/who/ - Doctor Who General

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best girl

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Doctor Whore

>>85275199
These always come in Pertwees.
Anyone predicting the next one to go?

>>85275199
>>85275205
Doesnt have to be the first, but with both Rose and Clara I am just priming myself for it to happen so I dont get surprised when it does.

Like, Ive been priming myself to expect Clara to retusn after Hell Bent and I'm glad I did because expecting it made me much less annoyed about it.

watching the ice warriors. what about you, /who/?

>>85275294
Ian Levine

>>85275310
Which are both Moffat characters. Show me a character Chibbs has written that is a marysue

>>85275328
Watching DS9

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>>85275328
watching some comfy touchwood

The only truly good things about Colin Baker's run was Peri's jiggly tits and Colin's jiggly belly.
*outs*

>>85275328
About to head to sleep, but probably going to try and start Fury from the Deep tomorrow.

>>85275346
Rose is a Moffat character? I thought she was RTD. Which is what I meant. Every showrunner will eventually make a companion they love too much

If Rose really is a Moffat character then I retract my statements

>>85275328
Starting Delta and the Bannerman.
McCoy's era so far has been a straight 50/50, Rani was complete garbage but Paradise Towers was pretty fun, even if it was an episode too long.

I'm just counting the hours untill Mel fucks off. Fucking hell.

i want more episodes in the past where the doctor makes famous people from the past happy. like dickens and van gogh

>>85275437
God no, Rose is RTD era, Anon.

>>85275328
rewatch of nuwho

>>85275437
s1 Rose wasn't, but s2 Rose most definitely was. Moffat companions tend to be Marysues from the get go.

>>85275480
Check a few threads ago in the archive. We had a lot of ideas for new celebrity historicals.

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>>85275457
>>85275422
>>85275383
>>85275382
do you guys think i can finish the entirety of classic who before the xmas special? i work for 6-8 hours a day and get about the same amount of free time every day not including weekends. t. >>85275328

Tomorrow should read that
comfy nz novelization of Revelation of The Daleks

>>85275496
So that anon was just wrong. Then my view stands that we'll eventually get a Chibnall Rose, unless he can reign himself in enough,

>>85275524
I'm glad he isnt writing female Doctor and mad that he pretty much writes her intro and BOTH Bill and Clara are in it,

I really want to have a cartoon of Doctor Who.
My concept is called "The Adventures of Peri." It's basically a cartoon version of the Peter Davison/Colin Baker years, and instead of revolving around The Doctor, it revolves around Peri.
What do you think?

>>85275764
how much cleavage is there

>>85275789
Well, since it's a cartoon, and since there have been many hot cartoon characters...
...Yes. Fucking yes. There will be a lot of cleavage.

>>85275328
i'm a nuwhofag who watched the series a few years ago, stopped right when 12 was coming in. so i'm rewatching. already up to tennant specials

Jodie has no on screen presence at all and cannot pull off strong leadership rolls. What a terrible choice for the first female doctor.

>>85275939
so you gonna watch the 12th doctor episodes this time?

moffat's s1-4 episodes were so good
what happened?

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>We didn't get a milf for 13

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>>85275328
Stargate SG-1, I need a pallet cleanser after yesterday

>>85275986
we literally did though
jodie has a kid

>>85275982
He has a limited bag of tricks, and is also not suited to be a showrunner.

>>85275997
too young looking

>>85275972
yeah, catching up, just started from the beginning.
i remember when clara showed up as souffle girl she immediately became my 1-off whofu 2. sally sparrow 3. jenny so i was pumped when i heard she would be companion, but i hear it didn't go so well. still will be fun to watch her/12 episodes

>>85275967
>Jodie has no on screen presence at all and cannot pull off strong leadership rolls.
[citation needed]

>>85276024

Arguments that are presented without evidence can be refuted without evidence.

show us her being commanding

>>85275982
Nothing. He was good then and he's good now, RTDfag

>>85276059
>show us her being commanding
https://streamable.com/w65id

>>85276024
Show me an example then, She's good at playing characters like she did in Broadchurch, but that's all. She's like that one kid in the highschool production who actually tries to act, but that's as good as she gets.

Rewatching Blink (cliche), I was kind of surprised at what I found so refreshing.
There's the four angels in the house, and then there's two more teased in the city. But when they trick the house angels into looking at each other, that's the end of the episode. There's no lead in to a 2-parter with the Doctor coming to help or anything, it's a relatively short story, but still left open by the 2 from before as well as the outro showing all the regular statues
Some of the 2 parters feel like they drag on so long, but a lot of the more popular stories are more than one part. So I guess I'm saying I like when they can actually make a single episode a good story
yw for the blog

>>85275988
kino

>>85276120
>she has never been given a different role
>ergo, she can only do one type of role
>never mind the fact that she was just given a different role

Just wait and see, man.

>>85275982
He wasnt in charge and so had limits to what he could do. Plus, he worked on two episode arcs at most. Both of those went away once he took over

>>85276063
that's most of /who/ apparently

>>85275982
river happened

>>85275294
Doctor Who
(1963-2018)

Alright, people, give me a Doctor, and I'll rank them on a scale of beauty from 1 to 10.
1: GET AWAY FROM MY FACE
2: Gross!
3: Bleeeeh.
4: Eh. Meh. Schmeh.
5: Okay, I've seen better.
6: Pretty cute looking.
7: Looking Good!
8: Insanely pretty.
9: So. very. beautiful.
10: *gets a raging boner*

>>85276307
But Missy already died

>>85276330
Kris Marshall

what makes the new season so bad
I feel it but I can't quite put my fat finger on it

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>>85270960
I want the Doctor to save Cosmo
>Literally the last of your kind
>Fall in love
>Turns out that your people planted a tracking device in your brain and eyes and the only way to remove it will result in you becoming deaf and mute
>Shadow tries to kill you
>Literally An Hero to save the universe
Being Cosmo is suffering. Made me fucking cry as a kid.

>>85276355
7.5

>>85276363
good set of characters distracting you from mediocre stories

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when

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>>85276369

>>85276426
please no, not while the show's in the mess it's currently in

>>85276454
DELET THIS

>>85276426
well he has already played a genius doctor

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>>85276454

How is \who\ reacting to Kris Marshall being the 13th doctor?

>>85276533
it's Jodie you idiot
Now go back to being depressed

>>85276533
>marshallfags still in denial

B T F O

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>>85276330
Tennant (of course)

>>85276599
>>85276632
you fucking idiots

>>85276254
>that's most of /who/ apparently

only 25%

>>85276599
>>85276632
>falling for bait

>>85276659
...4.
I don't actually think he's really that pretty.

if you are a doctor who fan, you are a cuck
doctor who fans = cucks
if you are a cuck, fuck you you fucking cuck

>>85276659
10 is the doctor/actor i would most want to hang out with

>>85276725
>>85276632
>>85276599
>they don't know what \who\ is
/who/ really is kill, isn't it?

>>85276727
OPINION DISCARDED

>>85276735
McGann and Smith seem like they'd be fun to chill with too

I've heard Capaldi is also super nice

>>85276760

lets all laugh at /tpg/

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>>85276821
>you will never drink tea or coffee in a cafe with capaldi

why liv

>>85276762
>they don't know what \who\ is
\who\ is a specific thing? last time I was here \who\ was just my asinine way of typing /who/ to piss people off

>>85275982
heaven sent and WEAT are better than any RTD era moff

>>85276668
>>85276762
>(crisp)

>>85276821
U gay lil shit
Ten is the worst doctor and we all know it

man, some episodes have some either really fucking cheesy or really fucking shitty messages
>THE PILOT: they're just misunderstood
>SMILE: they're just misunderstood
>THIN ICE: rich people are greedy cunts
>OXYGEN: capitalism is evil
>PYRAMID: force is never the way
>EMPRESS OF MARS: british people are evil

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>>85276369

all the doctors are really good
the companions however

>>85277050
That's like saying he's the worst flavor of ice cream, they're all good

>>85275917
best pair

>>85277050
11 is 10lite

>>85277074
>EMPRESS OF MARS: british people are evil

There's nothing cheesy or shitty about this message, desu

>>85277232
they can take a normal message and present it in the worst possible way, though

>>85277165
there all ok
the doctor is a contrived character to be honest.
he has enough knowledge for when the plot needs it but then is also just enough of a fuck up when the plot needs it as well. The doctor is also mysterious but in a way that will never conclude.

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What would each of the doctor's reactions be to this?

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so why was the cyberwoman in a costume that was clearly fitted for a female if cybermen remove sex?

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>>85276426
>>85275988
I'd rather have him

FUuuuck noooo. Victoria was official hottest companion

>>85277458
because it's not canon

>>85277510
she was :^)

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>>85277024
thanks lad

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>>85277594
obviously by victoria i mean pic related

>>85277621
Ughhhh, why do I want to see the ninth doctor all fat and squishy from eating too many crisps? Am I trash?

I'm still triggered that some people like Clara as a character

>>85277732
Well I'm a bit baffled how anyone enjoys the Tenth Doctor so I guess it's fair

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>>85277732
she was good in season 9 desu

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>>85277458
>>85277569
Cyberwoman is objectively the best Cyberman story of the NuWho universe to date

>>85277631
why does she have back cleavage?

>>85277818
They're called shoulder blades

>>85277789
It just doesn't work for me if the character was straight up placeholder for a real companion for two years and then it suddenly becomes 'good'

I hate the 'but she was redeemed' excuse because human perception exists and you can't just ignore it and pretend that it's a fresh start

>>85277854
thats not what i meant, i mean in season 7 she had no characterisation and was just a plot point, after that they explored her character

>>85277458
>>85277811
Why the hell don't I remember this?

>>85277889
because you havent seen torchwood

>>85277908
oh, yuck

>>85275272
Don't be like that. Pretty blonde white women are an under-represented group in the media. The BBC should be applauded for their brave decision.

Cats supports a twink companion

>>85277974
>it's a "all casting should prioritize representation" episode
kill thyself

>>85277997
so do I

up to the slitheen episode, rose just called the doctor gay. defund the homophobic BBC NOW!

Edge supports a twink companion

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>>85277889
Dunno

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Drawin' a thingy

I honestly believe that Capaldi's years is a low point of modern Doctor Who

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Holy fuck, I can't believe the madman said this! Why is no one talking about this??

>>85278260
>ignoring 10's tenure

>>85278294
too soon :(

Immigrant supports a twink companion

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do you ever have sleepovers with your best friend to watch doctor who?

>>85278374
I don't have friends

Neo doesn't support a twink companion

>>85278402
Based

>>85278351
Immigrant is black

>>85275764

They did. It's called Fonz and Happy Days gang.

>>85278519
Based

>>85278519
Twinkie companion

Cats IS a twink companion

What Doctor/companion dynamic would work best with 13? No romance allowed, purely platonic.

>>85278613
Captain Jack Harkness.

>>85278613
Just friends. With a gay twink companion

>>85278629
this

Cats has a barbed homo feline penile

if and when jack harkness appears in this show, hopefully we'll see a bit of torchwood as well

>>85278529
Oh, yeah, I get it, Hanna-Barbera didn't get to make a Doctor Who cartoon, so they made a shitty Happy Days cartoon with time travel.

>>85278643
By the name of Cats12

>>85278674

Having jack as a usual for a season would make it easy to springboard into a torchwood reboot

would HD slitheen look good?

>>85275592
you've got 156 days. That averages at about1 serial a day, every single day. You could easily do it if you stick to it.

>>85275982
Girl in the Fireplace is one of the shittiest Doctor Who scripts Moffat ever wrote.
It somehow isn't even the best episode of Series 2, which is impressive when you consider the low standards set by that year.

>>85278888
no

>>85278989
>Girl in the Fireplace is one of the shittiest Doctor Who scripts Moffat ever wrote.
I disagree

>It somehow isn't even the best episode of Series 2
I agree, impossible planet/satan pit is GOAT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDdTeoYPw6Y

why cant the sjw's just let us have out little programme. If they want some faggot shit they can watch queer as folk or something

>>85279173
>our little programme

Sorry mate, this show was created by a Jewish woman and a gay Arab. It's always been a "SJW" show and that's a fucking good thing too.

>>85279304
>and that's a fucking good thing too
The best episodes of doctor who have always been the ones without a political angle, no exceptions

>>85279321
Hope you aren't counting any Dalek stories then, seeing as they're based on the Nazis. That throws Genesis, Evil, Power and Dalek out the door, in case you forgot.

>>85279321
Most episodes will continue not having a political angle, Cletus.

>>85279422
>space capitalism

>>85279422
try watching the first few episodes of s10

the problem isn't the political angle, it's with how hamfisted they are.

>>85279464
Oxygen and the final Monk episode are the only ones with overt political messages. Single-line jokes don't count.

>>85279503
the problem isn't the political angle, it's that it's politics I disagree with

>>85279522
>>85279503

Thers nothing wrong with a show showing a political skew, as long as it doesnt affect the narrative and is contained in throwaway lines.

>>85279522
This. The same thing happened with Bill. People were fine with Clara and Danny's relationship (as they should've been, it was pretty well-written) but suddenly started complaining about Bill and Heather. Only same-sex relationships are ever "hamfisted" to them.

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>>85279608
>it was pretty well-written

also bill and heathers relationship was awful, you cannot say people are mad because they're gay when it was literally the worst relationship who has ever done. They met what 3 times? atleast bill went on a date with that other girl.

>>85279608
https://www.reddit.com/r/gallifrey/comments/6nxbpc/a_look_at_the_sexuality_of_companions_and_whether/

^ Statistically Bill's mentions of her sexuality were below average for NewWho companions too

>>85279608
I would've been fine with it if they didn't make 100% sure EVERYONE KNEW WHAT'S UP OKAY WE DON'T WANT ANYONE NOT GETTING THE HINT WE'RE GOING TO VERY EXPLICITLY EXPLAIN IT EVERY EPISODE

>>85279669
CLETUSES BTFO YET AGAIN

WHEN CAN WE START THE CULL?

>>85279692
See
https://www.reddit.com/r/gallifrey/comments/6nxbpc/a_look_at_the_sexuality_of_companions_and_whether/

>>85279692
Being lesbian is outside the norm so of course she has to explain it to people. They (understandably) assume she's straight because most of the population is, and she corrects them. This even occurred less than other companion's mentions of their straightness, see >>85279669

I love how cletuses never respond to actual evidence, like the actual amount of lines Bill has about her sexuality, or the actual amount of episodes it's mentioned in, but instead just continue whining and whinging and making vague complaints. Babies.

>>85279666
Love at first sight, anon

>>85279669
Except every other character bar martha had a partner during the season as a recurring person. Counting amy/rory rose/mickey clara/danny as the same thing as bill saying BTW IM GAY isnt really fair. People wouldnt compain if bill had a partner throughout the season but she didnt.

Reminder that Cats is literal cletus because he think homosexuality is an illness.

>>85279798
If she had a partner she would be reminding you homophobes of her gayness almost every episode, as opposed to her being single where it occurs less often. What is your problem with that?

Also people absolutely would complain if she had a girlfriend for the entire season

See, I see it differently, because the other companions mostly had parners, and talking about sexuality most of the time boiled down to "sorry, I have a bf/gf". talking about "the future" couple stuff instead of "oh hey I'm les and that's all you need to know"

>>85279798
Clara didn't have a partner in two of her three series

The vast majority of Rose's adventures were without Mickey

And you didn't mention Donna

So let's actually tally it up

Amy and Rory were together for the majority of their episodes
Clara and Danny had a few episodes together
Rose and Mickey - who weren't even together past the first episode - had a few episodes together

Martha effectively had no partner
Donna effectively had no partner
Clara had no partner in two of her series
Rose effectively had no partner, but an ex in a few of her episodes

Really, Amy/Rory is the only valid example. And that's a minority.

Besides, again, Bill mentions her sexuality far less than the majority of NewWho companions.

>>85279844
Source?

>>85279892
It's a meme, anon.

Please tell me nobody is unironically defending bill's "btw you know how I'm into girls right yeah good cheerio" line in the finale
that is not good character writing. Gay people in real life are not defined by their sexuality and they certainly don't go announcing it like that

>>85279876
>mentions her sexuality
It's been a while since I've watched the older nuwho episodes actually, does anyone explicitly bring up "I'm straight" or "I'm bi"? I think someone did but I can't for the life of me remember who it was

>People wouldnt compain if bill had a partner throughout the season but she didnt.

Jfc, cletuses are even delusional when it comes to their own prejudices

>>85279911
How do people miss the point of that line so hard. She was reassuring 12 that she was still her, that the cyberisation hadn't removed her identity yet.

>>85279916
I really do recommend reading https://www.reddit.com/r/gallifrey/comments/6nxbpc/a_look_at_the_sexuality_of_companions_and_whether/ , he goes through his methodology concerning things like that

>>85279908
NO IT'S NOT
CATS IS CLETUS
STOP HIDING THIS FACT

>>85279867
>>85279876
No problem, because the issue isnt frequency, its how they write it. Having a gay couple that feels natural is better than LOL IM GAY.

It didnt feel like too much, it felt forced.

>>85279911
>Gay people in real life are not defined by their sexuality and they certainly don't go announcing it like that

h-hey if i put this in here it seems like i'm not a homophobe!! right? i'm fighting FOR the fa-
i mean gays!! molon labe

>>85279931
I had no issues with bill dating that girl in the monk trilogy, the scenes were fine
heather in the pilot was similar but not quite as good because their whole romance was so hamfisted (they spoke like twice before heather turned into a puddle, never went on any dates but they're perfectly compatible soulmates? that's the most superficial shit and would be just as idiotic if it was a het couple)

>>85279962
I'm a gay myself you fag
virtue signalling fucks like moff completely miss the point more often than not and do more harm than good

>>85279960
It doesn't "feel natural" because homosexuality isn't the norm. Again, look at the numbers. Bill mentions her sexuality less than the other companions. It only feels "forced" because you're not gay.

>>85279911
>Gay people in real life are not defined by their sexuality and they certainly don't go announcing it like that

With my gay friends (10+) they are either what you described or they vehemently hate what you described.

>>85279960
If you were homosexual you'd realise LGBT people DO have to say that kinda stuff often. As a straight person, you could even just use your empathetic skills and put yourself in the shoes of an LGBT person to figure this out.

HEATHER
WAS
CUTE DAMMIT
wish she had more than 3 lines and an episode

>>85279963
Have you never heard of love at first sight? Nowhere was it said they were some destined perfect lovers, but they had chemistry and found each other attractive. Tonnes and tonnes of relationships start that way, it's romantic.

>>85279985
Yeah, such a typical virtue signalling move to make a gay companion mention their sexuality LESS than straight companions. Really shoving it in the viewer's face.

>>85279998
This

>>85277510
Fuck that shit. Ace was hottest companion

>>85280013
Love at first sight is bad writing and nobody can unironically defend it. Lust at first sight perhaps, but that's not what was written.

Mentioning sexuality and acting out sexuality are two different things and you cannot treat them like they're the same.

>>85279998
Just because they have to do it doesnt mean its good writing to do it over and over again. Explain it to the viewer of course but repeating the scenario adds nothing than annoyance, it'd be like explaining the concepts of the show at the beggining of every episode.

who gives a fuck if she's gay or not, the problem with the new season is its shitty writing and bland characters aside from the main cast

>>85279985
>virtue signalling
>uses the word fag

Are you one of those "Gay" alt-rightists? Reminds me of when Old School Runescape had a Gay Pride event and a "somewhat gay" Redditor voiced his opposition against it, only for him to reveal in the comments that his criteria for "somewhat gay" was that he had considered dating men because no woman wanted him. I bet that's you, Cletus.

>>85280046
Yeah, Romeo and Juliet was such bad writing, how can anyone unironically defend it. Love at first sight totally never happens in real life or "good" stories.

>>85280050
They literally did not do it over and over again. Reference the lines you're talking about. Talk the actual numbers.

>>85276866
They did a raffle for that this year http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2017-04-20/doctor-who-fans-this-is-your-chance-to-have-breakfast-with-seven-doctors--past-and-present

jealous af

>>85278056
yea I'm down

I really love how none of the cletuses respond to this https://www.reddit.com/r/gallifrey/comments/6nxbpc/a_look_at_the_sexuality_of_companions_and_whether/

Really fascinating how they keep complaining but never point to the actual facts. Almost like they just get off on feeling outraged, and don't actually have any decent points to make.

>>85280071
we are on 4chan, anon
fag holds no offense here. Fuck off back to tumblr if you can't handle a gay calling other people faggots

>>85280080
Y-you support a twink companion?

>>85280050
>Explain it to the viewer of course but repeating the scenario adds nothing than annoyance
It wasn't annoying at all. It was relatable for gay people and inconsequential for non-cletuses, in the same way that showing two straight characters dating in two seperate episodes would be absolutely fine. Nobody would criticise Moffat for "Repeating the scenario" if he did that.

>>85280109
>uses gay as a noun, reducing a person's personality to their sexuality alone

Confirmed for fake gay

Compare how captain jack's sexuality was handled compared to bill
why was one okay while the other gets complained about?

>>85280075
any time dedicating a scene to bill explaining her secuality more than once is too much because instead of it serving a purpose of explaining her to the AUDIENCE all it does is state the same fact and lecture the audience. Any time more than once is too much.

Just like the show doesnt have every single episode explaining that the doctor has two hearts. they'll mention it in a throwaway line sure but never dedicate a scene to it.

>>85280157
Given the conversation at hand and the point being made, the fact I'm a homosexual is the most relevant aspect to mention

>>85280174
Sure, you must really hate Amy and Rory then considering how much they reference their sexuality

>>85280158
Were you around in the actual RTD era? Tonnes of people complained about Jack

>>85280158
Because jacks was more about the fact that he was a sex crazed freak, not that he was bi

>>85280158
because jack's actually really cool while bill's really shit

>>85280127
twinks are qtpies

>>85280158
Jack had personality

>>85280174
The show isn't made for the meta-audience, it's made for the stories, how would every character in the show magically know Bill is gay just because the audience does? The Romans in the Eaters of Light can't magically absorb your audience knowledge about her sexuality. The guy hitting on her in Knock Knock doesn't have your benefit of foresight.

>>85280185
No self-respecting gay person calls themself "a gay". Either you're a self-hating gay Cletus or pretending to be gay. I think it's the latter.

>>85280158

Beacuse Captain jack followed "show don't tell", while at least half of bill's sexuality references were "tell don't show" - and that's far too high a percentage to be acceptable

>>85280158
It helps that Jack was white. You know what Cletuses are like

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>>85280216
>it's an Edge lusts after Jack thread

This is pathetic

>>85280194
reference doesnt mean explain anon...


If bill went around calling other girls hot in every episode that would have been fine. Its the fact they need to dedicate a scene to EXPLAIN it more than once. Once something has been explained to the audience, theres no need to do it again. That does not mean bill cannot reference her sexuality at all, because it's part of her character. But actually dedicating scenes to inform the audience she is gay is different.

>>85280230
>No self-respecting gay person calls themself "a gay"
I do.
What are you going to do about it? complain I didn't say "a cis gay male" or "a homosexual" because I didn't want to type that much?

>>85280250
Reference the actual lines. Tell us the actual lines you're referencing. Then count them.

Again, so fascinating how none of the cletuses actually respond to the factual analysis of companion sexuality references https://www.reddit.com/r/gallifrey/comments/6nxbpc/a_look_at_the_sexuality_of_companions_and_whether/

>>85280274
See>>85280229

>>85280262
I know right, the Cletuses still haven't fucking responded to this.
>>85280102

>>85280283
You call yourself a gay person. Not "a gay". Only homophobes (especially Russian ones for some reason) say that.

>>85280274
Homosexuality isn't the norm, heterosexuality is assumed, so gay and bi people have to explain their sexuality when people mistakenly assume they're straight. This is extremely simple and common

>>85280308
We don't all live where you do, you're overanalyzing meaningless shit to make an absurd invalid point

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Do we need Claudia to settle this?

i,m okay with gay characters right, but they can only say that theyre gay ONCE. after that,, NEVER AGAIN. only one time please. and no pubic displays of confection !! my grandchildren would be traumatised and they might catch the gay

Thread theme: https://youtu.be/7vHnCoURs7E

>>85280352
>no pubic displays of confection

Kek

>>85280352
shut up cletus
once again you prove yourself to be a hypocrite and cletus
die

Notice how the cletuses stopped posting after the fact they haven't responded to the actual fact-based statistical analysis of companion sexualities was brought up multiple times? They'll always scatter when you try and pin them down on facts.

>>85280316
>tfw i'm gay and don't bother explaining it every time because I don't give a shit

>>85280308
not him but seriously,
>muh Russians

>>85280352
They can say it as much as they want as long as it isnt written in a way to educate the audience that already knows she's gay. It would literally be the same thing as every episode where someone realises the doctor is a time lord has him giving a speech about being a time lord.

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>>85280352
Can you confirm or deny that this is a photograph of you?

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>>85280284
Off the top of my head
there's at least two times where bill's foster mom makes some comment about assuming she's straight (taking a boy home or whatever) and bill makes a sly indirect remark about the fact she's gay. Once in the pilot, once in extremis.
she says she's low key in love with the tardis in Thin Ice
there's the scene in eaters of light
there's the finale where she reminds the doctor she's into girls

That's 5 "tell don't show" references. Compared to 4 episodes where there were actual scenes of her showing gayness in her actions (two episodes with heather, two in the monk trilogy).
My analysis was correct. More than half of the gay moments were "tell don't show".
What was your point meant to be again?

>>85280259
I-I just said he had personality

>>85280420
Cats is majestic as fuck

>>85280404
Funny how you haven't responded to >>85280229
or >>85280102
You keep making the same point as if people haven't posted rebuttals

>>85280396
>muh Russians
No really, all the Russians I've talked to online say "the gays" and "a gay". I'm guessing it's something to do with their language, where that's probably how to you refer to gay people.

y'all are missing the real discussion of 13

it's not whether Jodie will be a good doctor, or whether the companion will be well written, or whether chimpballs will be a good main writer

it's whether the new intro will be good or shit like 12's

WHY DO PEOPLE IGNORE THAT FACT THAT CATS12 IS A FUCKING CLETUS
I'M SO DONE WITH YOU GUYS
IM DELETING THE WIKI
IT'S OVER

>>85280446
In the Russian language you refer to gay people as subhumans. Like a pot calling the polished toilet black.

>>85280229
Those scenes you mentioned would have worked if they were written in a way that lets the other characters in universe knows shes gay, instead of just telling the viewer again, in the exact same way.

>>85280437
And there was also a guy hitting on her in knock knock
so that's at least 6:4 tell:show, and that's abysmal.

>>85280420
STOP BULLYING ME

>>85280500
shut up fucking cletus

>>85280470
Russian """"people""" BTFO

>>85280460
I liked 10's intro
then again I also liked clara

>>85280470
>>85280529
As a Russian I'm very offended by this

>>85280500
Cats if you had to fuck a dude from Doctor Who, who would you pick

Hardmode: Which male Doctor?

>>85280437
Literally each of those lines has a purpose

The lines with her mum set up their relationship, explain Bill's dissatisfaction with her home life, and why she appreciates 12 so much (seen clearly in The Pilot and Smile especially, then taken as a given for the rest of the series more or less, until the finale)

The Thin Ice line, are you seriously implying this was meant to remind the audience the character was gay instead of just being a Dollard quip? Do you complain every time the Doctor compliments the TARDIS as "STUPID EXPOSITION REMINDING US THE DOCTOR LIKES THE TARDIS, THIS WAS ALREADY ESTABLISHED IN THE 60s AND NEVER NEEDS TO BE MENTIONED AGAIN!"

The Eaters of Light scene, again, are you seriously implying it was meant to remind the audience, instead of being characterisation for the Romans and yet another contrast between Roman and modern society, an underpinning point of the episode?

The finale line was her assuring 12 she was still her, and clinging to her identity successfully.

It's bizarre how you fixate on this "show, don't tell" idea as if these lines are trying to set up a character instead of just being natural characterisation with their own story purposes.

And my point was that Bill references her sexuality far less than other companions.

>>85280485
But they literally are. She isn't turning to the audience and reminding us. They aren't non-sequiturs. They're all lines with their own justifications and story purposes.

cats is fucking homophobe cletus
and this man dares to call someone else cletuses and even calls himself a SJW
cats12 is a mistake
cletus should die

muh show dont tell

muh characters can only ever mention something once, then NEVER AGAIN

rtd sucks because 9 and 10 both said they were the last of the time lords more then ONCE, gosh, what awful writing

>>85280554
Imagine living a country that has literally never experienced democracy and just accepting it because you're at the intellectual level of a flock of sheep.

series 5, 6, and 7 suck purely because amy and rory mention they're a couple after the 11th hour, which already established it. TERRIBLE WRITING

series 1 sucks because 9 mentions the time war again after the first episode. SHOW DONT TELL RTD YOU FUCK

>>85280485
The Roman had just saved his damsel from a dragon, he was fully expecting for her to be thoroughly wooed and Bill nipped that idea in the bud. I feel like you missed masses of subtext from that scene if you thought she brought it up apropos of nothing.
Scenes like that add humour, character and social commentary to the story. If we shaved all that stuff off and just had the bare bones of fighting a make believe monster, a lot of the audience would find it a very flat, dry piece of work indeed.

>no regard to HOW sexuality is shown or referenced, only looking at the frequency that it's there
what an abysmal argument

>>85280633
Yup. It served as social commentary, which is something that the show has always been known for, especially in NuWho. It showed that people of certain times had different opinions about what is normal, and pointed out that maybe our definition of "normal" is a product of our own time and societal influences. Not everything has to drive the plot, necessarily. In any case, the point of the Romans scene wasn't to establish Bill's sexuality but the Romans'.

finally we can get to hating the russians. both nazi cletuses and based sjws can come together on this one

>>85280556
if i HAD to choose, captain jack because he probs has some kinky stuff going on. but he's a bit JUST now. which doctor? what straight man wouldn't fall for the capaldick?

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capitalism is bad, you guys

Maybe this is subjective and some people being annoyed or not liking something doesn't make them subhuman or wacist

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If you're wondering whether Bill's sexuality is "overplayed," picture Amy and Rory as a gay couple and get back to me.

Like, Amy and Rory's literal entire life as characters was one string of corny (often cutely so) jokes about them being attracted to each other/in love. Bill making the very much more occasional than some think joke about thinking a girl is cute doesn't even come near Rose levels, let alone those two.

Amy is the one who said something along the lines of "My husband, this skirt and your glass floors" when Rory got distracted by looking up her skirt while helping the Doctor with something in the Tardis.

Not to mention, adult Amy was introduced as a kissogram girl. Compared to that, anything Bill did was pretty tame.

Amy trying to jump the Doctor's bones before her wedding to Rory is a good love story, but Bill's struggle to find a woman to love and share her life is corny and gratuitous?
I couldn't possibly disagree more.
Amy's entire schtick revolved around the show teasing "OOOOHHHH will she choose RORY or THE DOCTOR???" even though we all knew it was Rory.
For crying out loud, there's a whole plot line about Amy and Rory having sex on the TARDIS and making a time baby! And then the show has the nerve to tease "DOCTOR COULD THIS BE YOUR BABY?" for all of two seconds before it realizes how dumb that is and scraps it.
How can you possibly say THIS is an acceptable, wholesome love story, with no forced sexuality?
While Bill talking about her struggle to find someone, having to deal with the uncomfortable situation of turning down men (many of whom are perfectly nice but not for her) by letting them know nicely that she's a lesbian, and then finally ending up with the woman of her dreams for all eternity? How is THIS just gratuitous sexuality, and not a love story?

>>85280668
shut your dirty mouth cletus
you can't erase the evidence
we all know that you used to refer to homosexuality as an illness
you are cletus

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>tfw you've been so busy arguing for fun you forgot that you didn't actually have an issue with bill's gay mentions

>>85280681
>some people being annoyed or not liking something doesn't make them subhuman or wacist
that's not how it works you cletus

>>85280690
>we all know that you used to refer to homosexuality as an illness

Sauce

>>85280704
this is why the left is losing

>>85280591

wasnt last of the timelords his character arc? are you saying bills sexuality is her character arc you fucking bigot cletus

It's really ridiculous. Did she even have more than that one kiss with Heather through the whole show?

It seems that any mention of a character being LBGT is enough for people to claim it's being thrown in their faces. Funny how there was almost none of this outrage when Amy was desperately trying to sleep with the Doctor the night before her wedding.

It's heteronormativity. Audiences are so accustomed to references to heterosexuality that even a slight blip of anything else shines like a beacon. Every time characters talk about boyfriends, flirt with someone or say someone of the opposite sex are cute they are reminding the audience they're straight.

Bill's sexuality is totally underplayed, for what it's worth. She has a crush in the first episode, and goes on a couple of ill-fated dates in the middle of the run. There are two instances where a guy tries to hit on her, and she has to explain she's not into him. A couple of other small references.

Compared to the amount that Rose or Amy will talk about their sexuality from scene to scene, episode to episode, Bill's might as well be invisible. It's a fact of her life, but not a focal point. Except that it's not the cultural norm, so people pretend that they're being assaulted with it.

>>85280716
stop trying to get away you cletus

>>85280727
Plenty of people complained about Amy and the doctor

Overplayed?? People really think that? If ANYONE'S sexuality was overplayed, it was Rose's.

Amy and Rory literally made a baby in the TARDIS. Doctor Who does tend to get a little preachy about some issues but they would have had to try really hard to top that.

Yes, Bill explicitly says she is gay. That is life for exclusively gay (and asexual) people. Everyone assumes you are straight. In order to not hurt egos you have to nip it in the bud with the "It's not you, it's me," talk as soon as you realize what's happening. If a straight character existed in a world where everyone assumed they were gay the exact same thing would happen. That's just life for some people. Instead of complaining about the writing being bad, consider for a second that the writing is good and well researched in an area that you are completely unfamiliar with and take it as an opportunity to become more educated about a different type of person's life.

To the privileged, equality feels like oppression.

>>85280668
>finally we can get to hating the russians. both nazi cletuses and based sjws can come together on this one
CATS IS A RUSSOPHOBE TOO

Why did nobody complain when clara had lines that implied she was bi?

why are we talking about bill's sexuality instead of the fact that the show feels a lot more goofy and for kids now than it used to a couple years ago

>>85280727
except when decent writer writes homosexual characters (like jack or ianto or lesbian grandmothers or a lot more examples) people don't have an issue with that

As someone that is very against having a characters sexuality shoved in my face I applaud your efforts. The way that her sexuality was handled didn't feel like the way that say Dragon Age Inquisition handled the sexuality of everyone. (ie. LOOK AT ALL THE GAY/LESBIAN/BI-SEXUAL/HEROSEXUAL PEOPLE WE HAVE! LOOK AT HOW PROGRESSIVE WE ARE!) I can honestly say that I DIDN'T feel like Bill being a lesbian was shoved in my face. Like at all. Except for specific moments where she needs to say it to way lay a persistent individual (that roman comes to mind) it was handled very well.

Bill's sexuality wasn't overplayed at all, people just expect gay characters to say "I'm gay" once and then shut up about it.

I'm so sick of people acting like her talking about her sexuality is "bad writing", as if we haven't had to hear in detail about the sexuality of every straight character that has ever appeared on the show
also people who think gay people don't talk about being gay that often have obviously either never met, or never had a gay person be comfortable with them, because Bill feeling comfortable enough in herself and with the Doctor to talk about her sexuality even in historical episodes is a huge and incredibly brave thing for her to do, and the show did nothing but reward her for that, sending across the message that it's okay, you can be you, and anyone who matters will support and embrace you, you're not hurting anyone by existing as you

>>85280771
Because we all know S9 was peak characterkino but that doesn't appeal to plebs so moff had to water it down for S10 which resulted in the inferior series. there's nothing left to be said

>>85280766
because you're a cletus.

>>85280727
yes i too can copy comments from reddit.

How about this. tell me some other important facts about bill that dont relate to her sexuality.

>muh chips
>muh dead mum

pro tip: Muh amy and rory doesnt work here because i apply the same criticism to them

>>85280766
Fat, ugly inbred virgin Cletus: because i have a chance with bi women, so i can fap to doctor who and eventually meet clara on the set and ask her out

>>85280766
They did

>>85280778
People complained plenty then

Anyways, regarding the line in the Doctor Falls - She is essentially asking to see if he knows that she enjoyed the time they spent together. Twelve is neither anything even resembling Bill's age nor a woman, and yet, despite preferring that kind of company, Bill chose to spend a lot of her time with him. She's phrasing it so that he can infer the meaning behind it: If the Doctor already knows her preferences, then he knows she didn't spend her time with him because she was infatuated with him or anything like that, but because she truly valued their friendship. And looking at his facial response, the Doctor clearly pings this after she leaves.

I thought something was up since you troglodytes couldn't possibly type up this much shit in such a short amount of time

>>85280850
>People complained plenty then
I didn't

>>85280848
>and eventually meet clara on the set and ask her out
And thus Adam Orford was born

>>85280668
Barrowman looks good when he dyes his hair back to black, but otherwise yeah wew grey doesn't really suit him

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>>85280848
jenna is mine

>>85280870
why? what's the difference?

>>85280723
>the left is losing
sure doesn't feel like it, you false flagging cletus

>>85280841
She's an avid genre fan, something different for NewWho, leading to a lot of genre-savvy scenes (Eaters of Light sucked IMO because it kinda removed that trait and had her work out the TARDIS translation circuit way later than she should have, if the ep was pre Knock Knock it would have worked, but w/e, her characterisation on this worked well in all the other eps)

She's compassionate but unlike most previous companions she doesn't either ice up to get over it (like Rose), or just have it drift away when writers get bored with it (Donna), instead it's kept as a consistent trait informing her decisions even in negative ways (Monk trilogy)

Most of all to me, she's APPRECIATIVE. She doesn't take anything for granted. She actually THANKS 12 for the adventures, she's grateful and has a refreshing like student/teacher relationship with him. She doesn't take things for granted, which is a far cry from most companions

People are viewing Bill's sexuality as a prop. A prop like a gun that if introduced to the audience must be fired, otherwise it is a redundant element of the story—a needless complication and distraction. What people aren't picking up on is that by being a queer character, Bill's sexuality is making this story a queer story. It's not just a prop or embellishment.
Check out the instances of showing vs telling with regard to this. We as an audience see her sexuality in private moments, and we see her tell other characters about her sexuality in public moments...but that is still seeing her sexuality. In those scenes we are seeing how her sexuality informs how she responds to situations (she's apprehensive about how it will be received [likely because it hasn't always been positively received in previous experiences] but feels a need to be true to herself and her identity in spite of this), and the (queer)story being told is that (Knock Knock) acceptance can sometimes be effortlessly found, and (with the Romans) that across the time, geography and cultures of the Earth she is not alone in having a queer identity.
If you want to look at how each of those scenes inform the story of the episode from a meta perspective: each of those scenes endeared the audience towards those opposing characters. We would feel the loss of Paul because he was a good guy, and we now knew that the ultimate conflict to be resolved in the episode would be between the humans and monsters, not the two tribes of humans (similar to the reveal in Thin Ice where the chained sea-monster indicated that the real monster of the episode was a human).
[will cont in a mo, word limit]

>>85280928
because it actually felt somewhat natural and real and didn't break my immersion

>>85280933
>avid genre fan

what do you mean by this?

>>85280966
what made it feel natural as opposed to how bill was handled?
this is a genuine question, I'm not trying to attack

>>85280931
Where did I say or imply I was a leftist at all

>>85280962
cont
If you consider the line in The Doctor Falls to be another "telling" moment, for what it's worth I think that's been largely misinterpreted as a "I'm a lesbian!" where it was really a "you're not the type of person I usually spend time with or come to develop close relationships with, but I have, and that's because I really value you". I think it was just an I love you and thank you between a Millennial and a Scotsman. If you're interested check my comment history, a recent one contains a little more of an explanation to back this stance up.
I think Donna, the temp, is a really great analogue for how Bill's sexuality informs her characterisation. Donna brings up a lot that she's a temp, and sometimes it motivates her action in a scene—she succeeds because of her variety in skills and willingness to dive into something deep. But that same identity forces her to think of herself as different to the normal she's surrounded by (she's ordinary, in contrast to how she views the status quo of the scenarios she's taken to which is extraordinary; just like Bill is gay, in contrast to how the status quo of most scenarios is presumably straight). And so we get scenes like at the end of Turn Left where she says she's nothing special, and powerfully performed lines like "I'm just a temp from Chiswick", which are in contrast to what the audiences knows (she's brilliant) but are derived from how how identity inform how she views her place in the world.
[still have a tad more to write, will cont in a min]

>>85280931
how are all those bi-elections going for you again?

>>85280962
>>85280990
cont, last bit
This is where Bill's story differs, and effectively so.
Bill's conversations mark herself as different, seemingly again in contrast to what the audience knows (we know you're gay, that's cool, you're not different from other companions, you're just one who happens to fancy other girls). But no, Bill is different to other companions because of her sexuality. Not abnormal, just different, and that facilitates different stories. Sub in other companions to the Romans scene and they'd likely either rebuff any advances or flirt. What wouldn't happen however is the recognition that other characters in that scene are gay and bisexual. The story of that scene wouldn't be that non-heterosexual attractions have and will continue to exist, are valid and can be seen as normal. It wouldn't be that queer identities can comprise a legendary legion, representing the pinnacle of masculinity. It wouldn't be that humans, both straight and queer, stand together (sacrificing their lives) to fight against creatures who cannot help but consume the light, forcibly ending an enlightened world.
Those mightn't be stories important to you, they might not have been stories you were aware were being told, but that doesn't mean they weren't important stories, and that doesn't mean they weren't heard. It also doesn't mean that it was bad storytelling, it was just telling a different story.

well this thread has gone down the drain.
shame too, first post was one of the best FPs we've had in a good while

no captcha, you're not making me type out that massive string of numbers

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imagine being this butthurt LMAO

>>85280985
I don't know
probably RTD is more familiar with how homosexuality works in real world because he wrote a literal show about young homosexual boys before doctor who

Honestly I can't explain that, but I'm just saying what I'm feeling.

>>85281035
I have to give him credit where it's due, cletus has been a hugely successful meme for cats
far better than martha's crooked teeth

>>85281035
shut up, cletus

>>85280971
Well you know how in zombie movies, a lot of characters will have no like idea what zombies are, and not even call them zombies? They're not being 'genre-savvy', it's like they've never seen zombie movies before.

Bill acts like a character that, if not actually seen Doctor Who before of course, has seen other sci-fi and recognises some tropes when she seems them. Like the mindwipe in The Pilot, the TARDIS gags in the Pilot, colony stuff in Smile, the space doors in Oxygen, VR in Extremis, etc, even some of the monk dystopia stuff, she isn't bowled over by the story and reacting like it's all new to her, she acts like an actual person in the real world who's seen stories before would. a refreshing dynamic for the show

>>85281035
I have it filtered, kek

>>85281043
What a great argument. In comparison to the actual statistical analysis, we have "muh fee fees"

>>85281066
oh i see what you mean. But to be fair Mickey was also genre savvy in the way you described.

>>85281094
fuck offerino, don't act hostile to someone saying something civil and unoffensive

No one cares if Bill's gay
She's done far, far worse to justify me not liking her, especially that "HOW MANY HAVE YOU KILLED, DOCTAH" scene

>>85281094
i'm not trying to have an argument with you
Honestly I don't think 'facts' like as actual number of lines or percentage of on-screen homosexuality works in this case
I wouldn't want to prove anything to you, it's just how I feel

>>85281122
fuck offerino, don't act hostile to my sexuality

>>85280988
>>85281008
cleti

>>85281124
fuck that pissed me off.

OH DOWNT TELL ME YA'VE MOOVED ON

>>85281119
To a degree, but it felt like an inconsistent trait in him, used mostly for gags and overall deployed a lot less (especially since he wasn't a prime companion). In any case, it's a defining feature of Bill separate from her family and sexuality. Her appreciate nature is the big one for me though.

>>85281133
>Honestly I don't think 'facts' like as actual number of lines or percentage of on-screen homosexuality works in this case
What a surprise, when the facts aren't in your favour suddenly they don't apply at all. How convenient.

>>85281133
>Honestly I don't think 'facts' ... work in this case

Cmon mate youre literally sounding like a sjw. just drop it and move on if you lost an argument

>>85281190
stop acting offensive to me I'm trying to be nice
watch queer as folk to calm down
or take your pills

>>85281149
A group of cleti is called a cuckoldry.

A cuckoldry of cleti

>>85281190
>>85281218
it's almost like the type and quality of the reference is more important than the raw quality
woah
really made me ponder

>>85281226
'Trying to be nice' is disingenuous after a thread full of baseless vague attacks on homosexuality. I didn't say "stop acting offensive to me" when we disagreeing, I just provided more thoughts and contributed to the discussion. You're embarrassing yourself now by taking it so personally.

>>85281253
It's almost like you're still not referencing any specific lines or stats, and instead just moving the goalposts again. Woah.

>>85281253
raw quantity*

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I WILL NEVER STAND WITH r/gallifrey - Edition

>>85275199

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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

>>85281218
>youre literally sounding like a sjw
so?

>>85281262
I didn't attack anybody I wrote like 1 post before the first one
And out of all things I'm doing "attack on homosexuality" is the last thing in the list because I'm defending it

>>85281277
Uhh we're already here

>>85281315
>>85281315
>>85281315

Migrate

>>85281277
LOL

IM RETARDED

Here is BREAD >>85281320

>>85281320

>>85281320

>>85281320