James Cameron was the true genius behind Alien franchise

Alien was better. Slasher > Action Movie

>Turning horror kino into an action flick
no

they should remaster Aliens 1 day and tone back the shit ass noises that the guns make. Hearing those rifles spaz off makes me want to turn the movie off

>>83022361
>Jodorowsky was the true genius behind Alien franchise
ftfy

If Alien was better and Ridley is the true genius behind Alien then why is Prometheus and Covenant are so bad?

I'd say that he had more understanding of the franchise than Scott does... now after Covenant.

If you use "Alien" in the title you have to tread slowly

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Ridley:
>took a directing job for Alien
>didn't write it
>didn't produce it
>didn't design it
>was more involved in Prometheus and Covenant and both were shit
James Cameron:
>pitched Aliens
>wrote and directed it
>had his wife produced it
>designed most of the visuals by himself
>made Ripley into more then one note character which led to her Oscar nomination
>the movie established Alien franchise as a major sci-fi phenomenon

The problem is that Cameron could never accidentally make Alien and Ridley could never intentionally make Aliens.

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Does Cameron still do Rated R films?

>>83022914
You imply that all good Ripley movies were accidents, while all good Cameron movies are well calculated and executed? Seems legit considering JC only did 7 films.

>>83022914

>Ridley could never intentionally make Aliens.

Black Hawk Down is pretty much Aliens with Africans standing in for space monsters.

>>83022361
you can't be helped op. So rant away, like you do at the library.

>>83023107
Why so many people desire to simplify Aliens? It has so much more depth than Alien.

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>>83022565
not sure what to think about that

>>83022361
Why didn't she just shoot the queen?

>>83023107
You just triggered a line of though that lead me to remember to re-watch Kingdom of Heaven. Thank you.
>>83023358
1. To contrast Ripley's "mission style" with the Marines.
2. Sigourney is rabidly anti-gun and probably encouraged it if there was a discussion.
3. Because then how do you have the fight on the ship later?

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>>83023249
>Space marines vs Ayy lmao horde The Movie
>More depth than Alien
Top Kek

>>83023483
But she still shot the eggs and other ayys. Just not the queen, for some reason.

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>>83022361
No Genius has ever gotten within 100 yards of this franchise, OP.

>>83023737
She blamed aliens for losing her child (being unable to see her grow). She didn't need to shoot anything, the facility was going to explode anyway, but she had an impulse of rage and
wanted to avenge herself by killing queen's babies.

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Aliens ruined the franchise

Alien instilled a huge amount of cosmic horror. We dont know/understand the xeno's motivation for killing the ships crew. We dont know if it's intelligent or a mindless killing machine. The fact that it can hide in the ship's workings and camoflauge itself as well as the fact that in the deleted scene with lambert it doesnt just outright jump at her
https://youtu.be/eR5jYeIMBKk
shows that it might very well be an intelligent being. Nothing is explained to the viewer in alien and you're left to piece together what happened to the space jockey on the other worldly ship yourself. A huge sense of mystery surrounds the xeno and you never really get any answers fed to you and you're never supposed to. Its supposed to feel beyond your understanding as a lot of HR Giger and lovecraft works it was inspired by do.

Aliens completely trashes this concept and pretty much retcons the idea of the alien being a thinking being. The xeno in aliens is just a worker ant with an understood queen-hive ecosystem. This completely ruins not only the fear factor of the xeno, but also ruins the fear factor of the xeno in the film before it. The mysterious killing machine with no explanation or backstory becomes a mindless video game-esque copy/paste antagonist like a zombie or a faceless soldier. The xeno is no longer a force to be reckoned with but just a standard "run forward and attack" monster we've seen in so many films before and after the release of aliens. It also negates the fear factor of the xeno by having hundreds of them mowed down by gruff space marines. as well as turning ridley from a hero in to a full fledged super hero by the end of the film and cartoonizes a lot of the eeiry setting of the first film with bulky comic inspired machinery and mechs. The fact that aliens is most probably people's first contact with the alien franchise really pisses me off because it ruins the original before it before you even get a chance to experience it.

>>83023067
Ridley Scott only has two good films, and both of them were accidents.

>>83024046
This.

In the original script the Alien was incredibly smart and was supposed to win and send a message to the colony saying he was heading back, pretending to be the captain.

>>83022361
The concept of the Alien Queen is even more cheap than a genocidal android with a god complex creating the Alien as a perfect organism.

>>83024046
Nice reddit post.

Once again you fell for kino cinematography meme and can't see past "just uh action movee pow pow" mentality.

By the way Aliens doesn't retcon Alien in any way, but introduces the means of reproduction for the creature.

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Since Prometheus and Covenant, we all know who the true genius behind Alien was

>>83024160
It doesn't matter what was in the original script. Even Ridley disaproved this notion in prequels. Xenomorph is a killing machine, designed to kill, nothing more.

Alien was a nice sci-fi horror flick but that's it. Without Aliens people wouldn't remember Alien.

>>83023648
>slasher horror flick in space is so much deeper!!!1

wew

>>83022361
Alien belongs to Dan O Bannon

Everyone else who touches it just fucking ruins it

>>83024673
Not really. Dan O'Bannon came up with the idea of chestburster. His actual script was so shit, the entire movie was re-written by Fox staff writers. When the movie was about to be released O'Bannon sued and won to be credited and mentioned in every Alien movie or piece of media. The true writers of Alien then went on to write Alien 3.

>>83024046
that scene is so fucking stupid
the xeno looks clumsy and nonthreatening

>>83024439
>Xenomorph is a killing machine, designed to kill, nothing more.
bullshit
https://youtu.be/WsU6yaA0r0w
https://youtu.be/eR5jYeIMBKk

>>83024310
the xeno has a means of reproduction in the original
https://youtu.be/8MCoefVgW9w

>>83024924
Hence why it was deleted i suppose. The first part part looks too much like a guy in a suit where it scuttles towards her and stands up looks scary/imposing as fuck imo though

>>83024931
Nobody gives a shit about deleted scenes, retard. They are deleted for a reason and were never seen for 25 years.

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>>83024887

O'Bannon brought over the principal memebers of Jodorowsky's Dune production team he met in Paris. Ridley, the studio appointed director, didn't know any of those people, and they made the movie what it looked and felt like. Besdies, O'Bannon already beta-tested it with Dark Star.

>When the movie was about to be released O'Bannon sued and won to be credited

Bullshit.

>>83022361
>dude the alien is just a big ant with colonies, castes and a queen and everything lmao. SO cool
fuck off

>>83024991
the fact that they were shot at all means that scott/giger were thinking about these ideas when filming, regardless of whether they were cut or not.

>>83025036
It's in the documentary on DVD. They had a conflict where Fox were about to steal Alien ideas from O'Bannon
Dark Star is really bad by the way.

>>83025107
Neither Scott or Giger was involved in writing Alien. James Cameron couldn't be aware of whatever they deleted and came up with his own thing. It's canon now.

>>83025268

>Dark Star is really bad by the way.

It's a fun student movie, anon, and it's what got O'Bannon booked onto Dune. Without it there wouldn't be any Alien. O'Bannon's ideas are so good John Carpenter ran with the "blue collar guys meet improbable situations" throughout his entire career.

>>83025400
I can buy it being a student film I guess. Most people involved seem to be doing great things later.

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>>83022361
agreed

>>83025528

Sometimes i wish the bush would make a comeback. At least landing strips.

>>83024931
was it taking a shit in the first one? no wonder it got deleted

>>83025609
it's a sign of class now

>>83022574
Cause it's being based off of your opinion.... which is dogshit apparently

>>83025687
>getting your jokes from youtube comments

No, it looks as though it was doing some indescribable alien shit, as in stuff that we have no understanding of.

>>83024046
>>83024931


I'm just going to go right ahead and say this.
The deleted scenes from Alien are not and will never be canon.
Ridley said himself that the theatrical cut is the one, the directors cut was only done because he was asked to for the Quadrilogy dvd set.
Camrons is different as the execs forced him to cut it to keep it shorter for what they assumed were retarded american audiences at the time.
So no, the deleted scenes from Alien can fuck off. They are not and should never be regarded as canon in the Alien universe.

>>83022361
>taking a nearly unkillable creature of nightmares into a giant fucking bug

No

>>83022736
BASED CAMERON
R
A
V
O

>>83025797
I didn't even bother to open it in a new tab, so no, I didn't see the comments. Apparently it was someone else's impression as well, so there must be something to it. And no, that was not a joke. It's literally how it looks, and it's dumb.

>>83022361
They need to learn from sci fi masters like James Gunn and add some quips in that shit!

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>Gordon Carroll, Exec Producer of Aliens recalls in the book “Hello, He Lied” by Linda Obst how James Cameron sold the project: “Cameron was young. He had just directed Terminator. Cameron had called a meeting to discuss his “next project.” Everyone knew Cameron had written a treatment for Alien 2 that nobody would touch because Alien was not a massive financial success (also important to remember that back then, sequels were still seen as a frowned-upon lack of originality). Alien 2 was not on the table. We expected a professional pitch from Cameron, an outline and a treatment of what he had in mind with a cursory budget; perhaps a couple assistants to run a slide show. Instead Cameron walked in the room without so much as a piece of paper. He went to the chalk board in the room and simply wrote the word ALIEN. Then he added an ‘S’ to make ALIENS. Dramatically, he drew two vertical lines through the ‘S’, ALIEN$. He turned around and grinned. We greenlit the project that day for $18 million.”

>>83025862
>at the time

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>>83026103

>(also important to remember that back then, sequels were still seen as a frowned-upon lack of originality).

They were right. Truly a more enlightened age.

>>83022361
>James Cameron was the true Lucas behind Alien franchise
fixed it

>bug shit
>stereotypes
>muh action lel BOOM BOOM, EXPLOSIONS, LOOK THERE'S A NEW ALIEN AND ITS BIGGER!!!11!!!!

>>83024160
That's a retarded idea.

>>83026103
Some people really believe movies are made this way.

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>>83026696
A regular filmmaker wouldn't have the balls to pull this shit.

This man, though? I believe it.

>>83026357
>>83025864
>>83023648
>>83022424
>>83022397
When will this meme end and who invented it?

>>83025107
>trusting Ridley's intentions when he only stumbles into making good movies

>>83022361

The 3+ hour long behind the scenes documentary on this movie is great

>>83026909
Those are butthurt horror fans
Just ignore them

>>83024046
GTFO with your stale pasta

>>83024160
Did he morph into the captain too?

>>83022361
Aliens II when?
too bad bill paxton died, was hoping they could revive him

>>83025528
*inhales deeply*

>>83024046
I agree

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>>83024644
>>83023648
>>83023249
They're both deep in their own, interesting ways.

Alien is psychosexual nightmare slasher about an androgynous crew member being the only survivor of a giant bio-mechanical rapist penis, cum-exploding androids and an AI ship literally named Mommy.

Aliens is a duel between two pissed-off mothers and an allegory for the Vietnam war.

>>83022565
>>83023274
He's right in the sense that, by trying to adapt Dune, Jodo assembled a team of various artists like Giger, O'Bannon, Douglas Trumbull and Moebius and after the project fell through, all the fostered creativity came to be used in other projects.

O'Bannon, who was John Carpenter's film school buddy, had the original idea for Alien, which wouldn't have been what it is without Giger's designs and experiences on Dune. Similarly, after Dune, O'Bannon started hanging out with the highly influential French comics team Heavy Metal and wrote a comic drawn by Moebius, whose visual style became the main influence for Blade Runner; Moebius' work also influenced Lucas for Empire. At around the same time, these French guys were receiving a young Australian guy never George Miller who went on to create Mad Max as an unofficial adaptation of their works. During the same time, O'Bannon and his best friend were working on early adaptations of Total Recall and Minority Report. Ridley's two masterpieces are HIGHLY indebted to that sparked creativity and collabs fostered by Dune's failure and Jodo's insanity, and it's very easy to see that on his own, without visionary designers of the caliber of Moebius or Giger (and the incredibly talented old school British technical teams that were in charge of practical effects, matte paintings, miniature models, etc), his work is incredibly unimaginative and stale.

No. Aliens is extremely well executed but still formulaic. Alien is innovative kino. And I say this as someone who has a very high opinion of James Cameron.

>>83024046
>>83028138
These kinds of comments are why /tv/ is worth coming to.

>>83022361
Bullshit, it's all this guy http://alienanthology.wikia.com/wiki/Ronald_Shusett and the people he worked with

>>83026909
Not a meme, just good opinions from people who doesn't have shit taste

Go watch Avatar, you shiteater

>>83027753
>Did he morph into the captain too?
He xenomoprphed into the captain

>>83022541
Don't fuck with the pulse rifle.

>>83022541
Ok George Lucas, the rest of us will enjoy the movie how it was presented

>>83022361

>sudden obsession over child after encouraging everyone else to view those taken as 'already dead'
>retards don't leave some crew on the space ship
>inadequate communication
>how fucking long did the trip take? the kid seems to have been alone for months, if so how fucking long was that one guy on the wall for, incredibly convenient
>sending GREEN soldiers to the same fucking alien world, why no send real WY mercs? instead of these 'yanks' who probably don't answer to WY
>WY as incompetent as ever
>ridley goes from 'how does I shot' to rambo in the course of like an hour

The first two movies look great but have fucking retarded characters and plotlines. It's iconic and rehashed to death so by the time I watched them, they didn't have the impact they should. I accepted the first movie as 'wrong people, wrong place, everything goes to shit' but it wasn't even that, character broke protocol and were just fucking retards. A good slasher would have everyone trying their fucking best, sticking to protocol, being logical but having all their safety and countermeasures fail because the threat was simply outside the planned scope.

What would have been cool is if the aliens in alien got into the ship by melting their way in near undetected.

Entire franchise is horribly overrated. People only like it seemingly for having some iconic moments.

>>83023737
She probably thought a few bullets wouldn't kill the giant queen and she didn't want it chasing her while bleeding acid

>>83031175

That's just PLOT kicking in. Can't have the set pieces of elevator, jet, bishop ripped up and the 'I can drive a mech' set up pay off. Like seriously, a few bullets in the queens direction would have fixed it, but apparently she's meant to assume it's not capable of moving. Remember to double tap everything kids, no exceptions.

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Aliens is the best Alien movie by far. The cast was the best you can't even argue against that.

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>genius behind the Alien franchise
>anyone other than this based man
pick one

>>83024310
>all those shit words

>>83026909
>>83027310
Get a room, faggots

Both have dildos of Cameron?

>>83031741
This actually.

Alien=Aliens>Alien3>Alien Resurrection>Prometheus>Alien Covenant

>>83022361
Watch it again, it does not hold up

>>83024599
wrong.
alien would have been less well remembered if Giger's designs were not in it but even then the Nostromo interior is a milestone in sci fi set design.

could you wait another ten years before sharing your opinions plz

>>83032434
I don't understand why you use > instead of spaces but, yeah, this is the chronological releases.

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>>83031741

truly he was alien

>>83022361
For (You) OP and all the other Camerinos:
>After viewing Alien vs. Predator, however, Cameron remarked that "it was actually pretty good. I think of the five Alien films, I'd rate it third. I actually liked it. I actually liked it a lot."[3] Conversely, Ridley Scott had no interest in the Alien vs. Predator films. When asked in May 2012 if he had watched them, Scott laughed, "No. I couldn't do that. I couldn't quite take that step."[4] Director Neill Blomkamp would eventually go on to pitch his sequel to Aliens.[5]

>>83025268
again with the fetus opinions

>>83032806
made in Merry England.
English sockets, kettle.

>>83025050
You know nothing about film, all you want is for the Alien to be cool if that's your biggest complaint.

>>83032811
plus he liked Terminator Genysis.

>>83033006
k retard. aliens is still trash

>>83022736
But the creator of Alien Worked on the development of the Original. It's bound to be intrinsically superior by having OBannon and Giger THERE than otherwise - like the sequels. This post and this thread is Bait vs. Redditor

>>83022541
But theres just like 15 minutes of action. And in case you didn't notice they got their asses kicked there, pal.

The rest is just interesting / tense waiting.

>>83022736
The formula was all done for him, senpai. He just had to re-present it.

>>83033262
Giger don't do anything in Aliens, hyper retarded faggot!!!

Are you a true fan?

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>>83024931
How fucking stupid do you have to be to site DELETED scenes as proof for what happened in a movie?

>>83033539
hyper retarded faggot!!! re-read. That's my point.
Reading comp - F

Okay, sorry. We still agree Aliens sucks?

>>83030905
I don't see a problem with just lowering the volume on the pulse rifles, they're cheesey and obnoxious sounding

WHERE CAN I STREAM COVENANT?

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>>83033840
The theater, support capitalism brah.

>>83025528
That's one puffy fucking vulva.

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>>83033785
Forgiven dude, here's a beer. I remember ALIENS being entertaining. But its not the Classic the first film is. ALIEN is a landmark in design and suspense despite whatever imperfections it has.

>>83024160
Alien would have been perfect if they'd kept this ending.

>>83034324
By "perfect" you mean "incredibly cheesy and terrible", right?

>>83022541

Are you fucking gay?

The pulse rifle is an iconic gun sound

>>83033840
i also would like to watch.

>>83024046

>scott has no made two movies where the xenomorph is simply a killing machine
>people still hanger back to a low budget sci fi film for some sense of awe when all the xenomorph is is an animal

>>83034581
It would have added another layer of bizarre, mysterious horror to the Alien, ending the movie with a disturbing shock and the suggestion that the whole cycle will take place again.

Alien's only flaw is that Ripley survives. The happy ending doesn't fit the the movie.

>>83025050

It this a serious meme to not like the idea of an alien ant like animal?

>>83026909

It will last forever because there are manchildren that have to believe that the aliens are some sort of magical creature that embodies horror or some shit

>>83028138

"androgynous crew member"
"allegory for the vietnam war"

kek you kids crack me up sometimes

>>83036132
>t. brainlet
go play your video games junior

>>83032573

I've watched it 100 times and it does indeed hold up

>>83022574

The exact same reason I would be able to beat Larry Bird in a game of twenty-one if I played him right now.

>>83032573

I've probably seen it ten times.

Not only does it hold up, it's legit one of the greatest action movies ever made. Arguably THE greatest.

>>83033840
I've been looking for like three days and the only site that had it has a paywall

I guess the movie's too popular to risk getting caught recording a cam

>>83024887
Wait, is this why he and Ronald Shusett are credited as "Based on characters created by" in "Covenant"? I guess the characters are the aliens themselves.

>>83023107

When I see xenomorphs walking towards me on the sidewalk I don't cross the road, tell you that much

>>83037980
>I guess the movie's too popular to risk getting caught recording a cam

what? no. most of the cams are done in theaters in mexico or some shit where nobody gives a fuck about that.

>>83022541
Pulse Rifle is best rifle you mongoloid

>>83025753
Kek

>>83022980
>blue titty
obby

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>>83022541
Touch the pulse rifle and I'll fucking kill you nigger.

>>83022361
Such a comfy movie

>>83022574
>>83025753

the only thing good about Alien was Geiger, the artist who designed the xeno - if it was a bland alien design the movie would not be so well known

>>83030983
>obsession over child
Because she was a mother who lost her child. Shit hits real close to home, and she became overtly attached to newt.
>retards dont leave some crew on the space ship
Ya got me there. Sulaco is huge - where the fuckall is the rest of the crew? Or is that bitch fully automated?
>how long did the trip take
17 days overdue = rescue. I'm assuming they made some good leaps in faster than light travel between Ripleys time and the current Aliens time.
>sending green soldiers
Nobody was green. It sounded like the majority of these troops, minus Lt Gorman, were combat vets with prior deployments. "Is this a standup fight or another bughunt?"
>WY as incompetent as ever
How so?
>Ripleys character transition
She changed over the course of the film in a realistic manner. In the beginning she was terrified of returning to the planet - after shit hit the fan she got her shit together.

Aliens has some of the best characters out there, and Hudson has become iconic.

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>making a new Terminator
>making more avatar kino

Just let him make a new Alien movie as well. A proper sequel to Aliens.

>>83022736

C
A
J A M E S
E
R
O
N

>>83026103
I fucking wish.

>>83032740
could you go back before stating the obvious

>>83034260
>not the classic
Aliens is looked upon far more fondly than the first. Both are great, but Aliens had a much larger impact.

>>83039616
that's because most of the audience is retards who like action, shooting and explosions

smart people know alien is superior and it's not even a question

>>83032811
>>83033011
He's politician

>>83032811
Cameron its fucking brains over pride.
He knows better than to make enemies.

>>83038563
Yes

And the true genius behind James Cameron is Gale Anne Hurd.

after watching alien covenant i'm starting to think that this new trilogy (prometheus, covenant and "the next one") is a reboot.
like, how else would they explain the lore contradictions and the fact that the prequels have more advanced technology than the originals?

>>83041440
Tell that to Punisher Warzone

>>83022541
They should replace the guns with flashlights to be frank.

>>83041445
>more advanced technology
I don't recall seeing any independently targeting particle beam phalanx, tactical smart missiles, phased plasma pulse rifles, sonic electronic ball breakers or sharp sticks in the prequels.

>>83041445
simple really colony ships and weylands's flagship have high tech. space trucks are low tech and rugged.
>>83041476
t. Techpriest

>>83041445
>how else would they explain the lore contradictions and the fact that the prequels have more advanced technology than the originals?
Those ships might have left much earlier than the Covenant and Prometheus and they were only awoken from sleep later on too.

>>83041558
i was talking about the interface and holy shit that makes a lot of sense >>83041584
thanks.

also, since they haven't introduced the queen yet i bet those facehugger embryos david planted on the ship in the end are possibly queens.

>>83038708
Me neither. I turn 360* and walk away

what's the deal with stupid scientists and lack of enviromental suits in prometheus and alien covenant?

>>83041840
>I turn 360
well, congratulations. you got yourself caught

>>83041905
>being this new

>>83041905
Shit. It is summer already?

>guys we will get answers in the next movie, the movie.

What is his endgame?
No seriously, what does he hope to accomplish? He said in Prometheus that he hates uneccessary violence and suffering, so what good does it do to create the "perfect" being if it requires human death and suffering to come into existence? For that matter, does he intend on wiping out humanity the way he did the Engineers?

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>>83042049
Forgot pic but obviously I'm referring to David

>>83022361
I've got a question about covenant: How did David release the black stuff into the engineers if the planet was abandoned when they got there (in Prometheus)?

>>83022361
Pretty much. Without Aliens, the "franchise" never takes off. It would have stayed a cult film with maybe some cheesy B tier spin offs. But that isn't to say his contribution is better than the original, but without it the universe isn't so well known.

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>>83042595
there are two different planets:

1) the planet they arrive at in prometheus (the military installation from where they would have launched this)

2) the engineer homeworld they go back to from the planet in the first movie to find answers

>>83033414
Point? If he simply rehashed the original, than nobody gives a shit. He took it and made it his own and people loved it; so much so that it is the only reason more films were made.

>>83041929
>>83041999
>falling for this 3rd layer bait

Please tell me I wasn't the only one who thought Aliens was a Metroid live action movie as a kid.

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>>83041929
>>83041999
pet meet kettle
>>83041905
HAHA, memes

>>83043169
Jokes on you. I was only kidding.

>>83042049
He meant "unnecessary". And right now he feels the creation of these life forms is more necessary than the humans currently running around.

>>83022736
I agree with this.

File: james-cameron3.jpg (222KB, 1280x800px) Image search: [Google]

222KB, 1280x800px

>>83022736
Based James
How can Ridley "Senile Hack" Scott even compete?

>>83022541
They should go back and replace you instead.

The Pulse rifle is the GOAT weapon sound

>>83022736
Agreed. Alien has nothing going for it other than *muh kino cinematorgaphy*

>>83024931
Hey asshole, the scenes are deleted for a reason.

>>83022361
Alien > Alien 3 > Covenant > Prometheus > Aliens > Resurrection

>>83048327
LOL

>>83022361
Stop talking about things I don't like, you fucking pieces of shit. I'm getting goddamn tired of seeing Alien threads on the front page. How many of these fucking threads do I have to report?

>>83022361
Aliens was better than Alien because it had guns and 'splosions in it