/btg/ BattleTech General

Reposting for new thread.

>>54730292
I don't agree, simply because most people forget that most battletech planets are shit. Poisonous water and atmosphere, killer creatures, dying terraforming, insufficient water. The second thing is that many of those worlds are basically independent and just a tax stamp for the ruling nobility so only the actual institutions of power like the capital, spaceport and manufacturing centers are worth taking. The only time you see a full multicity planetary campaign is when the population are a bunch of die hards for their faction, like the campaigns on New Syrtis and Dieron. Battletech planetary conquests usually operate more like a military coup in the real world than an invasion.

The semi-garden worlds should maybe have big militias but not the rest. And they tend to anyway. Like look at Marfik in the 4th War. Shit tier dumping ground for malcontents. Still has a regiment of mechs, four of armor, and six of infantry.

>>54730513

Yet they still have populations in the billions. Atleast one to three zeroes should be slashed off planetary populations for the setting to make sense. I could see why a planet of 60 million wont field more than some infantry and a company of mechs but anything less than a full blown combined arms army of millions is laughable for a planet of six billion.

>>54730981
>Atleast one to three zeroes should be slashed off planetary populations for the setting to make sense.

You ain't gonna get an argument from me there. I always say that's one of the soft retcons that needs to happen in the setting, the same way they did jumpship numbers. Doesn't actually change anything in terms of the way things have been written historically, but fixes the numbers up quite a bit.

Selp me on the ghost bears without shitposting

>>54731209
They took the torch of top protag clan back in 3057. Haven't given it up yet and got all the sweet gear that comes with being a protagonist faction.

>>54731209
The Bears are present in both the inner sphere and homeworlds from REVIVAL to Reavings giving you the opportunity to play in either location.

They are neither wholly crusader nor wholly warden, having been in both camps, so you're not going to be a pariah for either ideology.

Fun rivalry with CHH, occasionally yanks the Wolf's tail. Hate Boner for the Nova Cats. Intimidate the shit out of the dragon. If you're playing during the jihad you get to go all insane berserker against the Word.

>>54731209

They get arguably the best mech in the game, the karhu

>>54731883
>karhu
Reminds me of the Z'Gok-E.

>>54731883
What's the deal with that? A melee-armed clan mech?

>>54732405
That's not even BT art, is it? It's too good to be. Too closely reminiscent of Studio Nue.

>>54732098
Mein crackah.

>>54732271
It cosplays as wolverine on the werkend. The G is arguably the best variant.

>>54732548
It's the back cover to CityTech, so yes it's BT.

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>>54732548
Is this some kind of joke? Jim Holloway is THE Battletech cover artist of the 80's. Read the old stuff, it's a ton of fun.

>>54732596
>>54732651
Well why isn't he anymore? This stuff is unbelievable for BattleTech art. Almost makes the setting appealing even.

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>>54732983
He did battletech stuff for like ten years straight, all the original stuff the grogs know and love from the scenario books to Citytech to Mechwarrior 1st Edition.

He's famous in old school DnD as well.

>Well why isn't he anymore?
He hasn't been super visible in the RPG biz in general since like 1994.

>>54732983
If I had to guess, FASA fuccking him over, not paying and him spending his time elsehwhere.

>>54731039
>You ain't gonna get an argument from me there.

same with me, and it makes sense- when so many inner sphere worlds have regular jumpship meets and basic civilian droppers everywhere, why not go to some other planet?

>>54732651
>Is this some kind of joke? Jim Holloway is THE Battletech cover artist of the 80's. Read the old stuff, it's a ton of fun.
Some of the best 20 bucks I ever spent was a copy of "The Tales of the Black Widow". True Mad Max in Space there, really has soul.

>>54731209
>Selp me on the ghost bears without shitposting
If you want to play clan in the 3050s and not be dicks, or if you want to downplay the obviously stupid clan "economies" Ghost Bear has you covered. Compared to the rest of the invaders, the Bears were arguably the kindest and best to the citizenry of the worlds they captured.

>>54733192
>Compared to the rest of the invaders, the Bears were arguably the kindest and best to the citizenry of the worlds they captured.
only after the retcon. originally were almost as bad as the jags

>>54733216
This. They didn't get the whole carebear reputation until later. And that was based on the fact that they were the only clan not to completely kill the family structure in their warrior class.

>>54732548
>Too closely reminiscent of Studio Nue.

>Has a nickname "Hanzo".
>Clearly shows the rocket pods on Warhammer.
>Mega RPG nerd.

He was a weeb, wasn't he?

>>54733263
All the FASA boys were weebs. You didn't even get access to most anime in those days if you weren't.

>>54733284
Internet-spoiled numbnuts chanting about "weebs" have no idea of the immense, thankless hard work and masturbation the western anime scene is built upon. The tears-of-frustration-inducingly degraded VHS recordings, copied with video boxes of the time to infinity to reach the many grasping hands, the furtive secrecy, the terrible personas that had to be suffered in order to spread the evangelion in smelly corners of comic and game cons, the living of double-identities necessitated by the hobby and the understanding that non-infected people could never, ever understand or forgive the practice...

The last clause reminds me of some of the old gang. I got my first copy of patlabor from an actual police officer. He used to doodle comics about arriving to work in one. The poor bastard had the drawing skills of a thalidomide child on too much red bull.

>>54730981
That just introduces a different continuity problem. People don't leave behind everything they know for the hazards and discomforts of colonial life (especially in alien biospheres) when room and resources are plentiful at home. An Inner Sphere full of 1/100th settle worlds doesn't make sense unless they're all populated by Finns and Canadians.

Is there ever a reason to equip machine guns instead of small lasers on mechs?

>>54733901
>) when room and resources are plentiful at home. An Inner Sphere full of 1/100th settle worlds doesn't make sense unless they're all populated by Finns and Canadians.

That's literally how the colonization of Battletech is already written. It's modeled after the western expansion of the US where many first settlers fucked off to the reaches the more government encroached on their homes. The 2300's are full of people just loading up and fucking off as far from the TH as they can.

And most battletech worlds with even billions of people only have like one continent on the planet settled with the rest of the place wild and untouched.

So, no. It doesn't introduce any kind of continuity problem. That's how the universe is already written.

>>54734454
Machines that already ride the heatcurve hard and killerizing infantry. Plus they're more flexible when you play with the option rapid fire.

>>54734456
Status: No Country For TOLD Men

>>54734454
Small lasers do not have anti-infantry ability.

And that aside, it is relatively easy to "game" machineguns by equipping a few powerful energy weapons that overwhelm your heatsinks, then spend the leftover tonnage on machineguns that are basically free fire on that. Treat it as zero range critseeking, like SRMs without the heat.

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What does /btg/ think of FJ4's CGI artwork?

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>>54734618
Reminds me of the original DA art and that makes me both rationally and violently angry.

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>>54734668
How so?

>>54734618
Reminds me of Pavel's work from the 90s.

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>>54730455
So when is /tg/ going to kickstart a class action lawsuit against harmony gold for fraudulent IP infringement claims?

>>54734456
Yes, that makes the Terran Alliance makes sense (people wanting to leave an overcrowded, overexploited Earth). But then unless Terra just keeps spewing people into the void, enough to populate all space, it doesn't work beyond that. It also doesn't explain why people keep going to different all-new worlds over and over when there's a host of underpopulated, underexploited ones out there, because again, there's very real costs and risks in choosing a new world over one that's already been partially settled and has some infrastructure and the like. You need a compelling reason to ignore that. In some cases it could be a persecuted or fanatical religion or political movement that has to be alone, but beyond that it doesn't make much sense.

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>>54734723
Because 3DCG has no place on the cover of any Battletech product but a video game. And DA stuck that shit front and center for 8 years straight instead of any decent traditional painted art, even on novels.

>>54731883
The best mech in the game is the Arcas, not the Karhu.

>>54734618
It looks like mid 90s cg, and of middling quality at that. Overall, not great.

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>>54734805
Heard you talkin' shit like I wouldn't hear you.

>>54734778
Have you seen all the proto states of the inner sphere? That's exactly what they did. Everybody out trying to make a stake and then spreading out a little to the surrounding worlds as their primary colony became established. It's the Morman response.

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>>54734618
Oh man, the Shads look awful.

>>54734770
When it also means we can get the IP into the hands of someone more competent than CGL.

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So MM just gave me a QUA -51T

Its(at least to my newbie eyes) fairly good. Its gonna cost me 226,400 cbills to swap out all the industrial armour and structure and up gun it a bit, to give me what you see

This is so worth it right. There isn't some rule i haven't heard of that will make this a shit investment

>>54734992
Are you using the industrial cockpit with advanced fire controls that it came with, or are you upgrading to a full military cockpit?

>>54734992
It's a factory level refit to upgrade it, and it still isn't an actual BattleMech, so you're still driving a piece of garbage.

>>54735048
it came with a Standard cockpit so i was going to leave it

>>54735053
But does the piece of shit act like a normal mech post upgrade?

>>54734874
Yes, I get that. But I'm talking about beyond the initial stage. It's no coincidence that the great migrations of history occur with shortages of food, land, or raw materials, invading enemies, or an unexpected burst of fresh resources. In modern times, people generally left well-tamed areas because there wasn't enough food or land--Irish famine, English non-firstborn sons due to the practice of primogeniture, non-English Europeans with family landholds too small to support families after being divided between sons over and over. In a universe where every world is underpopulated and flush with materials, the basic, initial colonization drive still works (Azami need to Azami someplace else; Hindus want to collectivize over yonder; I found some germanium over here), but falls apart when trying to explain why, having made that settlement, why everyone leaves it to go found a series of other underpopulated worlds again and again. You can't at once say people leave comfy home to go be with fellow like-minded individuals, but at the first opportunity screw off and leave them for the rigors of parts unknown.

>>54735053
>>54735048
Wait turns out i have an extra 4.5 tones of space as i dont need ES

Any suggestions on stuff to add?

>>54735109
>But does the piece of shit act like a normal mech post upgrade?
Not really, no. Besides that, you've done so many mods it's not really a Quasit anymore.

>>54735128
>again and again

They didn't. Look at the colony dates. Almost the entire Inner Sphere was settled over the span of a hundred years. The only people interested in colonizing after that were the periphery powers like the Rimworlds as a way to acquire more resources. The original settlers moved out to a surrounding four or five worlds generally to be able to support the infrastructure for an interstellar state.

Sorry for the blog post.

Just found out the guy who introduced me to tabletop BT and roleplaying in general died a couple months ago. He was in his mid 50's so it wasnt too surprising. We hadnt really talked in about two years, but its still weird to think about.

I was part of his group for about 5 years in my middle-late teens in the mid 2000's, around that time we did build up to and then initial clan invasion, plus a few fun deep periphery gallivanting campaigns.

He had been running a 'playthrough' of BT starting from late 3SW until when we last talked PCs were coming back from Bulldog, it was somewhat AU because his players could affect the universe and have lasting consequences.

I'm mostly writing this because I dont have any contact details for any other people in his group, so I figured I'd share my sadness, I was really hoping to see how the Civil War went.

>>54734805

...aight ill buy that

>>54735178
If you have the tonnage, drop a Mlas for a Large laser and another HS or some armor?

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>>54735783
How does this look. I really am just guessing.

Also why the large laser over just more mediums?

>>54736433
You'll outrange most of the light's you'll run into with a large laser.

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>>54733443
>Internet-spoiled numbnuts chanting about "weebs" have no idea of the immense, thankless hard work and masturbation the western anime scene is built upon.

You mean the American scene.
Here in Europe, Japanese cartoons didn't have a problem with getting aired on TV, with numerous co-productions happening. Europe still is the world's biggest foreign consumer of manga, ahead of all of Asia.

The more the merrier, though.

>>54734618
It's like those autist deviantart accounts.
Where they're horrible and get even worse as time goes by, but relentlessly continue doing it.

Screen it out and pretend he doesn't exist is probably the best course of action. No hurt feelings on one side and no need to cringe even more on the other.

>>54734770

When we can prove that we have been financially impacted on by HG, which you need to do for class action suits.

If you mean donate to a defence fund for, remember that the legal eagle for CGL is Loren Coleman. Do you trust Loren with a potentially large sum of money placed directly in his hands to be used for the theoretical betterment of BT after what happened the last time they did that?

Not to mention that they're fucked for the case any way since they have a binding agreement saying they wouldn't infringe, made a bunch of new designs that weren't infringing, and then as soon as HG stopped breathing down their necks pumped out a bunch of designs that were intentionally created to look as much like the source ones as possible. Regardless of what we may think of HG's business ethics, that shit ain't gonna fly in court and is exactly why CGL accepted summary judgement in default against them on all points raised by HG.

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>>54734618
The thing about him is his stuff really reminds me of HD Mechwarrior 2 stuff. While there is a certain quality to that, that stuff was low-poly for a reason. Sticking so close to it is kinda like an HD Minecraft skin.

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Also, since nobody seems to have done it yet, Plogdump.

Starting with his new takes on the Protos. First the Siren.

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>>54737637
Roc.

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>>54737651
Gorgon.

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>>54737679
Minotaur.

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>>54737703
Cecerops.

These are pretty sick, i like yhem better than the original art for protos.

>>54734852
What's the meme here with the Vulpes exactly?

>>54737637
Makes me think of a cross between the mech from District 9 and a Titan from Titanfall.

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>>54737718
Erineyes.

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>>54737814
Delphine.

>>54737637
What Clan is that?

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>>54737867
Minotaur P2.

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>>54737894
Last Plog for now, not sure what this is. It kinda looks like a Kodiak, but then, I'm old and don't do much Dark Age.

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>>54737921
Don't know if this was posted here either, but it's Bishop and we can't have enough of that.

Ever see Plogs version of the warships? Those are gorgeous also.

>>54737921
It looks nothing like Kodiak, this is clearly a battle armor

>>54737766

Feddie players bitch that it is totally like the worst 'Mech EVER and is symptomatic of the shit that constantly gets shovelled on them.

Non-Feddie players point out that it is shit easy to spam massive TMMs with it, that it kites like a mofo thanks to the twin Clan ER LLs, that the Stealth Armour on it actually saves you BV, and that, get this, you don't actually have to tape down the firing buttons because heat management is a thing.

>>54737921
>>54739078
Ogre BA?

>>54739078
>>54739192
I thought so but does the Ogre have that many weapons? I recall it only having battle claws and an SRM2. It looks a bit like that brawler BA in the /btg/TRO too, but if I recall that's lightly armed too.

>>54739183
>you don't actually have to tape down the firing buttons
But muh alpha strikes!

Tell me about your player characters, /btg/.

>>54739442

For me the most ironic thing is that they spent years saying they wanted a Grand Dragon or similar of their own and that any complaints about Drac/Cap/Burd machines were green saltybutt from players who couldn't into actual tactics, and when they finally get something that requires skill to use the sky is fucking falling all of a sudden.

>>54739627
My campaign died. Thanks for the reminder. It died for a stupid reason too, which sucks all the more.

>>54739627

RPG characters, tabletop wargame characters, AtB characters...what?

>>54739627
He was a SAFE operative. In true SAFE fashion, pretty much everyone had him figured out within a few days.

>>54734992
Replace the SRM-4 with a second LRM-5 and a third ML for a net gain in firepower. I would also recommend replacing the MG with a SPL for your anti-personnel needs.

>>54736433
Swap out the LRM-5 for a second SRM-4. Either replace a ton of ammo with a heat sink, or keep it and fill it with infernos.

>>54736818
Well that's because in Europe they didn't have companies like Harmony Gold shooting the legal exports in the leg.

>>54735392
Pretty much this and what's worth the Terran Alliance that was in place at the time when the major colonisation effort happened was really really shitty that I can understand people leaving in droves.

>>54739183
saves you BV, but costs a lot more to repair in a roleplaying setting.

>>54737651
*Sounds of Freedom*

>>54741585

>let me find something else to bitch about

The Vulpes would be welcomed with open arms by any non-Clan faction, and even some Clan factions. That you have to reach so far for something to complain about indicates what the real problem is.

I'm very sorry that CGL didn't cater to you with Boosted C3, Clan-tech Devastator like you expected but maybe after four fucking years you could get over your anal annhilation.

>>54740615

AFAIK Harmony Gold at least claims world-wide rights to Robotech/Macross. They only seem to be exerting those rights in the US, but whether that's because that's the only place they've had trouble or is all they care about I don't know.

>>54737921
It's a yet unnamed melee heavy. He does original art occasionally; this is one of those pieces.

>>54741976
IIRC, they only actually 'hold' rights within the US, though they could possibly control it elsewhere. There was a case years back in Japan that turned over the rights of the series to the original studio, Studio Nue, so right now HG only holds the rights of the series through US law because Studio Nue doesn't give a fuck about the American market. If they really wanted to they could punt HG out, but until that time HG is hellbent on holding what little they still possess.

However, between dubious legal distinctions, earlier lawsuits, and the fact that HG only really exists as a real-estate group now, their hold on the designs is tenuous at best. The only thing really keeping them on it is whatever the 'secret agreement' was between them and FASA. Some people speculate that in the current case the judge is trying to maneuver things to force that agreement into light.

>>54742394

There has been a lot of speculation about that court case, especially with ideas like HG over-reaching and HBS/PGI being onto a sure-fire winner. I can't see that.

What I can see is that HG has always gotten the shits when people infringe on IP they view as their own and have used the agreement with Jordan and FASA to torpedo stuff before. CGL know they're fucked unless HBS/PGI pull out an unlikely win and didn't even bother filing a defence.

HBS/PGI are arguing that HG doesn't own the rights, which *may* be correct but would require the Jap studios to sign onto the case to really push, which isn't going to happen. HBS/PGI have to defend though because if (or, more likely, when) they're found to be infringing they could be liable for damages to HG *and* will have to change the models of the Unseen, which will be extra work for them and probably piss the players off because all of a sudden they'll have the looks changed, and that's assuming PGI will have a ready replacement instead of putting them on the shelf until new art can be worked out.

The world-wide rights aren't super relevant, anything that gets bought to the west from Japan gets localised through the US any way so US rights basically means world-wide rights in effect if not in law.

>>54741958
lol you sound extremely butthurt, fuckboi

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>>54741976
>They only seem to be exerting those rights in the US

That's not true.
Newer Macross shows are released ONLY in Japan merely with English subtitles for the other Asians nations who all have to import it.

Likewise, they cucked us out of any Super Robot Wars English translations for very much the same reason. Most SRW games have Macross in them and after a lawsuit with Harmony Gold, they simply gave up on releasing the game outside of Japan for a good number of years.

The newest one is the first one with an official translation and an international (as in other Asian nations) release precisely because it's the first mainline SRW game to have no Macross in it.

What are some good Davion-built light mechs?

Putting together a Davion Light Guard lance.

>>54743824
4x DVS-X10 MUSE EARTH

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>>54743887

>>54737718
>>54737814
Huh. The rest are great, the Gorgon in particular, but those two I think I'd kinda prefer to stick with the reptiloids we've got.

>>54744265
Shit, I meant the second link to be >>54737867

Erinyes is nice.

>>54743824
You'll never go wanting for firepower with Davion lights. Javelin JVN-11A, Hollander BZK-F3, Night Hawk NTK-2Q and Spector SPR-5F.

Didja have any specific era in mind though?

>>54743824

Osiris.

>>54743690

It's hard to tell whether that's because of HG or because the Jap companies don't think it's worth their time to release the games overseas. The market for niche games is never as large as fans like to imagine it is.

It's also hard to tell whether it's a chicken and egg thing with HG's rights squatting having perhaps prevented real growth in what could have been that market or if no-one would ever have given a fuck.

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>>54744686
>It's hard to tell whether that's because of HG or because the Jap companies don't think it's worth their time to release the games overseas. The market for niche games is never as large as fans like to imagine it is.

As I said, this is not concerning overseas market.
Of course they don't give a single damn about the US or Europe.

However, when it comes to the rest of East Asia and South East Asia, it's a completely different story altogether. HG is bullying them out of those.

Jeez, what the fuck is it with you people to think you're like the only foreigners in the whole damn world?
I wouldn't care if I simply wrote foreign or something in there but I explicitly mentioned the ban on Asian countries and you still went with the whole "But they don't give a damn about the US," thing.

>>54744838

Not even a burger mate.

Just that I've seen plenty of Jap games I'd have lied to play never get any kind of foreign release because localisation costs too much or they just can't be fucked.

Not everything needs to be a HG-lead conspiracy that would require Adam Jensen, Miles Vorkosigan, and Fox Mulder to untangle.

Unless you have a source proving it is HG, in which case fair enough.

>>54743887
Oh snap.

>>54744402
Are the Hollander, Night Hawk and Spector made in the Suns or are they Lyran?

Era right now is the eternal 3060s.

>>54745012

I think those are all made in the Lyran half.

Suns in '67: Fireball, Locust, Wasp, Javelin, Garm, Hornet, Valkyrie, Osiris

>>54743824
The ultimate canon Davion light lance: Hornet, Fireball, Wasp and Locust.

Or four Timber Wolves.

>>54745063

>not four Leviathan IIIs

Fucking Outback pleb, get off of my Golden Five lawn.

>>54745056
Gotcha. I mean I love throwing some Lyran machines in here and there but for logistical/fluff purposes I was planning on going mostly domestically made stuff.

Thanks for the suggestions.

>>54744986
>Unless you have a source proving it is HG, in which case fair enough.

Super Robot Wars was sued by HG back in 2000 when they tried to make the first international release. The translation and international release were cancelled right afterwards.

That Macross wants to distribute stuff outside of Japan but can't and includes English subtitles on the DVD/BR as a consolation prize is mentioned in just about every Kawamori interview there is.

It's not a conspiracy. SRW company is just a mid-sized game company that stands no chance against HG in court so they stick to the safety of not doing any Macross abroad (they do publish all of their OG games across Asia). Macross can't do shit because Harmony Gold sniped their trademark and so they couldn't call their Macross shows Macross, as well as have to edit out all mentions of Macrosses in the shows themselves, which is bonkers.

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>>54743824
Four Valkyries. The most Davion of Davion lights. Call it Ride Lance.

4x QA/QD/QD1/Q8 depending on era.

New to the game. A friend lent me Field Manual Draconis Combine and Field Manual Federated Suns. We bought the introductory box set together.

He says whichever faction I pick he'll take the opposite so we can do versus games.

Feds seem like the West Europe Good Guys types.

Tell me about the Draconians.

What about their BattleMechs?

>>54746367
Fedrats are the noble knights
Snakes are the honorable samurai

Snakes are much more difficult to play because of their comparatively poor mech selection, especially compared to the Feddies who have some of the best machines in all eras. You play the Draconis Combine if you like some guys that are unapologetic saturday morning cartoon villains and do it with style. Basically, I wouldn't recommend Combine to a beginner. The people who usually can play them well are the GM's who got a lot of practice using them as OPFOR and can use their strengths to the best.

Fedsuns, Marik, and Steiner are all beginner friendly. All have a wide variety of capable machines that don't take any advanced skill to use effectively.

>>54746367
DCMS can be most easily abbreviated to "World War II Japan", except they also have mechs, so Samurai are the ones at the helm in all but the dregs regiments.

Unless you guys are agreeing on using the special abilities in those books and/or limiting yourselves to the equipment to best match the FM page, I wouldn't worry too much about which one you choose. Whatever unit suits your fancy. It is more fun to stick to the theme of the unit, I find.

Try checking www.camospecs.com and click on the Factions tab. They give a dropdown list of factions, which then branches off into example paintjobs for (almost) every canon regiment, according to their Field Manual information.

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>>54746367
Feds are...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YI3iw_AttNU

Draconians are a parody of Japanese stereotypes.
I wouldn't put that much thought behind what sort of battlemechs the factions use since there's such a huge selection within relatively simple building rules that just about any faction can add up to whatever you like. You like PPCs and that's about it for the Draconian flavor.

>>54746569
Draconians isn't even a battletech term. People say Kuritans like they say Davions.

>>54746672
Or shorten it to Dracs if they're talking the Combine.

Man, those second time around Plog Protos are fantastic.

>>54747203
Most are pretty great. Some like Cecyrops and Minotaur are worse than the originals.

What software can I use to make protomechs that can be used in MekaMek?

>>54747474
Notepad.

>>54747236

They're just different. They've certainly got the off putting vibe I didn't get from the originals which were silly looking.

>>54747570
How does that work?

>>54747824
>They're just different.
Cecerops was one of the only decent looking protos. It was a terrible mistake to ditch the hood and the snake head. Should have just made it look those bits look less organic. Minotaur without horns is just not a Minotaur either.

>>54745012
Javelin come from Caph, but the rest... yeah, pretty Lyran. You'd have plenty of them on Fedside too, of course, but no production.

For the civil war, I suppose I should redo it. Fire Javelin, Osiris 4D, Garm 01C - jesus, I loathe the little bastard - and a Valkyrie VLK-QD1 .

It does fight against my instincts to have such a slow light force, but the firepower's there, for sure.

>>54747921

The guns are it's horns. Still looks okay to me. The Cecerops is... eh, I'm divided on it but I'd take the newer one over the older one desu. I'm just not fond of the design as a whole.

>>54747981
Suns was known as the premier user of the Javelin in the Succession Wars and put in back into production on Panpour in 3055.

Same way people associate the Catapult with the Capellans or other OOP mechs with certain groups.

>>54747837
You open up an existing protomech file and edit the code by hand.

>>54737651
USA USA USA

>>54737867
>>54737814
>>54737718
>>54737703
>>54737679
>>54737651
>>54737637
FINALLY, non-retarded protomech designs. You show em, Plog, you magnificent bastard.

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>>54748110
That'll help. Thanks a bunch.

What system are ya'll using to run campaigns? Does anyone use Campaign Ops?

So im just starting with Aero

What sized maps would you start to use CAS to help. Im having some difficulties with turning

>>54748545

I use a hodgepodge from over the years. My go to standard used to be Mercenary 3055 but I've had to make adjustments over the years using the core hardcover rules and the recent Combat Manual: Mercenaries is pretty good. I am *not* a fan of the Chaos Campaign model but it's not bad, just not for my needs.

>>54748545
I'm on my third copy of FM: Mercenaries, and I guess when that one falls apart I'll switch to CampaignOps.

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>>54748545

NEA's system. Requires MekHQ for scenario generation.

XP costs (except for SPAs) are too high for the rate of games our group plays, so we cut them in half. But beyond that, it works pretty good.

>>54749205
100x100 is good for a fleet battle. Don't get cruising faster than 5-8 unless you got REALLY fast birds or really good pilots. Unlike mech combat, piloting is more important than gunnery in aero.

>>54746569
>Draconians are a parody of Japanese stereotypes.

It's a bit more complicated than that. Initially, it was a straight-faced 80's yellow peril smorgasbord, wrought almost entirely of themes of inhumanity, cruelty, pettiness, poverty and incompetence. As the years passed, though, they had to be accepted as they were written due to the authors' reticence towards any and all retcons, and as such, there is a general... divide, between the pre-clan invasion and post-clan invasion Kuritans. Not only do they begin to be shown as more aware of the awkwardness and reality-detachedness of the stereotypes they were written through, they also begin to receive a very narrow sense of humanity as well. Perhaps the most noticeable change, though, is that the average jap-named kuritan now actually has an actual Japanese name, rather than the old Hukasuko Massamutchi nipnong throwaway. Even some of the mech names and fluff are written with competent grammar, even if the occasional FENIKKUSU TAKA accident persists.

The blatant idiocy of the faction is one of the favourite recurring arguments on these threads. Shit's so bananas from the very start that there's fresh material for embarrassment even today.

Question about BT fiction in terms of medical abilities. How good is medical technology on healing serious injuries. This just came out where they can use things to heal and repair organs in days.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2017/08/07/penny-sized-nanochip-pad-regrow-organs-heal-injuries/

What's the rules concerning healing pilots, and also infantry? How do you know if an infantryman is permanently out of commission?

>>54749403
Unless you're playing Clans, your pilots are pretty fucked if they lose an organ or limb.

>>54749313
I was thinking more as part of a game of BT with mechs and the like or am i just attempting to use fast air in the wrong situation

>>54749403
Prosthetics are uncommon and expensive depending on the era. Only the Clans and the 3060s IS really have the ability to effectively work on bioware, and it's still not great. Remember, it's the future of the 1980s, not now.

>>54749575
If you're playing on ground maps then you can't use fast air at all continuously on the map. 1 thrust is 7 hexes in regular BT.

What you have to do is line them up in a flyover, fly through the map in a turn or two and ground strike or bomb the enemy, then fly off the map and do a return flyover three turns later. Keeping them on the map is suicide.

>>54749403
They like to replace stuff with machines instead of regrowing anything, unless you're a clanner.

>>54749528
>>54749615
>>54749681
I remember seeing something in one of the older books of that regrowing thing. That's really rare I guess.

>>54749651
ok ill invest in some vtols for my company then

Just experimenting

Havent seem much of the few aircraft i have tried to use getting shot down or even shot at

>>54737637
>>54737651
>>54737679
>>54737703
>>54737718
>>54737814
>>54737867
>>54737894
>>54737921
Oh sweet I love Titanfall 2!

The Star League was in the initial stages of regeneration technology. The Clans completed it but generally it takes quite awhile for it to work so the Warriors typically say fug it and get cybernetic versions instead.

Remember Battletech originally was the future of the 80s - cold war in space. It's almost diesel punk in some ways. Not quite, but close. But then it's been refreshed a few times and now resembles the New World Order modern political mess where everyone is either a moron, a conniving back-stabbing shitlord or a SJW white hat.

>>54749967
Yeah the drift of BT to modern social/political crap has been annoying.

>>54749932
Viper inna LAM when?

RIP best boy too fast to live

>>54749382
I think In universe that change of world view can be atrributed on the Clan Invasion where Draconis Combine lost more planets that they had lost in any war before and this was versus an enemy that was almost if more brutal than the DCMS. It was probably shocking eye opener to alot of people in the sense that "Is this what the other people feel when we do shit like this to them, I don't like it at all."

Unfortunatly all that character development was tossed out when Black Dragons started their shit and whole faction slided back in "Honorable Samurais, kill them with Katanas, Yaah" form.

Alot of that could be contributed to Ben Rome, who said that his favourite faction is actually Draconis Combine but I suspect the Draconis Combine was the "honorable Samurai" one and not the Teddy K modernised one.

>>54750101
Makes sense.

>>54739627
I've been in precisely one session of battletech rpg. All I remember about my character was that he was born deaf.

>>54750101
>Alot of that could be contributed to Ben Rome, who said that his favourite faction is actually Draconis Combine
Talk about repeating patterns, just like Coleman for Liao.

>>54750352
Ignore retarded namefagging, it was for one of those super power threads.

>>54750101
What happened to the Combine was kind of expected. Takashi made the Warlords fight and brutally claw over one another to remain in charge compared to the stable rulers of other provinces in other states. He did it to fix the stagnation of his army in the early 3000's, and it worked. Unfortunately, it also institutionalized in the system people overthrowing dukes and officers. Even Theodore's own supporters were telling him to take out his father in the 3030's.

All the while this is going on, groups like the Sons of the Dragon and the O5P are striving to maintain traditional values across the Combine. While both Takashi and Theodore were around, you had an uneasy peace between both sides. A fairly traditional Coordinator and a modern Kanrei.

When Takashi killed himself in 54, it upset the applecart and started the war for the soul of the Combine. The Kurita lost it so hard that Hohiro was basically a puppet and his line wiped out completely in the DA.

What's ironic is that the rest of the Inner Sphere sees the Dracs as the most united state. The Coordinator wields so much more direct power than most of the others. But if you look at their history from the death of Hohiro the First on up to Yori, it's full of more assassination attempts and coups than any other.

It could be Rome was just mandated to go in the direction he was told to.

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>>54739627
Essentially this.

>>54750101

>the Clan Invasion where Draconis Combine lost more planets that they had lost in any war before

2nd and 4th SW were more brutal than the Clan Invasion though, both in terms of human losses and territory.

If anything, IC they got even madder that everyone else was Drac'ing harder than they were.

>>54750355

Coleman powered up the Caps, who also got their shit unfucked in their HB. Rome presided over the Dracs getting Big Bear Cocked and fucked their shit up even worse in his cut-and-pasted HB.

>>54750475
Jordan Weisman is peculiar in that his games tend to have a recurring theme of "Japanese people are bad and stupid and smell of poo".

>>54750557

>human

I mean military, Dracs aren't human.

>>54750582

Their culture and mythology is super cool though. Case in point: ShadowRun.

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Best Vtols

GO!!!!!

>>54739627
It's was Jing Ling, who I've written about before. He was a cappie Goliath pilot who walked on all fours. We rampage up and down the FWL before we all died from nukes in the jihad.

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>>54751962

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>>54751962
Cargo Ferret, 17 BV, the cheapest aerial scout you'll ever need. Top tier Fed bird.
Sprint, both C3 and C3i versions, this is how you always keep your C3 network connected. A couple of these, a skulker and some hidden LRM boys can ruin the fuck out of people's day.
Tonbo, garbage in a fight but invaluable in a campaign. They are so much faster and more effective than mech haulers for salvaging
Karnov is the tried and true squishy transport, but there's a few other cheaper options with more carry weight in later eras. Thumper Karnov is also loads of fun if you housrule it being able to fire in the air like the real life gunship it's based on.
Classic Warrior is an excellent spotter/enemy VTOL hunter/tank crippler
Other than that, what you want in a VTOL is speed and range with a big gun. Things like the Yellow Jacket exemplify this.

Never take a close combat VTOL of any kind. There's lots of them and they all die horribly before they pay off their Battle Value.

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Is this any good for an introductory tech heli?

>>54752909
>Using a fusion engine in a grogtech disposable bird
>Getting into large laser range with a VTOL ever

Eh.

>>54752909

Drop the laser and go with larger missile racks. If you get inside large laser range you're gonna lose your VTOL to ppc or counter lrm fire.

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>>54753004
>>54753008
Would this work better?
I don't mind the fusion engine.

>>54752909
This is literally the only time I'd ever say this, but consider an AC/2 instead of the LL. Range games are the only thing keeping VTOLs alive, and a LL is exactly the opposite of what you want for that unless you plan to exclusively fight bugs and hunchbacks

>>54753237
> two tens and a five instead of six fives
Why.hpg

>>54753281
More favorable on the cluster hits table.
>>54753237
Just go for an LRM-15 and whatever SRM you can fit. Load with infernos.

Never use it on 'mechs, it's strictly for picking off lone vees or nailing infantry.

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>>54752909
>>54753008
VTOLs? For VTOLs, speed and range are life. You're going to want both in great supply. Bonus points for never having to Flank unless shit's really hitting the fan.

>>54753359
10s are the worst on the cluster table. Two 5s is always better.
5>15>20>10
5 is only better than 15 marginally because they are equal in terms of the cluster table, but with 5s you save a ton but have to roll to hit three times, so it can skew things a bit.

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>>54753461
All right, not as much speed, but would this chin turret and extra armor make this more able to move and fire at the same time?

>>54753839
I never personally understood heavily armoring VTOLs but chin turrets are indeed good stuff. I'd also merge those two 10s into a single 20 if it were me, unless you play on minelaying or something with it.

>>54753900
>>54753839

Seriously, just use a single 15. Use a chin turret and whatever extra mass you have for more speed or an ECM package.

>>54750459
>Takashi killed himself
In all the books I've read he died in his sleep.

He killed himself?

Is there anyone who would take BTech and unfuck it? Or at least manage it better than Loren "Jesus wants me to have a new porch" Coleman

>>54754129

No Citizen, he cut his belly open in his sleep in a tragic accident. He did not committ seppuku.

Do not question the Voice of the Dragon.

>>54754189
Easy answer? A lot of people that have nothing to do with the current game, and even some that do (Xotl).
Nightmare Mode answer? Us.

>>54750582
Well they aren't exactly grand.

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>>54754196
Th-thanks

>>54754129
Read the actual novel where he dies. He called Jaime Wolf out Wayne Waco style and then when told hard by his son and top ISF goon how starting a war with the Goons and the Fedcom when the Dracs had the clans on the their doorstep would fuck the Combine and having no way to back out honorably, he killed committed seppuku.

It's one of those things that makes no sense if you only read the Housebooks and stuff. Like the entire formation of Rasalhague makes zero sense unless you read Heir to the Dragon and know that it was the price Comstar extracted from Teddy in exchange for all the support and equipment they gave the Snakes back in the 30's.

>>54753900
>>54753951
Gotcha. Will do. Thanks, bros.

>>54754129

Still makes infinitely more sense than Li Dok To, Ricol, or Hohiro.

>>54754189

Nobody who has the money to buy the rights wants them.

Nobody who wants the rights has the money to buy them.

So not really.

On top of that you've got the issue of the BT rules really needing a major revamp if the game's going to be competitive on today's market, except that would cause 1000000% REEE from the grognards. And hell, I'm not even a grog but it would annoy me too.

They'd also need to buy back the mini rights from IWM or deal with the fact that the minis for the game are going to be eternally potato mode because they can't do anything right.

And then there's the current HG clusterfuck.

>>54754386
Who was Li?

Just thinking about Ricol's behavior makes me George Hasek II levels of angry, but Hohiro got captured by Blakists and was basically mindraped for years on end. I can understand him not being the same person after that. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it's revealed at some point that he pulled a Thomas Marik and it's a double.

>>54754430
So the answer really is to just re-make the game with a new name, updated mechanics, no borrowed designs (but with art that's got some callbacks) and lore that's just a cleaned-up version of what we have with new names and some new events to differentiate it. I actually had a really good conversation about how to handle it (in a meta sense, not in a fluff sense), but that shit ain't getting out unless I for some reason decide to do it myself.

>>54754430
Alpha Strike is the modern revamp of rules, the same lots of minis couple special abilities and simple hitpoint system that's a clone of every major tabletop minis game these days. People play Battletech because it's old school crunch and detail sim. That's what's made it last. Take a look at MWDA in terms of how well a reboot can go. Massively successful, literally millions of minis made, simplified combat and a collector model. It lasted 8 years and died. Battletech lives on. The truth is, you can shake up Battletech all you want, but you kill the core rules and you kill the long term game. That's not to say you can't adjust the core rules. They've been in continuous adjustment since the 80's. But trying to "modernize" it for the newest fad is just a death sentence. Their Alpha Strike policy has been pretty much the only smart way to go about it so far. The real mistake is wasting time on Alpha Strike specific books like the combat manual series instead of just adding those stats into regular plotbooks and TRO's next to the regular stuff, like they used to do with Battleforce and Battletroops stats.

IWM actually has been doing a pretty good job with minis as well the last few years. What the issue is, is that they need a big chunk of funding and talent to go back and redo all the 3025 stuff. That's what everyone complains about. They should have done it when they remolded everything back in 2002, but here we are.

>>54754435

Might not be Li Dok To. I'm away from my books ATM, but there's another Warlord who was in Theodore's camp since the beginning and is an enthusiastic champion of his reforms until "lol, I was a sekrit black dragon all along" happens during the Jihad.

I've said it before but I think the main problem is that they have so few named Drac characters but needed high-profile BDS recruits so even if it's completely fucking retarded for someone to be BDS based on past portrayal they get the job regardless.

For Hohiro I more mean that he falls into the usual Drac antagonist stereotype- we get told he's super badass and a good leader, but get shown someone who is functionally retarded and expected to believe the hype.

>>54754599
>we get told he's super badass and a good leader, but get shown someone who is functionally retarded and expected to believe the hype.

All I remember is him broing it up with Victor a bit, and then when his dad had a stroke, he was captured and midraped instead of being able to take command. And then by the time he was rescued, his warlords were running the show and basically kept doing so until the end of the war. He never recovered from that mentally or politically and spent the rest of his years as a figurehead.

It sucked but I don't remember any stuff about badassness.

>>54754586

AS still has some serious issues. I would lay most of them at the feet of Alex Knight because he clearly has no fucking idea what he's doing yet is, based on the OF, the driving force behind it.

Someone else might be able to fix things, but unless Xotl takes over it's not clear that anyone else who currently works for CGL even understands the ground game rules properly, which is a *bit* of an issue.

As for IWM, while they have improved in recent times they still aren't anywhere near modern production values and have been shit on from a great height by a literal who from Russia running a casting business from his гapaж for shits and giggles.

The reason Duke Ricol was included as a BDS Gem, was he was a big "name" that was scheduled to be eliminated along with the rest of the GDL characters.

>>54754637

He's supposed to be a rival for Victor the way his dad was a rival for Hanse.

Instead it's always "Help, help, I've fallen down and can't get up! Save me, Victor!" and him only getting jobs because Victor is too busy to take them.

Getting captured by the WoB and mentally broken was just a continuation of the theme.

>>54754735
>He's supposed to be a rival for Victor the way his dad was a rival for Hanse.

I never got that impression. Especially when you're reading about him as a little sheltered kid being hidden away and raised by nannies until he's almost a teenager because Teddy won't admit to his dad that he married his cousin's spy/bodyguard.

>>54754710

IMO Ricol being a Black Dragon makes no sense.

His whole character arc was about the Combine needing to change and modernise to stay strong, and he was an ally of Theodore and pushed his reform program. He even pissed off Takashi because of how progressive he was.

Then all of a sudden, lolno, I was a hard-core traditionalist who supported Takashi and hated Theodore all along.

They could easily have ganked him in other ways, like having a WoB special ops group make a point of killing him in the most gruesome way possible as revenge for distributing the Helm core back in the day.

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The missus got me a few minis. What are they?

>>54754777

Have a look at the 20-Year Update and BoK trilogy, they're clearly set up as mirrors, Theo and Hanse style. Even down to being sent to line units in similar regions to prepare for a new generation of combat, and being given the same 'Mech by the Dragoons.

>>54754793
That's a Lurch and a Marshall. Capellan and Taurian mechs respectively.

>>54754799
That's what their parents both intended, but I'm saying I never got that impression of Hohiro as a person.

>>54754793

Yu Huang on the left, Marshal on the right.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Yu_Huang
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Marshal

Yu Huang and an Anvil?

>>54754822

Hohiro barely gets characterised as anything other than a Vic fanboy until the Jihad, which is the other part of the problem.

Bit hard to take someone seriously when they spend all their time going "Victor-sempai, pls notice me! ~uguuu~"

>>54754863
Even in the BoK, he was getting brushed aside with "Introduce me to your sister."

>>54754783

Certainly won't argue with you on that view.

>>54754805
>>54754839
Thanks much.

>>54754701
nckestrel is the main guy behind AS. Alex just does unit conversion stuff, I think.

>>54754966

Wasn't nckestrel one of the guys who said he didn't play anything past 3025 tech unless absolutely forced and that he hated and tried to avoid it though?

I mean, even nckestrel is the one in charge the impression I've always gotten from him is that he's a grog who doesn't really understand how the game works. Alex is unbelievably shit but at least (claims) to play beyond introtech.

IMO the two biggest problems CGL has are that they keep promoting suck-up forum posters and that nobody actually plays the game any more. Much less *wants* to play the game.

>>54754839
Are these good mechs?

>>54755082
Marshall is good if you like generic Mediums. Yu Huang is just a revamped, fattened Cyclops in terms of weapons.

>>54755082

Not really, no.

They could be but do some derpy things. In the case of the Marshal at least this is intentional.

>>54755108
Forgive how much of a goddamned noob I am, but her surprising me with a few minis makes me want to make a mixed mercenary force. How easy would these be for a mercenary unit to get their hands on?

>>54755184
Pretty much the only way you'd get both in the same unit is if you fought on the Capellan front in the late 3060's.

>>54755217
Well, I don't like Capellans much. So this sounds like a prime scavenge opportunity.

>>54755183
How so?

>>54755244
It's made in the Periphery, so it's assumed the tech available isn't the best, and the designers aren't either. It's meant to watch after new colonies, not really fight off other 'mechs outside of pirates.

A plucky young man fresh out of pilot school and his childhood friend fresh out of mechanic school stumble upon a SLDF cache on the far edge of the outback in the year 3030. What's in it and how much of a shonen giant robot protagonist does he become when pirates show up on his dinky little dirt farming planet?

>>54755184

Yu Huang is almost impossible to get outside of the Chancellor's favourite units. They were very much a Xin Sheng machine.

The Marshall is very difficult to get outside of the CM/TDF/MAF.

>>54755342
But I imagine a purchased or brought-over Marshal wouldn't be impossible, nor would a scavenged Hauang?

I hope it isn't as cringe as trying to fit clan mechs in. These are my first two minis so I want to fit them in.

>>54755331
It's got an old SLDF Warhammer in it, actually made on Taurus in the 2700's before their workforce and quality control went to shit.

>>54755400
Marshal becomes periphery general by the Dark Age, but you're not getting a Lurch without either being a Capellan or killing Capellans.

Operation Sovereign Justice and Operation Thunderstrike are the best opportunity to grab both as Sunny had both Taurian and Capellan units in the front fighting the Davions and the Davion's mercenaries.

>>54755082

The Marshal -6MC is a <really> good trooper, though. It can fill in practically any lance except recon and indirect fire. One of the few decent 4/6 Medium Mechs after 3039.

>>54755426
That's a very helpful answer, thank you. ives me the opportunity the fluff the mercs as having won them as gifts for fighting well for the Capellans or as taking one of each as salvage fighting for Davion.

>>54755184
Sorry, I missed that you were new when I posted that. If I had realized I would have gone into greater detail about the 'Mechs in question. Thankfully everyone else covered for me.

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>>54755331

>>54755472
Not a problem. This is a pretty helpful and forgiving general compared to others.

>>54741958
no, see, this is what you don't get.

I don't want some UberMachine in its place. I want NOTHING in its place. I want classic davion designs to repopulate their RATs and their armies, not some mechanized fursuit.

You say it'd be welcomed with open arms in other factions? LET THEM HAVE IT. The FedSuns doesn't need it, they don't have a place for it, and the only good thing about it is how goddamn asscramped you get over my not wanting it.

>>54755500

The only thing that apparently makes it a poor fit for the Suns is the Stealth Armour.

Which is fukken nice to have any way. Otherwise it's your bog-standard mixtech fast heavy cav design.

Besides, a mixed-tech, BV-optimised, RAC-wielding machine with technology usually limited to other factions is about as Davion as you can *get.*

>>54755645
the stealth armor, the esoteric heat hog engine, which is a terrible accompaniment to the engine, and then two toasty ERLLs just incase your pilot had any moisture left in his body. About the only thing "Davion" about this mech is the rifleman-esque unbearable heat burden, and the RAC. The shape of the dumbass thing takes after the clan tendency to make their mechs double as cosplay, and the stealth armor is far more of a capellan hallmark.

Imagine if instead we got the Enforcer III ENF-7D in the Vulpes' place, instead of consigning one of the most iconic Davion chassis to some experimental TRO for this ugly shitstain.

>>54755752
>Enforcer III ENF-7D in the Vulpes' place, instead of consigning one of the most iconic Davion chassis to some experimental TRO for this ugly shitstain.

Not him but the 7D is the standard DA Davion Enforcer. It's the same model as the clicktech Enforcer III. It's got the little flippy hand and everything.

>>54755802
Yes, and? At least it's an Enforcer. I'd take a new Jagermech over the Vulpes too.

I'd like a FS that looks like the FS of yore again. as nice as the new black knights and atlases are, neither has ever really been a signature design of the Federated Suns.

>>54755331
>What's in it
The last of the Mackie -8Hs
>how much of a shonen giant robot protagonist does he become when pirates show up on his dinky little dirt farming planet?
Their entire lance is gone in under two minutes

>>54755869
I don't disagree with you but you just have to look at all the DA designs they were forced to include to know why the Davions look the way they do now.

The only original stuff was the Scarecrow, Vulpes and Antlion I think. Which is a real good reason to pick a bone with the Vulpes, honestly.

>>54755752

If I had a dollar every time some Feddie player told me that the PNT-10K was an excellent design and that I shouldn't complain about it because heat management is something all non-noobs should be able to do I'd be a rich man.

Yet the Vulpes is supposed to be some impossible to control heat nightmare, because of course Feddie machines need to be perfectly bracketed alpha babies that require no thought or preparation to use.

As for the looks, whatever. Taste in visuals vary, think the Hauptmann looks worse yet that gets jizzed all over because muh SL cigar.

TL;DR: stop being a hypocrite and learn to use your new machine.

>>54755920
Vulpes could have just as easily been a Sea Fox mech. Or, they had no qualms giving away the plants on Robinson to the Dracs, why not give the Vulpes plant to the Confederation? Be fine as a ROTS design too.

The Scarecrow at least fills a niche that needs filling. The Antlion is an interesting design. It looks like a retarded reject from the voltron team, but at least it's armament is interesting.

>>54754874
Damn Hohiro got cucked hard

>>54755482
Jokes on you, our mercenary unit was founded by a billionaire noble who bought up everything found in a Star League cache found by a local dirt farmer.

>>54755981
It's funny that you name the panther, because that is my favorite combine mech in 3025. It gets shafted between the succession wars and the dark ages though. I don't know what asshole is claiming that the 10K and its SHS is acceptable at all, but it's not me.

I also happen to love the hauptmann, though that's less about the cigar and more about the dire wolf DNA in it.

It's funny when you say feddie machines need to be perfectly bracketed, when they're saddled with an inordinate prevalence of poorly sunk riflemen.

TL;DR - YOU'RE NOT MY SUPERVISOR

>>54755981
Nobody that actually plays the game would say the 10K isn't a heat nightmare that you can only fire in 1-1-0 and hope you don't cook off your ammo. Just sitting still, you overheat by two when you fire your main gun. Compare that to the 9R where you can jump and shoot and barely build up heat unless you're in close quarters.

>>54756090
>>54756106

Over the years, and on the OF, I was often unironically told that the PNT-10K was just fine because all it was intended to do was deliver PPC fire on the cheap and that it was so good in its role that the Suns players wished they had it. Ditto for the Grand Dragon, Hatamoto-Chi and Ninja-to.

When asked if they'd be willing to trade the Osiris, Penetrator, Falconer, or exclusivity of the Gunslinger or whatever for such designs the silence was deafening.

So yeah. To me the whole thing is deeply ironic and hypocritical because they got a design where you have to maybe drop one ER LL depending on what else is happening every other turn and this means the sky is falling for heat management, as opposed to a number of shitpiles foisted off on other factions where GIT GUD has been the stock response for so long.

>riflemen

I can't even remember the last time I saw a Feddie actually field one of those and by the DA the ones with heat issues are either extinct or well on their way towards being so. Shit, they probably have more IICs than those by then.

>>54756214
Grand Dragon and Hatamoto-Chi are legit good mechs. Way better than the MRM-boat garbage. I know why you picked them comparatively though for the similar heat curve and how they drive compared to the Vulpes. Hatamoto-Chi has to pull a 2-2-1 most times and that's if you're willing to push the ammo rolls.

Hating on MRM's when there is apollo doesn't make sense. Equipping MRM's without apollo doesn't make sense either.

>>54756791
Is Apollo tournament legal now? That has some bearing on all this, you know. I don't give a fuck because I'm a grog and I'm not supposed to care about stupid dumb stinky future tech even though I use it all the time for fun even though 3025 is my favorite era.

>>54756791
Apollo is 3070's tech. There's a shit ton of late 3050's and 3060's designs without it.

>>54756854
Still listed as Advanced, so it's only tournament legal if they've pre-allowed those rules/equipment.

>>54756383

>Grand Dragon and Hatamoto-Chi are legit good mechs

Grand Dragon is extremely arguable. I personally hate them since they turn one of the MLs that did face forward to the rear because reasons and would prefer to have a smaller SFE and more armour to the XLFE and oversupply of DHS.

Hatamoto is just straight shit and gets outclassed by virtually every 3050 upgrade. SHS on it are absolute bullshit and this doesn't even get fixed until the 3060s.

For 3025 they're good if not great. For 3050+ they're retarded mook machines that look sort of impressive on paper but really only exist for the player character factions to have something to kill.

I'd still take the Vulpes in a heartbeat over either. Or hell, over both.

>>54756791

>Hating on MRM's when there is apollo doesn't make sense.

MRMs are completely terrible from start to finish. Not only do they fail to work with the fluff about being for green pilots since you need Veterans to break even with them, they have bad range brackets and virtually require you to have C3 in addition to the Veteran or better pilots, which again fucks with the idea of being a cheap and simple upgrade for newbie hordes.

Apollo still doesn't make them usable, especially with how easy it is to counter.

>>54757092
God including C3 in the "honorabru singre combat" faction was so dumb. Why wasn't it FWL tech again? I would have said the Cappies could have had it too, but they got Stealth and that'd make no sense retroactively. But before that, it'd have made more sense there too than with the DC. DC should have gotten something else. What? I don't fucking know. DHS?

>Give mechs hands
>Don't let them carry around large weapons or rifles

Why?

>>54757250
Some do Anon.

>>54756214
Do the Feddies build the Penetrator and Falconer or import them from the Lyrans?

>>54757174
>DC should have gotten something else. What?
Like the 12 regiments that disappeared.

>>54746367
Draconis Combine = Zeon (Mobile Suit Gundam)
Honorable Samurai warriors who die in job lots to angst-ridden, girly midgets. Feddies will out gun you for sure, but you'll have the edge in mobility in most cases. Snakes get some great lights like the Jenner & Panther but the rest of your selections will be rough. The Kurita Shadowhawk is a sweet PPC-armed Griffin-lite so use that. I've never liked the iconic Dragon for anything but kicking enemies and insult AC-2's. Vanilla Chargers with melee pilots are rarely brilliant, but the slow variant models are all okay save the Liao 20-toter which I despise for personal reasons. Try to leverage your BV cheap clunkers to outnumber and or out-pilot rank your Suns opponent.

>>54757174
C3 really is one of those things that feels like it should have been FWL (or FS).

Same with some of the mech distribution in that era. Some seem like they'd have fit different factions.

>>54757250
Handhelds are a thing.

>>54757294
Everyone has something to be salty about. You'd think it'd cause peace, but instead, people have to convince each other their particular salt lick is the biggest and the saltiest.

>>54757341
I guess. I'm not a Drac player, that's just what I'd be salty about if I was.

>>54757341
>Everyone has something to be salty about.

I don't. But I play MOC, so the entirety of my game experiences is all the cred of being a non-mainstream faction plus nothing but the best Capellan upgrades with no downsides.

Pick a faction. Got one? Good.

You get to design their entire mech lineup for the new TRO. Post your Results[Minimum of 5])

>>54757384
That's why I play them.

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>>54757398
done.

>>54757341
What I find ironic is most factions have a similar level of hodgepodge. It's just varies how it gets spread around and what people identify with. If people played Drac the way some people play Feddie, you'd have lances of Bulldog R omnis, captured clan machines, and Lexatech Gauss monsters. Instead you got people strapping themselves to Benjamin and LAW like it's the law.

>>54757384
Your shriveled old brother fucker married the Duke of Andurien. You're now technically ruled by Anduriens.

>>54757398
I've actually had a mind to ask /btg/ for contributions like that in the form of Jihad-era and Republic-era upgrades/variants to existing FWL mechs for an AU campaign I've been in.

>>54757449
No SHS grognard bullshit. Its 3150, people, everybody has everybody else's shit. If you want proprietary tech you have to invent it.

>>54757449
Those are mechs for the Draconis Combine.

>>54757449
quirks are as follows

Black Dragon
No Ejection
Easy To Pilot

Iajutsu
Hard to Pilot

Rockabilly
Easy to Pilot
Rocker Seat

Cross
Long Range Targeting

Roach
Bad Reputation
Hard to Maintain

Who wants me to do their 3150 lineup?

>>54757398
Republic of the Sphere, because despite being hit with the idiot stick from go I like the concept.

Drone fire support light: in vein of the Revenant and Celerity but fulfilling a cheap fire support role like the Hollander or Gun A, maybe a version with mechmortars for sillyness.

Totally not a Blakist design: 60-65 heavy, C3i

Praise Blake: a celestial inspired heavy omnimech with C3i, at least one variant with heavy gun and retractable blade.

Fire support assault: bulky, mixtech

Some sort of pants on head superweapon mech

>>54757398
I'm interested in doing this but can't till later.

>>54758099
No dude, you have to post TRO's.

I promise I won't call your mechs shitmechs. (But, you know, there are a lot of assholes on here, and some of them might)

Just filter out the assholes.

>>54758166
Well then lets make a new thread later.

>>54758306
here is some copy/pasta

Cappellan Design Committee Hearing 101
(Or Why Shit Never Gets Done)

This meeting shall now come to order. In the following proceedings we will review battlemech TRO's and establish committee proceedings as to which mechs to put into production.

>>54758099
There might not be a republic of the Sphere for very much longer. The houses will not be proud of themselves by the time they reach Terra. They will have done things, unspeakable things, in their pursuit of power. They will have, in some way or another, betrayed those serving under them, by leading them to the slaughter, slipping their knives between a friends shoulder blades, or some other unspeakable attrocity to maintain, consolidate, and attain power.

They will look at the clans, who with their honor, and their bravery, maintained their code in the face of the corruption of the inner sphere, and they will look upon them with envy, because they have a clean conscious. They obeyed the laws of their tribe and stayed loyal to one another, while the Great Houses fell upon themselves and their own people.

Jason, you are a terrible emperors midget. You are supposed to be telling me how awful I am and how much my ideas suck.

>>54758405
If this is seriously how it goes down, I'm gonna vomit. That's pathetic reasoning, the Clans are no better than the Houses.

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>>54757276

Build both.

>>54757174

Agreed so hard. The design philosophies just get so fucked up. C3 makes way more sense for the "team player" factions than the Dracs,

What the Dracs should have been focusing on is shit that's good in 1v1 combat.

>>54757461

>What I find ironic is most factions have a similar level of hodgepodge.

In theory yes. In practice we literally have the fluff and RATs handing out Gausswall designs by the fuckton to certain factions while saying that up to and including the middle stages of the Jihad the most common Drac light is the PNT-10K, the DRG-5K is the most common Heavy, and the HTM-27T is the most common assault.

Plus if you o go off script and select only from the best it tends to get side eyes at the least and open complaints quite often because the lore is so clear on the Dracs being weighed down with so much shit.

>lexatech gauss monsters

Ah, yes. The fabled Cerberus, with its 11 tons of armour (that's right, the 3025 Crusader has better protection...), inexplicable oversinking since the weapons array and movement get you to all of 21 heat, and the CT ammo bomb. Truly a weapon to surpass the Metal Gear.

>>54758405
And the clans, awash in the betrayals and theivery of the IS, will stand above it all. Some may fall, their ways may change, but they will retain their warrior spirit in the times to come.

>>54758449
NOICE!!
Fukken Saved

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>>54758526

There's still some level of retardation in them, but at least we're not at Dragon II/Weeaboo Mythology Name #1,788-tier mongoloidism.

>>54758449
Okay, here is what you do with that panther.

You drop the SRM 6, replace the ERML with an ERLL, and add an extra heat sink.

>>54758449
The Jenner looks good. The only thing I might consider is downgrading to Guardian ECM and seeing if you can add TAG or light TAG.

>>54758449
With the wolverine, take out a ton of srm ammo, replace the small pulse laser with a medium pulse laser.

>>54758706
That fifth one is a snowflake. XXL engines are only for super heavies. Sorry buddy.

Also, I think I'd take out the reinforced armor on all five unless its essential to your design. Just sort of a nerf cause people will call you a snowflake if you try to use too much of it.

If there were some plot reason for it, like a surplus of the stuff for some reason, you could use it.

>>54758449
Grand Dragon looks good. No changes needed, unless you can cram an XL Gyro in there somewhere.

>>54758975
You can have it on one or two, just not all of them, you know what i mean?

So is mixtech going to be the new "thing"? Suddenly everybody is mixing RAC 5's with CLPL?

>>54759031

B-R armour is the only trick the Dracs have that is even semi-unique in the DA though.

Mostly it's just there as a modernisation of old designs and a fuck you to the gausswallening of the AFFC and LCAF on the borders.

>>54759094

A lot of the DA designs have this, yes.

Most of the time it's used in retarded ways, with the Tenshi having a Clan GR and five (!) L-PPCs instead of doing something reasonable and carrying a Clan GR beside three Clan ER LLs though.

>>54759096
I might buy that.

I confess that only two of the mechs I posted were originally for the Combine.

>>54759121
I was under the impression that mixtech was rare and IS and Clan technology didn't mix well. Was there a cultural exchange between clan and IS engineers?

>>54759155

Mixtech gets a lot more common during the Dark Age. Everyone but the lesser Periphery powers has at least some. The Dracs, Suns, and Republic have the most.

>>54759155
>Was there a cultural exchange between clan and IS engineers?
It's more reverse engineering/salvaging/purchasing from the sharks. The clans have started using more mixtech designs for second line and garrison stuff as well (at least in the DA fluff).

>>54759155
The IS has been poking at Clantech for about a century at this point, and are getting better at it. And more directly, Sea Foxes are selling shit open market, Dracs killed the Nova Cats and have at least a couple vehicle factories that the Cats didn't totally wreck, Arc Royal was making Clan stuff not just for the WiE anymore, RoTS was a hodgepodge of IS and Clan stuff from their founding, and the Suns could actually make Clan spec weapons in the 3070s, just very expensively, so they're probably better at it now and the Snow Ravens are in bed with the Outworlds Alliance.

>>54759405

For the Suns, native manufacture. For the RotS, Clan assistance in building stuff right from the beginning. For the Dracs, captured Nova Cat factories, though what they have is not yet clear.

>>54759415
Oh, and I forgot to mention the Clan protectorate in the FWL where the Sea Foxes and Spirit Cats have set up shop.

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check out this hunchback IIC refit. I think it makes a good, somewhat cheesy lineman.

Why isn't Apollo guidance listed in megamek? I can't find it.

>>54759641
Apollo FCS.

>>54759641
nevermind, it was sorting according to period

>>54759641
Look for MRM Apollo FCS, which is also how it's listed in TacOps.

Here is how you fix the Akuma 1xJ

1) Remove a ton of cluster ammo
2) Add Apollo
3) Replace 2 MPL's with 1 ERLL
4) Remove 1/2 ton of armor
5) Remove Small Laser
6) Add Heat Sink

Done. Trash tier to brawler with a long range bracket in 6 easy steps.

>>54759881
And if you really want to get fancy, remove the jump jets and add a C3 Master.

>>54755500
>You say it'd be welcomed with open arms in other factions? LET THEM HAVE IT.
This is Clan Sea Fox bidding for the production line and distribution rights. Let us properly clannify that 'mech and use it as our totem.

>>54759894
don't think that would fit.

>>54759453
Its has a 3 step heat cycle.

Step 1: Fire LPLs
Step 2: Fire LPLs
Step 3: Fire 1 LPL and 3 MPL

>>54759881
>1) Remove a ton of cluster ammo
>2) Add Apollo
>3) Replace 2 MPL's with 1 ERLL
>4) Remove 1/2 ton of armor
>5) Remove Small Laser
>6) Add Heat Sink

Step 0: Remove ton of MRM ammo
Step 7: Add another Heat Sink.

Round 1: Fire lasers, close
Round 2: Fire lasers, close
Round 3: Let em have it

>>54760041
>>54759881

Better Idea
1) Remove a ton of cluster ammo
2) Remove a ton of MRM ammo
3) Add Apollo
4) Remove MPLs
5) Replace ERLL with HPPC
6) Add Heat Sink

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>>54760195
>AkumaTrollFace.jpg
I think I like this plan the best.

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>>54758405
>They will look at the clans, who with their honor, and their bravery, maintained their code in the face of the corruption of the inner sphere
>maintained their code in the face of the corruption of the inner sphere
>maintained their code
Two words, anon: "Malvina Hazen". Your argument is invalid.

>>54758405
Christ, I bet this is exactly how the devs thought it'd be.

Utter fucking repugnant. I bet the plot would even include Honorary Clan Yellow Bird, and accepting Hanse Davion as the spiritual liege of the clans.

new thread

>>54760730

>>54755043
>Wasn't nckestrel one of the guys who said he didn't play anything past 3025 tech unless absolutely forced and that he hated and tried to avoid it though?

Not that I ever recall. Could have happened, but I've never seen it.

>>54758449
How do we fix the Cerberus?