Why do people excuse laziness? Leaving it up to the audience

>>87431374
I agree, the movie was a total wank.

I didn't get it

>>87431374
The point of the movie isn't to "piece it together", the point is having the same experience as the characters.
Everything is portrayed to the audience just like they are presented to the characters, they also don’t know how did the dog there and who opened the door so they start suspecting one another, just like you are. The point of this is to actually feel paranoia and suspense while watching, not to solve plot points by yourself after the film.

Movies aren't puzzles which you have to put together in a certain kind of way to "get" them.

Having to have literally every part of a movie explained to you and getting annoyed when anything is left ambiguous or up to subjective interpretation is the hallmark of an idiot/cornflake box-art enthusiast. Obviously the movie has to do the groundwork to make those ambiguities and questions interesting, and many try and often fail, but to say that doing this at all is just "lazy" is idiotic. Subjective interpretation and the death of the author are some of if not the most important developments in modern thinking about art, and the space for the reader to have these interpretations of the ideas, themes and stories that art like film provides is, beyond pure aesthetic enjoyment, essentially the entire fucking point of art in the first place.

I haven't seen this movie, I can't say whether or not it tried and failed, or whether it was truly just lazy writing using ambiguity to fill holes, but honestly, what the fuck are you talking about? Kill yourself.

>>87431374
This movie could have been wholly saved with a simple title change.

>>87431374

The movie was shit, but an idiot could understand it.

>not everything is explained to me so it's shit

Stick to capeshit, pleb

>>87431568

To what? "Masque of Red Death Inspired Movie"?

This movie was really well made - especially how pragmatic all the characters were while still being morally good. But there was almost no enjoyment gotten out of watching it since it was so horribly depressing.

I really liked that none of the characters could be seen as "evil", they all were perfectly justified in their actions.

I think what a lot of people miss from this movie is that the nature of the sickness/whether there were monsters out there/how civilization is fairing doesn't actually matter at all. The movie tries to show you that the overwhelming danger of the world forces the characters to focus on the immediate issues. Hell, their dog that was attacked earlier that day was dragged back broken and bloody to their doorstep, but they were so preoccupied they couldn't deal with the ramifications.

Personally, I believe that the grandpa infected the dog(since it was his dog while he was alive). Since the dog was around the son so much, the son gets the disease as well. "it comes at night", it being paranoia and night horrors, symptoms of the disease. As the son gets more and more sick, his nightmares increase. Notice how both the son and dog sprint off to that noise in the forest while the two men are confused and follow later. This was hallucinations caused by the sickness. The son spends time with the young boy, infecting him and causing the boy to get nightmares towards the end of the movie too. Additionally, the son's nightmares indicate he actually did go outside the house to find the dog and left the door open. Just like the painting, the son was a harbringer of death.

>>87431541
>Everything is portrayed to the audience just like they are presented to the characters
Except the audience never finds out why they don't go out at night.

I can answer any questions about the film, ask away.

>>87431682
How did the infection get in the house? I feel like there's at least two plausible explanations.

>>87431541
but thats not even true.
If it were then we wouldnt see from any other characters perspective and this very clearly happens when the fathers go to get the other family. If what you say was accurate we would have spent the entirety of the film with Travis and Travis alone but thats not what happened. Even then aspects of Travis's own experience are left intentionally vague to us. Travis knows he dreams so if we are to know what he knows why would parts of his dreams by intentionally obscured from us if not for any other reason but to cover up gaps in the story the director cannot fill?
>feel paranoia and suspense while watching
Confusing and paranoia are not the same thing
Watch for example The Witch. Very similar film to It Comes at Night, but the vagueness around the events is actually well executed.
For example there is no reason to be ambigous about what the boy saw in the woods when he went looking for a witch because it then it needlessley convolutes a plot that had plenty of tension and paranoia regarding why events were happening to them.
It Comes at Night was really not that great and its sort of a shame that it is being touted as part of a horror renaissance of sorts thats been happening over the last couple of years.

>>87431374
This movie wasn't great but you sound like a fucking pleb. Film is a visual medium. If you want a "gripping story" go read a fucking book

>>87431627
/thread

>>87431557
>didnt even watch the movie
if you only knew.

>>87431691
The grandpa was initially infected. The dog was owned by the grandpa and spent a lot of time around him, so it got infected. The dog then spends a long time around the son, infecting him. The "1 day to show symptoms" thing can be chalked up to characters not knowing the disease and reduced immune system of an old man. Paranoia and nightmares are symptoms of the disease - and they slowly increase in both the son and dog throughout the film.

>>87431557
> but to say that doing this at all is just "lazy" is idiotic
Nice reading comprehension
>I haven't seen this movie, I can't say whether or not it tried and failed, or whether it was truly just lazy writing using ambiguity to fill holes, but honestly, what the fuck are you talking about? Kill yourself
Nowhere did I say that all films that use ambiguity are lazy. I'm clearly just talking about this specific movie and wondering why people make excuses for it.

>>87431727
Why didn't the characters go out at night?

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>>87431374
I've got a great new invention for all of you "I need a clearly spelled out story and plot" fags. I think you'll like it.

>>87431682
Also what was the titular "it" referring to?

>>87431727
why didnt the dog infect literally anyone else though?
Given how large swathes of time are dedicated to Travis alone and huge parts of days are skipped over so we can get to Travis's frustratingly pointless dream sequences its more than safe to assume that dog spends time with the mom or dad or even a member of the other family.
To insinuate this isnt possible because we didnt see it directly is retarded because 99% of the plot of this film is derived from things we dont see on screen.

>>87431771
its literally dreams.
Dreams come at night.
This director is a master troll.

>>87431830
Shouldn't it be "They Come At Night" then?

>>87431705
>If what you say was accurate we would have spent the entirety of the film with Travis and Travis alone but thats not what happened
Why would we? That way we would know for sure that he isn't responsible for anything and the paranoia factor would be lost.

>>87431744
Option A - the father has knowledge of the disease symptoms. He knows that paranoia and hallucinations occur to the infected at night, so he would prefer to keep his family inside while nightwalking sick people run around in a delirium.

Option B - maybe he has had conversations with the infected who swear they see untold night horrors/infected ghouls around at night.

Option C - its just a smart thing to do in a post apocalyptic world

>>87431819
I think the other theory is that one of Travis's outdoor dreams is actually him sleepwalking. Sleepwalking already seems to be a symptom based on the behaviors of the toddler.

>>87431771

Death.

>>87431819

Did you miss the end? Both the mother and father are infected.

>>87431771
"It" was the paranoia and nightmares that come at night - a symptom of the disease. Notice how as the movie continues, Travis gets more and more nightmares/hallucinations until he finally erupts in full blown sickness. Similarly, the dog and young kid both show similar signs like sleepwalking or hallucinating noises just before they get sick.

>>87431867
Another theory I heard, was that this is a zombie movie without the zombies. We never see the final stages of the infection, so it's possible that it results in some zombie-like state. There could be something wandering out at night, but since this movie is more about the characters and their interactions from their point of view, this wasn't focused on.

>>87431819
Travis' dreams werent useless, some of them like witnessing the dog were actually him sleepwalking. Travis saw his dog and brought it back, leaving the red door open. Also, its mentioned that Travis spends the most time with the dog, so he would be the first to be infected. The mom and dad are infected at the end of the movie, but it makes sense that they aren't infected as fast since they don't have as much contact.

>>87431919
Isn't there only one key to the red door? How did Travis unlock it while sleepwalking when only his mom or dad should have it?

>>87431863
but this is where the problem with the films structural issues comes in.
You cant say "the purpose of the film is to feel how the characters feel" and then also say "except for when it comes to crucial plot details a character experiences, we cant know that"
Because it doesnt make any fucking sense at all. The "paranoia" derived from this writing isnt one created by the atmosphere of the film or events unfolding but rather the fact that the film deliberately obscured information to us that by your own defense of the films standards should have been given.
The film was not trying to make you paranoid it was deliberately working against its own very weak story to create confusion in the audience because the writing and directing was just not compelling enough to engage you in any other way besides creating a story that intentionally doesnt make any god damn sense, because fucking nobody would be talking about this film otherwise.
Theres just nothing there. Promising effort, and i hope the director keeps working, but this terrible writing cant be excused just because the technical aspects worked well.

>>87431890
They showed literally no symptoms whatsoever until Travis was infected so its highly likely that Travis infected them and not the dog.

>piece together the story
>can't understand that those story elements are not even important

It's not even a horror really. It's a character drama and it was fucking amazing. I was expecting some retarded horror shit.

>>87431899
I've heard that theory, and there are some pros and cons.

Pros-
>what attacked the dog? The father/son attackers were the only bodies that weren't burnt, so they could have risen again and attacked the dog.
>what was that weird vaguely humanoid silhouette when the 2 men were driving? A zombie
>Also, the only dream that showed a reaction of travis' face was the one where he reacted to the dog noises and he had a gun/red lantern. Perhaps this was the only real dream, where he actually did go out at night and witnessed a monster?


Cons-
>how did the second father survive 2 days outside while tied up and immobile?
This may show that there were actually no monsters/zombies
>Paranoia is a symptom of the disease - perhaps as the family develops the disease, the idea of monsters prowling at night becomes more realistic.

>>87431954

The father's paranoia started midway through the film.

>>87431935
This may have just been bad writing. I can't remember 100% but it might have been mentioned that he doesn't sleep with the key. Perhaps travis took it off his bedside table and used it.

>>87432036

I don't think the dog was attacked. It was just advanced stages of the illness.

I tend to think Will brought it with him. It progresses faster in children and the elderly.

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shit movie

just like arrival

>>87431682
Why was Will punching a bandit who had been shot several times, before any questions had been asked?

>>87432164
Arrival has a dumb explanation, this movie has no explanation

>>87432083
I can agree with the dog probably not being attacked - just extremely delirious.

However, I'm not sure if Will bringing the sickness fits with the time frame.
I think the grandfather => dog => travis => kid and others makes sense more.

Because if Will was sick, his kid would have gotten sick much faster. However, as soon as travis and the kid spend time together, its shown that the kid starts having nightmares/sleepwalking.

Also, the grandfather => dog link seems to be pointed out when it's mentioned it was his dog. Also, they take care to show travis and the dog have a special connection. Correct me if Im wrong bc I cant remember, but doesn't Travis also experience nightmares before Will is even in contact with him?

>>87432260
There were 2 bandits, the main father shot one while Will subdued the other. Thats why there were 2 bodies.

>>87432286
See last paragraph of >>87431627

>>87431837
"Dreaming" then

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>>87431669
...because they are scared and fear makes you do irrational things.
Are you retarded?

>>87431708
>If you want a "gripping story" go read a fucking book
/lit/ here, and I take offense to this. If you want a "gripping story" don't bother with actual art because the aesthetics are key and narrative exists only to push aesthetics in a certain direction. Pocahontas (1995) uses the basic story of the character to present new Disney songs, whereas The New World (2005) uses the same story to show some dank shots of grass, and Avatar (2009) uses the same story to push 3D filmmaking to new heights. Shakespeare was a genius with his use and reinvention of the English language, and most of his plays' plots were borrowed from previous works or historic events. The concept of the "narrative" is a shitty device only used by people who don't have the balls to make a pure aesthetic experience.

>>87432290

Not if Will got sick on the way there. For all we know he got sick while tied to the tree the first night.

He has the first nightmare when Will shows up. The mother awakens him from it.

The dog makes the most sense, I suppose.

>>87432419
Seriously? That's the reason? "There is no reason, they're just scared lol."

I don't really buy it. Especially because when Paul is telling the other family that they don't go out at night, they don't question it at all. I think this suggests that there is a widely known reason that people shouldn't go out at night rather than just "might as well be extra cautious."

>>87432472

He also says they only go by twos during the day.

As we saw when they left, there are looters. Had either been alone, they'd have been fucked.

>>87432489
Why not just mention it? It wouldn't come across as heavy-handed at all to say that they don't go out at night/go out in twos because of looters/bandits. What they do instead is intentionally obscure as much detail as possible. It's honestly baffling.

I feel like the movie challenges the viewer to come up with their own headcanon for what the fuck happened, and based on what I've seen in the thread, none of the explanations are free of problems.

>>87432437
Oh shit true, definitely a possibility, didn't know the timing of the first nightmare was like that.

>>87432526

>just for safety

There is no reason to assume there is anything paranormal.

>>87432526
Its such a dangerous world, it just makes sense to not go out when it's night. I wouldn't question it if it was told to me

>>87432580
Yeah maybe this just annoyed me since it was explicitly brought up in a movie called "it comes at night" and then wasn't elaborated upon.

>>87432532

It works best on an allegorical level. Will represents the disease. He tries to bust in but can't; they let him in. Later, the door is already open.

We never see the toddler showing any symptoms

>>87432634
Maybe technically, since we don't know what the symptoms are exactly. But the toddler does sleepwalk, have nightmares, and Will and his wife say to hide the kid's eyes when Paul barges in on them, probably cuz they'd be a giveaway.

I still have no idea what came at night

>>87431374
I didn't get it as well....how did the little boy get sick?

Personally, I really enjoyed the abiguity about the kid being sick towards the end that DID have a definitive answer.

Two views:
>1. The son is sick, and the family just wants to leave to spend time before they all die. Will tells the son to hide his eyes so no one can see that he's sick. The crying is because the kid is dying

>2. The son isn't sick, and the family wants to leave because they felt the tension growing. They understood that relationships could only sour as the main father would always put his family above Will's. Will tells the kid to not look since things were about to get nasty and guns were being pointed around. The crying is just a toddler crying for no reason/travis hallucinating minor noises due to being sick.

WHY DIDN'T THEY JUST LET THE OTHER FAMILY LEAVE??????????????

>>87431374
There is absolutely nothing to piece together. You have low IQ, is all. The film is about fear of the unknown the proverbial darkness and of coming-of-age of the nigger.

You are very stupid!

>>87432595
I think the nightmares and hallucinations were the thing that came at night, symptoms of the disease.

>>87432600

>if they're sick then I am too

>>87432710
They didn't want them to come back later and steal their food/water or getting killed by them.

>>87432710
They were afraid if the family left, they would simply come back again and harm them when they eventually got desperate. Will's family had no shelter/food sources to start with, so they would get desperate fast.

Also, at this point in the movie, everyone was infected already, and that means they were extremely paranoid and untrusting.

>>87432710
Because of their fear.

You people can't be this fucking stupid

>>87432770
Does the disease make people paranoid or are you just assuming that? I think the reasons to distrust the other family were very reasonable.

>>87432696

The son is definitely sick. It wasn't just Travis hallucinating because they refused to open the door.

>>87432770
There is no infection other than fear in the film.

>>87432659
The symptoms seem to be akin to the bubonic plague with swollen lymph nodes on the skin. Both the grandfather and the son has this. It's possible the toddler is showing symptoms of a more mild disease since young children gets them all the time while developing their immune systems and they want to get away because the dad is being paranoid as fuck. Sleepwalking and nightmares aren't necessarily symptoms of anything.

>>87432807

They have visible lesions, anon, and something wiped out civilization.

>>87432823
Group hallucination of the family. The other family doesn't register them at all

>>87432843
That's because the lesions are real and the other family was the hallucination, brainlet.

>ambiguity is lazy
There was a zombie virus making people sick so they had to kill people and also there was a demon that comes out at nnight to kill people who are out at night. phew, that was hard work coming up with that, at least it wasn't lazy and ambiguous XD.

you are probably one of those plebs who judges a film purely on its premise, bet you love attack on titan too.

>>87432803
I'm assuming paranoia/hallucinations/nightmares from a couple things.

1.) As travis gets sicker throughout the film (symptoms like dry gagging and eventually full blown sickness), his nightmares also increases until its hard to tell what is real or delirium.

2.) The dog and Travis both "hear" something in the woods and go off sprinting, while the 2 dads don't go right away and instead follow a while later, looking confused why they ran. Later that night, its shown that the dog was actually full blown sick.

3.)Immediately after Travis starts spending time with the kid and infects him, the kid is shown to have nightmares and sleepwalk.

3.5) perhaps not a strong point, but the part where the family was trying to leave - everyone seemed to be way more paranoid and untrusting than in the beginning. Also, it was confirmed that at this point, everyone was infected.

>>87432910
How come the demon didn't kill Will when he was tied up for 2 days straight?

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>>87432850
>>87432843
>>87432807
2 DEEP

This flick was absolute trash, pretentious trash waste of time

>>87432818
but black death is in the host 7-10 days before symptoms show!

>>87432923

The nightmares are just a device to add tension and foreshadow.

The nightmare Travis has where he sees the dog attacked foreshadows the killing of the other wife and kid. He's wearing teh same shirt.

They Look Like People > It Comes at Night

>>87432944
u r a dum-e. eet wuh a ironic explination u duhmi.

The point was that it is super duper easy to make an unambiguous film and that making it ambiguous took more work than the other way around.

Literally pleb filter

>>87433008
The nightmares help seal a few plot holes - like the night when Travis dreamed about seeing the dog attacked, he brought back the dog's body and left the red door open. There's really no other way the door could have been opened since it was mentioned the kid wasn't tall enough

>>87433052

And none of them except the mother and father had the key to the outside door.

They said the kid was barely tall enough.

The constant changing of the aspect ratio was way too jarring. It did not affect my experience or make it any more claustrophobic, the only thing it did was me constantly looking at the black bars in every scene just so I know is something a dream or not.
Too gimmicky trick just so the director can have a "reality becomes a nightmare" ending.

>>87433189
I'm just trying to find an explanation for why the door was open, it seems more likely Travis would get the key than a toddler

>>87433251

The kid was shown to sleepwalk, anon. He could have done it just fine. Travis, from what we saw, wasn't show to sleepwalk, just dream. He never woke up in strange places.

The parents are way, way too defensive about the kid, which is understandable.

>>87431557
It's interesting how easily people started telling others to kill themselves, to a point where it annoys me so much that i would like them to have a taste of their own medicine

>>87432739

Dude, seriously? It's a bible reference. It means destruction.

"It", meaning judgment and destruction will come like a thief in the night.

Who came like a thief in the night? Literally?

>>87433203
Didn't even notice that

>>87433569
Well I'm glad it worked for you.
It wasn't even subtle really, the screen literally contracts in every dream sequence from 2.40:1 to 3.0:1, sometimes gradually and sometimes instantly with a cut to black. And in the end the "reality" has the same closed bars to make the ending a living nightmare.

>>87432595
>Yeah maybe this just annoyed me since it was explicitly brought up in a movie called "it comes at night" and then wasn't elaborated upon.
t.pleb

>>87431374
Whatever people think of the film, I'm pretty sure that's one of the best film posters of recent times, especially in this era of just compositing big actor heads onto each other.

>>87432710
Besides the obvious point of the entire movie >>87432800

They demanded food and resources. Literally holding the guy hostage for resources.

>>87433650
Looks like it was subtle enough to everyone else considering you're the only one complaining about it.

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What did he know? Didn't seem like a normal black teenager to me.

I think aliens arrived to earth and spread a virus or something to kill all humans.

>>87433981
I saw it in theatres, I presume most of the posters in this thread saw it on their computer/TV

>>87434051

I hope you learned your lesson.

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>>87434090

>>87432432
this. a good story is neat, but it is the lowest form of film making

>>87431682
why did the makers of this movie pay no attention to cinematography or visual narrative?
was Shane Carruth involved in this?

>>87433997
Those are government soldiers wearing gas masks trying to contain the disease

>>87431627
>This movie was really well made - especially how pragmatic all the characters were while still being morally good.
>I really liked that none of the characters could be seen as "evil", they all were perfectly justified in their actions.

this made it exceptionally for me. no dumb decisions to move the plot, no irrational screaming and tossing stuff. no forced arguments that could be solved by just talking to eachother, no love/romance bullshit (besides having a stable husband/wife relationship) etc.
people behaved like adults. i miss that in most movies.