And just like that, we have a new yardstick for bad flavor text.

>>53946629
Eh, it's more on-the-nose bland than bad.

My buddy will slot this into his Shadowborn Apostle EDH deck, no doubt.

Timmy cards get yawn-inducing expository flavortext because that's the level at which Timmy operates

>>53946629
The flavor text isn't really bad in and of itself, it's just bland and flavorless due to being pure exposition. It would be like getting a new Bolas card with
>Nicol Bolas is the last surviving elder dragon from Dominaria, and one of the oldest planeswalkers to ever exist. He manipulates planes across the multiverse to his own ends.
It's just descriptive, which is boring. Not bad, just boring.

>>53946629
Who were the first two? Wasn't one of them griselb&?

>>53946857
The other was Kothophed.

>>53946770
It's worse than that. The flavor text wanks it to Liliana when we'd like to know more about the demon.

>>53946629
>But, anon,how else are players gonna learn about out superdupermegacool plot that we've worked so hard on?

>>53946770
>>53946669
Are you implying that being really, really bland and boring isn't enough to make it qualify as being bad?

What does it even mean that it's not bad, to you? That it didn't even try to be good? Because not trying to be good, and succeeding, still means you're shit, and this flavor text is super, super fucking uninteresting and I can't see how that doesn't mean "bad" by any definition.

>WOTC makes a card that is almost as good as Griselbrand without completely breaking it

>adds flavor text that tells newer players about Liliana's intentions on Amonkhet, something that hasn't been talked about in any card

now the entirety of the magic community is complaining about "muh flavor text" when they just got a repeatable tutor effect on a beefcake

>>53948501
the thing is that no one gives a shit about liliana's intentions on amonkhet, and they will give even less of a shit about 2 years from now. flavor text should more or less be timeless. having read that flavor text, i have no idea who the fuck razaleth is, nor have i been made feel anything relevant to him, like fear, respect or admiration. it's just a big clump of text that says nothing relevant to the creature itself, except that he's a demon

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We've actually been getting stuff like this for a while. Somebody on the team is the most boring person alive, yet they keep giving them work.

We Yugioh now

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>>53946629
Post other bad flavortext

>>53948966
that's only 1 line and is actually related to thing it depicts

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>>53948764
Flavor text isn't easy.

Could you write better text for that card?

>>53949495
"Meow."
—Watchers of the Dead

>>53949495
>Could you write better text for that card?

No but that's why it isn't my job and I am not being paid to do so.

>>53949495
>Loyal beyond death

>In life they guard the dream lands, in death the halls of rebirth

>Corner Report"Died of natural causes, cat scratch fever"

>>53948501
>WOTC makes a card that is almost as good as Griselbrand without completely breaking it
That's the problem

>>53949495
"The dead rest easy, knowing their departure to the underworld is guarded."

>>53948764
>>53949495
Probably not, but I'll give it a go

>Able to peer through the darkest of catacombs. These silent watchers stand ever vigilant to ensure that none escape their final reward.

>>53946629
This reads like something from YGO

>>53949495
"When a cat stares at nothing - it's not nothing that it sees."

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>>53949418
Older was better.

>>53949813
Those are night and day.

>>53948764
>>53949495
"They guard against both those that would enter and leave without permission"

Or something like that.

>>53950056
B-But goblins are supposed to be silly! Zip, bang, paf! Boum!

>>53949495

People have given you plenty of examples, but it's not hard to write better text for it. Because anything that isn't a bland, dry definition of what their job is would be better.

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Why is there no asian guys in Amonkhet? They're not going the same way as Innistrad since the focus is already on brown people and that's all that matter for the twitter fatties?

>>53950691
I want to complain to WotC about not having enough Asians, as a joke, but I'm afraid they'd actually start shoe-horning them in.

>>53946721
Stop this "Timmy is dumb" meme

>>53950446
Honestly I think that this flavor text is worse than text that is amusingly bad. When something is actively bad it usually means that someone at least tried.

The person that wrote the flavor text for that awful Sorin vindicate card was at least trying to be funny. Whoever did this wasn't trying at all.

>>53949495
Easy.
"One for those who would enter. One for those who would leave."

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>>53950870
That's some good shit, man.

>>53950691
To people in the states, there are only two races.

>>53950922
Boston Marathon and Chicago Marathon?

>>53946890
EVERYONE wanks it to Liliana

>>53948501
>almost as good as Griselbrand
That's a good joke

>>53946721
A tutor-on-a-stick is more Johnny than Timmy.

>>53950446
>Bad and boring just makes something forgettable and easy to ignore.
So you're saying it's bad in a way that's not novel?
I can accept that and I agree. This is unexceptionally bad.

But the original comments stated that it wasn't actually bad at all, which I could not understand and did not agree with.

>>53950804
This. Might be fun but they're way too dense.

>>53950960
>Jace likes wanks, especially wanks to Liliana Vess, the symbol of MTG's fanservice.

>>53948044

It's not even really really bland and boring. It's just bland. I'm informed and it conveys some characterization. Definitely on the long-winded side but not bad.

>>53949813

No, this flavortext is crap. I hate this direction for Goblin leaders.

>>53951197
I'd rather have a lot of them be and act different than just a mindless dronelike personality no matter the plane.

>>53946629
"You understand the power of death, Liliana, but you still value life. That is why you are weak."

See, I just fixed it.

>>53946629
How does he feel about collars, the symbol of avacyn's church?

>>53951197
Fuck off, at least one goblin in the entire goddamned multiverse gets to be a battle-hardened veteran with the soul of a warrior, fuck your lolsorandumb bullshit.

>>53951315
>not using the TSP Ancient Grudge

>>53948501
>almost as good as griselbrand
Griselbrand is a t1 win if you play legacy
>ritual, entomb, shallow grave, griselbrand
>swing, pay 21 life
>lotus petal, ritual, ritual, ????, tendrils of agony

>>53950691

We had Khans 2 years ago.

>>53951315
>>53951141
I wonder if therell be an Unstable card referencing this flavor text.

>>53951419
You forgot Children of the Kolis (or whatever it is) to gain 21, draw more, and make them discard their hand before Tendrils. :^)

The Gatewatch hates baddies, especially Bolas, the pushed Super-Villain of MTG.

>>53951449
Children of Korlis
I swear I used to have one
But can they SSG into runeflare trap?

>>53951587
>playing SSG in Legacy
Yeah, no.

>>53950922
There aren't, it's just that blacks act like there are, and you're not allowed to call them out on it.

>>53950922
No.

Asians and Arabs just don't give a fuck and know there are more important matters than representation in a card game

>>53950691
Diversity means african americans.
Everyone else, including actual africans, is opressive and evil.

>>53951794

So how are you distinguishing the two on fantasy worlds? Why are people responding to this shit, in a thread that has nothing to do with it?

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>>53952302

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Flavor text? Flavor text

>>53951023
Johnny has no use for an 8 mana 8/8

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>>53952779

>>53946629
Will use in Kaalia.

>>53952973
The number of black cards that animate a single creature beg to differ.

>>53952973
You're in black, the thing costs 4 mana at most.

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>>53953284

heh

>>53952779
>[Unintelligible beatboxing]
>-Jace
Gets me every time.

>>53950123
thats great

>>53949512
>>53949646
>>53949734
>>53950123
>>53950870
/tg/ confirmed for better writers than WotC

Not that we didn't already know that

>>53949581
Wizards doesn't pay their employees my dude.

If there's anything /tg/ hates, it's bad flavor text. Especially overly expository flavor text, the symbol of bad storytelling.

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Sphinx hype anyone?

>>53946629

Liliana insisted on coming to Amonkhet, a plane populated by gods and their worshipers, who compete for a chance to best the Trial of the Five Gods, to confront one of the two remaining demons--incredibly fearsome demons of near-limitless power--to whom she is bound. Liliana, granted near-immortality and near-limitless power by actually four demons, was in a bind, so she has been hunting these four demons, of which only two remain, but only one will remain after this one, Razaketh, a fearsome demon, is defeated. Once she defeats this demon, Razaketh, and also the final demon to which she is bound, she will not be bound to any demons anymore. Thus, her powerful magic, like herself, will no longer be bound - it, like her, would be boundless. As of now though, both Razaketh and the final demon remain--binding her and her magic. Black lives matter.

>>53955403
It's going in my Isperia Flying Tribal.

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>>53950691
When your goal in life is to create as many KANGZ as you can, you don't allow yourself to be distracted by details.

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>>53949646
>>53950870
>>53949734

These are gold.

>>53950944
underappreciated comment

>>53949581
The quality of Wizards' writing in regards to Magic tells me one or two of many possibilities.
- they are hiring people straight out of school with no actual experience but willing to do anything for a (low) salary
- someone with an education does not necessarily mean they are good at their job
- maybe the people they hire have credible job experience but they are still desperate enough for a low paycheque
- hiring someone who is actually good at their job just inflates operating costs, and we all know Wizards has overseers who love keeping that shit down
- they're blowing their writing budget on trend analysts who are more interested in pushing a trendy political position or social justice position based off real life than writing good far-reaching fantasy

People fresh out of college deserve an abundance of opportunities and yes, they are often stuck doing mediocre work to build themselves up. But there needs to be a core group of senior and experienced people around to teach them how to grow and there is an absolute certainty that there is NOBODY at Wizards showing anybody the ropes when it comes to competent writing.

In all seriousness I'm surprised they're not trying to impose a 50/50 gender quota within the design team. I'm even more surprised that the retards complaining about the game aren't coming out and exclaiming that a game developed entirely by men in the past and present cannot possibly be healthy for people to play especially when art of a woman getting (deservedly) chokeslammed caused enough of a ruckus to illicit an official apology.

>>53956209
>they're not trying to impose a 50/50 gender quota within the design team
God, I'd love this to catch on, if only to see Rosewater going under the tide of PC tumblrinas screeching about how his team is white cock dominated and how he should relinquish his position to a POC woman who diserves it.

>>53956209
you're reading waaaay too much into it. They have gone from publishing entire books written by established (pulp) authors to short stories that would fit into the lore sections of rulebooks written by professional bloggers. There is clear theme of that kind of cutbacks extending to the flavor text. There's probably 1 or 2 "flavor text" guys in the design team and probably 75% of the stuff they write gets thrown straight in the garbage and replaced by whatever soulless marketing husk they employ who writes the shit we see on cards like Razaketh after it's been shown to a committee on grey powerpoint slides.

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>>53954075
>flavor text tries to describe something simply
>"It's shit! Why isn't it all poetic and stuff?"
>flavor text tries to be poetic and stuff
>"Fucking Wizards, who writes this purple prose shit?"
I like ya, /tg/, but you're not exactly literary connoisseurs. Some flavor texts are bad, of course, but it feels like everybody in these threads nowadays are just trying to recreate le epic Avacyn's Collar meme. It's the same shit you see on /co/, where stupid idiots will edit perfectly good webcomics, crying "words, words, words!" when the original amount of words was perfectly fine, all because of how funny it was when Buckley's comics (which really DID have too many words) got the treatment.

>>53956555
Honestly, it's a case of their creative team being overworked.
At this point in time, they have to create the world for each block, figure out what the fuck the plot is, commission the artists, write the flavor text, write the stories, make sure all of it fits together, and do all of this twice a year.
And soon it will be 2-3 times a year.
And they've had...maybe one person brought on board since they swapped to two-block?
While it doesn't explain Ancient Grudge itself, it does explain the notable drop in quality from the last three-set block to now in everything they're doing.
>>53956603
Wait, they do that shit on /co/? I only knew about it being applied to OotS here on /tg/ and that started solely because some chucklefuck said it took him a full minute to read six words and it devolved from there

>>53951430
I hope so

>>53946629
what a slut

>>53956699
>Wait, they do that shit on /co/? I only knew about it being applied to OotS here on /tg/ and that started solely because some chucklefuck said it took him a full minute to read six words and it devolved from there
they do it on /v too with Buckley comics claiming that they can remove up to 75% of the panels and dialog and preserve the joke.

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>>53950056
?

>>53956699
It's been a long time since I regulared /co/, but I remember it happening: I may have been thinking of it happening on /tg/, because I remember both the stuff you're talking about and some fucking idiots who tried to do it to Oglaf posting here.

Flavor text is actually doing fine. As I crudely sort of outlined above, one way to look at flavor text is to take one of two main tacks: expository text or evocative text. Some flavor text is evocative, which inspires an emotional reaction:
>Armageddon: A bloody dawn broke over a scabbed and tortured world.
You'll notice that this doesn't really tell us much about anything. The flavor text is appropriate for the card, and arguably kinda cool, but it's not tied to some greater story. It doesn't really tell the reader much information. So here's an example of an expository flavor text, which is:
>Feldon's Cane: Feldon found the first of these canes frozen in the Ronom Glacier.
I mean, it's not that exciting, except for the part where the cane is a hidden treasure. But it tells you something about Feldon (that he found a cane), and it tells you that there's a thing called the "Ronom glacier." It's useful information that makes you feel like a world is a bit more filled out, that gives you information on characters and locations, etc. And that's a good thing. As far as I'm concerned, Razaketh's flavor text fits into this spot, and it does its job perfectly well.
(Some flavor text, from this perspective, attempt both angles. A few, like Obliterate, actually manage it.)

Some CCGs and LCGs have more of one kind of flavor text than the other. Wizards is currently trying to make more expository flavor text because they wanted to get people more invested in the story. That doesn't make the new flavor text artistically void or whatever. It's just doing something different.

>>53956555

The most notable Magic books were written by dudes who also wrote Warcraft fiction, don't pretend like there's any change in the quality from then to now.

>>53956603

The OP image isn't "describing something simply". Feldon's flavor text describes something simply, with a succinct quote that nevertheless tells you a lot. Razaketh's flavor text reads like something you'd see in a synopsis on Sparknotes.

>>53957204
This, upon rereading the flavor text I just realized it doesn't even mention Razaketh. The flavor could be a complete nonsequitor if you didn't know Razaketh was one of the big three demons.

>>53956209
>they're blowing their writing budget on trend analysts
This.
I'm 99.99% positive the people in each of the creative writing courses I've been in could come up with better flavor text fodder in a shorter amount of time than whatever team they currently have going. And most of what we wrote was garbage. It's baffling how incompetent Wizards can be.

>>53950944
>not Nascar
I mean, i hate the shit, but it's the only race that matters, and i'm not even from the south
Horse races get some press locally, but that's due to us having a track

>>53946770
It would be like stating facts about collars, especially ones that are symbols of churches.

>>53946770
Bolas is one of the few times I would be ok with that.

>>53949512
Flavor text was thought up by the same one that did Turn to Frog?

>>53957250
I'm imagining this being the case on random other cards, with flavor texts being barely, if at all, actually related to the card.

>Man, I could go for some tacos
>~Jace Beleren to Ulamog

>>53957586
To be fair, pretty much all flavor text attributed to Jace is unrelated to Jace.

>>53957703
I was so fucking amazed when I started reading his stories. Why the disparity?

>>53956603
>"Fucking Wizards, who writes this purple prose shit?"
I lurk a lot of Flavor Text thread, and I've never once seen a complaint that Wizard's got too prose-y. Complaints about the content of the text, like
>>53951197
for example, but never about form in that way. But maybe I just need to look harder.

Also, /tg/ isn't a fucking hivemind, of course different anons are going to take different critical stances.

>>53957204
Oh, come on. So the Razaketh flavortext is too explicit, like a Sparknotes...
>>53957250
But the readers are so retarded, they wouldn't be able to make the connection between a legendary demon and flavor text about one demon specifically? One of you is giving readers too much credit, and the other, waaay too little.

I didn't say anything about "describing something simply," either, because that's not what I meant. I almost used "Smash to Smithereens" as an example.
>The giant Tarvik dreamed that trinkets and machines caused all the world's woe. When he awoke from his troubled sleep, he took the name Tarvik Relicsmasher.
That's not a description, and it's not simple, either. But it's still more informative in tone than evocative. In fact, it's almost exactly the same tone and length as Razaketh's.

>>53957719
Flavor text writers enjoy writing snarky counterspell flavortext in general. It just feels right for spells all about saying 'no' to have pithy comments such as that.
But there hasn't been a single character that those comments fit since the one who started making them, Ertai. For a while they were unattributed (like Last Word), but then someone got the bright idea to just make the Blue Planeswalker say it because he's blue, counterspells are blue, totally fits!
Except they forgot to check what kind of character Jace even was. And then someone ELSE saw that Jace had that kind of flavortext, and wrote another. And another. So people saw the flavortext, but the only way to find out what the character was actually like...was to read the books they put out, and most people didn't buy them.
The fact that Jace the Mind Sculptor happened at around that time didn't help people's perceptions in general either.

>>53957719
Wasn't Jace just a bureaucrat who was done with everyone's shit? I remember some anon saying something along those lines a few months ago in passing.

>>53957204
>>53957250
>>53957748
Know what might've worked better for Raz? A line from his story.
"You really ought to read contracts before you sign them, Liliana. People hide all sorts of nasty clauses in them."

>>53957977
See, that's a good example of what it should have been. It gets his character across, it connects to the current story, and it's short and snappy enough to be memorable. It also is open ended enough that it makes the reader curious as to the context around it, and so people might go and look up the story it's from.

Bam,

>>53957887
I like to imagine that someone confused Jace and Jaya and the rest is snark history.

>>53958132
No, because they DID have somewhere to put Jaya flavortexts.
Chandra is literally Jaya 2.0 to the point she trained in Jaya's Monastery and has issues about being compared to Jaya all while being Teen Jaya (despite not being a teen)

>>53957977

ANYTHING would have worked better than what we got, which is "This is the story that is happening right now, this character is a part of the story because their motivation is this".

The thing is that Wizards has basically the free reign to make up ANY fictional world they want through Magic. They have the audience and gameplay platform that it will sell simply on the weight of the game (which is also shitting the bed).

And instead of actually making fascinating worlds that are rich and developed, they're going the budget route by hijacking traditional Earth mythology (for some fucking reason the players want this), hiring people to research what is trendy and just carbon copying those worlds, and/or doing very little to make the things they steal unique.

Like, is there any part of Theros that was separate from actual Mediterranean mythology - there was a fucking Hercules, Trojan Horse and god of the forge. Was there really anything from Innistrad that ultimately gave it a horror element that related to Magic. And now we're doing Egypt and after that, literally pirates and dinosaurs.

I gotta say this, Kaladesh was actually wonderful to me. It was a high-end tech plane with a festival feel. Instead of being magic driven it was technology powered by magic-energy. So what did they do with it? Well they just overthrew the government and gave power to the FRENCH, in the sense that during the rebellion they just wrecked gorgeous shit for no fucking reason.

>>53958235
I agree that Chandra is Jaya jazzed up to be more marketable - which is fine. But instead of fleshing out a sassy character whom we are all already aware sets things on fire, they just made Chandra purely the Jaya from the flavor texts. No character. No development. Just a retard that shoots fire magic. We already knew Jaya was a retard that shoots fire magic but the worst fucking thing you could do is have TWO retards that do nothing but shoot a quip after burning something.

>>53958717
>Like, is there any part of Theros that was separate from actual Mediterranean mythology

Nyx being the night sky, and the divine beings born from it being made of stars.

>>53958717
Jace doesn't burn anything.

>>53958717
You forgot about Khans.
Why did you forget about Khans? Everybody forgets about Khans. It was a lovely set, but for some reason everybody always forgets it.

>>53958889

The world itself was great, but the time travelling gimmick was kinda shit, especially since it just ended up fucking the world over.

>>53958842
I wish that could have been made more apparent from the cards alone. Having Constellation appear in one set seems like a ridiculously poor decision.

>>53958889
In reflection exactly what was it about Khans flavor that is so memorable? And I have to restrict the answer to what we get from the cards because first and foremost it's what's on the cards that matter both art and flavor.

It's basically dragons.

Personally, it's really difficult for me to sit here and really say anything else about Khans than the whole dragon thing. Even with my vague understanding of history you can see they just carbon copied Asian themes like tibetan monks and samurai (in the desert). Don't get me wrong, it was nice to see Khans of Tarkir at first. The first set felt like they were going some place with these styles. It would have been very worthwhile to explore each of the wedges.

Except we didn't explore the wedges. After the first set we added dragons then after the final set we went "fuck everything, full dragons - you like that thing, it's because of dragons or gone because of dragons". It was more or less identical to Alara - let's take all these unique ecosystems in the first set and completely fuck them over by the end ensuring that by the end they all resemble nothing that made them appealing in the first place.

>>53956209
So long as they spend money on consultants, analysts and social media shit, the product will continue to devolve.
Corporate is the cancer. Suddenly you make $1M too many and all your budget is going wasted on secretaries for the secretaries of executives that suddenly showed up straight from hell telling you all your shit is wrong and they'll make sure your shit gets merged by Disney because that's what every company wants...

>>53953661
>>53953683
timmy scrubs detected

>>53946890
Trying to describe the demon in flavor-text.. I mean it could be done, but you're better off reading the short stores on MtG if you actually give a shit about the lore

>>53959167
I don't care that much about the demon, but I care even less about that flavor text. The current flavor text is 100% empty of content to give a shit about.

>>53959139
I don't have a problem with them spending money on consultants and analysts and hire people who engage in social media for the firm.

My problem is that they're obviously hiring fucking retards to do that work. It's important to spend money on those things, but whoever the fuck is doing that work needs to be shot. I agree that it must be corporate designating these firms to do the work but I'm also willing to say that it's nobody's job at Wizards to give a fuck about the quality of work that is produced. You ultimately need someone who has the balls to say, "look, I know you're trying to help us corporate, but we have a specific product and our players have special needs and we can't just use the same fucking companies that are good at selling My Little Pony, Nerf, or Monopoly to sell our highly specific and (once) very unique product.

Any idiot can sell Monopoly; it's about as easy as selling ketchup. Whoever came up with the idea to sell branded Monopoly probably wasn't a goddamn genius nor did they have to know anything about Monopoly to do it.

It's like hiring Cryptic to make their goddamn Magic MMORPG. Did you people not learn anything from Neverwinter? Whose fucking job it it at Wizards to tell corporate, "look, our customers are only slightly retarded; even though it might be financially successful, a shit product is going to linger in their minds like syphillis."

>>53959257
That's the problem. You believe Magic is the product these people are trying to sell but it's actually Hasbro actions and they'll do anything they can to make Hasbro actions easier to sell NOW even if it kills Magic tomorrow.

Executives haven't given a shit about long term since the mid 80's.

>>53959508
I still can't help but feel that Mythics were something mandated by Hasbro.
Have since they were announced.

>>53959508
Look man, I took one token corporate finance class. I know executives don't stick around long enough to reap long-term rewards or repercussions so all they do is short-term bullshit for short-term gain to look great.

But knowing that doesn't excuse shit behavior.

Somewhere along the line, the players REWARDED god awful garbage behavior. Somewhere either through the video game marketing or some shift in sales due to selling in big box stores the players caused a huge increase in all the numbers that mattered. And the company then grew addicted to the money. Someone decided that thegrowth can be sustained but instead of growing slow, strong, and smart, they pumped it full of steroids and the game grew irresponsibly and isn't growing in all the ways that will exist in its current form in the future. At some point we're going to hit the high water mark and I feel like at that point the LGS will no longer exist and Magic will be something the idiot pros remember fondly and will blame everyone but themselves for it being some watered-down shitty online experience.

I find myself sitting inside the store and the owner tells me Magic makes him no money; he has a diversified offering and does well but the point is that at some point he is going to ditch this game and Wizards has no idea this is happening here and everywhere else that isn't a college city.

In the end they'll be giving away actual packs, cards, and actually design a proper way to teach players to learn the game while the game is struggling to fire FNM and by then it will be too late because they've done nothing to have those systems in place while the game was healthy.

Can you imagine someone in this corporate boardroom saying, "What is this Legacy format?" when the game is nearly dead and the money stops rolling in? When do you think they'll pull the trigger on reviving any revenue stream they've neglected only to have it fail and not matter because there's no longer anybody to care.

>>53955403
I'm too autistic and can't get over how much I hate the art.

Pretty hard to have an impressing looking creature when there's three perfect fucking replicas right behind it.

>>53959704
You know, that is a little odd. I hadn't noticed that.
There are 4 behind him
Peculiar because everything else in the set has been pretty great.

>>53959733
At first I thought he was at least the only sphinx with gold adornments, his posse has it as well.

It's really jarring that a legendary (and legendary rules) almost entirely breaks itself in its own image. I can't fucking stand it.

I don't understand how non-undead megafauna can possibly exist in a land where life can only exist within the bounds of a mega-city that requires permanent magical shielding from undead horrors.

>>53959648
just be happy they didn't do the yu-gi-oh like twenty tiers of rares thing, and stuck with the PTCG 4.

>>53959685
>they'll be giving away actual packs, cards... while the game is struggling to fire FNM
Every month I hear something about a "magic open house" or whatever where they're giving away these 2-color paired 30card decks. "Sample Decks" I think they're called?

Your predictions describe now. The death throws are upon us.

>>53959951
Being grateful for not being completely garbage doesn't excuse it for being somewhat garbage. It's still garbage.

Coping with small pieces of bullshit only leads to bigger piles of bullshit. Nothing got better after the introduction of Mythics. Promos got worse, pre-releases got more gimmicky, introductory free events were attempted and killed, card design regulated playable entirely to the upper rarities, Masters product fails to inject significant volumes of product into the market to address the whole point of the product, a failure to deliver on a working MTGO client, an event reporter that doesn't crash every pre-releases, etc. etc.

That is not to say every little piece of bullshit you should let ruin your day. But look at where we are now.

>>53960005
They've been giving out free promo decks to people for years. You see crates of the things given away at conventions. They have nothing cool or useful in them.

I'm describing a world where they start giving out useful things, like those stupid Standard Showdown boosters with actual Rares in them. Except even those aren't useful because 90% of Rares in a set are dogshit and of the 10%, 50% are only useful because they're lands.

>>53951699
realy? cause in amonkhet we just had an indian dude go full meltdown because "it wasn't indian enough but also if it had been i would have been mad about that too because muh cultural appropriation" pretty much his own words there, just summarized.

So if anything I think you mean light-skinned asians.

>>53958717
>there was a fucking Hercules, Trojan Horse and god of the forge.
There have been articles on how they actually made an effort to exclude a Hercules from Theros. He was banging Angels on Ravinca at the time

>>53959804
What?
There's a lot of life outside the city walls but it's sort of like Grixiss with just undead, demons, and other monsters roam around.
It's also just desert for a long ways around too so there may a lot more to the plane than we know but I doubt it because it's about to get wrecked

>>53959257
>My problem is that they're obviously hiring fucking retards to do that work
I mean, as far as I can tell though that's all that exist any more. EVERY company is hiring those. There is no longer such a thing as a non-retarded consultant, analyst, marketer, or executive.
Which is why everywhere you look places are falling apart or soiling their sheets in one way or another.

>>53955403
>legendary creature
>3 more just like him in the art
Now that's just silly.

>>53950123
8/10 really like the idea

Good job anon

>>53960042
>90% of Rares in a set are dogshit and of the 10%, 50% are only useful because they're lands.
Ah. Hearthstone.

>>53957887
Shame. Maybe at some point we will get a new blue walker it fits better with.

>>53951261
>(you)

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>>53955403
What is this card even for? Sharuum goodstuff with a sphinx tribal subtheme? I like how it basically has grandeur, though!

>>53955403
>sphynx tribal
>mono blue
*yaaawn*

>>53951315
I have to agree. Ancient Grudge's flavor text is worse. OPs is just bland. Ancient Grudge is clunky.

>>53946629
Razaketh is the last demon, she already took care of the other 2, not only is the flavor text bland and uninteresting, It's actually wrong.

>>53961407
But ancient grudge is just a random card in the extension. This one is supposed to be a plot point, it should be memorable.

>>53960262
Well there must be other criosphinxes around if he's a sovereign after all

>>53961449
Isn't there one more to go?

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>>53948764

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>>53961449
She killed Kothophed and Griselbrand, came to Amonket to kill Razaketh, and now only needs to kill Belzenlok.

>>53961648
Magical pacts make no fucking sense in the magic universe. A pact implies there's some higher authority governing that both parties involved keep their end of the bargain. But in the Magic universe there is no higher authority and because of the nature of Planeswalkers it seems odd that their own power and magic cannot undo the power of the demonic if given time; it's not like the fucking demons themselves can chase after them. The whole point of spells like Naturalize is they undo any magical bullshit that takes physical or written form.

If the pact was made with some sort of timer that requires Liliana to deliver on her end (and I don't know what her end of things is) then why the fuck didn't they bother to put a "you can't kill me to get out of this" clause on it as well; that seems like entry level Pacts-101 shit right there; how would all four of them neglect to put a no-kill line in those runes they carved into her. In fact, why the fuck would any of them fail to notice that other demons have put their mark on her too and think, "well, who is to say if I add my mark to this she doesn't get strong enough to kill me outright."

I understand making a pact between some random wizard and whatever else on a plane; said wizard can't leave that fucking plane so obviously the thing they made a pact with can come knocking.

>>53961734
I seem to recall Bolas introducing her to those demons, so all four are supposed to be aware of each other existences, not sure of the rest.

>>53961896
Only one carved runes into her, Kothophed - who told her to get the Chain Veil, which she got, then used to blow him to pieces.

Apparently she used the power from each demon to undermine the promise she makes to another demon Constantine style. Except unlike Constantine's universe there's no overaching power (i.e. God) dictating rules.

Except we'll never actually know because they fucking fired the creative director and eliminated their job.

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>>53957522

>>53958717
>And instead of actually making fascinating worlds that are rich and developed, they're going the budget route by hijacking traditional Earth mythology
Some of the earliest sets were Arabian Nights and notAfrica. The two most popular sets, Ravnica and Innistrad are based on European and Gothic culture. A setting isn't novel and devoid of cultural influence just because you don't know the culture it's based on.

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now this is good flavor text one sentence but sums up a whole block

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>>53962486
same thing, different block summed up

>>53948764
NYAA~

>>53950922
>two races
>52 genders

t. bill nye the pseudoscience guy

>>53960183
No, there were articles about how they tried to include a Hercules in Theros but it sucked balls and mutated into Mistcutter Hydra.
They have not once claimed that Gideon is Hercules no matter how much sense that makes.

>>53963405
Wait, if Gids is Herc, then who is Philocetes?

>>53961734
I want to see the entire thing backfire on her.
That once she kills the last of these demons - or hell, even already - that the boons she was granted disappear. I mean, 'eternal youth' can disappear damn easy without you even noticing it when you've got the body of a twentysomething - you just start aging normal again, and it's only been maybe two years since she blew Kothophed to bits.

>>53963484
Come on Crone Liliana, lets go!

>>53955403
>play another copy of unesh for 2UU
>fof twice
Maybe the flavor of multiples of him in the art is that when you play more than one shit gets mystical and shiiiiet

>>53953661
>>53953683
Not in standard. Not in any of the other formats either, because there are better cards

>>53958717
I disagree with you on the subject on Innistrad, because it actually does feel like effort was put into making the world feel functional despite all the horror elements they tried to cram in. It has enough moving parts that it actually feels legitimate.

Everything else is basically spot on, though. Kaladesh could have been wonderful if they pulled the focus away from the city for half a second. Did you know that there was another city on Kaladesh that wasn't Ghirapur? Because I certainly fucking didn't.

>>53959021
>It's basically dragons.
But it wasn't. Khans of Tarkir specifically, set apart from Fate Reforged and Dragons, was fucking awesome. In my opinion, what was memorable were the cool factions and most of the mechanics (except ferocious, sadly. They shoulda just made morph the Temur thing.)
>Abzan were "samurai in the desert"
Are you actually retarded? Have you never heard of Persia before? Fuck, dude, they were nothing like Samurai -- they weren't fuedal, and their m.o. was a giant over-land trade route, the Salt Road, so they also had a bit of Northern China in their inspiration. Samurai didn't do any of that: I mean, samurai lived on an ISLAND nation, for fuck's sakes. The Abzan lived in the fucking desert. So where the fuck did you get samurai in the first place? Do you just see scale armor as an exclusively feudal Japanese thing? I'm just baffled over here.

I mean, it's already clear from your obsession with "carbon copying" that you don't know anything about art. But from this I'm beginning to suspect that you don't know anything about history, either.

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>>53960005
>death throws
this entire post makes me uncomfortable

>>53960115
>in amonkhet we just had an indian dude go full meltdown
Uh, did you mean Kaladesh?

Because, if so, I read that article too, and it didn't go like that. His complaint was essentially that he was excited for a plane featuring Indian mythological inspirations until it was revealed that Kaladesh would be mostly about a more-or-less original setting that was way more interested in current affairs (the neat artifacts, the revolution/consulate, etc.) than anything that came from Indian mythology, other than a few nods. He was a lot more concerned with cultural representation than appropriation.

I kinda agree. Everything was just wanking it to artifacts again, flavorwise. They could have at least had a legendary archer as a nod to Arjuna. And, an interesting thought -- vedalken have had multiple arms on Mirroden before. Why not give them multiple arms on Amonkhet? Maybe they thought that'd be too on the nose. Either way, it was a missed opportunity.

>>53946770
nah the clumsiness of this flavor text definitely reminds me of ancient grudge

>>53946770
Imagine if they made a Nicol bolas card and the flavor text said some garbage about the gatewatch joining forces to stand against great evil, without even fucking mentioning bolas at all. That's what we're looking at here

>LOLIANA CAME TO EGYPT SPECIFICALLY TO KILL A DEMON! THE END.

>>53964891
>this flavor text isn't bad, it's just kind of boring and descriptive
>BUT WHAT IF IT WASN'T EVEN DESCRIPTIVE?
And what if Mario Rosewater doodled a little turd on the bottom of the card and italicized it? What's your point?

>>53951578
kek

>>53946629
"Is bound" feels so fucking clunky. I'm no expert on Grammar, but "was bound" sounds leagues more eloquent. Right now it feels like the text is written from two separate perspectives.

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>>53952779
Favorite is
>Father, why does it hurt?
I'd like the last one if it only read:
>*Unintelligible beatboxing* - Jace
Without the Evanessence bit.

>>53955999
>lol i'm pretending to be a racist dipshit haha supah funny edgy joke
ironic shitposting is still shitposting

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>>53953284
Did Mojo Jojo write this?

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>>53960262
You're allowed to have 4 in the deck you donut.

>>53970282
Kek

>>53952302
Well when you hire an African-American consultant to make sure you write a fictional black assassin princess "right" one has to assume they're trying to.

>>53964669
What article? I'm talking about him awkward autisming at the devteam during their Q&A in the middle of a live, streamed event.

>>53971498
Oh, shit, we really were talking about different things.
Forget about that, then.

>>53971498
They are referring to this tumblr blogpost:
http://talinthas.tumblr.com/post/150111624732/kaladesh-you-break-my-heart
Link to video?
I recall trying to watch it at one point and being unable to deal with how uncomfortable it was.

>>53948044
>Are you implying that being really, really bland and boring isn't enough to make it qualify as being bad?
No. He's implying that being really bland and boring isn't enough to make it qualify as the new yardstick of bad.

>>53949734
this one's a winner
very apt

>>53950691

Innistrad is based on gothic horror, which tends to be set somewhere in Europe but feature occult elements that come from "the Orient" or darkest Africa. Ergo, the gothic horror world has multiple continents, the one we follow most closely is based on germany, but there are black and asian people that are presumably from the "orient" and africa counterparts Innistrad has.

Amonkhet is based on Egypt, which was primarily middle eastern but did have a dynasty of Nubian rulers and their subjects who integrated into the population before the Assyrians and Persians took over. Ergo, the egypt-based plane has black and middle eastern people in it.

>>53969406
racist is a meaningless word. But you go ahead and explain to us all why there is no racial diversity on Amonkhet. I am sure we will be most enlightened.

>inb4 monsters are racial diversity

>>53976536
When there is the will, there is the way. That's why if you want to put negroes in the middle of European horror set you will.
When there is no will, all doors are closed. That's why if you have a set full of KANGZ you don't need no caucasians or asians.
You come up with those pathetic excuses about how there are "elements from the orient" or whatever -- but in reality, those "elements" didn't naturally occur, people put those there because they wanted to. They could've easily put comparable elements of european or oriental nature in Amonkhet -- and they didn't.
Why?
because they only thought about what they wanted to do and the thing they wanted to do has nothing in common with diversity

>>53949495
"Enter at your peril."
Enscription above the entrance

>>53970734
This.

>>53976966

You know, typing in all capitals doesn't turn historical fact into a meme. There really were Nubian kings in Egypt. They ruled there for about a century. An egyptian block showing a population that is black and middle eastern is historically accurate, and actually kind of a neat inside joke since the 25th dynasty was the last one before the "Late Period" in Ancient Egyptian dynasties, and things are about to be very late on Amonkhet indeed.

And generally speaking there have been one or two flavors of human amidst fantasy races on most of the planes we visit, sometimes a little more. The big exception was Tarkir, which was entirely Asian and that's because "Asian" is largely an umbrella term that describes a whole lot of different people.

Kaladesh had Indian humans, White humans, and fantasy races, with Indian humans being a majority.

Innistrad has white, black, and asian humans, and monsters, with white humans being the majority.

Zendikar has, as I recall, white and asian humans and fantasy races, with white humans being the majority.

Theros had white humans (unless you want to argue about greeks being white) and black humans, with whites being the majority, and fantasy races.

You are trying to conjure a double standard where none exists.

>>53976966

It sounds to me like you're the one coming up with excuses to complain. Nothing about gothic (or eldritch) horror locks it to a particular real world time and place, while invoking a very specific ancient culture does. Salome, for example, is a gothic work taking place in biblical Judea.

>>53977266
>There really were Nubian kings in Egypt. They ruled there for about a century.
And how many centuries they didn't rule? Can you remind me exactly? Then divide one number by another. Just an exercise.

>You are trying to conjure a double standard where none exists.
You realize that magic sets are fiction, right? There are people basing them on the pieces of reality they choose at will, with no regards for historical accuracy. All I am pointing here that they are choosing very specific piece like nubian kings and moors in Europe and ancient greeks with dreadlocks, which I am *sure* has a good reason behind it.

>>53977366
>Nothing about gothic (or eldritch) horror locks it to a particular real world time and place
suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuureeee. By that logic, the same is true about pyramids and animal-headed gods I'd imagine, so can you point me to the nearest white/asian/native american denizen of Amonkhet?

>>53977416

Not the other guy, but I'm not going to argue with you, because you're not actually engaging in dialogue. You're just saying "no" and pretending like there's some double standard that doesn't exist. Also, way to ignore the actual concrete example I gave that proves the point.

>>53977416

>Which I am *sure* has a good reason behind it

Magic is interested in drawing in new players so the product continues to grow, and so when opportunities to expand appeal to new demographics appear they take them?

I mean, if I was a businessman I'd do the exact same thing, and I have found it utterly bewildering how many people seem to get their panties in a twist about brown people on their card art.

Which is just as new as people clamoring for more brown people, by the way, I don't remember people screaming about Sisay being a strong black woman or the main character of the original Ravnica novels being a black guy.

>>53962486
Please refrain from posting odyssey in future magic threads, it's too good for them.

>>53977473

Or Teferi being a super important character, or Jamuraa being a thing. It's like the people complaining know nothing about magic.

>>53977480
One must know what things were once like to truly realize how things are now.

>>53977433
Not even sure which guy are you but you both had no arguments in your post. You were saying that 'things that can explain this exist in real world' and completely ignoring that the argument is not about the impossibility, the argument is about the selectiveness.
But whatever floats your boat, pretend that everything is just fine and slurp the shit they pile down the pipes without complaints.

>>53977473
You can draw brown people in your card art. Heck, you can even draw deep black people in your card art, it's probably the same shit. It's when you draw only black people with right hand and then cry about how you 'champion diversity' with left then I call bullshit. The point here is to show the regressive PC faggots for the hypocrites they are. It's obvious to everyone who can see, you just have to open the Amonkhet visual spoiler and Ctrl+F "0xFFFFFF".

>>53977558

Well, you're entitled to your opinion. Personally I haven't found the choices for what humans are depicted as we go world to world immersion-breaking at all, but you clearly have.

Problems exist with MTG's lore, but anyone that tells you MTG's lore has ever not been full of gaping flaws views the past through rose-colored glasses. And the problems MTG's lore have now are a lot more about pacing, scope, and impact than race.

>>53977669
let me try another form of the argument with you: predictive power. I can make predictions about Ixalan based on the view of Wizards I have:

(reminder: Ixalan is Pirate x Aztec x Dinosaur world)

- Ixalan will have almost no strong white male figures, (despite strong white male heroes being a staple of the pirate genre). The only strong while male figures allowed will be either a) (un)dead b)EVIL or c) Jace.

- Ixalan will have a disproportionately high representation of women in positions of power and/or glory. Captains of pirates and spiritual and martial leader of the aztecs will be mostly women.

- There will be no whites or east Asians amongst aztec. There will be no asians amongst the pirates. Alot of the aztec and pirates will be jet black.

- There will be no new white male planeswalker.

In other words, I predict that there will be as much diversity as they can fit in a block, provided none of that diversity is white.

Your historical facts or the 'notable works of the genre' will not support predictions like that because they are not used as the base of the setting.

>>53977857

So if I am understanding you correctly your view is that if there is diversity at all in a setting it must include every race on every world, particularly a white male who is not Jace or Gideon?

I'm not trying to maliciously misrepresent your words, I am trying to understand why a setting based on meso-americans not having many white or asian people (our white male protagonist is already confirmed to be there, however, but I have observed Jace and Gideon don't count as white males because people don't like them?) bothers you so much.

>>53973127
It was part of the PAX 2016 Kaladesh debut World-building panel. Around the 45 minute mark.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyhzyLttUOk

There was also a "where's my fat and disabled token characters" SJW guy earlier in the Q&A, if you;re just looking for cringe. Which is stupid, because Daretti.

>>53977975
not exactly. I'm saying that white elements will be suppressed while negro elements will be promoted. Same with male vs female. The setting is not based only on meso-americans, it's pirates vs natives and pirates in popular stories are overwhelmingly white male.

Even the elements that are meso-american could've gotten whites by the same logic that Innistrad had blacks. But it won't because noone will be looking to justify a 'reverse' diversity inclusion. (I'm saying could've instead of should've here because I'd personally find a token white amongst Aztec Ixalans at the same level of unacceptable ridiculous forcedness as the blacks among the eastern european Innistradi).

In other words, I'm talking about selection again. There will be a very specific selection of what is included and what is not, amongst all the possible potential pieces of world building.

>>53977857
>Have Gideon, Jace, Garruk, Tezzeret, Dack, and Ral are all white males
>Sorin too, even if he's a millenia-old-vampire
>Ob used to be as well before being a demon, and has a card depicting him as such. Probably Tibalt as well but we don't have a card showing that so fuck Tibalt.
>Venser was a white male too
They don't want to add more white male characters because they already have a shitload of them. Yeah, they need more asians, and more white women and fuck some more black males while they're at it since all they've REALLY got is Koth of the Partially Rock, and they DEFINITELY need to add more fucking nonhumans, but they've got a pretty good selection of white males already.
So why is there not being another brand new one a problem?

>>53978255
personally I'd like more non-humanoids.

>>53957887
>>53958132
Actually according to MaRo Jace wasn't meant to get snarky flavor text, it literally just Swapped the speaker of the quote and here we are now.

>>53978322
Anyone who has actually ever read or otherwise given a shit about the story and not just bitched and whined and moaned about it has been able to tell the flavor text Jace gets as a snarky, self important wiseass has always contradicted his actual character which is much closer to a spaghetti spilling awkward teenager. Which he has every right to be given how he ended up where he is and his power set but still. Wizards just thinks smartass counterspell flavor text is still cool and Jace was the face of blue so they went with it. It's especially weird and frustrating when they try to acknowledge how people see him, like in the Jace protecting the GW from Emrakul story, where the writer acts like Jace actually does act like his flavor text when he meets himself in his mind despite the whole story him being actively not like that. I think they thought they were being cute by acknowledging the meta idea of what Jace is like but it was fucking stupid.

>>53978406
wait, so then does that mean that all of those snarky jace comebacks are in his head, probably 30 seconds or so after he's done spilling spaghetti and the moment has passed, but that's still sort of how he sees himself?

>>53978476
That's probably the most entertaining way to consolidate the flavor text and character disconnect, yes.

>>53978255
nitpicks
- You forgot Venser

My argument was about predictive power. I assume that wizards operate on certain principles, therefore, I predict they will not create a white male planeswalker anytime soon -- and same for male asian and attractive female asian.
If we accept your 'they want to print things they don't have' argument, they should've been printing a shit ton of those. They weren't and they won't -- ergo that's not the reason behind their choices.

There may be other sets of principles predicting this particular thing but they are not diversity -- and they won't predict other things I mentioned in the post.

>>53978476
Anon, that's genius. All 'jace cards' flavor text is the ultimate roasts Jace comes up at 3AM while being unable to sleep.

>>53978476
>>53978495
Also for the record he didn't think he was a cool dude with sweet burns during that story when he met his inner self. He "realized" he was being annoying and smug. Of course the problem again there is that he isn't actually like that very often. Even the things he does actually say that sound really smarmy like the flavor text on Hedron Archive actually sounds a lot more reasonable when not taken out of context. He wasn't trying to won up Ugin in the story and it was a legitimate question.

>>53978518
>"The pyromancer summoned up her mightiest onslaught of fire and rage. Jace feigned interest." Yeah. That would have shown her. Sick fires, Jace my man. Have to remember that one for next time.

>>53978538
>Even the things he does actually say that sound really smarmy like the flavor text on Hedron Archive actually sounds a lot more reasonable when not taken out of context.
Oh... Oh, he has my problem. I now feel a lot more sympathy for bluehood now.

>>53978476
He's Jace Beleren. EVERYTHING is in his head.

>>53978322
That's...exactly what I said.
>>53978280
So do I, so do I, but fuck at this point I'll settle for more nonhumans. Of course, saying even THAT is going to be pointless, because they consider a werewolf, a vampire, and a pair of cursed asshats to be as nonhuman as the dragons and the catman.
>>53978498
I didn't. I might have forgotten Domri Rade, but it's impossible to tell what the fuck he is other than allegedly human

>>53978582
In the story he actually went to Ugin to learn from from him and find a way to stop the Eldrazi. The flavor text on Hedron Archive by itself without that context kind of reads like "You're just a millenia-old dragon, what do you know, I already know all the answers".

>>53978562
more like
>Next time I won't scream like a little girl and do that thing with my hands and I won't flinch and shake. I will be cool and composed and will be like 'fire? meh'. Or or or even better I will be like 'ha, what is that? fire? how interesting.' Yeah, feign interest, that's the thing a cool guy like me would do.

>>53978605
>I didn't.
right, my bad, somehow missed him in your post. Likely the sign it's time to stop posting and start sleeping.

>>53978606
I mean, I knew that was how the story went, I just assumed he was being snarky because Ugin was like "yo this is how we fixed it, aren't i a genius dragon. you should do it too." and he was like "nah man that's stupid."

>>53978652
Basically it's just, Jace wasn't really being an ass in the story. That was a pretty real point. It didn't work last time, if only because Bolas is an asshole.

>>53978668
I wonder... if he has the same problems... does that mean Jace is autistic too?

>>53978611
And then he practices the lines while posing dramatically in the mirror.
"...but since you've only just begun to stand upright...wait no, WALK upright, that sounds even better, yeah..."

>>53946770
nothing beats some of 1d4chan's articles.
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Tezzeret

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>>53957887
>But there hasn't been a single character that those comments fit since the one who started making them

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>>53951197
i want this "all goblins are retarded and randum" meme to end. i bet the blue players did this.

>>53946629
Eh, shitty but I can it being useful in my Kaalia EDH deck.

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>>53979169
Red is the color of randomness via association with chaos, so I can see where it comes from, but goblins could still stand to better embody cooler aspects of chaos.

>>53948966
>>53949813
We are goblinkind, heirs to the mountain empires of chieftains past. It's time for the 'smash, smash' song!

>>53963788
griselbrand is banned in edh

>>53978102
Oh jesus, this isn't even the same video holy kek, let me try and find the other one.

>>53964669
>Wizards makes a setting
>"WHY DOESN'T THIS SETTING CONFORM TO WHAT I WANT"
This is literally what's happening.

>>53964669
>vedalken have had multiple arms on Mirroden before. Why not give them multiple arms on Amonkhet?
WotC and the Indian guy who wrote the article both specifically said that four armed vedalkens were completely out of the question as that would have been nothing but a caricature of an actual living culture and religion.

Kaladesh was them facing the same problem that they had when making Kamigawa and choosing the opposite solution. In Kamigawa they decided to be as faithful as possible to Shintoism, and while that was exciting for the Japanese audience and the minority of other players who were already well read on the subject, most of the rest just ended up confused and get alienated. In Kaladesh they instead decided to not touch the mythology or culture at all and instead just do a Magic set with a thin coat of Indian paint on top, and that was likely appreciated by the people who aren't Hindus or know the stories, but ended up disappointing the people who were and does.

>Wanting Indian culture on Kaladesh
Why? India is a filthy country full of ignorant, rude people. You think the Taj Mahal and gods have anything to do with present day India?

I don't think it's QUITE as bad as the avacyn's collar one

>>53948501

>almost as good as Griselbrand

It doesn't even get remotely close to Griselbrand.

Daddy G basically wins the game if you can Through the Breach him, this guy needs you to set up the board for him with sacrifice chaff and even then he doesn't refund the lifecost like Grisel does.

>>53980892
Avacyn's collar? You mean the symbol of her church? I can imagine werewolves hating that.

>>53980806

In the middle of the spectrum you have something like Theros which does incorporate Greek mythology, but not beyond a level that someone who has seen Disney's Hercules could understand.

>>53949495
"Rather curiously, their gaze is set upon the tombs, not the entrance."

>>53981025
Theros could get away with doing a pop culture take on the mythology because it's not a living religion. Shintoism and Hinduism do.

>>53949495

For the dead, they serve. For the God-Pharaoh, they obey.

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Post your favorite flavor texts

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>>53983133

>>53980806
I know fuckall about shintoism and still managed to appreciate kamigawa because it was just a cool and unique setting

Kaladesh wasn't cool, it was just a shitty fusion of ravnica and mirrodin with swirly filigree and too many stronk womyn in the card arts. And it's not that I hate strong women, Gunnm is my favorite mango, but there's just something I can't put my finger on that makes it all feel cheap and like they're pandering.

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>>53983639

>but there's just something I can't put my finger on that makes it all feel cheap and like they're pandering.

Could it be that it was co-written and approved by a literal pandering expert?

>>53983902
I mean I know they're pandering, I just can't say how it's expressed in the card art that makes it feel so shit

And it's not as simple as "too many blacks", there's something in how they're portrayed that didn't apply to old art even when you were dealing with overpowered rape trains like akroma

>>53963788
>shitting on timmy
>plays standard
Standard is the absolute worst fucking format besides sealed draft. Don't shit on a card because it doesn't cooperate with a garbage standard environment.

ITT: racists sound like triggered tumblrinas, whining about trivial bullshit that in no way affects you and making mountains out of molehills. Try actually running the numbers on important characters and their cards, dipshits.

>>53984213
He's right that there are better targets in practically every format.

>>53984267
Try running the number on black magic players

>>53983902
>pandering expert
>more like panda express expert

>>53984267
> don't like cheap pandering
> wtf fucking racists
Btw mirage is art-wise one of the best sets because it wasn't run by a fusion of chinese digital art corporate sweatshops and teenage girls infatuated with femimism and shitty cartoons

Can you salvage the Ancient Grudge flavor text? Is it possible to hit all the same points of information without it being that clunky?

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>>53984639
Honestly? Just drop the second half and you've got a cheesy joke along the lines of Werebear. You don't need to go into the details about the collar, or symbols, especially anything involving churches.

>>53984639
Yup.

>Among Werewolves, Avacyn's collar had an... interesting reception.

>>53984639

>Can you salvage the Ancient Grudge flavor text?

Yes, it's so fucking easy.

Like >>53984751 said, all you needed to do was drop the second bit.

Hell, like that it would even be moderately clever, it would reward people who knew the name Avacyn's symbol instead of just spelling it out for retards.

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>>53984799
And even the ones that didn't get it immediately would be able to go 'OH!' when they opened up one of these.

>>53984267
>If I shit on both sides, then I am truly their mental superior
Hit the weights fuckboi, that shit doesn't fly anymore.
>it doesnt affect you racists why care
Except it does. I crack open a cold pack with the boys and I get ugly nigger after ugly nigger. The rnd are more concerned with "Are we diverse enough?" instead of actually focusing on making the game itself fun to play. Remember those ugly niggers I was talking about? They're on mechanically weak and overcosted cards that don't see play outside of limited. Have you seen how bad some of these cards are in Amonkhet? But it's okay because they have Proud Kangz on them so they're diverse af y'all #woke

At least when Mirage did ugly niggers, it was part of the flavor, the cards were fun as fuck to play and they were actually good. Have you proxied up Mirage draft? It's easily one of the best sets to work with.

>>53985102

>They're on mechanically weak and overcosted cards that don't see play outside of limited

Mirage is fucking full of those and the worst cards in Mirage are way worse than the worst cards in WeWuzketh

>>53979247
that kinda describes Us here. Seemingly chaotic, but with random spurts of violently dogged direction.

>>53985102
Oh so you're lashing out with racist language because you're upset with the current mechanical state of the game. Well that clears things up.

>>53984799
>>53984751
Yeah, it's pretty clear that the only reason that flavor text turned out as lame as it did was because Wizards didn't want to confuse people who didn't know what Avacyn's collar was

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>>53980870
>Indian culture has to be modern Indian culture
>modern Indian culture has nothing to do with ancient Indian culture
nice hops anon

>>53985810
Except they did it in the worst thing possible - they explained the joke.

>>53981089
aren't the entrances to the tombs part of the tombs?
also
>upon
it's shit

>>53985881
yup

>>53985854
>modern Indian culture has nothing to do with ancient Indian culture
It has more to do with being a post-colonial civilization than it shares with ancient indian.
Look at any colony that stayed a colony for any decent period of time (excluding penal colonies. you don't drain resources from those, nor make sure they stay crippled thus remain under your thumb. they're ore of a set-it-and-forget-it-hope-they-die kind of thing).

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>>53984029
I sincerely know what you mean, anon. There's something that is inherent in it, like an illegitamacy of intent that we can feel but that hides from our language. Obviously we know they are pandering, but the art in itself carries something inherent. I would be curious to learn if there is such a word to describe this.

>>53962083
Is this real?

>>53987639
Yes

>>53949495
>Unlike most cats, they let the sleeping rest.

>>53983133
Based.

>>53983133
"I stand for every cobbler, tanner, and fool in this town—and they stand for me."

>>53987906
--Hanweir, the Writhing Township

>>53950691
here is how a liberal brain works
>BLACK COCK! ME LIKE LIKE!!! WANT IN WIFEY'S CUNNY! I so progressive!

So it's fine to change demographics and native races and cultures AS LONG it's replaced with the darkest shade of black you can put in.

>>53976536
>Theros
>Genocide Mediterranean people and replace them with subsaharans because lefties need their bbc to live

>>53978605
Doesn't Domri's origin story confirm he's an elf?

the fact that people actually care about flavor text

>>53955999
Pathfinder has an entire splatbook and Adventure Path focused on the East: more than Mwangi's gotten.

>>53991560
Who passed in your Cheerios?

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>>53983133
Don't even need to say it.

>>53992132
he's /pol/, so... probably himself. Its his own piss.

>>53978194
>negro elements
Tipped your hand, /pol/. How about you yell about the kikes while you're at it?

>>53978194
>pirates in popular stories are overwhelmingly white male
Too bad, in history most were former (typically haitian) slaves. Henri Caesar, for instance.

If you'll compare typical pirate behavior to typical urban gang behavior it's really not that big a mental leap.

>>53946629
Hey, we're going all weatherlight again

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>>53992608
I mean, I did hear the set after Ixlantan was Return to Dominaria.

Speaking of, do you think it will return as a vehicle?

>>53984267
fuck off.

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>>53992585
KANGZ: THE CARRIBEAN edition.

>>53992496
Just because you tabooed the word 'negro' in your burgerland and in your head does not make it in any way bad.
Also, 'm-muh pol bogeyman' argument, just go back to R-eddit, they don't allow that shit there and you'll get gold.

>>53983133
"For his family, Barrin made a funeral pyre of Tolaria."

>>53992650
It's kind of part of Karn, now.

>>53993167
Oh, right. Sorry. Came before my time with the hobby, so I forget stuff sometimes.

In that case, do you think Karn will be returning as a vehicle?

>>53991560

i dont understand what that has to do with magic: the gathering

>>53984905
Could you imagine if this was your first intro to magic.
Your very first pack and the first card is ancient grudge without the second line of flavor text.
Then later in the pack you get this and think oohhhhh. Clever.

>>53955257
Underrated