The Thread You've been waiting for

>>85842669
Fare? I dunno im retarded american. Ignore the spelling if wrong

>>85842669

combined with equivalent technology? do you mean if he were commanding roman legions with roman weaponry and armor?

if he were, he would get completely stomped

>>85842765
Are you serious? Though the roman legions may not have had *great* armor, they were still very well equipped, and more importantly, organized. Plus, ballista were commonly used by the romans, and as we now know, they're apparently the ideal anti dragon weapon

>>85842765
>weaponry and armor
>equivalent technology
Please think before you post. I'll let it pass this time, but do it again and ill hook u in the gabber, m8

>>85842669
Bump this shit pls. This is actually interesting.

>>85842669
140,000 troops would give him the biggest army. Westeros would be a new dominion of SPQR.

>>85842877
you're a fucking faggot who doesn't understand semantics. the post implies either
a. equivalent technology to that of the GoT universe or
b. the best of Roman technology

please think before you post, dumbass.

>>85842833
Romans had no plate. 90% of their successes were in steamrolling armies with worse equipment. The phalanx and troop tactics of the Romans were also suited for fighting freestanding armies, not armies that could yield massive cavalries as are seen in Westeros.

>>85843141
Roman TACTICS you absolute fucking tard. I know you misread so ill forgive you an additional time

>>85842669
Caesar wins without any doubt. At some moments during the conquest of the Gaul he was facing forces 10 times bigger and we know how it ended.

You didn't notice that the Unsullied used Roman tactics?

For shame. Caesar was a master tactician. Read about the battle of alesia. He would murder these medieval fuck ups.

>>85843674
No they didnt. Or if they did do you have a clip to show? From what i saw it was all big cgi massive force against massive force. Plus they dont relieve their frontlines

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>>85843804

Those are 50 man(at least) maniples, similar to the 60 man maniples of a roman order of battle. The triarii is a 10 maniple group that precedes the main battle group.

>>85842669
>In GoT armies get their camps raided and towns sacked like nothing
Just by his knowledge of Fort building Caesar would surpass any other commander on GoT.

>>85844034
Hmmm. Ill admit im not well read on this aside from wiki shit. But wouldnt those tiny circular shields be ineffective

>>85844075

He had the nuts to build a siege wall, then build a a wall around his own troops to keep out people trying to relieve the siege.

Who the fuck does that? And wins? Fuck Game of Thrones, that's more fantastical than dragons.

>>85844075
You ever watch that youtube series with little animations i guess, where it shows caesars tactical shit. He litteraly built a fort around an army once lmao

>>85843141

>roman
>phalanx

>rome
>no cavalry

>massive cavalries seen in westeros

>rome
>suited against barbarians
>what is carthage, seleucids and greeks

book doesn't count, it's bullshit anyway

the armies in the show are fucking pathetic, at most 10.000 men, there are no massive armies

GOT doesn't seem to have plate armor

similar technology is about iron and steel forging technology, you can't compare iron made in rome era with the iron and steel made in medieval age, that's why they say similar technology

rome army would fucking stomp any got army just because of their auxilia and legion system

>>85844104

Those shields are from those italian assholes. The Samnites. They preferred movement over protection.

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SNIVELRY

>>85844260

Who told you Rome didn't have cavalry?

>>85843674

Unsullied used greek tactics, roman tactics can't be used with a spear phalanx

The testudo shit isn't just putting a shield over you, unsullies just protect themselves like any army would do in a siege

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>>85844339
How was he so perfect bros?

>>85844260
/thread.

>>85844260
I love this. But do you think rome could adapt to dragons?

>>85844374

>doesn't understand greentext

>>85844405

I don't know, it's bullshit anyway because GRRM can pull off any deus ex

Still rome used a lot of scorpions and ballistas in their ships so probably something like that

>>85844393

what were the two offensive weapons of the roman army?

>>85844405
As this guy >>85842833 says in the show they are about to kill dragons with balistas so the roman's got that front covered.

>>85844397
Dis is not your master. I am your master, by the sacred oath under the standards of the 13th.

>>85844393

The Primus Pilus of a Roman Cohort. That means the first spear centurion.

>>85844397
He wasnt even evil. At all. He was loyal and only got corrupted by a roastie

>>85844483

?? Trarii didn't used roman tactics at all because they were old grumpy men who did whatever they wanted in the battlefield and were rarely deployed

The gladius and the scutum isn't exactly a round shield with a spear like we see in the series

The pilum is just a heavier javelin that by design wrecks and render shields useless at impact

and the auxilia system means that they knew how to deploy mercs as support troops instead of just charging with them a la jon snow

>>85844666

Latin league rome used phalanx but man that is just unfair, they didn't even have south italy back then

>>85842669
Your question is so vague and openended as to be meaningless.
What is the size and composition of Ceasar's forces?
What is the size, location, and composition of Ceasar's starting territories?
Does Ceasar have a basic, working, or in-depth knowledge of Westeros' history, religions, geography, populations, or politics?

All else being equal, the native westerosi forces have the Raven communication network. That alone, being able to securely and rapidly send messages over continental distances, gives them a huge strategic advantage over foreigners. I wish GoT would use this fact in its current season as it would provide some justification for how Jamie and Euron are able to run circles around Danaerys' forces.

>ballistae killing dragons

only if they get lucky, the show is going to make it retarded though. dragonbone is very light but as strong as steel (dragonbone bows are almost as prized as valyrian steel) and their hide is extremely tough. even if a bolt penetrates the skin it has to get through the bone first which is unlikely UNLESS you get lucky and hit an organ or eye directly which is very very hard since dragons move and can dodge.

during the dance of dragons most of the targ dragons were killed by OTHER dragons, not fucking ballistae.

>>85844716

You're absolutely right, I reversed that shit completely. Those are the old guard fuckers.

>>85844786

>raven communication network

>a raven takes almost 2 full episodes to fly to destination while a navy can move through seas faster and fucking ambush while nobody noticing

GoT intel network sucks major ass, the fact euron could pull off those ambushes speaks high of how incompetent they are


>>85844823

>muh dragons are immortal because reasons

yeah we know GRRM is a deus ex hack

>>85844182

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SU1Ej9Yqt68

the absolute madman

>>85844883
the point of dragons is that they are incredibly OP. imagine if only the US had nukes. having them killed easily by a ballistae is retarded, if that was the case how did valryia not get fucked up by old ghis?

>>85844397
he saved S2 from sucking due to them fucking up Octavian

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>>85844823
You're putting more thought into this than even the writers, give it up.

>*teleports behind your testudo*

Got has teleporting armies caesar has no chance

>>85844983

bad writing

>>85845073
no it's not bad writing in the books as of yet. danys dragons are not a 'solve everything' button like in the show. she can't even control them.

>>85845139

the books may as well be a pre-series writing fan fiction at this point

>>85844983

That had a lot of dragons and they were a lot bigger back in the day, whats her face has 3 not very large dragons. Her biggest dragon is a fucking whelp compared to the big dragons.

Now, the question is if a charle magne army could fight against the roman army, that would be a great discussion to have

>inb4 /his/

>>85844165
That's big nuts tactics. Imagine you're beseiged and the people laying seige to you begin to wall themselves up with h you. Fuck me man. No hope they'll decide to leave then.

>>85845456
a 2nd century Roman army would probably beat any European army until end of the Dark Ages

>>85843141
>>85843141
Manipular formations Ceasars legions used =/= phlanx. It also BTFOs a phalanx.

>>85844983
That's not how it works, bucko. Valyria had a shitload of dragons, so they used them basically like you'd use anti-infantry monsters in TW Warhammer.
Dragons aren't nukes on legs.

>>85843141
>Romans had no plate
Neither do the armies of Westeros, apparently. All they have is FUCKING LEATHER and steel parts held together by leather straps.

>>85844397
Quite literally the perfect casting.

>>85844983
they are not the same size the dragons

What's your favorite battle /tv/?

I just love the second punic war, it has so much drama and come backs, and literally kino battles like these or Zama

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MroGPObEZzk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjxYJBWcS08

>>85846327
Rome had pretty great casting across the board. And somewhat unusually for the genre, they actually made an effort to get actors that look like the people they're playing.

>>85842669

Caesar would send in Vorenus & Pullo, through pure luck, and to Vorenus's exasperation, Pullo saves the day.

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>>85846827
THIRTEEN

>>85844936
Can you imagine how crazy that shit must've been? How do you even get people to agree to go along with something like this? Caesar's armies must've been made of insanely loyal and dedicated men.

>>85846985
Caesar was the one paying them

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>>85842669
The Roman legions would stomp any infantry of Westeros, no question. If the Romans excelled at anything, it was heavy infantry. They were also excellent engineers and would likely have huge advantages in siege warfare. Because of the legion system, Roman armies were able to establish supply lines and march distances that early-to-mid medieval armies couldn't match.

The one area where the Romans would be in trouble is cavalry. The only (semi)decent cavalry the Romans could field was auxiliary cavalry, and even these were relatively lightly armoured, usually used for scouting or skirmishing. In Caesar's time the Romans had very little experience fighting heavy cavalry - something they would struggle to adapt to in their many wars against the Persians.
Roman horses were smaller than medieval European horses, were less armoured, and stirrups hadn't been invented yet. As a result, a fully armoured knight on a charger would be devastating to the Romans: not only practically, but also in terms of psychological shock. I doubt this would prove decisive in the long run, but they would very plausibly have a rough time adapting to this unknown type of enemy.

It's also clear that aside from maybe Stannis or Randyll Tarly, Westeros doesn't have any comparable military commander to Julius Caesar.

>>85846827
Here you got a quater gold talent. Go find Caesar's dragon.
>fortunepissesonme.jpeg

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NEWS FROM THE VALE

MARK ANTONY IS SAFE, BUT MOST OF THE SHIPS IN HIS FLEET SENT IN AID OF
GAIUS
JULIUS
CAESAR HAVE BEEN AMBUSHED BY EURON

CAESAR IS NOW SURROUNDED AND SEVERELY OUTNUMBERED

THE FORCES OF THE SEVEN KINGDOMS CONFIDENTLY EXPECT A DECISIVE VICTORY TO FOLLOW SHORTLY

*this month's public bread is provided by the King's Landing brotherhood of millers*

>>85847056
Sure, Caesar would've rolled over them.

Even with their worst generals though, rome would've smashed westeros. They had a long history of getting their asses handed to them and suffering what should be mortal wounds only to quickly recover and then... do the same thing all over again, until eventually all their idiots had managed to kill themselves off and less-retarded men were put in charge.

So romans might walk in and get rekt by westerosi cavalry. But then they'd come back a while later with better anti-cavalry tactics and equipment and try again. Then if that fails, try yet again.

And that's assuming they have equal numbers. Rome seemed able to raise single armies with more men in them than all the armies in westeros put together.

>>85843141
oh, ok, you don't know what you're talking about, rad

>Roman ballistas shot rocks not fucking harpoons.

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>>85847194
Ser Tanton Fossoway is not an apple and I am not a farmer.

Caesar already tried to conquest britannia in the ancient world so this question is stupid

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SHAME ON THE HOUSE OF LANNISTER FOR SUCH BARBARITY, SHAME

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>>85842669
Except Ceasar was in GoT...

>>85848099
HE WAS A STARK OF WINTERFELL

>>85842765
early lamellar roman armor has been discovered that is almost as strong as modern bulletproof kevlar

mid-late roman troopers had worse gear and weren't as well trained i think

>>85844034
>Those are 50 man(at least) maniples, similar to the 60 man maniples of a roman order of battle. The triarii is a 10 maniple group that precedes the main battle group.
what? no
The Triarii were the third and final line, not the first, and Maniples are comprised of two centuries. In the Camillan era, this means 120 men

>>85849285
Misconception. A third century or early fourth century Roman army would absolutely crush a Roman army from Caesar's time

>>85849384
what was different about their tactics and equipment

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would it or a derivative concept make a good HBO series? it would kind of have to be a bit ridiculous off the bat but HBO already does that honestly

>>85849432
Way better cavalry and skirmishers, equipment/training was roughly the same as before (except for innovations like the spatha), and the late army was also far larger.

>>85849432
Post-Diocletian the army had more, smaller legions and a greater emphasis on cavalry and light troops. Late Roman fortifications are much more effective than earlier ones as well.
In terms of equipment, the gladius was replaced by the longer spatha and spears made a comeback as weapons for use in the legions. Segmentata still existed but was less common than hamata and squamata

>>85849510
hey while you're here what about bronze

I got into an argument with my friend telling him that well made bronze weapons were superior to iron weapons, but that iron weapons were just easier to work with and more plentiful to mine

>>85845456
cavalry makes or breaks the scenario; otherwise a Carolingian army would be mostly infantry conscripts with a well-trained heavy cavalry core. The infantry would fight in such a way as to support the cavalry and the cavalry's tactics that would differ heavily from light auxiliary cavalry from the period of the First Triumvirate. So it depends, but their tactics would be heavily different even if the Carolingian infantry seems at first glance outclassed

>>85849628
You're right about earlier iron weapons, but iron of any quality is better for tools than bronze.

do snows always melt or was antony bluffing?

>>85849547
>>85849738
interesting stuff thanks guys

How come all medieval and ancient landscape in movies and TV shows are like barren unused land? Especially outside cities.

Is it really so hard to CG in some farms while you are doing all the castles?

>>85849928
>Is it really so hard to CG in some farms while you are doing all the castles?

yes. plus most viewers don't care anyway

>>85849922
In an essay I wrote for uni I had some plans of late Roman Danube forts, I'll post one to compare to an earlier one if I can find the essay again

>>85844397

He got BTFO by based Octavian.

Mark was a cuck.

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>>85850043
here's the walls of Durostorum, built by Diocletian. This is actually a pretty useful example of military advancements through the late Roman period because the large pentagonal towers date to the 6th century

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>>85849102

Half Life 3 fucking confirmed.

>>85850158
Really cool info, thanks m8

>talking about early roman tactics

If we are talking about Comitatenses and limitanei era troops and equipment than time would win

>>85849928
That always annoys me. Fertile land all around cities and no farms. Logistics were much more challenging back then. WHAT DO THEY EAT? Lembas?

OP stands fucking Roman

>>85849928
budget's probably already stretched thin by the costumes and extras and shooting on location at some old castle

Roman standing army at its height might have been as high as 375 000 men, i suppose that alone would mean bad luck for the westerosi if the Roman Empire suddenly appeared near them. Though much of those forces would be tied guarding the empire borders

>>85850046
>Autistavian

Mark Antony was without a doubt /ourguy/

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>>85849782
there is no neverending winter

>>85850346
>How would Glaba fare with the best of roman tactics combined with equivalent technology against a bunch of slaves?
Apparently not too well.

Ceasar would win by having sounder fiscal and taxation policies.

>>85843141
You historically illiterate nigger.

>>85844483
Gladius. And the 2nd Gladius, between the legs.

>>85842669
That depends.

What's his tax policy?

>>85850158
Romans = bees confirmed

>>85844034
>low-quality bait

>>85846985
All in a day's work for based Roman legionaries. They were engineers as much as soldiers.

>>85853420
Romans = the bees knees

>>85853420
>bees
>pentagons

>>85842669
He destroyed Pompeii being outnumbered 10 to 1 so yes he would destroy muh dragons tactically

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>>85842765

Late medieval Heavy cavalry and crossbows trump Roman legions but the Romans had much better training, organization, planning and logistics and another critical aspect of their success was their adaptability, so given a bit of time after the initial drubbing they’d get, the Romans would counter the feudal Westerosi military with their own crossbows, plus pike squares and heavy and light cavalry all supporting a now much better armed and armored and nigh unstoppable infantry.

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>>85844260
>GOT doesn't seem to have plate armor

Westeros is post-Medieval and well in the Renaissance, minus the gunpowder and before D&D slashed the budget, the shitty tv show did have full plate armor.

>>85850158
The Siege of Alesia was one of Caesar's most ridiculous victories ever.

>>85845067
That's not saying much.