Endtown discussion/pic thread. How's everyone doing?

Fuck holly

>>6737409
>How's everyone doing?

Not too well, Aaron's dickery has made me lose interest in the comic.

>>6738461
Many authors, actors, poducers and whatnot are complete dicks. That doesn't mean the stuff they've worked on is bad.

>>6738496
Just ask anyone reading Poppy Opossum.

>>6738525
Except Poppy is not a good comic made by a shitty person, it's a shitty comic made by a shitty person.

>>6737572
Holly was best waifu, Kirbee is a shit.

Probably something you guys would be interested in:

http://narbonic.com/comic/aaron-neathery-s-guest-week-and-a-half/

>Aaron did a guest week on the webcomic Narbonic
>Basically retooled the main character into an omnicidal maniac because that's how he would have written her
>Based his guest run on an Albert plotline he never got to use
>Original plotline involved Marx being "helpful" by giving Albert the formula to a soda that turned out to be lethal
>This being an Aaron Neathery plotline, people queued up to die because drinking the risky soda was seen as "cool"

Side note:

>More details on Albert's original run in Aaron's university newspaper
>When the new editor tried to axe it because he thought it was awful, Aaron's response was "But I got some fanmail!"

Why does this seem like a poor way to gauge the actual popularity of something? Fanmail is positive by definition. All it shows is that someone liked it, not the proportions of like to dislike, and I know for a fact that I'd be more inclined to make contact with a strange to praise something of theirs than I would be to denigrate it...

>>6738333

this is great, who drew this?

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>>6738674
>Holly is dead waifu, Kirbee a Cute!

Ftfy

>>6739515
>Kirbee a Cute!

You must be either blind or as stupid as Kirbee to think that. Holly was way cuter than that retarded lizard.

>>6738674
>>6738496

Yeah, but the comic is not really good enough to overlook Neathery and shit like >>6738955

I mean, the humor has always been terrible, Wally and Albert have no real distinct character, for the last year it's obviously been alot of death for shock value, Aaron changes what dittos can do almost weekly. I just don't think the comic is good anymore and hasnt been for awhile.

>>6738955
> I had to make appropriate adjustments to the story when adapting it to Narbonic. Dave fit Albert’s role as Cassandra nicely, sans culpability and consequent guilt, and having Helen deliberately create self-cooling cola for the purpose of killing huge swaths of humanity illustrates exactly why I tend to stick to characters that are fundamentally well-meaning; my mad scientists and comic villains always seem to follow through. This wasn’t a misreading of Shaenon’s character..just Helen Narbon as I would have handled her if Narbonic were my strip. And you can breathe easily that it wasn’t.

That... makes a lot of sense in scope of Endtown. Damn. Also it paints a bad picture about how Aaron respects the creations of others, which in turn makes a lot of sense how he treated the RPG guys.

Also I don't really see that much humour in this other than "LOL RANDUM XD". This is kind of the comic equivalent of *HOLDS UP A SPORK XD*.

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>>6739647

>was

Until Kirbee showed up for the first time.

>>6739858
>Also I don't really see that much humour in this other than "LOL RANDUM XD". This is kind of the comic equivalent of *HOLDS UP A SPORK XD*.
I've always felt Aaron was much better at subtle or character-based humour than any attempts at wackiness.

>>6739977

Even then I feel it's hit and miss most of the time. His wacky humour is near-always miss though.

>>6739858
>which in turn makes a lot of sense how he treated the RPG guys.

there's two sides of the coin, we don't really know the whole story, and chances are we wont. I try not to the the entire rpg fiasco at face value.

>>6740094

KC constantly kept saying he knows the second part yet he fails to ever deliver

> I try not to the the entire rpg fiasco at face value.

You what, mate?

>>6740122
>KC constantly kept saying he knows the second part yet he fails to ever deliver

he might be right, he might be making shit up, we will never know...

>You what, mate?

sorry, English is obviously not my first language... what i tried to say is, i try not to take it as fact? if that makes more sense.

>>6739669
>the humor has always been terrible
Disagree. I miss it.

>Wally and Albert have no real distinct character
They actually interact at some point and they're clearly different, Albert being driven by common sense while Wally is an idealist.

>Aaron changes what dittos can do almost weekly
This isn't just hyperbole, it's just plain wrong. It took a long time for dittos to do more than illusions and it had been established that enough dittos could make solid structures since they were introduced. While it was incredible at first, nothing contradicted that they could be sturdy enough to support people. Also even though it wasn't clear if it was the dittos or the ship's system producing the sound, it's not hard to figure it out.

>I just don't think the comic is good anymore and hasnt been for awhile.
Then why do you keep reading? Is this really what you think or what you want to believe now that you're not okay with Aaron?

You're being overly negative. Shitty attitude isn't justified just because you're responding to (Aaron's) shitty attitude. Calm down.

http://narbonic.com/comic/neathery-week-and-a-half-concluded/

> Shortly after this strip ran, a friend of Aaron’s contacted me to point out that nearly every storyline Aaron writes ends up more or less like this.

> Aaron:
General rule of thumb for just about everything I’ve ever written: the results of any character’s grand scheme is the complete opposite of what they’d intended. Naturally, a character setting out to brutally conquer the planet would inadvertently create a peaceful paradise they’d be incapable of ruling. The soundtrack for this strip would have to be the Talking Heads’ (Nothing but) Flowers.

...oh boy...

>>6740313
Yeah, reminder that the way he's ended at least two or three comics previous to Endtown has been with everyone dying.

>>6738674
>>6739515
>>6739647
>>6739868
Both are highly overrated. So far, Dottie, Linda and Maude are all better persons than them and arguably Gustine (she got over most of her issues already) and Allie (when not drunk) too.

>>6740313
>the results of any character’s grand scheme is the complete opposite of what they’d intended.
This is really making me look forward to the future of Endtown, because love that trope.

>>6740612
>Linda

come on now, anon... i get you hate Holly and Kirbee, but Linda was a topsider who loved converting mutants into mutts, I like her too, don't get me wrong. but you can't ignore that.

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>>6740691
>"for the greater good"
Everything's going to Hell again.

Why was today's /co/ thread so terrible?

>>6740935
The previous two were worse.

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>>6740935
>>6740984
I'll take the slowness over the constant shitposting any day.

>>6740935
Not much happening in the strip to talk about, and they've devolved into shitposting and... other disturbances lately, in general, anyway. Hang around and chat in here, if you like, this is more of an Endtown general now than anything. And don't be afraid to give critiques on the comic you wouldn't in the /co/ threads, as long as they're reasonably well-said.

>>6740935

what? would you rather see it revolve around waifufaggotry and kc hate?

>>6741011
>as long as they're reasonably well-said
This. Badmouthing is as bad as asskissing.

http://desuarchive.org/trash/thread/6566301/
http://desuarchive.org/trash/thread/6679065/

Links to previous threads, if anyone wanted them.

>>6738955
>>6739669
His new editor was full of shit, Albert the strip is great.

At least, I think so. Many folks at /co/ say they don't like it but I always assumed it was because it lacks furry waifus.

>>6741746
>it lacks furry waifus.

this is a big issue for most

>>6741746

It's because it's really bad humour if humour at all. It's not a pleasant read as the jokes are often morbid and mean spirited and not in a good way.

>>6741886
>It's not a pleasant read as the jokes are often morbid
It's dark humor. Some people like it, I know I do.

>and mean spirited and not in a good way
What do you mean?

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>>6740781
She regrets it.

>>6739488
RainbowOak

Do not expect consistent quality.

>>6740855
Poor Jim was too good for this world.

Jim is best waifu.

>>6738333
That's good stuff

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>>6742978

>>6746785
Fucking got me.

>>6742125
Even if it's dark humour it's not executed well. The punchline is "AND THEY'RE ALL DEAD NOW! LAUGH!", look at previously linked Narbonic comics, the punchline is "Everyone dies now, whoops I can't get to conquer the world anyway. CURSES."

Someone said it's like Schindler list where someone yells "BAZINGA!" At the end. It really is. The humour does not have the same timing and gravity as let's say Dr. Strangelove. If you even go back to original Fallout you have the black humour woven so nicely that you keep on smiling all the way through at the writing and dialogue despite the grim perspective.

In Albert? It's completely dry.

Look at the storyline with the presidential switcharoo. The punchlines? The real president gets killed in a fashion more akin to a nasty historic drama (this is what I mean by mean-spirited) and Albert is saved from the revolutionaries by... a safe falling out of the sky all of a sudden.

That's really not humour. Ever had a friend that pulls off a mean prank but only he is the one laughing? That's Albert for you.

I understand you might like this stuff, but it's really not that good of a strip.

>>6741011
>this is more of an Endtown general now than anything
Which is pretty fucking sad. /co/ is so bad that we have to talk in /trash/ of all places. Also, this board doesn't need any more generals so we're contributing to a problem. I hope it's just temporary.

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>>6746785
I wish I was married to Jim. He's such a great guy and a real qt too.

>>6749160
Disgusting. Fat fetishists are the worst.

>>6741746
>I always assumed it was because it lacks furry waifus.

Or you could actually listen to what people say. The old strips are on some 90's looking site somewhere. It's not really that funny. And it's got a whole lot more Marx.

I didn't read Endtown for the humour. In fact, I damn near put it down because of the humour. There's ONE joke in the early Endtown run that I laughed at. It's the one where Al and Gustine get the map, and it reads "here be dragons" and Gustine says "at least they know about the dragons". That was funny. All the shit about the beans? Not funny. The joke about the fish-head guy's head falling off? Not funny. The joke about Mallard's eccentricities? Not funny.

I don't know what it is, but people really like to convince themselves that they're funny when they're really not, but instead have some other talent. It's the same with Schlock Mercenary. Want to guess why I dropped that comic? Because the author thought his humour could carry the entire comic, while everyone actually read it because it somehow manages to be decent military sci-fi.

Aaron Neathery is not a funny man. He is good at writing downer stories, and that's what he ought to do.

>>6740935
You know things have gone to shit when Marx fans start popping up.

>>6750972
>The old strips are on some 90's looking site somewhere.
I remember when that got linked on /co/. Does it still need like about three separate clicks to advance the comic a single strip, or did they end up fixing that?

>>6750972
>Or you could actually listen to what people say. The old strips are on some 90's looking site somewhere
I knew already. I've read 'em all before and I'm telling you, I -like- them as they are and not just because Aaron made them. I just like that stuff, not all of them of course but enough to read them all.

>>6751770

IIRC that actually came up and one of Aaron's friends implied that the comic had intentionally been made laborious to access because Aaron wanted people to "work" for the answers on Endtown's backstory.

I mean, good grief.

>>6752636
>one of Aaron's friends implied that the comic had intentionally been made laborious to access because Aaron wanted people to "work" for the answers on Endtown's backstory
This is the first time I see this mentioned. Source?

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>>6752708
I remember this one. It was in the thread for Albert and Free Energy, the one where Marx destroys the entire Albert universe because of good intentions coupled with the simple lack of fact-checking common to a lot of Aaron's "ha ha isn't this funny he's failing epically and causing a lot of suffering" story lines.

https://desuarchive.org/co/thread/82785070/#82789454

There's no identity attached to the relevant post.

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Fuck holly, she should have died in a painful way.

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>>6754078
>Fuck holly,

I would if I could

>she should have died in a painful way.

Kirbeefags are horrible people.

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>>6754264
>Kirbeefags are horrible people.

>Talk shit about holly
>FUCKING KIRBEEFAGS!

Like clockwork... You Hollycucks are so fucking predictable.

>>6756785
So are you, LIZARD LOVER!

Anyone feel like making guesses? I think Aaron's just going to use the next few strips to try and hammer some nails in, so to speak. Probably Marx is just going to give Doc some kind of speech on certain things being inevitable, and/or having to be done for "the Greater Good" (which will end with Doc hating Marx and Marx reflecting on being Tragically Alone again...). Possibly he's going to echo Wally's sentiments.

Anyone holding out hope for something better?

>>6757662
Next comic: Doc asks if Marx could have done/could do anything. Marx answers "Maybe..." (cliffhanger)...

Monday: ... but not really, for reasons.

Wednesday: Doc makes counterpoint. More reasons.

Friday: Doc accepts or storms off. Close on Marx's final remark or reaction.

>Anyone holding out hope for something better?

Barely.

http://desuarchive.org/trash/thread/6679065/#6717097

>>6757662
I have no predictions. Trying to predict stuff in Endtown seems kinda pointless as Aaron really strives for unpredictability and is fairly good at it.

>>6757662
>>6757985

Something in between both of these but with a reference to Farx thrown in because Doc met the guy and has his suspicions.

>>6758113
Complete with another "I am infinite!" from Doctor Whonka.

>>6758113
In that case it'll probably be searching questions as to his identity and as to whether or not he knew this was going to happen when he rescued them.

Maybe even a bit where Aaron tries to satisfy fans with glimpses of universes where Wally and Holly are together and happy, while also stating there's ones where she's committed suicide or never survived the war.

>>6758319
In the monthly update he claims to not care about fan-pandering, so I doubt it.

>>6758341
I don't know if I'd call that pandering, anon... more like visually acknowledging the potential inherent in a previously-established element of the strip.

I might go as far as calling it "throwing the fans a bone".

>>6757662
Maybe since it's Doc he'll drop mention of Holly being barren from the miscarriage, since supposedly that was going to be a thing. Maybe even a last-minute addressing of her lifespan? That was supposed to turn up as an important thing too.

>>6759115
I think we were supposed to see "The anarchic first years of Endtown" or something like that, too, in this arc, which I guess probably would have been seen from Holly's perspective up in the clocktower.

Probably moved to Walt's inevitable flashback... might also have been done because showing Holly slowly recovering over two years up in the clocktower would probably have interfered with the progression Aaron was going for.

>>6757662
>>6757985

Thinking about it: I think we're going to see Aaron have both characters agree that Holly couldn't be healed by either Doc or Wally for whatever reason, and maybe find out that Marx had told Doc about the ship ahead of time but he still has doubts.

>>6759466

In before it's

"Is my daughter safe as we're agreed upon"
"She's safely at the ship"
"I wish there was some other way."
"There can't be another way you know, it's all for the Greater Good."
"Yeah... %!@^@ Greater Good."

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>>6759498

>>6759498
>InB4 the Greater Good turns out to be something horrible at the end of the comic and all the characters rebel against Marx

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Looks like he's gonna reference the "Secret End" option (>>6757985) but probably not take it.

Also I think someone called it in the last /co/ thread; Doc is the audience stand-in here (which means people will forever point to this sequence as proof that yes, on some level Marx is Aaron's self-insert).

>>6762232
Which is oddly appropriate, I did always like him.

>>6762232
"Good End" option would still work - the public story can only ever tell part of the tale, and nobody but Doc and Marx can ever know the full truth, because if Wally ever found out that Holly had sacrificed her freedom for them he'd feel like he had failed Holly far more than he does now and probably never get over it. It might even be framed as a potential "Lie [Doc] can live with", with the possibility of it actually being true left ambiguous (inverse echo of the original ending?)

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>>6759466
>>6759498
You guessed it!

Are you wizards?

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>>6763281
I don't think we can say we have... just yet. This could certainly be leading in that direction, but it's too early to say.

But anyway, I've never regarded Aaron as being as unpredictable as some people like to think. I've been seeing people call elements of the plot for ages now. The whole not-a-virus thing that was delivered like it was a big revelation, for instance.

And then there's ditto-Holly... so damn obvious and called so far in advance that it felt like a certain someone in-the-know started to react by strenuously mocking it, just to try and let the reveal retain some measure of surprise... and then there was pic related, right after said reveal... wrong on the tiny details (though apparently Holly was originally going to talk... via solid speech bubbles), but more or less right on the broad strokes... wonder if the unfulfilled ones will end up coming true?

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>>6764144
>The whole not-a-virus thing that was delivered like it was a big revelation, for instance.
More like a confirmation. Wally is full of shit, that's why he never realized it. Anyone who knows a bit about physics and viruses could tell it was just not possible, unless the virus was magical itself.

>ditto-Holly... so damn obvious and called so far in advance
To be fair, it -was- contradicted by the whole "dittos can't get into my bubble". But then again, Wally is full of shit.

>>6764242
>More like a confirmation. Wally is full of shit, that's why he never realized it. Anyone who knows a bit about physics and viruses could tell it was just not possible, unless the virus was magical itself.
It was a confirmation of what a lot of people already firmly believed (I wouldn't even say suspected, like you say, it was obvious to anyone with half a brain), but it was certainly delivered in-comic like it was supposed to be a revelation.

>To be fair, it -was- contradicted by the whole "dittos can't get into my bubble". But then again, Wally is full of shit.
Yeah, that was just... weird.

>>6765820
I haven't seen this pic before, is this new? If so, I like it. If not I still like it.

>>6766797
Think it's been around a while, actually.

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Promo art for my (mostly defunct for the time being) fancomic.

There is nothing wrong with liking Marx, the only people mad at his presence right now are buttmad waifufags

>>6767556
Not bad. I like the APC.

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Sigh.

>>6771070

>Play DnD with Holly
>She's a lawful good paladin and doesn't want me killing Orc babies

>>6738674
What's wrong with Poppy, and the creator? Gimme the dirt.

>>6771239
>Play DnD with Anon
>He's a Chaotic Evil That Guy who wants to be edgy but can't handle real conflict

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>>6771239
>>6774312
>Play DnD with Allie
>Her PC gets killed by the city guard during a bar fight

>>6775260
>>Her PC gets killed by the city guard during a bar fight
Not cool, man. Funny but not cool.

>>6773178
Seconding.

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>>6779620

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>>6785737
Does anyone still care about Ethel?

>>6785883
I think she deserved a little more strip time than she got. But the flashback part of the arc felt like it ended up running too long to me anyway, so I dunno. Maybe if Aaron had compressed everything that came after Lyn and the buddis...

>>6785927
She wasn't a particularly good person. I don't get the appeal, other than her being a talking snek.

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>>6785949
Remember when we were guessing what Ethel was

>>6786342
I really wanted her to be an opossum.

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>>6767556
More unfinished comic stuff. Will be dropping more of it here and there.

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>>6787198
I appreciate it, thank you

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>>6787253
Assorted model sheets of Mana, including her human form.

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>>6787274
Earlier sketches, note the presence of hair over her entire ears here as opposed to the newer one, and DK's piece. That was a later change to make her look more specifically poodle-like, without altering her too much.

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>>6787311

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>>6787387
Some of the other characters it was to have, among other things.

>>6787198
>>6787274
>>6787311
>>6787387
>>6787434
These are all pretty darn neat. Good character designs, and I especially like your abominations.

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>>6787525
Yet more early stuff.

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>>6787525
I even once toyed with the idea that they pick up/tame a little abomination, I later thought it was dumb.

>>6787580
I dunno... if you were worried about abomination temperaments, Al showed it was perfectly possible for at least some of them to be "tamed". I think that's kind of a cool idea, myself.

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>>6787580
Aahh. I guess I was worried he would descend into Slimer levels of obnoxiousness, ha.

>>6787580
>>6787623
Also, I gotta say I like the idea of one of the abominations having a wristwatch. That's a nice touch.

Also, have you been told that Penny is cute, lately?

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>>6787641
Fairly often, actually, ha. Speaking of which, some of her first designs, which were a lot more generic.

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>>6787665
The top left of this one was part of an idea where Mana or somebody gets chased up an elevator shaft.

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>>6787695
Solidifying Penny's design.

>>6787665
>>6787695
>>6787744
You thinking of using these characters for another project some time? I mean, the good thing about anthros is, they're portable...

>>6787760
Certainly! I'd need to think up something, though.

>>6787881
Awesome. I hope to see them find a more permanent home, then, some day.

>>6788859
That's good stuff, also a very true file name

>>6787984
There was a rough idea I had that Mana was originally written for, that I only ever drew 1-2 really old roughs for back in '08 during my old xbox testing days, called Post Human. It involved designer genetics as a levelling mechanic, and some Shadowrun elements. Ever hear of a wacky CD-i Beat 'em Up called Mutant Rampage: Bodyslam? A little like that.

REMOVE MARX remove marx

>>6799422
Sounds like the tagline to an anticommunist cleaning liquid.

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>>6799422

So... anyone want to bother to throw out a guess or two for today's comic?

Absent any sudden "It was all a "fun" story" or at least an "I may have left out an important detail or two", I think we're probably going to see Doc ask if Marx could have done anything, which will either be answered with a "No" and a statement of Marx's policies, or an "I already did" that'll lead up to him revealing he's responsible for the ship being there in the first place (in other words, a "Marxdunnit" in a comic that looks like it's going to be increasingly full of them going forward).

May or may not come with a statement that this is the most positive end state Holly could achieve (or rather, that Aaron was willing to write). Might also be turned around, with Doc asking if he could have done any more to help her, which could be the lead in to a dissection of Holly's character from Aaron's point of view and a list of bullet points as to why this or suicide was Holly's inevitable conclusion even despite Doc's help (stand by for Aaron ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL...)

>>6802368
Some kind of tease regarding Holly and then a "NOPE. She's gonna stagnate in a tin can for the rest of her life!"

No dying

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Have some Allie

> Today's comic

Just...

JUST....

JUST FUCK MY COMIC UP

>>>/co/88537163

>>6806523
Yeah, this is probably just going to end on another "Not everyone gets a happy ending" and/or Marx asking Doc if he'd be willing to take away what Holly "has", with Holly just being left in limbo, in the end.

Shit sucks, but I'm gonna see this through til' the bitter end of Holly's arc... Aaron's still got two strips to surprise me, if I've read his own estimate right.

>half a dozen relationships in two years

... okay. Sure Aaron. Well, at least she stuck with Wally the longest...

>>6806710

>>half a dozen relationships in two years

>... okay. Sure Aaron. Well, at least she stuck with Wally the longest...

Even people in the /co/ thread are calling that one out. If it had been the case, Wally would have known, considering how popular Holly was around town, and it also makes said popularity odd since this is a very conservative society Aaron's depicted, the sort where Holly would probably be seen as a "loose" woman for having that many relationships that quickly. Not to mention the reaction from her friend at the diner is one more like "Oooh, Holly finally has a boyfriend and he's a CAT!" not "Oh shit, she's getting tangled again"...

>>6806813
When I saw people claiming Holly was being character assassinated by Aaron, I thought they were just bitter fanboys. Upset that their beloved character was behaving -in their eyes- irrationally. Unstable. I thought going crazy was just natural in Endtown's world. I'd go crazy, there.

I hate to admit it, but I think they were right. Because damn straight a 1950's slut wouldn't be considered popular around town. Damn straight you can't suddenly claim something like this without having dropped hints first. We can tell how characters were written, and Holly was written as a typical sweetheart when we first saw her in Endtown, with maybe a slight mean streak. Nothing pointed to her being promiscuous.

Of course, I wouldn't really consider it weird, for the same reasons as stated above. It's a crapsack world, and mutants need love, too. But that makes Aaron's seeming insistence that this behaviour ever so slightly makes her a worse person just a little bit more seedy.

I've already peeked behind the curtains. I can't go back to thinking of Aaron as this masterful character writer. That sucks. And I can kind of see where this comes from. When you have an idea in your head, you change things along the way. Sometimes really major things, that can change the entire nature of the story. Webcomic artists find themselves in the bind where they are publishing as they produce, so any change will automatically be a retcon, instead of part of the original story.

And if Aaron used Marx and "Eye" to adress THIS as a topic, I would consider it very interesting. But he seems to be missing a golden oppertunity, here, to actually make Marx a worthy addition to the cast.

>>6806916
>An idea is like a virus. Resilient. Highly contagious. And even the smallest seed of an idea can grow. It can grow to define or destroy you.
Aaron should've watched Inception.

>>6806916
It really does kind of feel like Aaron took "Leading lady with issues that are due to be resolved in a nicely-symmetrical character arc where her partner winds up teaching her her own lessons" and decided (I'm guessing around 2013-2014) to turn it into "Fragile and tragically-broken plot element that the hero must overcome".

>>6806993
It's more like an eternal editing process. I used to write, and ideas still prop up. And without intending it, I still work on them in my head, just by thinking about them. Say, for instance, I have a science fiction idea about some sort of cybernetic implant, which also symbolises something. Then I think about it again, and I decide that the story should take place in some sort of post-apocalyptic setting to illustrate the importance of the social thing the implant describes. Then I think about it again, and the idea ferments. Maybe I suddenly become fascinated by the setting, and push it to the fore. Or maybe it becomes a vestigial thing of no real importance.

In webcomics, however, that process is always going on. There's no point where it's "finished".

>>6807043
Yeah, it has all the appearence of that.

>>6807058
This is why most webcomics suck. Series that have no clear ending and intend to be successful need to be episodic.

Al and Gustine switching to Wally was a good example of this, different stories that play around in the setting, quite frankly I would have been fine with the Wally / Holly relationship with Wally just overcoming his drifter mentality, maybe extend the arc a bit, but it's fine as a lesson as was sacrifice in the lesson before.

If you intend to change format to a full, all encompassing story, you NEED story, you need a clear end point, you can't just wing it day by day. Even if you're a shit hot writer, statistically as time goes on you're going to make mistakes and missteps, you have to write a script that you can read from point a to point b, have it make sense, and then read it backwards to make sure your plot holes are eliminated.

Aaron is a bit hacky, I get it, he has medical complications and this is his job, but just telling people to trust him over and over and pretending it'll all make sense in the end, when he consistently drops holes all over his story, is stoopid.

Doesn't help that his fanbase is pure cancer and don't know good writing when they see it. It's amazing how many of these morons think Marx is a decent character.

>>6806710
>Shit sucks, but I'm gonna see this through til' the bitter end of Holly's arc... Aaron's still got two strips to surprise me, if I've read his own estimate right.
>InB4 Aaron has Marx "solve" the fans' issues with this ending by taking Holly to the Crossroads and letting her reincarnate somewhere nicer with Lyn and her child, literally killing her off.

>>6807910

> Doesn't help that his fanbase is pure cancer and don't know good writing when they see it. It's amazing how many of these morons think Marx is a decent character.

I think at this point it's false flagging. Selina was the only person ever admitting she finds Marx cute or funny.

A lot of people have dropped the comic and the Endtown defence force is in full swing at this moment...

>>6808139
I mean mostly his fanbase on gocomics. I've never been to /co/ and didn't even know they had any interest in shitty little Endtown.

I got into it from Doc Rat a while ago, and the comment section on Endtown is just, pure awful cancer, even from Jenner backing up his friend. Everything is, we have to have faith, we trust, OH WHAT A TWIST I LOVE TWISTS, ha ha Marx is so cuuuuul.

It's awful.

>>6808521
We all know GoComics readers are stupid. No wonder you're so angry, you should've been discussing the comic in /co/ instead.

>Doc Rat
I dropped it when it killed the old archive. I get it, the comic is "serious" now. No need to remove what people enjoyed before that.

>>6808521
Fuck off, waifufag cuck.

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>>6810036
>person makes bad comment
>respond with equally shitty comment

>>6808099
Enh, at this point I'm almost expecting Aaron to go back on his own word a bit to take another swing at his fanbase by having Marx consenting to bring Holly back and then having it go badly wrong, with Holly either throwing herself off the bridge/clocktower or ending up incarcerated again.

Or he just tells Doc to ask the oracle what would happen, and it's something horrible... that'd probably fit into the remaining strips, unless Aaron's going into overtime with the denouement, which already feels kind of like an extension.

>>6809342
>you should've been discussing the comic in /co/ instead
Lol no though.

>I dropped it when it killed the old archive.
Is back up. What did they remove? As far as I know it wasn't an intentional kill.

>>6810036
I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at? Holly? I don't like Holly.

>>6810488
>Is back up. What did they remove? As far as I know it wasn't an intentional kill.
Not that guy, but I heard Doc Rat had an it-was-all-a-dream Endtown crossover. Is that true? Last time I went to check the archives were a mess...

>>6810488
>Lol no though.
Your loss. The current shitposting is relatively recent, Endtown threads (and fans) were known to be one of the best in the board.

>>6774312

Gary Gygax says it's OK to convert evil creatures at swordpoint, and kill them, since they're dying as a "good" creature that will go to heaven.

>>6810519
I don't know honestly, I stopped reading Doc Rat a while ago because of the same reason, only recently went back to it to see if the archives were fixed up, which they are.

Gonna start from square one, see how it goes.

>>6810535
Eh, just not interested, not really a loss. I only /k/ and /out/ besides this place now. I'm fine with light circle jerking and banter but I'd never care that much about a comic lol.

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>>6810907
>but I'd never care that much about a comic lol.
Then why are you here getting angry over Endtown?

>>6807910
Yeah, exactly. Having seperate scripts for X length of time makes those scripts stand alone issues within which there isn't much change, and which can be used as reference material. Which makes it easier to maintain consistence between scripts.

I was dismayed when Aaron mentioned writing a much larger role for Kirbee, and that she is some sort of key character all of a sudden. This is one of those loose ideas asserting itself. It also illustrated the problem of lack of preparation. If you're writing a script and this happens, you can change your script for a proper insertion of the character, and assign them their own definite arc. With this webcomic format, he has to insert her now, and figure what to do later. Which is also now, because she's here.

And you can't go back and edit stuff. Every conscious change you make is a retcon, and so is ever mistake.

>>6810959
>getting angry
Brah wut

>>6811092
Yeah, even movies that go through mid production rewrites end up borked, and you can clearly see the script changes in the final.

But at least you have a CHANCE to go back and revise it to how it needs to be, best you can.

You're right, with a web comic you're kinda fucked lol, don't get me wrong, I'm fine with a plot hole here and there, but it's almost like he forgot who Holly was. He's really fucking her character lol.

>>6811182
It's the insistence that everything in the past is now retroactively some other way. We can damn well see he just made shit up that was never there. And that kind of defeats the entire purpose of a character arc. I think Aaron doesn't realize that.

It makes what we're reading now not the end of the entire arc, but the end of whatever arc he started when he came up with that retcon. Somewhere, Holly's arc ended. Aaron just had to scamper about to find an excuse to end it, but in his head he was already done.

>>6814639

That mutation tends to make you irrational and easily angry.

>>6817003

In a fair world, Lyn would've been immune to mutation, same with Sparkplug's family.

>>6812794
Yeah, he's obviously backed himself into a place he doesn't know how to get out of.

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Random Penanon stuff because we need some funny pics in here...

Let's keep this going a little longer

>>6820428
I don't know about you but I'm only waiting for someone to post >>>/co/88543620.

>>6820808

That's obviously Jamil's work, you could ask him for it.

>>6806425

Kazen needs to draw more allie, this pic is wonderful!

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>>6821343
I'm reposting this one.
>>6804169
Nice a new RainbowOak pic

>>6822366

Allie is best waifu, there's literally no contest

>>6822467
That's not how "literally" should be used.

>>6823711
I wish dark humor was more popular.

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>>6821743
Thanks, I should!

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>>6824243
More Allie is always awesome.

>>6824243

That's some really cute Allie!

>>6822639
He's not wrong, though. There literally is not a contest about who is the best waifu.

>>6812794
I think the most egregious recent thing is the "she blazed her way through six boyfriends" retcon, when the most that was suggested previously was that she'd had *some* manner of attachment to someone who she lost to a surface mission (hence Doc warning her about not getting involved with the outlander who obviously wanted to leave, Holly running away in despair shouting "They don't come back!" when told about Wally's mission, and her decision to stow away in Wally's backpack - she was going to be there for *this* one when he needed her... and what do you know, she actually saved his life...)

At this point I'm almost hoping Aaron will have Marx reveal everything since the end of the Milk Trial (including the last few comics) has been taking place in an alternate Endtown with a more screwed-up Holly. I say almost, because I can't actually see him doing that.

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>>6825058
Are you shitting me?

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>>6825075

Why is it so hard to believe Holly was a slut?

>>6825103

Holly "CockSleeve" Hollister, The easiest woman in endtown.

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>>6825058
>There literally is not a contest about who is the best waifu.

Yeah, everyone knows Roxie is the hottest stoat in town.

>>6825103
It's not hard to believe she was a slut, it's hard to believe she went quickly through 6 relationships and nobody mentioned it before (compare that to Allie who only had a couple of dates before she was considered undesireable). It also contradicts her clingy nature.

>>6825698

Well, Doc did warned Wally against dating her.

>nobody mentioned it before

The way i see it, everyone has their own very serious issues to deal with, i don't see people caring too much about someone having very unstable relationships.

>It also contradicts her clingy nature.

Well, maybe this is exactly what drove her relationships into the ground? i mean, she's obsessive as fuck, i don't find it very hard to believe that it was her pardners who ultimately shut her down.

>>6825754
Not the same guy, but:

>Well, Doc did warned Wally against dating her.
He warned him that Holly would get the worst of it, though. It felt less like "She's bad for her partners and her relationships end poorly" and more "If you let her get too attached to you, then she's not going to be able to handle it (again) when you either die or leave Endtown."

Just another thing that says to me that she was originally intended to have lost her original husband to scanvenger duty, or something along those lines. Maybe a previous drifter... it really does sound like a one-off, whatever it was, as I remember Holly telling Doc "Don't worry, I know better", in an "I've been burned once, I won't let it happen again" kind of way.

>The way i see it, everyone has their own very serious issues to deal with, i don't see people caring too much about someone having very unstable relationships.
Sorry, I just find it hard to believe that nobody would have mentioned anything to Wally in the whole two years he was in Endtown with her? Not once? Not even overhearing gossip or anything? Not even a mention from his Lizard pal? Remember that it's a tiny community in an enclosed environment, and Holly was well-known...

>>6826009

>Sorry, I just find it hard to believe that nobody would have mentioned anything to Wally

why would they? i mean, if he was friends with roxie i would agree with you.

>Not even a mention from his Lizard pal?

he's literally the only person Wally had constant contact with, i never saw him talk with anyone else.

>Remember that it's a tiny community in an enclosed environment, and Holly was well-known...

true, but also one filled with drama and misery, people has more important things to be worried about.

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Huh... re-reading some old stuff from when Holly's arc was just getting started... I'm calling it: Doc wasn't originally supposed to be even step-related to her... he calls her "Miss Hollister" here (Miss Hollister... does someone go back to being "Miss" after they lose a hiusband? Okay, now I'm wondering if Aaron even intended her to be previously married...)...

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>>6826089
... and here he's "like a father". Not an actual stepfather. Huh.

>>6826089
He was just being professional, they were in the hospital.

>>6826106
Though I get the feeling with that one. I mean, it's not like people don't know what a step-father is. But it also looks like her mother married him very late, she didn't seem to consider him a father until the apocalypse. It's probably her who has a problem understanding their relationship.

>>6826050
>why would they? i mean, if he was friends with roxie i would agree with you.
Accidental talk from someone unaware of the relationship with Holly, a friendly warning like the cautions they got about Jackrabbit/the political situation from Cooper, someone who didn't like their relationship trying to poison the well, I could see all sorts of ways he'd find out.

>he's literally the only person Wally had constant contact with, i never saw him talk with anyone else.
Again, Wally was there for two years, complete with time-skips - we don't know how many people he was friendly with. They obviously had an acquaintance with Cooper, for instance. He could have had plenty of contacts we just never saw.

>true, but also one filled with drama and misery, people has more important things to be worried about.
Actually, I don't know about you, but in my experience a lot of people turn to chatting about other people's problems when they don't want to think about their own. Hence the popularity of crap like reality TV and celebrity gossip...

>>6826219
>a lot of people turn to chatting about other people's problems when they don't want to think about their own. Hence the popularity of crap like reality TV and celebrity gossip...
This. We saw this shit during the Milk Trial. Remember that people were also talking about Linda's ideas and Allie talked about hearing rumors of someone's husband being in the Council and being an Allgood supporter. Also, Holly was apparently very popular in Endtown so how can you not expect people to talk about her?

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>>6826208
>He was just being professional, they were in the hospital.
Sorry, not going for that one. Can't see why not calling a family member by their familiar name would be "professional"... that's more the way you treat a client, albeit one you're friendly with.

>Though I get the feeling with that one. I mean, it's not like people don't know what a step-father is. But it also looks like her mother married him very late, she didn't seem to consider him a father until the apocalypse. It's probably her who has a problem understanding their relationship.
She calls him "Poppa" in the flashback, though.

>>6826219
>I could see all sorts of ways he'd find out.

i could see all sorts of way he could have found out about her being crazy, about the fact she was married... he never did though, not until the end.


>we don't know how many people he was friendly with.

True, but he mostly seems to keep to himself. Like i said, i never saw him talking to no one else besides the lizard guy.

>Actually, I don't know about you, but in my experience a lot of people turn to chatting about other people's problems when they don't want to think about their own. Hence the popularity of crap like reality TV and celebrity gossip...

I don't deny this, but i still don't see people going straight to wally just to talk about it and shit on his relationship.

>>6826322

>how can you not expect people to talk about her?

not suggesting no one ever talks about her, but like i mentioned above, i don't see people going their way just to let wally know about what she used to fuck or not, as for gossiping and wally just over hearing a conversation, well that is just very unlikely to happen. Holly could have been popular in endtown, but that doesn't mean she's the only topic of discussion, unlike in these threads apparently.

>>6826219

>Accidental talk from someone unaware of the relationship with Holly, a friendly warning like the cautions they got about Jackrabbit/the political situation from Cooper, someone who didn't like their relationship trying to poison the well, I could see all sorts of ways he'd find out.

Hell, you'd think one of Holly's supposed six exes would have had something to say, either out of worry for Wally or out of spite towards Holly...

>>6826336
At least in Mexico, you're not supposed to treat family specially... or even at all. I assumed it was the same in the USA.

>She calls him "Poppa" in the flashback
Yeah, after their bonding moment.

>>6826480
>i could see all sorts of way he could have found out about her being crazy, about the fact she was married... he never did though, not until the end.
Quite a few people around here are of the opinion a lot of that stuff was a retcon to various degrees too, though. As the plot stands now, it seems to me to be a rather unbelievable stroke of "luck" that Wally never found out, and that's the problem...

>True, but he mostly seems to keep to himself. Like i said, i never saw him talking to no one else besides the lizard guy.
Remember, he spent two years down there, alongside a girlfriend who advocates mingling and opening up to people, and people would at least have become very aware of him when he literally stepped out of a hole in the middle of the air on a crowded street.

>I don't deny this, but i still don't see people going straight to wally just to talk about it and shit on his relationship.
That discounts the possibility of it getting back to him another way, though. Again, it's a closed environment, I find it really hard to believe he never caught a whiff of this.

>not suggesting no one ever talks about her, but like i mentioned above, i don't see people going their way just to let wally know about what she used to fuck or not, as for gossiping and wally just over hearing a conversation, well that is just very unlikely to happen.
Sorry, I can definitely see someone either giving Wally a warning, Wally finding out early on from normal conversation with someone who doesn't know he's in a relationship with Holly, or as >>6826485 says, meeting an ex, which is something I've seen happen in more sparse communities than Endtown.

>Holly could have been popular in endtown, but that doesn't mean she's the only topic of discussion, unlike in these threads apparently.
Well... the entire last arc was and continues to be about her, and the whole thing left a lot of bad feeling. I'm not really surprised she's a big topic of discussion at the moment.

>>6826661
>At least in Mexico, you're not supposed to treat family specially... or even at all. I assumed it was the same in the USA.
Then wouldn't you think he'd start by calling her "Miss Hollister" as the default and switch to "Holly" to try and catch her attention, not the other way around?

>>6826661
>Yeah, after their bonding moment.
Right, she was bonding with him to the point where she was calling him "Poppa". He even got her into Endtown. And *six years later* he's still "like a father"? No, sorry, dude, it really does feel like a retcon to me.

>>6826480
>i could see all sorts of way he could have found out about her being crazy, about the fact she was married... he never did though, not until the end
Everyone is crazy in Endtown, it'd be the pots calling the kettle black. And besides isolating herself in the tower for a while she didn't show serious problems until after the Milk Trial. He could have never found out because nobody knew. But now there's something that everyone should know about but Wally never heard of.

>i never saw him talking to no one else besides the lizard guy
IN TWO YEARS??

>that doesn't mean she's the only topic of discussion
But it was a relevant topic for Wally because now he was part of the topic, being one of her relationships.

Are you being dense on purpose or what?

>>6826796
I'm not arguing against the retcon, I was just explaining my points.

>>6826796
>wouldn't you think he'd start by calling her "Miss Hollister" as the default
I saw it as a slip of the tounge. JUST SAYING, don't take it so seriously. We're all guessing here.

>>6826875
>>6826922
Fair enough, and granted making Doc her step-dad isn't the worst retcon we've seen by far (I'm more curious about what her being "Miss Hollister" at that point in the comic means).

>JUST SAYING, don't take it so seriously. We're all guessing here.
I know. To be fair, voicing our suspicions is all we can do in regards to this stuff, unless Aaron ever comes forward and admits to anything (I'd love to see a tell-all Endtown retrospective some day, after the fuss has died down... something like Watterson's Calvin and Hobbes highlights book with all the commentary)

>>6827017
Aaron seems less humble than before, must have been all the constant praise. I don't think he'll admit anything in a while. KC is definitely not helping the issue, probably rubbing off his own bad traits on him.

>>6827100
>Aaron seems less humble than before

how? he still answers my emails very politely, no matter how harsh they are.

>>6827184
>harsh
Intriguing... do tell, anon.

>>6827100
Well, one can dream. Assuming Aaron can pick the quality of the comic back up again after this, a 10"x10" large-print of all the best and most well-drawn strips/arcs with a completely honest and candid "Director's Commentary" below each one talking about art, writing, character development, plot, and yes, any and all relevant retcons would be quite the tempting product...

Would anyone here recommend reading Endtown or should I just read something else instead? I'm not picky about plot things unless its generally hard to follow or full of holes. Also, I think that some of the characters that I've seen in this thread are kinda cute.

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>>6827457

I think it's pretty good, I've gotten into it recently myself.

>>6827198

i rant to Aaron sometimes, he's polite enough to answer.

>>6827184
His last report was a bit pretentious and he was talking down to his fans for the first time (something he claimed to hate).

>>6827457
Find out for yourself. The best tip anyone can give you is to not stop until you see Sparkplug, that's when you'll know for sure if the comic is good or not.

>>6827457
Hoboy.

It has its ups and downs - mostly ups until recently. I'd say the character writing peaks around 2013, there's a couple of bits that you might read and go "Why on Earth would the author do this?", and the first arc is hit-and-miss for a lot of people (like >>6827582 says, at least give it the benefit of the doubt until Sparkplug). And that's without getting into the most recent arc, which is highly controversial to say the least. Ultimately, yeah, just give it a read.

>>6827538
Well that's something, though I can't help but wonder if a polite response is the same thing as actually taking any of your criticisms on board...

>>6827672

well, such rants sometimes end up in full blown discussions, so at least there's that.

>>6827731
Any samples?

>>6827497
>>6827582
>>6827622
Thanks, y'all. I guess I'll give it a look.

>>6827884

I honestly rather not share, i would encourage you to write to him instead.

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I figure this is /trash/ appropriate enough...

>>6828236
>That title

>>6828236

>requesting holly giving the porcupine a blowjob

>>6828570
Who are you quoting?

Page 10

No comic yet. This is the latest it's been in a while, I think. Perhaps Aaron is busy with Christmas stuff?

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Just some highlights from the last /co/ thread.

>>6834591
According to the GoComics comments (I know...) Aaron had a HDD crash, so his computer's defunct until further notice. He says the next comic likely won't be here until Thursday.

>>6835848
Wonder if he lost anything important?

Wow, even some of the GoComics guys think there are issues with the current arc/Holly's story.

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>>6836769
All those sexy Maude pics, now gone forever.

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>>6842756

>>6842756
>>6843374
Pure gold. Thanks for making this ridiculously funny stuff, Penanon. It helps.

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>>6843682
I'm glad it helps. I never expected one of my pics to be the OP pic in a /trash/ thread, especially the one of the non maid pics.

>>6844027
Ah, well, a lot has changed in the last few weeks.

I do love your maid stuff, though.

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>>6844125
Yeah, but I dig it though. I'm glad you guys like it, because /trash/ has really good Endtown threads when they want to.

>>6844555

man, we need more sexy Abby

>>6844555
Yeah, /trash/ is full of surprises.

And seconding >>6844825. Maybe with an "I'm still alive!", to keep the H*R references going...

>>6826089
>>6826106
I'm reading this in the light of what I already suspect of Aaron: He adjusts the narrative -retcons it, in effect- as he's going on. Whenever he says "this was always supposed to happen" he's lying. To a degree, you can get away with it. But when he decided retroactively that Holly was "only seen through Wallys eyes", I knew he was full of shit. Those pages are both Holly-centric.

This is just pathetic. Omnipotent and omnipresent Coolguy McCoolguy crying, that in fact he's not Omnipotent.

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>>6848128
I don't think he meant -literally- always and yes there are many strips like this.

It's just that Wally steals the spotlight most of the time so we mostly saw Holly through his interactions with her. This was even the case in the last arc which is an egregious flaw.

>>6849326
He is NOT omnipotent but bringing something from point A to point B, even through REALITIES, is something he does just to get chewing gum so it makes no sense that he -can't- bring Holly back to Endtown.

I bet the real reason is "because the plot demands it" metatextual bullshit.

/co/ thread is already shit.

>>6850365
how come?

>>6850556
Shitposting, of course.

>>6757662
>Probably Marx is just going to give Doc some kind of speech on certain things being inevitable, and/or having to be done for "the Greater Good" (which will end with Doc hating Marx and Marx reflecting on being Tragically Alone again...).
>>6757985
>Next comic: Doc asks if Marx could have done/could do anything. Marx answers "Maybe..." (cliffhanger)...
>Monday: ... but not really, for reasons.
>Wednesday: Doc makes counterpoint. More reasons.
>Friday: Doc accepts or storms off. Close on Marx's final remark or reaction.
>>6759115
>Maybe since it's Doc he'll drop mention of Holly being barren from the miscarriage, since supposedly that was going to be a thing.
>>6759466
>Thinking about it: I think we're going to see Aaron have both characters agree that Holly couldn't be healed by either Doc or Wally for whatever reason, and maybe find out that Marx had told Doc about the ship ahead of time but he still has doubts.
>>6802368
>I think we're probably going to see Doc ask if Marx could have done anything, which will either be answered with a "No" and a statement of Marx's policies
>a dissection of Holly's character from Aaron's point of view

Variously accurate or close.

>>6803162
>Some kind of tease regarding Holly and then a "NOPE. She's gonna stagnate in a tin can for the rest of her life!"

I think this is pretty much what we're getting.

>>6758192
>Complete with another "I am infinite!" from Doctor Whonka.

And weirdly, we got the opposite of that.

Still getting a feeling of Marx=Aaron/Doc=Audience in this latest strip. I think Aaron may have been getting some disappointed or angry emails... I know he's even been getting pleas (and even criticism) from the GoComics people.

>>6857398

kek, that's adorable

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>>6857854
More Penny is always good

If RPG Anon is going to give up on an Endtown game, I'd like to throw my hat into the ring

Free of charge, no lawyers, no bullshit redtape. Just a humble fan project. And if Aaron wants to sue he can suck on my anonymous cock.

>>6863130
You're a bit late

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>>6860135

>>6863130
>>6863144
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9zUbKbVjWUBcDFKMjVqZEFZMlU/view
RPGanon pretty much finished it and I think this is the newest version in the link. But if you want to give it a try Endtown threads get better with more OC.

>>6863130

The joke is that the RPG was meant to be sort of ad/additonal revenue for Aaron. But best of luck. RPGAnon had a group playtesting it for over a year

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>>6863429
You can get highres images from endtown.com.

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Apparently, it's common for Aaron to receive questions about incidental characters.

So are we expecting the each page a day late until Aaron's computer troubles are over?

>>6863748

That's good that there's something, I just thought that he scrapped everything. But yeah, it is depressing to see how Aaron couldn't manage that.

>>6866570
RPGAnon's actually gonna turn it into its own thing, apparently. It sounds pretty cool. I hope all his work pays off.

Where are the sheep in Endtown?

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>>6867253
Bottom of bottom panel, Kazen also has a sheep oc

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About what we were expecting.

>>6867982

This felt a bit cruelly stretched out, honestly.

>>6868017
Felt a lot like Aaron messing with the fans that were hoping Holly would come back somehow, either now or in the future, to me. Hell, that third panel could be interpreted as "I don't care if you don't believe me on this always being the way Holly's story was going, it's how it's gone", in the context of the characters as stand ins that people have been talking about.

INB4 "The Greater Good" turns out to be something REALLY meta, like "The comic having a drama-laden plot".

>>6868130
>Felt a lot like Aaron messing with the fans that were hoping Holly would come back somehow,

are you seriously this dense? Aaron stated that holly was not coming back, this place is seriously infested with hollyfags in a state of strong denial.

> Hell, that third panel could be interpreted as "I don't care if you don't believe me on this always being the way Holly's story was going, it's how it's gone", in the context of the characters as stand ins that people have been talking about.

So, you are gonna interpret every single panel as an personal insult from now on? why are you even bothering with the comic at this point?

>>6868227
It's an entertaining trainwreck.

>>6868241
>trainwreck.

looks like it's doing good to me, besides the mediocre ending. The only people butthurt is the hollyfags who wont let go.

>>6868241
Last few weeks have certainly been interesting. Really interesting how something like this can make people step back and re-examine a larger part of a work in a more critical light.

>>6868321

>Aaron killed my waifu, the comic is shit now

literally what's happening right now

>>6868130
>INB4 "The Greater Good" turns out to be something REALLY meta, like "The comic having a drama-laden plot".

God no. That'd be awful.

>>6868241
STOP FEEDING THE TROLL, dammit.

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Merry Christmas! It may seem like a great idea at the time but gift wrapping and whiskey don't mix.

>>6868949

>He doesn't agree with me
>He must be obviously a troll!

>>6869167
Poor Allie, never has any luck.

Nice work, man.

>>6869167
Wish I could get her something to cheer her up.

New thread is up, if anyone's still interested.

>>6869507