When did the Alien franchise go off the rails?

For a long time people said Cameron, but Prometheus and Covenant seem to be proof that Ridley is a hack, and O'Bannon was the real talent.

Aliens, even if it was a genuinely good film.

Alien and the 3rd one are the only good ones.

>>87785049
This.

Alien 3 Assembly Cut is absolute kino, second only to Alien theatrical cut.

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>>87784993
O'Bannon made one of the best zombie movies ever, so I'm inclined to believe that.

Aliens. Audiences want all Alien sequels to be exactly like that one now.

Resurrection. It was incredibly cheesy. Winona Ryder was shit in it and Sigourney writhing around like a human/alien hybrid reminds me of the Jamie Lee Curtis True Lies copypasta. Ron Perlman is the only redeeming quality.

>>87784993
>O'Bannon
No Giger made Alien great

>>87784929
Alien is the only good one. Aliens single-handedly destroyed the franchise. A great pleb filter is someone who says they prefer Aliens over Alien, a guy that told me this once also said how he loved the movie Battle Los Angeles.

Only Aliens movie that is bad is Covenant, rest are redeemable

Aliens is a great great film but I wish it wasn't a part of the Alien franchise.

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>>87785120
>yfw nobody wants a 3 hour movie that contains 45 minutes of atmosphere establishment shots panning across empty rooms with random blinking sci fi lights.

fucking art is dead man

At least we have isolation. That really scratched my autistic itch for atmosphere.

>>87785095
1st person I've seen that agreed with me, Most people hail Aliens instead for some reason and shit on 3.

I think I would've liked Aliens, if I had seen it when it came out, but I wasn't born.
When I originally watched, I had already seen enough murica macho marine cliche shit that I hated it

>>87784929
don't phonepost

>>87785326
>murica macho marine cliche shit
Is that what you call movies for men? The 80s would have drove you to suicide, kiddo.

>>87784929
Aliens

>>87785120
It's just the thing that turned it from a movie to a franchise. The moment that happened shit went off the rails and we needed to learn alien origin stories and maintain a cannon.

>>87785236
>for some reason
what's the point of feigning ignorance for something so obvious?

>>87785381
>>87785221
>>87785168
>>87785120
>>87785049
>>87785031
These

Alien s was great, but it really did destroy the threat of the xenomorphs unfortunately

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>>87784929
>this thread
>everyone saying aliens
well done lads. /tv/ has finally seen the light, what happened to the james cameron fanboys?

anyway aliens is a great film, just not an alien film.
4 and prometheus are shit though and I haven't watched covenant yet out of fear of disappointment

>>87785095
3 sucks. it was made as some sort of commentary on American prison systems in the early 90s.
complete trash

>>87785351
I'm guessing my phone can do everything your computer can plus more
get mobile

>>87785623
>what happened to the james cameron fanboys?
Cameron decided to spend the rest of his career jerking off to blue cgi cat people instead of working on another alien or terminator movie

alien and aliens are both excellent. everything, and I mean everything after those two films belong in a 1$ movie bin at your local walmart.

>>87785729
weak bait

>>87785752
i haven't had a computer in 7 years

Peaked with Aliens but didn't go to complete and utter shit until Resurrection.

>>87785449
enlighten me

>>87785623
I will meet you in the middle and agree on you with that. Aliens is an action film, Alien is a space horror. I really liked both of them, however I do think that Aliens was a good sequel to Alien even though it was a different genre.

Alien 3 was a big dip, and Alien Resurrection was just bad.

>>87785673
>3 sucks. it was made as some sort of commentary on American prison systems in the early 90s.
>complete trash

The studio jews ruined the theatrical release.

The assembly cut has a much greater emphasis on the "monastery in space" thing that fincher was trying to go for, with more shots of the architecture and religious symbolism, and the supporting characters are seen less as irredeemable murderers, and more as deeply flawed human beings working on redemption.

>>87785789
3 was terrible.

>>87785820
Mediocre at best.

>>87785804
You honestly don't understand why people like Aliens?

>>87785857
seems like you don't either

>>87785811
ive yet to see the assembly cut but ill give it a shot. added to the list for all spooky October movies to watch.

but alien 3 the theatrical cut is what counts cause it's what came out.

>>87785898
what?

>>87785804
>>87785898
the characters. same as Alien.
Alien 3 had what? A Ripley that shaved her head and a jesus loving black guy with glasses?

>>87784929
In the first 5 minutes of Alien3, and there hasn't been a worthy 5 minutes in the entire series since.

>>87785918
I'll agree with you, Alien 3 theatrical is trash. Assembly Cut fixes some problems, but creates a few new ones.

>>87785965
>a jesus loving black guy with glasses?

confirmed that people who hate Alien 3 Assembly are all just angry atheists

The Alien series lost a lot of its scare-factor when they revealed the monster. The only reason why the xenomorph was scary in the first place was because it was unknown. Taking that air of mystery away made it a lot less scary.

>>87785740
yeah that film was pretty shit but after rewatching I think the main actor was the worst part of it though in all honesty

>>87785805
I disagree only because one xenomorph was a huge near indestructible threat in alien, but in aliens, there was a swarm and it's like the threat of the xenomorph was diminished

>>87786144
The Dallas scene was elite, you pleb.

>>87785161
Giger wasn't involved in narrative and direction, that's what matters in the end for a movie

>>87786023
just said i didn't see assembly
>>87785918
so you tell me about all the characters and what made them great

They always struggled with how to continue the series after Aliens.

Cameron was actually hired to write the story he pitched for Aliens, with Ripley as the main character, before a deal was ever reached with Sigourney Weaver. This meant that when they had a draft everybody loved and wanted to make, she had the producers by the balls. As a result she got the biggest payday of any actress in history up to that point, and she wasn't signed for any more movies after Aliens, so her fee for any potential third movie would have been huge.

Weaver was also pissed off that Fox forced Cameron to cut the subplot about Ripley's dead daughter from the theatrical cut of Aliens, and that soured her on returning for a sequel.

Because of this, Fox toyed with several approaches to the third Alien movie. Some didn't feature Ripley at all, some had Ripley in a cameo, and some had her return as full-fledged lead. The history of the various scripts they commissioned is extensive and can be found online. It took Fox a longtime to accept that the series had become Ripley's story, and I think that's one of the big things that inhibits everything that came after Aliens. Alien 3 & Resurrection feel boxed-in by having to continue with Ripley (especially Resurrection, which has no compelling reason to exist and where her presence required the ass-pull of cloning), and yet in shit like the AVP movies and the new Ridley Scott movies, the absence of Sigourney Weaver means it doesn't quite feel like Alien.

>>87786558
I think finding something original to do after two movies is also just incredibly hard. Aliens was the logical continuation of Alien because it could increase the scale, add emotional stakes, and change the tone while recognizably being a part of the same universe, but where can you go from Aliens that feels just as fresh while maintaining continuity with the first two movies? A lot of the unused the drafts of Alien 3 ended up just being retreads of Aliens but much BIGGER and EPIC and as a result weren't interesting. The final version of Alien 3 ended up hewing closer to Alien, and had the same problem of also feeling dully familiar.

>>87786207
The xeno on the nostromo was near indestructible because they couldn't use any real weapons

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bump for comfy alien discussion

I actually thought that Resurrection was better than 3.

reminder to all the haters that 2 is one of the top 5 action movies of all time

>>87788172
What are the other four?

>>87788402
inb4 terminator 1, t2, avatar and true lies

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Aliens is a great film and a worthy sequel to Alien.

The detail brought into LV426, the Colonial Marines as well as the Xenomorph Queen is extraordinary and very much worthy of the mythos established in the original.

What irks me is how people interpreted Aliens with the sequels. The Alien had the opportunity to transcend the Xenomorph and become a established series of 'Alien' stories about this gritty, industrial future and mankind's struggles with its expansion and the hostile forces that hinder that, foreign and domestic.

I'd love to see 'Alien', 'Android', 'Colony' - semi connected films dealing with different genres and stories with loose influence with each other.