Is the Triforce of courage the most useless divine artifact ever?

>>54515665
Zelda is shit.

>>54515665
Name one good thing Triforce of Power ever did.

>>54515665
>the thing that makes you destined to be a great hero with the determination, ingenuity and tenacity to defeat the literal avatar of darkness and save the world.

I dunno, seems pretty alright to me.

>>54515665

>The Ability to master every weird type of Weapon after just touching it once
>never knows fear
>Can open magic portals and shit

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>1/3rd of a wish granting artifact
>useless

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>>54515665
It created some bitchin' music.

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>>54515725
Why does Zelda got 5 stars? They send in the feds at that point.

>>54515665
The theory that it's power is to respawn the hero means it's the most powerful.

>>54515665
>Protects you from curses and evil magic
>Amplifies your willpower and determination and you even get to keep that after you lose it
>Makes you so courageous that monsters that literally frighten people to death just make you stop for a second

>>54516083
Link's demonstrably not bound to it, though and the respawning ingame isn't canon. Dying is though :^)

>>54515689
Ressurected ganondorf into ganon

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>>54515665
As Wind Waker Link demonstrated, the Triforce of Courage doesn't mean shit.
Destiny doesn't mean shit. Fuck destiny.

>>54515717
>>54516949
Most of the games have you finding it halfway or three-quarters of the way into the game. You do all that other stuff without it.

It seems like the only point of Courage is as a test against evil. An evil being grabs the whole Triforce and Courage and Wisdom say oh fuck that and take off looking for better hosts to safeguard the power. Ganon is still pretty damn powerful, but he's not on level with a god when he's only got one of them.

>>54515689
Or Wisdom.
Split, each piece is quite weak. Picking OoT, Link is brave even as a child, facing Gohma, Dodongo, letting himself into Jabu Jabu.
Zelda is wise and saw through Ganondorf false alliance.
Ganondorf got the strenght to lead his people into a war for better pastures.

But together it is so powerful it send a floating island to ground and restored the anti Triforce and flooded Hyrule for ever

>>54517057
I don't think typically meet Redead or evil curses in any of the games before you have the Triforce of Courage, at least in Ocarina of Time, Twilight Princess and the 1, 2 and LttP you don't.
Well, in Ocarina maybe the curse of the forest, but that might be the Deku Tree protecting you at first.

We know it canonically keeps you from losing your soul in TP and it also supposedly keeps you from getting dusted by Ganondorf's magic.

>>54515665
Was Ganon really that much in the wrong?
I mean, yeah, he was a conqueror and had a bunch of monstrous minions and shit, but most of the games don't ever mention him commiting atrocities.

>>54517351
>Was Ganon really that much in the wrong?
>I mean, yeah, he was a conqueror and had a bunch of monstrous minions and shit, but most of the games don't ever mention him commiting atrocities.
Using magic to brainwash soldiers into fighting and dying on his command seems pretty evil.

Kidnapping children to further his own personal power seems pretty evil.

>>54517606
>Kidnapping children to further his own personal power seems pretty evil.
That's royalty children, though. Or are you talking about Wind Waker, where he couldn't risk releasing the children from the Fortress?

>>54515689
Gave Ganon immortality, if you're into that.
Not personally my thing, but some people dig that.

>>54517656
Fernando is a pretty cool villain, though, way better than Demise.

>>54517682
>Fernando
I have no fucking idea how Ganondorf got auto-corrected into Fernando.

>>54515665
I makes Link immortal.
I know what you're thinking: "Link dies *all the time*, either to monster attacks or traps or drowning or catching on fire or-"
Yeah, but here's the thing: every time out die in LoZ, what happens? Say you jump off a cliff and die. What happens next? You respawn, probably prone, down a heart at the edge of the cliff you just jumped off of. And what happens when you lose all your hearts? You just reload your last save, however recently that was.
Look at the Triforce of Courage, and the feats accomplished by it's wielder. And realize that, from the in-game perspective, the holder of the Triforce of Courage did all that *in one pass*.

Courage manipulates time in a way the ocarina wishes it could.

>>54517351
Ganondorf was originally a "desert thief" and the king of thieves from the desert, the only male Gerudo. If Hylian sources are to be believed, he was essentially the leader of a very large, very influential group of bandits that Hyrule warred with. He "allied" with the king for a closer shot at the Triforce, and Ganondorf says it was to improve life for his people. Regardless, the evil methods he'd used to get there (kidnapping, extortion, killing the Deku Tree, killing Jabu Jabu) corrupted his heart and the Triforce of power warped it further.
But yes, he murdered the guardian spirit of both the Kokiri and the Zora, while simultaneously attempting to starve every Goron. That's just in a single game, too.

>>54517351
Ganondorf the man?
Debatably so. His intentions might have been benevolent, he saw the desert as a terrible prison to his people. We know that they have been assigned the role of guardians over the Spirit Temple by some godess, however, and we have no real evidence that the godesses are in any way cruel or evil. We also don't really know if the Gerudo were unhappy with their lot or not, but considering how they seem to stick to the desert even when they could leave, it doesn't seem that way. It seems more like the seed of discontent was planted in him by the witches and fed by the evil within him.
Also, if the state of Hyrule Town doesn't speak of atrocities, I don't know what will in a Nintendo game.
I'd say he was misled and spiralled into pure evil because he was cursed with an evil fucking demon twisting his being.

Ganon the Creature? Yeah, he's pretty wrong and a pure asshole. Any incarnatio of Ganon we know is pure cruelty and evil, it's what happens when the man gives up and the beast emerges (or he goes where he shouldn't and is cursed to reveal his true nature)

>>54517351
Before obtaining the Triforce of Power, he:
1) Killed the Great Deku Tree
2) Released monsters in Dodongo Cave, cutting Gorons off from their food supply
3) Infected Lord Jabu Jabu with monsters and endanged Princess Ruto

After obtaining the Triforce of Power, he (in no particular order):
1) Killed the King of Hyrule (who was in no way shape or form said or implied to be a bad king)
2) Reduced Hyrule Castle Town to a Re-Dead filled wasteland
3) Sent his personal shadow to kidnap Saria
4) Unleashed monsters on Deku Forest and Kokiri Village
5) Sealed Dodongo Cave, cutting Gorons off from thier food supply
6) Unleashed monsters on Zora's Realm and FROZE it
7) Removed the rightful owner of Lon-Lon Ranch and put an asshole in charge for really no discernible reason

>>54517721
Link's resurrections in-game are not canon, and one of the timeline's relies on Link's canon death, the Downfall Timeline that leads to A Link to the Past and the NES Zelda games.

>>54517780
>7) Removed the rightful owner of Lon-Lon Ranch and put an asshole in charge for really no discernible reason
The nerve of the man! Does he also jaywalk? Where are the morals of the youth nowadays?

>>54517721
Yeah, but every video game protagonist has that particular superpower, so Link would have it as long as he was the hero of the story even if he wasn't the Hero Chosen By the Goddesses or whatever.

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>>54515665
>Never have to will-save
>Immune to fear effects
>Still have sense of danger when needed
>Not immediately falling to despair at a juggernaught of a reincarnated Demon Lord-Pigman whom can shatter boulders with his fists coming at you, taking him head on on with a clear mind
>Bad thing
u wot m8?

I think being able to take on Majora's brand of eldritch bullshit is evidence enough of what that part of the Triforce does for it's wielder, don't you?

>>54517780
This is only a single game, too. It's not even to mention the fact in the latest game he's become a techno-Lich who's lived so long he's lost his mind to hate and before he "dies" tries to take Hyrule with him.

>>54517780
>7) Removed the rightful owner of Lon-Lon Ranch and put an asshole in charge for really no discernible reason

This always cracks me up. I wonder, is he just a micromanaging asshole? Like, what is he doing all those years anyway? Hyrule Castle Town is destroyed, he's just casually shitting on Zora and Gorons and not governing them, Kakariko is hidden and the two witches are ruling over the Gerudo for him. So I guess he really might be micromanaging the fuck out of what is left of Hyrule.

>>54517712
>PhotoshoppedGanondorfAsStereotypicalLatino.jpg

>>54515665
We once had to listen to an ent tell stories for several days, very slowly. As a reward he gave one of us a wooden ring with an ac bonus. I felt so bored and frustrated that I drove my (pc) henchman to suicide, again.

>>54517762
I'm not sure if Barinade would kill Jabu Jabu as much as make him do weird things.

>>54517886
>newtumblrheadcannon.jpg

>>54517768
Are ReDeads zombies or clay golems? SSBM trophy says they're just made of clay, but that's not canon.
Yeah, living in a desert definitely skews one's sense of mercy or willingness to preserve others.

>>54517780
>7) Removed the rightful owner of Lon-Lon Ranch and put an asshole in charge for really no discernible reason
Talon was a lazy fuck, anyways. Sure Ingo was an asshole, but at least he fucking works.

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>>54517682
>>54517886
Customary thousand hours

>>54516998
Elaborate

Haven't played

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>>54515665
My headcanon is that the Triforce of Courage is what's needed to be able to unlock the full power of the Master Sword, since you needed to collect the Triforce Shards in Windwaker to be able to open the shrine and re-awaken the Triforce.
Basically, the Triforce of Courage is the password needed to activate the "banish evil.Fixe" program within the sword and be able to stop Ganondorf

>>54519354
WW Link is some random kid and not actually a descendant or chosen hero or anything.

>>54519354
In most Zelda games, "Link" is a reincarnation of the same Link over and over again. Completely new memories and personality (mostly) and so on, but nevertheless destined to fight Ganondorf and probably defeat him.

In Wind Waker, you're not that. You're just a kid who happens to be named Link who's sister was kidnapped. You are explicitly said to NOT have ANY relation to the recurring Link, no destiny, nothing like that. You're just some kid.

And Ganondorf make the mistake of kidnapping your sister. As it turns out, the last mistake that he ever made, given that the Wind Waker timeline is the one timeline where Ganondorf is well and truly DEAD.

Not certain what's keeping him dead - could be the miles of ocean water on his corpse, could be that he died without the Triforce of Power inside of him, could be because of the King of Hyrule's wish, could be because Ganondorf turned to stone...

...but personally, I like to think it's because Link shoved a sword through Ganondorf's forehead and left it there.

Don't fuck with Wind Waker Link's sister.

"The wind...it is...blowing..."

>>54519477
Except that the game the master sword was introduced was when the Tri-Force was united in the Dark realm.

>>54519354
WW Link was just some schmuck kid from some podunk island, until his his sister gets kidnapped by a bird andhe gilt-trips a pirate into helping him rescue her.

He tries to solid snake his way into a prison, then gets rocked hard and saved by a talking boat. The boat looks at him and he's all "Well shit, you aint the Hero of Time, you're just some punk, but I guess you'll do. Now listen o me and go on this adventure to collect these artifacts, and maybe you just might have a chance to save your sister."

You then get dragged along on an adventure, picking up Link's old hand-me-downs, and running into people who mistake you forLink before realizing you aren't him (like the Deku Tree and some giant fish dude), and wishing you good luck in trying to not get killed.

Eventually, you find the Mastersword, but because you're not Link its shit and won't work for you, and Ganondorf just pimp-slaps you around for a bit before you get saved by a dragon. Then you have to travel the sea, and try to rebuild the TFoC fr yourself.

>>54519560
>"Link" is a reincarnation of the same Link over and over again.
Literally only true in Twilight Princess, which is one of the reasons why it sucks aside from the fanfic tier writing and nonesense plot that's more obssessed with trying to emulate and reference Orcarina tan actually telling a unique and cohesive narrative. The sad thing is, this could've been fixed and avoided by instead removing the triforce elements, removing the OoT stuff, and isntead making it a successor to Majora's Mask and putting it in Termina. Heck, most of the story elements, designs, and setting stuff is practically built for MM. IT EVEN HAS THE SAME FUCKING MONKEYS! Plus it would have saved us from the complete clusterfuck that is the confusing and bullshit 3-way split timeline

I hate this "reincarnation" meme that shitty fanfic writers have been trying to push in zelda for years.

>>54519645
What's wrong with it being reincarnation

Link in some way or form is ALWAYS the hero

"Oh well isn't that a coincidence ;)" is a boring ass explanation and gay

>>54519645
Uh, Skyward Sword explicitly sets up the reincarnation thing, doesn't it? Pretty sure it does. Certain it does, actually.

>>54517865
I bet it's because early on someone said he was just destroying shit, so he went out of his way to deal with the farm without destroying it. I bet he read every book in the Hyrule Library regarding horses and cows, examined the land of the farm, considered every facet of trade and had a full audit performed on the farms accounts before giving the job to Ingo because he looks a bit like Ganondorf. And then he destroyed Castle Town.

>>54519712
>"Oh well isn't that a coincidence ;)" is a boring ass explanation and gay

Except one time, in Wind Waker, because it goes out of its way to make it work, and a huge part of why Wind Waker Link is so badass is precisely BECAUSE he's not destined for anything in particular.

>>54519741
It's not like they ever specifically say he isn't the reincarnation of Link. Wind Waker Link is strongly implied if not outright stated to be Link's descendant, only the triforce of courage was lost long before that would matter. It's not like reincarnation guarantees that you'll understand the Hylian language (though apparently new game+ does)

>>54515721
That's pretty useless, when you don't have the other two.

>>54519716
Yeah, and that par is easily the weakest part of the game, and was possibly the biggest boneheaded mistake in the game

>>54519712
Because Reincarnation is lazy writing, and removes most of the agency and personality from the character, and allows the game to ignore trying to give you a personal reason to go stop the bad guy and save the world. Nearly every story that involves the japanese/FF.net interpretaion of "reincarnation" almost always ends up being shit, and shows how lazy the writer is for wanting to rely more and more on the having the conflict occur and happen because "its the way it must be/tied by fate" and other nonsense.

Its also why WW is one of the best games in the franchise. The game puts in the work to make Link his own person, with his own motivations, drive, and being a person capable to defining his own destiny irrespective of what prophecies may say. By not trying to shoehorn in the bullshit of this "chosen hero" nonesense it makes your accomplishments all the more meaningful, and actually makes you a true and proper hero, someone who has true courage to make his fate rather than just being a recycled puppet of prophecy and cycles

Also, it allows for the character to eventually come into his own and allows himself to grow into the character that is worthy of the power of the Triforce and being a hero. That way you actually have to have the character go through the progression of the Hero's Journey, rather than just having the story right off the bat go "Congrats, you were born the SPECIAL! You are more important than everyone else now go save the world as you are ordained to do because you're the cosmic janitor warrior."

If you can't understand the importance of agency and self-actualization of the Hero's Journey in myth and story, then fuck off back to your FF.net Naruto Xovers

>>54519801
Both the King and the Deku Tree explicitly say he isn't link you dumbass, and that he doesn't possess the "hero's spirit"

>>54519801
>It's not like they ever specifically say he isn't the reincarnation of Link.

Actually, yes, they do specifically say just that, during Jabun and the King of Red Lion's conversation.
>Jabun: (Translated) If you have sought me out...it must mean you have found the Hero of Time, does it not?
>King of Red Lions: Unfortunately, that is not so.
>Jabun: (Translated) Then for what purpose have you come to see me?
>King of Red Lions: The one I have brought with me has no connection to the legendary one. And yet I sense great promise in the courage that this one possesses.
>Jabun: (Translated) Promise? You suggest that I leave the fate of Hyrule up to chance?
>King of Red Lions: I do. It is the only way.

"No connection" means "no connection". None. Zip. Zilch. Nada. You're just some kid who's sister was kidnapped, and you're gonna make the guy who kidnapped him pay. And his fucking bird, too.

>>54519880
I like it because I can appreciate that eastern storytelling theme of in spite of the horrible and or bonding fate that awaits X still persists and conquers

I fail to see how that takes away from agency and personality

>>54519801
>Wind Waker Link is strongly implied if not outright stated to be Link's descendant,
Fucking when and where? It has never done so in the entire run of the game, and in fact one of the main DRIVING PLOT POINTS OF THE WHOLE STORY was that the Hero of time stopped existing in the timeline and never came back or aided in the millennia since Ganon was sealed, and that the world was doomed and forsaken by legend and prphecy. The whole point of Wind Waker is that you're a bad enough dude to say "fuck that noise, I'm saving my sister and stealing all this shit for myself"

>>54519880
Okay...but it's not fanfiction. It's an official game, it literally can't be fanfiction. It's canon.

You don't have to like it, but you do have to accept it.

Hell, if you want to get technical I'm pretty sure that all the writers of the various Zelda games have been pretty explicit about the reincarnation thing going all the way back to A Link To The Past, at least. Reincarnation has always been a big thing in Zelda, it's just that Twilight Princess and Wind Waker both have it come to the fore for the first time.

>>54519916
>bonding
Binding*

>>54519916
>I fail to see how that takes away from agency and personality

I'd like to point out that Wind Waker actually proves that it doesn't...it IS possible to end Ganondorf permanently, at least in that timeline. And if in that timeline, why not others?

I want Linkle to be canon so we can get a game where Link and Linkle both reincarnate at the same time and have to work together because the goddess(es) got drunk and split Courage right down the middle by accident.

>>54519916
>theme of in spite of the horrible and or bonding fate that awaits X still persists and conquers
Except it never happens that way, instead its always about "here, you're the special destined to be special. Take your magical plot device McGuffin that you don't need to work for, and save the world as you are already expected to do". It has never been about persisting in spite of your fate, and if it was then Ganondorf would've won and broken free from his cycle of sealing and release.

>>54519933
Learn reading comprehensive you illiterate mong. I said it was as shitty as fanfiction not that it was, and just because a story is made and canon doesn't mean it doesn't suck a huge chode and makes no sense in context to the lore and story. Otherwise by your logic Metroid Other M is a good game and the Prime series is bad because they're no longer canon.

>>54519933
>Twilight Princess and Wind Waker both have it come to the fore for the first time.
Except Wind Waker is EXPLICITLY against it and does everything in its power to not only avoid the implication, but also deny it. Literally only TP and SS do so, and does so in the laziest way possible. Heck, I could've even excused it in TP if they had instead of trying to shoehorn "muh eternal ganondorf conflict" they instead went with the story idea of Link dieing forgotten in Termina and passing his power on to someone to carry out his legacy, and then just make the whole game in Termina instead or Hyrule. That way, it becomes a story about fulfilling legacies and the new generation surpassing the old, with Link being less of a literal reincarnation, and rather more of a worthy successor to the dead hero.

>>54519896
>And his fucking bird, too.
Killing that dumb fucbord was so satisfying

>>54519880
>and removes most of the agency and personality
Thats just words anon.
Reincarnation boosts and makes the character BOLD to sticking to his traits.

>>54520115
>I said it was as shitty as fanfiction not that it was

Okay, so, first point: you said:
>I hate this "reincarnation" meme that shitty fanfic writers have been trying to push in zelda for years.

So, in fact, you called it fanfiction, not "like" fanfiction.

Second point:
>and just because a story is made and canon doesn't mean it doesn't suck a huge chode

But that's not my argument. My argument is:
1) It's not fanfiction, it's an official part of the lore and has been for decades, and has never been recanted
2) This means that while you don't have to like it, you DO have to accept it. You can argue that it's a bad plot point if you feel that way, but your argument must still ultimately bow to the fact that it's the way things are, and any statements about the game must accept reincarnation as fact, or else your argument is baseless.

Third point: Reincarnation in the Zelda universe does not remove all agency, since it's clear (from the branching timelines of Ocarina of Time and the ending of Wind Waker) that destiny, while extant, can still be changed. There is no such thing as a choice made in a vacuum, after all, every choice has something influencing it. Zelda simply adds the weight of destiny as one more influencing factor - but destiny can still be changed and shaped.

>>54520115
>and if it was then Ganondorf would've won and broken free from his cycle of sealing and release.

In fact I'm pretty sure that is one of the canon timelines...the timeline splits at Ocarina of Time into three:
a) Link stops Ganondorf as a child
2) Link stops Ganondorf as an adult and the series progresses from there
3) Link fails to stop Ganondorf in either case, and dies

>>54520248
>Ocarina of Time into three:
And if TP wasn't such shit, and made no sense in terms of lore, we would've only had 2 timelines based off of the two halves of OoT (the timeline to returned to as a kid, and the one you left behind as an adult), and they would've made a shit ton more sense.

Also I'm not saying it isn't fact, I'm saying that the later games that solidified it as fact my bowing to the retarded fanfic memes are shit and ruined the lore and story by making things more incomprehensible and convoluted than they needed to be

Also stop including Wind Waker in your analogies. IT has nothing to do with the destiny shit you're muttering about, and was written before the reincarnation retcons raped the lore.

'm not saying I don't accept it, I'm saying that I hate it and, when considering the games from before TP and SS in terms of thier own lore and story, those elements don't apply to them and rather are nonesense retcons that just made what was once simple and elegant to understand all the more confusing

Basically, TP is the Dark Souls 2 of the Selda franchise. IT official and canon, but it being canon just convolutes and contradicts so much of what was already established that it makes th whole thing shittier and sometimes it would just be easier to disregard those pieces of trash when talking about all the games before them. Then SS came along and made it even more egregious by cockslapping the audience with its ending

>>54520382
>And if TP wasn't such shit, and made no sense in terms of lore, we would've only had 2 timelines based off of the two halves of OoT (the timeline to returned to as a kid, and the one you left behind as an adult), and they would've made a shit ton more sense.
Okay, I'm one of the dumb ones who don't really comprehend the timeline stuff entirely. Isn't the timeline you're discounting, the one where Link fails, also the one the NES Zelda games happen in? Where do they go without it?

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>>54520445
No, the NES games come from the timeline where Link returns to Hyrule as a kid, goes on his advenute to Termina, then has to take a long trek to make his way back to Hyrule (with maybe Link's Awakening being in between them, depending on interpretation), and makes it back to Hyrule to find that Zelda and theKing weren't able to stop th Ganon of this limeline from taking stuff over, so he has to stop him here. Then after you kill Ganon some wizard does asshole things and tries to bring Ganon back, and then you do Zelda 2 to stop his resurrection and kill Dark Link.

Back before TP was released, GAmetrailers did a decent overview of the games, and detailed the 2-split theory in thier video. I'm having a hard time finding it though, I'll come back once I do, but to put it simply the old timeline before TP fucked it all up was as thus.

Sorry for the size, had a hard time finding one that wasn't made by ants

>>54520615
>>54520445

Again, this was a speculative timeline released before TP was finished and released, so TP's place in the timeline was merely a theory and only tentative

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>>54520615
What you posted has never been a canon timeline, at all. It was fan speculation. They only released the official timeline after Twilight Princess, and it was the FIRST time an official timeline had been released.

And it's this.

>>54520382
>and was written before the reincarnation retcons raped the lore.

They're not "retcons". Reincarnation has always been a thing in Zelda. Always. Since forever. It was the official explenation for why there's always a Link and always a Ganondorf even though the latter is only detestably the same one and the former certainly wasn't always the same one.

>>54520797
And it made a hell of a lot more sense than the egregious and shitty retcons that came about when TP was released.

Do you not get it now? TP sucks, made far sweeping retcons, and tore things up so bad that what was once a simple concept had to be made ino overcomplicated bullshit to try to justiy its existence.

Also, pay attention to the discussion. He was specifically ASKING about the old split timeline you retard.

>>54520834
>. Since forever. It was the official explenation for why there's always a Link and always a Ganondorf even though the latter is only detestably the same one and the former certainly wasn't always the same one.
Citation needed, and please a Citation from before Twilight Princess was made and they had to cover thier asses ater realizing they fucked up with the story. Also, that still does not support the Reincarnation theory as Ganon has been consistently SEALED then released, not reincarnation, and tended to stay dead afer killed, and in fact one of the major plot lines of TWO of the games was the some fucks were trying to revive that dead fuck. If he could be reincarnated, then he wouldn't need to be resurrected.

Ganon does not reincarnate, wen he dies he stays dead, He can come back after being sealed, but he needs an external force to bring him back and reincarnat from the dead.

And really, why does each Link have to be the same soul? Can't it just be about someone new each time rising to meet the challenge, and proving himself to be someone worthy to save the day and champion the power of the Triforce of Courage?

>>54520615
>>54520445
Found it https://youtu.be/4LpAGJ92Zvs
It was part of a retrospective of the Franchise that Gametrailers did in anticipation of TP and the hype it had coming from it. The full video can be watched here. https://youtu.be/dRQlpuwFSPg

>>54519712
It's pretty obvious that there was no original intent to create a cohesive timeline for the series, apart from the titles which were direct sequels to a previous game in the series.

The whole three-way timeline split was just Nintendo pandering to the fans who had been trying to connect the games together for decades before then.

>>54520834
>Always. Since forever
The earliest explanation for why all the games was about the same hero going on similar journeys was that they were all the same stories told at different times in history in different cultures. Reincarnation wasn't added until very recently.

>>54515665
Keep /v/ tier trash on /v/ please

>>54519880
>>54519896
>>54520115
>He isn't the Hero of Time
Yeah, he isn't. Because the Hero of Time is only OoT Link. No other Link has been referred to as the Hero of Time. Reincarnation or not, WW Link isn't OoT Link, and therefore isn't the Hero of Time.

That has nothing to do with whether or not he's subject to the same destiny as the other Links.

>>54520969
>Ganon has been consistently SEALED then released, not reincarnation
Four Swords Adventures.

>>54520615
>>54520969
>complains about "fanfic" when discussing the actual games
>post and exalts literal fanfic

>>54520615
>the two Game Boy Color games that take place literally back-to-back are in different timelines

Man, Zelda fans will come up with some stupid shit. When will they learn that there's no actual continuity in Zelda games, just references and callbacks?

>>54520382
Wind Waker's the one that breaks the timeline, though. Otherwise there would never have been any implication of a continued adult timeline. Which there shouldn't be because Link and Zelda stopped Ganondorf from getting the Triforce in the first place.

Really, everything makes much more sense if you just excise Wind Waker and the shitty games that continued its abortive timeline.

>>54515665
You get a free poor man's moon pearl. So far, that's the only power that's actually confirmed.

>>54519524
>>54519560
>>54519645
>WW Link is some random kid and not actually a descendant or chosen hero or anything.
>You're just a kid who happens to be named Link who's sister was kidnapped.
>WW Link was just some schmuck kid from some podunk island
That's wrong. The characters you're going to cite aren't authoritative on the matter. WW Link isn't a random kid. He's exactly the same as the others.

Additionally, reincarnation in Zelda is a lot more complex. Reincarnated souls are not bound to single entities in one timeline. On the other hand, they do not do much for someone. They do not affect mind or body. WW Link having the same soul as the others do not make him any less or more special than he was before. Any Link isn't special because of his soul, he's special because he lives at the right place in the right time and is actually doing something.

>>54521079
They should have just made their "official" timeline all the games in order of release, even the ones implied to be prequels, which is almost all of them now because people love shit they recognize already.

>>54521815
>which is almost all of them now
The Legend of Zelda (Original)
Zelda II (Sequel to Original)
A Link to the Past (Prequel I)
Link's Awakening (Sequel to Prequel I)
Ocarina of Time (Prequel II)
Majora's Mask (Sequel I to Prequel II)
Oracle of Seasons/Ages (Prequel to Sequel to Prequel I)
Four Swords (Side Game attached to Prequel I)
Wind Waker (Sequel II to Prequel II)
Four Swords Adventures (Sequel to Side Game attached to Prequel I)
Minish Cap (Prequel to Side Game attached to Prequel I)
Twilight Princess (Sequel to Sequel I to Prequel II)
Phantom Hourglass (Sequel to Sequel II to Prequel II)
Spirit Tracks (Sequel to Sequel to Sequel II to Prequel II)
Skyward Sword (Prequel III)
A Link Between Worlds (Sequel to Sequel to Prequel I)
Triforce Heroes (Side Game II)
Breath of the Wild (Sequel to Unknown)

"quel" has lost all meaning to me now

>>54520969
>>54520615
>Link's Awakening not being after Link to the Past, despite LttP's Agahnim and Ganon showing up as forms of Nightmare
>Link to the Past being after LoZ and AoL despite being it specifically being before them since it came out
Whoever came up with this wasn't paying attention to shit-all.

>>54515665
I thought that title solidly belonged to the sword of truth?

>>54519077
>an electric jellyfish infecting it from the inside won't kill it
We don't see it die explicitly, but it's gone when you return as an adult and doesn't come back. It's safe to assume that it died, from what I remember it's in an enclosed reservoir, unable to swim away.

>>54519524
>thinking that being the chosen hero is based on bloodline
It's a spiritual thing. He's a nobody farmboy in TP, the son of a refugee in OoT, there are other games where he has no explained connection to the royal family by birth.

>>54519929
It's better than that. There was also a running theme of Ganondorf being blinded by his obsession with the past while the rightful King of Hyrule wanted to create a new future.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsPEKgQNGlg

And in the end... they did. In sequels to Wind Waker, Ganon never shows up again. In all games set in Old Hyrule, modern technology is worse than stuff you find in ancient ruins... but in the post-Wind Waker setting people are actually *advancing*.

Wind Waker Link didn't just overcome his own fate. He broke the cycle, for good.

>>54522762
>He broke the cycle
The King broke the cycle. Link was more or less just the piece he moved.

>>54522762
And yet people will still argue to the death that Breath of the Wild takes place in the Adult timeline because "BotW timeline placement" arguments are actually rather transparent "favorite timeline" arguments, but nobody will admit it

>>54523090
It OBVIOUSLY takes place in the fourth timeline, silly.

>>54523165
The only possible thing stupider than that would be if the second DLC pack involved Vaati wearing Majora's Mask.

>>54523233
>implying Vaati isn't THE Majora's Mask

>>54522979
And OoT Zelda set the gameboard by removing the Hero of Time's soul from the timeline.

>>54523346
That's debatable, and has a lot to do with what a soul is. Link's body, at least, should still be in the Adult timeline, since what was moving back and forth between the past and the future was just his mind. (See: Raru's conversation when you pull the sword for the first time.) If the soul is just the mind, well, that's that. But it doesn't make sense for that to be the case, since reincarnations don't retain memories or lessons.

>>54521079
This.

If you read into it enough and do some theorizing, you can form a loose timeline. But there's no concrete way to be entirely sure of it other than by looking at the ties between games done by recycling ideas or sometimes in actually deliberate ways in more modern times.

Really, it's hardly even important to "know the timeline" unless you are specifically trying to place things in it.

>>54523307
Don't be silly.
He's Majora's Cap, not Majora's Mask.

>>54523558
>Really, it's hardly even important to "know the timeline" unless you are specifically trying to place things in it.
Yeah, but we're talking about Zelda players. The games have conditioned them to assume that needlessly difficult, esoteric, and hidden tasks lead to heart containers.

>>54523655
Nah, that's just bosses that give heart containers.
You have to do SEVERAL needlessly difficult, esoteric, and hidden tasks to get enough Pieces of Heart to get a full heart container. Or maybe it'll just give you rupees when you've got a full wallet already. You never know!

>>54516032
underrated post

>>54523805
>tfw none of the needlessly difficult, esoteric, and hidden tasks in Breath of the Wild give Pieces of Heart
Some of them are Shrine Quests, sure, but...it's not the same, somehow.

>>54515665

Who needs courage when you have a gun?

>>54526271
A person faced with several opponents who also have guns?

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>>54520615
>Shitty fanfic timeline makes zero sense
>Autists still complain about the official timeline when shit like this is the alternative
Really gets that noggin joggin

>>54515665
I always saw that as the reason Link was a backflipping, bomb explosion dodging, wall running, cleaving gigantic monsters with a sword shonen action hero. It makes him into Ichigo/Naruto with a sword.

And other theories are
>power means they never run out of magic no matter how many spells they cast
>Wisdom lets Zelda be ten steps ahead and be able to set plans into place that make everything come out perfectly waaaaay later in the future even after she is captured

>>54515689
Ganon

>>54528094
Gerudo get out, this is a Hylian board.

>>54522365
Not all parasites kill. I know that there are viruses that were once really deadly that evolved to be tolerable, so that their host can live to provide infectible cells and help spread.

As for Jabu-Jabu 7 years later, I figured he was just frozen because there is a glitch that allows you to enter him as an adult.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paGKhhv4fDA

.
There are counterarguments to my hypothesis, though.
1) It's a glitch.
2) Said glitch is taking into account something that was story-wise from the past, and may not be intended.
3) The hunk of ice doesn't really resemble the shape of Jabu-Jabu, though this could be proven or disproven if we look at the underside, which I don't know about since I'm too lazy to pull out my shit and look.

>>54528332
Or Goron. Zora. Kokiri. Anything but gerudo, really.

>>54521705
This. I doubt many people in Nintendo actually cared of the chronology of Zelda games until Autists started pestering them. That's why BoW has no exact timeline

>>54521746
>The characters you're going to cite aren't authoritative on the matter.

Hate to point this out, but they've got considerably more authority than you, and I'm not aware of the idea having been recanted anywhere.

Additionally, the game just means more if he's just some random kid named Link - the idea that you're some schmuck is actually ingrained into the plot.

>>54517721
Do you have to treat every game as fucking Undertale? Meta is not canon in 99.99% of universes.
There's Undertale, Dark Souls, and that's pretty much it.

>>54515689
It makes you immortal.

>>54515717
>never knows fear
You and I had very different experiences with the LoZ series. I remember the REEEEE-Dead could paralyze Link with terror.

He's a tough little bastard though, so, fair point.

>>54529063
>not wanting warrior women to snu snu you

>>54515665
I think the individual pieces of the Triforce are one of those "If you need it, you don't deserve it" things.

>>54520018
You'd probably get a game where you can switch genders at will. Link is stronger, tougher, and uses mostly melee shit. Linkle is more dexterous, flexible, and uses mostly ranged shit.

Link uses the classic sword and shield, Linkle uses her crossbows and has to dodge incoming attacks rather than block.

>>54531117
>>54520018
The name "Linkle" upsets me.

>>54530359
>but they've got considerably more authority than you, and I'm not aware of the idea having been recanted anywhere.
They got considerably less authority than me because they are characters limited to a single game. You have higher authority than them if you played at least OoT and SS. You can see the patterns. They cannot see them and therefore cannot know whether this Link is connected or not. Both of them are not old enough. They have never seen the other guys. Their assessment makes sense, but it isn't less wrong.

You have to free yourself from the idea that all the opinions of characters are true. In general, the kings of Hyrule mess up, especially those around the games we play. From the king's perspective, the assessment is correct. There's no indication that those Links are connected. Even to us, it appeared as a stretch, since their bodies and minds are obviously different. But this piece already is more information than what the guys in WW have.

They don't know about reincarnations of souls. The only guy who almost figured it out is Ganondorf, because it's the same guy in several games. Ganondorf is unique in that regard. He sees those Links pulling the same kind of shit with him. In TP, there's cut dialogue from his dying speech where he addresses the reincarnation. In TP he definitely figured it out. In WW he might have too. I consider Ganondorf in WW to be more knowledgeable and wiser than in any other game.

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>People are seriously arguing about a timeline Nintendo pulled out of their ass.

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>>54531967

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>>54531978

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>>54531992

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>>54532004

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>>54532016

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>>54532064

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>>54532071

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>>54532082

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>>54532143

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>>54532153

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>>54532177

>>54531769
>/tg/ is autistic

I mean it's about the only reason I come here I wish there was more fun allowed tho

I still want my Neo Hyrule with the laser Mastersword and the Hyrulecycle from Mario Kart 8.
I think they checked the waters with BotW

>>54528997
It was a killing curse that Ganondorf put on Jabu Jabu. It's a MAGICAL parasite, intended to kill.
You're using an unintended glitch as your counterargument which proves you have nothing else. Ganondorf killed Jabu-Jabu.

>>54519477
I like the joke in the pic, but if they were going to calculate the percent it annoys me that they didn't round it correctly

>>54533863
I think Sheikah magitek is as close as we're gonna get.

>>54515665
Could be useful if the enemies were played up. Like there are actual eldritch horrors, but the Triforce of Courage holder isn't phased by noneuclidean insanity.

>>54515665
Yea, even with it Link is still in the closet.

>>54535533
But you killed the curse.

>>54536709
As Link did with Gohma? It only didn't became sushi became the player should be able to reenter the dungeon to collect golden skulltula. A husk of a tree do accomplish this. A dead fish, not.

>>54517173
>I don't think typically meet Redead or evil curses in any of the games before you have the Triforce of Courage, at least in Ocarina of Time

Redead are found in the Sun's Song grave, along with every other enterable grave I think.

>>54520018
>>54531117
I wonder if they will ever make a game where every other thing that is normal in a Zelda story is different.
>protagonist is a heroine
>antagonist holds the Triforce of Wisdom, protagonist ally holds the Triforce of Power while the protagonist has the Triforce of Courage
>fighting "fair" is possible, but sneak attacks, traps, and shooting are more encouraged

Other ideas I've had is:
>certain important characters think she is supposed to be royalty, but she they also suspect she could be the hero of legend instead
>the antagonist doesn't have much prowess unlike Ganondorf, but makes up for it with keiaku and actively tries to find ways to screw you over, even going as far as to have a larger plan to ensure that you don't win in the end.
>your character has high stealth and vertical mobility because, early on, cities and towns aren't completely safe for you. May have something to do with bad guy's keiaku.
>Not only do you get a stamina meter, but you also get a slowly recharging magic meter that is used to cast desperation spells such as invisibility, fleeting invulnerability, time slowing, and even damage boost, really not too different from Zelda II spells or BotW special powers.
>Significant references to Zelda II, including said spells above. Iron Knuckles + horseback, downward thrust assassinations, bird knights, goriyas,

>>54537925
I've found Tetra to be a great display on how to do a good Zelda.

But yeah, would love some quirks, like a Zora ecoterrorist villain wielding the Triforce of Wisdom.

>>54538025
>a Zora ecoterrorist villain wielding the Triforce of Wisdom.
At that point, why even include the triforce at all?

>>54538074
Because Ganon have a corrupted Power to rule over everything. A corrupted Wisdom could be used as "we must kill Hylians to save the world".

>>54538131
How would corrupted Courage work? Self-righteousness? Evil juggernaut?

>>54538264
I know it's not canon, but Link was going down that path for just a bit in Hyrule Warriors. It would basically be a bullheaded belief that you are absolutely in the right and never need hold back or consider anyone but yourself as you rush headfirst into whatever you have decided is the correct course of action. Anyone telling you otherwise is wrong at best.

>>54515689
Ganondorf took a sword to the chest and usurped another dimension using it.

>>54537925
What i'd like is a separation of Ganon and Ganondorf as separate characters. Imagine this...

>Ganon's back to trying to get the full triforce
>remembered/learned how to manifest without a host so he's back to being piggy king of thieves
>Link's called to the rescue
>Sneaking missions as Zelda to deliver guidance and supplies to Link a la Sphinx
>mystery character does Hyrule Warriors-style beat-em-up sections to clear out boss armies so that Link can access the next temple
>almost to the final battle
>mystery character turns out to be Ganondorf, lived through all this time and ticked off over not getting the Triforce and granting the Gerudo the nice landscape Hylians take for granted
>duel against Ganondorf
>Final battle against Ganon, somehow wised up from previous encounters
>doesn't show weak spot at all, Zelda can't get a bead on the guy.
>cue big damn hero Ganondorf wrestling Ganon to the ground, giving Zelda an opening.
>last phase sees Link, Zelda and Ganondorf cooperate to take down Ganon.

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>>54530384
N'wah, please.

>>54537925
Breathe of the wild could have easily had Zelda as the player-character. She's running around gathering the triforce and securing the master sword so that she can awaken link to help her take on Ganon before ancient seals drop.

>>54520797
Wow

>>54540616
That's the expansion of the game, to come after the DLCs

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>>54542312
It fucking better be.

>>54538264
corrupted courage always sounded like a berserker to me.
as for what courage does for you, I always felt that it could be the explanation for how link takes such incredible amounts of punishment.

>>54538131
Ganon never corrupted Power, he just tried to take the entire Triforce and it split up in reaction to that, the most suitable part remaining with him and the others fucking off to suitable hosts.
Either way, it seems possible that anybody can hold any part as long as he can get ahold of it.

>>54539014
>Not having Ganondorf give a rousing speech on how Power is not good or evil, it is only how one decides to use that power.
>Not having Ganondorf sacrifice himself before the final battle to shatter through Ganon's armoured plating and expose his weak point
>Not having Ganondorf, while dying of his wounds, ask Link and Zelda to help the Gerudo tribe in his place, his pride cracking just enough to show how much he cares for his people.
>Not using his dying breath at the end of the boss fight to unite the Triforce and use its power to banish Ganon from the cycle permanently.

It's like you don't even dramatic tension.

>>54542312
>>54543723
I'd imagine Zelda would work like Corvo from Dishonored: can fight with a sword but has magic at his disposal.

>Din's Fire
You can select objects and enemies can causes them to combust.

>Farore's Wind A
Literally Corvo's Blink

>Farore's Wind B
Create a stationary cyclone that swirls enemies and objects around while buffeting enemy projectiles not from you. Can be dispelled prematurely.

>Nayru's Love A
Gives you brief invulnerability to damage and enemy knockback (not hazards like lava) while also making you invisible. Great at getting out of tough situations in order to flee or gain a better vantage point.

>??? Time
Everything else goes slow for a brief time as though you were air-shotting or Flurry Rushing. Your speed is unaffected.

>??? Shock
Shocks all enemies within a certain radius centered around you

>>54515665
I always headcanon'd that the Triforce of Courage is what lets Link load a saved game if he dies.
In that sense, it is only natural that the bearer of the Triforce of Courage is the legendary hero - given enough attempts, he's guaranteed to succeed eventually, even against the bearer of the Triforce of Power.

>>54519354
In every game prior to the timeline of Wind Waker, Link is reincarnated from the same soul. Due to time fuckery, Zelda sends adult Link back into the past of Ocarina of Time to be able to regain the 7 years of his life he lost. This creates 2 timelines, one of which Link no longer exists in because his soul was sent to a different timeline.

So since Link's soul is no longer around to reincarnate when Ganon revives again there's nobody around to stop him and he fucks up everything. But eventually some random kid dressed up as the legendary hero that he happens to be named after decides to get shit done.

>>54545545
>Not having Ganondorf already be wounded from the duel before and just struggle and power on regardless of the blood leaking from between his bandages as he suplexes Ganon again and again.
>not having him collapse after the fight and give that speech with a pointed "if i won't make it" tint while Zelda franctically calls for medical aid.
>not having him make a full recovery anyway with some scenes of Link and Zelda visiting him in the infirmary
>not having Zelda finally give Ganondorf his wish and revitalize the gerudo lands as he walks off towards the canyon between Hylia Field and what used to be Gerudo Desert.

It's like you don't even wind down. That and what's the point of separating a character from another and writing them out of the story right afterwards? The dynamic would have at least three games more in it.