>asks hitler for permission to leave Berlin ahead of soviet

>Hitler didn't flee Germany and spent the next 40 years in Argentina.

>>81294831
Buenas noches mein fuhrer.

maybe he thought the allies would act the same as the soviets when they took Berlin. The Germans were already getting reports of the atrocities the soviets were committing in German territory

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>>81294811
>Invade almost every country in Europe
>Make autistic decisions and cause the deaths of over 5,000,000 young German men
>Get fucked back to Berlin
>Hide in your bunker while literal kids and pensioners are fighting and dying for you
>Blame your generals and soldiers for your problems
Why was he so autistic?

>>81294811
He had no concept of failure that also included the survival of germans as a whole. He probly expected everyone to just kill themselves on the whole.

>Welp, that was another war down
>Might as well self genocide

>>81295037
he had syphilis

It was a stupid movie based on jewish lies. You really think someone would do that in real life?

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>>81295037
He was a straight edge vegetarian faggot in a time everybody drank, smoke and ate meat. Truly an euphoric gentleman.

>>81295199
>It was a stupid movie based on jewish lies.
It wasn't, you retard.
Hitler really was that autistic in real life.
The movie is based on interviews and testimonies with people who worked with him in the bunker

>>81294811
nazis were faggots, thats why

>>81294886
>implying
The RAF freaking RAVAGED German cities. Excessively so according to most military historians.

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>>81295280
>people who worked with him in the bunker
in interviews conducted by jewish reporters and writers.

>>81295037
how do you reckon he would be remembered if he died fighting? i reckon even normies would respect that

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>>81295314
Sure keep telling yourself that senpai

>>81295328
> i reckon even normies would respect that
Probably.

>>81295280
I just wished they portrayed Hitler as slightly taller and deep-voiced.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLkADpdKL0k

Bruno Ganz is a fine actor but he overplayed the parkinsons and squeakified the voice.

>>81294831

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgbgEvOxQ_E

>>81295300
don't really remember whole battalions of brits going around raping women and killing children

>decides to kill himself and his family with grenades instead
Yeah getting shot with the last thing seeing your family raped by soviets sounds way better.

>At least 100,000 women are believed to have been raped in Berlin
>Female deaths in connection with the rapes in Germany, overall, are estimated at 240,000.

>>81295374
>I just wished they portrayed Hitler as slightly taller and deep-voiced.
Yeah, he is a little small for Hitler but he really does look like Hitler in 1945 if you've seen pictures of him.
Ganz' portrayal of him is probably the best so far

>>81295392
I'm not denying that claim. I'm sure the Soviets being Marxists had a warped sense of decency and human life so I don't doubt for a moment that the order for mass-rape came from higher up.
But what the British did was just outright annihilation of civilian areas. I don't know which is worse.

It's pretty fucking simple you autist. He desperately wanted to flee but was too loyal to disobey his Fuhrer so he killed himself so as to avoid being captured by the Soviets while still not fleeing the city like he was forbidden to.

>>81294811
He made an Oath anon. You can't break an Oath.

>>81295328
>died fighting

The risk of being captured was too high, and he knew it. They would have tortured him and broken his balls (just like they did before the Nurnberg trials with people like Höss) to get him to confess to every sin under the sun. They would have killed him anyways, true, but before that they would have broken him publicly and destroyed his legacy once and for all.

>>81295484
>I don't doubt for a moment that the order for mass-rape came from higher up.
There was no order to start raping German women left and right. Rape was officially forbidden in the Red Army but it happened regardless because many of the soldiers had lost family to the Germans and wanted revenge

>>81295392
>muh rape is worse than actual annihilation! rrr-- rape is even worse than bombing cities to dust, women are the real victims of war!

Fuck off, faggot, rape is LITERALLY the lightest of war crimes

>>81295614
Lots of thing were forbidden in the Red Army but you can't convince anyone that they had any form of social control to make sure they didn't happen.
This isn't Africa, claiming your defeated enemy as war-booty isn't usually practiced by Westrn countries unless it is sanctioned by the leadership.

>>81295654
Civilized countries down lets their nation's military go off and pillage like a bunch of fucking apes

It's funny to see the left today praise Bomber Harris and celebrating the killing of nazis.

Originally it was only the leftists who in the '60's and '70's decried allied war crimes inflicted on Germany as a sort of typical universal liberal whining about any loss of human life. The victors of the war were as bad as the losers for engaging in total warfare and there were no heroes and so on. Whereas the right was usually glorifying the war for having won and proudly blowing the fuck out of the Germans.

Since David Irving however those two sides have shifted.

>>81295698
no, but they firebomb whole ciities? Fuck off with you holier than thou attitude. Britain deserves the muslim invasion desu, Theyve committed the worst atrocities in history and still act as if they are a paragon of virtue and honor just hecause they have silly accents and drink tea. Fuck off

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>>81295839
Germany asked for Dresden with their nigger behavior

>>81295300
And the Germans ravaged Polish, Czech, French, Belgian, Dutch, Ukrainian, Russian, British etc etc cities too. War is war, if the Germans didn't want to have a Dresden they shouldn't have boasted about the destruction of Coventry.

German soldiers actually got treated with respect after their capture by the Allies, the Soviets were nowhere near as kind. Equating Allied bombing raids with the razing of Eastern Europe by the Soviets is silly. There's a reason German soldiers tried to flee west towards the Allies rather than surrender to the Russians.

>>81295839
>muh dresden

get fucked you pansy, germany got what they deserved for the atrocities they commited, they're lucky they didn't get nuked

>>81295614
>officially forbidden

Holy kek yes it was forbidden AFTER THREE DAYS
>A woman telephone operator from the Soviet Army recalled that:

When we occupied every town, we had first three days for looting and ... [rapes]. That was unofficial of course. But after three days one could be court-martialed for doing this. ... I remember one raped German woman laying naked, with hand grenade between her legs. Now I feel shame, but I did not feel shame back then... Do you think it was easy to forgive [the Germans]? We hated to see their clean undamaged white houses. With roses. I wanted them to suffer. I wanted to see their tears. ... Decades had to pass until I started feeling pity for them.

>>81295839
>muh dresden

Tell that to Warsaw, Rotterdam, London, Malta, Coventry, Moscow or any other major city acroos Europe the Germans bombed indiscriminately. Faggot.

>>81295865
>>81295904
>implying the Nazis ever did anything worse than what England did in India, Africa etc.

Just drop the act, just be honest that you empire was equivalnt if not worse than the Nazis in human rights violation, Just admit that history of wwii was written by the victors and there were no "good guys", does even that dead pig churchill (may he rest in shit)

>>81296010
allies weren't as bad as soviets
>MUH DRESDEN

dresden was a justifiable move against germany's greater atrocities
>NO EMPIRE HAS BEEN INNOCENT IN HISTORY BRITS WERE JUST AS BAD A LONG LONG TIME AGO

nice

>>81296070
>BAD A LONG LONG TIME AGO

Churchill himself took part in genocides in africa and mass-starved Bangladesh on purpose. Surely, by A LONG LONG TIME AGO you meant a little longer than 20 yrs before WWII?

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>>81295982
>>81295865
>>81295698
Just dropping by in this thread to tell the autistic germanophobic rev/leftypol/ack to kill himself :^)

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>balder.org/judea/Important-Quotations-For-A-Better-Understanding-Of-WWII.php

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>>81295300
Oh no, the British bombed industrial centers in a war they didn't start. Somebody call the wambulance!

>>81296010
The Allies did nothing worse than what the Germans had already done to them. Even the Soviets with their atrocities were spurned on by what German troops had done to their homes, families and cities.

Fuck off with your historical revisionism. The Nazis were dead in the wrong in WW2, and the blame for Dresden lies solely in their hands when you consider what they did to civilians all across Europe with no remorse.

>>81296149
Damn if only that evil Churchill had thought of the nazi elephants

F

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>>81296181
>>81296181
This isn't even bait

Kill yourself you clueless angry virgin lmao

>>81296149
>if you're not a nazi, you're left wing

Wrong, kiddo. And if anyone in this thread was on the brink of killing themselves, it'd be you autistic fucks. After all, if your Fuhrer was so admirable, why not follow his last cowardly act?

>>81295484
>Marxists had a warped sense of decency and human life
It had nothing to do with them being marxists. They were dirt poor peasants who were jealous that all the german towns had plumbing and electricity and mad about the invasion of their country. The officers didn't act like the regular army because they were educated.

>>81295944
The soviet army didn't encourage mass rape they just lost control of their army for reasons stated above. Soviets started shooting their own soldiers for it a couple of days after the fall of Berlin to get them back in line.

>>81295654
raping and murdering the wives and children of the enemy is the biggest psychological warfare card you could ever pull. Also being raped to fucking death is worse than being killed in a bombing raid.

>>81296228
>this hilarious projection

>>81296228
>>81296149
nice, /pol/ """info"""graphics consisting on nazi propaganda, amazing how the nazis are still able to wrangle retards almost 80 years after their demise

>>81296215
>Even the Soviets with their atrocities were spurned on by what German troops had done to their homes, families and cities.

fucking kill yourself, they invaded finland and poland while having a peace pact with the Nazis, and literally starved millions of Ukrainians to death before the Nazis even were in power, and the Soviets murdered millions INSIDE the USSR both before and after the war, Next thing youre gonna tell me the Soviets were good boys who dindu nuffin. Either be capable of making reasonable claims or shut up and fuck off

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>>81296228
Shit happens in war, krauts did the same in 1940, what goes around, comes around lad

>>81295982

All these bombings were of strategic nature. From taking out industry to terror bombings to forcing capitulation like in Rotterdam. Not saying these attacks were justified or anything else than horrible but they were not destruction for destruction sake like Dresden.
Dresden was simply petty, unnecessary revenge for the bombings in England which ironically enough were started when the Brits bombed Lübeck in 42

>>81296303
Not once in my life have I ever defended the Soviet system, but can you honestly tell me that when a prosperous nation invades your dirt poor shithole of a country, kills millions, pillages, destroys what little infrastructure there is, that they would not feel hard done by and angry at the Germans with all their luxuries and comforts.

>g-g-go away y-you meanie
Nice argument.

>>81296376
>winhunds
obviously something to do with dogs, but what? Would like to know what this insult means

>>81296401
>g-g-go away y-you meanie
>ignores the three-sentence argument I made, with historical examples and answers with emotions

btw it was more of a "youre so stupid I can feel my brain cells dying just from arguing with your idiocy." than it was a "g-g-go away y-you meanie"

>>81296408
A winhund is a type of dog, but it also kinda looks like they were trying to write schwinehund.

>>81296398
Dresden was a strategic bombing. It was a major centre on infrastructure. It was packed full of German soldiers that were feared as being sent to fight the Allies in the West. It was used as a demonstration to the Soviets as a reminder in Allied airpower and logistics. It was used to block German army traffic from moving in either direction and it was used as a tool to pressure the civilian population to demand their leaders to surrender.

Rotterdam was bombed AFTER the Dutch surrendered for no reason other than terrorism and bombing practice on cities.

London was first bombed in mid-late 1940, not after 1942. The Germans were sending rockets towards London with no other purpose than to kill civilians as late as 44/45.

Anything else?

>>81296441
Still no arguments.

>>81296458
>schweinehund
pigsdog?

>>81295300
chat shit get banged

>>81295271
>straight edge
>amphetamine junkie

>>81296585
Yeah it literally means pigdog (a dog for hunting pigs, not just two random animals), it was a common German insult at the time.

>>81296539
that's bullshit, a senior officer in the RAF admitted to the press that it was primarily to destroy German morale. After that got out Churchill tried to distance himself from it because 25k dead civilians and a razed city doesn't look good.

>>81294811
>decides to kill himself and his family with grenades instead
nice one bro

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>>81296010
>Just admit that history of wwii was written by the victors and there were no "good guys",

>>81296715
Destroying morale is a valid strategic goal, perhaps the foremost of all in any war. The Germans did this against the Brits in 1940. As I said in my post, one of the goals of Dresden was to destroy morale so much that the German populations would force their government to surrender.

>>81294811
>kill himself with grenades

that's fucking stupid. why not just use a gun?

>>81296539
>Dresden was a strategic bombing

Obviously started out as that meant. But they didn't have to obliterate the city in a huge fireball. The unnecessary extent was pure sadism and fueled by vengeance not by "strategic thinking"

>It was packed full of German soldiers

Haha what? The bombings were in 1945 every recruitable German was on the front.

>Rotterdam was bombed AFTER the Dutch surrendered

No they surrendered BECAUSE of Rotterdam and because the Nazis threatened to do the same in Utrecht.

>London was first bombed in mid-late 1940

Again, for strategic reasons. Germans only started to attack culturally important cities after the Brits started attacking inner cities like in Lübeck. Sorry to bust your bubble but Brits started massacring civilians and inner cities for revenge and perfected that practice in Dresden.

>>81296010
>Churchill: Voted Greatest Briton in History
>Hitler: Most hated person of all time

Yeah pretty much the same man

>>81296848
His kids liked fireworks.

>>81296149
>hospital city
>mmuh ZIONISTs
>300 to 500,000 innocents

WEW Dresden was a major manufacturing and logistics hub for the nazi war effort; you'd think people interested in history world be interested to learn about it before taking overarching positions on events LAD

>>81296848
You really would kill your wife and kids one after another and let them watch instead of just killing them all at the same time?

>>81296879
>(((polls)))

>>81296844
>wantingly killing thousands of civilians is a valid strategic goal
>what is the Hague Convention

>>81296879
literally doesnt prove a thing. Joseph Stalin was voted Greatest Russian Leader in History, and hes just as bad as Hitler, also, this just goes back to my earlier "victors writing the suitable history" argument, had the Nazis won, Im sure Hitler would have been voted greatest leader in history wherever he wanted

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>tfw Britain BTFO Germany 3 times in 100 years

>people talking about shit they have no knowledge about based on shitposts they read on /pol/

Please don't talk about shit you don't have any knowledge of. Thanks.

>>81296985
And a lot of good that did

>start as a giant Empire
>now even Scotland is leaving

>>81296985
And what a great future the Anglo so bravely fought for. I hope you enjoy your jewish run anti-white media, multiculturalism and never ending cold war.

>>81296864
>Dresden was just sadism
Wrong, Allied command had good reason to believe it was a logistical, industrial and infrastructure centre for the Wehrmacht. It was still of valuable use to the German army fighting the Russians.

>Every German was at the front
And how did many of them get there? Through Dresden.

>Rotterdam
So the Germans carpet bombed the city to force a surrender? How does that make the Allies monsters when the Germans were purposefully doing so five years earlier?

>Germans only attacked culturally important cities after...

Every city is culturally important. How was the cathedral in Coventry not culturally important?

>Sorry to burst your bubble...
Hahaha, if Dresden was massacring civilians just for revenge, so was Germany starting WW2. OH WAIT. That's exactly what it was because they got BTFO for escalating WW1.

>>81296864
Quick question, what do I get from blowing you the fuck out over this topic?

>>81297088
Yes, I'm sure arbitary totalitariansim would have been so much better for all of us...

>>81297231
>he actually thinks he lives in a democracy

>>81297231
>he actually wants to live in a dictatorship

>>81297385
>replying to my own post

oops

>>81297180
>Wrong, Allied command had good reason

This is getting frustrating. I didn't doubt the motive was strategic. I said the EXTENT of the attack was pure sadism. I'm not saying the attack wasn't justified I said the excessive destruction was completely unnecessary and fueled by revenge. I can't do the reading for you.

>And how did many of them get there? Through Dresden.

That is just contemporary propaganda to justify the attack. Dresden was packed, yes, but with refugees from the east.

>Every city is culturally important. How was the cathedral in Coventry not culturally important?

Thanks for proving the point. Coventry was an important industrial city and was bombed for that exact reason. Like I said the Brits were the ones who started retaliating by bombing strategically unimportant cities for petty revenge. Then the germans did the same and eventually we got Dresden because the British had to double down. Even Churchill distanced himself later from the attack.

>Germany starting WW2

Nice education.

>they got BTFO for escalating WW1

Nice understanding of history.

>>81296951
>what is nuclear deterrence and MAD doctrine of the Cold War

>>81297640
Not him, I am >>81297223 what do I get for blowing you the fuck out over this topic? Because I could, but I suspect you won't reply or turn to shitpost mode if I do.

>>81297180
You're deluded. Allied bombing killed almost half a million Germans and Austrian civilians, possibly even more. The allied civilian toll was one tenth of that.

Also strategic bombing didn't work to pummel the enemy into submission. If anything it made them more fanatical after their families were killed. It wasn't until the US started dropping nukes that it all ended.

Ruthlessness, revenge and the Treaty of Versailles is what caused WWII in the first place. This is what people like Vera Brittain was warning everyone about directly after WWI.

>How was the cathedral in Coventry not culturally important?
stupidest sentence ITT

>>81297726
Go ahead, I can admit when I'm wrong. Remember though all I'm saying is that the utter destruction of Dresden was unnecessary and an act of vengeance not the attack itself.

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its hilarious to see how /pol/tards get destroyed when they're not in their echo chamber

>>81297640
I was going to reply to your post, but I noticed the
>implying germany started ww2
part and I've decided I've got better things to do than to debate an idiot who shuts his fingers in his ears.

I've explained why Dresden happened. You've not said anything which makes it more morally wrong than what the Germans did to the Allies throughout the war.

Why do you solely focus on the Brits? More American bombs were dropped on Dresden than British. And I struggle to comprehend how the carpet bombing of numerous cities by the Germans across Europe and the strafing of refugees with Stuka bombers well before the British bombed a single German city makes the Dresden bombing evil, and the German attacks just strategic. How is Hamburg, Berlin, Cologne and Dresden not strategic if Warsaw, Rotterdam, Guernica and Coventry are?

Don't bother replying, I won't read it. You're a hopeless Naziboo that is desperate to make your megolamanic heroes out as the good guys and I've heard it all before. You desperately cling to Dresden as a sign that you were the victims of the war, not the instigators who bombed, strafed, invaded and killed its way across neutral Europe.

>>81297942
who exactly do you think is getting destroyed?

>>81297942
I'm a /pol/ack, but I don't have to cover up Nazi war crimes and worship a bollockless Austrian to be one. The sooner Naziboo revisionists fuck off the better /pol/ would be t b h f a m.

>>81297942
This.
>bitch about Dresden
>the day after their beloved Ass-SAD! uses chemical weapons on civilians again

>>81297830
How is that post stupid? Why is Dresden merely a cultural centre, while Coventry is just an industrial one? Explain.

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>>81297960
I'm not that guy, but everyone who doesn't agree with the allied conduct in WWII doesn't make them a nazi sympathiser.

Churchill was le greatest tory prime minister ever and it was actually liberals, left wing writers and the educated who were outraged when they found out about the bombing of Dresden and the tactics being employed by their head of state and military.

There are very valid reasons why the UN was created after WWII, and if you don't accept your country is not perfect you yourself are a nationalist shill who is not capable of critical thinking.

>>81297877
Okay. I have 2000 odd words.

1. Dresden was not a random target picked for revenge. Dresden was a target that Russia asked to be bombed. General Antonov said, and I quote "Well, we want the Dresden railway junction bombed". This was discussed at Yalta. UK and USA agreed.

2. It was the German lynchpin in the defence of Marshall Koniev`s left flank. Captured German documents stated "Dresden is to be fortified as a military strongpoint, to be held at all costs." Thus it needed to be attacked. This claim was backed up by intercepted messages from British Intelligence.

3. It was a major staging area for German land forces. Russian sources claim it had on average 28 troop trains move in and out of the area.

4. It had a military target of the Dresden Arsenal.

5. Russia wanted it bombed as it was the Communication Centre to the Eastern Front via Telephone (or telegraph I forget). They wanted that taken out.

6. There were 120 odd factories in the city. Including the production of guns and ammo. They were converted civilian factories.

6. In 1942, the Dresden Yearbook said " "Anyone who knows Dresden only as a cultural city would be very surprised to be made aware of the extensive and versatile activity that make Dresden one of the foremost industrial locations of the Reich"

As for the claim of 500,000 civilian dead, Germany themselves disagree. Dresden Commission of Historians for the Ascertainment of the Number of Victims of the Air Raids on the City of Dresden on 13/14 February 1945 has provisionally estimated the likely death-toll at around 18,000 and definitely no more than 25,000.

I could go on, but not enough space. Unless you want me to.

>>81298222
>As for the claim of 500,000 civilian dead
who the fuck claimed that

>>81298186
I don't claim the bombings were morally right, I claim that the actions committed by the Allies were justified after what the Germans had done to their populations until the Germans surrendered. It was total war, and it was a war that the Allies had not started. I don't blame them for trying to bring an end to it as quickly as possible. Which commander is going to risk the lives of his own men by not bombing enemy cities after your own cities have been bombed, and your enemies cities are full of industry producing war goods and transport.

There was nothing moral about any of WW2. War is awful. But Dresden was no worse than any other bombing raid conducted by both sides. The only difference is the high death toll, but you can't blame the Allies for getting good at a craft that the Germans had bloodily enforced upon them early in the war and in WW1 (worlds first strategic bombing campaign was by the Zeppelin's).

>>81298337
See >>81296149 >>81296228 "as many as a half a million". "Between 3 to 500,000 inhabitants" Etc.

>>81298222
Please go on. Good post. Also, there were 50'000 factory workers in Dresden still working in those factories producing war goods and weaponry. Dresden was very much still the center of German arms production, if not the most by the beginning of 1945 after the strategic bombing campaigns in the Ruhr had decimated production there.

>>81298488
To counter the meme that it was a 'war crime'. The Geneva convention DID NOT prohibit the bombing of industrial centres located in residential areas. Dresden was targetted not just because UK and USA had promised to bomb it for the Russians, but because when the Battle of the Bulge happened, it scared USA (despite the British telling the USA it was going to happen). To make things worse, the Germans had finally launched a counter to the British and American air superiority in the form of jet engine fighters, some shot down hundreds over the final months. Dresden was helping support the production of these, the railway transported shit to other areas. So Dresden was bombed.

As for the reasons for the death? The death of civilians was not planned. The reason it happened is for the following:

1. Dresden had many wooden buildings; wood burns easily. So the buildings burnt and people died. Worse death tolls happened in Japan thanks to purposeful American fire bombing, for no reason other than to prove they could hurt Japan.

2. It had been very dry that winter, unseasonally. This meant that supports in non-all wood buildings got caught and shit collapsed when it's tensile strength failed.

3. Germany had moved it's AA platforms to defend the Eastern Front as they believed the Russians would not care about killing civilians and IL-2's were causing a problem.

4. Corruption in the city. The leaders of the city were given money to build air raid shelters, but they did not spend it all for the public. Most of them spent the money building private air raid shelters in their homes in the suburbs. Those that WERE built were largely insufficent to supply the entire city.

5. Since it was a railway depot, refugees had massed there. The lack of air raid shelters, the lack of information and the lack of leadership meant these died in an inferno caused by accident due to many factors.

Out of space, sadly.

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Le May or Arthur Harris?
Who was better?

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>when you fight on the right side of history and then get beaten and burned to death by one of your beloved nigger pets
I fucking love it. I hope he died with the tought "this is what my kike overlords want for me".

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>>81298881
>he is krautus cocksucker
Pathetic

>>81298953
No, I can just see from the world right now that the wrong side won.

Just look at them whining now that they've gotten what they wanted: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1229643/This-isnt-Britain-fought-say-unknown-warriors-WWII.html
I LOVE it.

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>>81299018
But Hitler loved balck people and muslims

>>81298383
>a war that the Allies had not started
They were implicated though. It started with the ally created Treaty of Versailles and their creation of the Weimar Republic. I don't think you understand how unstable things were in post WWI Germany that led to the rise of fascism in the country. France and GB drafted the terms of the Treaty with the direct aim of weakening Germany (or in France's case, wanting to destroy it).

Remember that this is around the time of the Great Depression which hit Germany a million times harder due to their massive debt and reparations they were ordered to pay. GB also abandoned the gold standard which devalued their currency even further. This is the period that you see photos of Germans with wheelbarrows full of marks that are of basically no value because of hyperinflation. Then Hitler was elected with promises to start industry up again so everyone was happy to have jobs and food.

Germans are not inherently evil people hell bent on the destruction of Europe. History is mostly cause and effect, not just the main event.

>>81299134
yeah - back in their countries.

god I love how the civic nationalist english cucks celebrate the diversity that's fucking them do death, and that's what'll happen because by rejecting it they'd have to admit that they were wrong and that the nazis were right and that will never happen. It's great