Certainly ONE of the biggest fuck ups in superhero genre.

>>86477419
no idea why any of you take this shit seriously as adults. eternal childhood.

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>>86477419
>>86477550
Daily reminder that the people who hate on BvS are low-test R*ddit & Memey homos

>>86477852
Ok, since I´m such a faggot, then tell me how the movie is so good. Please do it.

>>86477985
Explain to me why its bad.

>>86478022
I´ll tell you why, the movie makes no damn sense since everything everyone does is just stupid (Like Btaman wnating to kill Superman or Batman not killing Lex Luthor at the end but he´s ok killing a bunch of goons)

Or why is Wonder Woman here, she´s shoved into teh movie for no reason other than to fight Doomsday.

The effects are just bad, especially Doomsday.

Lois Lane isn´t needed on the movie

Superman is boring

Batman´s hallucinations are just put on the movie to set up Justice League

Turkish Airlines

And so on...

>>86478373
>Btaman wnating to kill Superman
Cuz he felt that he was a ticking time bomb and needed to be killed before he would set off
>Batman not killing Lex Luthor at the end but he´s ok killing a bunch of goons
Batman doesn't execute
>Or why is Wonder Woman here, she´s shoved into teh movie for no reason other than to fight Doomsday.
Not really, she's there to bring out the mythical side of DC
>The effects are just bad, especially Doomsday.
He's not meant to look good, he's meant to look like an ugly gigantic beast and unfortunately in the real world there's not much reference for that so thats why it looks weird. Other than that BvS was a technical masterpiece so i dont know what you mean.
>Lois Lane isn´t needed on the movie
Yes she is. She is Clark's world, and she's what keeps Superman, well, a man.
>Superman is boring
He was at his lowest point in the movie. You expect him to smile and quip about it?
>Batman´s hallucinations are just put on the movie to set up Justice League
Umm, they're the final push for Bruce to begin his preparation to kill Superman. He literally saw a future where Superman becomes a tyrant.
>Turkish Airlines
What?

>>86478373
Oh also, Martha.

>>86478726
>Batman doesn't execute
Wait what? where the hell where you when he killed in cold blood all of Lex´s goons during that fucking chase scene, and if he doesn´t execute why is he preparing to kill Superman?

>He's not meant to look good, he's meant to look like an ugly gigantic beast and unfortunately in the real world there's not much reference for that so thats why it looks weird. Other than that BvS was a technical masterpiece so i dont know what you mean.

You don´t get it, I don´t care if he looks pretty or ugly, I care for him to feel like he´s actually on the film and not just some bad special effect added later. And this suprises me from SNyder since he makes special effects look good in movies.

>Yes she is. She is Clark's world, and she's what keeps Superman, well, a man.

You´re right, she IS just that but then why is she given a whole subplot? She´s just a love interest not an important character to the story.

>He was at his lowest point in the movie. You expect him to smile and quip about it?

I would expect him to be interesting and not just some guy with superpowers who gets angry and punches things.

>Umm, they're the final push for Bruce to begin his preparation to kill Superman. He literally saw a future where Superman becomes a tyrant.

Ok, so why didn´t they just transmit that in other way?, Like Batman simulating in his computer Superman´s danger to the world. And the answer is; Just that they do it so they can refrence things and characters who will appear in later movies.

>>86477419
You fucked up by being a brainlet.

>>86478726
>Cuz he felt that he was a ticking time bomb and needed to be killed before he would set off

Then why didn´t he just talk to him. Instead of fighting?

>>86479195
How so?

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>>86479140
>Wait what? where the hell where you when he killed in cold blood all of Lex´s goons during that fucking chase scene, and if he doesn´t execute why is he preparing to kill Superman?

I think you need to acquaint yourself with what the term "in cold blood" really means. That's the one thing he doesn't let himself do, and even when he's killing in self-defense, it's never directly. He's not behaving rationally, and what little bit of sanity working in the midst of all that anger and desire for revenge was still subtly sabotaging Bruce's "war" against Superman, and that comes down to not just the his choice of murder weapon, but also to how he doesn't even enter the fight carrying it. He set himself up, forced himself into precisely the sort of circumstances where it would be next to impossible for him to kill Clark. Why? Because the part of him that's still sane knows Clark's not really his enemy.

There's a damn good chance that Clark didn't even say his mother's name, and Bruce just heard what he needed to hear to stop himself.

>>86479424
What the fuck?

He DOES kills directly, fucking shooting guns to them, hurling vehicles with goons inside with his Batmobile, Hitting them to the point whre you can see that they´re dead.

Batman is just an ass in this movie, he tries to kill Superman and threatens him before and in-mid fight.

>where it would be next to impossible for him to kill Clark

He made a fucking spear that he, himself, has to manually use to kill Superman, I don´t see how that translates to mercy.

And the fucking Martha moment is unforgiveable, since they just put it so Batman doesn´t kill Superman.

It doesn´t even make any sense; Why would a grown ass man, who had years of mental training, cry over his parents death while not killing, what he considers to be the most dangerous thing on Earth?

BvS rules actually.

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>>86479786
What's he aiming for in pic-related? Keep in mind, these aren't the distinctions *we're* making; they're the distinctions *he's* making, because he's not acting rationally. He never kills in a way that he can't rationalize as self-defense, and even then without something acting as a buffer - his car, his plane, an explosion, even that crate he throws during the warehouse fight. He simply can't let himself because it's not something he can rationalize.

And speaking of rationalization, literally every reason he gives for his "war" is exactly that - a rationalization. His only real reason for it is pure revenge.

That's the message of his dream - he's turning his back on the truth and in doing so, he's letting his obsession with revenge consume him.

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>>86480480
I'll go a step further and say that the scene where the guy shoots him - that exact framing is liable to show up again. I don't even think he sees the guy he's in the midst of beating to death.

He sees the Joker.

>>86480714
Ok, sorry but that just sounds stupid.

He is killing directly, fucking shooting a man on a car with your machine gun isn´t forgiveable to say it wasn´t intentional, it fucking was.

At least there would be a group of people who would belive the same as you, but there isn´t because it just sounds bad.

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>>86480989
He didn't shoot him. He shot out the car's suspension. Check this out:

https://youtu.be/MyVPh3Usrho?t=86

Watch at about 3:12. It's like a live-action version of what's happening in pic-related with the goon acting as a sort of stand-in for Gordon.

Wonder Woman was good by capeshit standards. Gal Gadot does nothing for me as herself, but she's hot as fuck as WW.

>>86477550
he was expecting for fortykeks too bad didnt happen

>>86480714
ANd what you just said made Batman look more of a reckless, emotional, idiot since he just acts and doesn´t care for consequences.

>>86481209

Jesus Christ, you´re just in denial.

You think the machine gun guy didn't die from the bullets or the car flipping and possibly exploding?

Look:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgkQS7q6sT0

Batman killing is ok for me, but not killing certain characters just because they´re important is just stupid.

>>86481332
Yeah, and that's the point. He's nuts, out of balance, and doesn't fully return to form until after Clark's death. We got a more realistic depiction of a redemption arc than the cliche bullshit moments of epiphany we normally get out of Hollywood.

What makes it even better is that it's no single thing that brings Bruce back around, and witnessing Clark's heroism is just the brighter side of it. The pathology's still there just beneath the surface: the "Bat" wanted to see the alien die. It got what it was after anyway.

>>86481332
So what you're saying is Batman is emotionally and mentally fucked from all those years of crimefighting and losing the people he cares about? Well geez, it's not like THAT WAS THE ENTIRE FUCKING POINT YOU ABSOLUTE RETARD

>>86481513
He's not saying Batman didn't kill, he's saying Batman killed that guy in an indirect fashion and technically in self-defense since the shitter opened up with a minigun first, which justified that death in Bruce's fucked up mental state.

>>86481556
I would rather die, before thinking this is realistic.

>>86481513
What "important" character doesn't he kill? He doesn't kill any of the men he interrogates not because of their importance, but because they're at his mercy.

They also state in pretty explicit terms that this is a new thing for him - certainly the branding is, and all of that comes after the Battle of Metropolis.

I like the film and it did alright at box office, but holy shit it should have done much better.

It's fucking Batman & Superman, in the title as well, they should have cross the $1B mark easily. They're easily the biggest pop culture icons of all time. Pretty sure the Superman symbol is like the one of the most recognized thing on Earth to boot, behind the Cross, McD's and Coke.

>>86481559
If it was the point then why didn´t the movie emphasize this? It´s not like it highlights this, Batman just kills for no reason just cause.

I don´t get what Snyder was aiming for, but a Batman that´s even a bit heroic wasn´t one, this isn´t THE Batman, it´s A Batman but not a good Batman still.

>>86478373
>Literally this movie is bad because I could not understand it

>>86481735
I agree.

>>86481779
The entire movie is emphasizing this. Alfred's emphasizing it, his dreams emphasize it, and his actions emphasize it.

>>86481794
Ok, tell what I couldn´t understand.

The plot is so simple it´s so easy to follow it.

>>86481723
Lex Luthor, Superman, Joker, Harley, Deadshot.

And the weird thing is that all of these characters were needed to amke more movies. Strange.

>>86481735
Yeah, it really is testament to how much they fucked it. The title alone is pretty much a $1.5 Billion gift.

>>86481615
Batman is so skilled that he should be able to beat everyone and not kill anyone, but Batman is just a moron here.

>>86481895
If it's so simple, why do we have to keep telling you the same things every week, pointing out the same details, delving into the psychology of the characters again and again?

Mainly, it's because you've been indoctrinated into only taking everything you see at face value, and in most movies you can do that, but it's also the difference between a shallow, easily digested bit of entertainment, and the sort of film that's still getting discussed a year and a half since its release.

>>86482005
Every character you just mentioned, literally every one of them, all come after he's reined himself back in. If you have problems believing that he put everything else on the back burner to up his street-level game to a point where he felt he could take down Superman, then there's nothing I can do that's going to convince you otherwise, but that's more than good enough for me.

>>86481894
It really isn´t, it vaguely shows how Batman changes after watching Superman die, but that´s it. It didn´t do it on a smart way.

>>86481894
that wasn't a dream you retard

>>86482314
Ok no need to start shit, since it won´t bring anything to this conversation.

>>86482106
No, shit like that is all you ever post in these threads.

>>86482300
If you have guns, a huge sample of kryptonite, and already know it can shard down small enough to make a scalpel, why make a fuck-huge spear out of it instead of a knife, bullets, knuckles, literally everything everyone always says as criticism?

>"It doesn't make any sense."

Exactly.

>>86482266
Maybe good for you, but you aren´t everyone.
You can like this, I´m not saying you can´t, but DC fans and the general public deserved better than this "thing".

>>86482314
The intro: dream.

The Man-Bat: dream

The Knightmare: not dream.

Clear now?

>>86482455
So I'm not a DC fan now? Fucking kek. I'm the guy that's telling you that Bruce's psychology in BvS is in perfect keeping with the lore and that Clark's is. too.

You're the one who's getting all butt-hurt over the fact that you didn't understand it. I've been saying essentially the same things for better than a year and adding to them as more detail and nuance fell into place.

>>86482266
the joker and deadshot scenes in SS were before bvs

Joker is directly responsible for the vast majority of batman's mental degradation.

He suddenly doesn't kill deadshot because he's necessary to the plot of the movie the scene is in.

>>86482410
I don´t follow your logic.

>Just because Batman didn´t make an efficient weapon with krytonite then that means he´s retaliating.

It just shows he´s a moron.

>>86482473
More accurately:

>The intro: Memories in a dream

>>86482473
so batman's origin was a dream in bvs?

>>86482584
What? I didn´t say you weren´t a DC fan, I´m just saying that just because you liked it, it doesn´t mean it´s flawless.

>>86482623
I'm saying it's irrational to make a spear when you could make a bullet.

>>86482597
How long before? Maybe before the Battle of Metropolis? Go figure.

>>>reddit

>>86482644
See >>86482639.

>>86482718
That doesn't change the fact that todd getting joker'd is primarily responsible for batman's mental degradation.

>>86482775
Yeah, and there's a damn good chance that he killed him for it. Time will tell.

I waited 30 years to get the details of Anakin Skywalkers fall from grace and it was a massive, massive disappointment. Looks like I'll be waiting less than a decade to see Bruce's and there's an excellent chance it's going to deliver where Lucas abysmally failed.

>>86482473
And the fla,sh was that a dream or premonicion or what the fuck? was flash real?

>>86482866
Uh, negro, they've already accidentally dropped the entire batman backstory in the DCEU. An unshown joker turned jason, batman kills that joker thinking jason is dead, finds jason, etc.

So canonically batman is already in kill mode. A mode that's randomly turned on and off depending upon what's needed for future (or current) movies.

>>86482718
Either way, Batman is an idiot for trying to kill Superman without having a civil conversation before. And when they do get to talk they threaten each other, why?

>>86482980
My god, that just bad writting.

>>86482902
I'll tell you what I think:

I don't think they're going to let Barry(or anyone else) physically time travel on his own power. I think he opened a wormhole to contact Bruce, but that it was actually the same sort of dream tech Zod used on Clark in MoS that made the communication possible.

I think a side-effect of opening up that portal was Bruce being able to "remember forward" to the events of his own death in that timeline.

>>86482999
Batman is impossibly stupid the entire movie. Then suicide squad shows that isn't a recent development.

Even the last scene where he doesn't brand lex is batman still being hilariously stupid, as it means he never even suspected that lex was responsible for killing the branded criminals.

>>86483070
What. The. Fuck?

That sounds even more stupid than the movie itself, I sure do hope they don´t do that.

>>86482980
Yeah, "negro," and depending on when and how that happened, he hasn't let anyone "important" live.

>>86483142
Yeah, I prefer my movies with comic book science to be as unimaginative as possible, too.

>>86483155
The point is it happened before suicide squad, but he needed to let deadshot live, so he's just been randomly flitting back and forth between kill mode on and kill mode off.

>>86483155
Lex Luthor?

You really think they won´t bring him back?

Or Joker?

>>86483249
So how long had Deadshot been in prison? When did he kill the Joker? When did he discover Todd?

You don't know. Neither do I.

>>86483292
The suicide squad timeline establishes pretty cleanly that todd got joker'd before deadshot was imprisoned. You can check by the dossiers on harley and deadshot.

>>86483292
But it still sounds stupid that Batman wouldn´t kill Deadshot before BvS, when this was the time Batman was a murderer. Or more importantly, Joker.

>>86483263
>Luthor: Bruce comes into contact with him *after* he's on his road to redemption.

>Joker: damn likely to be his corrupted partner.

Yeah, I see what you're saying. It makes absolutely no sense at all. It's almost like it's got to involve some sort of personal trauma, something that hits really close to home for Bruce to go over the edge. What terrible writing.

>>86483418
A). That´s wierdly convinient.
B). You don´t know that

>>86483418
And you also act as if you knew for sure that Joker is Todd, which It´s obvious you don´t.

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>>86483361
Todd got "Joker'd" in a very literal sense. I don't give a shit what Ayer said. Until I see it myself, I still say this Joker is Jason Todd.

>>86483486
>Bruce doesn't come into direct contact with the guy pulling his strings until after he knows he has reason to.

Yeah, it's all just so terribly contrived.

>>86483687
And he didn´t have a reason before? Like, I don´t know, being conected to the man he sees as a threat and also posessing his only weakness?

Certainly Batman is the best detective in the world.

>>86483529
Ayer is under contract to lie, if he tells the truth it'll damage the brand, put ayer in breech, and WB will sue him for everything they've paid him so far.

>>86483687
It´s also really weird that Luthor left the court before the explosion went off, that´s strange but I bet Batman knows it´s nothing to start suspecting that Luthor might be the one behind all of this.

>>86483833
Bruce knows Lex is bringing kryptonite into the country. That's the only reason Lex is even on his radar. He has something that he very badly wants and he has good reason to think Lex wouldn't just be willing to give it to him.

>>86484119
um sweetie batman wasn't at the court meeting

>>86483974
Want to see me kill myself?

What´s wrong with Reddit? Why is it being brought into conversation?

>>86484119
>gee I wonder why that angry dude who sent back all our disability checks has a nice lexcorp brand wheelchair

>oh well time to go kill superman with the kryptonite I stole from lexcorp!

>>86484158
He was watching it when he found out about the returned disability checks

>>86484158
But wasn´t the fucking court case Live streamed on the News?

And I bet it was public knowledge that Luthor was supposed to go, so even if Batman didn´t go, he should´ve suspected something

I bet Batman would´ve been interested in knowing how things went, don´t you think? WIth him being the best detectivein the world?

>>86484299
he was but he only saw lex fucking with him on a personal level, not controlling him.
he does confront him basically by fucking up his lab and taking his kryptonite

>>86484329
Pshaw, batman would have no reason to want as much information on superman as possible before they fite.

He was just ignoring the proceedings while grinding out his lexcorp brand kryptonite spear and lexcorp brand kryptonite gas grenades.

>>86484366
So Batman isn´t the greatest detective if he couldn´t figure out Lex´s very simple plan.

>>86484419
t. chris stuckmann
and lex

>>86484450
*lex is way more smarter than bruce

>>86484494
Only because the plot demands it.

>>86477419
That's not Civil War.

BvS, in it's theatrical version, is weak due to the editing. it misses so many beats and stumbles too much. Extended fixes that.
But thematically, it's superior to most capeshit.

>>86484494
But his plan is horribly simplistic.

It´s so simle for Batman to figure it out.

>>86484573
Ok, if that´s what you think. I´m ok with it.

>>86484573
The theatrical version was a total mess.

The extended version was a bloated mess.

>>86484551
>>86484575
not really.
emotions can cloud judgement

>>86484898
And how come a lesser intelligent character like Lois Lane could figure it out?

>>86484965
because she witnessed beforehand?
and had the help of a government official?

>>86485003
And a man with resources and a genius intelect couldn´t? just because he felt angered?

>>86484898
The idea that bruce was emotional for 18 solid months is pretty far beyond retarded

>>86481794
>I can't understand why the CGI looks like a Xbox game.
Damn right I can't.

>>86485528
That´s Zack Snyder for ya.

>>86479140
>I would expect him to be interesting and not just some guy with superpowers who gets angry and punches things.
That's Superman in like 99% of his comics.

>>86485660
I know, fuck me for wanting something better.

>>86485528
>he woke up angry
>he ate breakfast angry
>he shat angrily
>he pissed angrily
>he showered angrily
>he fought crime angry
>he ate lunch angry
>he fought more crime angry
>he managed wayne enterprises angry
>he ate dinner angry
>he fucked some ho angry
>he went to bed angry
>he repeated this every day for 18 months

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>>86477419
nope

>>86485708
No, fuck you for watching capeshit.

>>86485766
Well, I did say ONE not THE.

>>86485708
You want something better? I'll gove you something better *pulls out dick*

>>86485826
Ok, buddy

>>86485660
>I've never read a Superman comic in my life.

>>86478373
I guaran-fucking-tee you that the only reason that Superman comes back to life in Justice League is because Steppenwolf resurrects him under strict mind control. And, the very situation that Batman THOUGHT he avoided, Superman going evil, absolutely comes true. Get rekt brainlet. These movies are not self-contained and BvS laid the foundation for many, MANY cool storylines.

>>86486689
>the good guy is evil because of mind control!

such a creative comic book storyline for our deep and serious cinematic universe

>>86486744
Brainlet.

>>86481794
>hamfisted symbols makes a movie deep

>>86486838
It doesn't matter why you do something stupid, you're still an idiot.

>>86482718
>b-b-but if he makes it a spear they can relate in to mythology in a really clunky way!

>>86483529
Why fixate on Todd? What about Grayson? Not a peep about him. Thematically, any of the Robins becoming a Joker would do that storyline right.

>>86487019
... because that's the jason todd storyline? None of the other robins got joker'd

>>86486872
>Everything I don't fully understand is hamfisted

>>86487170
i understand it
it just was really forced and poorly executed

>>86487072
With any Robin, it would still be thematically consistent and faithful to the storyline.

>>86486907
There are endless compelling reasons as to why someone would do something stupid. You're just an autistic brainlet with no imagination.

>>86487338
see >>86486907

>>86487269
the storyline has only happened with a robin named jason todd, thus, until proven otherwise, the DCEU robin is jason todd.

>>86487349
Not an argument, turbo brainlet. The very meaning of the universe eludes us, so I guess existence itself must be pretty stupid. But here we are arguing on a basket-weaving forum over a Superhero movie as you assert your undeniable intellectual elitism.

>>86487475
dragging existentialism into rationalizing your idiocy doesn't undo your idiocy.

>>86487429
Art is fluid, dude. I'm not saying you're wrong, ding dong. I'm trying to open your mind to that possibility since we've only seen evidence of the existence of a single Robin in the DCEU.

>>86487537
wholly irrelevant to the reason the DCEU joker is being referred to as jason todd

You asked why people are fixating on jason todd. You were told. You are now waxing poetic for some stupid fucking reason.

>>86487530
You sound like a pompous Nolan-tard; spewing out empty platitude after platitude, just like that shitty Dark Knight trilogy, as if your words actually hold any weight.

>>86487609
why are you talking to me as if I am (you)?

>>86487586
What I'm getting at here is that autistic plebians literally get asspained if a single detail is changed from the gospel of the comic lore that nobody actually reads. And you have proven me correct in your overtly displayed asspain. Any further asspain displays will only reinforce my aformentioned point.

>>86487720
they're copying the jason todd storyline. They've already betrayed that completely. Making some minute changes to names or some other bullshit won't change the fact they're copying the jason todd storyline.

>>86487019
There's a nightwing movie coming. I see no reason why it would be Dick, it would either be that he has to return being Nightwing or make the whole movie in the past. Or worse, someone else be Nightwing.

>>86487853
>make the whole movie in the past
Huh. I didn't even think about that. Mite be cool. But the announcement of the Nightwing movie feels so tacked on that I wish I could believe it. But who knows. In my mind, I imagine Snyder totally making like a vague framework for what will occur in the DCEU stories and the coked-out producers totally not reading any of it.

>>86486380
t. never has read a comic and thinks Reeves corn superman is the definitive version

>>86478022
Because it's a dumbass superhero movie?

>>86478022
WHAT

A

FAGGOT
A
G
G
O
T

Do you understand what you're doing? Are you knowingly intellectually dishonest or just stupid?

If you can't put forward and defend your own argument, you're probably on the wrong side. Only redditor faggots would demand that people explain to you the fundamentals of filmmaking and how the movie fails at executing them, just so you can likely negate whatever they say because you're a faggot.

The movie is trash. The script is disorganized and stupid and the characters are all stupid and shitty. And no amount of hamfisted religious imagery and retarded dream premonition sequences fixes that shit.

>>86487170
It's even worse than that. If he doesn't understand it, it's stupid. Once someone explains it to him in exhaustive detail, it's never, "Oh, thanks for pointing that out," it just moves from his "stupid" column to his "hamfisted" column, because the guy you're talking to is never ever wrong about anything. Ever. Even when he's utterly BTFO, it's still you that's mistaken, because he was only pretending to be retarded.

Only it's increasingly apparent that he only *thinks* he's pretending.