Not doing your Research

>>54868251
Bad translation of the AD&D 1e Monster Manual.

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>>54868251
>Or I have not done my homework
yes

most nips get their information about western fantasy from ODnD and ADnD

ADnD 2nd edition kobolds were vaguely dog-like

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>>54868281
and all this time the guy was trying to make her a gnoll but he just got it wrong.

just like in spanish there is a confusion between sirens and mermaids.

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>>54868281
>ADnD 2nd edition kobolds were vaguely dog-like
They always had a dog-like head and scaly skin. That artist thought that meant 'cross between pug and goblin'. Here's a mid-2e kobold.

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>>54868281
>>54868292
>dog girl
>hyena

I don't think so, anon

>>54868251
This is why I use term eastern kobolds sometimes
But in truth kobolds became little dragons in 3,5 (But I do prefer them to kobolds before hand), but you could always just say that this is "Easter kobold"

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>>54868298

This is like complaining Brazzers' portrayal of Spider-Man was inaccurate because his dick was too long.

>>54868296
The entirety of japan believes that kobolds are dog-creatures because the original japanese translation for D&D took "dog like head" and left it at that.
Mistranslations have awkward legacies in Japan. For example, they seem to think the spear of Lugh (irish warrior-god of light) is called "Brionac", but no such word comes from celtic mythology. Nevertheless you'll find Brionac as a legendary spear in dozens of japanese media, much like Excalibur for swords.

>>54868298
I would have guess he just took creative freedom.
yet again... this is the guy who names the characters

Mia the Lamia
Papi the Harpy
Centora the Centaur
Rachnera the Arachnera
...
so maybe there wasnt much creativity there...
Im still waiting for him to add a Human girl name
Yuman or Yumana

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>>54868307
cute
>>54868298
>>54868251
here's an idea, thread

if kobolds are supposed to somehow descend from dragons (even if that's new fluff), what sort of dragons would dog/ratbolds descend from or be related to?

I propose pic related

>>54868320
>the original japanese translation for D&D took "dog like head" and left it at that.
I thought they botched it into 'dog head'.

>>54868326
He didn't take creative liberties, it was the guys in the late 70s/early 80s translating D&D who did it. I'd be surprised if Okayado had played D&D at all.

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>>54868341
Okay, what if lthere was an USA American Kobold, with the dragon like features?
would that be fitting?

>>54868371
If you're playing 3e onwards, that's just a normal kobold. If you're playing 2e or earlier it's its own thing.

>>54868281
Have you ever seen a dog, Anon?

>>54868901
That pic looks exactly like a pug.

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>>54868251
>>54868281
Both of you havent done your homework.

The first instances of japs seeing western fantasy in action were vidyagames, not DnD, which however were based on ADnD and ODnD and made by nerds for nerds to emulate Pen&Paper. Nevermind that in tons of early Textbased Adventures they were describes as ''dog-faced'' too.

>>54869194
This. Specifically the Wizardry games which feature dogbolds.

"Kobold" in fantasy is a term largely devoid of inherent meaning. In Japan they're doglike. In D&D they're recently lizardlike and earlier something else. In folklore they're just little people.
I think most people would agree that "kobold" doesn't sound like a very large creature, but beyond that there's quite little in common.

>>54868251
But dogbolds bestbolds.

>>54868251
that's what all the kobolds in my game look like whats the problem?

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>>54869459
Are you playing Heroines of the First Age, MAID or Pathfinder?

Why don't we just go get a real kobold and compare?

Oh right, because they're fucking imaginary.

>>54868251
It's one of the examples of divergent evolution in Japanese versions of western fantasy creatures. ODD kobolds had both dog like and reptilian traits (they had scaly skin but dog like faces) In the west kobolds abandoned the doglike traits and changed into little lizard people in DnD 3.5 (although 5th edition gave them dog noses again), while in Japan they lost the reptilian traits and became dog people (probably influenced by Wizardry videogame where kobolds are more dog like and translators of ODD changing/mistranslating the line about them having dog like faces to them being dog like). Other examples include pig orcs (based on ODD monster manual art), "glutton tail" succubi, aka. tailvorecubi (based on...nobody seems to know for sure), and slimes being the standard low-level adventurer fodder (based on Dragon Quest videogames).

If anybody can think of other examples, I'd like to know, as this is a subject I think it would be interesting to do a presentation about in some con.

>>54869569
wut

>>54869665
Weren't a bunch of D&D monsters based off of plastic toys?

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>>54868251

Yuan-Yuan edition?

Yukio best girl.

>>54868292
>just like in spanish there is a confusion between sirens and mermaids.
It's not just spanish, the half-fish women were created from a wrong transcription of the Odissey where sirens were said to be covered in fins instead of feathers

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>>54868251

Kobolds are fantasy creatures, so they can be pretty much whatever you want.

>>54869733
Bulette, rust monster, and owlbear are all based on these weird nondescript creatures that you for some reason find in bags of cheap plastic dinosaur toys along with the actual dinosaurs. Gygax used those toys to represent monsters, and ended up making stats for the weirdo ones since nobody knew what they were supposed to be.

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>>54870557
Wish he did the rest desu.

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>>54868326
What's wrong with Ms Smith?

>>54868371
What, like, in Monster Whatever?
Could be pretty fun.

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A kobold is a German house spirit resembling an ugly little man

What are you niggers smoking?

>>54870903
Nothing, But her name doesnt sound like her species like the rest of the girls.

>>54871997
But Smith is one of the most common last names, excluding Chinese names.

The trouble is that that "lizardman" is already a common name for a lizard people but there is no ready term for dog people.

So anyone searching for dog people will find "kobold" as the first response because there is nothing else there, it's a feedback loop.

To solve the issue a new acceptable generic fantasy term for a dog person is required.

Either that or accept that the taxonomy of fictional creatures is a waste of time and energy and go do something better with your life eh?

>>54868251
I remember a screencap of some online discussion where a common bitch in her common ignorance called out tale of Beauty and Beast as something that wouldn't work if genders were reversed because men are shallow like that, only to get swarmed by people declaring their love for Polt and monstergirls in general.

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>>54868251

You know, for all of his shit Oyakado does perhaps too much research.

He probably knew about "real" kobolds in DND, but -rightly so- didn't give a fuck.

>>54868292

That's a little more complex than that.

Basically you have two myths:

The greek one. Homer had them as something kinda oracular with wings, but the gist was more about the "we know shit that you couldn't imagine" thing. Odyssey:

But them, the Seirenes (Sirens) saw the quick vessel near them and raised their voices in high clear notes : ‘Come hither, renowned Odysseus, hither, you pride and glory of all Akhaia (Achaea)! Pause with your ship; listen to our song. Never has nay man passed this way in his dark vessel and left unheard the honey-sweet music from our lips; first he has taken his delight, then gone on his way a wiser man. We know of all the sorrows in the wide land of Troy that Argives and Trojans bore because the gods would needs have it so; we know all things that come to pass on the fruitful earth.’

>I now realized greek seirenes are lovecraftian in a way

The mermaid (half-woman, half fish or half seal) thing come from northern europe. Yeah, we all know that it's more universal, but the usual shit, the tragic love, the changing form, the beauty, the taboo, the living on land and all, it's pretty circumscript, mermaid, selkie or melusine. Even near eastern/arab myths are pretty differnt, if anything similar to the greek one.
>the males are mostly an aftertought but apparently during the middle ages they tought of them more

Amusingly enough, Mero being a princess might not even a Crhistian Andersen thing. Check out the House of Lusignan.

In languages derived from latin (it applies to french, spanish, I think portoguese, certainly italian) it was all conflated on one word, from greek, while the imagery is the fishwoman but in a way it makes sense: we don't really connect the mermaid with the greek myth, aside from the voice.

>>54870903

Based Darling know his shit.

>>54868251
That's not a Kobold, Japanese are autistic and just made this furryshit to give autism to hundreds if not thousands of westerners.

>>54868251
>her fur is especially thick near the abdomen/crotch so it is practically impossible to shave
Bueno...

>>54873028

Furshit is worse than scaleshit?

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>>54869665
Being interested in biology, I find it interesting how well this sort of memetic evolution of fantasy cretaures parallels actual evolution. The situation is very similar to what might happen when individuals of a species end up isolated from the main population, for example on an island, and without contact to the main population evolve along a different path and become a new species.

In case of orcs, the western orcs have over time lost the piglike face (although they still retain traces of it, namely the tusks and often a somewhat upturned nose), while their Japanese relatives retain basal ("primitive") traits of their last common ancestor. But like most "living fossils" Japanese orcs aren't actually the same thing as ODD orcs, they've just haven't undergone as dramatic change as their western cousins.

With kobolds, you see a clear case of divergence. The last common ancestor of DnD kobolds and Japanse kobods had reptilian and mammalian traits. In west, the reptilian traits became more promiment at the expense of the mammalian traits, causing kobolds to evolve into small lizard-people. In Japan, the opposite happened, with kobolds losing any reptilian traits and becoming dog-people.

>>54873199

The case of the tailvore-succubus is particularly interesting because most Japanse portrayals of succubi are not very different from western ones (in the phylogenetic analogy we can think of them as a subspecies; distinct enough from their western counterpart that you can differentiate the two but stimilar enough that they're still clearly the same creature), and the vore-cubi seems to have more or less come out of nowhere (there's nothing about the western succubus that would naturally lead to people deciding they can use their tail to eat people, so it's probably somethign somebody pretty much randomly came up with and others then copied). A phylogenetic equivalent would be a beneficial mutation propagating in a subset of the population, allowing them to exploit a new ecological niche and eventually resulting in speciation. As the new species does not directly compete with its parent species the two can coexist and due to the very specialized niche the new species has evolved to fill it remains less common than its more generalist parent.

>>54868251
Kobolds are just a catch-all for every setting's vermin-folk.
Our kobolds are different, just like our trolls are different and our zombies are different.

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>>54869665
>>54873199
Relevant.

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>>54873286

I dread to ask, but what is a tailvore-succubus?

>>54873383

NO! Kobolds are dragonfolk, kobolds are superior! You can take our dungeons, but you'll never take our FREEDOM!

>actually this game is more interesting that you would think

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>>54873481
A type of succubus that sometimes appears in hentai, which has an orifice on the tip of her tail that allows her to swallow up people. Don't know if there's an official name for them, but the common one seems to be tailmouth or glutton tail succubus.

Nobody seems to know where exactly they come from, but being inspired by Dragoball's Cell (who also had a tail that he could use to swallow up people to assimilate them) is a common theory.

>>54868251
I prefer dogbolds and porks anyway.

>>54872688
Loads of cultures have some form of dog-headed people and the general term in English is cynocephalus.

>>54873286
13th century and onwards European depictions of demons commonly have a demon's tail ending in a snake's head, lion's tassel or more rarely a scorpion's sting. These were simplified in engravings and became the spade that you more commonly see today.

If a jap skipped out on recent portrayals of demons and went directly to old demon dictionaries their first experience with western demons would be that some have mouths on their tails. They probably made the succubus tail mouth look like a fleshlight because snakes aren't known for the skill at blowjobs.

It would be like someone looking up the original kobolds and putting them in their setting as spirits (possibly of dead miners) that look like old men who hide in mines and place curses on certain ores resulting in clouds of poison gas. The pre-d&d kobolds were closer to a cross between goblins (which has the same root word as kobold) and tommyknockers, with no relation to lizards or dogs.

>>54873575

That's new. Oh well. I don't get vore, but honestly doesn't disgust me either.

I'd be curious about other cases of divergent evolution. In Japan it happened before a common game market and when english was even more obscure. Where else could it have happened? Perhaps Russia?

>>54873679

>cynocephalus

Skiapod cute girls when?

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>>54873575
>A type of succubus that sometimes appears in hentai, which has an orifice on the tip of her tail that allows her to swallow up people.

Eating people with their tails, huh?

Interesting...

>>54873679
>13th century and onwards European depictions of demons commonly have a demon's tail ending in a snake's head, lion's tassel or more rarely a scorpion's sting. These were simplified in engravings and became the spade that you more commonly see today.
I haven't thought about this in connection to the vore-cubi, although I knew the standard pointy demon-tail is derived from medieval demons sometimes being descipted with a live snake for a tail (Japanese non-vore succubi also deem to take the pointy tail and make it more heart-shaped compared to western ones). While I do believe Cell is probably a huge inspiration (due to DBZ being massively popular in Japan when it came out, meanign pretty much everybody who grew up at the time would be familiar with it, and the tail-mouth is usually drawn working exactly like Cell's tail), but the snake-tail might be the missing piece connecting Cell and succubi. i.e. somebody learned that demons used to be descipted with a mouth at the end of their tail and combined that with Cell from DBZ to get a succubus that uses a tail-mouth to absorb people.

>>54873842
Can't think of as many modern cases (Russia might have them, but I'm not very familiar with Russian takes of western fantasy creatures), but historically this is actually very common. Look at mythology of nearby countries with similar cultures, and you'll find a lot of examples of different takes on the same kind of creature. For example, different variations of Scandinavian trolls, or vampires in Romania and nearby countries. Japan makes for a good "natural laboratory" since the memetic mutations are much more recent and therefore easier to trace.

>>54873575
I kind of want to stat these things in DnD.

>>54873432
Well we couldn't have our allegory for everybody that isn't white be smart, now could we

>>54873983
Did you miss the part where they explicitly mentioned Cell?

>>54874181
I did, yes.

>>54873432
>>54874145
Probably because Tolkien viewed industrialisation as an evil. He loved the English countriside and certainly didn't approve factories and coal mines polluting the pristine landscape he grew up in, and having fought in WWI knew firsthand how horrifying industrial-scale warfare could be (despite enduring belief LotR is not an alegory to WWI or II, but fighting in the war definitely shaped Tolkien's worldview and thus affected his writing). Thus the bad guys using building huge smoke-belching furnaces and cutting down ancient forests to feed the fires of military industry.
However, as most people today tend to see industrialisation as a good thign due to it resulting in a lot of nice technology ve rely on, associating it primarily with the villains doesn't work as well. Instead orcs get associated with what we consider the worst aspects of humanity: cruelty, violence, savagery and ignorance.

>>54868251
>>54868281
Basically this^. Kobolds were originally a type of German fairy, IIRC. Reptilian Kobolds are relatively new and are entirely a D&D creation. Dog people kobolds are based off of the vaguely canine picture in the AD&D MM.

>>54868251
Should have called them gnolls, though due to translation issues kobolds were always described as dog-like in the Japanese version of D&D, so Japanese authors always picture kobolds as looking like dogs.

>>54874145

To be fair tough at least since Warcraft orcs are kinda different.

>>54874275

Problem is he kinda grew up when industrialization was more nasty... and NOT just confined to cities proper.

Who knows, maybe nowdays he would think a little different. Maybe he would have the orcs be angry because mordor is Shenzen.

Actually, kobols being depicted as mammal-like animal/humanoids are not just Japanese thing.

Sapkowski's Witcher universe described a kobolds vaguely as furry humanoids, with possibly cat-like traits. Which is honestly more true to the folklore creature origin than modern Dn'D depiction.

>>54873028
You do realize that you accuse others of being autistic while simultaneously saying that ONE depiction in one particular set of really bad fantasy guidelines is the only correct depiction?

>>54874275
He did not see industrialization as evil. He thought it can be destructive to the environment, and often as an eye-sore. You don't have to hate industrialization to make a quick aesthetic connection between industrial zone and a symbol of corruption though.

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>>54873575
Did these exist before or after the monstergirl Manticore with her emphasis on the supposedly erotic, but super spiky tail?

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>>54874044
Well, I ended up doing it. Would still need the fluff text, and probably change in CR. It has the same CR as regular succubus, but replaces ability to shapeshift and the draining kiss with a tail attack and swallow whole that functions partially like the draining kiss. It only does less the damage of the draining kiss (average 10 instead of 32), but can be used in combat against non-charmed targets as well (provided it first hits with the tail attack and target doesn't break the grapple before it gets to attack again) and deals that damage every round the target is swallowed, which might still make it too powerful (although average damage per round wise it is within the range for the CR).

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>>54872967
Found it for you.

>>54868251
I mean, kobolds were originally dog-like, not lizard-like, so it's just a monstergirl interpretation of the original concept. Nothing wrong with that.

The giant hands really get my engine going, goddamn.

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>>54875537
I'm quite sure they existed before MGE. The most famous example is Alma Elma from Monstergirl Quest, but she's not the first one. I don't know what exactly is the first example of a tailmouth succubus in hentai, and while it actually would be intresting to know where they originated from I don't have the time or fortitude to trawl the dark corners of the internet for the firt recorded instance of a succubus eating somebody with its tail.

OP, as always: depends on the setting.
:^)

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>>54870903

>>54868251
> Use trope/race straight
HURR DUURRR DAS BORING

> Change it up
HOW AM I MEANT TO KNOW WHAT IS WHAT IF THAT IS NOT THAT REEEEE

>>54872357
It might as well be the most common human name.
In a few years it will be made public that the chinese are actually insectoids from the underground, living in hollowed shells of the dead the ancient chinese(human ones) buried
Very few chinese are still alive, with some of the decoys being used for hundreds of years on end by the damn bugs.

>>54875870
Perhaps Violated Hero? I haven't actually played the games myself, but it might be one in there somewhere.

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>>54875870
>tfw found vore absolutely repulsive until discovering those image sets ripped from the MGQ vore oriented spin offs
The internet really does corrupt.

>>54868251
One fucking corporation shows konolds as lizards and you dweebs think that's all they have ever been. Because of a bizarre marketing decision by one company in the mid 1990s. Fuck the germanic folklore and thousands of years of stories, a recent company used the term for yet another lizard species.

>>54872357
>>54871997
She's the granddaughter of John Smith, the protagonist of another comic by the same author.

John Smith being one of the most bland and generic names possible without going into the Doe family.

>>54876268
I thought all the Doe family were dead?

>>54876268
So which monstergirl's in her family tree?

>>54875692

I still find Polt weird. Can't tell where the fur ends and the skin begins.

>>54876380
None in her direct lineage, presumably, since she's human, but John Smith fucked a lot of monstergirls under the guise of "research", so she probably has some monstergirl relatives in her family tree

>>54875692
This is gold! This is one of the days I am proud to be this weird

>>54876405
There is no "skin begins".

It's just thick fur and thin fur.

/tg/- Fantasy Evolutionary Biologists

>>54876460

I dunno, she seems pretty unfurred to me. Weird.

>>54876460
wait, shit does that make polt Furry?

>>54876684
No, it's still safe zone of 25%

>>54876684
All monstergirls are furry anon. They're just for furries in denial

>>54876684
She's borderline

>>54876732
anthro and furry is a bit different - all furry are anthro, but not all anthro are furry

>>54873007
>it was all conflated on one word, from greek, while the imagery is the fishwoman but in a way it makes sense: we don't really connect the mermaid with the greek myth, aside from the voice.
it creates some funny situation though. For instance according to the myth the city of naples was founded where fishermen found the body of the syren Parthenope after she had drowned herself for failing to kill Odysseus.
Now for fishwoman it doesn't really make sense does it.
Ancient portraials actually show her as a birdwoman while after the 1700 they started showing her as a fishwoman, so in the city there are many mermaid statues

>>54868292
well that depiction of gnolls is wrong too if we follow the myth, so there's that.
>>54873199
>>54873286
that's essentially the concept of meme as Dawkins first put it

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>>54876053
The earliest I recall seeing it is Disgaea 1 in 2003. The tail doubled as an extra mouth witch could bite, drain, and launch magical attacks.
>https://youtu.be/XVFFbCz6GQA?t=418
Monster Girl Quest and Violated Hero both came out around 2011 or so. Alma Elma also bears an uncanny resemblance to the Disgaea 3(2008) Succubus design. The semi sentient tail seems to absent in this design though.

>>54876684

I can see your SAN crumbling from here anon. Just accept it.

>to be fair I'm in denial too - to me monstergirls are acceptable if there is a decently-sized human part. Suu is debatable to me but honestly I don't really get her as "hot"

>>54876793

After the 1700? THAT's interesting actually. I mean, might point out when even in a city in which people had reasonable knowledge of their classical the name shifted.

>>54876667
It's just very short shiny fur, not dissimilar to what's on a horse.

>>54876757
Furry is furry, doesn't really matter though as long as your not a faggot about it.

>>54874000
or fairies and elfs. In continental europe those were very similar creatures/spirits, noble races, of human heights with various powers. Tolkien elfs or the fairy godmother in pinocchio are example of this.
But in the UK they got mixed with various tiny irish spirits, like the pixies, giving us the small fairies, elfs or feys.

>>54877090
>After the 1700?
well i sort of guessed that was the century when the meaning shifter, for sure by the 19th century all the portrayals are or mermaids. While the last portrayal as a birdwoman that I can think of is from the 17th century.
for instance this was in 1498
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fountain_of_the_Spinacorona
and this was from the 17th century
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Delle_imprese_trattato_detail.jpg

while this from 1869 is clearly a mermaid
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fontana_della_Sirena

>>54877202
But even with the Irish version there we're larger more human sized things and in the continental and northern versions there were also small folk, it's mostly just a case of elf or fairy being more of a generic term to refer to damn dear any old supernatural creature.

>>54877090
My metric for monstergirls is thus: If it has a snout, I am out. That stuff is just a tad too far for me.

>>54877449
not quite. Elfs and fairies were consistently big creatures in continental europe, along with other similar beings with different names.
It's in the UK t hat they were shrunk in size nad mixed up with the smaller beings. I never said that they didn't also have larger folk.

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>>54875959
Yep. What of it?

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>>54876234

>>54876234

But lizardbodls are a good idea.

You take the mightiest creatures in DND and link them to puny little scaly and scheming beings.

Kobolds in folklore are pretty unintersting as foes.

>>54877449
Rather like "troll" in scandinavia.

>>54878993
Subterranean goblins who can create poison and fire could be a dangerous enemy in a dungeon.

>>54880386

But that wouldn't be real kobolds at all. At most, they would be fire home-spirits or mine-spirits.

>>54880432
That's basically what I said.

>>54876732
Something like Polt seems borderline furry, since she's got fur and a doglike nose, but no muzzle. She's kind of an intermediate stage between kemomimi (human but with animal ears and tail, i.e. catgirls) and furry (fur and animal head).
I wouldn't consider something like lamia or mermaid furry (scaly, whatever), though, as they're human from waist up and just have their legs replaced with an animal tail.

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>>54870903
>The manga is all about the monster girls
>Ms Smith is the only one I've ever fapped to
Is something wrong with me?

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>>54873007
>Check out the House of Lusignan.
And here I was thinking Mero had a French name because it sounds fancy. That's a pretty obscure reference he's making there.

>>54873983
"short attention span" or "reading comprehension" the post.

>>54883767
not really, she's obviously the best

>>54877202
Some of that may also be case of fantasy convergent evolution, i.e. unrelated mythologies that have similar creatures because they embody the same archetypes. Various nature spirits and "hidden people" archetypes tend to show up everywhere, and there's half a dozen creatures commonly known as "[country's] vampire" (like jiang-shi, aka. Chinese vampire) despite having no relation to Romanian folklore.

>>54868298
>rat-lizard-man
>pug
>malnourished ratman
>lizard

>>54876732
Monstergirls are not furry by definition.

>>54868333
I agree.
Would they be Luckbolds then?

>>54868326
Yeah, those names are pretty cringeworthy, i wonder if he thinks he's clever or just doesn't give a shit at all.

>>54875735
For me, it's the keen sense of smell. If she can tell how much you've worked out by the smell of your sweat, she could probably smell you getting turned on by her. Considering how easily flustered she apparently is, I can just picture her getting redder and redder as she realizes how excited she's making you

>>54876268
>John Smith being one of the most bland and generic names possible
My great-grandfather had a major problem because of that. He'd sign into hotels and get mistaken for someone using a pseudonym. Everyone assumed his documentation was fake.
He took to trolling people because he was so sick of it, and so people would rue the name 'John Smith'.
I'm not sure if he was the early adopter of motoring that ended up weighing 300lb because of all the metal holding him together due to his crazy driving, or if that was another great-grandfather, or my mother's great-grandfather.

>>54876460
This.

>>54876684
Does her button nose count as a muzzle or not? I see her as just on the 'not furry' side, myself.
But, then, I don't see anything WRONG with furry art itself.
I reserve the right to object to the content, though. Much like with the fandom; I don't have a problem with people liking furry things and dressing up, just fucking BATHE, don't wave adult things in public, have some common fucking sense about things, and realise that I don't want to have your fursona explained to me in exacting detail just because I'm sat next to you somewhere, or that we have a mutual friend.
Yes, I'm bitter about furries being annoying furfags, because it drove me out of the fandom with drama.

>>54875037
>To be fair tough at least since Warcraft orcs are kinda different.

They're still pretty derivative of America's racism issues, though, Warcraft just swapped "hide your princess hide your scrying orb" to "brave, strapping primitive warriors pulled out of their own world"; it's a more positive prebaked identity but prebaked identities of any sort are still garbage.

>>54883767

Filthy degenerate.

>but I have to admit I might like Papi because hell, at least her vagoo SHOULD be kinda human, right?

>>54883799

Even better actually. Lorelei it's an obvious reference to the germanic MODERN legend...

.... which is also about tragic love (actually it's a reskinning of Ovid's Echo story). While the mermaids/selkies are almost always tragical, Andersen and the other 1800s writers put it up to eleven really.

>I still think Homer's sirens should have a comeback someway

>>54883976

Funny thing is, in a sense the jianghsi is a little more modern, being a full-fledged walking (hopping, whatever) corpse: it is totally unrelated but ends up more similar in this regard to 1900-2000s vampires.Vampires were way more ghostly up to... to Polidori, probably, but even later (Carmilla and Clarimonde, the real first and pretty awesome moepires, have something of this). Before you could easily find storie, even literary ones but especially in folklore of them behaving like spirits.

Nowdays the vampire is pretty material - DND with the fog thing probably puzzles modern newbies (I'm not even sure it's still there in fifth ed. actually, does it?). Dracula had it, but he was perhaps the last one, so it's kinda obscure.

>the evolution of the vampire with Twilight interests me while being revolting as fuck - basically it's a glorification of abusive relationships that plays it totally straight. If you really think about it, Edward is the real monster, and the readers who like him thinking him a "good guy" the victims

>>54888106

True dat, they kinda swapped the bad savage (in DND) for the good savage. At least they aren't peaceful bullshit savages.

Of all things in the movie I think they were... passable, to me. Not too bad, not to good, execpt from the villain. With agency. That's more or less like you should depict "natives", like humans (AH!).

>mind you, it's probably because the humans in that movie were way more cartoonish than the CGI ones

>>54875692
If only I could convey the metric tons of furry porn to a person with a single image, they don't even know that MonMusu is entry level.

>>54876099
>Minakami Sakura
Wish this series would get a continuation. >>54887205
>Yes, I'm bitter about furries being annoying furfags, because it drove me out of the fandom with drama.
What bothers me is that I enjoy anthropomorphic characters and stories about them, but I never interacted with online communities dedicated to them outside of some geocity sites devoted to Redwall cooking. So it was a surprise to me to see just how fucked up the furry community at large is and how sullied their reputation is. Still doesn't stop me from enjoying the content I do, but yeah; can't exactly be vocal about it in some areas just because I get lumped in with the diaper fetishists and fursuiters.

>>54875692
Also, fembeast is drawn as cute. If you really want to make the point of the ugly girl, make fembeast a feral snarling monster like beast is supposed to be, not a cute cat like monster.

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>>54868251
>Is calling this a Kobold a mistake?..
yes.
THIS is a kobold

>>54890767

Well, the actual best was the epitome of uglycute.

What is different is that she seems kinda nice, but in that scene he was too, I guess.

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>>54868251
God this anime was a fucking tragedy. The one chance for them to do some harem anime shit without it being generic as fuck, and they somehow make it generic as fuck. I wish this was so bad it's hilarious but it's not even funny. It's mediocre on every level and the Monster Musume general has to be the second most autistic general i've ever seen.

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>>54890767
Male beast in all his popular appearances is this noble bara royalty looking motherfucker. Aside from the fur and horns and shit, he's got a lot of pretty traditionally handsome qualities.
This is not a character designed to be unappealing.

>>54890991
Plebs gonna pleb
If it wasn't generic as fuck it wouldn't be popular enough to get an anime.

>>54890991

Even great harem series are generic. It's like pretending to have a dry sea.

>also in the end the girls aren't that generic, but they're used for generic plot

>>54868251

The Japanese have a very loose grasp of how exactly western fantasy creatures work.

I'm reminded of that funny tweet from the Tekken 7 director, who was asked why the vampire chick in T7 has horns: "it's because the artist doesn't know the difference between a vampire and a succubus".

>>54873007

Also the fish people from ancient Sumerian myth.

>>54895223
>>54895223

Oh, there are tons of fishmen. I think polynesian managed to have actual weresharks, which might be the single most metal thing the human mind ever conceived.
But they're kinda separate, I'd say. Aside from the fact that they are, well, fishmen, the ningyo of Japan have no connection to mermaids (no, not even the voice, a skylark isn't like the voice of the greek sirens).

The arab/middle eastern one I think have some traits in common (mating with humans) but it's pretty thin anyway.

>funfact: the mesopotamian version is what ended with all that hippie bullshit about the Oannes and aliens

>>54869665
>"glutton tail" succubi, aka. tailvorecubi (based on...nobody seems to know for sure)
wait what

>>54894442

It's not like western people don't care do their research often, of course. DND Nagas aren't exactly the indian nagas, and basically every L5R monster is bullshit

>>54890879
Kobooooooold

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>>54888195
>Funny thing is, in a sense the jianghsi is a little more modern.

Jiangshi myth stem from the "Corpse herder" profession in Xiangxi and some part of Indonesia.

The corpse herders are responsible for transporting the dead back to their hometown for burial. In the days before modern transportation, they did this by foot.

Since there were apparently more dead body than corpse herder, they just transport the corpses like pic related. If you chance upon them at night...those really do look like hopping corpse.

>>54890767
>Fierce wolf-queen locks me in her castle until I go on a date with her
This is easily more in my strike-zone than the one that looks like some toy dog breed.

JFantasy creature that are different from Western D&D counterpart (from the top of my head)

> J-orc tend to be literal pig-faced and beer-bellied, with strong hentai/rape tendencies even in non-hentai works. Not always green-skinned.

> J-goblins are like goblins, but more hentai.

> J-elves tend to be frail, more human in body proportion, and need sleeps.

> Some J-dwarves have dog-like features (dog ears etc).

> Dogbold, as mentioned by the OP.

> Cat/Dog/Bunnygirl-like beastmen instead of the more furry variety.

>>54897776

> J-trolls and J-ogres don't exist.

> J-gnoll also doesn't exist. OTOH, either kobold or werewolf replace them.

> J-werewolves tend to form into their own race instead of being lone monster/small pack and hiding among human.

>>54877506
That's the same for me. Polt is the line. More furry then her I am out. She is the last acceptable type.

>>54888195
>>I still think Homer's sirens should have a comeback someway
I think they are in various Monster Girl stuff, there are almost always a subspecies of Harpy that uses songs / hangs out by the sea. Hasn't really caught on in other sources yet though, far as I can tell.

>>54897870
I would argue that Oni are 90% Ogre, just significantly more human. Kinda a half Giant / Ogre hybrid, and considering neither Giants nor Ogres exist in their side they could just be catch all-ing any Ogre / Giant as Oni.

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>>54897870
Thats because J-Ogres have a superior variant, Oni.

>>54894442
Counterpoint: DnD Naga are hardly indian Naga and the entire idiocy of Ogre Mages.

Hell, DnD has metal-bull-monsters called Gorgons. Not even western writers get western myths right. And DnD was the inventor of the scaley'bold.

>>54897776
>Some J-dwarves have dog-like features (dog ears etc).
Fucking where? I literally never see it

>>54894442
There actually is significant overlap between J-vampires and J-succubi. Japanese vampires tend to be somewhat more demonic and less undead than western ones. They virtually always have pointy ears (standard demonic trait in Japan, which is why elves in Japan have extra long pointy ears to distinguish them from demons) and often have bat wings. Meanwhile succubi are sometimes descipted very similarly to vampires (especially in video games vampires and succubi both tend to have health draining attacks).

>>54895715
See above. Long story short, it's a succubutt with a mouth at the end of its tail that she eats you with. They kind of showed up in hentai at some point, and nobody seems to know exactly where they first appeared, or why.

>>54899160
Light novels. There's an outburst of Japanese fantasy/isekai web novels (and quite a lot already get adapted into anime and stuffs) in recent years.

But there are still a lot that's unheard of in the West.

>>54898652
Proper Oni rarely show up in J-fantasy...if they show up at all, they are often depicted as human-sized waifu materials with horn and monstrous strength.

>>54897776
Also J-Demons tend to be less literal manifestations of Evil and more like another fantasy race that is usually evil. Primarily because Japan doesn't have a Christian tradition and because their mythological equivalent of demons were more like those asshole fae than pure cosmic evil made manifest.

>>54899941
Indeed. Second this.

J-Dark lord also tend to be simply extra-powerful/talented individuals that are more like a unifier of (evil) tribes ala Genghis Khan, rather than some evil manifest that cause the evil races to automatically flocks to him.

>>54869194
>The first instances of japs seeing western fantasy in action were vidyagames, not DnD

OG final fantasy was based on DND you fuckwad. Why do you think mages got spells per day and warriors were fighters?

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>>54899160
>>54899827
Here's your J-Dwarf.

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>>54869762
EXTRA THICC

>>54897388

One wonders why they didn't just use a fucking cart.

>>54900249
Because cart can't be used in treacherous mountainous terrain ?

>>54888710
>because I get lumped in with the diaper fetishists and fursuiters
Even the fursuiters look down on the fetishists. A ridiculous amount of work goes into those things, and a decent one can cost as much as a half-decent used car.
To the point where I was considering one, but looked at the quote and thought 'I could buy a car for that'. Then I did.

>>54899827
We call our webnovels "fanfiction" and there's a shitload of it.

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>>54900588
>>54899827
Am I the only one who unironically likes isekai Light Novel adaptations?

>>54900667
Yes

>>54900667
What the fuck does isekai mean?

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>>54900667
I don't like them genrally speaking. They are too boring and samey for my taste and if I wanted to read a novella of questionable quality I can find something that doesn't require the main character to be a normal person sent to another world. But I find that bits of inspiration can be found even still which is why I keep my ear to the ground.

Take for instance this page from the series you just posted. Having it so that people with large amounts of mana struggle with basic spells to the point of them being unusable is an interesting idea. It means you can't effectively "cast down" under these rules and it's more of a benefit to be born with a lower mana reserve than a higher one in the general sense since higher magic spells can take months to cast.

The story is the type of wish fulfillment I've come to expect from modern Isekai but there's enough nuggets of quality to stick around through it all.

>>54900802
Literally "Different world". A name given to a genre of fiction wherein the character is transported to another world; so stuff like Alice in Wonderland or John Carter would be considered Isekai.

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>>54900802
Trapped in a fantasy world.

>>54900588
I am not too familiar with the fanfiction scene, but Japanese web novels are usually original works (i.e. not fanfic) and tend to get adapted into proper light novel/anime/manga afterwards.

>>54900815
Good for killing time, but really good stories do come out once in a while.

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>>54868320
>Brionac
>Cu Chulainn
But anon, that's wrong. Cu Chulainn possessed the Gae Bolg, which was a barbed spear crafted from the yew tree. It was said that if the spear drew blood, the barbs of the apear would grow through a person's veins and strike their heart, killing them instantly, and the spear would need to be cut free of its new growths in order to remove it from someone's body.

Brionac is an alleged name of Lugh's unconquerable spear, often also called the Spear of Light, which held similarities to Odin's Gungnir, in that it would always find its mark and could pierce all armors.

This spear is also not to be mistaken for Gae Assail, or the "Spear of Assal", which Lugh also owned.

>>54900962
Nor gae dearg or gae buidhe from Diarmuid Ua Duibhne From "The Pursuit of Diarmuid and Grainne

>>54900962
There's also Ichaival, alleged magic bow owned by Odin.

>not having kobolds be fae
Annoying when there is established mythology and something entirely different snatches the name. Kobolds are weird, little, mischievous and often ugly people with powerful fairy magic. Leprechauns and Klabautermänner could be considered types of kobolds as well.

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>>54886350
Anon, pls.

>>54868251
There was a page where she's explaining the origins of Cobalt, and how in myth miners would say Kobalds magic had done it.

>>54868251

Kobolds are dog people over there.

>>54897388

That's pretty cool in its own way.

>>54897776

> J-elves tend to be frail, more human in body proportion, and need sleeps.

So, the J here stands for John Ronald Reul Tolkien?

http://middle-earth.xenite.org/do-elves-sleep/

I bet you think also dwarves have boating problems

>>54903694
> So, the J here stands for John Ronald Reul Tolkien?
Japanese.

And D&D elves don't sleep.

>I bet you think also dwarves have boating problems
Why yes! Dwarves being people of the mountain/earth prefer to have their feet on firm ground.

Not the first time I've come across dwarf with a bad case of aviophobia in Japanese fantasy either.

>>54904255

I think you should check out your sarcasm detector.

I was stating that this characteristics are pretty much tolkienian.

>Why yes! Dwarves being people of the mountain/earth prefer to have their feet on firm ground.

It's a whole lot of DND bull that doesn't really add anything. The sleeping is misunderstanding, but Gimli have no qualms about leaving Lorien on boats and there is no way to be confused about that.
If anything, the hobbits have problems with rivers, I think they say something like that about the Brandywine at the start.

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>>54900962
>strike their heart, killing them instantly

Well...

>>54902506
and she knows just how erect that is

>>54905697
Shoulda named the file "Evasion" and it woulda been perfect

>>54905697
Poor Lancer wasn't told that the other players were using hacks, is all.

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>>54868251
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjt-5GOppdg

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>>54905699
C'mon man, gimme a break. It's bad enough I'm picturing her going from her normal incredibly upbeat cheerful self into a blushing, embarrassed silence.
STOP THROWING FUEL ON THE FIRE.

>>54905697

Ah yes, Magic Resistance and Luck, the reason why Casters and Lancers almost never get to win the Grail War.

>>54868309

But it's canon that Spider-Man has a huge package.

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>>54869471
I include monstergirls in my OSR games.
Not all kinds of course. I've still got regular orcs and goblins and such.

>>54876268

What work is this?

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>>54906187
>>54906453

Monster Musume is low-tier. Elf-san wa Yaserarenai (Elf Can't Diet) is where it's at. It's about a guy who works for one of those Beauty Spas where they use massages to help women lose weight and meets different Fantasy Monster Girls who can't go back to their home dimension because they've gained weight. It's a secret though and he's the only one who knows what they are.

It's done by Methonium, who does Hentai, but there's no fucking in this.

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>>54908070

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>>54908113

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>>54908132

>>54908070
> This much fat fetishism

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>>54908152

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>>54908198

Lots of Elf Bullying in this comic.

>>54908170

No one is really fat. Just Thicc.

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>>54908225

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>>54908263

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>>54908287

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>>54908311

Wait, what was this thread about?

>>54908070

>fat elves

But why? It's like big titted lolis, doesn't make any sense.

>>54908758

Too many french fries.

>>54908332
>Her name is Kuro and she is black
That's fitting

>>54900146
It's a matter of scale. US had a first TRPG boom in the late '70s, with the D&D basic set sold in toy stores and the game itself reaching pop culture consciousness, while even the most popular console and computer RPGs before FF7 struggled to reach sales over 100-200k.

Meanwhile, for Japan, play before 1985 was limited to fan-translated rules, and the first Japanese edition (which was infamous for poor translations like "plutonium" rather than "platinum pieces") didn't end up shipping until the same year as PC Wizardry, only two years before Famicom Wizardry and FF.

Essentially, while D&D did have a little bit of an early mover's advantage among grognards and college clubs, it didn't have time to penetrate even tabletop gamer consciousness in the "Old Testament" way it has in the west.
Japan also didn't get AD&D proper until well after homegrown systems hit the market at much more reasonable paperback prices.

>>54908070
>Double peace sign
Kek

>>54869437
>I think most people would agree that "kobold" doesn't sound like a very large creature
it's also the German word for "goblin"

These threads are getting kobold.

>>54870623
I only have the Bullete, where can you get the rest?

>>54900249
If you are a chinese peasant from before people figured out eggs are edible and your job is transporting corpses then you do not have "owns a cart" money. It will be YEARS of corpse hauling before you've paid off the loan you had to take out to afford the two bamboo sticks.

>>54906694
https://exhentai.org/g/588041/d271d8ffc8/

>>54915180

Fucking Sad Panda. Does g.e- not work anymore?

>>54888710
That goes both ways. I don't see any problem with jerking it to weird porn, but walking around in a suit pretending you are an animal goes so far past the line you can't even see the line anymore.

>>54916142
no it doesn't. It switched to just e-

Also, some things aren't on e- that are on ex, so its a mixed bag.

>>54917770
That one should be on e-, though. No fjording tags.

>>54917770
>>54917797

It worked! Also, I remember this! Is this actually canon?

>>54919686
If thats the thing about monmusu, its about as canon as anything else is. I'd argue its more canon to the new series than the strips about the 8 brothers, at least.

>>54875692
I hate women.

>>54919981

For being too normie?

>>54908758

Because elves are supposed to be these perfect creatures. The idea that they are vulnerable to the modern world like everyone else, get insecure about their muffin tops and pot bellies and need to sweat and whimper on treadmills to try and lose their decadent gluttony-weight, is cute and sexy.

Also,

>not liking oppai lolis

Plebian

>>54908225
Not everyone wants to feel the Thiccening, though, Thighlander...

>>54920570

All the better for me, then. For there can only be one.
(Seriously though, it's a funny mango)

>>54909547
(Forest) Elf is Erufuda
Ogre is Oga
Mermaid is Mero

>>54910552

I see what you did there anon

And it's medioogre

>>54920425
>oppai lolis
Either go shortstack or admit you're a pedo.

>>54923166

Why not shortstack masquerading as an oppai

>deviancy_intensifies.jpg

So what would be a good name to call the lil dragon kobolds instead?

>>54920425

That's the retardest shit I've read on 4chan in the last month.

Bravo.

>>54923924
Geckos

>>54923924

In what context?

Do we have other forms of kobolds we need to classify in the setting?

Hound Kobolds would work to go with Lizard Kobolds.

>>54875692
This is why anyone who says "Guys would never fuck ___" are fools. Actually applies to all people, someone is into it. This place used to be crawling with women who had an insect rape/impregnation kink.

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>>54908070
>but there's no fucking in this
It's a shame because that fucking dark elf one.

Good lord.

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>>54927774

Dat elf, tho.

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>>54927774
>>54928003

Dat Elf indeed.

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>>54927774
>>54928003
>>54928036

>>54920410
basic bitches gonna be basic.
And bitchy.

>>54869194
The One True Kobold.

>>54908070
Victory_Screech.jpg

>>54927047
>women who had an insect rape/impregnation kink
I've seen doujins of that and I just do not understand why women would want bugs of all things all up in there

>>54935270
I dunno why either.

Some of the stuff can get pretty horrific, too.

>>54935445
Thanks for reminding me about Blowfly Girl anon. And I was just about to start making dinner too.

>>54935556
I was thinking more along the lines of someone having insects stuff eggs into their boobs and having to birth them from their nips.

What is this "Blowfly Girl" though?
What makes it so horrific?

>>54935579
not OP but I think it is the comic where a girl get raped by a bunch of insects and then her tummy explodes with larva or something.

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>>54935270
Personally, women being into something that weird makes me confident that there has to be at least a few that are into giantess stuff.

Because, if they're into bugs crawling up the vagoo, then maybe really tall girls aren't as weird as I thought.

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>>54935817

>>54928078
Dat Ass cannot be contained.

>>54935820
I've encountered a few women into giantess stuff.
Unfortunately, they've all been exclusively into girls as well.

>>54914057
> Pushing cart along
> Cart hits pothole
> Cart tips over
> Corpses roll out
> Put corpses back in, keep going
> Cart hits tree root
> Cart tips over
> Sigh, put corpses back in, keep going
> Break cart as it rolls over, have to fix it with local materials
> It's not just a bamboo pole, so you have to use planks

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>>54897776
>Cat/Dog/Bunnygirl-like beastmen instead of the more furry variety
Nothing makes me more furious then this half assed animal-girls that are nothing more then regular girls with changes so slight that they are often only visable at the end of extremities and/or ears (bonus points of for some reason there are human ears aswell).
Either have a real antro race or don't.

>>54921274
Whats up with this japanese monster girls almost porn and her super lame names?

Still waiting for the human girl named "Yuman"

ok ok, fucking anthropomorphic animals everywhere.
But where can one find zoomorphic humans?

>>54908225

they are fat. If you don't think those fatties are fat you must be a hambeast yourself.

>>54935579
>>54935817
no, it was a blog of a girl with a insect and garbage fetish, who went garbage diving and stuffed rotten maggot infested meat in her vagina let it fester and then woke up in a hospital after she almost died, and she gives detailed accounts of her sensations with stuffing garbage in her pussy, the squirming of the maggots, the rotten stench, and so on.
It's not really that bad.
The funniest part was where she said, "this is who I am, this is what I deserve, other girls give birth to babie,s I give birth to filth and garbage" or something along those lines

>>54895799
Kobold?

>>54900667
Okay, that's not fair. You chose one of the few that are actually good.

But I do admit, I enjoy them too.

>>54900667
No sir, you are not.

>>54875692
>Men are never told to give an ugly woman a chance because she's nice
>Oh yeah? Well here's a bunch of sexy anime babes with a few token non-human features (that do not in any way detract from their appearance). Consider yourself proven wrong.

That doesn't work. That doesn't work at all. I mean, maybe if she said "men don't masturbate to monstergirls" then it would work as a response, but as written it's a complete non-sequitur, and her point still stands (I honestly can't think of a single example of female love interest in literally any fiction who isn't intended to be incredibly attractive).

Now, granted, I guess you could make the case that Beast is sexy as fuck in his popular appearances (and he is holy shit disney), but that's purely adaptational and I'm pretty sure completely accidental, as it goes against the entire theme, premise, and core concept of the work, not to mention that it makes the entire idea of the "curse" no longer work (how the fuck is being made more attractive a curse? And don't give me any "so sexy it's a curse" bs, because you know as well as I do that it seldom if ever works for male characters, especially if the "curse" also makes them super strong/fast/deadly combat beasts who can fight off entire wolf packs alone and unarmed.

Now, I have nothing against monstergirls, but I'm pretty sure her response was more to the effect of "why are you telling me about your favorite hentai wtf I didn't ask for this" rather than "oh no hell and damnation I have been made the fool"

>>54868281

Well I think dungeon meshi did a pretty good version of kobolds. And that OP slime alternate world guy manga.

>>54945428

But that female beast is uglycute as the actual beast was.

>>54945494
Eh, fair enough.

>>54945428
>sexy anime babes with a few token non-human features
He could have posted the mountains of xeno porn instead. His point is still valid.

Some people will fuck anything.

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>>54945714
Can confirm.

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>>54945714

>>54945454
Name is Tensei Shitara Slime Datta Ken.