Exalted General

>>55362150
>What non-weapon artifact are you most excited to see in 3e?
I'd love to see an artifact ship, carriage, a mount made of magical materials or something like that. I seem to recall Vance mentioning that there will be a ship on the Arms, so that's definitely something I'm looking forwards to see.

>>55362227

Oh wow there'll be an Artifact ship? Now that I'm interested in seeing.

>>55362227
>will be a ship on the Arms
Air, land, or normal?

>>55347735
ES seems to have a view of Exalted that's so bleak it's reached the point of parody I still love this from Terrifying Argent Witches because it's like something from Robot Chicken.
"The last of the alaun was impaled upon all five Elemental Poles at once."

>>55364875

I honestly really like the bleak parts of Exalted. It's sort of the point that "Wow, this setting is actually REALLY AWFUL for anyone except the Exalted."

One difference between D&D and exalted players online (the latter is mostly from SV), is that in my experience the former is more willing to talk about things you can do with the system.

D&D 3.5 is broken, but people know that and it doesn't stop them from making ideas with it.

With Exalted, it isn't the same.

Suppose you were thinking of how to solve a problem in a Clever way.
Like this:
you are being chased by a group of orcs, and
you go to a cliff, but the bridge has fallen apart.
You cast wall of iron to make a crude bridge, then use invisibility on the bridge so the orcs wont try to follow you.

The people on a dnd forum says "that's nice".

The Exalted group, complains that Wizard is the most broken class and the game is terrible and that you should remove it from the game. Even if the wizard isn't actually breaking anything.

You see this if you bring up something like the eclipse anima power. Even if you aren't breaking something, they don't like it.

>>55365198
because they fags

>>55365198
It's because D&D is for min-maxing autists.

Literally.

D&D, especially in his 3.5 and 3.75 edition, is a nightmare of a system that has created his own cult following of Asperger teens trying to routinely break or min-max it. Why are classes guides so popular? Why is min-maxing so popular? D&D has a very vibrant culture of low-spectrum autists that like it exactly because it is easily broken, incoherent, and too complex for what it does.

Most Exalted fans derive no particular pleasure trying the break or master the system, in large part because it is so open-ended. They like creating cool builds or cool MA or interesting new charms, but won't sperg on it.

There are still autists in Exalted's fandom, don't get me wrong but the proportion is largely smaller (only 10% of autists? Something like that).

>>55365198
>eclipse anima power

But the eclipse anima power has actively made the game worse.

It's why we have shit like the Lunar's charmset being dull: Because it's writer designed the charmset so that Solar's could take charms from it without harming their own thematics, and knacks are there to shove all the interesting bits into so Solars can't grab it.

>>55365198
>Even if you aren't breaking something
it ruined many things in two editions before the devs finally thought of reigning it in. see:Knacks

Impaling the last Alaun on all the Elemental Poles at once skips past "dark" for me and into really silly because of the sheer logistics involved. I actually laughed out loud the first time I read it.

>>55366238
Mountain folks a bestest.

Lintha a best.

Dragon-king a okay.

Alaun a shit.

>>55366238
You just have to use weird, metaphysical effects! It's no weirder than Sidereal Martial Arts.

>>55365643

>D&D is easily broken, incoherent, and too complex for what it does.

This applies to exalted as well.


>Exalted is so open-ended.

This applies to D&D as well.

>>55366333
It's just that in context there's no real justification for it and OOC its clearly the Infernal fans influence on TAW

>>55366351
t. D&D autist

>>55364875

Any info on the fallen races and the First Age?

I have this Idea in my mind:

A campaign where the Empire crumbles because one of the fallen Races returns in full force. The PCs are Solar Exalted sperging around in an Independent City State at the start. They do whatever the fuck they like but the power Vacuum the falling Empire leaves behind will soon reach them. And then they have to deal with the advancing fallen race eventually...

Then they have to find First Age stuff and are confronted with their former selfs from the First Age and their sins.

Optional: If the Fallen Races alone aren't threatening enough : They are the Puppets of Abysals or Infernals

>>55365751
>>55366047

The point of the eclipse charmshare power is to learn charms from other sources. It's obvious that some god/ghost/demon is going to have a different theme to it's charms than solars.
Mixing thematics is a basic consequence of it.

So why does that mean Lunar charms have to be dull?

In addition there is a difference between the ability and a specific usage of the ability.

Charmshare is broken from a game-balance stand point because of stuff it gives access to.
This does not mean that all uses of Charmshare are broken.

If an Eclipse caste Solar learns the "Host of Spirits" variant that allows him to summon a pillow, that isn't exactly gamebreaking.

>>55366468

What does the "t." in "t. <group> autist" thing stand for?

>>55366831
Scroll of the Fallen Race has information on the Jadeborn and the Dragon Kings. That's pretty much it. Neither of those races is going to topple the Realm, though.

>>55366333
you don't even need that. the alaun had very long necks. VERY VERY VERY long ;)

>>55367098
>So why does that mean Lunar charms have to be dull?
it is literally the answer the lunar writer gave for the separation of all shapeshifting into knacks rather than it being spread through the charmtrees. "gotta quarenteen this bullshit so solars can't take it and go off theme, or steal the lunar-shapeshifting splat feature"

>>55367133
Terveisin, or with regards or smt

>>55367553
Why not just make shapeshifting Charms non-Eclipse?

>>55367616
Because they didn't want to damage Solar Specialiness by saying that Lunars had charms the Solar's couldn't learn.

>>55367715
I think it's more that having to go 'Eclipse-No' over and over again puts a dent in your overall word count. At least with Knacks they could be billed as a unique Lunar power in addition to charms like Astrology was for Sidereals.

>>55367616
native didn't exist as a keyword until the infernals book iirc

so you get these weird and inconsistently kludge workarounds for everybody else.

Personally I'd have liked to see something like the "enhanced" keyword inkmonkies used to make solar herostyle extra special to solars. so eclipse could learn something LIKE the lunar's charm but lesser and stripped of all shapeshifting the lunar native version makes use of.

>>55367810
Just not having charmshare is a much more elegant solution, though.

>>55367810
and like fiends and the holy keyword, eclipses could learn charms that consisted solely of shapeshifting only to gain access to things they are a prerequisite for

>>55367860
it is. but we're talking about 2e where charmshare was established as a thing in the first book and there was nothing the lunar's writer could do about that.

(which is why eclipse charmshare is a terrible thing that had to die (or at least be hobbled and castrated like in 3e))

problem with charmshare is that it often fuels this weird mindset that seeking out broken mechanics is on a par with clever choices made in-character.

It's just a bit of google fu to find some of this crap assuming you're not willing to straight up ask for it.

>>55367133
It's the Finnish equivalent to "Regards", pretty sure /pol/ memed it into general 4chan parlance a while ago.

>>55365198
You can't explain to these people that the concept of an idea is good and you can re-work systems around it. They think a poisoned mechanic is a poisoned idea. The Exalted fanbase is incredibly simplistic online. You'll get used to it.

>>55368169
The thing is that the concept of this particular idea isn't actually good.

>>55365198
uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

I've seen lots of people use charms in a clever way. There's a difference between doing things cleverly and abusing a poorly thought out feature to completely assfuck the thematics of a game or world.

>>55368296

There is a difference between thematics ruining and game balance ruining.

If we are talking about thematics, complaining about the Eclipse caste power is kind of weird.
It has been there since the beginning.

File: 7q3ujTH.jpg (48KB, 500x565px) Image search: [Google]

48KB, 500x565px

Do exalts use the bathroom? I need to know for science.

>>55368526
eclipses being the best at (X) because they can buy the best charms belonging to other exalts is stupid. It goes in the same bin as Twilights being better warriors than dawns. I like the current formulation of the eclipse tag a lot better, and if anything once some spirits get made and there's a variety of Eclipse-tagged effects to choose from it'll better encourage the kind of creativity you want.

>>55368528
Do angels use bathroom?

>>55368528
They don't call it a golden shower for nothing.

>>55368528
everyone except Alchemicals and some Infernals leading theory is that they're androids and should be destroyed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQTW7Pd1vqc

>>55365198
Actually what draws my entire LGS to this is that exalted is the closest thing you can ever get to Jojo's Bizarre Adventure or Hunter x Hunter and other power based anime like it without rebuilding them directly in GURPS.

Nobody is invulnerable, full stop. No set of charms makes you immune to all comers, no set of charms in any one splat makes you immune to literally everything every other splat can throw at you.

You can take everything in the solar resistance, integrity, and similar trees, and you will -still- get nailed by that one Lunar or Infernal or Fae who has built themselves around taking you down.

Hell, it's canonical that the greatest danger the high first age faced wasn't the primordials or the fae or even the other exalted.

It was the single primordial who fled creation into the deepest parts of true chaos, and used that to utterly reforge himself into an entity that existed purely to beat the solar exalted. Each of his component souls was built around getting around the various possible builds he had seen the solar exalted employ, he was the primordial of war and terrible victory. They still beat his face in and threw him out but it caused way more casualties than anybody was reasonably expecting. The usurpation can only happen -because- this stuff is true, and the Sidereals learned the strengths and weakenesses of every single Solar and Lunar, and then built kill teams specific to them. The Lunars only survived because they are the adaptation splat and most of them weren't even at the feast of 300 knives.

Exalted is the setting where no matter how much you min max yourself, there's always going to be at least one guy with the technique that can take you down HARD, no matter how massive a bulkward of utter badassitude you make.

>>55369580

Plus, even if you defend yourself from MOST things, you instantly make yourself pretty much useless at actually doing anything except defending yourself. Every solar, every exalt, has to split his time between actually making himself good at doing things, and watching his back.

>>55368526
just because it is old doesn't make it good. there is something very wrong when your dawn player rolled a twilight for that tanky anima and because dawns are shit(zenith or night have better caste attributes for a fighter than the fighter caste), or when your mad research-wizard twilight would kill for the eclipse anima because it lets her learn all the things.
...or when literally anybody else wants to be an eclipse because they are absolutely the best at anything because they can take the charms of other exalts.

dawns having all the weapons filling up their caste abilities was also in 1e but nobody cries about the more flexible caste abilities fixing that (or about the supernatural system changing the way charms work to make dawns favoring all the weapons work as intended in 3e).

besides, the oath binding and ancient diplomatic immunity/contacts alone is A loads more thematic and B a complete anima power in and of itself. the crossplat charms was only ever an excessive dollop of gravy on top.

>>55370124
(and of course all that stuff about no longer having to worry about it when making other splats)

Eclipses being diplomats never really was borne out by their mechanics, except for their immunity anima power. including the charmshare made them read more as "The most Mary of Sues" in first or second edition. So it even /harmed/ the Eclipse thematics, making them more about traveling the world bargaining for more and stranger personal powers which feels far more warlock/twilight.

>>55370454
honestly the deal making anima power worked too, and they work as diplomats if you see them in terms of "Diplomats don't actually make the decisions, they bring the word of their superiors"

their job isn't necessarily to convince the other side to agree, their job is to make sure all the beuracratic nonsense doesn't get in the way of making the agreement, and to deliver the messages of their lords. Even the socialize ability set is about detecting lies more than convincing people (IE: knowing if somebody is worth dealing with, but that's kinda hilarious given in 1e the eclipse Swan was totally cool with working with Mask of winters but the zenith panther wasn't, when Panther should have had the lower MDV)

Would you rather have awareness or athletics favored as a steriotypical fighty dawn?

>>55370683
Awareness, 100%. I'd buy Athletics too, just as noncaste nonfavored.

>>55368296

Why does it mess up the thematics?

>>55370803
Things like the Eclipse anima in old editions made Eclipses the best caste for pretty much anything, because they could snipe the best charms from other exalts, or stack things that shouldn't have been stacked. It means that your character would probably be better as an Eclipse, regardless of your concept.

It's proof positive that more options isn't always better.

>>55370803
>>55370454

>>55362150
>What non-weapon artifact are you most excited to see in 3e?
I really want to see consumable "artifacts," like potions/alchemy, or maybe some spellbomb-like items. Basically, I want something for my Craft Supernal to be useful in combat.

>>55366351
>This applies to exalted as well.

I don't know, amigo. At least in Exalted, everyone is equally nuts instead of D&D's Casters raping Martials right out of the gate.

>muh eclipse
just banish it from your game dude

>>55370973
do you completely not understand the context of this conversation. can you even read.

>>55371013
>eclipse is broken buaaaaaaa
just ban, if something is making the game unfun or its broken then ban from the table till the devs fix it you dumbtard

>>55371102
Dude. The problems already been solved circa 3e. The conversation is about how Eclipse charmshare was one of the problems of the prior edition, did not work well with the thematics,and generally made the edition overall worse.

Why do you call people dumbtards when you don't read the conversation at hand.

>>55371102
1 this problem is already fixed in 3e
2 banning wouldn't help, the damage to other splats is already done whether charmshare is houseruled away or not

>>55371126
do you know there are ppl who play 2e and still complain right?

Continuing in this vein: Critique this idea.

>Strip the Eclipse charmshare
>Give it to all Solars w/ a caveat
>They can only Mirror a charm which falls into their caste's abilities

Would this be a better alternative to just banning the Eclipse charmshare?

>>55371344
I'd just do what 3e does and let the player learn "safe" and vetted charms from spirits desu.

>>55371370
Yeah. I think that the main fuck-up was not providing delineation between what you could learn and what you shouldn't learn. Hopefully this means no more implied Charm fuckery to accommodate the Eclipse's BS.

>character learned of Solar fuckery and corruption and shit from a God
>Exalts from contemplating how they fucked totally up
Zenith or Eclipse?
The message spreader or the one who can spread the message?

How might one go about backporting supernaturals to 2.5e? I was thinking "choose one caste ability and learn it's charms as if you were essence 6(until you actually hit e6 at which point this perk vanishes)" but i get the feeling this sets things on fire in some unnoticed way.

Followup question, how would you go about powering up the other splats so they're not just even more shit compared to solars than they already were? I was thinking "lunars automatically have all the knacks that exist just to expand their heartsblood targets, and automatically get the charms to suppress tells and hide tattoos" and "infernals treat their caste/favored/urge yozi charms as if their essence requirements were one essence lower(pick 2 of the three)" as a slightly different version of the solar/abyssal supernatural. But don't know what to do for dragonbloods and sidereals.
I had planned on leaving alchemicals as they are to put them a little closer to terestrial level.


ALSO

What breaks if I take away the scourge's ability to suppress their anima and give them a(n optionally activated) anima flux like dragonbloods have. Move the ability to suppress the anima like a night caste to fiends, and give the fiend's oath binding and breaking to malefactors? (cross splat charms goes to defilers, but is then deleted because cross splat is ass. I made the eclipse version spirit charms only and restricted moonshadows to arcanoi, and then gave all twilight-oids three free degrees in thaumaturgy) https://pastebin.com/a8tFdJsV

Follow up question does the scourge's new anima flux require beefing up and if so how should I do it?

disclaimer, I haven't played infernals and so would have to review their charmtrees

>>55371196
Yes. And you would know that we weren't talking about or really being the people who still play 2e and complain if you READ THE CONVERSATION UP TO THIS POINT.

Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

>>55371196
You're missing the point.

File: 1504787181976.jpg (10KB, 252x276px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 252x276px

>>55371610
Are you high

>>55371642
>>55371637
i was saying for the ones who play 2e you two fucking autists
>implying you two arent the same fag

>>55371589
Either works, but you don't have to limit yourself to Solars with that sort of concept.

Is this game as convoluted as the general would suggest or does it make more sense once you've stopped being a lazy bastard and actually read the book?

>>55371701
It makes sense quite fast if you give it a go

>>55371701
>>55371732
3e that is, don't touch 2e.

>>55370934

Wasn't a "Solars >everyone else" an intended part of Exalted 2es design?*
*which is a bad thing.

File: 5c027012ff0a7084bc0473014221945c.jpg (129KB, 686x960px) Image search: [Google]

129KB, 686x960px

Autochthon, Law of Diminishment, Alchemicals.
What would you say if it was hinted that Alchemicals pushed Autochthon's sickness further and made it worse?

>>55371701
2e is completely impenetrable for newcomers, would not recommend. There's so much content, meaningless details and contradicting material that it's impossible to form a coherent view of the world, even without taking into account all the stuff that came out of the Ink Monkeys and Infernal wanking.

3e kinda sucks in a few regards, but I'd always recommend it for newbies trying to get into the game.

>>55371610
Also, thoughts on this modified bond background?
https://pastebin.com/RJqUgN48

or this modification to the "lunars gain limit when they see the full moon" mechanic? https://pastebin.com/eXftawHM

>>55371674
maybe, whwy?

>>55371781
Already been dismissed by word of god. They said that it would be completely antithetical to the entire point of Exalted except for, perhaps, Abyssal and Infernals.

The GMs can run with it if they like, but it'll never be directly stated as a thing in the setting, because it would be the ultimate fuck you to alchemical players "The world would be a better place if you never existed".

File: thankyou_01.png (488KB, 750x547px) Image search: [Google]

488KB, 750x547px

>>55371732
>>55371749
>>55371819
Thanks anons.

>>55371701
Yes. It doesn't start making sense
>>55371781
I would say that idea is retarded. His sickness is just a part of his nature not because he was dumb enough to make exalts without planning for the side effects. This
>>55344961
Is why he is sick.

>>55371885
>>55343132

>>55371819
>2e is completely impenetrable for newcomers
Newcomer here. Maybe if you're retarded or talking about super optimization. Basics and making something decent is doable with even slight understanding of dicepool systems.

>>55369580

It's funny because that was hilariously untrue for 2 entire editions. You had rock solid, unbreakable defenses, and anyone who didn't ate shit, and you had no way around them at all unless you could out-mote them, which a good portion of the time simply was impossible.

>>55371824
Or this on Familiars?
https://pastebin.com/fMBJ5Sij

2e is a pain for how much of the books that has been rejected by the fanbase or deliberately overwritten by later books.

>>55371943
only if you were direct attacking. There were totally folks you couldn't beat in direct offensive attacks, but perfect defense wouldn't work against social attacks, or if you did shit like throw them across creation without damaging them so that they ended up inside of the pole of fire and had to walk their way back across all of creation, or even a few things like dumping them into elsewhere.

You only ran into the 'impenetrable defense' thing if you were entirely focused on actual combat.

>>55372055
>perfect defense wouldn't work against social attacks

Luckily, I have the best perfect social defense of all: Roll join battle. In 2e you weren't allowed to talk and fight at the same time

>>55372055
>f you did shit like throw them across creation without damaging them so that they ended up inside of the pole of fire and had to walk their way back across all of creation

Pretty sure that involved an attack/could be perfect dodged.

>>55372055
>but perfect defense wouldn't work against social attacks

Social perfect defenses existed.

>or if you did shit like throw them across creation without damaging them so that they ended up inside of the pole of fire

That certainly would constitute an attack by most reasonable people, which would result in the perfects nulling it.

>or even a few things like dumping them into elsewhere

And how were you going to do that?

>>55371773
It's been an intended part of the design of all editions, but the problem has always been execution, not theory. It's like, yeah, Solars can have mastery of martial arts, the highest level of sorcery, can draw out the strongest evocations from any magical material, they can have ridiculous power even at Ess 1 thanks to Supernals, and add more dice than anyone to their rolls...

But in practice, in most games, you're only going to be able to afford having overwhelming power /in your area of expertise/. You're going to be Unbeatable Sword guy, Unbeatable Diplomacy guy, or Unbeatable Sorcery guy, but only one of those. You can try to be able to do all things at the same time, but you'd be half-assing it, sacrificing depth for width. Given arbitrarily large amounts of time and experience, Solars will be the best at everything, sure, but no game should have such a thing as an almighty bored Exalt dude.

Ideally the other Exalt types should have their own stuff that made them good. Dragon-bloods use elemental powers, Lunars shapeshift and take new forms, Sidereals have more information and planning on their hands than anyone, and so on - those are cool concepts that can be as cool as Solars, without compromising how they're the strongest. The problem has always been bad execution. Lunars are thematically incoherent; Sidereals have great charms, but it's a closed set; Abyssals are just Solars painted black, and the less said about Infernals the better.


>>55371781
It makes sense, but only as a retroactive explanation.

>>55372199
>>55372178
>>55372143
pretty sure you guys can't do -all- of those things simultaneously even with a really nice combo, which, again, is how the usurpation went down, cause they couldn't defend against everything at once and they ended up getting nailed with it.

>Open 3e CRB
>Look at all this cool shit we're mentioning!
>Creation chapter
>btw we only statted one of those things

>finding out the daystar and Nyssela are gone in 3e

Damn it, I could have lived without the super gundam deathstar, but Nysella was genuinely one of the better written gods.

>>55371610
typo: essence 5 not six. and infernals' perk is also capped at 5.

and looking at lunar charms: the heartsblood options for supernatural stuff is not included in that, I forgot those existed

>>55372663
Maybe she's his handmaiden in heaven?

>>55372663
>personal headcanon is that the dirigible of day is just the core of a giant solar-essence elemental thing curled around it. The Dawnstar is actually a giant plasma chow that curled itself up around it's core and is taking a nap while waiting for UCS to come back and give it ear scratchies.

do solars not have a "i don't need to sleep" charm?

>>55373208
yes

>>55372663
she's the goddess of righteous ideals, there's plenty of scope for her to exist without the Daystar

File: 1451790018116.png (5KB, 255x253px) Image search: [Google]

5KB, 255x253px

Rate my character idea: self hating Solar.

Born as a twin with a brother who later exalted into a dragon-blooded, to a well off family in the East.

One day their farm gets raided by a group of DB outcastes, MC rushes in a little bit after his brother to find him getting beaten pretty badly. MC runs in, facing what is nearly a guaranteed death, and exalts. After all the bandits have been gutted MC realizes that he's glowing yellow, his family's huddled in the corner looking more than scared shitless and his brother's pointing his daiklaive at him looking pissed as hell. Rather than kill him, his brother gives our new Solar a chance to run, even though (he thinks) that a demon has just eaten his soul and is now gonna run around doing Bad Shit™ with his body.
Solar absconds, has an identity crisis over whether or not he's the same guy as the farmer he was yesterday, blah blah game starts in a tavern where's he getting shit-faced drunk trying to forget what he is.

>>55374132
If you're off in the east enough that your family has a farm, they probably aren't devout followers of the immaculate doctrine. Also, if there are a group of DB Outcastes in the area, they probably have better things to do than raid a farm. Like, knock over the local kingdom or something.

File: 1460281090678.png (137KB, 526x436px) Image search: [Google]

137KB, 526x436px

>>55374226
I dunno the lore extremely well, my man. Is there any kind of group out there that would be able to fuck up a lone dragon blood but still be petty enough to torch his farm after killing his family? I'd think fae but I think a fae raid would probably end with the MC as an abyssal, not a solar.

how to calculate alchemical maximum charm slot count?

>>55374274
You are honestly more likely to survive a Fae Raid than an equal number of Outcaste DBs desu.

>>55374274
>a fae raid would probably end with the MC as an abyssal, not a solar.

One of the canon Zeniths exalted during a Fae raid

She's also the daughter of one of Lookshy's Chiefs of Staff, and sister to three DB brothers so its closer to your character idea than you imagine

>>55374132
Would need to be in the north or south or maybe the west. East is not a fan of the Realm.

Or he's part of Lookshy, in which case you'd be part of the military families not the helots.

File: 1454225282881.jpg (24KB, 236x234px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 236x234px

>>55374391
Oh shit, I had no idea. That's pretty rad.

>>55374285

Alchemicals can have infinite charms slots

>>55374802
huh. weird. I had thought I missed something since the book keeps talking like they don't and since they're physical objects that need to be implanted.

I get that charms are much cheaper if you don't buy a slot for each one and with their ability to change loadouts is more efficient that way. but I thought there was a h ard cap I kept somehow skimming over

thanks

>>55374802
>>55375012
Nah, no hard cap. They're just... well... they can get =really= expensive over time, and often it's just plain easier to not deal with more slots because you don't need to be a swiss army knife as an alchemical, you just need to be the specific tool for the job today.

>>55365056
>It's sort of the point that "Wow, this setting is actually REALLY AWFUL for anyone except the Exalted."
This.

I love how it's supposed to look like an ordinary happy-go-lucky fantasy setting on the surface, but when you actually get into the details, you find out how fucking awful the world is.

One of the writer comments on The Realm and how they intended to depict in 3e was spot on for this. Basically that it's the height of culture and learning, with more wealth than anyone else in Creation, where even the peasant villages can count on having a few educated people around and enough to eat for everyone... But it's all supported by the crushing taxation of their Satrapies, who they practically force the local rulers of to be tyrannical, to meet their demands, because they'll just replace them if they don't.

>>55372217
>Sidereals have great charms,
You must be talking about 1e.
>but it's a closed set
And more importantly, that's a feature, not a flaw!

t. a Sidereal fanboy since 1e

>>55375513

>And more importantly, that's a feature, not a flaw!

It makes dealing with power creep a real bitch, is annoying from a homebrewer stance, and limits player creativity. I get that in order to make a good Sidereal charm you need to keep the themes of the colleges in mind in addition to charm progression, but there's nothing wrong with a solid stance.

I mean Astrological charms were made to get around that stupid limit.

>>55375669
I'll admit, part of my devotion to the closed Charmset is just being a stubborn 'puritan' about them.

But another big part of it is that Sidereal Charms are supposed to be a toolbox that you use to find clever solutions to your problems, instead of simply having a specific tool that solves the problem for you (like most other Exalts).

>>55375928

Which I can relate to, but you really face issues later on down the line when power creep kicks in. Sidereals are forced to go SMA or bust and/or simply not have the tools for the task.

The Maidens may've been able to foresee all the tools their chosen would need, the people writing them do not.

>>55368154
It was /int/.

>>55375928
>>55376006
I feel that an in-universe closed Charm set is a neat idea. Making it so the Sidereals are bound to a certain set of tools and they can't just make a custom Charm perfectly suited to the situation.

However from an out of character perspective of the writers, they should be able to add to the Charm set, retroactively saying "they were always there" from an in-universe perspective so they haven't handcuffed themselves to a Charm set that could be obsoleted after it's been around 6 years.

why did 2e devs feel the need to nerf thaumaturgy of all things by removing the ability to substitute essence for ritual ingredients or tools? and did they not consider what that does to the lore of procedures such as blood magic, jade extraction, or gather essence tokens?

and why is it so prohibitively expensive for exalts? it's not like anybody ever used the stuff so the errata just feels bizarre

I for one /like/ the closed charmset thing sids have. it's interesting.

>>55376090
>they should be able to add to the Charm set, retroactively saying "they were always there"
That's how everyone I know has always done it and it'd indeed be the best way to deal with the charmset.

>>55376553

It's cool in that it forces them to use their charmset in unusual ways. It's not like they can't use Martial Arts and Sorcery to make up for it though. That's pretty much what SMA is for anyway.

The thing about the sidereal closed charmset was two-fold- one is that you were actually allowed to petition the maidens (Read: Your Storyteller via roleplaying) to add your custom charms.

But exalted has a conveyance problem. So nobody realized how to do this or how to better tutorialize it.

Secondly, as per the 1e-2e model, SMA was supposed to be your 'High Essence' charmset, but generally people don't care for that approach.

Fuck if I know how it's going to work in 3e.

>>55376747

So use SMA and/or sorcery or bust.

That is bad design.

>>55376784

SMA doesn't really need to be a "High Essence" charmset anymore because charmtrees are all going to cap out at E5, meaning that SMAs no longer need to have non combat applications such as using Citrine Poxes of Contagion as you high level Medicine tree.

>>55376917

It is. It forced you to favour both Occult and Martial Arts. But we all know that it's not the first, or last bad design, or even the worst. In Ex3 Sidereals all favour MA for free (and presumably get the necessary merit, but the word is out on needing Brawl 1) and the general consensus in these threads is that Sorcerous Workings are the best thing since the breaking of the Jade Prison. We'll see how it goes from there.

>>55376669
but not the players, the storyteller.

>>55376969
see, they say that. but all they really did was take a 10 tiered system of which only the first 6 were usable and compact it into 5. better if they had left it 10 and used that increased granularity with the now lowered effective essence cap. but cutting it to 5 was more satisfying since people would still reee about e10 charms even if they were the same damn charms.

What happens if you exalt as a solar or lunar inside of the Realm but you're a blindly loyal to the Realm/Immaculate type of person? That's presumably a thing that can happen given how blind loyalty IS one of the fatal flaws that you sometimes see in greco-roman heroes, making them no less heroic, but often very tragic.

Do they turn themselves in? What is it that prevents it from happening?

File: SpearUser3.jpg (463KB, 1500x2312px) Image search: [Google]

463KB, 1500x2312px

>>55377238

Suicide, or a sudden overwhelming eruption of common sense and they get the fuck outta there (or try to).

>>55377238
nothing

nothing is there to prevent you doing that, except that it may or may not end play and make your circlemates bitch about the time it'll take you to roll a new character before you can join them. I suppose a lunar might get grabbed by the silverpact but they tend to write off the blessed isle, the solar might get snapped up by gold faction and socialfu'd into going with them instead. other than that you just turn yourself in and get put down for the greater good. (points for actually being true. you successfully dodged the great curse, horay! die a hero rather than live to be the grossly incandescent yet deranged tyrant you were one day doomed to become)

>>55377238
well on the positive side you'd probably get a real funeral and may even be allowed in the family tomb for doing the right thing and facing your death with honor. may your next incarnation be a dragonblood.

Does anyone have the new Hundred Devils Parade NPCs?

is there a write up of the imperial manse anywhere?

How many charmslots of which type would you recomend for an e4 alchemical?

>>55377973
depends on two things. Caste and Situation. As a rule of thumb I'd generally say that an ever 50:50 mix of free and favored slots, maybe adjusted to 1 free for every 2 favored slots.

Then it depends on the situation. Do you see a ton of down time between adventures? Do you stick close to civilized cities? If yes then you can go more heavily on the favored slots, if no then you should consider going for more free slots and being -very- discerning with what you buy.

In general, think of the role your character is going to have in the party, and perfect that singular role. You're way more experience efficient than just about any other exalt (ignoring slot costs), so you'll punch -way- outside of your weight class essence wise, but you'll very likely spend more in motes and such to do so, and can't swap out easily unless you're stuck to civilized areas, which is something that often happens in autochthonian games so don't sweat it.

Is there a hard limit on how many exalts are around creation at once? For what they are capable of it seems hard to believe that even a small handful couldn't topple every status quo in every region they could physically reach.

>>55378351

There used to be a set number of each type, except for DB's (because they just breed). 300 Solars (which was knocked down to 150 Solars, 100 Abyssals, 50 Infernals when that went down), 300 Lunars (400 in the original Ex1 fluff), 100 Sidereal.

>>55378381

Did we ever get a number on how many Alchemicals exist? I know they're similar to DBs in that there's no hard cap, but making one is a matter of resources.

>>55378351
The thing is, a lot of Exalts would prefer the status quo to remain the same (Dragon-Bloods and Sidereals, Gold Faction notwithstanding), so a lot of the time things balance themselves out.

File: Alchemical2.png (2MB, 800x1084px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 800x1084px

>>55378430

I think it was 1,000, but don't quote me on that.

>>55374362

Why?

>>55377911

I think it is in "Under The Rose".

>>55378441
Why is that? Aren't exalts criminalized in a majority of the world? Not all of them might want to rule over the world like in the old era, but surely they would want to at least be respected?

I'm sad. Its going to be years until we get Infernals and probably at least another half dozen years until we get the enough fanmade charms for them to be awesome. Unless the Infernals book comes with hundreds of charms based for each Yozi its probably going to disappoint me. Though I suppose I could try converting the hundreds of fan made charms to 3e a shot

Alright I need advice /exg/

My players are planning on going to Rathess. And so I am now statting up everything in Rathess. Right now they are Essence 2 and can go to Essence 3 at any time when I allow it. Usually at an important moment or through enlightenment. I was going to have them go to Essence 3 when they perform a sacrifice on the top of the Temple of the Sun (preferably human but I am pretty sure the Zenith is going to stop that). However as I am looking at what they will be engaging. The Goblin King an Essence 5 Solar. Several battle groups of goblins. Tons of battle groups of Dragon Kings. Dozens of higher essence gods who are part of Han-Tha's retinue. Tons of underfolk. With all this I am not thinking they have much of a chance with one size 4 elite troop company, a couple dozen first circle demons, an air aspect and 5 Solars. The players are not really aware all of this is in Rathess both in character and out.

So should I bump them up to Essence 3 before going in letting them at least get access to the bulk of their combat charms? Or should I stick with my original plan and send them into a situation that they have a good chance of getting killed and let them really work around the problem?

If I let them go to Essence 3 and let the Twilight summon several Second Circle Demons over a few months it might make the whole encounter too trivial. And I really prefer good moments to allow them to raise essence rather then it just be a thing that happens when you reach X XP spent.

>>55379275
You can throw more shit at them relatively easily without it seeming out of place, but it's much harder to deescalate what you've already pushed forward if it turns out to be overwhelming. Let them go essence 3 before that, then have something like Ma-Ha-Suchi, or Lookshy, or something the Sidereals do, all throw into the mix if it looks like they might actually win the day and take the city, as that will leave them vulnerable, and there's a ton of valuable shit in the city that the other factions really really really want, and they'd use it as an excuse to jump in and pounce.

That lets the solars push through, but not take it too easily, ending up in a 3 way+ war.

Find a reason to raise their XP on the way. They'll have to pass through Harborhead right? Alhat is one of the unconquered sun's bros and would be a good thing, telling them legends of what he achieved, giving them spiritual guidance in the way of the original lawbringers and the great war, and how he turned harborhead into the place that produced no less than 1/3rd of all solars, and a considerable number of all other original exalt picks preceding the war with the primordials.

>>55379466
>or Lookshy, or something the Sidereals do

That is all after the fight once they take Rathess. Nobody has Ghost-Eating Technique so all the gods especially Han-Tha is going to file a massive paperwork shitstorm on the Solars (especially if they kill the Goblin King) in Yu Shan which the Bronze Faction will be more then happy to expedite the process and get a Wyld Hunt going. Assuming they did not tip off the Realm's guard at the end of the river towards Rathess anyway. I can't force the Sid/DB movement forward until they do something. Ma-Ha-Suchi I can do but him randomly attacking Rathess is out of place too. Also I already had the 3-way war thing going with Ma-Ha-Suchi in a previous game. While I don't mind retreading it I would hate to play him out and have plans for him later.

>Find a reason to raise their XP on the way.

They are already east of Great Forks doing other stuff. Once they finish the current arc they are going to Rathess. But this arc has nothing really major in it. Its a fetch quest for a Exigent. And their Essence 1-2 jump was in Great Forks at a temple to a subordinate to the UCS where they trained their bodies and minds. And I told one of the players he can't use the same method to achieve greater enlightenment unless something major occurred.

I guess I can just let them make the jump to Essence 3 and brutalize them with the Dragonblooded/Sidereal response. The Realm response alone has 1-2 Warstriders and an airship in published material. That is not to mention the Lookshy/Local Dragonblooded lord responses. The players will probably have a functioning airship and some first age defenses by then though.

>>55378935

And don't forget, they'll probably put those shitty new Exalt types first.

>>55374362

Depends on the Fae or Dragonblood.

A Raksha with "Bastion of the Self (Heart)", is going to steamroll a large group of mortals harder than a dragon blood.

>>55379275

>when they perform a sacrifice on the top of the Temple of the Sun (preferably human but I am pretty sure the Zenith is going to stop that).

Don't worry, the unconquered sun is fine with human sacrifice.

See Dragon Kings, and "Offering to Heaven" from "Eye of Heaven" martial art for reference.

>>55379771
Oh I know. The Zenith won't want to kill somebody for a ritual though. A sacrifice of a human heart in that location will certainly get a small glance from the UCS and bestow a boon to the Solars.

>>55379613
yeah but everybody wants a piece of Rathess, and the thing is, you can have other groups playing into it as well. Abyssals, Infernals, whatever.

Who has been a persistant thorn in the player's side and would want 3 of the most intact 3rd age manses and the most powerful oracular device in all of creation (Even more so than the damn loom of fate for god's sake when it has less than 50 sidereals working together to decipher it). Rathess has, until now, been too out of the way, and too tough a nut to crack.

If =anybody= thinks the Solars are going to have even a ghost of a chance taking the place, they are going to try to make a play for it at the same time. Full stop. Lunars, Beastmen tribes, the Eastern and Southern Faerie courts, elementals, gods, the Sidereals will throw everything they have at getting the device that predicted the contagion if the solars are there to take the brunt of the damage.

>>55380015
my point is you can justify just about any power in the central to southern east, and the eastern south making a play for Rathess if a full circle of Anathema are going to make a play for it.

And don't forget, there's an entire faerie-court occupied tower of WORKING, fully functional, goddamn -air ships- and a reality generator in one of the cardinal air dock towers. That alone means Lookshy would make a full blown play for it in an INSTANT if they were told about it, and the Sidereals just damn well might if it meant keeping it out of the solars hands.

>>55380040
Oh, deathlords. Mask of Winters might send a contingent and he has a legit method of knowing about it because the dude has spies literally everywhere, it's his entire shtick as a death lord. And he'd have memories of how awesome Rathess is, probably want to cause a massive slaughter there just to turn it into a shadowland.

Also, Filial Wisdom, the Goblin King is an essence 5 dawn caste who is more or less a 1v1 murder machine. Let your exalts get essence 3 and team up on him or he'll obliterate them.

>>55380015
>Who has been a persistant thorn in the player's side

Yeah... they killed everybody. They literally leave destruction in their wake in a line from Coral to the East. One player jokes the Sidereals don't know where they are going to be because they themselves both in and out of character don't know where they are going to be. Only two beings know they exist. An elder Lunar who is in the West and will get to them later. And an Exigent in Nexus who wants to be friends with them. Everyone else they killed or pressed into service with no witnesses. Its really odd.

So nobody knows the characters are going there or even that they exist besides the wreckage they leave behind.

Any response to the characters is going to be responsive not proactive. Simply because they don't know what is coming.

>>55380128
Any Dawn caste solar with melee supernal is a 1v1 murder machine. Being essence 5 just means they can juice more.

>>55380141
Did they confirm the kills or were any bodies left unfound?

And if they left a line of destruction, that just means at least ONE of the deathlords knows about them and will make a guess based on their tragectory and followers where they're headed, or have been having them followed quietly. Which is what the mask of winters -does-, again, it's his entire bag.

>>55380164
yeah but the Goblin king is literally the strongest solar of the current age. He could 1v1 the Golden Bull and any abyssal you care to name, and probably take down most circles single handedly.

He was built to be one of the toughest things the players could possibly fight if you're using anything -close- to his build in the 2e 'compass of terrestrial directions: the east' build.

>>55380167
The Zenith burns the bodies. Except for the ships at Sea which... well they exploded.

And the thing is they go on murder sprees in spouts. So you take a map of Creation and there are just dots that zig zag. They have been using ships and Stormwind rider to mass move around Creation. They are also paranoid of spirits as shit and 3 of them have Spirit-Detecting Glance on nearly all the time.

>>55380200
Say the guys on the ships survived or their ghosts avoided going to lethe. Or, again. Mask of Winters, the guy who has spies even in the bloody western Faerie court of pearls, the imperial manse and according to one ink monkey the fucking jade pleasure dome in yu-shan as I recall.

>>55380222
Alright so one group knew the Solars exist. That's great. Now how can he spy if he can't get ghosts to watch them dematrialized because 3 of the players would see them? They go cross-country and rarely are in cities. And when they are they may be in Great Forks one weekend and Whitewall the next. This does not mean anybody knows they are going to Rathess because once they go cross-country again to get there they could be going to any of thousands of places. And even if they did not have Spirit-Detecting Glance up they have demons and a god who would be able to see them just fine when they are dematerialized.

>>55380276
Then I have no clue dude, but the straight fact of the matter is you are going to walk them into a TPK if you try to force them to fight the Goblin King at essence 2. And that's before you account for everything else going on in that city.

>>55380358
These guys solo'd 4 size 5 battle groups, a fair folk noble, and a mata-yadh at the same time. I am not worried about them taking the Goblin King. I am worried about them taking the Goblin King and the gods. The gods are actually more and an issue then anything.

>>55380408
>>55380200
>>55380276
Not gonna lie, your players sound absolutely fucking awful to GM for.

What is Rathess, other than dead wiki?

>>55380408
you do know that sorcery on the scale you're talking about makes the loom light up like a christmas tree right?

>>55380476
Last Dragon King city, as 3 of the best intact remaining 1st age/age of glory manses left, an intact air docking tower filled completely with shogunate era air ships military and civilian, all intact, 3-6 intact and functioning reality engines, an orrery that was so accurate it out guessed the sidereals and was able to predict both the contagion and the fair folk invasion but nobody believed the dragon kings about it and it didn't help them because they couldn't go against the shogunate and quarantine themselves.

It's inhabitted by the god of corpse eaters, a court of fair folk, an ungodly number of canablistic eastern dragonlords, and an essence 5 or 6 solar exalt who serves the god of corpse eaters (who is an essence 9 god)

>>55380440
Not really. They are just experienced. We have been playing since around 2004-5. My players turn into their own worst enemies. Hell we spent 4 sessions in a city we saved and the only reason we did is because one of them was trying to get another one of them to fuck a dragonblooded who was not really interested and a god was interested in the Solar hitting on the Dragonblooded which was in the relation with the other Solar who was trying to get the first solar to hit on the dragonblooded in the first place. It was magnificent. The Zenith was inches away from defenestrating the Eclipse.

>>55380477
Yeah. Except the Sidereals were planning on the Fair Folk to kill the city they were in and then use a nearby Wyld Hunt to deal with it after the fact. The Solars ruined that but the Sidereals were not paying attention to it because they were expecting the Fair Folk to light it up. So in about a month in game the Sidereal who was assigned to it is going to march this army over and find giant goblin graveyards and a fully functional city. By then the Solars will be in Rathess.

>>55380519
wait. You've been playing for the better part of a decade and you've only let them reach essence 3 -now-?

What the fuck man.

>>55380536
In a 3e game. We started with about 4 1e games. Then did about 4-5 2e games. Then we are doing our first 3e game.

Anyway I am the ST who had the original question. I am going to bed. Thanks for the advice. I'll bump them up to 3 and just fuck with them after they control Rathess. Thanks again anons.

>>55380739
No problem Joss

>>55380551
aaaah okay I see, sorry I misunderstood. Your phrasing made me think this was all one campaign!

Good luck!

>>55378761
The siddies and DBs do have most of the power and Solars and such players have been out of the game for a while, or are surprisingly antagonistic to each other

>>55371773
Yes, but to be fair, it also laid that out unambiguously in the text. Whereas D&D pathologically refuses to acknowledge that a Level 10 Druid is very far beyond a Level 10 Fighter.

>>55371861
That.

I don't need guilt for my robots.

If you want to use that explanation in your game, that is perfectly fine. But thematically, Autochton, the Primordial of Innovation, the builder of the Exaltation, getting sick because he is making them is a huge fuck you.

>>55381589
Idk, it kind of sounds deliciously ironic

>>55381790
Would Autochton tear out pieces of himself in order to give them the autonomy to potentially cure himself? Perhaps, though it implies that he has given up on being able to cure himself under his own power.

>>55378935
converted 2e and homebrew would be more satisfying anyway. 3e infernals will have as much in common with the ones you want as 1 vs 2e lunars do with eachother.

>>55379724
you're a shitty new Exalt type

>>55382725
I like some aspects of 3e Infernals like the build your own Shintai

>>55371781
No. His sickness is explained, and the actual reason is much much better than that lame nonsense. Besides, primordials are too big for the law of diminishment, it's why gia can have swarms of dragonbloods but the sun sets every day from only 300 solars. Even the biggest gods are vastly smaller beyond their narrow specialization.

I believe the explanation can also be found in 1e, but I know it was published in the inkmonkies pdf

>>55382959
You mean the DBT they steal from 2e Lunars because 3e won't be using that and inkmonkies loved their own By Rage Recast? ;)

>>55382996
We have confirmation that not only did the Dragons only pay the Law of Diminishment tab for the Dragonblooded, they only had to do it once and didn't need to pay for the further exaltations.

>>55382842
No

U

>>55382996
also he was sick long before this point. the sun didn't retroactively always have set, and even if it had it wouldn't make sense for the sun getting made fun of for setting being the reason he empowered the solars to go kick those guy's ass which is the reason the sun retroactively sets. which is what you're saying if you replace sun with autobot. the cause and effect logistics for this imo dull theory don't even work out.

>>55383035
in this third edition we are all a shitty new exalt type

>>55382842
nah just sit back and appreciate the irony of Infernal and Alchemical fans getting tribal about new Exalts appearing and stealing the spotlight

You have to go on a date with a Yozi, which one would you choose?

>>55383246
Amalion, no other can compare. Mostly because she is the least likely to fuck my shit up.

>>55383276
no man. like...the whole yozi.

>>55383332
No idea how that would work since Malfeas is like an entire world, Cecylne is a desert, Kimbery is an ocean, and so on.

>>55383246
your mother

>>55383366
they can use avatars, often even humanoid ones

File: Exalted Ex3 Story Part 1.png (175KB, 950x1900px) Image search: [Google]

175KB, 950x1900px

>>55380128

>Filial Wisdom

Don't I know that name? Haven't you posted here?

>>55383838
Yeah, but any date with them is going to suck like a vacuum. All of them will have there hang-ups that will ruin any sort of amiciable interaction:

>Malfeas: I am King of all I survey. Kneel!
>Cecylene: Oh no! You broke a rule! Bend over.
>Kimbery: Call me mommy.
>She Who Lives In Her Name: I made Creation what is is y'know. And burned most of it away.
>Adorjan: (Please be quiet)
>Ebon Dragon: Have you seen my bride? She truly is a treasure for me to behold.
>Cytherea: Just crying, literally just endless crying over being severed from her child.
>Isidoros: Just anger. Pure anger and rage. Likely to punch for no reason.

Picking a Yozi for a date (though it really should be the other way around) is literally picking the flavor of your sodomy.

>>55384041

That's not the image I wanted. can't find it now but, oh well.

>>55384063

Try Szoreny, you might end up with a mirror image of yourself.

File: 1503897677530.jpg (22KB, 718x512px) Image search: [Google]

22KB, 718x512px

>>55384063
>>Cecylene: Oh no! You broke a rule! Bend over.
>>Kimbery: Call me mommy.
Yes please

>>55384137
>Szoreny
Yeah, but I hate myself. I'd rather bunk with the Schizophrenic Jocasta-complex called Kimbery.

File: Wood Elf Waifu.png (151KB, 1233x841px) Image search: [Google]

151KB, 1233x841px

>>55384292

Remember that if you even look at another woman after you hook up with Kimbery, she'll go all Yandere on you.

>>55383006

>thinking 3e Lunars won't have DBT

I see you're retarded.

>>55384063

Isidoros isn't really pure anger and rage.

That is some of what malfeas does, when he isn't dancing his streets naked.

IIRC isidoros themes are gratious sex and violence, and do what I want.

>>55383132
YES

>>55384063
I think that was the point

>>55385101
It was. I'm just trying to see, well, which one will let me leave with my soul and anus intact. The answer is none of them.

File: 1503896618956.jpg (41KB, 461x461px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 461x461px

>>55384328
I love me my Yandere
oh yes I do, snugglybum

>>55384041
is there more to that story time?

IS IT TRUE DAWN IS THE WORST CLASS?

>>55385738
There are no classes

>>55385815
you understood me you fag

Just me or is it currently impossible to pay for the newest Hundred Devil's Night Parade?

>>55385738
yes,in 1 and 2 e they are unquestionably the worst caste. everything they did was done better by others.

>>55385201
I think most of them have no interest in depriving you of either of those things

>>55386525
So which Yozi would you date?

>>55385815
cleric, thief, and for fucks sake wizard, were all set up in ways that made them better at doing the fighty thing than the fighter. and of course so was the bard, the bard is best at everything because he cheats.

>>55386543
well I wouldn't. they'd either destroy me by accident, destroy me on purpose, or ignore me entirely. but if I had to pick, one of the majority who'd ignore

>>55386256
you mean the sites glitchy not that its accidentally free

>>55386758
The former.

>>55382996
The Dragon-Blooded are the chosen of the Elemental Dragons, not the chosen of Gaia.

>>55381790
yeah but the setting isn't about delicious irony, it's about surpassing your limits. The setting is super grim dark NOT because it's a 40k like world where -everything- you do comes to nothing but dirt and ashes, but because it makes you so much more heroic by contrast.

It's about overcoming impossible challenges, about becoming a god like hero who saves the day and everything becomes wonderful.It's a Neutralbright setting (between noble and grim) because the world -can- improve, things are really shitty, and really wonderous all at the same time, there are so many things to see and do, and some of them are REALLY HORRIBLE, and there are real consequences for your actions, but you, as an Exalted, can change the world and make it -better-.

By making Autochthon making alchemicals only making him worse (rather than say, using them to temporarily make himself worse so that they can work on a permanent cure, and even that is a bit much imo), it pushes alchemical exalted right into grimdark territory, because no matter -what- the alchemical exalted do, they can't fix things, their very existence is part of the problem.

could a powerful solar solo a elemental dragon?

>>55387278

So you turn into mary sues?

>>55387145
They are still her souls.

Man, I don't know what people expected with Liminals.

Like, did anybody -really- think that Alchemicals, the red headed step child of the setting, would ever get more attention than the new thing that White Wolf probably invested a few hundred thousand in design effort on right before they decided to go to 3rd Edition? Liminals were already being bandied about at the end of 2.75 or whatever, so of course they're going to get in right after we get the core 5 (Solar, Lunar, Dragonblooded, Sidereal, Abyssal). It wouldn't surprise me if they got in before Infernals, but Infernal Green Sun Princes at least have a proper write up.

Then we'll have exigents, though it's a toss up what the order of the 3 is going to be (Liminal, Infernal, Exigent, but my bet is on Infernals first, then Liminals, then Exigents)

My guess is we'll have devil-tiger-style "become a primordial" a their own distinct splat eventually since there's a 2nd wave of infernals coming. There's also akuma, the rogue sidereal dudes with fate spinners in their spines, and alchemicals. All of the above only got a 2 page art spread and we'll be very lucky if they appear.

Finally, we have the INCREDIBLY MYSTERIOUS 'support' exalted that are somehow meant to be followers or npcs or something, and who the fuck knows what that's about, we only know about it because of the dev discussions. Maybe Cytherea is finally getting an exalted type.

We also have 2 exaltations that were invented by the unstoppable black boar yozi and oramus, and we have no idea what those were except they creeped the rest of the yozi's out, resulting in them stealing solar exaltations in order to learn crap.

>>55387307
A powerful solar can solo anything.

>>55387382
You can be heroic and the world can be changed for the better without being a mary sue. A mary sue is not heroic because they do such things effortlessly, or with only a token effort. Heroism is defined by overcoming challenge and making the world a better place. Exalted are heroic because they overcome incredible things, and risk themselves to do so. An exalted risks death and other tragedy, including their own corruption, to try and change the world for the better.

Is anybody else annoyed at how some parts of /tg/ consider anything not grimdark to automatically be mary sues?

>>55387449
Exigents are after Lunars. They were after Dragonblooded but Lunar fans were too rabid.

>>55387461

Yeah, I don't really think so.

They aren't going to be able to Solo someone like the Unconquered Sun, or Isidoros.

File: reaction_Are_you_serious.png (12KB, 226x223px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 226x223px

>>55387490
as they should be
Seriously, what bone head would try to put them out before lunars? I mean I can see them coming before all the other true antagonist splats, but lunars? Come on.

>>55387497
eeeeehn, the elemental dragons don't have30 automatic successes on anything they attempt to do even before they roll the dice. A solar built explicitly to take one of them down could probably do it if he was dedicated to literally nothing else.

>>55387468

>change the world for the better

When that night caste, the one who kills husbands to take their place and slleps with their wives, willing to slit a baby's throat for coin?

Not all Solars want to change the world for the better.

>>55387278
I thought it was about the last dying ember flaring up as a final gasp just before becoming prehistory for the world of darkness ;) all your splendor is pretty fall leaves. and it's mostly the solars's fault

>>55387382
that IS the theme of the solar splat afterall

>>55387702
Not since early design docs. All that went away before 1e was even published.

>>55387617
not all do, but the setting was obviously written from the point of view of being big damn heroes and saving the world.

I mean we were talking about the goblin king earlier, and he's about as bad as a solar can go without being snapped up and turned into an akuma or abyssal. And even -he- can be redeemed.

If the setting was full grim dark and horrendous, there wouldn't be a built in mechanic for abyssals to flip into solars.

>>55387702
Yeah the devs have pretty much unequivocably stated that exalted isn't the prelude to world of darkness so that's out.

>>55387278
>it's about surpassing your limits.

Well, if you are a Solar. Otherwise it's more 'Stay in your place' with stuff like 'Dragonblooded that try to learn Sid Martial Arts explode' or 'Heaven likes mortals more than it likes DB as mortals could one day be a solar'

>>55387844
Ehn, fair enough, but the rest more or less remains the same or flips about for even the villain splats.

>>55384063
>>55384919
>tfw people focus on the superficial aspects of Isidoros, every time
Okay no, Isidoros is "The Unstoppable Force", Ego personified...that's why he's basically described as being a giant boar-shaped black hole, is obsessed with out-doing everyone else, and hates any image of himself except when its Szoreny, because his power let's him be a perfect reflection of the Black Board that Twists the Sky.

>>55387737
it's printed on the 1e corebook iirc

>>55388225
The 1e book was a mismash of things. One paragraph they were talking about how its a history of the world while the next it says that Creation is doomed unless the Solars save it.

The back cover illustrates this perfectly.
>Before there was a World of Darkness, there was an age of savage adventure
A couple paragraphs down
>Will these living legends herald the return of the Golden Age or the end of Creation?

Well which is it? Are you predestined to fail or are you not?

>>55388034
>Always remember that Isidoros used to be best buddies with the Unconquered sun and would go out into the wyld to cow-tip massive unshaped.

File: Paio7.jpg (109KB, 337x369px) Image search: [Google]

109KB, 337x369px

What was the name of the demon that shit's out Manse?
Does it have a limit on the aspects of the Manse it shit's out?

>>55371674
is that a mouse on her head?

>>55388486
...?

>>55388628
Filename.

File: 9c1.jpg (162KB, 1024x768px) Image search: [Google]

162KB, 1024x768px

>>55388592
No. She is a penguin.

>>55388569
Amalion aka best 3rd Circle Demon, fite me bro
>CoCD: Malfeas, p.117
Her Neighbor’s House—With but a word, Amalion can
raise a manse from any uncapped demesne. The ground
erupts as earth, wood, metal and stone flow like water to
her design. Raising a manse thus costs her one temporary
Willpower and takes a number of hours equal to the manse’s
rating. The manse’s architecture bears the unmistakable
stamp of Malfeas, but it is otherwise fully functional and
contains any unusual characteristics that she sees fit to
include (see The Books of Sorcery, Vol. III—Oadenol’s
Codex, pp. 63–79). She has complete control over the
manse’s layout and the nature of its hearthstone. Amalion
erects mundane structures in a similar fashion. A hut
forms in seconds, a new wing of a house in minutes and
a castle in just under an hour. If she designs rooms and
structures to support specific feelings or activities, treat
them as perfect equipment (see Exalted, p. 366).

>>55388340
What interactions, if any, did the Primordials have with their created Gods? Or did they just make them to do certain shit and fuck with them when they got bored?

>>55388799
I M A G I N E

>>55388801
The Incarnae, barring the Maidens, tended to have the closest relationship with the primordials.

You know what's actually kind of hilarious? She who lives within her name might have been perfectly okay serving Yu-Shan as a glorified night light and something to set their clocks too if they had wanted. By locking her up in Malfeas they basically pushed her into limit break and had her pitch a fit about being tossed aside like trash.

>>55388919
>A Creation where the skys are filled with SHLIN's orbs, day and night. So orderly are they that you can set your time by them and never lose a second. She will never allow it.
...
>A Creation that is infinitely bigger than what we have now.

Oh gods, what would that be like?

SWILIHN is tsundere?

Hey, people. Been working on an Artifact with a buddy of mine, any input would be appreciated. We've got a solid basis for the Charms but costs and general balancing might need some work.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1z7DUwMXWb5EN6BI1OpPOqEyms3TDIY-bPYEQMqQiG-o/edit?usp=sharing

how do you feel about replacing the scourge's stealth anima power with an improved anima flux?

>>55389184
Have any of them been tested?

http://oglaf.com/magmachamber/

>>55389258
Not in game, unfortunately. The player who was supposed to use them ran off.

>>55389266
A+

>>55388486
Where is that from?

>>55388801
>Amalion aka best 3rd Circle Demon, fite me bro
Bitch it's Ipithymia and you know it.
Thanks.

>>55389320
Unfortunate, because for
>Subtle Slice of Fate
it seems likely to me that players are ALWAYS going to put off the damage until the end of the scene and always try to game it by upping their soak/hardness right before they lose the committed motes.

So I'd say change it to:
>The Withering/Decisive attack (post soak/hardness) that would have struck the Exalt is tallied and deferred to the end of the scene/battle.
>There they inflict the total damage the Exalt should have been dealt as Pattern-Spiders rush to fix the loop in the Loom of Fate before it snares anything else.
>This damage cannot be altered.

Also, when you use a Resonant/Dissonant, it looks cleaner if you don't repeat those words in its description.

>>55389457
Ipithymia is a whore and nothing else. Even Madelrada can act as a whore, but at least she can do more than just that.
But please, let's not devolve into which Yozi's Soul could out-lewd the other.

>>55389246
Detail what power's the Anima Flux will have first. Because muting your Anima and 10m silence pretty good for an assassin.

>>55389547
I'm not sure if there is a misunderstanding but Subtle Slice of Fate is meant to defer the damage YOU would deal to other people.

>I attack Bob, I use Subtle Slice of Fate
>He would have been dealt 6 Initiative damage
>I hold onto the motes and not deal the damage until I want to.
>Oh shit he reset to base, I deal my damage, I get a sweet crash bonus.

And in this case, yes you defer the final damage after soak and other such reductions.


Regarding Resonant/Dissonant I tried to copy the format in one of the previews but yeah I can easily clean that up.

>>55389639
Oh fuck, I did. In that case, yeah it makes sense.

>>55389424
It's from a ridiculous RP thing on tumblr, known as Sandsverse. This is specifically is a fanart of an exchange between Horace the Boar and Seymour the Ape. Not furries, just outright animals who spend their time blogging and insulting one another.

I just thought the comic in its entirety was somewhat reminiscent of Isidoros and Malfeas, one being a boar and the other being an angry green being.

>>55390076
Sorry, I mean Elmer the Ape. My bad, Elmer.

>>55389753
Aside from that, anything else jump out as over or under costed? Or a bit too crazy?

File: Exalted Ex3 Story Part 2.png (92KB, 950x2190px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 950x2190px

>>55385735

File: Exalted Ex3 Story Part 3.png (199KB, 950x4346px) Image search: [Google]

199KB, 950x4346px

>>55391471

>>55389607 figures similar rules to dragonblood, but stronger. how much better than dragonblood would it need to be to be able to move the anima muting to fiends instead?(and then move fiend oathbinding/breaking to replace malefactor's while transplanting fiend charmshare to defilers. malefactors stay priests and fiends keep diplomatic immunity. scourges keep the silence bubble and quiet powers

oh, and possibly move malefactor's current +1 appearance and 1 auto success on speech rolls against lower essence targets to fiends. or maybe instead leave oath breaking with fiends, yeah that sounds better I think?)

>>55391573
>>55391599
>>55391858
>>55391963
My dude, are you okay?

>>55392008
...this site does something fucky with the delete button doesn't it

>>55392085
Well the most immediate problem I can find with this is that Adorjan has a series of charms to give them an anima flux like effect, but it takes three purchases to really get anywhere and is 6m1wp for a scene

>>55383228
>mentioned in the earliest days of 1E in supplements and maybe the core book, the actual foundation of the game
>VS some shit added 2 editions later and suddenly thrown into the core because 2 dev's wanted to add more shit for the sake of adding more shit

File: areyousure.jpg (111KB, 400x400px) Image search: [Google]

111KB, 400x400px

>>55393138
well, all this shit is in 3e's core book too, so it's just as foundational.

>>55390733
Considering that the entire Evoc. tree revolves around fucking with times, you're obviously going to get people who will reject this because they don't want to keep track of what-ifs, but for those who can handle it... seems like good shit.

Clarify 'Reality Rent in Twain' though and say what possible outcomes there are lest someone take the "only death can pay for life" literally and kill an extra to save an Exalt.

Also, what was your intention w/ 'Form Bisecting Blades'? Because I'm reading it as 2 Copies of the same Exalt with different Form Charms attacking separately.

>>55393138
yeah that's nice but there's still a lot of people who despise both for not being there at the very start

>>55393544
Hmmm those are some odd readings, didn't think it was too unclear.

Form Bisecting Blades, you get to have two Form Charms active simultaneously. That's it.

Reality Rent in Twain lists the possibilities open after using the Charm.

1. You kill the person who "killed" your ally. The killing blow to your ally is undone and they're back to what they were before that.

2. The person who "killed" your ally kills you. The killing blow to your ally is undone and they're back to what they were before that.

3. You give up commitment of the Charm in order to safe yourself from the backlash. Your friend is dead and stays dead, you can't try again.

File: 1505147298427.png (106KB, 359x440px) Image search: [Google]

106KB, 359x440px

When a tree falls Inna forest and there's nothing to hear it does it make a noise

>>55387385
>They are still her souls.
The Elemental Dragons are the children of Gaia, not her souls.

>>55368169

Yeah, by the same reasoning they go with you could say that Solars should be removed from the game because of how they mess with other splats.

>>55396132

Yes.

nb4 "hurr durr but nothing can hear it how does it exist!"

Science you fucking moron.

Is Avoiding the truth technique an automatic success?

What do you guys think of the "Technique Mirror" sorcery spell?

>>55385738
its true, Dawns have no class they need to be taught not to eat with their hands and that it's inapprorpiate to fart in public

>>55397561
Meh waste of space.

>>55398517

Why?

>>55397267
...science literally cannot say anything about a fallen tree in a forest that nobody has observed. it's a fundamental limit of scientific inquiry that it requires experiment and observation.

>>55368169
but the idea itself was bad, not just flawed mechanics. and there was no possible good way to implement it mechanically that avoided it's problems and the problems it caused every other splat(you can't just balance the effects against their own charms, but against all other splat charms in case an eclipse takes that combo).

the closest you can get is a total nerf/replacement like 3e did where eclipses were cut down to pre-approved spirit charms and other solars had a charm to gain a similar ability. and I think they only even did that because it's a legacy thing from 1 and 2e.

In creation how many hours are daylight or night out of each day?

>>55368169
That's because, again, the distinction between bad mechanics and bad ideas is mostly an autistic one.

Only autists want to play with a flawed ruleset to purposefully break it, writing 1500 pages long fanfiction about a world following D&D rules and how their self insert became a god at level 3. You can't turn it around. It is an autistic ordeal to begin with.

What you think is simplistic is actually the signs of an emotionally mature fanbase, one that isn't made of 24 years old virgins compiling lists of elven waifus for their Thrallherd characters.

It can be jarring at time, of course. Emotional maturity can be spooky when you aren't, yourself, mature. But you shouldn't fear it. Embrace it.

File: OgPGqyq.gif (2MB, 700x714px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 700x714px

>>55399060
>other solars had a charm to gain a similar ability.
Ignoring the shit out of that shit ugh
That's Eclipse schtick

File: 1487354873214.gif (1024KB, 242x227px) Image search: [Google]

1024KB, 242x227px

Why aren't there trains in Creation?

>>55399367
the problem is it's not actually about autistic gamebreaking players(who the st could easily slap down) but that the lunar writer took this bullshit into account which sucked all the flavor out of lunars in 2e. It's more than a problem at the table it is a problem that infected and lessened how all future rulesets were made.

>>55399383
then eclipses continue to be best because they have more options, unless approved charms are utterly toothless.

besides if we're ignoring charms then the personas thing is blatantly an infernal charm for example, and .blablabla. apparently things change between editions.

>>55399421
because trains are awesome. therefore as a returned solar it is up to YOU to build them ;)

>>55399455
on second thought, ignore the toothless complaint. Supernaturals fixes that for the most part and I forgot the expansions to twilight's power..

>>55399421
I could definitely see the Underworld having tortured soul ghost trains, Yu-shan having golden trains, and Malfeas having rad DEMON TRAIN OF GREEN HELLFIRE.

>>55399925
Can I suplex the ghost train? I assume as a specter it'd be nearly weightless?

>>55399421
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_railway_history

Ask yourself why trains would be needed, justified?
Then ask how they would be made, how the logistics of creating, running, maintaining them be carried out?

>>55399367


>
What you think is simplistic is actually the signs of an emotionally mature fanbase, one that isn't made of 24 years old virgins compiling lists of elven waifus for their Thrallherd characters.

Isn't that what abyssal charms are for?

>>55399367


>What you think is simplistic is actually the signs of an emotionally mature fanbase, one that isn't made of 24 years old virgins compiling lists of elven waifus for their Thrallherd characters.

Isn't that what Abyssal charms are for?

>>55399925

Doesn't the Midnight Express do exactly that? I don't have Compass: Underworld, so I can't check.

>>55400784
Memories fade in the waters of Lethe, to fray at the edges and coalesce into one another until all is as one.
>http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Midnight_Express

>>55399421
Currently building a train line from Anteng to Gem through the fire mountains. I bribed all the volcanoe and mountain gods to help maintain it by replacing the wooden planks that link the rails with prayer wheels devoted to the god of whatever particular mountain the trains ran over, so they don't mind having had their mountains carved into nor having to divert their lavaflows away from the tracks.

And that is how you sorcerer-engineer as a zenith.

>>55399367
Hold on are you actually trying to argue FOR the side that can't draw distinctions between crunch and fluff as being emotionally mature? I just want to make sure before I engage in pointing-and-laughing mode.

File: 1496175892537.jpg (85KB, 736x736px) Image search: [Google]

85KB, 736x736px

Is there a backlash or something from breaking the Diplomatic Immunity and attacking your host for the Eclipse?

>>55401626

If an Eclipse attacks a spirit, he loses his diplomatic immunity and the spirit is free to kill him. Spirits can't break d the Eclipses DI by attacking first, but may goad the Eclipse into attack, in which case, the Eclipse loses DI as above.

File: 1504462295190.gif (499KB, 270x270px) Image search: [Google]

499KB, 270x270px

>go full Totemic
>Banner is golden chains coming down from the sun and wrapping around your body
>Have to explain people that no, it's not the demon wrapping itself around your soul, you're just wrapped up in stuff

>>55401778
First age solars never had to deal with this shit. People just assumed you were wearing laser robes.

>>55399367

>Only autists want to play with a flawed ruleset to purposefully break it, writing 1500 pages long fanfiction about a world following D&D rules and how their self insert became a god at level 3. You can't turn it around. It is an autistic ordeal to begin with.

Good thing we weren't talking about that.


Something that is badly designed in a game can still be used in a non game breaking way.

>>55401868
exactly this.

I'm going to point out something. Perfect Balance ain't ever going to happen in anything that includes folks with multiple ability sets, the best you can hope for is perfect imbalance. And even then it's one of the hardest things to get right. Table Top Games have it the worst because they have so many damn rules, and you have to manually test them all over and over and over again, and try to imagine every single situation they can be applied too.

I promise you, nobody at wizard's ever imagined something like Pun-Pun would be possible.

That's why these games have -game masters-. They act as the balance, the guy who tells you to knock shit off when you go beyond the pale.

And at the end of the day, Exalted is very much a game about wish fulfillment, even when playing a heroic mortal to a degree.

>>55399925
IIRC Hell has something like that: a shortcut demon that swallows you and shits you out in a different layer and a moving road. Because otherwise you'd never get anywhere.

>>55400003
>Ask yourself why trains would be needed, justified?

because the actually named and fluffed cities are about a week's ride apart at their densest and otherwise I'd have to homebrew way more locations :wink:

How they would be made: Guild Resources+Exalted Bullshit ^tm Mut really more likely it'd have to be first age leftovers? Nobody in 2nd age seems to have steam

>>55402056
Remember, creation is only 700 years out from having 90% of all living things killed off.There's a =ton= of empty space across creation because of that. Even with the best efforts of gods and sidereals to fix things and boost population. There's going to be more ghost towns than not even with week long distances.

How do you feel about a malfeas craft charm that involves punching the stupid lazy object that dares to be "broken" into full function for [essence] scenes of active use at the cost of doubling it's eventual maintenance times?

Maybe allow the charm to be reapplied but require a craft roll which destroys the object on a botch?

_________________
Does that fit themes?

>>55402885
The Engineer from TF2 approves.

Are the Glories of the Most High worth reading?

>>55403256
Not really, though thousand correct actions is

File: __lillie_and_yungoos_pokemon_pokemon_game_and_pokemon_sm_drawn_by_sukemyon__9bb9a16483ee2290b31c2b9eeeb70160.png (452KB, 1000x1011px) Image search: [Google]

452KB, 1000x1011px

>>55403286
What about the Adventures?

>>55403256
depends, it was pretty refreshing the first time around once it became the new status quo though

>>55403335
Most of them are unintentionally funny.

>>55403335
the adventure about the opening act of return of the scarlet empress is worth it only because it describes the Sword of Creation in detail, including how it's the literal seed bank of creation, able to give patterns that allow solar shapers to rebuild everything lost from it blasting away significant bits of creation, up to and including people and souls (apparently the sword of creation, when it gets down to the business of actually annihilating segments of reality, doesn't even leave proper essence patterns that can sustain souls even).

It also means that creation might be able to be rebuilt, including all the stuff lost to the wyld at the end of the shogunate. It's pretty rad.

What does You Shan look like when one someone who's not Sol leads?

File: 1479345190821.jpg (46KB, 680x679px) Image search: [Google]

46KB, 680x679px

>mfw they got rid of the Exaltation shards

>>55403425
Instead of a sun shining overhead it's a moon or a single bright star.

>>55403500
what are you talking about?

>>55403335
>Veil of Ebon Blades
>Quotes: (silence just before she strikes)

>>55403678
There are no shards in 3e, just the Exaltation given by Sol or whatever god

>>55403942
There were... I'm confused, I don't remember reading about shards of exaltations in 2e, you can't split up an exaltation. Gods could empower mortals by a specific set of charms but that was as close as I can think of to actually having micro-exaltations.

>>55403996
I think he means Exigents

>>55403996
In 2e (and maybe 1e idk) Exaltations were shards that ran around the world looking for hosts to make into Primordial murder machines

>>55404086
Sol always had complete control over the Exaltations though. He still does. They will find someone appropriate if Sol can't be assed to look himself.

>>55404142
>Sol always had complete control over the Exaltations though.
If he did why didn't the Primordial War end with an order to stop this bs

>>55404086
those are still a thing, an exaltation is still a real actual deal in the world, and all the other types are copies of those primordial murder machine schemas.

>>55404161
Multiple reasons. One the Geas was one where he could not attack them. He is not. His Exalts are but he cannot directly control the Exalts. They can tell him to stop Exalted people but he can just ignore them.

Second Exaltations will seek out potential Exalts eventually if the UCS won't do anything. Again the Geas never said that they had complete control over the UCS. So his inaction lets them continue to Exalt if the Primordials somehow sealed Him or cut Him off of the world.

>>55399421

There's the train loops Yu-Shan to the sun IIRC

>>55402885

Stealing

I have heard some people say that the yozis would kill the GSP if they managed to escape, I found that weird.