, and again blatantly obviously with the Homulilly fight. She knows how this story ends, but Homu won't listen to the blunette she kind of hates/feels cucked by.

This isn't miscommunication, it's deliberate ignorance. Homu Knows Best, so she's willing to distance herself from everyone and everything (including her god's love) in order to feel like she did something. She's obviously miserable, but misery is her default state.

It's sad, since the rest of the Holy Quintet are perfectly willing to help Homu, but she just has to be on her Dark Knight shit.

>>2119018
>I don't believe miscommunication has that much of a bearing on things by Rebellion
One of the major points of the series is that Homura is a Cassandra-- she know the truth that nobody will believe until it's too late. That is failed communication. As for Rebellion, if Sayaka had sat down and explained everything to Homura in clear terms, would she have not gone along with the plan instead of trying to pull the devil stunt?

>>2119018
> I don't believe miscommunication has that much of a bearing on things by Rebellion.

It was a scene and scenario that was specifically written to prevent Madoka from speaking with Homura with full knowledge of her existence. Miscommunication isn't the entirety, but it's a significant factor in how things turned out.

I'm fucking sick of people saying Homura doesn't care at all about what Madoka wants and is just a controlling bitch. I bet these homuhaters are retarded sayakafags

I forgot to mention:

>>2119018
>This ain't Eva, sis
It kind of is, actually, in that the shows present thorough dissections of their respective characters' psychologies, and put them in scenarios that bring their flaws to light.

>>2119018
>She knows Homura has always looked out for her and lets Homu be her protector forever more (end of series)
Madoka disappears forever and is forever alone as the grief sink of the universe and Homura has nothing to live for. That was the ending to the series. Madoka at no point allows Homura to protect her.

>then praises Homu for her hard work/thanks her for the vacation from being a concept (flower field).
The only way that whole scenario was possible was because Kyubey trapped them and made both Homura and Madoka forget their previous existences. That wasn't a vacation.

>>2119019
>Her desire to protect Madoka overrides all, so she defaults to fuck the world determination with VERY OBVIOUS suicidal self-destructive overtones.
She was singularly responsible for revealing Madoka to Kyubey. She had reason to be suicidal and the ending of Rebellion focused on two things: he reversion of Madoka into a human girl and the subjugation of the Incubator race. Whether Homura's methods are right or wrong in regard to Madoka ignores the point that Kyubey is a constant threat to Madoka even if Homura had gone to heaven with her.

>>2119042
>She was singularly responsible for revealing Madoka to Kyubey.
"Singularly" isn't entirely true. The Incubators knew about the Law of Cycles; Homura gave them a large clue about its modus operandi. It's not impossible to think they would have found it out later even if Homura had mentioned nothing.

>>2119034
I don't want to assume all Homu criticism is HomuHate or bait, but that anon's reading ignores and twists more than a few events of the series.

>>2119043
Curiosity is illogical. They would have never been interested because they don't care for doing things for the sake of doing then. The only reason they were interested was because of witches and the efficiency that a system like that would bring. There entire reasoning was to turn all magical girls into witches. Had they not known about witches, they would not have cared.

>>2119047
Curiosity for the sake of curiosity is illogical. Curiosity for the sake of some tangible goal is not. How then, if not for curiosity, could the Incubators determine that overcoming entropy, a thermodynamic principle, is possible?

>>2119050
Meant practical goal, not tangible goal.

>>2119050
They have no tangible goal if they don't know why witches don't exist. This isn't up for debate. They state this themselves and didn't care enough to try anything in the thousands of years prior.

>>2119053
The goal is "how do we manipulate the Law of Cycles to increase energy output?" This is no less vague than something like "how do we exploit a system in order to circumvent the Second Law of Thermodynamics?" especially when you consider that Madoka is essentially a universal law. Not to mention they probably spent millions of years on the second question before establishing a system based on human emotion.

>>2118928
> Homura doesn't micromanage her; she's simply trying to steer Madoka away from ending her life.
An entire universe being "perfect" at the end of rebellion says otherwise. For Madoka to not see a means to sacrifice herself, Homura decides to control just about everything. Not only about her but anything that can possibly effect her, with is to say (at the height of Madoka's power) EVERYTHING.

> For one, Homura has a deep-rooted and long-running sense of self-hatred in addition to putting Madoka on a pedestal to the point of basically worship.
True, which makes of part of that issue because, ultimately ,Homura has no real hope in superseding the image of Madoka that she puts forward. It's why Madoka is a god to be honest, that image plus Homura focus on just her via the time-loops brought about the scenario that made Madoka into what she is.
> Secondly, Homura is at her happiest when she is submissive to Madoka.
This I will argue, which makes the rest of your statement moot because not matter how much she looks submissive... Homura is very far from that.
She isn't really honest with herself, which I will attribute to age more than anything. Even with that Homura needs to be in control of every scenario she is in, and every single chink in her emotional armour is made when she is not. It is not by accident that Madoka (either invoked by name or in person) tends to be around her when that happens.
Her happiest moment isn't really a submissive one either. It happens at the end of the series, Homura looks serene. Peaceful. And she is... because for the first time in a long while, she has no struggle. There is no war for her to fight (aside from protecting the world that Madoka created), and because of that her confidence grows by leaps. Enough to assume that Kyuubey is harmless.

>>2118932
>Which directly leads into everything unravelling as I mentioned. This is notably twofold: Homura ends up betraying their promise, and Madoka ends up razing the planet as a witch. Homura simply cannot allow that, and has to use extreme preventative measures.

That is assuming that by taking control of Madoka, that is Kyuubey's end game. Which is really wasn't.
Kyuubey's concerns are completely single-minded in scope, even in Madoka's new world they have not changed... what ever gets it what it wants in the most efficient way possible, Kyuubey will strive for it. It's not even a question, Incubators are not bound by pesky morals and care nothing for others. So if there is another means to gain the energy it needs, Kyuubey is going to investigate it. The suffering of others be damned.

How much that bares into the world's well being? From Kyuubey's perspective, it doesn't. From Madoka's perspective, it does. And Homura? She doesn't care, Kyuubey trying to fuck with Madoka.... that is all that really matters to her.


> While Madoka does have some degree of ennui, all things considered, she does have a very happy life. She's in the midst of a sort-of existential crisis, but that's normal, and moreover, she'd be able to move past it thanks to a supportive environment; it's a stage in growing up. Unless some terrible tragedy befell her, she would grow up happy.

True, it is why there is one rather constant question when it concerns Madoka... Why become a Magical Girl if it means giving up so much of her, rather wonderful, life?
A question that she answers by the end of the series: Because if it means a world without hope, then it is wrong.
And that is kind of the thing that seems to lack in Homura's universe, it has almost everything... but hope?

>>2118935
>To me, Homura's reaction in and from the flower scene doesn't indicate a need for control or love or ownership - it's rather her catalyst for seeing Madoka as someone who needs to be saved from herself.

There is where I would argue otherwise because Madoka clearly didn't need to be saved from herself. In fact, the very threat that she is dealing with turns out to be fairly contained. Kyuubey, despite all it's planing, is effectively her bitch for the duration of the Movie from the point it got started. Homura turns out to be the one thing that she can't predict, and why is that? She has no clue what Homura is really like. Because Homura herself doesn't.
As I said, Homura is never really honest with herself. She *thinks* that Madoka needs to be "to be saved from herself," when just about everyone (save Mami and Kyouko) tells her that it's fine and she doesn't need to get involved. That things are different because Madoka, Sayaka and Bebe has the bases covered.
Well, Homura doesn't want different. She wants to "have the power to protect Madoka," and if she feels that there is a threat. She is going to get involved, no matter how much she is at the core of the problem... that why her being the Witch shakes her, she never once assumes that she might be near the centre of it all (because as a Magical Girl in Madoka's universe, Homura is an anomaly that is defined by the rules of the old universal law) and it snap all the resolve that she has.
Kyuubey, of course, is counting on this to work in it's direction but aside on her obsession over Madoka their is something else it didn't count on. Homura taking the threat of Kyuubey VERY personally.

>>2119101
Actually the script says Homura was feeling lonely but still smiled in that scene with Junko. She wasn't really in a peace of mind because Madoka was gone, but she was close to. Madoka was the missing part there.
I would say the happiest Homura has ever been was inside her barrier because she could be by Madoka's side without worrying about Madoka dying because nightmares were harmless. Also, Madoka was very happy in that world and that made Homura happy as well, they were good friends like in the first timelines. Homura even said it : "Being able to feel you kindness and talk to you like this once again has made very happy. Thanks, this is more than enough happiness for me".

>>2119119
>There is where I would argue otherwise because Madoka clearly didn't need to be saved from herself. In fact, the very threat that she is dealing with turns out to be fairly contained.
When I say Homura sees Madoka as someone who needs to be saved from herself, I'm referring not to the early plot of the movie, but to Madoka's very decision to become Godoka in the first place. During the flower scene Homura has her first real interaction with Madoka since the point where Madoka sacrificed herself. Up until that point, Homura kept herself together by convincing herself that Madoka really, truly wanted to use all of herself to change the world. However, in this scene she is faced with the reality that Madoka still misses her family and friends. Now, obviously Madoka still doesn't regret becoming a goddess, but to Homura that's exactly the problem - Madoka is sacrificing all of herself and her own happiness for other people. She's saving Madoka from Madoka's decision to (in Homura's view) forego happiness by becoming a goddess in the first place, not from some paltry mundane problem like meddling Incubators.

Of course, her method of 'helping' isn't exactly ideal. But Homura doesn't have the power of an insane wish at her hands to shape reality, so she can't undo Madoka's decision entirely - I believe that if she could simply exchange places with Madoka, she probably would. Her alternative might have sounded nice in her mind (Madoka can live a normal life again, even if it's just an illusion!) but it obviously didn't work out so well.

>>2119119
>She *thinks* that Madoka needs to be "to be saved from herself," when just about everyone (save Mami and Kyouko) tells her that it's fine and she doesn't need to get involved.
Except Homura is right. Madoka's sacrificed her life with her family for the sake of others. She'll never have share her first drink with her mother. She won't be around when Tatsuya gets married and has a child. She won't be able to see her parents smile as she walks down the aisle. She'll never hold her grandkid in her hands. She knew all that and did it anyway, because she was willing to sacrifice her happiness for the sake of others.

Homura was able to find a loophole that still saves magical girls and gives Madoka her life back. The only problem is that it necessarily involves erasing her memories (or she reverts to the LoC), so Homura thinks she'll end up being hated by her eventually.

>>2119101
>An entire universe being "perfect" at the end of rebellion says otherwise.
It's perfect in the sense everyone is reunited. As long as Madoka doesn't become a magical girl, Homura has no reason to care what she does.

>It happens at the end of the series, Homura looks serene. Peaceful. And she is... because for the first time in a long while, she has no struggle.
Everyone in Magica Quartet will disagree with you. She lost the one thing that meant anything to her. Now she just fights with no purpose.

>>2119108
>That is assuming that by taking control of Madoka, that is Kyuubey's end game. Which is really wasn't.

Did you actually watch this series? His whole fucking game is getting Madoka to contract and his game in Rebellion was to capture and control Madoka.

>A question that she answers by the end of the series: Because if it means a world without hope, then it is wrong.
That is only relevent to the final timeline wish. She was ready to contract to protect Sayaka from Kyouko, save Sayaka from her burden, and even wish for a cake. This is a girl who gave her soul for a cat.

>>2119119
>There is where I would argue otherwise because Madoka clearly didn't need to be saved from herself.
It's like you didn't even read anon's post. If Madoka values her friends and family and would never voluntarily leave them, then Homura's view is right: Madoka's tendency toward martyrdom is self-destructive. Madoka feels compelled by duty to sacrifice herself and Homura wants to stop that from happening. Homura cares about Madoka's personal happiness and doesn't want to enable her martydom. This in itself is just as self-destructive.

>Kyubey
Madoka's plan worked once. It wouldn't work a second or thrid time. Mami and Kyouko saw Madoka and it's a given they'd just keep trying. They are immortal after all. The only way to fix it is to prevent the beys from learning about Madoka. In the mean time though, their subjugation iis what we have now.

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>>2118436
Here's Symmetry Diamond, two chapters plus a couple of pages from the third one. I recall it was posted on /a/, pity I didn't save it at the time.
http://www.mediafire.com/download/9vwwspwbc2s42o8/

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>>2119101
>For Madoka to not see a means to sacrifice herself, Homura decides to control just about everything.
No. She makes fixes where they are necessary-- these being the cases of magical girls. Interference is necessary. The most controlling thing she did over Madoka was sending her overseas to the US for 3 years, which is presumably to account for the whole "transfer student" thing as Homura herself is already enrolled. And also, presumably, to help her in English (her worst subject). She's not directing the day-to-day events of Madoka's life.
>Her happiest moment isn't really a submissive one either. It happens at the end of the series, Homura looks serene.
False. It's pic related, and also in her own barrier, before she realizes it's a false world. In both instances, Madoka is senior to her. And as pointed out: Moreover, at the end of the series, her burden is not relieved-- Homura feels indebted to Madoka to the point of blaming herself for Madoka's wish. Her reason to live is gone.

Moreover, Homura's control "issues" are reactions to threat levels. In pic related, she believes that she can save Madoka because her wish to time leap came true, and now she has some extra firepower to defeat Walpurgisnacht; she is not aware of the true threat of becoming a witch, so she is content in a submissive role. When she realized Madoka's self-sacrificing nature is a threat, she escalates her actions in order to prevent her contract. In Rebellion, her actions are a response to the fact that the Incubators are threatening Madoka.

>>2119108
>And that is kind of the thing that seems to lack in Homura's universe, it has almost everything... but hope?
The only hope lacking from Homura's universe is that Homura has given up on her own relationship with Madoka.

First off, an aside... Wow, meaning rebellion debate that doesn't descend into a flaming mess on 4chan /u/. There might be hope for the world yet.

>>2119125
> Homura was feeling lonely but still smiled in that scene with Junko. She wasn't really in a peace of mind because Madoka was gone, but she was close to. Madoka was the missing part there.

You know, if she didn't have that look in other scenes after the massive reset.... I would have agreed with you but she does, even when faced with the Wraith.
That said, your not wrong either... that is likely the reasons she ask Junko about Tatsuya, whom is drawing Magical Girl Madoka in the sand at the time, and about said drawing.

> I would say the happiest Homura has ever been was inside her barrier because she could be by Madoka's side without worrying about Madoka dying because nightmares were harmless.
True, until she began to investigate the world itself. Once she begins to get suspicious of her little world, the happiness dies for her. Once she figures out that Kyuubey, little white shit that it is, is behind all of this for the sake of what amount to an experiment, she is furious.
And then it drops the bomb that ultimately... SHE is to blame, the reason that Kyuubey has the tools to undo everything comes from the fact that SHE EXISTS.

>>2119152
> Except Homura is right. Madoka's sacrificed her life with her family for the sake of others.
And again all that comes to is the answer that she stated at the end of the series. Sure, she miss all of that... but it is worth it to her if the world continues to spin and hope can be found in the world. So long as the glass is half full for the world at large, she doesn't seem to mind not being a part of it.

>>2119152
>The only problem is that it necessarily involves erasing her memories (or she reverts to the LoC), so Homura thinks she'll end up being hated by her eventually.
That's where Rebellion gets me. Homura's trapped in this cycle of guilt, self-loathing, and fear and the only person who understands her and can save her from this is the one who she believes she is protecting by suppressing her power.

>>2119155
>It's perfect in the sense everyone is reunited. As long as Madoka doesn't become a magical girl, Homura has no reason to care what she does.
No, it's a gilded cage. It's pretty and there doesn't seem to be any conflict, and the only one that arises (between Homura and Sayaka, whom is none to pleased at the results of her world changing stunt) is quickly shut down but there is a reason that "perfect" is in quotes.
It's not going to last, not with the Law of Cycle's continuing to seek out it's centre, which it found in frightening ease. Not with Sayaka still around and with some of her memories intact. Not with the fact that there is nothing in place to deal with the problems that the franchise presents (like the BS about the heat death of the universe).

And so long as NO-ONE becomes a Magical Girl, Homura doesn't need to raise all hell to stop them. Magical Girl's appear to solve "problems", there are no "problems" in Homura's universe. It is "perfect", there is no "suffering" and "hope" isn't needed to solve anything. Everything is "fine".

> Did you actually watch this series? His whole fucking game is getting Madoka to contract and his game in Rebellion was to capture and control Madoka.
Which is really an aside to THE QUOTA. All Kyuubey cares about is how much energy it is getting and how much of that fill it's planetary quota. Everything that Kyuubey does is toward that single goal. Even with the new universe that Madoka build, it's only motivation, it's primary motivation is this. If there is another way to go about it than fighting Wraith's for it.... fuck the consequences, it is worth looking into.
Having control of the Cycle something that it looked forward to, but the only reason that Kyuubey remotely thinks of doing it has the quota purely in mind. There is nothing else.

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My heart... manga did a better job with the feels than the movie

>>2119206
>And so long as NO-ONE becomes a Magical Girl, Homura doesn't need to raise all hell to stop them.
But magical girls still exist in Homura's universe. Literally the "only" thing she did was seperate Madoka from the Law of Cycles. It's still there.

>Magical girls appear to solve problems
No they don't. Their a by-product of a system to counteract entropy. Madoka is in the cage aka seperated from her powers. The other girls aren't. Butcher confirmed magical girls still exist and Homura stated wraiths continue to exist, which means suffering exists.

>Kyubey
The quota and Madoka are inseperable. He targets Madoka because she's the most efficient source of energy and fill his quota. Even if its not personal, his target is Madoka Kaname.

>>2119210
> Magical girls still exist in Homura's universe
No, no they don't. If Magical Girl exist... there is still a need for hope. If there is a need for hope, the world has problems and therefore isn't perfect. If the world isn't perfect and has issues, Madoka will notice that and wish to do something about it.
The whole thing comes crashing down the very second that this masquerade can't keep itself up. And it's already bursting at the seams from the moment that Homura put it up.

This cage will not last. And Homura knows it.

> The quota and Madoka are inseparable.
Then you have not been watching Kyuubey what so ever. Madoka is not an energy source to it, Madoka is not even a person as far as Kyuubey is concerned. Madoka is a roadblock that prevents it's investigation of another source for it's quota. Nothing more, nothing less.
It's ruthless to an extreme, but Kyuubey has been that before several times... and with it's "unique" morality, Kyuubey sees nothing wrong with removing a roadblock and bring back a system that feed on despair. It's just another day at the office.

>>2119226
So your talking out your ass and going against actual quotes from Quartet?

>>2119173
Reuploaded:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/lbh6l6xpo6v57iw/

>>2119228
If you got links, I am all ears.

>>2118970
Where is that from ?

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>>2119230
The image is post-Homupothesis. Kyouko and Sayaka both have their rings and meguca marks. Homura says there are still wraiths. Homura says Kyubey still has a purpose (collecting grief). There was no indication magical girls or suffering ended. The only characters that have changed are Madoka and Homura because they are no longer magical girls.

The direct confirmation from Butcher is from some notes some guy took at Japan Expo 2014.

>For The Rebellion Story, Urobuchi also did not have any overt philosophical influence while writing the story. It should be noted that this is true for all Urobuchi works. His influences are more philosophical muses than direct guides. References to Nietzsche and other German philosophy were added after the story was completed.
>According to my friend who understands Japanese mannerisms, Urobuchi seemed very resigned while talking about the addition of "God is dead" and etc. to the scenario. Urobuchi also made very clear both at JXUSA and AX that any future Madoka scenarios are both his work and that of many others. I'm hoping to ask him if this means the rest of the Magica Quartet/scenario designers or if he is referring to fan works.
>Magical girls do exist in Homura's new world.

>>2119236
The transformatiom sequence in Rebellion. It's one of the images spliced in.

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Homura will bring balance to the force.

>>2119290
I wonder if that's deliberate foreshadowing.

>>2119348
Doubt it. I think Gen threw whatever he had left from the series at Rebellion and figured that would work. Stuff like Kyouko asking for a dream feels like he got ideas from a rewatch of the series.

>>2119290
For the sake of space-time's no longer virgin asshole, Junko should stop giving advice while she's drunk.

>>2119036
Eva didn't invent that shit, desu.

>>2119480
I wonder how she'd feel if she ever found out her role in the clusterfuck that is the universe getting buttfuckked by two different dykes?

>>2119500
>I need another drink

>>2119480
I'm pretty sure she allowed Madoka to go out alone during Walpurgisnacht only because she was drunk.

>>2119493
Of course not, but it's widely credited as the series that brought it to mainstream anime.

>>2115828
> "Magic and miracles are real! The Habs are gonna win today!"
Fine, I'm in.

Madoka - C - Great hands and speed, but passes when she should shoot
Homura - LW - Takes after Pavel, but often calls for a pass to keep Madoka from shooting or getting herself into the dirty areas
Kyoko - RW - Professional pest, higher PIM than +/- nearly every game.
Mami - D - Rightside defenseman, uses her height to stand opponents up entering the zone and has a wicked slapper
Nagisa - D - Mami's opposite on the blue line, a stay at home defenseman known for her break out passes to the wingers
Sayaka - G - Poor positioning leaves Sayaka constantly scrambling, but never gives up protecting the net and her crease. Talks to the posts.

>Kyoko and Sayaka don't get along at first, but start to get closer as they help each other with French/English, until Kyoko drops the gloves with anyone who snow showers Sayaka
>The team initially doesn't trust Nagisa because she transferred from an rival team, but embrace her when her natural chemistry with Mami gives them one of the most dynamic D pairs in the league
>Homura is desperate to stop Madoka from fighting Eva Walpurgisnacht, captain of The Witches. Madoka considers it her duty as captain to stand up for her team against their goon squad rivals and German captain.

>This summer, Magical Girl Junior Ice Hockey League. Won't you sign an entery level contract with me?

I really don't think we have to think that hard to deduce where Homura was wrong. Is Homura crazy and a bit creepy? Yes, but she's mentally almost twice her physical age and not a single day of it was happy. We all saw it on screen. You may as well be mocking a veteran with severe PTSD, depression, and survivors guilt. While Homura's character flaws definitely play into her decision, they are mostly irrelevent to why she her decision is wrong. Madoka loves her inspite of those deep character flaws. Looking at her goal and intent are all that's necessary to see where she fucked up.

Homura's intent was to protect Madoka's smile. This is the last thing she tells Madoka. This is given a full duologue in the concept movie. By protecting Madoka's happiness, Homura believed she had to become Madoka's enemy and she believed her continued pain would be okay because all the pain in the world would be worth it for Madoka. This is why she is wrong.

Would Madoka be happy losing her very best friend for a brief illusion of happiness? No. Madoka couldn't wait to see Homura again and was estatic at the notion that they would finally be reunited for eternity.

Would Madoka be happy knowing that her corporeal happiness comes at the expense of her very best friend's soul? Fuck no.

Forget muh sacrifice. Absolutely no moral human being, let alone Madoka, would be okay with knowing their happiness is only guarenteed by the suffering of their most precious person. Madoka was deeply saddened by the magical girl system's role in stability to the universe at the cost of a few lives. She gave her life for girls across time and space that she had never met before. Why would she be okay with Homura's suffering, especially for her sake? Madoka has a moral responsibility as someone that loves Homura to break out of that cage and put an end to that suffering in a constructive manner.

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Moemura is the best girl to be platonic best friends with.
You get to hang out with her and all her cuteness, but you don't have to worry about setting off a chain of events that will turn her into lesbian satan and assfuck the universe.

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>>2119922
Kys HomuSayafag

>>2119904
Naturally so, but we can only say this as the audience. We know that there exists some possibility where Madoka and Homura would exist as some dualistic yin-yang concept and be together for all eternity, but from an in-universe perspective (particularly Homura's) there is no alternative course of action to ensure Madoka's safety and happiness except at Homura's own expense. Homura is wrong, and she herself acknowledges this, but at the same time, she's justified by virtue of her other option being to leave Madoka at the mercy of the Incubators.

>>2119975
On the 'bator end, they atleast realized that their system was fucked and inherently dangerous when Homura became the devil. They admitted that it was their folly for playing with fire. But of course Homura rightly points out that their role is a necessary one. Because they kept their memories, I'm curious to see how that plays out. In my mind, yinyanging would be the most likely answer to ending and replacing the Incubators' flawed, explotative, and inherently dangerous system. But that will be seen in the future.

>>2119988
I suppose that all depends on how "good" of an ending we get. What will be the role of magical girls in the new system? If Madoka sees Homura's punishment of the Incubators as overbearingly cruel, how will their threat be mitigated?

Nice triple doubles, by the way.

An odd question occurred to me while doing fic research: are soul gems affected by ionizing radiation?

>>2120003
Magical girls serve one purpose: to counter entropy. Anything else is a by product.

I have no expectation of them making it out alive, but if Madoka really is lonely, I'd like her to have company in the conceptual realm, even if it serves no other purpose than erasing Homura from the memory of the world.

>>2120032
cont.
>even if it serves no other purpose than erasing Homura from the memory of the world which would solve the 'bator question.

>>2120028
Most likely not. They would use up a lot of magic by healing the affected body though.

On the LoC though, how exactly does Madoka address someone like Kyouko? Homura's ungranted wish is one thing, buy how do you resolve the guilt and regret of someone whose wish objectively made things worse? Sayaka could die happy knowing her sacrifice meant Kyousuke could play the violim again. Kyouko's wish was granted and it directly lead to her family dying. How does Madokami even reconcile that?

>>2120028
We don't know the chemical composition of soul gems, but we can assume they're relatively normal crystals in terms of physical properties.

>>2120032
That's theoretically a solution, although as I mentioned before, it's not unreasonable to think that the Incubators could figure out how to exploit the Law of Cycles without Homura's explanations. Although if this is never addressed, it's safe to assume that it is a nonissue.

>>2120055
Presumably, Kyoko came to terms with it herself. She wouldn't have been all buddy-buddy with Mami and Sayaka if she hadn't.

>>2120055
I would say the suffering and recovery/redemption Kyouko went through was important enough that it should not be taken away. But you could easily argue that things would be a great deal better if you reverted it all, though you can't know the butterfly effects of it (Well, maybe Madokami can).

Everyone has terrible things that happen in their lives, or awful mistakes they made, but undoing them is in a way oftentimes also a big mistake too.

No completely right or wrong answer probably, but Madokami seems to respect people's choices even if they are flawed, which is kind of a big difference between her and Homu I suppose.

>>2120055
By being the God that gives her a good dream, sis. Even after fucking up her own life as badly as she did, Madokami forgives and absolves.

She doesn't judge, she just keeps girls from Witching out. Sayaka got special treatment because she was Madoka's other bestie and possibly since she was doomed to become Oktavia every time she contracted, which also gave her heavy karmic weight.

>>2120066
>Although if this is never addressed, it's safe to assume that it is a nonissue.
It's addressed and stated by the Incubators themselves that their only goal is to recreate witches, which they state state and we see they learn from Homura.

>Episode 12
>Kyubey: That witch concept you mentioned is quite interesting. As a means of collecting human emotional energy, it certainly has an appeal! If such a lucrative means of harvesting energy had been available to us... we Incubators might have employed a very different strategy for all this...
>Kyubey: But the witch world you were describing, there weren't wraiths like the ones we fought here, right? So collecting curses must have been a much faster process!

>Rebellion
>Kyubey: The information we'd collect from that would allow us to conquer the Law of Cycles completely. Then, we could make magical girls turn into witches and collect vast amounts of energy all in one go. Your hope and despair are the keys. The phase change between those emotions creates huge amounts of energy. More than we ever imagined. You magical girls are the gateway to limitless possibilities. In our humble opinion, you should all conclude your existence by transforming into witches.

He literally only knows about witches because of Homura and only wanted to observe the LoC for that purpose.

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>>2120055
She probably can't. The spirit of Madoka's wish was to make magical girls never regret their wishes. Kyouko seemed to prefer the fake life in the barrier to the real world and shies away from discussing her wish outside of the segment in the series.

>>2120096
>Madokami seems to respect people's choices even if they are flawed, which is kind of a big difference between her and Homu I suppose
Except that wish that got us into this mess.

Does anyone know where I could get Agedum! Puella Magica!

Homo girls DON'T know how to love! Love between girls should be forbidden and be punished with DEATH!

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>>2124926
Hitomi please go and stay go, /u/ is a place for hope and dreams.

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>>2124926
Maybe, maybe not.
But I do know Homu girls know how to love

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>>2124926
End your life.