>demons were just the losing side in a cosmic battle, and

Not cliche, just crap. I know you want to make your story as special as you are, but you must understand that words like "demon" have an established meaning in our cultural heritage. Just like making "dwarves" into giants and "elves" into short-lived jugglers from Martian cities can all be categorised as plain old "bullshit", so can making your demons good in an angels vs. demons story.

>>54489919
What if the "angels" took advantage of that established meaning in our cultural heritage, and are actually just short-lived jugglers from Mars?

>>54489919
I dunno, I feel like as long as they're "fallen from grace" versions of things called angels (who are themselves messengers/servants of a God figure) and/or are generally imprisoned in a Hell-ish abyss people will generally understand what you mean when you call them "demons."

It's better if the demons won, but suck at writing so everyone thinks they're hardcore edgelords but they're actually just bad with hyperboles.

I find the concept works better when there's no great deception on either side - just conflicting views of what is right. One side sees themselves as obeying the natural order, and the other sees themselves as rebeling against unjust dominion. It's better when neither can really said to be totally right.

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When I do angels vs demons I like makeing the angels fascist and the demons anarchists so that there is no right side and the only way forward is a compromise

>>54489919
>words like "demon" have an established meaning in our cultural heritage

Isn't that the point? That the angels set that in stone and mortals believe it, but the truth is different?

>>54489842
It's perfectly fine for a doodle in your notebook during Mrs Mulvaney's Grade 9 English class.

>>54489842
So the Civil War?

>>54489842
Probably the laziest way you could subvert the "angles good lemons evil" plot point, but I guess it's not cliche.

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>>54489919
Ahem

>>54489842
Agree. Angels are assholes who do nothing about great evils, unless the PC is one in which case theyll send several CR60 demi-gods to tear open your anus.

What if neither angels or demons are good/evil. They're just beings with powers so humans without automatically worshipped them as something divine. In turn, they used humans to fight their wars to prevent their own deaths. Like living fucking chess pieces.

>>54492266
>>54491061
>>54490940
>>54489842

Combine this to get my take on it, tbqh.

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>>54489842
>Too cliche?
Not really. It has been done quite a few times before though (Paradise Lost, Sandman, etc) so if you wish to explore such a concept make sure your spin on it is interesting.

You could make it morally gray. "Yeah the demons did X with their best intentions but maybe rebelling had unforeseeable consequences."

>>54489842

Quite. If all you're doing is turning the cosmology upside down and seeing where things settle, it's going to be either preachy or boring.

Its going to entirely depend on what the actual battle was: If it's entirely "The demons are good guys", It's going to fall flat.

"The Demons freed us" is a good one, but not particularly unique; It's the base of half of SMT and a few religions actually.

Try feeding us some more detail: The trope is rather cliche, but there's nothing saying your angle isn't fresh.

>>54491061
I recognize that picture.

Your kind do not belong here.

>>54489842
try kabbalism

>>54490979
the problem with that is that your trying to make scene and the players just want a casus belli. imagine PCs being given free rain to justify any action.

>>54489919
Tbh, I've seen so many "good" demons and "evil" angels that it doesn't even register as a misuse of the term anymore. As did short-lived elves! The only constant all the time were the ears!

Dwarves definitely vary very little, though. Either way, OP, I'd much rather just IGNORE reality altogether and cook your own story than to invent bullshitty reasons for why it ain't so. In your owrld demons are good and angels are evil, that's it, you don't actually need to use excuses for that. I mean, unless you actually want a story of oppression against the poor demons who are being slandered, or whatever.

Did you just finish Paradise Lost for your summer reading assignment?

>>54492216
i thought you didn't notice

>>54495032
few brave guardsmen venture into >>>/b/
Ho no, I accidentally opened up a chaos rift

>>54492266
This is usually how I run most beings of great power, but I like being disappointing in my writing so meh.

>>54489842
>Angels were created out of a god's thoughts and therefore are based in that god's desires
>Demons were born of human thoughts, and showcase human desires
>Said god is now pissed because humans shouldn't be able to do something they do
>Uses the religion to confirm angels as good and demons as evil, despite basically being the same species

>>54491061
>>54491101
>>54492266
>>54494560


>>54495236

>>54489842
Angels remained loyal to preserve the order of existence, demons broke free and created free will and all the horrors that come from it. History was rewritten to be a cleaner conflict, as there's an issue in how the Divine knew and allowed demonry to do this as part of the order of things.

Demons are drunk on the madness of infinite possibilities which often pushes them to extremes, while Angels are finite in purpose and do their job effectively within their purpose. Humanity are the middle ground, built for a purpose but able to pursue their own means; the Good in the end will follow the purposes of Law.

Knowing the truth might cause strife within the religious orders and the greater flock, but if most people kept living their lives as they did there wouldn't be too much issue. But most people would rather get angry, or twist that to gain power in society, and that means problems.