How do you treat disease without antibiotics? Our enemies are

>>55335949
Healing potions are literal miracle cures.

Its why people can live 'till they're 100 even though they do nothing but shovel shit and farm most of their life.

>>55335949
Send in the Unseen Servant to trigger the traps.

>>55336396
>>55336437
Sorry, should have said in OP: no magic setting.

>>55336560
oh, then they die or become a cripple. Simple as that.

>>55335949
be a paladin lol
a paladin can eat literally shit all day long and never get sick

>>55336599
No plants or intrusive treatment that can be used?

>>55336626
No magic sadly.

>>55336683
You're not gonna treat sepsis with herbal remedies or leeches.

>>55336683
Maybe but theres a reason we invented antibiotics, some shit is just too deadly and the infection runs too deep. People died in their 40s-50s.

>>55335949

Just look up Roman medicine. It was surprisingly advanced and effective, for the time. Long story short, though, each disease tends to have its own course of treatment. What works for cholera isn't going to work on diphtheria.

>>55336703
I searched and the first 'antibiotics' are pretty old. I just don't know which exactly things I should seek.

For example, if I get hurt I can search for marigold and aloe. Not a magical cure, but it really helps the wound.

>>55336762
Yeah but chances are that even if you don't die if you take even one good hit in combat you're probably still done as a fighter

>>55336762
>I just don't know which exactly things I should seek.
It doesn't matter if YOU know. What matters is if any of your characters, or their allies, or simply doctors you can pay, know. Ask your GM.

>>55335949
Amputation.

How about you stop fighting these guys? Because that is some shit you don't come back from.

>>55336856
My character is literally me, so any knowledge you guys give helps on the table. And I cannot ask GM directly exactly because of that.

>>55336916
No can do. They are psychotic drug users, like the Fiends in Fallout.

>>55337010
Then you don't need to actually know how to cure diseased wounds. You just need to convince your DM that you know how to cure diseased wounds.

Whenever you get hit, wash/disinfect the wounds with strong alcohol, and bandage it with clean bandages. reapply bandages every 24 hours until the wounds are healed.
IRL, this is nowhere near enough to avoid gangrene/tetanus/blood-poisoning, but it sounds like the right thing to do, and that's probably good enough for the DM.

>>55337117
That's... actually pretty good. I'm going to attempt that. Thanks.

Just to finish however, in rl if this happened I'm screwed?

>>55337010
>no magic
>getting shit on in-game
>"literally me"

wtf game are you playing

>>55337151
>if this happened I'm screwed?
I have no clue, so probably.

>>55337155
It sounds like he's playing a ttrpg version of one of those "stuck in a fantasy world/MMO" animes that are all the rage these days.

>>55335949
You can just research historical medicine. Antibiotics are a recent invention.
1) For minor wounds, simply cleaning them thoroughly goes a long way toward reducing the chance of infection. ANY antiseptic chemical also helps, including your classic go-to of pure(ish) alcohol.
2) For a major wound, like a crushed limb, amputation may be the only reasonably course of action. A serious wound to the head or torso is probably a "clean it out, bandage it, and hope for the best" situation.
3) Cleanliness. Can't emphasize this enough. The biggest contributor to the horrors of traditional medicine was that they didn't KNOW how germs worked. They didn't clean their tools adequately, they re-used bandages and linens, they didn't use anti-septic chemicals, etc.

>>55336396

Healing potions don't resolve status effects, you need cure potions for that.

>>55337151
So long as you can properly clean the wound and not leave it open to further infection, you should be good so long as it doesn't get into your bloodstream by nicking a major blood vessel.

Spider web works too and make sure not to use sinew or anything animal based to stitch the wound closed. It rots and has predictable results.

>>55337151
In modern times no, a heavy dosage of antibiotics and some days in the hospital should be enough. In older days, yes because there was no way to treat the deeper infection and it would probably evolve into gangrene or blood poisoning which had no cure beyond amputation or leeches/bleeding.

>>55337314
Immediately healing up the wound would go a long way against any infection to say the least

>>55337374
Romans knew that boiling wine was good for cleaning wounds, not that they understood exactly why that was.

>>55336683
Boiling wine or any other alcoholic beverage IIRC was pretty decent after cleaning the wound immediately

>>55336703
Actually...
Okay, time for some modern science and how it relates to ancient medical practices. Dr. Merrick recently invented a cure for sepsis - combine an anabolic steroid with vitamin C. Yes, its that simple, but regular doses of vitamin c don't work since the normal absorption pathways have been wrecked, as sespsis is basically a lethally acute case of scurvy and scavenges those pathways for remnants of vitamin c. The anabolic steroid forces absorption of the vitamin c (and will actually force absorption of a lot of things, which is where he got the idea to combine it with vitamin c after doing sepsis research).
Anyways, there's an old Jewish (and also Chinese) recipe for "long life". Take the testes of a young bull, slice them, and steam them, making sure to capture the steam. Add to dandelion tea, or orange juice (Sephardic, aka Spanish, variant of the recipe). Now, the steam method is a primitive extraction of Taurine, which is a weak anabolic steroid, and dandelion is a source of vitamin c. Regular doses will have approximately the same effect over time as the modern method, accounting for the inefficiency of the taurine extraction and the inefficiency of absorbing the medicine via the digestive tract.
So there you have it.

>>55335949
Hey that's in the Marine Corps Museum in Quantico, I live right by it.

>>55335949
Honey is a natural antibiotic. The right type of maggots eat only necrosis and secrete bactericides. Copper has bactericidal proprierties. Get the strongest spirit, make the wounded chug half of it and the wound the other half. Boiled wine mixes the boiled water with some alcohol which also kills microorganisms.

>>55337374
>In older days, yes because there was no way to treat the deeper infection and it would probably evolve into gangrene or blood poisoning which had no cure beyond amputation or leeches/bleeding.
anyone who wants to experience these problems in-game should check out Harnmaster.

>>55336683

No magic, primitive medicine? Well you can't.

You die. Sorry.

>>55336683
Clean out the wounds with boiling water

>>55338542
>Clean out the wounds with boiling water
If you enjoy second degree burns, sure.

>>55338639
Would you rather have second-degree burns or infection?

>>55335949
Shink down and enter the body to fight it.
lore fetish people will love it

>>55335949
Survival fag here.
honey has so much sugar that it disinfects wounds by stripping the fluid out of bacteria by osmosis. This is why it self preserves.
acids, like citric acid or vinegar, are very anti bacterial and why they use acid to preserve food.
salt of course kills bacteria as per honey and is used for preserving like vinegar.
dog saliva is anti bacterial. That's one stage of why they can eat poo and not get ill. The second side is their highly acidic bowels.
garlic and onions are also anti bacterial. Not sure why on this one.
Burn filthy wounds then keep them dry to try and stem infection.
really don't let any wounds get moist.

Basic stuff that should be readily available in your non magical setting.

>>55336683
alcohol, some plants can have mild antibiotic effects, like garlic, honey, and that's pretty much it.

>>55337151
>>55337117
washing the wound with clear water for a couple minutes can greatly reduce the chance of infection and is the first treatment that you can apply.
>>55337155
planet of the apes

>>55337919
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maggot_therapy>maggot

>>55339556
>Planet of the Apes RPG
I never knew I wanted that until now

>>55338639
Better than dying of gangrene

OP, get some fucking soap while you're at it

>>55339556
>planet of the apes
>monkeys develop their brains
>keep flinging literal shit

>>55337314
Depends on how you got the infection or disease, but immediately healing and open wound is going to prevent a lot of complications during the healing process that would normally be fatal.

>>55336683
People traditionally treated bleeding wounds by rubbing dirt into it, and there's actually some evidence to support it's usefulness as promise first aid. There's actually many species of fungus growing in soil that naturally produce antibiotics, and some clay filled earth is rich in metal ions that can act as antiseptics. It isn't going to save you from a deep wound contaminated with feces, and is generally inadvisable due to the (surprisingly low) possibility of secondary infections, but it is a traditional method of first aid that you might be able work from

>>55338752
>>55340294


Boiling water creates a large burn area. Burns are extremely prone to infection because the skin has been destroyed. It's essentially a massive open wound with the addition of compromised circulation. If you didn't have an infection before, you sure as fuck do now. And if you had an infection before, it just became 10x as severe. In a pre antibiotic and sterile field setting you are looking at nearly 100% fatality. Amputation is your only hope and even that has a very low success rate. You will most likely die.

>>55338542
*boiled
Boiled water, you dump truck, not boiling water.

>>55335949
Clean and wash the wound thoroughly. Scrape or cut away any infected tissue. If there is any disinfectant available, make sure to use it. (I prefer hydrogen peroxide, iodine will also work, but alcohol will do in a pinch)

Treat the wounds as soon as you are able, but not during combat. The longer you leave the wound untreated, the sooner infection will set in.

Bandage the wound in cloth or gauss, you can use strips of clothing if nothing else is available. Remember to continue to clean and wash the wound and change the bandages regularly.

>>55336683
There is a good chance that you are fucked.

But you can do a few things to improve your odds.

-Proper hygiene, clean the wounds with boiled water and wear clean clothes, wash regulary.

-Rub stuff on it. As some anons pointed out, Garlic and strong alcohol are good candidates, but so is honey. I'd try clean water, then alcohol and making some sort of band-aid with garlic or honey.

-If you aint Bitch-made (and do not need full funtion of your limbs), try burning it out with a hot iron, but this is pretty much your last chance ditch, because afterwards you will have to deal with a sizeable burn wound.

In general you wan't to clean it as fast as possible, also invest in good protection.
If your enemy pulls shit like that, consider just burning down the place.

>>55340773
If the wound is deep, you may need to apply suction (using a straw or reed if nothing else is available), or worse, dig any dung or dirt out of the wound with whatever is availible. (Make sure whatever you use to remove the filth is sterile, even if you only wash your hands before digging it out with a fingernail)

Of course, none of that means anything if you can't stop the bleeding. In order to staunch the flow of blood, make sure to tie a tourniquet tightly. (Some people say you shouldn't tie it too tight cause you will get gangrene, but they've never seen anyone about to bleed out. You can loosen it later, in an hour or two)

If a tourniquet doesn't work, use fire. Give you're patient something to bite onto. If they pass out from shock, they might die, so do everything in your power to keep them conscious. You may need to cauterize an artery or vein directly, or seal it off with a clamp, especially if its a leg wound.

>>55337596
That's ridiculous. Send a lab a sample of the coagulant, I'm calling your bluff.

The only thing I'm not really sure about is how to remove foreign objects from a body. You really need a surgeon for that sort of thing. You have to take into account blood loss and risk of infection when considering triage, i.e., how far it is to the nearest hospital or local clinic/ witch doctor.

In the modern era, we often consider leaving it in if the blood loss is not too severe. But like you said, without antibiotics, the risk of infection is pretty severe.

If you do decide to remove it, don't pussy foot around. Assumming a small object, just give it one firm tug. Don't pull it so hard it snaps.

If its a large object, like a piece of rebar, give it 2 or 3 hard tugs. Don't stop during the removal to see if you've opened an artery, just keep pulling and deal with the fallout after.

Generally you will know if you've pulled to hard or ripped open the wound by the screams of the patient.

>>55341084
Keep a steady hand, and remember: if you don't do anything, he is dead anyway. You can do no harm by attempting to intervene.

>>55337596
Your typing style is extremely obnoxious

One last thing:

If the wound has any sort of puss or boils, or looks as if the flesh around it is tight, you might need to lance the infection. Lancing is risky because it might spread the infection, so make sure to pour disinfectant on it immediately afterwards and have some cloth to absorb the fluids. Generally you should only lance a wound when the infection looks severe and does not look as if it will heal on its own. (Chances are if you have pustules the wound is already infected, lancing it properly will do no further harm)

>>55341123
Which is why you use line spacing to separate your paragraphs when there is no way to indent them.

Chicken noodle soup and sprite

>>55340332
I could make soap I guess. Just kill an animal and remove fat, or I need something else?

>>55339337
>honey has so much sugar that it disinfects wounds by stripping the fluid out of bacteria by osmosis. This is why it self preserves.
>acids, like citric acid or vinegar, are very anti bacterial and why they use acid to preserve food.
>salt of course kills bacteria as per honey and is used for preserving like vinegar.
>dog saliva is anti bacterial. That's one stage of why they can eat poo and not get ill. The second side is their highly acidic bowels.
>garlic and onions are also anti bacterial. Not sure why on this one.
>Burn filthy wounds then keep them dry to try and stem infection.

Jesus fucking christ, what are you, a witchdoctor? None of this shit is likely to be true.

>>55341246
Soap requires lye, lye is actually kind of complicated to make. Also, lye is not a disinfectant. Most disinfectant soaps use alcohol.

>>55336781
Alexander the great got injured in almost every single battle he fought in. This stupid "nick your finger and your dead without antibiotics" meme needs to fucking die.

>>55341380
Alexander the great had the best personal physicians on the planet

>>55341249
>honey has so much sugar that it disinfects wounds by stripping the fluid out of bacteria by osmosis. This is why it self preserves.
>acids, like citric acid or vinegar, are very anti bacterial and why they use acid to preserve food.
>salt of course kills bacteria as per honey and is used for preserving like vinegar.


>Jesus fucking christ, what are you, a witchdoctor? None of this shit is likely to be true.

Do you literally live under a rock and never cooked before in your life ?

>>55341249
Not that guy, but I can tell you the honey thing actually is true. Don't know about any of the rest though

>>55341329
Hmm. I could try making basic alcohol then.

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>>55341249
This better be fucking bait.

>>55341463
I can confirm the vinegar and garlic

>>55335949
Herbal medicine - not very successful but better than nothing - or cauterise the wound - would lead to extensive scarring. Or simply treat with salt water as an antiseptic.

Check out "Where there is no doctor" for a manual in third world shithole disease prevention.
http://hesperian.org/books-and-resources/

>>55341249
Honey, acid and salt is at least partially true, they are bactericidal *in food*. I doubt honey is effective as wound treatment, and salt would hurt like hell, but maybe acid could work. (Diluted, obviously, but if it's a non-technological society they won't have high concentration acid anyway)

I have never heard about the dog saliva thing, but it seems questionable at best, probably dangerous precisely because dogs eat nasty shit all the time. Garlic and onion are not bactericidal, that's a common misconception (folk remedy). Cauterizing wounds is a thing, but burns heal slower and are a huge infection risk even today, so it's not something to take lightly.

>>55337596
As a biochemist I can tell you this is nonsense

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>>55341751
They're all true, you dip. Garlic juice especially is known to be a good antimicrobial agent. Honey I can understand you not quite believing, as different types of honey have differing levels of effectiveness and it seems somewhat counterintuitive to introduce a sugar-rich substance into your body, but even that goes beyond the simple task of killing bacteria due to osmosis and actually EXPEDITES the healing process. Before you go spouting off what you perceive to be a simple folk remedy when the plants and substances themselves have actually been studied to inhibit bacterial growth, and in the case of honey even seeming to be able to prevent resistant strains from forming with high enough concentration, take the time to do a quick second glance on a search engine of your choice to prevent you from appearing as a bubble-blowing double faggot in the future.

>>55342488
Well that was a tad harsh.

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>>55340475
there is one minor problem with this rubbing dirt in the wound policy

>>55341249
honey is so dry that bacteria can't survive in it and so it can act as a disinfectant, but putting it on a wound can give it humidity making it a festering ground for bacteria.
It is useful to treat wounds as a makeshift antibiotic, but you must be careful in how you use it.

dog saliva is antibacterial, more than our saliva, but also full of bacteria. If you have a clean wound it's better to avoid dog saliva, but if it's been smeared with poop, or just soil then having a dog lick you is beneficial. In absence of a dog your own saliva is better than nothing .

Salt does kill bacteria, for the same reason as honey, but it also damages your tissue. Better avoid that one.
Vinegar and lemon juice are usful though. In fact you can "cook" things in either. Submergea slice of meat or fish in vinegar or lemon juice for some hours and its safe to eat.

Garlic has powerful antibacterial properties. And also pesticidal properties. it's antibiotic properties are also useful when eaten as food. Along with a bunch of other stuff. Eat garlic, it's good for you.
Onion is a less potent version of garlic.
There are also other plants with antibiotic properties, and plants with coagulant properties, and various other benefits.

here OP, read this
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC88925/

>>55337596
>modern science
No, that's bullshit hippy pseudo-science. Fuck off with that facebook """""""science"""""""" garbage before you kill more children with preventable diseases.

>>55337596
Woah Woah give the man the whole story.
Resident nurse fag here. The vitamins c was given at a high dose IV with corticosteroids and thiamine. It's not just eat an orange.

The first step is treating this like wilderness first aid. A wound doesn't automatically become septic. Soap and water are very efficient for a start. Alcohol should not be used in the wound but for sterilizing instruments.
Clean the wounds, clean bandages daily and amputate if needed. Other anon is right you don't have to solve the problem just give enough to the dm that he believes you have.

Lastly some plants have antiseptic properties. And ancient medicine wasn't all dumb. Maggots and bloodletting have a place in modern ln medicine. Also try not getting stabbed or if your dm is going to be a dick then you need to start poisoning water supplies, and your own biological warfare.

So did no one stop to think that if the world has this kind of understanding of microbiology, they'd probably have developed antibiotics?

>>55336560
>>55335949
as other Anons have said
properly cleaning and washing the wound etcetera, see here
>>55340860
>>55339337

I personally would go with escalating the affair.
and/or
Digging my own pit traps.
Employing fire, chemical, bio-
in fact I'd just start working my way through the Geneva Convention.

Have you considered rounding up some of the locals and using them to check for traps?
a peasant, a bit of rope and a ranged weapon, might solve your trap problem.


If you want to give details, I'll put on my "Dorf Fort over kill" hat and see what I can come up with

Wash it with water and soap

If you want to use a poultice or something, use mashed raw onion.

>>55342790
Okay, I will go and share what happened:

Me and the other players were in a plane, going on a trip. Suddenly we got hit by a mysterious energy, blacked out and woke up naked on an island.

So basically we start stripped naked. DM tells us that everything we have we will have to craft or scavenge. He is a fan of survival games and wanted to make something based on that.

So we start by grabbing materials, making some stone age tools and shelter. Pretty soon we ran into wild animals (like the entire fauna wants us dead for some reason), then native cannibals, then the 'crack boys', a group of psychos who weared rags and syringues. Now we are fighting the 'dung boys', a group that seems to idolize disease.

We still haven't got an infection (one of our boys got hit but he resisted), but after the hit we started discussing what to do if he had contracted it.

>>55335949
Don't get hit

Sterilise all wounds with alcohol and fire as quickly as possible after they are obtained

You're probably still likely to get an infection or blood poisoning, but those are all the measures you can take. Guerrila tactics are a bitch specifically because they just fuck you over.

>>55336683
If you don't already know how to identify plants with antibacterial properties, then chances are you're just gonna add a second poison to your system.

Wash out the wound with the strongest proof alcohol you have. Close it with gunpowder.

It probably won't work, you're probably gonna die or end up a shrivelled wreck, but them's the breaks when you fight the Việt Cộng.

>>55340475
Enjoy your tetenus

Don't try any old-style cures unless you really know what and why you are doing, because the wrong leaf rubbed into a wound can make things worse, and the wrong dirt rubbed into a wound will literally fucking kill you

>>55343435
For future reference, including important information in the OP question like it being a modern setting with no magic is how you avoid looking like a complete and utter retard and also not waste everyone's time.

>>55341249
These things are literally grade school chemistry/biology

Where do you live that you don't know these things?

>>55343613
I guess. But it also gives people a chance to imagine, which is good right?

>>55343635
Don't make excuses. It doesn't make you look less stupid, quite the opposite.

>>55343650
Geez.

>>55341249
>None of this shit is likely to be true
>likely
So you're saying you're a fucking retard who has no idea what they're talking about and just assumes whether something is true or not based on your feels and incredulity.
I'd say how embarrassing but you may be too stupid for any self-awareness for shame or embarrassment.

>>55335949
>How do you treat disease without antibiotics? Our enemies are using bolts and traps coated in filth and human waste.

As in like, legitly, "back in the day"?

Well, you suffered and your own natural immune system either fought it off... or you died. And quite often there were lasting effects afterwards even if you DID recover.

First aid still helps though. It's not so much "magically curing" where you get back hit-points, but it makes the following infection and risk of death a little bit better.

First off, stemming the blood loss helps fight off immediate shock. This is straight up removing "bleed counters".

Then clean the wound. That means physically scrapping out any material you can. The LESS poison/shit in your system the easier it will be to fight off. Dosage makes the drug.

Various "poultices" and "healing salves" acted as antiseptics, which would help with infection. Like Witchhazel. As a natural antiseptic (huh, and some natural antibiotic aspects...) If you spread it on a shit stick wound, the antiseptic will hopefully kill off some of the bugs in the shit.

Then closing the wound with bandages or sewing it back up helps protect it from further infection, and clots the blood flowing out once you take off the tourniquet or remove pressure.


And all of that will still be pointless sometimes if the weak-ass low constitution characters can't fight off a little bug.

>>55343883
>a fucking retard who has no idea what they're talking about and just assumes whether something is true or not based on your feels and incredulity.
>may be too stupid for any self-awareness for shame or embarrassment.
This is also known as "the average American."

>>55342528
This is 4chan, we call out retards out of the goodness of our hearts so they can learn, if you want a self-sabotaging safespace there are better sites for it.

>>55343959
>americans REEE!
OBSESSED

>>55341186
Unfortunately, these days you can't do that without newfags desperate to fit in screeching about reddit, especially /pol/fags which is ironic since they've brought in the biggest ever wave of reddit newfags from the_donald or whatever it's called. You reap what you sow though and I've already seen numerous posts over there regretting the newfag takeover.

>>55343959
How do you know the poster is american?

>>55335949
>How do you treat disease without antibiotics?
we will find out within our lifetimes

The CDC says we are almost out if antibiotics that diseases have not developed resistances towards

>>55344046
Because they're a fucking retard who has no idea what they're talking about and just assumes whether something is true or not based on your feels and incredulity and may be too stupid for any self-awareness for shame or embarrassment.

These are telltale signs of being an American. Though these symptoms can also indicate they're Australian or British, its less likely based on their typing style.

>>55344085
That's retarded. You cannot throw a nationality upon the air just because he said something stupid. There is a lot of nationalities here.

>>55344118
>t. Buttmad American

>>55344149
Brazillian, go back to /bant/ if you want country banter.

>>55344158
Go back to your safe space if you can't handle it.

>>55344158
>t. Buttmad South American

>>55335949
Alcohol kills most things.

(Microbes, relationships...)

>>55344224
>if you don't like shitposting you want a safe space
Lolno.

>>55344046
That anon is just OBSESSED with america due to their own insecurities.
Whatever country they come from is surely fucked up in its own ways.

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>>55335949
Huff jank get yo resistance game up bro.

Honey is a natural antibiotic. We still use it in dressings for some patients today. Some silver ions are natural antibiotics too. Really your best bet is to clean the wound, keep it dry, and keep it from getting wet. Clean it once a day. If it's infected with human waste, sorry bud, but you're probably already infected with E Coli and Staph, maybe some strains of Streptococcus. RiP in peace or hope for the best.

Source; actual medfag

As an aside, if you look at medical history, it was really Calvinball until around the late 1600s with occasional bright spots of good ideas from occasional doctors.

>>55342558
>>55343601
I never said it was a GOOD idea, only that there was some basis to the old remedy. We do derive a lot of modern antibiotics from soil fungal samples, with penicillin bring the first and most recognizable.

The clay I mentioned does get around the problem of pathogens assuming it has metal ions present (silver ions in particular are quite commonly used in the medical field), so it is technically still a viable option in a worst case scenario

>>55336683
Anyone have some mouldy bread?

>>55344891
It should be noted that medihoney is primarily for ulcers and burns. And may be inappropriate for battle injuries. Silver likewise is primarily used for prevention, in silver dressings like aquacel or acticoat. In these dressing the goal is to inhibit bacterial growth. Like wise with silver catheters the goal is prevention and not treatment.

Of note is without antibiotics there are not antibiotics resistant strains.

>>55345502
All true. I've honestly only even used medihoney to mitigate symptoms in the dying or compromised patient, but any port in a storm, you know?

>>55345591
In long term wound care it works nicely for pressure ulcers. Provides a protective most layer to promote healing. Similar for burns I assume. I guess fresh honey on a burn in a medieval setting might protect the burn from fluid loss. But you would still need to clean the burn daily. Probably making it quite painful.

Another use for honey is as a sweetener, making an apothecarys mix easier to swallow and taste better. Components that cannot be dismissed as non contributory.

RN in inpatient orthopedics and wounds. You?

>>55342629

I love when people post great sources and/or explanations and OP and the other millennial fucks just disregard it cause it dosent fit in their head.

I fucking hate people.

>>55345904
>implying people will literally click an outsider links
I never leave 4chan.

>>55345904
It doesn't even have a tl;Dr don't be a faggot. Not every person has been educated on the specific skill of reading scientific literature. It isn't just reading comprehensive, it is a skill.

Also
>clicking outside links Costanza.tiff

>>55335949
Eat a shit ton of plants in your diet that boost your immune system.

For instance, Stinging Nettle has four times the amount of vitamin C in it than an orange.

Rose Hips are also a good source of vitamin C.

>>55336741
The Romans were fucking retarded though. There was this one herb that was so effective at preventing unwanted pregnancies that the Romans hunted it to extinction.

Not a single person stopped to think, "Hmmm, maybe if instead of cutting this plant up and selling it I could transplant it to a pot, take it home, and grow a shit ton more that I can sell for a hundred times the profit!"

>>55341249
This is true, ever wonder why a beehive isn't covered in mold?

Ancient Egyptians did too, then figured out that honey is a natural disinfectant, and used it the way we use neosporin today.

Hell, honey is STILL used like that. If your parents never made you swallow a teaspoon of honey when you had a sore throat then they were shitty ass parents who didn't know jack shit.

Of course, it has to be all natural honey. More often than not the honey you buy in stores can be up to 70% corn syrup.

>>55340332
>>55341246
>>55341329
No no no.

What you need is soapanine. A chemical that certain species of plant produce. The roots of the Yucca plant is once source. This is what makes soap fizzle and create all the bubbles when wet.

Everything else, like animal fat and lye is just the "glue" that holds the soapanine together in a bar or lump for easy handling/packaging.

>>55341167
Before you lance it try to "bring it to a head" by applying cloth soaked in hot water directly to the infected site. Just keep a pot or kettle of water over a fire/coals so it's boiling continuously, then dump a bunch of rags into it. Take one out, and once it's cool enough to touch without burning, but not so cooled down that it isn't still hot, then lay it flat over the infected site. Keep rotating the rags so the infected site doesn't cool down.

The heated up puss will expand with the heat, and take the path of least resistance to relieve the pressure. Basically, it will lance itself, through the least amount of layers of skin/tissue.

Where as if you try to lance the wound yourself by hand, you are just guessing, and can accidentally stab in the wrong place, releasing the infection to spread under the skin.

>>55341751
Garlic is most definitely a natural disinfectant. I know because I had a nasty yeast infection that my ex gave me when I lost my virginity. I used minced garlic to cure it after doing some research online.

>>55336437
ROFl i wish my gm would let us, if i use that he makes the wxcuse for it not setting traps off as "oh its waitless and doesn't have a life therefore traps can't be set off by it"

>>55341410
Are you comparing modern day medicine/physicians to ancient medicine/physicians?

>>55344891
>>55345120
>silver is a natural disinfectant
>in ancient legends silver hurts werewolves

Huh....

>>55345904
>clicking outside links

Enjoy your viruses and porn pop ups.

>>55347350
In so far as expensive and highly trained doctors will treat ailments that would likely hinder or kill someone without their treatment? Yes.

>>55347475
You are technically correct, sir. But still, fuck you.

>>55342780
Well, you corrected me better than the other anons did.
I'll have to beat the ex-roommate who over-hyped the research, if he ever comes back to this state.
I did see the thiamine part, or that it was corticosteroids instead of anabolic. I was also mistaken for thinking that Taurine was a steroid (fuck you, internet!).
So the question is, can you find a plant or animal based source of extractable corticosteroids and thiamine? Can you extract them into a usable form with medieval-level alchemy/chemistry equipment?
And finally, can we find period evidence of this method being used, somewhere?

>>55347105
Of course they tried that, some shit just doesn't take to domestication. We still haven't figured out how to grow truffles in controlled environments.

>>55335949
This may come as a shock but that was rare IRL because of issues with rust. when it was done in Europe the best type of shit for it was view as Horse shit. It would cause tenosynovitis at a rather high success rate.

>>55335949
Roll a heal check to see if your character knows what to do.

>>55342488
>They're all true

No, they're fucking not. If they are you would be able to cite sources recommending salt and dog saliva for wound treatment.


I said that honey is bactericidal, bit questioned its use for treating open wounds. You can use it on burns, but we weren't talking about fucking burns.

If you have a source for garlic, not just garlic-derived compounds at higher concentrations than they occur naturally in garlic, but actual garlic, I would be interested.

>>55347330
Yeast is fungal, not bacterial.

>>55342528
If he was right I wouldn't care about the harshness, and if he was completely wrong he would just be making himself look stupid. You, on the other hand contribute nothing and should lurk more.

>>55335949

Find some local antibiotics, like Garlic, Myrrh, Honey, Thyme, Oregano... Each of them is for a different group of bacteria; better to make a mixture of all those you can find and take some every 8 hours.

Also, this might surprise you, but your body can generate surprising defenses. Help your good guys by keeping yourself warm without the slightest cold interruption; drinking enough water and vitamins, and eating well.

Put faith in your god or whatever it works to you, and cheer up your body, be thankful for all the good things it does for you. Think about it like cheering your football team so they play better: cells can hear you.

You can activelly help by cleaning the wounds with the most aseptic treatment you can manage. Your own urine is in a high percentage ammonia: apply it. Store the first piss of the morning, which for some reason has the highest ammonia peak, combined with the lowest toxin amount.

Consider amputating or purging with fire if the infection has bad signs and the wounds are in a non-vital part

>>55348669
Saliva definitely has antibacterial properties, it's the origins of the phrase 'licking your wounds'. I haven't heard of dog saliva being used specifically though, in general I think you want to keep it inside the same species. You definitely don't want komodo dragon saliva.

Honey can be used for open wounds if you combine it with something like corn starch or flour. Probably insufficient for a gaping hole in your stomach, but should help with a nasty cut on your arm.

>>55335949

Don't get hit, don't fall into traps.

ITT
>Filling wounds with honey
>Letting dogs lick the wound
>Stuffing wounds with garlic and onion

You're all dogs or cannibals. Right?

Holy fuck this thread became gold.
Posted last night before falling asleep and wake up to someone calling me a witch doctor followed by everyone calling him out. Feels good man.

>>55348835
Yes it is funny that the things I listed kind of sounds like an Asian marinade.
I tried it on chicken once, it wasn't great.

>>55336560
You either hope you are VERY lucky with the herbal medicine or whatever humour hocus pocus your doctor can conjure up
Or hope at least that God loves you and will answer your prayers if you pray real hard

>>55335949
>all disease is caused by bacteria

>>55342568
>In absence of a dog your own saliva is better than nothing .
No. No no no no.

Compared to a dog's, a human's mouth is like papa Nurgle's festering asshole.

>>55335949
Bread with spider nets. Mould that grows on it is actually penicillin and it was used in middle ages with good effects.

Everything in this thread is dedicated to a single problem. How about help for other ailments?
>Antithermics in case of fevers?
>Treating burn wounds
>Broken limbs
>Eye injuries
>Stomach pains / the runs
>Headaches

Anybody got something?

>>55350046
>tfw you always lick your cuts
should i really not? they heal pretty well

>>55350680
>cold water
>cold water
>splint (and cold water)
>(boiled) warm water
>no idea but drink water to prevent dehydration
>you're probably dehydrated, drink water

>>55348669
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10594976

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0112726

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12174037/

https://academic.oup.com/jac/article/43/6/837/754741/Antibacterial-effect-of-garlic-and-omeprazole-on

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4121107/

There. Take them all in. There's also quite a few other related pieces available to the right of three of these if these five aren't enough for you.

And for your edification on honey, though other anons further up have discussed the topic as well:
http://www.woundsresearch.com/article/honey-biologic-wound-dressing

And on the case of dog saliva and salt, at no point did I say they were your go-to soloutions. Saliva, dog or human, does have bactericidal properties in addition to oral flora working as a preventative for the purposes of competition. The mouth is an easy entryway for disease, and not having these would be astronomically detrimental. That's not to say you should go around licking wounds, that's asking for an introduction of something really fucking dangerous that doesn't have to deal with competition as it would in the mouth, but it's better than nothing and dog saliva's a stronger contender to help you than human saliva. On the matter of salt using plain salt is not advised, as a saline solution is far more useful, but it does still maintain its bactericidal properties for a range of microorganisms. Given the constraints of the setting, these are likely to be OP's best bets in the absence of other things.

>>55350692
Being a filthy cunt in general and you being lucky.

Just wash it and put on a plaster.

>>55350680
>
>Antithermics in case of fevers?
Bloodletting
>Treating burn wounds
Bloodletting, pour blood of healthy virging child on wound
>Broken limbs
Amputation
>Eye injuries
Scoop out eye and the more bloodletting
>Stomach pains / the runs
>Headaches
Surprise surprise, guess who it is.
The leeches

>>55350046
read the rest of the post and understand the context.
If your wound is clan don't lick it or let a dog lick it.
If there's shit or dirt or soil then licking it with saliva will reduce your risk of infection.

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>>55336683
Alcohol has been used to clean wounds and numb pain for thousands of years. It can also make water safe to drink and be burned for light. Highly distilled alcohol is pretty much essential on the low fantasy battlefield.

>>55336737
No, people died most often as infants or kids, bringing the average down. Generally if you lived to see 20 you'd at least see 65.

>>55335949
Sulfa drugs. Chemical cocktails that poison bacterial infections.

>>55341249
It's actually legit, this is how people did it for centuries.

Turns out not everyone who got so little as a scratch died of septic shock in ye olde times.

>>55335949
You endure it and recover or you die

>>55335949
Anything with a lot of alcohol, sugar, acidic compounds or good old fashioned "wash it and cauterize the bleeding area". Combinations based on severity of infection and injury do some good.

There's also this fancy thing called "immune systems" which are stronger in populations with less access to modern medicine, so consider that you might just Con Save (or game equivalent) your way to victory.

>>55341084
Don't take it out. Leave the bullet in you do more damage risk deeper infection and cause lasting damage digging things out.

>>55337919
Silver is also bactricidal.

>>55348673
>Garlic, Myrrh, Honey, Thyme, Oregano
And if the patient kicks it anyway, you can cook 'em up and eat 'em afterwards.

>>55337919
Boiled wine? Congratulations, you just un-distilled your booze. But I guess the tannins may be somewhat anti-bacterial.

>>55336560
>>55335949
Soap.

Properly cleaning wounds is how to not die.

>>55352384
I'd say you're well above low-fantasy if your setting is producing highly distilled alcohol in commercial quantities.

>>55352872
There's a reason you use tannin to preserve hides, anon.

You forget, wine was fermented and largely not filtered, so the chances of a yeast-based infection were high, so boiling it killed the yeast, left some alcohol intact, but also concentrated the tannins.

>>55342528
Welcome to 4chan, watch out, sometimes people say 'nigger' here!

>>55345704
Hospice, former Infectious Disease.

>>55353360
I'm not saying you need a tun of it, just a couple barrels.

>>55335949
As I understand it, there are differences between disinfectants, antiseptics, and antibiotics.

Disinfectants are used to kill microorganisms in a non-living context, e.g., on surfaces. They can be quite harsh: think alcohol or bleach.

Antiseptics are used on living things, e.g., to kill bacteria on or near a wound. Think iodine or Neosporin (although Wikipedia lists iodine as a disinfectant; I guess the categories aren't hard ones). The majority of this thread has concerned antiseptics.

Antibiotics are used inside living things. They have the special property of selectively killing bacteria without harming your own cells. These compounds are harder to find than disinfectants or antiseptics, which is why antibiotics are a relatively recent thing.

I think the best course of action here is to clean the wound with soap and water first, and then dress the wound using some variety of antiseptic. An actual infection is difficult to treat without antibiotics; you're probably stuck with "amputate" or "hope your immune system can cope with it."

>>55339337
The ones I wouldn't want to try: salt, dog saliva, burning. Salt has a long history as a food preservative, but it's really hard to imagine that it would work well as a wound dressing, and painful enough to give rise to the old expression about rubbing salt in someone's wounds. I'm not sure dog saliva would even make a decent food preservative. And burns, of course, are notorious infection risks.

>>55343622
It'd be a waste of time to teach this stuff in grade school. There, you want to focus on questions like "What is a cell?" and "What's in cells?" rather than specific wound treatments.

>>55342629
>>55345904
I usually just post the paper directly. Thanks for linking to a review rather than a single study, although it's kinda dated, being published in 1999. A lot of what's in here is somewhat speculative or highly specific, so it'd be hard to use in a roleplaying campaign.

>>55335949
use the heal skill lol

>>55354214
(cont'd)

>>55351351
Honestly, this is pretty weak. Ankri and Mirelman (1999) concerns pure allicin and is behind a paywall anyway, the methodology of Lemar et al. (2002) is aimed at yeast cultures, Jonkers et al. (1999) is totally irrelevant inasmuch as we aren't talking about ulcers, and Wallock-Richards et al. (2014), like Ankri and Mirelman (1999), tests allicin against bacterial cultures, rather than any sort of topical or in vivo preparation. Sood et al. (2014) is actually on point and recent, and it substantiates the honey recommendation, but it's focused on contemporary wound dressings and doesn't have anything to say about dog saliva, garlic, salt, burns, or acids. The most important sentence in it is in the abstract: "Few high-quality, randomized controlled trials evaluating wound dressings exist and do not clearly demonstrate superiority of many materials or categories." However, it does have a lot to say about silver, which is really interesting.

I'm not buying "it's better than nothing", either. It may actually be worse than nothing. The garlic idea might be worth a try, based on Wallock-Richards et al. (2014), but I wouldn't claim it's well-substantiated.

>>55335949
Herbs with astringent qualities. Clean the wounds with purified, water diluted grain alcohol. Cover their weapons in righteous flame from a flaming position.

>>55355202
>flaming
*flanking

>>55354231
Roleplaying bonus on skill checks

>>55335949
>>55336560

Unless your setting has germ theory (why would it?) or someone has stumbled on (and propagated) the notion of cleaning wounds, hands, and tools/bandages, the only answer is pray.

>>55347105
They did cultivate Silphium. The city-state in the area it grew revolved their entire economy around cultivating and shipping it. It was even depicted on their currency. But it wouldn't grow anywhere other than that specific part of North Africa, and between a minor climate shift and Roman governors going ham on overharvesting, it couldn't survive.
Also, it didn't prevent pregnancies, it "encouraged the menstrual cycle", which is a polite way to say it flushed zygotes down the drain. And it was used in cooking and as a cure for nearly every other medical problem they could find, some of which even were mitigated or cured by it.

>>55348673
Don't just store the urine. Boil it to create your own ammonia.

>>55350680
For headaches and general aches and pains use willow bark tea. The ingredient in it that alleviates pain is actually the origin of aspirin. So there is literally no difference between taking a couple of aspirin and drinking a cup of willow bark tea.

As for stomach pains/the runs eat a mixture of ground up charcoal and fire pit ash. This has all kinds of health benefits, from absorbing whatever toxins are in your gut so you poop them out, to lowering the amount of stomach acid to combat heartburn/ulcurs, to safely cleaning your teeth due to charcoal being just abrasive enough to remove plaque but not abrasive enough to damage your teeth. (make sure it's GROUND up charcoal though, so you don't chomp down on a solid piece of unburnt wood and lose a tooth) This is why eating dark toast is supposed to be so good for you, even if the bread is shitty white bread. Because it's not the bread that matters, it's the burnt black charcoal that matters.

>>55335949

clean the wound thoroughtly ASAP rest in the most clean and quiet you can find and hope for the best.

If you don't have the chemicals for cleaning a wound or a clean place then just hope for the best.

In realty is not necesarily not "that" bad, our inmune systems have been dealing with out unholy retardness for millions of years and have become quite adept at dealing with infections. The problem is that some bacteria are better than others at overcoming it too and when you heal like this you require time for both healing and recovering and you can expect that long term consequences would become much more common

And of course, death, for every wound there is still a chance of things going bad, slim, but if your line of work means that you will receive many small injuries at some point you are going to fall in the low end of the statistic.

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>this thread
>that feel when I receive a better education on fucking 4chan of all places than I ever did in school

>>55356749

uuuh, no anon, you are just under the illusion that people here know what they are talking about because you haven't been exposed to the same level of shallow knowledge(and probably false, inefficient or misguided) than the rest of us here, hence why it seems like people here know things but in reality they are not that much different from a trip to wikipedia.

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>>55356749
That's because academia has been turned into a tool of indoctrination and enforced mediocrity rather than learning applicable information and skills.

>>55356798
>shallow knowledge
Little bitch, my family's been working in the medical field for three fucking generations.

>>55356846
>Little bitch, my family's been working in the medical field for three fucking generations.

or so you claim.

you know? Even if you showed us a medical degree no one would even know if it would belong to you unless you put your ID next to it(which would be a very retarded move, specially here) and I'm not a medic so even if you started deploying your "knowledge" I couldn't tell the difference between you and a person who has just read many books and then turns out that they are about homeophathy or some bullshit like that.

The only thing that can tell you if someone is right or not here, is logic and common sense, and in reality these aren't that trustworthy at all except for very basic things.

So, I recommend to just put yourself under the /b/ law of disbelief: The stories and information posted here are artistic works of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact

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>>55356969
>these aren't that trustworthy at all except for very basic things.
It's not like people have already been citing sources for their information or anything.

>>55354214
This post has the correct idea, also if they're using anything related to Standard Earth based disease, some of the risks, such as Tetanus for example, are helped by your vaccinations.

>>55347409
Ironic coincidence more than anything. Another natural disinfectant is copper, in fact many hospitals have been switching to copper door handles as of late. Any pathogens left on them die quickly which is very helpful in high traffic areas

>>55347433
You're not wrong. The National Center for Biotechnology Information (NCBI) is well known for its viruses. Try looking up the website beforehand if you're so worried about it newfriend

>>55357054
Don't feed the trolls, they only cite Wikipedia

>>55341249

How do you not know about honey. Or salt.