Was Steve an ASS to his friend Tony?

It was pretty bold of Marvel to make Captain America the villain in his own movie.

>>84167178
>"I don't care. He killed my mom."

I was on Team Iron Man from that point on.

There's a difference from being drunk and straight up mind control.

>>84167249
Exactly. Mom vs long lost friend. Steve was totally wrong. (my wife is getting heated right now defending steve...women, i swear.)

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>>84167178
I was always on Iron Man's side

Steve is a fucking hypocrite and let me tell you why

Anyone who breaks the fucking law, it's fucking jail or execution for you with Captain America

He's never made exceptions.

But when it comes to his bestest friend in the whole wide world Bucky, oh NOW there's grays not just blacks and whites NOW we have to take special considerations.

No. Fuck that. Bucky gets the same fucking treatment as everyone who Steve has ever fucking put away.

No special treatment, "cap", don't treat him different because he's your bestest buddy and pal steve.

Bring him in, and let the fucking courts decide if he was brainwashed when he did what he did. It's not your fucking job to be judge jury and executioner.

Justice is supposed to be fucking blind, damnit!!! What kind of icon lets his judgement be clouded?


Doing the right thing is hard sometimes, Steve, serving justice sometimes means sacrifice to do the right thing.

The Captain is the biggest fucking hypocrite in fiction.

While he shouldn't let Tony kill him if he's really mr boy scout like he pretends to be he should bring Bucky in and turn him in to the authorities.

>>84167311
Let the courts decide

Steve isn't a fucking judge and he shouldn't decide who is put away and who goes scott free

I'm not saying let Tony tear him apart, I'm saying bring him in so Bucky can have a fair trial.

>>84167516
Great point. Cap shouldve been a good friend to bucky by helping him get a good defense team to represent him in court. cap elevated his friendship with bucky above the law and allowed a murderer to escape justice. cap really shouldnt be allowed to be an avenger anymore for doing that. he couldve been a good friend to both men in the roles they needed at the time. instead he betrayed the very laws he swore to uphold and destroyed tonys faith in friendships.

And steve also decided that, despite having zero expertise in the matter, that bucky would never be a sleeper agent being activated again. for all steve knows bucky could be loaded down with subliminal commands that could take experts years to unravel and remove from his mind. BUCKY COULD KILL AGAIN.

>>84167516
>While he shouldn't let Tony kill him if he's really mr boy scout like he pretends to be he should bring Bucky in and turn him in to the authorities.

You realize that's what he's been trying to do the whole movie.

Fuck...even in the film itself bucky attacked cap at one point. so, capis going to babysit bucky for the rest of his life to make sure theres no other mind control techniques bucky is susceptible to? No. steve fucked up. steve jumped the shark. steve betrayed tony who did nothing wrong at all. what a fucking awful friend steve really is. and hes unworthy of being an avenger thats for sure.

>>84167178
>>84167733
Yeah, well, in the end he had the chance to turn him in and he didn't, he hid him in Wakovia.


Let me put it this way.

If a guy murders someone and a cop takes him in and gives him a fair trial,

and then the cop's best friend later murders someone while on drugs and the cop ends up hiding his friend somewhere because their friendship is something special and he always wants to stick by him,

What kind of cop does that make him?

>>84167313
Show her this post so that she can divorce you.

>>84167178
>I will drop marvel just like that if tony ever accepts bucky in any role in any movie iron man is in. iron man should never forgive bucky. EVER.

I don't think Marvel will ever do that. If anything it will be working grudgingly together because otherwise Thanos will wreck the planet.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's one of those "once this is over we're enemies again" type of deals

>>84167178
Don't forget that Bucky wasn't just Steve's friend, he represents a whole life that he lost when he went on ice. A whole world that becomes more and more foreign by the day. Steve was fighting for his ties to his past as well.

But Bucky also represents Steve's greatest failure and regret. He blamed himself for Buck's death - and after finding out that he was alive, and that there was a shred of the old guy still in under all that Winter Soldier programming... Captain Rogers would do anything to undo that regret and save his friend.

There were a few reasons beyond MUH BUCKY for cap to be a douche - but a douche he was all the same.

>>84167973
I might accept it if tony looks at bucky about to be killed and simply flies past him refusing to help and tells steve to go save his faggot killer friend again.

>>84167516
Cap knows a unique case such as Bucky's would never be judged fairly in the court of law

>but Mind Control!
We, the viewer, know this is completely true and he was just a gun to be fired (like how you don't blame guns for the murders but the people shooting them), but what judge is ever going to buy that?

>>84168031
"My nostalgia means more than your mom, tony. grow up ffs."

That wouldve been honest writing.

>>84167178
>tony wants justice and goes after bucky

"You're after the wrong guy"

>people cheer for bucky and steve trying to kill tony

They weren't trying to kill him.

>yet people demand drunk drivers go to prison for vehicular manslaughter

You choose to get drunk. Bucky didn't choose to be brainwashed.

>>84168094
It wouldve been a military court with shield experts involved. cap broke the law. cap is a selfish nostalgic dickhead putting old friends above the deep pain of a a good friend. cap is unworthy of the avengers and any law enforcement job. cap is risking others being killed by bucky at any time.

>>84167550
>Let the courts decide

They weren't planning on taking Bucky alive.

>>84168041
Nah

Robert Downey Jr. will retire from being iron man so I'm betting any kind of money that he will die in Infinity Wars, sacrifice himself like he did in the first Avengers movie

Then Bucky and cap can be together again as bestest buddies forever


>>84168031>>84168094


Doesn't matter.
Steve damn well knows it's his responsibility to uphold the law blindly and he knows what he is doing is wrong.

Get him the best defense possible make sure he goes to trial.

>>84167178
Maybe he didnt want to complicate his relationship with his two best friends by showing the video tape. Maybe he values his only connection to his previous life and lifelong friend more than his new arrogant avengers superhero buddy.

>>84168134
stabbing your vibranium shield into a guys atomic chest thingie is a pretty good example of attempted murder.

>>84167178
>it's another Tony is the bad guy movie

We had Avengers, we had Age of Ultron, and now this.

Watch Infinity War have Tony be the bad guy again. He'll be a puppet of Thanos or something.

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>>84168173
>They weren't planning on taking Bucky alive.

Except that's exactly what they fucking did you idiot

See him in that fucking holding cell? IS HE DEAD?

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>>84167178
>yet people demand drunk drivers go to prison for vehicular manslaughter.
>Drunk drivers are not responsible for their actions either

You seriously don't think this do you?

>>84167516
>But when it comes to his bestest friend in the whole wide world Bucky, oh NOW there's grays not just blacks and whites NOW we have to take special considerations.
Its called escalation, flying city =/fight in city. And yes sometimes people are emotionally compromised by personal attachments. Thats how characters in fiction work. It creates drama and tension, adds depth.

>>84168205
The arc reactor at that point no longer sustained Tony's life. It was just a power source for the armor. Steve was trying to disable Tony's suit.

>>84168188
Oh fuck me...you make me think marvel will actually have tony die....SAVING bucky from thanos.

I hate marvel now.

I was pretty drunk when I watched this, but read the comic ages ago. Was it about registration?

>>84168230
Yeah but that wasn't the original plan. The original plan was to shoot him dead, like they tried to do several times. That blonde bitch who worked for task force even literally said "we have orders to shoot on sight".

>>84168245
Besides the point

I understand WHY he did it

That doesn't make it right. He broke the law and deserves to be taken in for a trial

>>84168274
I also don't think it'll be like that. It will be like Avengers, sacrificing to save earth

It's like pottery, it rhymes

>>84168256
Im pretty sure hitting it with an indestructible object could cause a big ass explosion. Its called a reactor for a reason.

>>84168309
Ok I understand thats your drive here, but ultimately that would of made the movie worse and less interesting than them beating each other to death for a movie. I dont think its character breaking or ill fitting for the genre.

>>84168335
Okay but it didn't. And if Steve's intention was to kill Tony than he would have just smashed his face in with the shield instead, like Tony thought he was going to do.

Wasn't this movie about how bullshit the law Cap used to uphold has become, mainly because of Tony being guilt-tripped by a fat black woman for a dead civilian?

Under the movie's context, you can't really blame him for deciding to "fuck that shit" and go with his gut

>>84168358
Oh I don't think it was ill fitting either, I totally agree.

Just saying that Steve is a nepotistic hypocritical asshole

>>84168407
The law was all kinds of retarded and honestly should have been dropped.

"Oh look you caused damage to new york WHILE RISKING YOUR LIVES SAVING THE FUCKING PLANET it's your fault you should be held accountable"

That's just bad writing.

The whole thing should have been about hunting bucky down.

>>84168407
Tony's motivation was so retarded. It was a complete 180. He was freaking out over aliens before and now he's willing to forget all of that because one kid died.

>>84168494
Actually it was because the whole ultron thing, yeah that was kind of his fault

The world was about to fucking end because he created ultron

no yeah that would fuck with my mind too if I was tony

>>84168494
He still cared about the aliens, it's not like the UN would just be like "Nah, let's just fight Thanos and his goons with UN forces, you Avengers go on vacation."

>>84168527
Yeah but he should cut himself some slack because he was trying to save the world from aliens. Big ambitions means big risks.

>>84168582
I think they'd have the Avengers doing a bunch of stupid political missions for profit instead of letting Tony have free research time.

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>>84168582
I feel like the whole ultron thing just kind of sidetracked the entire world

Thanos will be able to come in and cause chaos because ultron shifted all the worries from what's out there to the bullshit problems we have here

And then... when Ultron returns as Thanos is being defeated and takes hold of the infinity gauntlet... then we will remember that we don't have to only worry about what's out there again...

They THINK they destroyed all of Ultron. But Ultron was everywhere, all over the internet.

He's just watching...

watching and waiting...

>>84168642
It's a huge weight on his shoulders

The thing with the boy just made it more personal but he carries the weight of knowing he almost ended all life on earth as we know it because he toyed with forces he doesn't fully understand.

That's some heavy shit

>>84168527
That's true, and this is why I mostly blame the movie and how it was executed in such a dumb way.

At first it was like
>yo Iron Man you killed my son because your butt buddies threw a bomb in the air and killed 50 people instead of leaving the bomb alone to kill thousands, shame on you

And then it went on with
>you Avengers are dangerous people, look at how this one city was partially wrecked while you defended the whole planet against aliens and probably complete extinction

And by the time you get to Ultron you already stopped caring about these 'motivations' for imposing so many restrictions on the Avengers and Tony being mentally scarred. Fat Black Woman should have blamed him for that city Ultron destroyed from the start to actually have a coherent subplot about Tony being morally torn. Instead he gets upset at a picture of a nigger after all the shit he's been through.

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>>84168717
Vision burned him out of the internet, as much as I'd like Ultron to still be hiding somewhere, I doubt he is.

>>84167178
>people say But bucky wasnt in control of his actions.
>yet people demand drunk drivers go to prison for vehicular manslaughter.
This is the most disingenuous thing I've ever read, I can't even imagine the logical backflips you'd have to go through to justify such a retarded comparison.

>>84168899
He's hiding in Vision.
Waiting as dormant code for the day that's the Avengers have dealt with threats to Ultron's existence like Thanos.

>>84168899
Youve never followed Ultron in the comics have you? hes probably hiding inside of Tony ala bendis and will emerge as a female in IW and be the new iron man in Iron Man 4:Strap On Technology. Pepper will be curious then thrilled but Ultron-lady-iron-man will hook upo with bucky probably.

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>>84169000
Trips of truth. This I could get behind, especially given the ambiguity of this scene.

But that would be cool, so Marvel won't do it.

>>84169030
I don't follow comics, but I am aware that Ultron always finds away out and is technically immortal. See above response though.

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>>84168899
In the comics Ultron is one of the Avengers' most formidable foe

He escapes by downloading himself by various means and upgrades his armor to counter every avenger's powers

>>84169000
Remember: If Thanos is going to collect all the infinity stones, he will have to get the one on Vision's forehead... somehow...

>>84168969
It's called bait

>>84169067
That scene was the one kino part of any MCU movie. Vision and Ultron, the man made Gods, one standing in the light, the other in the dark, this being the last time they spoke as friends.

Because the dialogue has a point and isn't undercut by a quip, I assume Joss Whedon had nothing to do with it and actively fought for it's removal so he could show Thor skinnydipping in a vision pool more.

>>84167178

Tony was being an autist since Bucky wasn't in control of his actions and obviously it wasn't safe to hand him over to the authorities because Zemo would get to him as they just saw at the UN, they should have stashed Bucky somewhere and dealt with Zemo first like Steve and his mates were trying to do.

However since Marvel movies actually have good writing it's understandable why Tony would react that way since he was quite JUSTed from Pepper leaving him, the world blaming him for Ultron and having to surrender his values and sign up with the government.

>>84169067
>But that would be cool, so Marvel won't do it.


Calling it now

Infinity Gauntlet Ultron is the final Boss of Avengers: Infinity War

cap this post

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Why did he need the fucking orange slices?

>>84169185
to eat

>>84169185
To replenish his sustenance

>>84169185
What's wrong with a man just wanting to eat some orange slices?

>>84167516
I think you morons, who are obviously trolling or are genuinely retarded, are forgetting CA is from another world and another time. He doesn't belong in a sense and his relationship and defense of Bucky is understandable to the degree that he represents his last connection to his life. The life he grew up, the time he grew up, everyone he knew is gone and lost in time. Steve is protecting the only person in the world he has any real human relationship with, a guy that represents everyone and everything he lost in time.

It's not about right or wrong, it's about people or CA in this case clinging on to the last vestige of his past and the last connection he has to his world and life before essentially getting frozen and lost in time. Everyone he knew is dead.

This doesn't take genius to figure out and if you can't make the connection that's your fault for being so dense and thinking in HURRRRRRR BLACKS AND WHITES NOTHING ELSE MUHHHHH SOGENY MUHHHH MORALITY.

The human experience is complex.

>>84169070
Comics rarely truly kill a villain off, but I wouldn't bet on most of them coming back from the dead in movie. Loki's an exception because he's basically the only meaningful support cast for Thor, but I'd be pretty shocked if we ever see more Ultron

>>84167516
>Anyone who breaks the fucking law, it's fucking jail or execution for you with Captain America

Keeping in mind that the constitution of the United States is the law he's following.

If the constitution were remotely enforced half the government would be in jail and hundreds of illegitimate laws would not be obeyed.

>>84169067
>When he hit War Machine vision was actually aiming for war machine, not falcon to cause more war/dischord

>vision is actually Ultron playing nice, biding his time because the infinity stone in his forehead tells him Thanos and the rest of the stones are coming

>Thanos comes looking for the stone

>Vision/Ultron volunteers to go as bait

>"VISION WHAT ARE YOU DOING?" as vision removes the infinity stone in his forehead and puts it on Thanos' gauntlet

>shit hits the fan

>Thanos is somehow defeated

>Ultron snatches up the infinity gauntlet and is the ultimate boss

>>84169227
Again I understand why he's doing it

I think you're too stupid to understand that I don't disagree with any of that

But it DOES make him a hypocrite and a nepotist, and yes Steve is WRONG

I understand why he's doing it you fucking idiot, get it in your head.

It's not the right thing to do. That's my point.

>>84167851
You fucking piece of shit.
Bucky was brainwashed.

Taking drugs or being drunk is something you do to yourself. Fucking arguments.

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>>84167178
>Tony and Steve agree to discuss accord terms and come to a fair resolution
>Tony says Wanda is temporarily in a safe place - after all, she was the one responsible for the deaths in Lagos
>Steve loses his shit and throws an autistic tantrum

Tony did nothing wrong.

>>84169494
This. When Steve brought out Wanda when she still wasn't ready and tried to play it off with "hundreds died... But she's sorry so that's fine with me"

>>84169465
Look I don't give a shit about any of that.

Bucky committed crimes.
He needs to have a trial and be locked up if found guilty.
End of fucking story.

It shouldn't be so complicated!!!

Is Steve Rogers a fucking judge? NO

He shouldn't get to decide that bucky goes free.

It's that fucking simple. Get it through your thick fucking skull.

How many lives is Steve endangering keeping bucky around? He had to freeze himself because someone could come and read some codes and control him! What steve is doing is wrong.

I understand why he did it.

But it's narrow sighted and wrong and it is not upholding justice. You must set aside your feelings and face facts to uphold justice sometimes and steve has failed horribly.

steve rogers has failed his country, his friends, and his code of ethics.

I can accept that Civil war was about the decay of captain america from national hero to hypocritical nepotist, a common criminal. Why can't others?

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How is OP this autistic

>>84169336
Please stop having ideas. This is just terrible.

Zemo was justified. He should definitely go to jail but he was justified in his revenge. And smart going through all that trouble just for a video to show iron man

>>84169695
>Cap's stance on pedophilia

>>84167178
My nigga black panther came through with godlike wisdom and showed those petty white men the true path in the end. God Bless Him.

>>84169448
There is no such thing as a "right" thing to do in this case. That's why you are the dense one.

So Captain America should do nothing and let Iron Man commit murder? Or fight Iron Man and turn him in to a corrupt government that will incarcerate him and use unconventional methods to understand the brainwashing that was done or get information out of him?

You keep arguing about these stupid things that are the "MUHHHH RIGHT THING" to do yet you can't even see how those are also "morally" wrong things to do.

If anything letting Iron Man murder him would be juvenile because Iron Man would be just destroying the weapon and not the people who actually killed his parents. There is no right.

>>84169697
Fine shakespeare you come up with something better

sheesh everybody's a fucking critic

These movies have no depth. It's like two kids fighting on a playground, wahh he not my fwend!

Now BvS...

>>84169695
>the point
------------------------------------------
>your head

You just don't understand what that panel means

>>84169796
don't even start

WHAT YOUR MOM'S NAME IS MARTHA TOO? LET'S FUCKING BE FRIENDS M8!!!!

>>84168899

Only during the final fight, homeboy would have to have been retarded to not back himself up first thing.

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>>84169695
>>84169640
I feel like the point of this movie is that captain America isn't always right

yes he's doing the wrong thing because he's protecting a friend

But in the end his actions are hypocritical and he is failing his country, his allies, and his own principles of upholding the law and putting the law first before any feelings or preferences.

The comic panel also depicts this bullheadedness that led to captain america's fall from grace and ultimate downfall.

You can do what you feel is right for all the right reasons and still be wrong in the end.

Again, there's nothing wrong with seeing Civil War as the story of how Captain America fell from his perch and became a common criminal.

It's ok guys, steve is a human fucking being in the end, he's got faults...he's allowed to be human and be wrong, ok?

>>84169784
ok? Ok.

>So Captain America should do nothing and let Iron Man commit murder?

Again if you read a few posts back I said he should not let Stark have his way with bucky. Take him in. Give him a fair trial.

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>>84167516
>that spacing

>>84170072
what? would youpreferawalloftext?

>>84167178
Worst part of the whole movie was
>Steve: sorry tony. He's my friend
>Tony: So was I
Wat
They were literally never friends and the banter between them was always contentious at best. They literally almost came to blows in Avengers and were openly spiteful of each other in Age of Ultron

I like the idea of ultron returning through vision and claiming the gauntlet for himself. thats cool. But i also like the idea of Vision knowing ultron is inside him and uploads ultron into...fuck...im high...i almost said Apokolips computer interface and ultron would control a war planet but i forgot thanos is a rip off of darkseid, not the king himself. but if thanos did have his own war planet, lets say it would be called apocalypse, very original, then ultron could fight starlords pacman in the final act. weeeeeeeeeeee!

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>>84170146
I agree with this

They were more like coworkers

They cooperated to a goal

Steve always resents tony because there's nothing special about him outside the suit (which is why tony had to remind him he was a billionaire philanthropist playboy etc.)

Meanwhile Tony resents steve's "natural" physical abilities without a need for a suit and is quick to point out that he's not natty, he's a roided up goon

Honestly that line was done for pure drama and for something nice for the promo reels

But damn if it didn't hit me in the feels

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>>84167178

Bucky was brainwashed. Should Hawkeye die because of all the people he killed when brainwashed? No. Rodgers was right about Bucky, right about the bombing and right about the corrupt UN.

Stark was wrong the entire movie. He is the one that built an army of killer robots that blew up a city. But it's Captain America that's treated like a criminal for not bowing down to the corrupt UN. Stark signed out of self guilt and self pity. The spoiled billionaire didn't want to suffer the consequences for his heinous actions.

>Drunk drivers are not responsible for their actions either

Wrong. Are you fucking retarded? Is that the garbage they teach in Alky Anonymous?

>>84167178
Hoes before bros. And Tony wasn't even a good bro.

ITT: fat manchildren discussing a shitty corporate franchise and getting excited over it

Get a life, you gigantic faggots.

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>>84167550
>Let the courts decide
>Steve isn't a fucking judge

Good for Rodgers. A retarded judge just invented "cyber murder". Fuck him and fuck you.

The entire point of being a superhero vigilante is doing the right thing, no matter what corrupt government says. Captain America and his team are the real Avengers. Stark and his people are now just UN soldiers. Nothing more nothing less. They will be protecting the globalist pedophiles, instead of punching them.

>>84170332
It was proven that Hawkeye was brainwashed

So, again, the right thing is for steve to turn in frozen bucky so they can thaw him and let him stand trial, and maybe if it's proven he was brainwashed he can get it reduced to prison time

Steve doesn't get to be judge jury and executioner.

Steve is not above the law

>>84170499
Steve will punch them unless they happen to be friends of his. Then they can GET AWAY WITH MURDER, right?

Because, you know, the law is all about who you like and don't like and how you FEEEEL about things.

Fuck facts.

If you don't FEEEEEL someone should go to jail he shouldn't no matter how many people he killed, amiright?

fucking idiot.

>>84170484
no fuck you the whole thing is deeper than you give it credit for

If you don't like it then why are you here get the fuck out troll

>>84170761
Ebin roast XDDd

What is this really about, OP?

>>84170562

Look at all of that reddit spacing. Are you incapable of proper grammar?

>It was proven that Hawkeye was brainwashed

It was proven that Bucky was brainwashed. The end.

>Steve is not above the law

You're still here? The government is not above the law either. When they arrested Rodgers, Bucky and the Avengers, they refused to give them lawyers or a fair trial. If Rodgers is a criminal, then so are all the government agents that took part in that.

>the law is all about who you like and don't like and how you FEEEEL about things

The law is what a jury says it is. There is no jury in the world that would convict Captain America for any of his actions. And the government knows it.

"If he's this far gone, Nat, I should be the one to bring him in". - Steve on how he plans on bringing Bucky to the authorities.

/thread
/OP's wrists

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>>84170948
>It was proven that Bucky was brainwashed. The end.

Good. Then steve is not just wrong, but an idiot, because he doesn't have anything to worry about. Let bucky stand trial.

>The government is not above the law either. When they arrested Rodgers, Bucky and the Avengers, they refused to give them lawyers or a fair trial. If Rodgers is a criminal, then so are all the government agents that took part in that.

that's no excuse for steve to pardon/condemn who he pleases.

Again, if a cop decides to not take a murderer in to stand trial because it's HIS FWEEEEEND then that cop is a criminal himself. He is failing to uphold the law.

Accept it. Steve is wrong. This movie is about the downfall of a hero who put his personal feelings ahead of justice and fairness and has become a criminal. Yes he's doing it because he's a loyal friend and standing up for what he believes in, but he's still WRONG and a TRAITOR and a HYPOCRITE.

DEAL WITH IT.

It's not the end of the world, i know you spergs love steve, I do too, but he is not right this time. Don't look at your feelings. Look at the facts.

He's failed his country.
He's failed his allies
He's failed his principles
He's become a common criminal.

DEAL
WITH
IT

>>84171030
This to start with.

Also remember that in attempting to apprehend him the UN decided they didn't want the winter solider to stand trial, they wanted him dead.

The UN had active hit squads out for Buckeys head. What the fuck kind of "fair trial" was he gonna get? So obviously Cap says fuck you.

Then later they're forced to take Buckey in alive having cornered them in public and realizing that killing Buckey right there would mean killing Cap / forcing Cap to kill UN soldiers in defence of Buckey. Bad optics.

So he's caged and presumably held to stand trial. A trial which more than likely would be a complete bullshit show, but okay sure "believe in the process Cap! You have to or you're a hypocrite criminal!" Fine.

So what's the first fucking thing that happens from Cap's perspective? The UN interrogator goes in and activates Buckey's Winter Soldier programming.

From Caps perspective it looks like UN is doing the same fuckery Hydra was up to at Shield. That's not justice that's evil. And even if you're like "but Cap obviously it was some nefarious agent." Then he's still had the UN prove right in front of him that they're incapable of securing this potential weapon safely.

So yes, you get him the fuck out of there until you can unravel what's happening. And when it's all said and done? Well you can't trust pretty much anyone - the last few years of your life have proven that everyone is just trying to snap up weapons and mutants as fast as they can in a new arms race. What's more likely to happen from Caps perspective? A public fair trial where the existence of the winter soldier program is made known and a judge finds Bucky "not criminally responsible" for his actions? Or the UN or USA using the red book and redeploying Bucky as an asset of their own? Or reverse engineering the process so "next time it'll be better."

Better to put Bucky on ice aka imprisoned hidden until you can get him help

Cap did literally nothing morally wrong. Period.

>>84171373
Except aid and conceal a known murderer instead of upholding the law

Look, kid, cops don't get to pick and choose who they want to bring in and who they don't. They're supposed to bring in all suspects no matter how much of their friends they are and what their personal prejudices are.

Cap is wrong he's making decisions he has no right to make and he's throwing everything away, backstabbing his allies including yes the man who was willing to drive a fucking missile into a space hole and sacrifice himself to save the world all for his little buddy bucky.

The captain is bullheaded and when he believes he is right he digs his heels in like in this panel >>84169695 and that's admirable.

His loyalty to bucky is admirable.

But the problem is that he's a fucking human being and he's flawed and yes he's fucking wrong this time.

The problem is that he didn't have to admit it in the end because he was able to overpower iron man so nobody is going to make him.

As tony said he doesn't deserve to fucking hold the shield anymore. You know, that shield that HOWARD STARK made? The guy who got murdered by his best friend bucky?

His code of ethics? His wanting to do the right thing and uphold justice no matter what? GONE

He's a hypocrite and a failure as a national hero.

He put his personal biases and feelings ahead of facts and justice.

He is truly a fallen hero and I'm ok with this story being about that. Just accept it.

>>84171610
You must be shitposting for (You)'s and le ebin trolling there's no other explanation.

First and most obviously Cap isn't a police officer. In fact in the very same movie we're discussing the avengers have a conversation wherein Cap states flat out that the Avengers have always existed outside the law in order to fight threats bigger than one nations laws, and should conitune to do so.
That's his position and he remains morally consistent.

The world has had no problem with this tacit authority up until the events of the film.

To the point about bringing in all suspects. Are you actually saying that if a cop arrests a guy he knows is innocent while also being aware that if he takes the suspect to the station, said suspect will be shot, no matter what the officer has to take him in?

Nevertheless Cap also didn't backstab Stark. Tony (like the UN) wanted Bucky dead so Cap stopped that. And then when Bucky was taken into custody and the UN immediately tried to use the Winter Soldier, Tony was too blinded by (understandable) anger to see that Buckys "official/legitimate" custody posed a massive risk.

"But that's not Caps job to make those decisions!"

It literally is. It's the main point of the Avengers existing as a global force and not under any nations banner. The entire film asks the question whether the status quo aka continuing to make unilateral decisions is the best one. Stark obviously disagrees. But to claim that Cap has no right is disingenuous because he was given that moral authority by the people of earth.

Nothing he's done compromises his wanting to do good above all else. You're falling into a fallacy of believing that one nation/groups set of laws are inherently superior

>he put his personal biases and feelings ahead of facts and justice

What facts? The facts I laid out in my previous post show pretty clearly that hiding him was the only good option. Who's justice? "Universal justice" aka a higher moral code or the law UN changed

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>>84171610
>cops

Then it's a good thing Rodgers isn't a cop. If cops cared more about doing the right thing than their pensions, then cops would be more trusted by the people.

>His code of ethics? His wanting to do the right thing and uphold justice no matter what? GONE
>He's a hypocrite and a failure as a national hero

Captain America and his team would be more loved now than before. Becoming outlaws only makes them more badass. They are the underdog heroes sticking it to the world government, on behalf of the little guy. If I had to name an organization more evil than Hydra, the UN would be it. Cap is right again! If Rodgers ran for president, then he would win in a fucking landslide.

>>84172186
>If I had to name an organization more evil than Hydra, the UN would be it.

Well I mean that's pretty retarded

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on topic of AoU, did anybody not like the direction they took with ultron's look? the face just bothers me too much - i understand they wanted him to be able to emote properly but for fucks sakes he's moves around static pieces of metal on his face like human eyebrows and it looks so bad it's not even funny, they should've just gone for the iconic look he had

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Why didn't CIA just kill Capitan America and all enemies of USA? I think CIA is more powerful than SHIELD

>>84172304
I had less of a problem with his face than I did the voice. The initial trailer had David Spaders voice done with post processing that made it much more metallic and menacing. In the end we just got a regular voice with some reverb.

>>84172349
Or whatever that guys fucking name is I can't remember.

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>>84172304
The concept art looked so much better than what we got. I will never forgive Whedon for this.

>>84172349
i may be alone in the idea but i always imagined ultron's voice from the design alone to be extremely harsh, loud, and almost screaming; like the type of voice that invokes the same sort of fear you get from some sort of fatal computer virus or error, pretty much if a malevolent blue screen could talk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12NSGz7ffno

pretty much like this, but just more shrill, robotic, and fast paced - it's contradictory to the idea of a sociopathic super-AI but it works a lot better i feel with the visual design of the original ultron

>>84168309
He'll die to save Spidey, who's young and has the future in his hands.

He'll leave it to the next generation to take over after he dies.

>>84168494
It was especially baffling because his followup was

>hmmm I'm guilt ridden over getting this kid killed
>I KNOW! I WILL BRING THIS YOUNG MAN TO A BATTLE EVEN THOUGH I ALREADY HAVE A BUNCH OF HEROES TO HELP

Him involving Spiderman was an instance of such monumental bad writing that I couldn't believe it.

>>84170499
>Good for Rodgers. A retarded judge just invented "cyber murder". Fuck him and fuck you.
Are you really that butthurt about that girl getting punished for talking a guy into killing himself?

Can someone tell me what was so good about this movie?

It lacks any sort of depth or substance like the rest of Marvel movies.

You're all fucking capeshit plebs.