EDH/Commander General /edhg/

Reposting from last thread

Is the way that champion creatures + Ianna combos off

Creature enters, Champion and Ianna both occur on ETB, as they are simultaneous, you choose order they go on stack, set Ianna to resolve before champion, make a copy, copy champions the origional, then sac the copy to get the original back, then repeat?

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>>54869238
>Who is your favorite Golgari Commander?

Gitrog forever and always. Rog planeswalker when?

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>>54869332
Savra is my waifu

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People keep recommending warp world for my Wort deck but I don't really understand why. It's good in almost no situations and for the cost is a complete gamble, is there something im missing.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/goblin-parade-1/

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>>54869537
Play this instead and wait for someone to play a "x target permanent" card, nothing like returning every players everything to their hand or exiling the entire board on turn 19

>>54869238
>Thread Question:
I've been enjoying Hepatra a lot, but Nath is my main man.

>>54869557
Ghave, Sporebro.

My buddy and I are splitting a case of the new C17 commanders. He's getting the Vampires, I'm getting the wizards. Then, we are going to either flip a coin, roll a die or whatever to divvy up the other two.

Anyway, what's everyone thinking about upgrades to the Wizard deck? I'm thinking about changing the commander to Kess and just make a deck slanging spells. But I'm not really sure. Any suggestions?

>the dude who runs unglued/unhinged cards in his deck to make everyone do weird shit

It's almost that time again. Besides the juicy land art does anyone ever consider the silver bordered cards for their decks.

>>54869686
Never considered the silver bordered cards for a deck, just not my thing. But I don't mind playing against them, depending on the card.

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>>54869686
I'm planning to run Double Cross on Nebuchedennazar discard shenaningans.
Would you agree to be thoughtseized turn 0 next game?

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>>54869644
Kess makes a really good storm commander which you can do easily without going full competitive EDH. Add tons of cheap cantrips like Preordain and Ponder and use things like Mind's Desire or Empty the Warrens to either win or just create tons of value.

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>>54869443
>>54869332
Move aside, nerds, I have a Protean Hulk to reanimate.

>i-i swear i own an original copy of this card
>i-i just dont want to buy the same card for ever deck

>>54869844
Oh shit guys, he got us. Pack it up, we're done here.

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>>54869827

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>>54869827
*discards lands behind you*
Heh, nothing personnel kid.

>>54869827
Well, at least there were two classy answers until this showed up

Edgar Markov is a retarded 1v1 commander.

>>54869879
To be fair 1v1 EDH is a retarded format.

Is it just me or is C17 underwhelming powerwise?

I mean I'm sure that they are fun to play, but there isn't much in terms of powerful cards.

>>54869238
>Who is your favorite Golgari Commander?
I hate to say it, but Meren. The hipster part of me cries out for Hapatra, but Meren works.

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>>54869928
As well as moneywise. I've come to terms with communist cat, but Teferi's bullshit is going into every white deck from now on, let alone Ad Nauseam combo

They had one job. Don't let Mirri to "duel" horde-vs-1 and add "If it's you turn, end the turn" to Teferi's Protection". You know, like Day's undoing that does milder thing

>>54869938
>As well as moneywise
Are the cards not worth the msrd?

>>54869970
Msrp

>>54869970
I didn't go as far as comparing the prices of every card, but the lands are shit and there are only a few playable pieces of removal, all far below 10$, so I say yes.

>>54870017
>At the beginning of your upkeep, end the turn.
Very useful.

>>54869686
I have a City of Ass proxying a City of Brass in one of my decks

>>54870017
>you have no permanents every turn
genius man

>>54870017
Panoptic Mirror is banned, anon.

>"All in all, there's a strong argument that the Commander 2017 decks are the best ever released in the Commander series."

Is SaffronOlive high on drugs?

>>54870066
I'd love to hear said argument.

>>54870066
Shills are a thing.

>>54870066
Maybe he is just a huge fan of lands that enter the battlefield tapped.

>>54870088

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/commander-2017-ranking-the-decks

>>54870066

no he's just retarded.

>>54869970
When they're saying every single new card is worth $10, yes.

>>54869928
It's about the same as every other set of precons. Let's just look at the new commanders

>Kess
Potent enough to get grumblings out of the Eternal Competitive demographics, unseats top-tier favorite Jeleva as the new queen of Grixis Storm.

>Inalla
Infinites the bed about as well as Karador

>Dragons Taigam
Taigam Turns is going to be a thing; he's probably at a similar power level to Kaalia, really with the same general weakness to disruption. Except he's got blue to run interference.

>Mirri
I feel like she's consistently underrated here; powerful on the offense and defense.

>Ramos
Is primed to do some real stupid shit.

>Mairsil
King of jank, perhaps, but still powerful enough to provoke interest

>Mathis
Cheap, efficent, and offers potential CA (at the cost of doing a little group hugging) in Mardu. While not amazing he does open up new avenues of play.

>Ur Dragon
Not the hero Dragons deserved, but the one their expensive asses needed.

>Edgar
Represents a decently effective commander under the cEDH level. We got 3 or 4 essentially competitive commanders, it's surprising we're not scraping rock bottom by now.

>Khans Taigam
Not a superb commander but he is viable for dimir and decent in the 99. Folks run Tomorrow, and he has a lot of Tomorrow's benefits with the added upside of a killer activated ability.

>Arahbo
Cute, but not going to cut it in multiplayer. We are now in the realm of honestly weak commanders.

>Wasitora
OK forced sacrifice is never bad but Shattergang is probably better for that shit.

>Balan
Comes in third among Mono-white Voltron commanders after Sram and 8.5 Tails. Too bad Monowhite Voltron is kinda shitty.

>O-Kagachi
Everyone's favorite disappointment, he'll helm 5c Spiritcraft and fit right in. Protip: That's never gonna be a good deck

>Nazahn
At least Balan came with one of the most critical Voltron abilities (Double Strike) and a way around equip costs at 4 CMC.

>Licia
Garbage. There's one or more in every set.

>>54870066
Has he actually seen the decklists? Jesus

>>54870105
I really hope noone tries to play the dragon deck out of the box.

>>54870141
>Protip: That's never gonna be a good deck
Y-you don't know that!

>>54869871
What's the story behind this? Why isn't it just a random monster?

>>54870017
>>54870040
>>54870054
what a mess

>>54869873
Who cares about being classy when you do everything that Golgari does but even better?

>>54870141
>everyone's favorite disappointment.
In true spirit of Kamigawa.

>>54870141
licia is probably better than some of those other lower-tier comnanders. if you can proc her cost reduction on turns 3-5 and play her she's pretty good. i never underestimate cost reduction from the zone

>>54870141
>about the same as every other set of precons
The legendaries are pretty ok, but the rest of the decks are pretty bad. The only card worth something is Mirari in Cats deck, but then, Cat has the worst eminence out of them all.

>>54870169

>http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/magic-story/sacrifice-2016-03-23

Long story short, its an oversized Hypnotoad that eats sheep and people and takes over an entire village community.

>>54870211
Can you cost-reduce her commander tax?

>>54870066
He's actually retarded because he suggested vampires going Mardu isn't going to be a thing and they'll take apart the vamp deck to make an Olivia deck instead.

You know, because the best board wipes and best targetted removal in the game aren't going to make it worth it.

>>54870165
"Fun" and "Good" aren't the same thing, anon.

>>54870222
You just need to regain 2 more life

>>54870141
>Folks run Tomorrow, and he has a lot of Tomorrow's benefits with the added upside of a killer activated ability.

No, Tomorrow's benefit is making it impossible to deck yourself out. Tomorrow is a shenanigans commander, and Evil Taigam does not fit into the same niche.

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You guys got any ideas for Kess?

>Secrets of the Dead
>Dream Halls
>Increasing Vengeance
>Increasing Ambition
>Burning Vengeance
>Mystic Speculation (and other buyback cards)
Though some of those a probably too cute and should be cut for general goodstuff.

1cmc red burn removal like Lightning Bolt and Flame Slash don't normally do very well in EDH, but I think Kess could make it work. With Kess, Flame Slash becomes "RR: Deal 8 damage to target creature, or 4 damage to two target creatures. Exile Flameslash."
That's pretty good.

I've also considered running some targeted discard spells. Thoughtseize is normally pretty shit in multiplayer because you're sharing the card disadvantage with the targeted player, putting you behind everybody else. Being able to recast it from the grave makes it a little more viable. Probably still not worth it though.

You could also run her as a reanimator. Mill everybody with cards like Mesmeric Orb and then cast reanimation spells from your graveyard. With Kess, every reanimation spell is basically an Unburial Rites, so you can get great value from milling everything.

I've also considered having a janky infect subtheme.
>Tainted strike + 2x Titan's Strength = 10 poison counters
That sort of thing.
But that's too shitty, even by my incredibly low standards.

Honestly, I'm probably just going to run a shitload of cantrips and rely on Docent of Perfection for the win like a do in Izzet spellinger.
At least I can now double-dip into Seething Song like a filthy degenerate.

>>54870254
Taigam stops you from decking yourself too though.

>54870255
What I like about Grixis reanimator is how it folds to gravehate, despite being tricolor. I run daddy Sedris only with backbreaking effects and infinite combos (and then still put it away when serious business starts) and jeleva only with storm. I tried to make my favorite combo work in semi-casual, but it rarely does

>>54870274
Yeah, once a turn, but he doesn't make it impossible.

>>54870288
Oh, fair.

How many creatures vs noncreatures does Edric usually run? Gonna try my hand at building him, but not using Walks

>>54870066
Who?

So, only way to get the decks near MSRP at the moment is to order all four at once, which I really don't want to do because I hardly play paper commander as it is.
Which decks do you think are going to tank below MSRP after release and which will stay above it/rise further?

>>54870372
Wizards is the only one that I can see getting a decent price. But they are all pretty horrible, I would try to get a c16.

>>54870222
Yup, same way you can Karador.

>>54870340
I built a budget Edric with 90% creatures and it was super boring and linear.

Edric is ridiculously cheap to build, yet still very strong, but after playing with him a few times you've experience everything he has to offer.

I still recommend building him. I mean, he's so cheap, so why not?
However, for the sake of fun, don't run:
>70 1cmc evasive creatures and mana dorks
>28 lands
>Notorius Throng
Put some other stuff in there, even if you make the deck a little weaker in the process.

>>54870397
I already have the C16 deck I want, so I'm good there.

I'm a massive catfag and the deck looks ho-hum at best, so I'm planning on getting the feline one. I still have most of a Kemba deck, so I already have plenty of upgrades.
Going GW instead of monowhite means I won't have a manabase worth a fuck, though.

>>54870211
To what end are you reducing her cost, though? Karador is good not just because you can drop his cost, but because he actually does something worth doing once he's on the field. Licia's sole ability to buff herself once per turn cycle inclines her towards Voltron without giving her any of the tools she really needs to succeed in an already dubious role. So you drop her and dump 5 life and if she doesn't eat a path you dump 5 more and swing with your 10/10 to get it all back, only to have her come to a dead stop on a Saproling that is then immediately sacrificed to deny the lifelink. What then? Good commanders support their deck as well as being supported by their deck, and either present a devastatingly good plan A or a backup plan or plans that allow them to continue to play with the hope of winning if the board hasn't gone their way. The best commanders often do both.

Licia does none of that. She has one plan and it involves swinging without native haste, evasion, or defenses better than a high toughness, meaning she has to have her deck covering for her deficiencies.

The other five bottom-of-the-bin commanders all have something she doesn't. Voltron buddy Balan has Double Strike access and "Grab all" that makes resetting far easier. Nazahn, the other Voltron Buddy, at least tutors up something he wants. Wasitora is an evasive beater who at least messes with peoples boards. O-Kagachi, probably the other worst of the lot, gets you all five colors. And Arahbo at least has Eminence for constant value and grants trample with his "Go Tall" nonsense; there's a reason people want to get cute and have him run infect. What does Licia do that compares to any of those?

Pretty much every commander newer than c13 is below 5$, but Atraxa is 20$. How so?

>>54870439
If it makes you feel better, cats have the best landbase of them all(that is not say much though), and it has Mirari in case you don't already have it.

>>54870431
Yeah honestly I'm just looking for a cheap creature beatdown deck. What would you substitute in place of a chunk of the flyers/unblockables?

>>54870440
Synergizes with and can help trigger big lifegain?

I imagine the idea is to get effects that care about gaining loads of life at once, rather than tiny amounts like Karlov.

She's undeniably weak, but I don't think she is without purpose.

>>54870453
Atraxa is pushed to the point of being overpowered, is extremely open-ended, and synergizes with two of the most popular strategies in the format, +1/+1 counters and superfriends.

She is the most popular commander ever, I think.

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Anything I should cut/add to this list?

>>54870480
According to EDHrec, she's the most played commander of all time by a significant amount. That's only based on the decklists submitted to tappedout, but it seems to be about right based on her price.

>>54870541
Add green, roll Wortmother

>>54870541
>35 lands
>1 (ONE) rock
>that mana curve
Damn you suck at this.

>>54870576
Maybe suggest things instead of "lol u sux im pro tour edh champion"

>>54870541
Mogg Infestation and Descent of the Dragons are nice ways to double up on all your creatures for Purph triggers.
Also general Purphoros goodstuff you might want to add: Panharmonicon, Tempt with Vengence, and Norin the Wary.

>>54870613
Not with that attitude.

>>54870613
Go fuck yourself champ.

Hey guys, quick question about Athreos, If I'm trying to sacrifice Fiend Hunter with a Karmic Guide underneath can I stack the triggers so that Athreos' ability fizzles and I can combo off or is that not possible?

>>54870613
I'll give you advice since that guy's in a bad mood: add Kher Keep and Valakut as lands.
For mana rocks, you really want 2cmc ones to power out Purphoros on turn 3. Viable ones include: Mind Stone, Charcoal Diamond, Ruby Medallion, Iron Myr, Star Compass, Coldsteel Heart, and maybe Everflowing Chalice.
About 6 of these should be enough.

>>54870701
You're only allowed to stack triggers during a full moon when there are exactly 37 cards left in your deck.

>>54870141
>>Inalla
>Infinites the bed about as well as Karador
The only actually decent Inalla combo is Wanderwine Prophets. Inalla is much more of a tribal value deck than a competitive combo deck. I guess getting a repeatable Venser trigger for 3UU is pretty good, but it's only an actual wincon if you already had infinite colored mana. And in that situation, if you were using Deadeye and Chron, Inalla is totally redundant

>>54870620
Hmm I thought Mogg infestation and Descent were more expensive than they were hence why I never got them. Tempt is way too pricey for me at 13~ tix.

>>54870340
I run 10 counters, but they're the ones like Dream Fracture that draw other people cards so I can make fragile alliances 'cuz I'm a gay like that. I have a couple mass bounces and green removal, and the rest is evasive creatures, ramp and a Beastmaster Ascension

>>54870017
I think this is exacly what teferi did when the invasion begun.
do you want to loose your spark anon?

>>54870724
This doesn't help me, It's not a full moon tonight and I'm test playing the deck later.

>>54870732
Entomb/Fatestitcher/Mesmeric Orb costs 3UB and wins the game.

>>54870710
Cheers boss, I'll have a gander at what you've suggested.

>>54870467
I'm looking through my Edric deck now and most of my non-evasive-1cmc cards are generic Simic goodstuff, so perhaps it's my own fault I got bored of Edric so quickly.

You could include a few massive fat green creatures. Use things like Plasm Capture, Ashnod's Altar and Kydele to get them onto the field quickly. That way, your deck has a backup plan and is a little more versatile.

Most 1cmc evasive creatures are all the same in function, so Edric tends to play the same way no matter which of those 1cmc creatures you choose to cast. Playing 1cmc flier over another is a redundant decision.
On the other hand, many 8cmc creatures have some crazy effect that'll change the state of the board when they enter the battlefield. Playing one 8cmc creature instead of another 8cmc can lead the game down a drastically different path.

Perhaps this is just my inner Timmy talking, but you could use your fliers and mana-docks to ramp into something fat and interesting to close the game out, instead of just winning with Triumph of the Hordes.

Take Druids' Repository for example. You can generate a ridiculous amount of mana with this in an Edric deck, and it only cost 30 cents.

>>54870765
Wow, a three card combo where none of the pieces individually support the gameplay. Basically every deck ever can set something like that up. I would hardly say Inalla has the combo potential of Marath, Karador, Animar, etc.

>>54870787
Hey that's a neat idea. I'm gonna try not to run Craterhoof either, I just have to find some goofy fatties to use instead

Are Hatebears even feasible in a beatdown meta? I want to be a dick and make everyone miserable but I doubt Hatebears is the best way to do it with my group

>>54870820
>Grave manipulation isn't part of the gameplan
lul

>>54869238
>Who is your favorite Golgari Commander?
Probably Meren
I really like the color combination in other formats but I cant really find a commander I would bother building

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>>54869873
>you dont have class unless you play what I want you to play

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Update on that sperg who totally wasnt just larping about asking a girl out via edh?
also daily reminder

>>54870765
I can see how you'd deck yourself with this combo to win with Lab Man, but how do you actually win with just those cards?

>>54870954
Yes, because class is about others' perception of yourself. If you are a closet faggot, keep it to yourself and nobody would have a problem

So, I wanna play a GWx deck but not Naya since I already have an Angry Omnath deck and I don't want to repeat two colors. Should I go Abzan or Bant? I usually like midrange-y value decks, and I also don't like to be a huge target from the get-go. I'm considering Roon, Jenara, Anafenza, Ghave or Teneb, but I could also hear some other suggestions.

>>54871005
>class is about others' perception of yourself
no thats called an opinion

>>54870765
>Waaaahhhh Inalla is broken
>Posts a shittier version of the Basalt/Orb combo that could be ran in any deck that uses Labman.

http://commandertheory.com/post/164148373497/c17-commander-set-review

Thoughts on this review of the set?

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>Cat deck gets some really good shit
>dragon is nerfed to hell and back on account of its fucked landbase
>vampire and wizard is what I expected

How did they manage to fuck this up? Only singles are worth buying over this crap

>>54871004
Mill yourself, untap one land with the last Fatestitchet, get a Narcomoeba, two Fatestitchers and the Narcomoeba to Flashback a Dread Return, get a Bloodline Necromancer, use the mana from the land to copy it with Inalla, get a Snapcaster and a Laboratory Maniac, Flashback a Gitaxian Probe for 2 life, win.

>>54870632
>>54870655
haha you stupid fucking cunts

>>54871113
>Also, this might be the first Commander deck to ever run Whip Sergeant.
He does miss that Skyship Stalker is a better haste enabler for Mairsil also underestimate the uses for Ramos on combo but his review of the new commanders is pretty spot on.

>>54870613
Even though you're a dumb faggot I'll help you out. All edh decks typically run 38-40 lands you want to run very few enter tapped lands unless you have utility lands, mana rocks should always be at least 4-7 depending on the deck now fuck off

>>54871112
Yeah, that's another combo you can run. It's almost like I'm saying that Inalla is a good combo commander.

Why do they assign cards in precons, especially singleton formats like commander, a rarity?
Only thing I can think of is for formats like pauper.

>>54871213
You do know edh cards can be used in legacy/vintage?

>>54871213
Yes.

>was planning on making planeswalker teferi
>got bored halfway through, put all of the mana rocks and artifacts but couldn't find motivation to finish it
>swing by the flgs, pick up an Oona
>suddenly a light shines specifically on me
>all the deck does is ramp, cast oona, then deck people in a variety of ways
>that feel running unwinding clock, untaping 20 mana worth of rocks each turn, and decking people while also shitting out more faeries than the table can handle
>the next step is adding paradox engine for maximum fuckery
I'm so excited boys, I think I've finally found the perfect deck.

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Anyone have more ideas of what the final out is for UB Cycling.dec?

I have Chasm Skulker, the demon, Drake Haven, Faith of the Devoted.

I'm considering Zombie infestation, nuKozilek and similar, but they only really go crazy if I land an Alhammaret's Archive or Thought Reflection.

Though, I did get to stifle a Aetherflux Reservoir with Obstructionist and New Perspectives the other day.

>>54871206
Lol someones a bit angry, did you lose to someone running a budget meme phage deck with your $2000 dollar atraxia?

>>54871196
I am excited for Blighted Bat. It is literally the only card with colorless haste activation in these colors, which is insane to me. It just got printed too.

>>54871208
What I'm saying is Inalla isn't much better as a combo commander than the average Grixis commander

>>54870888
Depends. I think Gaddock would suck but the new Mirri looks pretty good for that. Stuff like Grafdigger's Cage and Containment Priest would be good too

If I use Buried Alive can I decide the order of the cards in the grave?

>>54871246
>implying anyone still cares about atraxa>>54871277

>>54871285
Yeah, but playing graveyard order matters cards is being a dick to your playgroup.

>>54871285
Yes. If cards enter the grave simultaneously their owner chooses the order.

>>54871313
>being this casual

>>54871259
Bat is probably the second best haste enabler because of colorless activation but Stalker at least has a secondary effect on the pump that could come in handy for Commander damage kills.

Also I don't even know how to build him I tried three different lists, from playtesting on Forge it's so hard to cage cards fast, but I don't want to shot straigh to a two card combo as fast as I can, I know I'll be bored with that quickly.

>>54871337
>attacking with Mairsil
Jesus Christ What Are You Doing.

How many mana rocks do you tend to run 3-color decks that don't feature green? I'm in Grixis and I'm trying to hit that sweetspot of ramp, color fixing, and consistency but I'm not too familiar with 3-color. It helps that it leans heavily to blue so I'm not having to shell out for a lot of expensive stuff, but I still want to strike a proper balance.

>>54871337
I have a list on Forge, but it is useless to test without Mairsil implemented.

The deck does surprisingly a lot without him, but I guess it is expected with so many creatures.

I'm okay with Buried Aliving the same stuff every game, since it doesn't win on the spot. But that might change after playing against real people.

>>54871360
Depends on curve, but I like somewhere between 8 and 10.

Surely there must be some synergy or strategy I'm not thinking of with Edgar Markov.

Everything I try doesn't work. Is go-wide aggro really all he can do?

>>54871360
12, assumg you want to draw at least 1 ramp card in your opening hand

having 12 rocks is about 70% chance of drawing one on turns 1 or 2. putting any less decreases your chance of drawing that ramp to such a low chance that it's not reliable to mulligan for the ramp. having more than 12 ramps will usually give you a bunch of dead draws after you're done ramping.

so 12 is pretty much the perfect number.

there are specific cases where you want a different number though. my maelstrom deck runs about 18 ramp cards though, but that's because it needs to hit that 8 mana before it does anything.

>>54871424
monoblack stax

cast smokestack and then drop shitty vampire tokens all day long to feed it

it probably won't be good but you will probably make your group hate WotC

>>54871424
Aristocrats? Seems like he could make a good skullclamp.dec.

>>54871353
Chimeric Staff + Hateflayer, kill one with combat damage, the other with Hateflayer's damage. I had some other pieces that cared about Mairsil's size too.

>>54871113
Oh right, Locust God+Kindred Discovery draws your whole deck.

>>54871206
Do people actually run 38-40 lands, I never run more than 34 and that's only in decks where I want to be able to get to 10 drops, most of my decks have had 29-31 and I never have mana issues

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Post cute cards.

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>>54871562
>Post cute cards.

>>54871559
I run Azusa Lands.dec so I've got 50 lands there because nonbasic lands are my drug.

>>54871559
I start at 35 and cut from there
start at 10 mana rocks and go up from there
some green deck I run up to 38 lands but 40 seems excessive unless theres a reason you want close to half of your draws to be lands
like if you were playing the gitrekt frog

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>>54870732
The Wizard Vampire is also a bretty gud combo.
Combine those with superb card selection and colors for tutors and you got a killing machine.

>>54871559
Unless you're in blue with tons of cantrips, you should generally run 36-38 to avoid missing your first few land drops.

I have about 100$ for improving my goodstuff control. What would you recommend?

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/fancy-necklace-boy/

>>54871719
Fetches. Training Grounds is a great addition if you want to put bananaman to good use. What's your general wincon?

>>54871559
I run 37-38 by default.

2 land hands just feel like shit in EDH. Even if I have some ramp, if I don't draw more lands by turn 3, it just feels like I'm losing to myself.

I'll take the occasional flood to never be manascrewed.

>>54871113
>guys look at this blog that isn't mine teehee~

Okay shill

>>54871768
I'm strongly considering Training grounds, but how common are situations when it's advantageous for your opponents?

>What's your general wincon?
Beating down with Tasigur and Gitrog, copying or reanimation something big. The deck doesn't normally win on the spot, but leaves everybody out of resources by late game, while denying quick combo wins. Considering adding Deadeye for Slime and Mystic Snake

>>54871828
Training Grounds is asymmetrical so you don't have to worry about your opponents getting advantage out of it. Deadeye would definitely be a good addition. Mystic Remora is the best card draw in blue unless your playgroup is literally craw wurm. If you're not averse to combo you could also get Peregrine Drake/Great Whale/Palinchron to go with the Deadeye.

>>54870141
>Potent enough to get grumblings out of the Eternal Competitive demographics, unseats top-tier favorite Jeleva as the new queen of Grixis Storm.


I'm seriously wondering about this. It isn't completely black and white. Jeleva has the advantage of being much more disruptive to the opponents, but Kess is much better at playing your own gameplan, so is probably better.

If only I could have kess with Jeleva's art.

>>54871909
I'm not against combo, but that deck was born as an answer to a combo meta, and compared to stax and other combos is extremely low-key if you play the political game and don't annoy people with his ability. Adding straight up infinites would cause unwanted aggression I think.

I'd put those in my Niv-Mizzet, Firemind deck I'm building atm. Still don't have extra turns, omniscience/dreamhalls, show and tell to go with it

>>54871966
If your deck relies on people deciding other decks are greater threats, then it isn't a very good deck.

>>54871428
Interesting. What are your thoughts on one-shot mana ramps like Lotus Petal? Worth or no?

>>54871956
Kess is the waifu cEDH deserves.

>>54871966
If Blue is prominent in your meta I'd also recommend Carpet of Flowers and Seedtime. Maybe Uba-Mask, since you can get around the downside with Tasigur's activated.

>>54871985
Politics shouldn't be neglected either, fampai.

>>54871985
Good thing we're playing EDH.

>>54871996
depends on whether you can do anything with them

fast mana is always very powerful if you can use it

>>54870214
>http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/magic-story/sacrifice-2016-03-23
Was she the girtrog the whole time or what?

>>54871996
Lotus Petal is only good if you're playing all-in storm or some artifact jank like Silas Ren.

>>54872016
>>54872023
Consider: Either your opponents are right in their threat evaluation, and your deck therefore isn't very good, or they're incorrect in their threat evaluation, but your deck relied on your opponents making mistakes to win, in which case, it isn't very good.

Either way, your deck isn't very good. I find it's a much more enjoyable deckbuilding challenge to be able to play Archenemy and win.

>>54872055
If it wins the game, who cares?
Politics is part of multiplayer EDH. As much as you find enjoyable to play the top deck and win as archenemy, other people like to play EDH for the politics part and win with an unnoticed threat.

>>54871985
Considering I don't get any advantage by threatening the table, that's what I want everybody to think. If I can consistently win without drawing too much hate, that's a success.

>>54872016
I'm not sure, usually people playing blue around here use it for CA and not reactive play. Uba mask looks like shooting yourself in the foot though

>>54872055
It often requires the most degenerate techs and leaves people frustrated. You are pretty much required to bring a submachinegun to a fencing competition. It's hard to maintain in the long run. That's the difference between robbing banks and accepting bribes.

>>54872107
Yeah, those people are usually the whiniest assholes.

>Why are you attacking me, ____ has ____?
>whoa, using your removal on my ____ when ____ has ____?

Repeat ad nauseam. Politics in EDH is a meme, and once you see it as the whiners crutch that it is, you'll start improving.

>>54872055
I don't mind my deck being bad if it wins games.

They can't even get wise about my politics, because I genuinely am the lesser threat.

>>54872107
>playing a draft of Conspiracy 2
>one of the other people in the group was getting ganged up on because of politics.
>He exclaimed "This is why I hate multiplayer magic, it's just political bullshit."
>My response "Why are you here then?"
>"I wanted to play magic"
>"Me too, so either suck up and deal or get the hell out"

>>54872032
No, at the end of the story she gives in to the Frog, sacrifices her friend, and lives as the only servant to the Frog, sacrificing anyone else who comes by.

>>54872126
>I'm not sure, usually people playing blue around here use it for CA and not reactive play. Uba mask looks like shooting yourself in the foot though
Fair enough. The only other thing I noticed is playing Lignify over Imprisoned in the Moon. Imprisoned is a lot more permanent if the purpose is dealing with a commander and is definitely worth the one extra mana imo.

>>54872146
Look. Just because you have a bad experience with something, doesn't mean that it's the case everywhere.
Also, if you can't separate ingame politics with outside social interaction. Consider switching to Duel.

>>54872146
No need.

I don't mind getting judged for it by competitive people. There's an art to doing it without being irritating.

The game is a social format and if I get to stay alive because I made someone laugh, that's good enough for me.

>>54872146
>politics in edh is a meme

Just because you have a bad experience with it, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist, or isn't a big part of the game, otherwise group hug decks would never win.

Also, if people are attacking you when someone else is clearly a bigger threat on the table, its because you are just being a dipshit that people wants to take care off quickly.

>>54872180
>Also, if you can't separate ingame politics with outside social interaction.

That's what we did. It's a lot more fun. Tabletalk is usually gossip or swapping stories, while the in game decision making is usually spot on, and the deck quality has gone way up. It's way more fun than when "politics" was involved.

>>54872212
Nice invalid assumptions. My example was of me attacking someone because of a valid threat, only to get whined at for the next five minutes about how another player was a greater threat. That's the EDH political experience. Anytime I play with randoms or online, it happens.

>>54872212
Politics is just an excuse for poor threat assessment
group hug decks win on the back on not being a threat then just killing the table

>>54872232
>Anytime I play with randoms
There's your problem

>>54872244
Also, group hug decks make for unfun games. Either the group hug deck wins, or the worst deck wins.

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>>54872263
>everyone says group hug sucks
>have a 100% win rate with my gay kings deck

>>54872232
A lot of the time that player is actually a greater threat. You could have arranged a bargain with a person who is unhappy to be attacked and use his resources, but you seem to be too focused and experienced for that.

Have you ever prevented an attack to your face by threatening to wipe the board in response? The way that you still have the spell and you opponents are losing resources? If not, you are a lost cause

Stop pretending to understand the multiplayer if you use the same assumptions as in 1v1

>>54872263
>Either the group hug deck wins, or the worst deck wins.
>Implying

>>54872213
Maybe your crowd is just different. I like talking about the game.

Honestly, if I was at a table that just talked about whatever and didn't talk about the game, I'd prefer to do something else with them. Like get dinner, drink or just hang.

>>54872232
Things aren't so binary. Two players can ultimately be threats at the same time. There isn't always a correct choice unless you have hindsight or precognition.

It isn't always about redirecting people away from me either. Sometimes I am the biggest threat. I've frequently suggested people to wipe my board or hit me instead of other people.

>>54872287
What's your wincon? I've been thinking about building Crouching Faggots Hidden Nephilim.

>>54872213
You didn't separate anything, you just decided to abolish it altogether because your table can't handle it without getting whiny. Again, it shows that you had bad experiences.
All the power to you if your normal method works for your table to have fun. But that doesn't mean that politics is inherently bad.

>>54872312
Either Insurrection or infinite turns with EWitness/Archaeomancer + Crystal Shard

>>54872358
Gay/10 not surprised.

>>54871113
for someone who writes so much about MTG, he sure seems to have a poor grasp of card power levels

>fractured identity and wasitora rated at "3" power
>shifting shadows a 3-mana insane value engine rated at 2, the same as o-kagachi

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>>54872379
Gotta win somehow
>2 people sat there complaining about how bullshit infinite turns is when you don't win fast while i slowly searched for the insurrection/mob rule to win

>>54872301
>A lot of the time that player is actually a greater threat. You could have arranged a bargain with a person who is unhappy to be attacked and use his resources, but you seem to be too focused and experienced for that.

EDH bargains are ultimately unenforceable. If magic had a mechanic for negotiating and enforcing bargains, my stance on politics would be different, because then it would be part of the game.

>>54872310
>There isn't always a correct choice unless you have hindsight or precognition.

Over all the EDH games I've played, I've encountered only 1 or 2 situations where it was ambiguous who was the bigger threat. If you know the decks you're playing with, and know what your deck is capable of responding to, you can guess pretty accurately based on boardstate.

Before we abolished table talk altogether, my stance on politics was that I would only offer game commentary if asked directly, or if someone was making a mistake by not hurting me in some way (but only based on information they know). It's made for more satisfying games than the ones I won when I was just starting out online, where I would do the political bullshit.

>Why is this guy our president If he doesn't even lift?
>Sissy politician, fight me 1v1
>I only punched him once and he started whining, called security and now I'm sentenced for a lifetime of shower rape
>What a bitch

>>54872446
More power to you, I guess.

But I'm not worried about being dissatisfied because I only won because everyone teamed up on the guy running infinite combos and didn't leave enough removal for my dudes.

And I think you're overestimating the amount of variance. Have you really not lost to a topdeck after killing another player?

And bargains aren't enforceable, but if someone is just lying, they aren't worth my time. My friends don't do that.

Anyway, I understand your point of view. And in some ways, I respect it. But I don't like being called a whiny scrub just because I enjoy a multiplayer format as is without stipulations.

Ramos, Dragon Engine is a colorless commander, right?

>>54871353
It's pretty easy to give him any activated ability that would give him keywords and pump him. If any of those tap him you can untap and pump him with umbral mantle, or sword of the paruns.

>>54872263
>or the worst deck wins.
????
group hug makes bad decks ok and good decks amazing
no reason why you should lose if you have a better deck

>>54872555
Nope. It's 5 color.

>>54872312
I tun saheeli cat and stasis locks as a wincon,

>>54872578
No. Group hug decks make good decks slightly better, and bad decks incredibly efficient killing machines.

A good deck will often include reliable sources of card advantage, ramp, and tutors, at the expense of running some amount of threats. Bad decks just run tons of threats. While under the effects of a group hug engine, are more efficient than good decks, because they didn't "waste" card slots on card advantage, tutor, or ramp that they're getting for free.

Help me out with my scrub-y cat deck? Looking for superior options I could swap in for other cards, and just advice in general

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/cats-using-tools/

>>54872555
>While in game play mechanics the color of a card is always determined exclusively by the colors used in its casting cost or its color indicator, the color identity of a card is specified by all mana symbols that appear in its casting cost, color indicator, and rules text.

>>54872592
Also gay.

>>54869928
Edgar, Ramos and Kess are retarded, the rest are all worse than Atraxa/Breya/Meren

>>54872244
>>54872263
there's group hug and then there's chaos retardation

group hug
>help players who are behind, not the player who is already winning
>give people mostly stuff like creatures and permanents rather than mana or cards
>actively deal with threats alongside everyone else
>try to win with a big alpha strike or with a slowly built up pillowfort or lock-out when the time is right

chaos "group hug"
>giggle at how crazy your deck is by helping everyone symmetrically
>help combo players combo out by giving them draw, help face-smasher players face-smash by giving them ramp
>don't have anything but shitty group hug spells in your entire deck, basically a parasite to the table since all you do is create you can't remove threats that aren't even your own threats
>cry like a bitch whenever anyone attacks you because "i didn't even do anything to you" and "I'M HELPING YOU!!!!"
>never even try to win because you're a fucking degenerate chaos player and you just want to shit up games

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I played the 100% storm Yidris list and it was pretty dope, but I'm looking to tone it down a bit and maybe do like a fun Hypergenesis deck with him. Has anyone tried that jank?

>>54872654
Inalla can be a TON of value in a good deck and leads to some nifty infinite combos, so that's neat.

but i agree with you, those three are far and away the best of the set.

>>54872664
>all you do is create you can't remove threats that aren't even your own threats

i was so upset that i worded this bad

meant to write

>all you do is create threats you can't remove, that aren't even your own threats

>>54870141
Did you forget the part where Nazahn can tutor an Equipment that makes him indestructible and gives you free equips on ETB? He's an 8/4 indestructible at the very least, and he will NEVER be just that in any halfway tuned deck.

>>54872555
Depends on what you mean.

His color identity is all five colors because of the mana symbols in the text box, but there's nothing stopping you from building a colorless deck with him at the helm.

It'd be kinda pointless, given his abilities, but you COULD.

>>54872668
mind giving your 100% storm list for Yidris?

Arahbo, Roar of the World W/G
Kemba, Kha Regent W
Jazal Goldmane W
Jareth, Leonine Titan W
Jedit Ojanen of Efrava G
Raksha Golden Cub W
Mirri, Weatherlight Duelist W/G
Balan, Wandering Knight W
Nazahn, Revered Bladesmith W/G

Edgar Markov W/B/R
Anowon, the Ruin Sage B
Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief B
Mathas, Fiend Seeker W/B/R
Licia, Sanguine Tribune W/B/R

The Ur-Dragon W/U/B/R/G
Dromoka, the Eternal W/G
Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury B/R
Scion of the Ur-Dragon W/U/B/R/G
Crosis, the Purger U/B/R
Intet, the Dreamer U/R/G
Niv-Mizzet, Dracogenius U/R
Ryusei, the Falling Star R
Silumgar, the Drifting Death U/B
Teneb, the Harvester W/B/G
Atarka, World Render R/G
Bladewing the Risen B/R
Ojutai, Soul of Winter W/U
Taigam, Ojutai Master W/U
Wasitora, Nekoru Queen B/R/G
O-Kagachi, Vengeful Kami W/U/B/R/G
Ramos, Dragon Engine W/U/B/R/G

Inalla, Archmage Ritualist U/B/R
Nin, the Pain Artist U/R
Marchesa, the Black Rose U/B/R
Azami, Lady of Scrolls U
Arcanis the Omnipotent U
Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind U/R
Vela the Night-Clad U/B
Kess, Dissident Mage U/B/R
Mairsil, the Pretender U/B/R
Taigam, Sidisi's Hand U/B

Choose your commander.

>>54872774
Nig-Mizzles.

>>54872797
This

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>>54869332
REALEST NIGGA REPRESENT

>>54872774
Mirri

>>54872761
it's pretty similar to this list: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/melt-banana-copy-2/

it's not t1 competitive because you're all-in on yidris connecting without very much protection, but as soon as you connect even once you outright win unless you brick super hard on your cascades.

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If I cage this with Mairsil then I would be able to just take control of creatures, right?

>>54872774
edgar. i just love the idea of the deck transitioning from an earlygame aristocrats deck into an aggressive beats deck. every aristocrats deck i've played won through combo, so i have a feeling this'll be a nice change of pace.

>>54872774
I'm probably building Arahbo first. Throwing in a bunch of low-cost cats (janky shit like Glittering Lynx and Wily Bandar), adding in some equipment like Jitte and Sword of Fire and Ice, then finishing it off with GW hate cards like Aura Shards and Rest In Peace.
It's not going to be good, but it'll be fun.

>>54872774
Mirri
>>54872633

>>54872828
Thanks

>>54872836
unfortunately the text that makes you lose control of the creature is included in the activated ability, so you do lose it when marisil becomes untapped.

>>54872774
Ur-Dragon. Still got most of the Khans Blocks Dragons and Dragon-matters cards, might as well build some fun jank.

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>Ryusei

Make that fucker work as a commander.

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>>54871574
wtf is this meme

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Total noob here so bear with me.

I'm thinking of building Zada, but I have a doubt.
If someone paths Zada in response to , let's say Balduvian Rage, or in response to the trigger do I still get my copies of it?

>>54871242
Tutor out Fluctuator, get something that gets buffed by Cycling out (Cunning Survivor or Shadowstorm Vizier, probably), Cycle most of your deck and swing. Bonus points for using Shadow of the Grave to double up when they're not expecting it.

I run a Scarab God Cycling Tribal, myself. It's hilarious when I combo off and suddenly obliterate someone.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/ub-cycle-tribal/

>>54872904
There's a number of sacrifice abilities you can combo it with.

>>54872928
token dragon deck, sacrifice the token via the legendary rule repeatedly to wipe the board

>>54872774
with a perfect mana base, can kess dethrone babyjace as the best high tide commander? black gives you tutors and rituals which i'd say gives her the edge

>>54872942
You still get the copies. Someone Imprinting a Stifle on an Isochron Scepter would fuck you up pretty bad tho

>>54872944
I wanted to do Scarab, but the anti synergy with Abandoned Sac put me off of it.

I actually just cut two dudes that get pumped by cycling and discard, but I did keep the ones you mentioned.

I'll keep at it as is then. I'll check your list.

Is it possible to use Mairisil as an engine to make unplayably expensive crap useful? If yes, what can crap can he turn into gold?

>>54872942
>thinking of building Zada
before you do, ask your group if they'd be willing to let you use ink-treader instead. it's the same shit but with more colors and is a lot more fun.

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If someone goes to activate Mairsil and in response I Pull the card with the ability he's activating will the ability fizzle?

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>>54872979

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>Who is your favorite Golgari Commander?

Pic related. I've been playing a lot of Meren, but she's hella boring and I'm probably taking the deck apart.

>>54872979
MOX LOTUS

altar of shadows is probably pretty neat though

>>54872994
I think if the ability has already been activated when you remove the card from exile, it will remain on the stack, but I'm not sure. There's got to be a ruling somewhere on a similar, older card.

>>54872994
no

>>54873029
nvm disregard this garbage i'm tired

>>54872904
You'd probably insta-sac the stolen critter for caged Razaketh

>>54872966
Yeah I guess stifle would fuck me up

>>54872988
Do you mean as a hidden commander, I thought about it but the Idea of going monocolor one trick pony budget deck is fun.

Anyway could some goodhearted anon pleas explain to me the ruling cause I'm already picturing me arguing that I get the effect and not convincing anybody

>>54872979
Mirror-Mad Phantasm can mill you out completely if you're into that sort of thing

>>54872994
>goes to activate Mairsil

That's not a thing in game. Here is what will happen in the situation I think you are trying to create.
>Marsail taps to draw 3 cards, using the ability of a caged arcanis
>You pull from eternity
>The ability is already on the stack, so you pull arcanis but then they draw 3 cards

Alternatively
>You pull from eternity, targeting arcanis
>Marsail taps to draw 3 cards in response once they get priority

Short answer is no, pull doesn't fizzle anything.

>>54873064
yes you still get the copies, the ability triggered on cast of your card, not the resolution.

and i meant not as a hidden commander but an unofficial one. the nephilim are basically legendary, so some groups allow it.

>>54873020
Are you me? She is already more fun, and the deck is still incomplete

Never knew Glissa would give me a boner

>>54872979
Demonic Hordes, Shauku, Pestilence Demon, Razaketh (before he's banned :^)), something something of Leshrac who taps to destroy target creature or land.

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>>54872979
Loads of junk.

I don't know how good it will be. But there is a bunch of good shit.

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>>54873089
She deserved more.

>>54869827
She's the reason I run a Night Soil and a Necromantic Selection in my Ghave Deck. She's also the only thing that people target more than my Ghave deck.

>>54873090
you're missing phyrexian devourer, the ultimate bullshit mairsil jank.

>>54873090
>>54873098
>>54873108
Shut the fuck and stop posting my secret tech.

>>54873090
Pestilence Demon is bad for the same reason Kuro, Pitlord is still bad.

You can only do it once a turn.

>>54873108
Devourer was already usable before with Necrotic Ooze though, those I mentioned were overcosted stuff with no homes yet.

>>54873115
I felt that way too, man, but until they come out, my tech is just posturing.

I looked at 1800 cards the other day. There are no secrets left.

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>>54873125
Hello there

>>54873125
fuck you're right. i keep forgetting the once per turn clause on mairsil.

hateflayer + arcanus draws you 6 cards per turn for 3 mana though, which is a neat trick.

>>54873101
She's solid in Reki, History of Kamigawa.

>>54873101
I'm changing my elf deck from Frey alive to this because of the tribe matters land. Got any spice?

>>54873137
So uh... If you exiled this with mairsil and had him target himself with it would it remove the once per turn restriction?

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>>54873157
i mean there's always

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>average CMC of Volrath deck is upwards of 6
This rules

>>54873168
Everywhere I read about it says yes. At least if you have Elemental out and he targets Mairsil there's no OPT restriction for him.

>>54873137
Did we confirm whether that works or not?

Because this guy then will go infinite at the drop of a hat and everyone in my group will start running processors.

I really want Kuro to work. I don't know how greedy I can be though, the deck is full of huge uncastable creatures already.

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>>54873182
don't forget to pack some reanimation for those big fat butts

>>54872975
Abandoned Sarcophagus exiles Cycling cards anyways if they leave play, so Scarab is actually fine (and also makes weak Cyclers into stronger 4/4s).

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>>54873182
don't forget the classic

Should I spend the 5 bucks or something to pull The Great Snake Mistake on my group once, then never do it again?

>>54873194
True, but I guess that's my argument against all reanimator. But that's retarded, since I'm running Living Death anyway.

Hm. Maybe I'll replace my general with him. I dunno. I'll fuck around with it. I do love Scarab.

>>54873188
Yeah that's the backup, along with some targeted recursion

>>54873064
Cast != Resolve

601.2. To cast a spell is to take it from where it is (usually the hand), put it on the stack, and pay its costs, so that it will eventually resolve and have its effect. Casting a spell follows the steps listed below, in order. If, at any point during the casting of a spell, a player is unable to comply with any of the steps listed below, the casting of the spell is illegal; the game returns to the moment before that spell started to be cast (see rule 717, "Handling Illegal Actions"). Announcements and payments can't be altered after they've been made.

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>>54869238
>Thread Question

What's the best way to build Skullbriar other than +1/+1 Counter goodstuff

>>54873216
Yeh.

>>54873241
I mean, if you're not building with his ability in mind, what's the point of using him?

The other option is to build him to put non +1/+1 counters on him, I guess

>>54873241
there was an annoying skullbriar player in my meta so i put scar in all of my decks just to fuck with him

>>54873241
There really isn't one. Skullbriar is very much a one-note commander

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So what upgrades can be made to Eddie? A few cards I've looked at are:
>Exquisite Blood
>Drana, Liberator of Malakir
>Mephidross Vampire
>Olivia Voldaren
>Indulgent Aristocrat
>Bloodline Keeper
>Stensia Banquet
>Possibly Whip of Erebos
>Vampire Nocturnus

What else?

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This is secret-est tech in Mairsil.

>>54873340
Nope. War Barge.

I mean, there's plenty of other ways to get Mairsil able to sac itself.

>>54872774
Edgar, I'm only missing 10 commons to build him optimally for 1v1 where he's retarded, and that shit is a store credit farming goldmine over here.

>>54873321
grave pact effects, stoneforge mystic to get skullclamp, purphoros, anointed procession, enlightened tutor, ahsnod's/phyrexian altar, bloodghast to reliably sac to things every turn, attrition, etc.

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>>54873292
>>54873312
I just meant building him without dumb infinites like Mike and Trike, of course I'd have +1/+1 support in there. I was just wondering if there's some secret tech I wouldn't hear about elsewhere

>>54873371
Honestly I've never seen Skullbriar as "+1/+1 counter tribal", it's always been "Load him the fuck up with counters and equipment and sideways him"

>>54873371
Unearth probably works well with him. The card, that is.

>Ashnod's gona up $3 in the past week
What else besides Riptide and Patron have been rising?
Was Staff of Domination always this expensive?

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>>54869238
>Thread Question
I don't play Golgari, but if I did, Mazirek.

>>54873371
Big fan of Solidarity of Heroes, since it can make for surprise lethal. Maybe Prowler's Helm?

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>>54872624
>bad decks incredibly efficient killing machines

>>54873241
This probably isn't what you really want, but I would suggest building him as stupid as you possibly can. Focus on putting -1/-1 counters on him and then making infinite mana so you can cast him infinite times and have an infinite number of etb triggers and etg triggers. I'm sure there are easier ways to do that, but doing it with your commander is super stylish.

>>54873388
>Was Staff of Domination always this expensive?>>
Yes

>>54872928
>Ryusei
Go for Red Enchantment Tribal, with the usual Burn thrown into the mix. Gratuitous Violence, Dictate of the Twin Gods, Where Ancients Tread, Warstorm Surge, Repercussions... Make just casting him become super fucking painful.

>>54873321
Nocturnus

>>54872774
One from each deck

>Nazahn, Revered Bladesmith W/G
Equipment Voltron, I guess. Cat deck is most boring for me.

>Mathas, Fiend Seeker W/B/R
Seems like a fun politics commander. Would load with Curses and other "Target playetr" stuff

>Wasitora, Nekoru Queen B/R/G
Dude Cat Dragon lmao

>Mairsil, the Pretender U/B/R
This hits my deckbuilding boner hard and I want to see what shit I can throw in to make him crazy as possible.

>>54873340
That's not Kozilek's Translator.

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>>54870141
>Ur Dragon
>Not the hero Dragons deserved, but the one their expensive asses needed.

You're goddamn right he is.

>>54873463
>Cat deck is most boring for me.

i don't know anyone other than stupid hipsters who are interested in the cat deck.

you have good taste.

>>54873480
LaughingZirilan.dec

Everyone seems to know a million amazing cards for Mairsil.

Can someone make a list of cards that DON'T work in Mairsil despite fitting the criteria and seem good at first glance? Anything that is too magical Christmas land?

>>54873415
>doesn't understand basic english grammar

>>54873498
Mairsil IS christmasland, the jank man, Dr. Goodstuff.
If it's an activated ability you can find someway to build around it.
Just make sure to give him 5 different froms of removal dodging to make him a slippery son of a bitch that doesn't cost 12 mana since the whole table will want your 1 man army off the battlefield as often as possible.

>>54873351
Why War Barge?

>>54873578
is joke

>>54873546
I'm just worried I'm going too crazy. What if turning him into a Shifty Doppelgänger is just poor?

>>54873498
Any Mairsil combos are jank. I don't think any card works particularly well with him.

>>54873578
Repeatable creature removal with blink or bounce.

shhh, secret. That's why it is tech.

>>54873541
>bad decks
>incredibly efficient killing machines
this statement is beyond retarded

>>54873589
Does he come back if you move him to the command zone when exiling as part of the ability?

>>54873619
Understand the context m8. Gr8 b8 though.

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>>54872312
>Crouching Faggots Hidden Nephilim
[desire to know more intensifies]

>>54873620
Worried about stifle? From what I can tell, yeah, that would work.

That doesn't increase commander tax, does it?

>>54873632
The Nephilim that goes with Kangz is Ink-Treader. Imagine 4 color Zada.

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>>54872774
THE UR-DRAGON

>>54873648
No, worried about removal.

If you have to keep Mairsil in exile to get it to return at the end of your turn, then they can remove the creature that you shifted in to permanently exile your commander.

If however, you can move the commander to the command zone and still have it return, that risk is not present.

It's the difference between completely unplayable jank and just unplayable jank imo.

>>54873578
>give commander unblockable against certain players
>or removal when you blink him
It's versatile and the looks you table will give you caging war barge will be priceless.

>>54873628
no even in context its retarded
bad decks use inefficient creatures
low amounts of removal
no card filtering/draw
little or expensive ramp
you only change 2/4ths of what makes a deck bad, good decks get the exact same boost only have a better constructed deck.
in no way shape or form does group hug disproportionately help poorly made decks over well made decks
you moron

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>>54873655
>Imagine 4 color Zada.
why not 5c

>>54873692
I think you're playing with a different class of bad deck than I am. Most of them are just timmies using the same suite of 40-50 efficient creatures, with very little support. Group hug gives them the support. It's not like it's hard to run efficient creatures these days.

>>54873692
They do if your help cards target one player.

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>>54872774
Mairsil.

>>54873546
Shouldn't you get pretty decent value out of him giving himself the abillity to flicker? Unless he forgets his abillity while in exile this should dodge spot removal end get around the once-a-turn restriction.

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>>54873125
Not if it's a different [PRETENDER]

>>54873731
the better your deck is the more help you get from symmetrical effects
no "bad" deck is going to reap the reward more than a deck that was better designed

New thread

>>54873757
>>54873757
>>54873757
>>54873757

>>54873460
Nocturnus is off 20% of the time in Modern's mono black vampire tribal deck.
How often do you think he'll be active in a tricolor 100c singleton deck?

>>54873760
Completely the reverse. The worse your deck is, the more you'll benefit from those same effects, because a good deck is already getting what the symmetrical effects apply.

The difference between land 1 and land 2 is incredible for its effect on the game. The difference between land 5 and land 6 is less so. Same with card draw.

>>54873787
>The worse your deck is, the more you'll benefit from those same effects
10+5 =15
1+5= 6
yeah the 1 in this situation gets much more from the +5 but its still 9 points away from 15 as its always been

>>54872263
how is it the worse deck if it wins?

>>54873998
Because the only reason it was able to win was with a 2nd deck in the game helping it.

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>>54873115
thinking there is secret tech when the internet exists. lel

>>54873107
>Enchantments and artifacts
>against a green deck

*Laughs in Reclamation Sage*

>>54873769
This. I like it, but in three colors it's just too unreliable.

>>54873769
I dunno man, probably pretty often since modern can't play obscene shit like scroll rack or SDT, or run thawing glaciers to crack when the top card isn't good, or run vamp tutor or run...

You get the picture, the card pool is much different, and many cards that people would already be running make noct a better card.

It depends a lot on how much money he is willing to throw at the deck. Scroll rack+land tax isn't free, and many of the best manipulation and shuffle effects are expensive.

>>54869970
>msrd
Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Dineros?

>>54873216
>5 bucks
What do you have to buy for it?

>>54873321
Aggravated Assault and True Conviction.

>i'll run hellkite charger instead of aggravated assault because that's an extra 10 damage
>aurelia for extra combats too
>i'll put in a gisela to double my vamp damage
>and avacyn to protect the vamps plus it'll be funny with markov
>blinding angel is great with all these extra combats
Someone help stop me from putting a bunch of angels into this vampire deck, if I'm not careful Kaalia would work better than Edgar.