Warhammer 40k General - /40kg/

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So thoughts on the griffon?

78 points for 2D6-take-the-highest STR 6 AP -1 damage D3, ignores cover and LOS shots, 234 for a battery of 3.

Seems okay, its by far the cheapest artillery vehicle IG has now.

Re-posting my list, made with leftovers of my Vraks Renegade and the content of the Starter box.

Thoughts.

+++Batailon Detachment+++

HQ
Typhus – 164pts
Winged Daemon Prince of Chaos – Mark of Nurgle, 2x Chaos Claws – 180pts

TROOP
x20 Poxwalkers – 120pts
x20 Poxwalkers – 120pts
x7 Plague Marines – Plasma Rifle - 160pts

TRANSPORT
Chaos Rhino – Combi Bolter – 72pts

ELITE
x11 Renegade Disciples – Covenant of Nurgle, Missile Launcher – 86pts
x10 Renegade Disciples – Covenant of Nurgle, Missile Launcher – 80pts
x10 Renegade Disciples – Covenant of Nurgle, Missile Launcher – 80pts

FAST ATTACK
Foetid Bloat-Drone - 158pts


+++Spearhead Detachment+++

HQ
Malignant Plaguecaster - 110pts

HEAVY SUPPORT
Armageddon Pattern Medusa – Medusa siege gun, Heavy Bolter – 111pts
Hellforged Leviathan Dreadnought – x2 Grav-flux Bombard – 305pts
Wyvern – Heavy Bolter - 93pts
Chaos Vindicator - 160pts

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r8 h8 and maturb9

>>53965207
OP declared for Grand Alliance: Faggot

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I came up with this on the fly, thoughts?
>God is watching, look busy" +3CPs
Overlord: Warscythe, Ress Orb - 147
Illuminor Szeras - 143

20x Warriors - 240
20x Warriors - 240
10x Immortals: Tesla - 170

5x Lychguard: Shields - 185
Deceiver - 225
Nightbringer - 230

Doomsday Ark - 203
Doomsday Ark - 203
1986

>>53965267
Pretty sure Plague marines are troops only in death guard armies

>>53965327
In which program you make such lists

>>53965348
Shit, you are right.

I'll have to swap them with a Disciple squad and count them as Renegade infantry then.

Optimal Chimera loadout?
I'm thinking double flamers.

RIP Roster Creator. Guess GW doesn't want competition for their as yet unreleased list builder.

>>53965392

If flamers werent so fucking expensive I would agree, otherwise autocannon chimeras are actually pretty damn good.

Do orks have a brain? Literally asked, not if they are stupid.
.

>>53965343
Wy Tesla on your Immortals ? Hordes shouldn't be a problem with what you are allready feilding.

>>53965369
There is no more such program...

So now that apothecaries are independant characters and restore wounds (or one model) to a unit instead of giving FnP, what is the best way to use them now?

Is it best to just have them follow another character to keep them alive?

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How the fuck do the Red Scorpions get to don the aquila on their armor?

>>53965400
Daily reminder that autocannon chimeras are Krieger vehicles and resist boltguns on 2s.

Opinions on Centaur infiltration move? Stromtroopmoving Grenadiers anyone?

>>53965404
Yeah but it only occasionally matters

>>53965457
If you're smart with your placement, yes. If not, he'll get mulched in close combat.
Alternatively have him baby sit devastators in your deployment.

>>53965424
I haven't played Necrons, so i thought having a squad of Tesla would be good insurance
But if Gauss would make the list more effective overall then i'll change

>>53965462
Krieg resist everything

>>53965466
Storm Chimera seems better

>>53965461

They are the purest

>>53965461
Loyalist EC

>>53965462

Also reminder that krieg leman russes are just flat out superior to regular AM leman russes and can fire ALL of their heavy weapons without movement penalty AND get coaxial bonuses AND have a 2+ save against S4 and below.

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How do I Nidzilla in 8ed ?
how much fodder do i need and which one between terma and horma ?

>>53965531
Carnifexes, Tyrannofexes, etc. Run swarms of Hormas to tarpit as you move, some warriors are good as mid-tier troops and synapse fun.

Fexes are double scything or double double deathspitters. Bio-plas to taste. FW Crusher Fexes aren't bad either.

>>53965531
>Fodder

Implying they aren't the most OP part of your army.

>>53965457
Either babysit a character or babysit a unit where a single downed model, including the first you would choose to die, is worth replacing.

>>53965526
How are my Stukas? I mean Avengers.

When using Death to the False Emperor with a squad of Plague Marines, do you choose which weapon gets the extra attack?

>>53965526
Seems like Kiregers are 40k equvalent of Lamborgini or Porshe.
Dont belive porn, size dont matter most of the time. Your walllet size makes them wet most, or gun to the head. Trust me Im your friend.
t.Noise Marine.

>>53965531
thats a nice horsey face you got there chap

>>53965574
Yes.

You have say 3 attacks, you can pick to attack with one weapon once and the other twice.

>>53965583
>He looks at the face
heh.

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>>53965571
Good.

Krieg gets no Air Support though.

>>53965574
You roll dice of difrent clour for difrent weapons.
>>53965586
That wasnt the question.

>>53965597
The breasts look unnatural as fuck too.

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I feel I got my final list worked out before list builder went down.

I am more or less happy with my list but i am thinking about the ratio of assault cannon and auto cannon dreads. Earlier I was using three assault and one auto. Now I have two of each. I am now pondering one assault and three Auto.

Any thoughts would be welcome.

>>53965616
Yes it was.

>>53965612
I am still probably fucked on how the keywords and detachements work, but I can get Air Support detachement, cant I?

>>53965654
Not bad. No LoW can hurt tho.

>>53965654
I wish Chaos got some HQ dread as well.
That would be fun to watch.

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I have a 7e army I wanted to put together when Traitor Legions came out, a bit of a "comedy" army in its own right. The idea was to combine a Helforged Warpack and Word Bearers WL traits to fish for a Warlord Psyker Defiler (pic related).

This army was pretty much a "I want an excuse to model a cathedral on legs", and wasn't meant for super-serious/WAAC play (not to mean it was supposed to be a pushover either). The idea was to use "some summons" to reinforce, while sacrificing Cultists to roadblock stuff/disrupt backfield units (I might shuffle points for more autoguns), and stomping things at range or in melee.

When I went over the list, I realized that the Horrors and Herald cost exactly the same as a Forgefiend, so if I switched them out, and turned the Plasmafiend into another Hades fiend, I have 25 pts to spend. On the other hand, 4 Hades Autofiends might be too "all or nothing." Another alternative might be dropping the Ectofiend, giving access to 2 Heldrakes, but I dislike the mini and that would feel too "that guy" (even if Drakes aren't that hot), and using leftover points for more small cultist units/autoguns.

Thoughts? I'm waiting for codex drops before considering 8th, for now.

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What should I fill this 1750 pt army with? More troops?

I feel like I need some buffer units

>>53965654
Well, could get a Chaplain Dread still. That, and the other Dread variants, could stoll be used for variety. Would be fun to play against, regardless.

Shame Daggan doesn't have a model; Blood Swords chapter master was a ven dreadnought.

98 points gets you a taurox prime with double volley guns and a punisher cannon

103 points gets you a storm chimera with an autocannon, heavy bolter and a 2+ save against S4 and below.

Dakka versus safety, its a better paradigm than a vanilla chimera.

>>53965674
I'm unsure? Like, if your army is Krieg battleforged, no, but I'm unsure if all your detachments have to be Krieg to use Krieg stuff.

Why are people so retarded? All the list builders have wolf guard pack leaders cost 16 like they are wolf guard when pg 198 of the imperial index says
"Many units are led by a champion of some kind such as a Sergeant.
Unit champions often have better characteristics and weapon
options than the models they command. With the exception of
Wolf Guard Pack Leaders in Terminator Armour, unit champions
have the same points cost as the others models in their unit."

THEY ARE ONLY 13 IN A UNIT OF BLOOD CLAWS REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>53965531
Ugh. The least attractive of the Ivy's.

>>53965702
Yes. Lots more.

>>53965704
Well I have a hard on for the box dread so that's the primary reason I have avoided other types. And because of many Forgeworld units in my other army I have decided to use none in this one. I am using the Chaplain model as my Death Company Dread becuse that model is amazing.

>>53965670
No. Plauge marines have one shooty weapon and one CC, save for champion.
So they cant use that rule on other weapons since they have FUKIN ONE.
And its good sportsmanship to use diffrent colour of dice to roll a bunch so everything is transparent and neat.
Think before you post, and than dont post.

>>53965738
Should I go with tactical marines or scouts?

I have some sternguard vets, but they also seem too expensive to use that way

>>53965723
The battlecannon + autocannons is nice too.

It is a good either or. I think base Taurox with dual autos shouldn't be overlooked either.

>>53965725
Well from what I understand, they all have keyword Imperium, so they can be used together? Like that is to point of Imperium keyword?

Actually I am unsure on interaction of Astra Militarum/Faction keyword and regiment/subfaction keyword. My original understanding was that you can have units with different subfactions in one detachement, but they do not benefit from special rules. But that is wrong.

Fuck me, I feel like 8th edition bingo playing autist.

>>53965759
Tacs honestly. Need bodies. Scouts are for Sniper Rifles, you just need bodies.

>>53965765
Not sure. Thats how AoS is I think?

>>53965725
Confussed samefag, I am quite lucky that in my group no one really hates FW and we are more RAI than RAW, unlike jerks cropping out online, so it would not be such a big problem. Still I would rather understand it correctly.

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>make the standard marine for my custom chapter
>like the look, but forgot to copy down the color #hex for all paints

fuck me

>>53965771
Ok, I haven't played 8th yet.

I really like tactical marines, but they weren't very good for me in 7th.

Are 10 man squads the way to go this edition? Also I hear there are new HQ units that can buff them

Thanks for input!

What are the current opinions about Intercessors, Hellblasters and Inceptors now that people have had a little time to play with them?

How well do they synergise with the HQs?

>>53965759
Tacts. You need more dudes on the table, and not just straight filler... ten-man tact units are pretty good at clogging up areas in and around objectives. Plus, you have a lot of great heavy and special wep options this edition if you're so inclined to put points into that.

>>53965461
I don't understand the question

>>53965526
I might be retarded, but where does it say that it can fire all heavy weapons (not just the turret ones) without penalty when moving?

Any recommendations on how to weight dice properly and not be caught? I'm trying to win a sort of tournament. Most 500 pt casual games won wins a dark imp box set this coming weekend.

Are corsairs any good?

>>53965795
Intercessors are great imo, being able to unload a fuck ton of shots out of deep strike has been fantastic.

>>53965784
Never got into the AoS beyond thinking how to canibalise models for 40k (Sigmarines are problem, their heads are awesome for cultist-ish characters and their legs could probably be used for truescaling-primarising the regular marines, but I hate the bodies)

>>53965813
You could try gitting gud

Does anyone have the Manta rules? I looked in the MEG, but all the info is gone from the file, it's just the unit frame and FOC slot displayed.

>>53965813
Yeah, I can help you, but you need to buy a box set of tools that retails at $250.00 MSRP + Shipping.

>>53965813
Great bait, but still defenestrate yourself.

>>53965817
Dead army. Abandon hope. They're useless now.

which is a shame, because their rules and brace of pistols are so cool.

>>53965817
They might be if they existed in any appreciable amount. Their squads are ok. Can get all shardcarbines, which is nice.

>>53965848
>>53965843
I was thinking of running them in a biker ynnari gang with reavers, lancers, and skyweavers.

>>53965759
I like to take 3 sniper squads with camo. Plop them into cover and enjoy. If theres a mid field objective camp on that.

>>53965843
Might get a list later.

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> builder is down
Well, fuck.

Why is it that renegades can take baneblades while Genestealer's can't?

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>>53965830
Sure.

>>53965863
Those cost you a bit more but yeah.

>>53965863
Could work. They have the jump pack squad. Also Wasp Walkers.

>>53965882
genestealers are NPC Xenos Race :^)

What does the <regiment> Key word mean?

>>53965689
That would be cool. As I have a nurgle and slaanesh dreadnoughts under construction.

>>53965863
The bikes are maby the one good unit. A good way to get alternate special weapons on bikes.

>>53965869
God I hope so. I put a ton of money into a converted corsair army.

>>53965848
>>53965848
I don't understand this.

>shard carbines: 0 points
>shrunken catapults: 0 points.
>assault 3 lasguns: 7 fucking points
>brace of pistols: 2 points
A lasblaster corsair is 18 points

and they're one of the only units in the game that pay for their normal seargents.

>>53965882
Genestealers can as an allied detachment.

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What's a good way to know how much you should value your army at when selling it?

should I max out hellblasters or intercessor

>>53965918
Intercessor.

>>53965911
Who knows. I know I want to dump all my Tau and imperial guard for a song due to shit conversions and bad painting decisions.

Anybody else notice that the T'au Tiger Shark AX-1-0 can't ever fire its Heavy Rail Cannons? They're Macro and it's a flyer with a minimum move distance (and no hover), and it doesn't have Titanic.

>>53965526
Why can't GW and FW just be consistent with each other for once?

>>53965903
I missed Cloud Dancers. So three units I think? You can run them in a general Eldar list still.

Do we know how Primaris Marines fit into Chapter Organisation yet?

I need to know how to paint their trims accurately.

>>53965948
The neat thing is they don't have any special rules to lose for joining a ynnari list.

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>>53965207
Any good stories or parts of stories about custodians kicking ass?

>>53965911
Get the retail price of your army new. If everything is assembled and painted at display quality, can sell for above retail. If it's tabletop to high quality, near to full retail. If it's just unprimed, primed or painted poorly, significant discount. If you fucked up the models by gluing like a retard, just give them away and kill yourself.

>>53965952
Fuck you fag. We're discussing npcs here.

Stop being autistic about paint schemes and make up a chapter organization, since each chapter is probably going to have a different attitude to their little brother chads.

>>53965899
It means YOU can use something like Regiment T'au Guevesta or however it is spelt. Then use them with T'au.

>>53965960
the Blood Games short story was cool imho.
Haven't read it myself, but Master Of Mankind should also have some neat depictions of them, despite how shit the book is otherwise.

>>53965983
Baiting this hard eh

>>53965944
Coax benefits only are with Conquerer or Vanquisher guns, which normal guard get too. Not sure where they're getting the all Heavy though. It's still just turret weapons.

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>>53965970
Anon, I play Ultramarines. Mostly 4th.

Holy shit, I just looked at the "updates" for corsairs. What utter lazy dogshit typoridden garbage

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I want to finally actually own an army and shit. Been thinking about it for weeks and think I can finally do it. Decided on one of four factions and planned an army for each in the style of them that I want to play.

If anyone wouldn't mind giving me a quick opinion, which of pic related would be the best choice after taking into account difficulty of finding/assembling/painting, price, effectiveness, and most fun?

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Chaplain dreadnoughts are HQ choices now, everyone else go home it's dreadnoughts now and forever for me

>>53965960
Same as GK stories, power wank of imposible levels. They use GK blood instead of Sororitas.

I refuse existance of Goldboys on table top, they were fuking guardians of Emperor and now they run free. You cant GUARD him if you 20k yearls light away. REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Any alternatives for making army lists now?

Battlescribe is dogshit.

>>53966006
One positive thing: Biker Troops are back to fill out a brigade or battalion detachment!

Have Tyranid bio-titan stats been leaked yet?

>>53966053
PEN
AND
PAPER

>>53965788
>the Crimson Shins

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>>53966053
Excel

>>53966077
This isn't 1854 anymore.

>>53966087
PEN AND PAPER
E
N

A
N
D

P
A
P
E
R

>>53965369
>List Builder
http://webapplications-webroster.rhcloud.com/rc/web/#!/rosterCreator#%2FrosterCreator

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>>53966053
>>53966053

>>53966097
DONT MAKE ME CRY

>>53966047
Hell yah! You mixing types or sticking with one type?
Myself I am a Boxnought only with space magic blood angel HQ dreads.

>>53966006

Very lazy indeed, but they look good. MSU skyreavers with Shardcarbines and Blasters running in an Ynarri army with splinter cannon cloud dancers is how I'm gonna run em. Probably with blaster scourges for tough stuff

>>53966097
Hahahahah.

Anon, it's kill. Give it up.

>>53965941
The whole book is a mess of typos like this. Fucking BTFO xenos lovers and people who bought forge world models... apparently

>>53966115
All of them, at once.
Actually ironclads are obsolete now that seige dreadnoughts are the same stat line and weapons but have guns instead of a second useless arm and are less points

>>53966042
Grey Knights would probably be the easiest one to assemble and paint, and they're cheap in monies too.

I want you to do the Drukhari one though, because the idea of a massive tide of razorwings swooping upon the enemy at the fore of a formation of skimmers ridden by wyches is awesome.

>>53966056
you mean the fast attack cloud dancers? because the sky reavers are just jump pack duders

>>53966053
It's working fine for me

Maybe I just happen to be writing lists for the armies that have good, working files at the moment though

>>53965788
Closest GW paint is probably khorne red, I reckon.

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>>53966061

>he doesnt buy the entire range of models, some in duplicates and triplicates, when he gets into an army

Dont you want all the options possible?

>>53966159
Sounds good. I would want a Leviathan myself becuse if the fire power it could put out. But I must stay true to my boxs.

>>53965654

Whilst blood Angels do have that handy +2 move on boxy dreads, I really wouldn't run them alone in a dread list.

I currently have a 2000 point vanilla marines dread list, but I'm thinking of allying in blood Angels for the 3000 version.

Any advice for building mechanicus in 8e?

>>53966221
FAQ'd.

Man, can someone make a youtube video about how to choose an army?

>>53966104
looks gross

>>53966181
Oh, you're right. Still though, they're fast as fuck troops.

>>53966110
>>53966121
Oh fuck, I literally made the list at the top on Wednesday! Sad to see it go.

mirror when?

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God damnit this thing is just straight up a better, cheaper broadside isn't it.

>>53966056
There are no biker troops

>>53966135
It's like they just ran out of proofreaders and decided: 'Fuck it it's probably all correct, publish it!'

>>53966221
>Claims RAW
>Hasnt read the FAQ

wu tang fags have no dignity.

>>53965983
>>53966221
So can I use an artillery piece, give it the Death Korps Key word so i can field it in a Deathkorps list?

>>53966197
If you had the site open before it got taken down, you can still use it. But if you reload, you won't be able to use it.

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>>53966042

I'm biased but I'd say drukhari. It's a shame pic related doesn't exist anymore though. What are your intentions for all the birds? They're expensive models anon.

>>53966006
HA Fuck you eldar waacfag!

>>53966281
I meant Battlescribe

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>>53966221
The fact that they had to FAQ so that retards like you couldn't argue for that is a crying shame you dynamite autist.

>>53966264
>called bomber
>no bombs

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>>53966279
Only if its on the list for Death Korps.

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>>53965771
>>53965808
>>53965771
How does this look?

I considered putting a multi-melta on the razorback squad, with that and the twin heavy flamers, it seems like a good unit to keep things at a distance.

>>53965813
Use GW pipped dice

https://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/That%27s_How_I_Roll_-_A_Scientific_Analysis_of_Dice

>>53966289
Yup, all eldar players only collected them because they were powerful at the time, not because they actually like the appearance and lore

You massive fucktard

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Sentinel power lifters, good now? I own one for display never fielded it. 45 points for this. Opinions?

>>53966264
where else do i get the other forgeworld tau units?

>>53966342
Fair chance you can get off a first turn charge, and tie up some units so yeah. Just don't expect miracles.

>>53966342
How the shit is the equivalent of a forklift more powerful than most dedicated combat weapons?

I always just figured they were for display pieces, to make a board look cool.

>>53965813
You could try killing yourself you cheating baitposting scum

RIP http://webapplications-webroster.rhcloud.com/rc/web/#!/rosterCreator#%2FrosterCreator

Email [email protected] and get them to hire this man.

It's been 100 times better than this piece of shit
https://www.warhammer-community.com/warscroll-builder/


Let's start a campaign to get this guy hired! /tg/ gets shit done!

>>53966342
Its ok I guess, it has one role and that is to move up, charge and tie shit up until it dies.

>>53966349
in the epub, in the OP. download calibre to read it/convert it (converting epub to PDF takes many hours).

here's the tldr:

riptides are okay, commander alt suits rock, named commanders rock, hazard suits super fucking overpriced, AX10 literally unplayable, other fliers are alright.

>>53966359
The Emperor provides mircales anon. The Emperor's holy power lifter is merely his tool to which he may conduct them.

>>53966374
Hydraulic pistons are quite powerful. But same reason as to why horses are better than Space Marines in CC.

>>53966374
Its a massive hydraulic claw in a military platform. More than a forklift.

I think they may work as Distraction Carnifexes almost.

>>53966310
>>53966279
>>53966273
>>53966247
>I spend the entire post explaining RAI, knowing that it's the only thing that has ever mattered, and then poke fun at how it's written in the rulebook because of how unclear it is
>fkuck you fagot powergamer trying to break the game diddnt you read the fuxking faq

>>53966380

Looks like it could hurt shooty heavy infantry pretty solidly. Anything with 2-3 wounds, low model count and no assault AP.

>>53966264
Its not better

Hammerhead cant take ATS, and its not a BATTLESUIT so no drone synergy.

Is it a good alternative? Yes. But it's not strictly better.

How many points is it?

>>53966042
Flesh tearers would be cheapest and there arent enough blood angels, easy to expand on too with more frequent model updates

Are the FW epubs fucked up for anyone else?

>>53966322
smart missiles are kind of a waste on hammerheads, since they cant take ATS to give them any AP

Did you buy a devilfish for Longstrike...?

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>>53966404
>How unclear it is

If you didn't suffer from the same kind of chromosome deficiency as WAACfags do you would be able to infer that the RAI and RAW are the same

Is something fucked up with the ForgeWorld customer services number?

It says they're closed even though they SHOULD be open going by the hours listed on their site, and as far as I can tell it's not a holiday in the UK.

>>53966378
GW was in the right here though. The guy was getting money and using official art and assets as well as all the point values

>>53966378
Fuck off.

>>53966459
Most CS lines close at 6pm

>>53966378

Oh shit.
There was no downloadable version of it, was there?

>>53966378
Fuck off, we're not helping you get a job.
Don't make money off of GW assests next time you mong

>>53966459
It's Friday, they've probably knocked off and gone down the pub.

>>53966479
this

>>53966468
No they weren't. They waited 3 years too late to use that defence

>>53966483
Nope. People are asking for him to release the source code minus the rules.
.

>>53966468
Yes GWs is required to defend their IP and all that fine jazz, but the real question is, when's the fucking mirror coming online?

>>53966171
>>53966288

I figured it would probably be between DEldar and SoB, and probably best to leave sisters for whenever they maybe get plastics, despite how much I want them now.

That collection in that picture there is near perfect. A shame, I was looking for something similiar earlier.

I thought the birds would add some much needed meat to the army, being high speed high wound cheap flying assault beasts that would be a pain to deal with and could get wherever I want them to be annoying at very quickly. The entire army is either on a transport or flying 12"+, so when I wanted something tougher to soak fire I figured 7pts for 4 wounds on 12" flying movement with 2.3 effective melee attacks per model should do it. And they're pretty cool.

Plus someone has to use the +leadership drug, might as well put it where it's most helpful.

>>53966404
>>I spend the entire post explaining RAI, knowing that it's the only thing that has ever mattered, and then poke fun at how it's written in the rulebook because of how unclear it is
It was never unclear, anyone with half a brain knew GW didn't intend for wu tang bullshit, as shown by the FAQ.
You're wrong you autist, get over it.

>>53966482
Ah, what a shitty customer service system.

>>53966450
Closing the program automatically? That's what's happening to me with Kobo on PC

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Is this good? 40 points. You can take 3 in a fortification detachment too.

Anyone know how to solve the problem with Games Workshop/Forge World's emails not being sent? Can't reset my password on their sites because I'm getting no fucking emails from them.

>>53966517

Birds can't take drugs anon (unless you mean the beast master)! They'll be a nuisance for sure. List looks good though hope you enjoy using it

>>53966454
From the FAQ:

>Q: If I create an Astra Militarum Regiment of my own and name them, for example, the ‘Emperor’s Finest’, and I then also create an Adeptus Astartes Chapter of my own choosing, and also call them the ‘Emperor’s Finest’, do the abilities that work on the <Regiment> and/or <Chapter> keywords now work on both the Astra Militarum and Adeptus Astartes units?

>A: No.
>The intent of naming Regiments, Chapters, etc. of your own creation is to personalise your collections and not to enable players to circumvent the restrictions on what abilities affect what units. It is also not intended to circumvent the restrictions on which units are able to be included in the same Detachment.

Notice how the devs say the rules are "intended" to be used this way, and "intended" to let you do this and that, instead of explaining their wording and stating "no, actually, if you read them carefully they actually say this other thing". They're openly acknowledging that RAW and RAI are different. It reminds me a few years ago in fantasy where the ogre army book let them take mage armour I think, and in the FAQ instead of patching the rules to not let them take mage armour, Jervis just called the people who took mage armour bad people. He never said you weren't allowed, he literally said it wasn't in the spirit of the rule. GW can't write rules to save their life.

>>53966569
FW xenos and AM work in readium for me

You know what I haven't dusted off in a while?
Chapter Master.
Fuck that was a good ride while it lasted.

>>53966508
>because GW just now noticed it instead of 3 years ago, they are wrong!

Someone brought it to their attention on Facebook so naturally they'll actually do something when they found out about it

>>53966508
>They waited 3 years too late to use that defence
You wot m8?
They have the legal right to tell you to cease and desist as soon as they learn of the violation.
Unless your implying the statue of limitations is up, which is
A) wrong, U.S. Code title 35 part III chapter 29 § 286 clearly states "no recovery shall be had for any infringement committed more than six years prior to the filing of the complaint or counterclaim for infringement in the action." There is only a limit on the period you can collect damages in, you can tell them to stop at anytime.
B) that thing hasn't been around 9 years so I'm honestly interested to learn why you think it's 3 years too late for them to call for him to cease and desist.
Really anon, why on earth do you think they don't have that legal right?

>>53966578
Seems alright, seeing as you want to bait the enemy so much as tau now it gives a good target for them to go after

>>53966601
need the screencap of the guy that posted it on facebook for reasons

>>53966590
kys

Why do yous anons hate Battlescribe? It works pretty well for me.

>>53965654
Thought my friend who brought me back in in time for 8th ed was joking with the dreads. Jeez

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>>53966468
>>53966479
>>53966500
No one's disputing they were in the right to close it down, surprised it didn't happen sooner.

But fuck, it was a fantastic tool. I want it to live on officially. Why be so spiteful?
No I'm not Reepy. I'm the faggot who painted the Grey Space Wolf Johnny and instigated the collage for the WIP image.

https://pastebin.com/q8zcRzi4

>>53965795
Bump for more responses?

>>53965207
>http://webapplications-webroster.rhcloud.com/rc/web/#!/rosterCreator#%2FrosterCreator
GW strikes again?

>>53966650
LOL I POSTED IT AGAIN I AM SO FUNNY

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>>53966590
>I'm literally too autistic to understand the meaning behind words if it isn't spelled out for me in pictures and crayon

Okay man whatever, as long as you agree that you are a bad person who takes mage armor on ogres.

>>53966603
Wait, scratch that, it's title 17 chapter 5 that deals with copyright infringement, that was patent law.
but, as outlined in § 504
"
The copyright owner is entitled to recover the actual damages suffered by him or her as a result of the infringement, and any profits of the infringer that are attributable to the infringement and are not taken into account in computing the actual damages"
So long as it is "commenced within 5 years after the cause of action arose." in accordance with § 507. Seeing as the action continues up until today GW has until 2022 to press criminal charges, so no anon, it is not 3 years to late.

>>53966603
You have to defend asap. They knew about it long before, they only attacked now because it was making them look bad.

>>53966669
Don't feed him.

>>53966325
Not gr8 m8

>>53966569
I'm using SumptraPDF and it's not rendering properly. All of the text is placed outside the page in a list.

>>53966650
Wow it all makes sense. I'll go tell my boyfriend it is for the Emperor next time he asks me to suck his dick. Then maybe make him suck mine instead before reeming his tight Elder butt hole with my Emperor's Blessed Cock, while dressed like a DKOK.

>>53966688
That's wrong though. You have to prove that they knew about it before this.
Unless you have some documents that prove GW's knowledge (which if you do, please present them) you'd get laughed out of court.

Any Ork stuff from IA?

>>53966647
>It was however completely non-profit
Apart from the patreon, dipshit.
>the community was saddened
>all the community asks
You don't speak for "the community" just because you've decided you do.

So again, fuck off. Not your personal army.

>>53966707
The ebooks are all fucked. You're gonna have to wait for someone to magically convert them somehow.

>>53966728
Just fucking download it in OP retard

>>53965259
sounds like a killer, just need to get your points back

>>53966688
>They knew about it long before, they only attacked now because it was making them look bad.
And you know this how?
Prove it anon, or fuck off, we aren't your personal army faggot.

>>53966418
What site are you use?

>>53966728
Seems everything that was in the Ork FW book (Kastor Novum) made it. Zhadsnark, Buzzgob, Grot Tanks, Grot Mega-Tank, Squiggoth, Meka-Dread, Lifta Wagon, Big Trakk, Battlewagon w/ Supa Kannon, Kill Tank, WarKopta, Kustom Stompa, Gargantuan Squiggoth.


>>53966744
Fug

>>53965207
Where are Squats?

Anyone got any good 40k hfy stuff? I've become addicted to humans being resilient.

>>53966733
Well done, you're default mode is set to "cunt".

12,000 reported daily users is a feasible statistic he wouldn't pull to prop up his e-peen. You can definitely say that counts as a community who want this tool.

>>53966824
40k is the utter antithesis of HFY

>>53966688
>>53966722
Also, chapter 5 § 507 clearly states that the claim must be filed "three years after the claim accrued."
Now, the claim accrued means, of course, when the actual injury to the plaintiff, GW, took place, which is from the very moment that their assets were used without their permission up until the very end of their illegal use, which would be today.
This is an ongoing violation, and thus it is not "too late."

Seriously anon, I'm bummed the list builder got taken down too, but don't talk out of your ass about it.

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>>53966842
Humans is master race in warhammer

Looking for awesome TS alternative color schemes. Love both the blue and the pre-heresy schemes but want something rad and different, maybe something fitting for non-TS CSM as well?

>>53966888
Space Marines aren't human anymore.

Just got back from my first game of 8th, it was intense.

50 power level of my Tau vs enemy Necrons. I had 48 power, he had 52 so I went first which really helped. Also when we added up the points I was only 100 points ahead of him, so it was really balanced.

Managed to win during my last turn, using my last command point to make his necron lord reroll his armour save which allowed me to claim the objective.

>>53966911
Transhuman. Posthumans are beings who were never humans to begin with, like the Primarchs.

Any reason why Shadow Captain Korvydae isnt in the Imperial Armor books?

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>>53966903
Its post-humans
>>53966911
Aaand? Galaxy belongs to mankind and SM just help at this point

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>>53966920

Every thread anon? Stop this bait.

>>53966899
This blog has some ripped from the supplement/

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/1440

Warp talons went from absolutely useless to accomplishing a niche battlefield role. I almost don't know what to do with myself...

>>53966920
> using my last command point to make his necron lord reroll his armour save
Nigga

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>>53966888
>Tfw we will never get cool looking Chaos models like this that don't look retarded and are still completely in control of themselves and use chaos as a tool rather than succumbing to it and having a million spikes and angry faces all over their bodies

>tzeentch can't twist fate and force your opponent to reroll a single dice

>>53966601
>Someone brought it to their attention on Facebook
Fucking normies have to ruin everything.

>>53966969
In the codex maybe.

>>53966920
Why do people copy pasta
What's the point

missed phil kelly's tyranids, how did they do?

>>53966211
Anything on the Hierodule? Just got one for cheap and I'm interested in putting it to use.

>>53966956
Like you need chaos version of marines when you can make chaos version of marines

>>53966956
>Chaos
>Control of themselves

Look at him and laugh

Does ForgeWorld send out their shit ON the day of release, or before?

>>53966996
Just run the barbed one, scythed is still worse

>>53966616
I'll meet up and assist you with your reasons.

>>53966451
the devilfish are above the units that go into them.

one devilfish takes cadre fireblade, strike team, pathfinder team with pulse accel drone etc.

Smart missiles are not a waste when they're hitting on 2+ without marker lights, and the extra range is worth it. the trade off compared to a battle suit is the speed and toughness of a hammerhead. at least from what i think having that ability to strike hidden units on a point is very nice.

Could you guys redpill me on the Alpha Legion?

Are they closet loyalists?

True heretics?

>>53966999
>what is Archaon in Fantasy
>what is Abbadon who refuses to pledge himself to a god and merely uses their power

Am I reading Ratlings right that they can MoveShootMove a full 12"? Or can they just use their move AFTER they shoot?

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>>53966842
Not really. Humanity scraping by in a universe where every other sentient being wants to kill them is definitely impressive.

Normal human guardsmen fighting against horrible 10 foot tall tentacle marines is impressive even if they loose.

Guardsmen in general are pretty impressive. Not so much in the sense that they win but the sense that they fight in the first place.

>>53967024
Renegades, regardless.

>>53966956
>>53966998 is right - you could just buy regular marines and make them slightly spiky instead of going full edge. I might do the same later on for my regular CSM because I'm just tired of these shit-tier ancient sculpts.

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>Reading Xeno's FW book
>Kill Tank Giga Shoota: 6D6 S6 AP-2 D1
>Kill Tank has a BS of 4+ if it has 14-24 wounds left

>Grot Tanks have a BS of 4+
>A squad of four can have 5 KMBs hitting on 4+

>Chinork WarKoptas can only carry 10 models but have the "Scoutin' Ahead" rule letting it come in from reserves 9" away from any enemy unit.

>>53967024
My head canon is that, because chaos corruption is a literal thing in the 40k universe, after 10,000 years of playing at it they've probably flown too close to the sun and fallen.

>>53966590
>>A: No.
It says no you autist.
KYS

>>53966342

How well could could this fight a broodlord?

>>53967024
They are renegade heretik loyalists

>>53966929
Fuckign sanctioned mutants thats what they are. 3 lungs? 2 hearts? dafaq human is this?
Soon the galaxy will be purged from mon-keigh and your corpse of a leader.

>>53965343
Looking at what you're trying to do with a good roll at the beginning you could really destroy your opponent's original plans with the deceiver.

The main problem is the c'tan (they're squishy) although you may get lucky and do something nasty with their powers.Character killing with time's arrow would be near impossible due to you lacking ways of reducing their wounds without outright killing them.So you're stuck with the two other powers. Overall the main problem is character killing ability, not a bad problem to have. I can't imagine what you need the res orb for though aside from just a point filler.

>>53967007
Unfortunately the one I got is Scythed. I play in a casual meta though, so I'm not worried. Mostly just planning on using it against my Grey Knight friend who brings Robute Guilliman all the time.

>>53967029
Implying Fantasy exists?
Implying Abbadon isn't just a tool

>>53967024
Some are truly working for chaos, some are truly working for the empire. Nobody knows who is who, because everyone is aware that the legion has fractured loyalties, and everyone plays their true motives close to the chest.

>>53966661
Yes. They issued a C&D based on claims of IP.

GW will also be releasing their own 40k builder soon

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>>53966996

Lookin to get back into 40k with the models I have from ages back.
Terrible list or passable?


++ (Space Marines) [1000 Pts, 23 Pwr] ++

+ HQ +

Captain [5 Pwr, 85 Pts]: Plasma Pistol, Power Sword

+ Troops +

Tactical Squad [9 Pwr, 141 Pts]: 4x Additional Marines, Plasma Gun, Plasma Pistol, Power Sword

Tactical Squad [175 Pts, 9 Pwr]: 5x Additional Marines, Plasma Cannon, Plasma Gun, Plasma Pistol, Power Sword

+ Elites +

Dreadnought [139 Pts]: Dreadnought CCW, Multi-Melta, Stormbolter

+ Heavy Support +

Devastator Squad [158 Pts]: Additional Marines , Armorium Cherub, 3x Missile Launcher

Devastator Squad [158 Pts]: Additional Marines, Armorium Cherub, 3x Lascannon

+ Dedicated Transport +

Rhino [72 Pts]: Stormbolter

Rhino [72 Pts]: Stormbolter

++ Total: [1000 Pts, 23 Pwr] ++

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Just finished listening to the carrion throne. Great book. MASSIVE props to the anon who dropped a link to the files. Got me through 2 days of work.

>The red angel was completely right,
praise the emperor, fuck the high lords.


Any other audiobook suggestions (with a link preferably) would be greatly appreciated. Got another 8 hour shift coming up at 4:00 today and I could use something to get through it.

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>>53967100

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>>53967086
>said xeno-sxum who purged himself
Yeah. And eldars dont suck from everyone. How about cup of infiltrated rage?
Eldars suck cause they dont have rotor cannons

>>53966661
Thats very disappointing, it was a good list maker and geedubs doesn't have any official tools.

>>53967004
????

For space wolves, grey hunters can take a special weapon for every 5 models in the unit.
Does the wolf guard count now?

>>53967111
Good shit right?

>>53967037
The essence of HFY is that humanity has enough qualities to stand head and shoulders with or above all other presented species. In 40k it's repeatedly stated both in the fluff and tabletop that a human being is an utterly pathetic creature as compared to literally every single other species in the galaxy. And humanity only survives through the work of a select few super-beings instead of as a collective whole.

It has also been made clear that humanity is ultimately doomed no matter what they do - thus they are a failure as a species.

>>53967119
What is that? One of your subpar technologies that is likely to kill the user as it is to kill the target? Oh, if only you actually knew how your own weapons work, maybe you could of fixed them.

>tfw no new CSM models until 10th edition

Why even play chaos?

>>53966578
>those stats

I guess use terrain to your advantage, use it to hold a corner and buff or something? It looks p. easy to shoot off the table

>>53967147
The Pack Leader does. A Battle leader won't because it's not part of the unit.

>>53966313
It's call a Heavy Bombardment Gunship. Not a Bomber. Bombardment ≠ Bomber.

>>53966427
The Hammerhead with 2 high yields and 2 smart missiles is 283

A Broadside with the same is 202

So for 81 points you get

M WS BS S T W A Sv
+7 -2 +1 +1 +2 +7 +0 -1

It looks like a Pretty fair trade off to me for how much tanker the Hammerhead is the Broadside. Also it has fly so it can Fall back and Still shoot.

So I would call it even if not a bit better for the Hammerhead just based oh how much harder it is to remove and how it can repossession better

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Vanguard detachment

Chaplain dreadnought = 204
2 fists, 2 stormbolters
techmarine = 98
servo harness, boltgun

Dreadnought = 133
+Assault cannon, fist, heavy flamer
Dreadnought = 154
+Multi-melta, fist, stormbolter
Dreadnought = 136
+2 twin autocannons
Venerable dreadnought = 177
+plasma cannon, fist, heavy flamer
Relic Deredeo dreadnought = 232
+twin heavy bolter, autocannon battery, aiolos missile battery

Relic Leviathan dreadnought = 353
2 claws, 2 melta guns, 2 heavy flamers

1487 out of 1500

March of the ancients, baby

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>>53967182
> that is likely to kill the user as it is to kill the target
Stupid elf, plasma cant kill shooter now if he dont want

>>53967147
the wolf guard pack leader is a model in the unit, so yeah. (friendly reminder that they are also only 14 points like any other model in the unit, unless they have terminator armor.)

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>Even the Leviathan is a Dreadlet now.

>>53966818
In Age of Sigmar

>>53967259
at least it didn't skip leg day

>>53967193
>>53967252
Beautiful.
This and the new combiweapons makes me happy. Being able to just unpack my old army and get right back to it is great.

>>53966378
>Goes fine for years
>That stupid bitch Atia makes a post about it
>Gets taken down within a day

Really makes me think.

>>53965329
I dunno, I kinda missed this meme.

>>53967111
This is how you do Custodes right. Also suprisingly nice suspense, I was really unsure if it was chaos, stealers, or what.

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>>53967171
False. The essence of HFY is what it says on the tin. Humanity Fuck Yeah. If what makes you say Fuck Yeah is the resilience of humanity than it is HFY

And yeah. Maybe humans are pathetic but they're still around. They're still kicking and yeah, they're doomed but they're still fighting. They haven't given up. Every day they get up, knowing that they could starve or they could get ripped apart by something bigger and stronger than them but they still get up.

They grab their shitty flashlight rifle, go to the front line and stand toe to toe with literal gods. And they've been doing this for 10,000 years. If that doesn't make you say "Fuck Yeah" than I don't know what will.

>>53967171
Uh, no. In the fluff the Human Form is exalted. Not just the physical form (which is taken to extremes with the Space Marine), but the spiritual form too. The soul of Humanity is what allows humans to survive despite constant encroachments by devil or xeno.

>>53967273
>>53967259
There really isn't that much difference between the new dread and the Leviathan's legs though m8y

>>53967183

Cucks who become slaves to a single god get models, while those who reject slavery to Chaos and use it purely as a tool don't.

>>53967306
As someone who enjoyed taking combi-melta and combi-plasma, the buff to combi weapons makes me moister than an oyster.

>>53966956
>are still completely in control of themselves and use chaos as a tool rather than succumbing to it

t. I want all the benefits of Chaos but none of the downsides because Mary Sue's empowered by Best Stepdad are AWESOME!2!!!1!!!

>>53967102
You dont need swords and pistols in tactical squad. Its for melee

>>53967202
Yeah I would say it's mostly a fair trade, but I would still give the edge to a Broadside because its missiles are higher AP (with an ATS) and because its a BATTLESUIT drones can absorb heavy weapons (and now battlesuits can be healed, while vehicles cant)

Also have a much smaller body, making it easier to be out of LOS.

To me it seems like the missile hammerhead is just asking for heavy weapons to blast it apart while a broadside can safely turret with a couple of drones nearby.

So what are the highlights in the new FW AM index for a sisters army? I know we didn't get anything explicitly, but we can still take pretty much any vehicle added.

>>53967349
No, its called mark of chaos undivided and we had this at 3.5e. Not cult-legions must have their bonuses

>>53966956
Chaos marines are gaudy trash

>>53967327
the ankles are puny, the thigh plating is exposed, the feet look flimsy, the fist doesn't look like the fingertips can tough each other. Is the occupant in a recliner or something? The shoulder joint is exposed. It might be shorter but the Leviathan is built like godzilla

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>>53967327

From a complimentary angle, sure.

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>>53966418

>homebrewed chapter
>crappy scheme

its like clockwork

>>53967349
I like characters that defy odds and refuse to yield. They can get their shit kicked in nonstop but it makes for interesting stuff if you have guys who seek to dominate all around them and make them submit. Besides if anyone is Mary Sues it's Space Marines and Eldar

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>>53967259
Strong Fat is not a good look.

>>53965207
I'm assembling predator now, what should I run? 4 lass or 2 lass + 2hbolters?

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i'm still mad about this shit
gw goes full wysiwyg with it's kits this edition and fw goes full retard on top of breaking the promise that all models on sale will be playable

>>53967389
Can someone do a DOOD mirror version of this?

>>53967111
>carrion throne
Can you link for me? :)

>>53967399
yoba-guns from fw and name it Hellforged Predator

>>53967398
pleb taste

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>>53965404

Yeah, it's right up in their skull and even partially visible with a weirdboy.

The real question is if they have nipples.

Believe me when I say I've done a lot of research into the subject and conclusion that they only have one left nipple mainly used to clamp rings on.

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>>53967389
>that manlet dread in the background

>>53967399
Why not autocannon?

Are there any good youtube channels for batreps?

Specifically looking for Tau players and insights

>>53966211
what the fuck is macro type

>>53967306
I love new combis so much, Wolf Guard are amazing now.

>>53967398

Sumo with tiny ankles that'd snap in a stiff breeze.

Guys doing dread spam lists: Are you gonna get a Redemptor?

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>>53966626
>>53966684
>>53967063
I don't know why I keep pressing this.
I fully fucking acknowledge that 40K is not MTG. I know RAI trumps RAW every time. That's why we have these FAQs. I never fucking ran mage armour on ogres, that was an example.
I'm simply explaining that 8ed has badly written rules that don't explain themselves properly, and the devs have to step in and correct them. That's it. I don't think you are able to put space marines and orks in the same army, I never did, I just thought it was weird that the rules were vague on this before the faq, and that the faq uses very fluffy language to explain why you're not allowed.
Is it now heresy to say that 8ed has badly written rules? When in every other thread we've been poking fun at infinite celestines, BS 3 (not 3+) hierophants and tiger sharks not being able to fire their main gun. I can't tell if you're actual shills or if you've just bought into the best edition evaaar PR, I like the edition, but it's very rough at the minute and the rules are full of holes. RAI always trumps RAW, this is well known in 40K, I have never tried to push the opposite, read my goddamn posts. Nobody is actually going to make your hierophant hit only on 3s and not 3+s, but I didn't know it was now heresy to point out the typos.

And that ogre kingdoms FAQ was mocked right up until the end of fantasy. Pic related is still on the black library website.

>>53967460
Cant shoot if moved and not titanic

>>53967349
But the more focused chaos factions are actually more unique and powerful with a greater tie to their primarch and unique characters?

>>53967460
new destroyer rules. does more damage or hits if you're firing on big stuff

>>53967432
Orks don't have nipples. Any git knows that.

>>53967472
Is right
>>53967476
is an idiot

>>53967471

Wh...

Why does giving it a fist let it take armour?

>>53967357
Most of the people I have been playing have just been shooting the drones out from under the suits.

Also at what point have you had to many drones just being wounds for a broadside

The repair drones are game changer but you can still have your Broadside 1 shot by a Lazcannon or a Metla gun.

But the +1 T is a really big deal VS STR 5-6 guns which need 5+ to wound it and the broadside will get wounded on a 4+ or a 3+

As for it will pull in all the big guns both of these will pull in the big guns shots if they are your only ones in the army.

I think it comes down to what you want and need out of that slot.

>>53967488
but >>53967476
is right to
macro cannons deal double damage on TITANIC things
>>53967460
A model armed with a Macro weapon may not fire it if it has moved previously in the turn, unless the firing unit also has the TITANICkeyword. No Macro weapon may be used to make Overwatch attacks. When used against units with the TITANICor BUILDINGkeyword, the damage inflicted by a Macro weapon is doubled (this doubling takes place after any randomised damage has been rolled for)

>>53966818
in the digesting pools.

>>53967493
In 8th, characters could only buy Magic Armor if they could take at least 1 piece of armor in their normal equipment list, which the Iron Fist counted as.

Incidentally...
>Next edition of the Ogre Kingdoms army book.
Snigger.

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For the people who requested the Facebook post

>>53967629
Thats a paddlin

>>53967539
>Most of the people I have been playing have just been shooting the drones out from under the suits.
Keep them out of LOS. It's not hard to position your battlesuits on the edge of a wall and have the drones behind. Saviour Protocols is a very generous 3" range.

>The repair drones are game changer but you can still have your Broadside 1 shot by a Lazcannon or a Metla gun.
Assuming you have 2 drones nearby (which is a fair assumption) it would take 3 shots and a lucky shot

>But the +1 T is a really big deal VS STR 5-6 guns which need 5+ to wound it and the broadside will get wounded on a 4+ or a 3+
People aren't going to use S5/6 weapons on a tank, that's just idiotic. Your tanks will be exclusively shot by meltas and lascannons and their equivalents.
Higher toughness is certainly better but Broadsides are durable enough that your opponent will want to use heavy weapons on them and then your drones absorb the hits.

The Broadside has a 2+ save and can easily get into cover, so it has still has a 5+ save against AP4 weapons.

I think both are valid but I give the edge to the Broadside. It's similar damage output (arguably more because of ATS) and is harder to counter than a tank that needs to sit in the open.

I think our disagreement stems from your placement of drones. If you position them correctly then the BATTLESUIT keyword is extremely good.

>>53967629
Holy shit that response. That's hilarious. It feels like one of those meme jew reaction pictures.

So, tactical/rules question.

I have a ynnari army, with a unit of ynnari banshees and Jain Zar, within 6 inches of the banshees. Additionally, there is a third unit within 7 inches of the banshees.

During my opponent's shooting phase, they attack and kill the third unit. This triggers soulburst. I soulburst the banshees, and have them multicharge every unit within range. The charge roll is successful.

I move the banshees so they are within 1 inch of every unit I can get them within 1 inch of, while maintaining coherency.

Since it is my opponent's shooting phase, I believe they will be unable to shoot or charge with these units.

Is my understanding of all these rules interactions correct? And how useful do you think this is? Because on paper it seems like it would be really good, but I haven't had much practice.

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>>53967629
>it looks ace
>TO SUE

>>53967629
Come on! This is New Games Workshop™

>>53967629
>blocking out the name of someone who deserves a cyclonic warhead shoved up his ass

>>53967629
What a moron. I know you won't link his account, but at least tell me he's getting spammed for being a moron.

>>53966956
Convert normal marines.

>>53967690

The picture was in my recycling bin waiting for deletion. It is several days old atleast.

Does anybody have Crimson King audiobook? Pretty please?

>>53967024
Gullieman is Alpharius.

So what would chapters derived from traitor Primarchs be like? Some of them like Magnus would be easy to predict but some others are mostly influenced by their Primarch's upbringing

>World Eaters
They were only so rage filled because of Angron and the Butcher's Nails. What would they be like without him?

>Death Guard
Mortarion's influence made them all about poison and shit (literally)

And so on