MtG Ixalan Spoilers

>>55403742
>Slightly more versatile Alter's Reap.

Neat.

So is this incorrect, or do we finally have the tribal set with no (0) lords in it? Have MaRo's dreams finally come true, a set which undermines itself completely?

>>55403927

Merfolk have a lord. The one that gives Merfolk weak hexproof.

Lords don't always have to boost stats.

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>>55403927
>no lords
while >>55403971 has a point, there's also a regular old anthem-lord too, so you're wrong.

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If you count lords as creatures which have huge synergy with creatures of the same tribe, then this set has plenty of them.

If you count lords as creatures that gives other creatures of the same tribe a flat power/toughness increase, this set still has a couple.

>>55403774
that's some pretty good art

>>55403907
Trilobite tribal when?

Why isn't this just a crab or an insect?

>>55404089

ancient creatures, dinosaurs n shieeet

>>55404104
This made too much sense as an inclusion

>>55404174
fuck, i get it. nice flavor

>>55404174
That is a neat flavorful ability

>>55404147
Trilobite lord in Muraganda when?

>>55404025
>>55403971
Wow, an anthem lord at 7 whole mana, and a lord that isn't all that good to begin with.

You sure proved me wrong.

>>55403890
YOU CAN'T MAKE ME SACRIFICE MY DOGGO

every fucking card has some neon red/orange gradient highlight in the art

>>55404381
You're also missing >>55403984. "Bad" lords are still lords.

>>55403927
Admiral Beckett Brass?

>>55404381
> there are no lords
> here are seven lords
> exactly, no lords

>>55404174
That's pretty cool, would be nice to see on a bigger beast like the 1/7.

>>55404439
Given that "dinosaur"="big butt" before dinosaurs were even really a thing, some really generous toughness boosting for dinos would be appropriate.

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p.gud in limited

I so want to build some kind of janky Dimir Control deck with Drake Haven and Revel in Riches.

And fuck the rules, I'm going to toss my tokens around. Like hell will a Pirate deck follow some lofty rule.

Did they do away with tribal noncreature cards, like they had in Lorwyn? I liked those.

>no card named Keelhaul
>no card named Black Spot
if i don't get at least one of these in rivals i'm gonna kill a man, namely Mark Rosewater

>>55404579
Maro didn't understand the way to use them, so they got labeled as a confusing mechanic. It turns out when you just put tribal on spells that don't really have anything to do with the tribe, it makes tribal look pointless. Who knew?

>>55403690
>>55403706
These two cards have completely revitalized the card pool in limited for me.

White now feels like the best secondary colour in the set, and blue cemented itself as probably the strongest single colour.

>>55403742
Useful card. Better than it looks at first glance i would even bet.

>>55403830
Green is easily the most versatile colour this set. Fight mechanics have been the best thing to add to Greens colour flavour since the 90s, and this helps so much of the set fire for value.

>>55403890
All the keepers fantastic. I doubt I'll sac them all that often, but great critters for their costs, and Commons to boot.

From my initial take i would guess the following:
Pirates - Low powered - Aggro utility combo
Merfolk - Mid to high power - Aggro control
Vamp - Mid to high - Utility Sustain Midrange
Dino - Low to high - Ramp Midrange combo

I'm looking forward to UGr or UGw as being top colour combos this time.

Whats everyone else's thoughts?

>>55404614
I'm starting to agree with the Maro hate then.

>>55403759
That's a cute card

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Post your shitbrews. Trying to do a budget Ramunap Red because I'm cheap and don't want to throw a lot of money into Hazorets/Chandras

4x Fire Shrine Keeper
4x Bloodlust Inciter
4x Bloodrage Brawler
2x Soul-Scar Mage
3x Captain Lannery Storm
4x Earthshaker Khenra
4x Ahn-Crop Crasher

4x Shock
2x Abrade
4x Lightning Strike
2x Vance's Blasting Cannons

14x Mountain
4x Ramunap Ruins
4x Sunscorched Desert
-
3x Chandra's Defeat
2x Glorybringer
2x Abrade
2x Kari Zev, Skyship Raider
2x Sweltering Suns
2x Blazing Volley
2x Insult /// Injury

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>>55404634
>Pirates low
How about this?

Creatures appearing in art and flavortext but doesn't have their own cards
>Coatls
>Demons
>Minotaur Planeswalker
>Skeletons
>Zombies

Seriously Wizards?

>>55403742
Does pauper kuldotha/Affinity want this?

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Noah Bradly scenery

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Another Red Bear with upside

>>55404714
great vs merfolk
50/50 vs vamps
mostly bad vs dinos
Worthless vs pirates

Considering 3 of the 5 colours will have access to pirates consistently, in limited this might be bad. I would actually probably run this more often in a dino deck as another method of enrage triggering.

Until I can play the set a bit, I get the feeling its merely ok.

>>55403774
“They groaned, they stirred, they all uprose, Nor spake, nor moved their eyes; It had been strange, even in a dream, To have seen those dead men rise.”
- Samuel Taylor Coleridge, The Rime of the Ancient Mariner

>>55404614
No, they tried using them again in Innistrad, only to find it came up except with a single Zombie support card, because in order for Tribal to matter, you need to fill your set with 'when you cast an X spell' and 'search for an X card' AND 'get an X card out of your graveyard'
Otherwise it's just pointless extra text that can prevent it from being reprinted easily.
I still think it's dumb that they just outright dropped it, but it wasn't because 'it was a confusing mechanic'

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>>55404772
We also have not-Cradle in this set

>>55403774
>>55404818
I can do even better
>"Don't rattle me bones"

>>55404815
Well, a 3 mana instant Pyroclasm is still going to be overall decent, even in any red commander deck.

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>>55404745
Unlikely.
Affinity has Perilous Research in it's colors already and rarely runs the full four. Thoughcast is usually good enough. Some Kuldotha players have been favoring Battle Screech and have been cutting Rebirths entirely. Spalshing an extra color would be a hard for the deck.

>>55404819
>Otherwise it's just pointless extra text that can prevent it from being reprinted easily.

Which is why you need to only put it on cards that are flavorfully 100% that tribe and actually have a tribal mechanic built in to themselves.

That's not to say it's going to be the perfect fit all the time, but when you have a lot of cards that are Tribal for 0 reason at all, it's no wonder they would see it as pointless extra text.

>>55404891
>>55404714
39 out of 136 critters are pirates.

so 28.67% of all creatures.

and only counting uncommon and common, 27 of 96, which means most of the time in limited it won't damage.... huh, same percentage, roughly 28.12% of the enemies board.

>>55405037
You're forgetting that if you pick this card there's a good chance you cut away some of the other players' pirates too

>>55403890
Pretty fucked up, considering that one of the main ways that the conquistadors liked to kill Indians was by feeding them to their dogs.

>>55403890
Wtf did the vamps eat the dog??!

>>55405033
But then what counts as 100% that tribe? Anything that references a creature type? Beyond that?
Do they go in every set or just sets with tribal themes? Does every token making card become a Tribal card?

>>55405054
Oh i know.

But the only tribe its good against is merfolk, where it would be great. If the opponent is using dino's with enrage, or pirates themselves, this card actively hurts you.

Against vamps, it is a 2 damage spread. By itself, thats not going to kill most of their critters. Now as pirates, you want to be attacking, so yeah, you will pick up a bunch of extra targets with this.

I'm not convinced its a great card. I would use it in an enrage dino deck more often than a pirate deck. And sideboard it more often than not. Especially with the better removal cards already in the set.

>>55405092
The name has to relate to the tribe, first and foremost. Secondly, the effect of the card has to relate to the tribe. If you have a card called Dragon's Roar that costs less if you control a Dragon, that'd be a prime example. Such a card wouldn't appear outside of a set without some degree of dragon tribal going on anyway.

Token making cards are a corner case, but should generally be restricted in cases where the name is very obviously tied to that tribe or a specific plane, and the set as a whole has a tribal theme. That way, a card that creates those tokens would count as the same type while in your hand or deck, rather than just the tokens themselves on the field.

It really isn't that hard to figure out.

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I find it infuriating amonkhet couldn't have the mummy creature type since it was removed in the great clean up.


Just for Ixalan to bring back dinosaurs, oracle old cards back into dinosaurs, and give us fucking trilobite as a creature type.

So just looking at the whole set list, sealed is gonna be all about ramping into dinosaurs right? Merfolk and vampires just seem like they get mega outscaled.

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>>55405222
pun intended?

>>55405222
I would agree.

It's either going to be pirate loot fueled dino's, or merfolk ramped dino's at the top.

With Vamps coming third I think over pirates.

>>55405108
>Against vamps, it is a 2 damage spread. By itself, thats not going to kill most of their critters
Kills all the lifelinking 1/1s though

I mean, I'm still excited for sealed because treasure is gonna make splashing to 4 or 5 colors easier. The bombs you do open you can play but if you don't open any bombs to spend the treasure on its definitely gonna be rough.

>>55405222
I could see some use for Merfolk, since the combo of Blue and Green offers a mix of ramp and utility.

I would expect it to be Pirates, Dinos, and Merfolk supplemented by Dinos. I don't think Vampires and pirates have enough synergy to mix with Black there, but I could see UG trying to draw out the game as they steadily build up a bunch of big dinos.

>>55405285
Good point. Yes, that definitely is an important niche, but really just means i will take it a bit earlier in draft for my sideboard.

>>55405316
This is probably my biggest gripe with sealed. Admittedly I'm pretty shit at sealed and draft, so whenever I run into someone who got a bomb and draws it, I'm usually fucked.
Depending on how bomb the bomb is, even the best players at my store can't do shit about it.
It's a less-than-fun experience when your promo is Hazoret's Undying Fury and two of your six rares are Djeru and the other four are spread across the colors of your weakest commons and uncommons.
Then my first opponent went adorned pouncer into pride sov into anointed procession into crested sunmare, I just scooped and went home.

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Gimme gimme all the treasure

Wait, so Axis of Immortality is absolutely batshit insane. BW midrange vampires is going to be a deck for standard.

There's multiple vampires with clausless 'pay x life for effect' abilities. You're almost gurenteed a t7 win if the enchantment and your lifesink is unanswered. One lifesink gets indestructable too.

How do we build this deck?

>>55405463
These tokens are going to fuel so many "when artifacts ETB" decks. I wonder if any old affinity decks will see a resurgence in modern.

Unlikely I know.

>>55405463
What is the functional difference between

Gold/Treasure?

>>55405523
fuck ignore me. I found it.

>>55405523
Kaladesh had a mechanic called Improvise, that allows you to tap artifacts in order to reduce the cost of a spell, much like Convoke except with artifacts instead of creatures.

Imagine being able to tap your Treasure to cast an Improvise spell on the cheap, only to sac them to cast another spell. It would be far too advantageous.

>>55405553
yeah I feel foolish.

I kept thinking Gold had to tap also.

Cards available online when?

I want to get that booty and use my infinite wealth to buy my victory.

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Is there a good way to make this into a valakut win condition?

>>55405577
Treasure also has the subtype 'Treasure' whereas Gold tokens have no subtype, and are just tokens named Gold - had they used Gold anyways, all the currently Treasure-matters cards would have had to say 'an artifact named Gold/artifacts named Gold' instead of 'Treasures'

>>55405475
this guy again.

core would be
4 Adento Vanguard
4 Glorifier of Dusk
4 Axis of Mortality

Deck is Wx, but there's strong synergy in black with the vamp legendary being a really good.

>>55405594
>basic land cards
no

>>55405674
mountains aren't basic land cards?

>>55405732
Valakuts are not basic land cards, and the only win-cons in Valakut decks that have ever worked are the ones that let you search your Valakuts and your mountains at the same time.

>>55405802
true, but has there been a way to search for 5+ mountains in one instant phase on turn 4 before?

Just need some way to flood a bunch of tokens and have valakut out.

>>55405553
Wait so you can't use tokens to improvise even though they are artifact tokens?

>>55404722
We've got two more sets in this plane, plenty of time for all of that.

>>55405874
No you can use tokens to improvise.


Both gold and treasure can be used for improvise.


Its just that gold can still be sacced after that for mana, while treasure cannot (you have to tap to activate its sac ability)

>>55405874
You can use them to improvise but you can't sac them for mana on the same turn that you improvise.

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>>55404818
Already in use, sadly

>>55405866
Scapeshift
>"but Scapeshift's a sorcery"
And Settle the Wreckage in this case can only be used at one specific instance during your turn, so it may as well be a Sorcery.

>>55405874
No, he's saying you can't tap them for Improvise, THEN sac them for mana as Treasure requires you to tap to sac. Gold doesn't need the tapping and would be WAY too stronk with Improvise.

Been testing out a Dimir improvise treasure build and that shit is baller. Inspiring Statuary + Marionette Master is just cruel and unusual with all the new Treasure cards.

>>55405628
still building. I think both the 3 and 4 cost spells that give lifesteal vamps are good. The 3 drop that gives you life is also good. The wincon is combo, so all the stall, lifegain, and even trades we can get are good.

Digging for more card advantage and potential ramp at this point.

>>55404494
Grr. This is a Red ability, you fucks. Black already can kill high toughness creatures. It doesn't need help.

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How's BG looking for standard play after Ixalan?

Another Standard set with no needed reprints

Path to Exile would have made a ton of sense here, given that the entire set is based around "Ramp into dino". Pillage would have been pretty damn flavorful. But hey, what do I know, just reprint fucking Demolish for the 500th time, whatever.

>>55406050
>And Settle the Wreckage in this case can only be used at one specific instance during your turn
What? I'm not saying that card is a Scapeshift replacement but you're wrong.

>>55406406
snek will still be a thing, along with energy. Personally I think going Jund energy will be better now.

>>55406438
They're never going to reprint Path in a standard-legal set, and regret doing so in the first place.
If you were hoping for Path you were deluded.
They also haven't printed STONE RAIN since Ninth due to their stance on land destruction - why do you think they'd print something that is better than that here, just because of the name? Demolish is the best LD we're going to be getting. 3 mana LD is not something they're willing to print, and haven't been for 12 years.

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>Make a dinosaur set
>Fuck it up by adding vampires and pirates

What were they literally thinking

>>55406438
Path honestly would have been a home run for flavor here. Depict some disgraced vampire noble being sent off on an expedition to atone for his sins. It fits the themes of exploration nicely, and since only one tribe focuses on really big creatures it won't really feel too bad in many cases. Plus, for Dinos, they'd always need more mana, so even there it isn't that off.

Granted, it certainly would have been a rare if not a mythic, but it's a shame the card has a stigma for the designers.

>>55406438
Path to exile will never be reprinted in a standard legal set.


As much as I would love it, standard wont have card of that power, and I cannot imagine why you think they would reprint it.

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>>55406558
>Make a set with cool vampires and pirates
>Fuck it up by adding insanely pushed dinsoaurs

What were they literally thinking?

>>55406558
This is the "wacky exploration adventures in the new world" set that happens to have dinosaurs.

Muraganda will be the real DINOSAURS! dinosaur set.

>>55406569
Each new set spoilers you'll have some faggots sperging about why they don't print (insert old busted cards here). It's nothing new.

>>55406406
Hapatra is still pretty weak, energy is still pretty strong.

>>55406558
>>55406578
>When the set is so dope you can see both sides of the argument.
Let's all get along, guys.

>>55406558
Its not "the" dinosaur set. Murganda is the "prehistoric" plane and seems like it will have more of that theme.

The vampires in this set are great too, way different then prior vampires.

>>55403725
Not bad. Kills a dude and lets you counter a spell later. UB Decks will like it, and I suspect there will be several in Ixalan.

>>55406607
I understand. I am the same way, I want those cards reprinted more. I just understand what powerlevel wizards want standard to be, so I keep quiet about it.

>>55406613

I see. Thanks for the. Clarification

>>55403759
In a Changeling deck that abuses Dredge (for some ungodly reason), this card is straight gas.

>>55406632
A better Aphetto Dredging I guess.

>>55406623
shit like that belongs in the likes of Modern Masters and other out of rotation sets.

Yo this set looks sweet, all the good uncommon and commons were just hiding behind the fulll spoiler all along

>>55406450
How is it wrong? You can only use it when you attack with your creatures on your turn.

>>55406584
>inb4 Muraganda is just annother continent on Ixilan.

>>55406686
Where does it say that?

>>55403774
The art is gorgeous, the card is neat but they really missed a chance to print it with a cool flavour text.

>>55406708
>Exile are creatures target player controls
Now, if you're targeting your own creatures, how the fuck are you gonna get them to attack when it's not your turn?

This set looks great

>>55406708
>>55406734
*Exile all attacking creatures target player controls
sorry I accidentally words

>>55406734
I'm targeting myself, not my creatures. Does a player magically can't be targeted if he's not attacking?

>>55405178
That was partially to give more zombie synergy

>>55406735
Already ordered a Fat Pack, a Display and going to 2 pre-releases.
Hyped as fuck for that thing and won't even need to spend more money to draft in-store because my play group already has at least 2 displays that we can play in it.

I can not fucking wait for everything to release on XMage or Cockatrice and the actual release in general.

>>55406558
>Dinosaur set
where have they ever said that?

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>>55406774
Are you retarded or just trolling me? If the whole point is to use it to get lands into play, you have to target yourself WHILE YOU'RE ATTACKING!
Jesus Christ, what's so fucking hard about this to understand?!?

>>55406774
>Exile all ATTACK creatures target player controls
Good luck having your creatures attack on your opponent's turn.

>>55406438
Are you an idiot? Great reprints. Maybe the best in years.

>>55406774
If it's not your turn, your creatures aren't attacking.
Even if you're targetting yourself, on someone else's turn, then you're exiling 0 attacking creatures and thus getting 0 lands, which defeats the purpose of targetting yourself.
If you want the lands, it has to be your creatures being exiled on your turn.

>>55406550

Fuck you, your sniveling, apologetic cowtowing is what made Standard the way it is today. I hope you slip and crack your front tooth.

>>55406982
He's not saying they're right, just saying why they're not going to do it.

>>55407005
Exactly.

>>55406550
>They're never going to reprint Path in a standard-legal set, and regret doing so in the first place.
The thing is, Path would likely be fine in Standard, just as it was the first time. The reason it didn't dominate the format wasn't that people underestimated it, but because the drawback is very real in a format where most opponents are actually trying to cast six drops and can actually take advantage of the ramp you provide.

It's great in eternal formats simply because the curves are so much lower.

>>55406788

I've been waiting for them to go live on xmage just for spyglass alone. It's going to be great for any kind of chalice deck in legacy. Sideboard card, but still.

>>55407663
Not only that, but White isn't exactly that strong in the current standard meta anyway. Right now Temur energy is the big thing, and with all the new toys Blue got I don't see that changing. A lot of the White cards in this set seem to really be wrapped up in giving dinos and vampires efficient creatures.

I think Standard could handle Path right now.

>>55403774
1 mana gain 2 cards. that seems nuts

>>55407741
Yeah, and with how cheap most pirates are, odds are good you'll be able to play one pretty quickly. The card practically pays for itself if you pick something that makes treasure tokens.

>>55405475
>>55405628
>>55406089
I dig this.

>>55405463
I love the treasure.

I'm dressing up as a pirate for a thing my library is running, I'm going to see if I can get my local game stores to donate just the Treasure tokens so I can hand them out to the kiddies.

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Guy looks like Joseph Fiennes.

Real question, why is there no black green uncommon. Every set has a card for draft in each guild until now.

Has the vampire token been spoiled? I'm going to be honest, I'm just a really big fan of the vamp designs in Ixalan. Excited enough to really want to see more in the next set

>>55408794
There's also not one for WU. I think the answer is that they wanted one for each of the ten draft archetypes, so there's one for each two-color pair, which are all shared by a tribe, and then one for Grixis and one for Naya, to help fill out pirates and dinos.

Thus far the only thing those colors have going this set is Glacial Fortress and Vraska. GB is going to basically boil down to some Merfolk Pirate jank based on treasure and color fixing, while WU is gonna be stuck with trying to get value out of some of the cheap flyers.

>>55408860
So the lesson is draft red

>>55409005
Either Red or Green I'd say. Both colors as a whole seem very efficient, and offer a lot of easy places to branch out to.

>>55405092
I believe All is Dust is the card they regret making tribal but don't quote me on it. Because of that card we can't have any tribal spells ever again.

>>55405594
>swing your titans
>titans trigger on stack
>resolve trigger getting valikuts+mountains
>bounce titans
>get some basics
>titans return
>etb trigger getting more mountains and valukets
It could work but I have no clue if it would work well.

>want to play fish in standard
>they're probsbly too shit for constructed

>>55403690
Holy shit I do NOT know how to do tribal limited.

I thought it would be easier (just pick the same card types bro) but knoeing when to go for a good card and knowing when to commit to a tribe is hard as fuck.

>>55405169
The issues with tjw Tribal cars type have been known for years, they were told point blank it wasnt worth the trouble to make it in the first place but they were obsessed with the corner cases.

Tribal is an or nothing thing, once you introduce it to a set, countless things "shoukd be" tribal, but then you are adding extra text and rules nonsense for very little in game efffect.


http://podbay.fm/show/580709168/e/1417018500?autostart=1

>>55406438
Path to Exile was a mistake.

When decks are splashing white because they have the best creature kill cards, you have fucked the color pie.

>>55408794
>>55408860
WU and BG dont sync with any tribes so they dont get build arounds.

BG is explore deck, wu seems like normal tempo

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>>55409039
In the bit where he talked about why they stopped using Tribal, he actually said the Eldrazi tribals were fine.

>>55409071
>bounce
Anon have you read the card

>>55409842
He said he could imagine that being a special case where tribal could possibly return in the future. Turned out it wasn't a good enough reason.

>>55409729
Push is better then path and white is supposed to have very good removal, remember UW control? Numtg is a mistake, i want white to be a control colour again.

>>55409528
Unless you get godly picks, draft for power level / usefulness (removal, value) over simply having tribal synergy.

It is unlikely that you will end up with enough "tribal matters" cards when playing limited that it should really sway your picks.

>>55409977
>white is supposed to have very good removal
Not really, no. White is number one at mass removal, has versatile "temporary" removal (Oblivion Ring, Banishing Light), and some conditional removal (e.g. "exile target attacking or blocking creature," or "destroy target creature with power 4 or more") but is only supposed to be third best at spot removal over all.

>>55404089
Walking Sponge needed a friend?

>>55410113
White and red are supposed to be different, but both have and always had spot removal, white's spot removal costs more but is the most unconditional removal in the game, white has always had good removal, it's only lately they are only giving it conditional removal.

>>55403927
.t Retard

>>55409969
Yeah, but it wasn't the reason why like the other anon suggested.

>>55403742
>instant
Hey that's p sick
Use it to sacrifice your opponent is destroying, or one of your chump blockers

>>55409969
>>55410113
>>55410172
And regardless of other factors, Black is supposed to be the #1 Single Target Creature Kill color.

>>55410201
Wait, is it?

>>55409842

>wordier and caused more confusion

Really? Really now? That's what we're going with? "Tribal Sorcery - Zombie" is just waaaaay too wordy and confusing? Holy fuck that's dumb, like easily the dumbest thing I've heard all day and I'm currently browsing the internet.

>>55410544
Might look like Johnny Joestar with dreads and boobs if you squint until you can't actually see, in that they both have weird hats with weird accessories and full lips.

So really it looks very little like Johnny Joestar.

>>55410869
Yep. And it's also because they felt like that occasional interaction where you return a spell that makes zombies to your hand with a spell that returns zombies from your graveyard wasn't worth the one extra word.

I mean really, as though a new player opening packs is going to be more confused by a spell that's also a zombie compared to a Planeswalker or something.

>>55403927
>>55404381
Admiral Brass
The shitty stat booster for dinos
Regisaur Alpha is tribal haste lord

>>55404819
But they keep bringing one or two Curses here and there.

>>55411375
What's relevant about that?

>>55411475
>we'll keep bringing back a subtype that only mattered to a couple cards a million years ago
>but we won't bring back this supertype for not mattering enough right now

>>55411375
It's just a subtype. They're auras that are slapped on to an opponent.

>>55411538
>We'll keep bringing back this flavorful subtype that players love and requires one extra word on a handful of cards every few years
>We won't keep bringing back this card type that most people bitch about not being necessary, bitch about being there, bitch about NOT being there, think is a supertype instead of a type, and would require constantly putting otherwise pointless text on a bunch of cards (and cards to utilize them) for not much effort, while also having to teach new players that this card type does nothing in and of itself

>>55411723
It's just a supertype. They're spells that have to do with a tribe.

>>55411745
Incorrect. The supertypes are Legendary, Basic, Snow, and World. Fuck the supplemental shit.
Tribal is a type, like Creature, Land, Artifact, Enchantment, Instant, Sorcery, and Planeswalker. Tribal would, in fact, not work as a supertype.
It is a type that is neither a permanent nor a nonpermanent, and shares a list of subtypes with Creature.

>>55409071
>>55409905
Kek my bad. Nevermind it's utter trash/edh bait.

>>55411328
New player's first decks now have walkers in them.

>>55410172
Whitw having spot removal is fine, whote havinf the BEST creature kill is the issue. Path and Swords are so powerful and went with such small "down sides" it got to the point where decks wede asding white JUST because Path was the best mill spell in the format.

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>>55411806
Will wizards ever bring back snow?

>>55410869
The "zombie" part wasnt the issue, people got that, it was the "tribal" part. Stuffing the set with a weird ass rules corner case on a bunch of cards that didnt even mattee the most of the time was the issue.

You dont use up a huge chunk of a sets complexitt budget for 90% of the time trinket text.

>>55412196
Yep. So random spells having the same types as creatures even though new players probably ignore creature types half the time is too confusing, but having a special card type that behaves like no other cards, doesn't actually say how its abilities are activated anywhere on it, and can be attacked separately making attacking more complicated is starter-deck material.

Maro really knows his stuff, huh?

>>55411538
Tribal isn't a supertype.

Its a Card type with a silly rules workaround because of the way mtg handles sub types.

>>55412227
>Durr, what does Tribal mean on this Sorcery - Zombie?
>It means that it has a creature type, unlike all these other Sorcery cards

Such a strange corner case

>>55412246
Adding a word to a bunch of cards in a set that literally doesn't matter most of ths time, and that activeltly makes less sense the more sets come out, that ALSO requires some insane rules lawyering just for upsides that very rarely happen isnt worth it.

http://media.wizards.com/2014/podcasts/magic/drivetowork178_tribal.mp3

The issues with the Tribal card type have been broken down amd explained many, many times.

>>55412230
It is more that they don't want to set a precedent that anything vaguely related to a tribe is tribal because then we'd have players begging for errata for old cards and whenever something happens to not be tribal, people would push for it for stupid reasons.

Basically, Tribal was a failed experiment and not interesting enough to devote a paragraph in the "how to play" pamphlet and errata out the ass for.

>>55412309
No one who argues that Tribal is worthwhile will listen to Maro talk for half an hour. They have decided he's clueless.

>>55412311
>they don't want to set a precedent that anything vaguely related to a tribe is tribal

So tribal is bad because they already did the one thing they didn't want to do with it, which was randomly slap Tribal on non-tribal cards for no reason

>>55412309
>We had 8 tribes
>Goblins
>Elves
>Merfolk
>Zombies
>Faeries
>Elementals
>And...Kithkin!

Seems legit

>>55412311
Yeah Tribal is all or nothing.

If you make Call to the Feast a Vampire, why isnt Krenkos Command a Goblin?

If you just make the handfum of cards were it would actually matter tribal, its inconsistent.

If you make everything tribal, its massive wasted effort on whys basically trinlwt text.


Heck , take a look at Ixalan, even if it did use ths Tribal type, it would very rarely be relevent.

>>55412374
If anything that says "elf" in the effect or name is now an Elf , you have a big incosistency problem with shit like Elven Lyre, Elvish Guidance, Eyebligjt Massacre, Mercy Killing etc.

It also causes an arcane style reprinting issue, unless you make Tribal evergreen, you couldnt say, reprint Goblin Fodder anywhere if it was Tribal Sorcery-Goblin. And even if you did, you just tossed an extra mechanic into a set where it almoat certaonly doesnt mattee(because you cant make EVERY set a tribal set.)

They tried bringing back the card type in a set that actually could use it and it just wasnt worth it.

>>55412412
Kithkin actually got into Lorwyn as a fucking joke.

They were looking for a white characteristic race someone laughingly pitched Kithkin, amd boom their we were.

>>55412556
Well, it looked like they were trying to make them Magic-brand Hobbits, so I can see why they thought it might work

>>55412540
If the card has an actual tribal effect beyond just making tokens, then it won't get reprinted in a non-tribal set anyway.

Eyeblight Massacre is a card that could have been Tribal. It's flavor is specific to Lorwyn, so it's not like it'll be reprinted outside of a return block. It's effect is specific to Elf tribal. And within the set itself, you do have an elf tribal subtheme, although it only really interacts with Sylvan messenger.

Maybe I'm just not getting what's so complicated about Tribal being evergreen in that regard. Yes, it's something that doesn't matter a lot of the time, but in cases where it doesn't matter, it's quick to skip over it, and in cases where it does matter, it's more interesting to have it.

The crux of the matter is this:

It would be great to give some non-creature cards creature types. In Innistrad the absolute best example was the zombie token making sorceries. Zombies had a recursion strategy where they could return some zombie creatures from the graveyard to the hand. Adding tribal to the sorceries would allow you to return everything that made a zombie to your hand. This was awesome.

Problem: Okay, so Innistrad has lots of tribes. Are you only going to put Tribal on zombie cards? Shouldn't Moonmist become a werewolf card? Shouldn't Lingering Souls become a spirit card?

Even more, some cards don't mechanically interact with a creature or creature type but are incredibly flavored using a depiction of a certain creature. Should Awaken the Bear or Savage Punch have a bear creature type?

Really where do you stop? We know magic players want symmetry and in addition there is a complete gradient of where you choose to add creature types. Essentially you could make arguments that the majority of non-creature cards could have creature types. And when you get to that point you'd just be better off typing EVERY card.

But the even bigger problem in Innistrad was this: It really didn't matter. Making Moonmist a Werewolf really did nothing. In the vast majority of cases adding the card type didn't enable any new or interesting shenanigans. Sure the zombies loved it, but every other tribe didn't care.

And that gives you a bunch of useless text on a bunch of cards. Wizard's HATES that.

So they decided it really wasn't worth it. Sure it would be great for a few one off cards, but it just wouldn't be elegant. And if they actually did it right, by doing total buy in, it would just clutter everything up for no gain.

>>55404381
>liking the most boring kind of lord

>>55412645
It doesnt matter MOST of the time.

Which means you are adding two words to a bunch of spells with very little gameplay pay off, and you now have the issue where cards look and sounds like they should be an elf/goblin/etc. But arent.

>>55406275
red does not destroy creatures...

>>55412850
A case could be made for this specific type of creature destruction in red

>this set
We have finally lost all hope.

What's with the number of like... very slighty better commons/uncommons as rares in this set?

>>55412958
Pendulum means they printed stronger instants and sorceries this set than usual. Instant and sorceries are more likely to be commons and uncommons than rares.

>>55412649

Tribal is something that could have worked, if they'd done it from the start. Sorta like how Instant would have been (If they could go back in time) different. Instant Sorcery, Instant Creature etc.

Trying to add it now, there just is way too much stuff to retcon into being a particular tribe or to have a lot of tribes sitting about pointlessly.

>>55412067
It shits on aggro decks in standard. Can see it being run sideboard against a few hyper aggressive decks. Aggro decks dont need land, all it does is thin their deck, but if they're not running any kinda card advantage or fuel, it straight fucks them.

>>55405085
I think it's flavor wise meant to be that the dog is killed as a sentry but the rest of the camp gets time to gear up.

>>55412994
Yeah, Future Card Buddyfight has every card get subtypes.

So like "pump spell tribal" is a thing their.

>>55405899
One more set.

>>55413170

Yeah, it's too late for MTG to get into that. Which is a bit of a pity, as it could have done some interesting things with tribes. Like Elemental would have been a huge tribe in Red with stuff like Lightning Bolt.

>>55406774
Has /tg/ somehow gotten worse at magic?

>>55413213
Nah, Amonkhet spoiler season was worse for mechanical mistakes.

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How good will Walk the Plank be?

It's gonna be the promo today at the LGS. Full art version.

>>55414348
Probably standard staple of any black deck until it rotates.

>>55414368
It's not gonna see any play in modern, is it?

Sad, the art looks sweet.

>>55414380
>2 mana
>heavy color resriction
>sorcery
Nope.

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I can't get over how big this dude is, as a common creature. How do you even deal with something like this in limited? I mean, kill them before they scrape together eight mana and/or just go around for the last bit of damage, but still, holy shit.

>>55414738
Legion's Judgement, Skittering Heartstopper, and Hijack look like okayish commons.

>>55414841
I'll admit stuff exists, it's not as bad as 6/7 hexproof.

>>55414856
Some colours are definitely gonna be sad.

>>55414738
You chump it with useless 1/1s.

>>55413865
Amonkhet was very simple though. How did they fuck that up?

>>55412224
Eventually

>>55412457
I think about 4 cards would care

>>55403742
Most certainly sacrificing treasure with this.

>>55415017
People thought Embalm was instant speed, among other things. When it was pointed that it wasn't there was a whole lot of whining about how "WotC never lets us have good things."

>>55415017
There are several but the only one i can remember is people thinking Decimator Beetle can't put a counter without removing one.

Ixalan is so fucking bad holy shit

>>55415413
I fucking love it. No gatewatch, no shit story, Pirates and dinosaurs.

These cannons on ships, are they regular gunpowder-powered guns or some weird magical 'fire cannon' shit? I did not get it

>>55415463

>No gatewatch
>Jace is still there and is the central figure

It's Shadows over Innistrad all over again.

>>55415017
"New Perspectives is broken, it lets you keep the card with cycling in your hand and draw infinitely, how could WotC make such a basic mistake?"
"What? As Foretold doesn't let you cast Ancestral Visions, stop being stupid."
"Approach of the Second Sun is a horrible card because your opponent will just say you never cast it before, or that they already cast it before, and you can't prove otherwise either way."

>>55415480
They're magical projectile-launchers and not technically gunpowder-based weaponry.

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How long until Jace is spoiled to secretly be Venser the whole time? This whole repetitive mind rape thing just screams "SECRETLY YOU HAVE A BRAIN FROM JIN-GITAXIAS SO YOU CAN'T REMEMBER UNTIL THE TIME IS RIGHT!"

>>55414395
So in order to see play in modern, removal needs to be 1CMC or less, preferably hybrid, ideally colorless and instant speed?

>>55415673
>removal needs to be 1CMC
No. Abrupt Decay and Dreadbore, and even Maelstrom Pulse, see play in the format, but those hit far more things that simply not-quite-all-creatures.

>preferably hybrid
It can't cost BB without heavy upside. Sorcery speed with a downside is not playable at that cost in Modern.

>instant speed
Unless it's got some other heavy upside, yes.

>>55415557
He doesn't fucking count, he doesn't remember how shit he is.

Question. What the fuck is a Magic Open House?

>>55415673
If Walk the Plank was playable, Victim of the Night would be played in every deck running B already.

>>55415795
An event to bring more new blood into the game afaik.

>>55415819
...Then why are they giving out promos?

>>55403690
>tfw merfolk are the shittiest tribe hands down

Again, I got excited for a UG faction for nothing.

>>55416215
It feels like they just don't have enough stuff. Like they were supposed to be some spell-slinging faction but don't have enough spells that care about merfolk

>>55406558

Thise set is like a potluck of things that didnt have enough space to feel a set on their own : Aztecs, conquistadors, pirates and dinosaurs. That said, they still managed to make it feel cohesive somehow.

>>55415413
Yousir are the worsts. You have no room in your soul to ever like anything .

>>55415672
Never.
Jace was running around doing things concurrently with Venser's existence.
Tezzeret would've recognized that the two are physically identical.
Venser is not missing his brain. He's missing his spark (and his heart) - even if the Phyrexians reanimated him, he wouldn't be a planeswalker.
And, in general, Phyrexians can't be planeswalkers.

>>55415557
>>55415727
>Implying Jace alone wasn't the best part of SoI

>>55416049
To convince people to bring in newbies. Or I'd assume that's the thinking.
New people get a COOL ALTART CARD and learn the game. The person that brought them gets a promo.

I haven't been into standard in a while but after seeing Ixalan I want to make a WU flying tribal with counterspell subtheme.
Will it be able to get off the ground?

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My Jund senses are tingling.

>>55416550
Hazorat's Favor and maybe two Hijacks.

>>55413213
By his english, I would say he's just not very smart.

>>55416549
I think there are enough good flyers, and Ixalan brought some nice counterspells and that enchantment to buff flying creatures. Some sort of control spell based around whittling them down from the air could work, but it might be a bit too cumbersome compared to other control options.

I'm considering playing prerelease for this set. What do you guys figure is an okayish color combo?

I'm really digging the legendary enchantments transformations. Green looks pretty good for limited.

>>55403725
Limited all star. Pick it highly and use it to help with splashing bombs in your controlling 3.5 color deck.

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>>55416594
I like the way you think. I also can't wait to shoot some monkeys out of a cannon.

>>55403806
>"STOP TOUCHING MY CREATURES" the card

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My big gripe is that WotC is purposely trying to create no interactions with the old tribal typed cards.

Sylvan Messenger, a reprint, interacts with tribal typed cards.

Gnarlroot Trapper, a new card, does not interact with tribal typed card, because the creature clause.

In fact, many of the pre-Lorwyn "tribal" cards didn't have a creature clause attached to them.

>>55403774
welcome aboard mateys

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>>55414738
>being impressed by biggies in 2017

Brontodon is hardly playable

>>55416803
>Complain that Tribal is a bad type because it doesnt matter enough
>Make random clauses that make tribal matter even less

Amazing how adding creature under that ability is utterly extraneous and wastes space in the set for a non-functional clause, but adding Tribal to the one Elf-specific sorcery in the set would have been too narrow for only mattering for those cards.

>>55416953
He's speaking strictly in terms of limited.
Not that many limited games go past turn 8

>>55405178
I'm fine with not giving them the mummy type.
But i agree with everything else. Fucking hell.

>>55406584
>>55406703
I'd be fine with that as long as they drop the mayan thematic.

will ixalain make it worth it to play standard again? a lot of the cards and decks look to be pretty sweet

>>55417784
no

>>55417784
Absolutely not

>>55416049
https://magic.wizards.com/en/event-types/magic-open-house

>>55416301
3/4s of those are inherently attached though.

You cant have Conquistadors without aztecs, and the golden age of piracy was built off the spanish new world empire.

>>55417784
If anything it looks like standard will be devolving into mono-midrange again.

>>55418073
We have The rdw as an aggro deck

And Nayasaurs as a ramp/combo perhaps control build.

Also pirates as disruptive aggro.

>>55404174
Nice visual image with it attacking with vigilance, and then "swinging" it's tail for that extra one damage into something in its way.

>>55403690
I just wanted to see some natives getting fucked up in the art. My wish didn't come true.

>>55414738
Look at the card right above this?
Also, a mana leak would kill that thing, no one's waiting til 11 mana to play it. Doesn't have trample, so- It swings, opposing player chumps it with a 1/1 then swings on the owner, because his big blogger is tapped, just gotta leave a 1/1 open to chump.

Even timmy wouldn't be in awe of this. It needs Trample or something.

>>55418239
Raider's Wake and Bloodcrazed Paladin have some of that.

They might have though Smallpox would have been a bit too on the nose.

>>55418239
I still have hope for art of some priests converting the local population.

>>55403890
Huh, shitty Squadron Hawk. Nice.

It doesn't fly or search up more copies of itself but makes up for it by costing one less, having first strike, and becoming larger in the late game.

>>55418299
Like they did in Alara, we will see Vampire Pirate among other converts.

>>55416666
Nice quads you foul demon.

>>55415810
Victim of night just matches super badly since zombie happens to be a relevant enough creature type (gurmag angler)

>>55418404
As is Merfolk.

>>55403725
assassinate with benefit, i like it

>>55418431
A card being dead against one deck is acceptable. But there are just enough decks that randomly have zombies or vampires as part of the creature base that victim is just a sad card.

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>>55416420
>>55416420
>>55416420
>need to bring someone new and register a DCI so the person and I each get a promo
>bring wife, register her name, free promo for us yay
>wife ends up having 3-4 DCI numbers from us doing this

Not even sorry, wotc.

>>55415810
Victim of the night is already played in some decks, walk the plank is better, hits everything relevant and wouldn't be a bad as a 2 of to sideboard out against merfolk and even there it could be used a counter fodder vs kira.

>>55418466
I applaud this shameless fleecing given how badly they've mismanaged a once great game.

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>>55418306
But we actually have a shitty Squadron Hawk in this set.

>>55418466
Damn, why didn't I think of that. I need to start using my wife in this correct manner.

>>55418520
Its still a pretty good effect. Its a perfectly average card for what it is. Monstrous in limited if you build your deck right.

>>55404064
agreed
feels like drudge skeletons

>>55418192
Extra three damage. Just because it's doing three with its ass doesn't mean it's not still doing two with its face.

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>>55415673

>>55418780
Not only that, but it's done as a super-first strike, since you can tap it after everything is declared

>>55406558
Think of this as Skull Island, not Jurassic Park.

>>55418528
>using your wife incorrectly
For shame.

>>55415128
will wizards ever bring back artifact lands?

So is anyone excited about mtg arena, or are people just annoyed with how they're doing it? Seems like a cash grab trying to be the next hearthstone. And not incorporating the first 20ish years of magic cards just so they can control it better and justify not giving the people on MTGO the cards on the new platform because otherwise people wouldn't play MTGO if arena was just better MTGO. This way its different and thus they make more money and people just get annoyed unless they're new to magic and don't care about old cards.

>>55419273
I played magic origins for a while once. Impossible to make a functioning deck without shilling out and even if you did, you'd get bored of it halfway into getting enough decks. Not making the same mistake again

>>55419273
I'll probably play digital drafts for free because I am a sucker. Not sure I'll care about standard constructed.

I'd sacrifice a goat for other format support, even with an initially limited card pool. Pauper/Peasant/EDH would be welcome.

>>55412224
MaRo considers it a mistake, so I doubt it.

>>55419400
MaRo considers everything a mistake these days

>>55419326
Don't know how I feel about pauper or EDH if they only do new cards. So many iconic cards for those formats that basically make them what they are and make them fun. They could certainly do Arena versions of the formats but they would feel so different. I feel like this move just alienates the player base for magic. They should have just made arena new online that's prettier and better made and let people keep the cards they had for online when transitioning to arena. Then it would truly be magic's hearthstone but people wouldn't mind too much if online died but they kept their inventory here. I'm interested to see what they do for pricing of cards on it. Will be a fun standard draft engine though.

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This is what I got for free today.

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What the fuck is this die for?

>>55419423
The way Wizards is keeping Online but introducing Arena, they want to have their cake and eat it too. They really want Arena to be visible, popular, easy to use so people play it and show it off, and get new people playing the game as well.

But they're keeping Online because they still want to fleece those poor bastards for more money.

>>55419468
Counters?

>>55419468
Counters....

>>55419494
It's only 1,2,3 and the HoD symbol.

>>55419468
It's a DBolas made of Lazurite, of course.

If it dies you can eternalize it.

>>55419517
Brick counters!

>>55419477
They also don't want the massive outrage turning modo off would cause.
"Hey, you threw an absolute shitload of money into this, you can now fuck off." is not something they want to be saying considering just how much money's been sunk into it.

>>55419521
>>55419528
I have no idea what you guys are talking about.

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>>55419583
At pre-release HoD I used mine for this.

>>55419583
It's a d4 you could get from completing challenges at the prerelease. Like the prerelease d20 which had the set symbol in place of the 20, it has the set symbol in place of the 4.

It's a d4.

>>55419600
>>55419610
So they gave me something I will never need? Nice.

At least I will get another die at the prerelease next week.

>>55419649
+1/+1 counters. -1/-1 counters. Charge counters.
It's a nifty pyramid-shaped die in fancy colors they gave you for free, and you're bitching about it.

>>55419427

Si ma paga le bollette

>>55419273
There's going to be no trading again, so except for a few free games vs the computer, i don't see it being popular.

>>55419714
Top kek.

It's my bike's insurance, it's gonna expire in October.

>>55404784
Was someone wanting a sexy female pirate.

>>55419427
>>55419468
>Bologna
Did you go to Goblin or Games Accademy for your open house?

The dice is d4. Il numero estratto è sulla punta

>>55403890
>Cats get strong cats in all formats and a Commander deck and the best Planeswalker
>Dogs get a dog that you are rewarding for getting rid of, possibly to empower some cats, that isn't even a dog.

Wizards vendetta against the Baha Men continues apace.

>>55420076
>Bologna
Dove? Ah, no quella è la sede delle assicurazioni, credo.
Io sono di Bolzano.

>>55419468
it's a really nice d4 that can be used for counters or for fancy d4 spells in DnD

>>55404174
>Armasaur
>Four legs

What the fuck I hate Dinosaurs now.

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So... the Story will be about how Vraska ended up falling in love with Jace after all their adventures in the jungle?

>>55420390
Also, what does the "planeswalker symbol" watermark in the Textbox mean?
some cards have that... are suppose to be story heavy or what?

>>55420410
Yep.

>>55419427
What is in that Box with the dino on it?

>>55420390
I assume she just needs his magical support to help get whatever treasure/goal she's looking for on Ix.

Remind me what went down between them in Ravnica 2: Electric Boogaloo? Just Jace was investigating some weird killings and shit that she was involved with because assassins and then he got distracted with Guildpact/Maze bullshit?

>>55420540
>Guildpact/Maze bullshit

Help a lorepleb out. What is this Guildpact shit? Is Jace a wizard or just a mage? And since Planeswalkers can bring clothes with them between planes, could Bolas carry his entire Eternalized army in the pockets of an enormous duster?

>>55420614
>could Bolas carry his entire Eternalized army in the pockets of an enormous duster?
Don't think so. It seems like that's why Bolas was interested in the Planar Bridge which was invented on Kaladesh, however the Planar Bridge got smashed up pretty good and the Gatewatch talked to the inventor about how big a threat such a object is.

>>55420000
Yeah, that was me, quadsman. You find one, you let me know.

What's the best way to try out Ixalan sealed online?
Haven't played in a while, I'm not really up to date.

>>55420508
It's the box where they put everything.

>>55420650
Tezzeret managed to grab the most important component - the original device itself, the rest was an amplifier for it - before walking away.
He can build another amplifier.

>>55420650
Or the Planar Bridge was just a red herring to keep the Gatewatch from ruining the Australia/Orcs/Trilobites/Anthropomorphic Food/Tailors themed plane where Bolas is getting his coat made.

File: i needa the bootay.jpg (57KB, 599x675px) Image search: [Google]

57KB, 599x675px

>>55403875
good with t1 ornthopter for a booty deck? dowsing dagger and inspiring statuary for more ramp too.

also would panharmonicon be worth it to double treasure ETB creatures?

>>55420614
I'm pretty sure Bolas could. You can carry a lot between planes as long as it's not super alive. Artifact creatures, seeds, presumably eggs...I don't see any reason some weird rocky zombies would be excluded, though i suppose it depends on how much soul they still have with them. Granted, I'm also not sure if Bolas couldn't just stab them with a soul-stealing dagger and then carry that and a corpse with him.

It's very loose and unclear, but the main result is that planeswalkers can't take people or pets with them.