Fallout

POST IDEAS

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>>53935008
Midwestern Fallout? A lot of ranches for brahmin, mixed in with more nomadic communities of biker gangs or caravans. Most settlements are more like gathering places for traders or craftsmen. Mixed in are remnants of Native American tribes - maybe the Black Hills has some secret fort underneath with a bunch of tribals on top of it. Enclave probably holds parts of Minnesota for iron mines and the medical hospitals, and a huge air base that's in North Dakota. Parts of places are probably almost completely unaffected by the war due to lack of bombs, but most are abandoned.

Fallout Lousiana:

Nawlins': walled city, the wall keeps the mississipi out. But the wall was poorly maintained by the city council and the pumps can't keep the water out, poor neighborhoods are flooded and the rich live in highrises. Serious civil strife, there's a breaking point and when its reached there's going to be serious violence. City is also a major trading hub.

Rouge: second trading hub, lies on a river bluff and remains safe from flooding, however the city is under consistent attack from enormous crabs and crawfish as it lies in the mutant beast's spawning territory. Efforts to exterminate the menace have failed, the city has become a hub for mercenaries and travellers.

The State of things: The state is mostly given over to jungle, a handful of cities and many towns persist but mostly along rivers. The bayous and forests have become haven to all manners of monsters and strange folk, a dangerous place to be sure but what lies in the Gulf draws scavvers far and wide.

With the death of the oil industry the rigs left behind were put to a different use: uranium processing. Using an experimental technology the Gulf of Mexico became the testing site of a chain of artificial islands that, even to this day, are maintained by automated systems and produce ready to use nuclear fuel, as a consequence despite the relative lack of technological facilities on the mainland the gulf coast is oddly advanced in some ways.

Factions:

The Scavs: A clan of wandering scavengers, a loose family community consisting of misfots, freaks, and opportunists.

The Gentleman's Club: a Group of Hunters that operate out of Rouge, a tad chauvanistic but they'll take anyone who can kill monsters and prove it with a trophy.

The Delta Knights: an order of psuedo-fuedalistic soldiers who help the corrupt city council maintain an iron grip on 'Nawlins.

>>53935132
Gay
>>53935227
Somehow even gayer ,probanly because of you unironically saying nawlins

>>53935132
horde of Namericans allied with townships to fight encroaching legion raiders y/n?

>>53935408
I feel like the natives would join the legion

>>53935448
you mean the same legion that exploits, and then destroys every tribe they encounter? Only reason the white legs ever joined was that they were shit tier at survival and they were lying to the Khans and exploiting their desire for revenge.

Presumably this is after ceasar's death so you would maybe have a north/south divide or something in their territories.

Basically short of survival or a serious change in the Legion MO tribals have no reason to join the legion so only shit tier raider tribes will want to join and I'm thinking of small Namerican nations with huge tracts of arable land full of ranchers and farms with lots of cavalry.

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>>53935580
>you mean the same legion that exploits, and then destroys every tribe they encounter?

No I mean the legion that enslaves raiders and are the best guys in the whole fallout universe but /tg/ will never accept this because

>Muh human rights in a post apocalyptic state
>WHERE's THE POWER ARMOR
>reee slavery even though most of the wasteland does it anyways

You might not know this but the natives use to practice slavery to, and had they regresses back into being tribals they would already be slavers. So yeah they'd join the legion and raid shit with them for the lulz.

No wonder that last thread got derailed so easily , /tg/ is more butt sore than any other board

>>53935752
Oh hey, hello Vulpes.

>>53935752
Vulpes get out of the thread

>>53935580
Ignore the legionfag. His posts are fairly easy to spot by this point.

>>53935827
>>53935838
>Because I'm saying that the natives would join the legion I must support the legion

No, if the legion are the best guys then the enclave are the gods of the wasteland. I'm just pointing out that the natives would probably join up with the legion seeing as how it just amalgamates most tribals who join it because they're just the toughest guys on the block.

Like the Great Khans.

>>53935849
>The legion fag

Enclave > legion. Frigg off

>>53935878
Vuples get out of the thread

>>53935916
>Vulpes

Alright who hurt you fags? Where did the legionfag touch you?

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>muh slaves
>muh freedumb
Both the Legion and NCR are operating in ways that are completely unsustainable.

The NCR is running up massive debts to fun the war. The morale of the people and troops is abysmal, NCR troops will drop chems, even one of the Ranger's rooms at Golf has Med-X everywhere. The government is totally corrupt, and bends its knee to huge corporations. The currency is totally debased, with the dollar rapidly inflating. On top of all this the regional governments are incredibly uppity, with secession and unrest being a definite possibility. On top of that the NCR needs constant expansion to feed the ballooning population. Just like real California, the NCR needs to drain Lake Mead for enough water. Basically it's a late stage democracy. It replicated Pre-War America and suffers from all of the same problems.

The Legion is equally unsustainable, for reasons that most people in this thread understand so I won't bother writing them out.

Caesar, when you talk to him, mentions the war is dialectics. He means that should the NCR be defeated the Legion will radically transform from a nomadic army into an actual state. For the NCR to defeat the Legion they will have to purge the weakness from their society, otherwise the sheer cost of the war will exacerbate the NCR's internal cancers to the point of total collapse.

Both have something the other lacks, and to survive one must integrate the values of the other.

The Courier killing Caesar is objectively bad for the future, as the NCR will win for free without having to reform itself. As a result the all of the ailments picking away at the NCR will come to ahead, triggering its collapse.

The whole point is that both are fundamentally flawed. Only of them addresses this issue however. The fact that barely anybody mentions this key theme is mindboggling.

>>53935408
Why would the Legion go far out to the north or east? They seem focused on heading west.

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I'm currently running a fallout setting set in Legion controlled New Mexico ATM. Shit is tight; I have mounted legionnaires in chariots pulled by gila-dragon like lizards, based out of the remains of Las Cruces (now renamed "The Crucible", because they're a hub of blacksmiths and metalworkers). All sorts of neat shit too, like firearm-obsessed raiders that cant find any ammo, and have to resort to just smacking people with guns. Their leader is Johnny Twelve Guns, wielding a flail made out of 12 pistols attached with chains to a stick. I also have a drunk philosopher who found a book containing the story of Icarus, and thus became obsessed with flight and made a jury-rigged hang glider that he launches from a firewatch tower and strafes the players by dropping bags of scorpions on them. The players are currently trying to refit a VW bus for a trip to Yuma, hopefully to catch a train into NCR territory. I love it.

>>53935276
what a well thought out and constructed contribution to the thread. really glad to have you around anon

>>53935969
vuples get out of the thread

>>53936115
everyone is more than happy to address the inherent flaws of Kimball's NCR, NCR supporters however rarely try to actively derail threads with headcanon and revisions of history to make their faction look like heroes.

The NCR is flawed but they're an average democracy built on the ruins of the old world.

The Legion are upjumped raiders larping as Romans.

There's Kimball's chauvanism for instance, perhaps as a product of Queen Tandi's reign he's intituted sexist policies and backed people who actively discriminate against women. Its the least of his crimes so I'll bring it up first, all things considered this sort of thing is easy to roll back, especially with how beloved Tandi is in the NCR.

Next up we have his fetishism for military victories, wanting to be seen as a strong man figure, and feeling the squeeze from disastrous ecological policies he wants to push further west and prove himself a better leader than Tandi in war spoils.

There's his obsession with pointless technologies like the Vertibird, know how to maintain a vertibird and you know how to maintain a helicopter. For the price of keeping bearforce one active he could easily build several cheap, functional helos. But he's obsessed with being seen as a world power so he touts technologies he can barely afford to use.

His continued and hasty efforts to take the Mojave, combined with alienation of his own military prove that Kimball has no business being president and is doubtlessly the core of a military industrial complex intent on revisiting Manifest Destiny without the means, logistical, technological, or social to back up his claims to outer territories.

Part of the problems lie with Kimball, and presumably whatever political party backed him. Best case for the NCR is Wildcard or House rulership, especially if Kimball is assassinated.

>>53936201
sounds legit anon, who are your PCs?

>>53936315
>especially if Kimball is assassinated.
Seems a bit too risky, might make him a martyr for his cause.

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>>53936315
Don't you understand that the NCR needs to take Vegas? Socal is scrubland and desert, the only reason there's so much agriculture is because they're taking water from the Colorado.

>The Legion are upjumped raiders larping as Romans.
Raiders have none of the discipline and cunning that the Legion does. If they're just raiders how are they so diciplined they will perform decimatio on their comrades? If they're just raiders how can they defeat dudes with armor and automatic weapons while wearing football gear and wielding machetes?

>Kimball's NCR
The problems are inherent to the NCR. It would take far more than replacing the president to fix them. There needs to be a radical shift in their society. They need to unfuck the currency, they need to purge corruption, which is unlikely considering any candidate for Presidents needs the backing of corporations to win an election. And probably most importantly, they need to unfuck the morals of society. If you think an elected politician can just wave his hand and rekindle civic duty and moral strength in the hearts millions of people you are sorely mistaken.

>Part of the problems lie with Kimball, and presumably whatever political party backed him.
If you live in the West and think like this I honestly feel bad for you. If you think that [INSERT POLITICAL PARTY] taking power can fix the systemic problems in our countries you are living in fantasy land.

>>53936115
NCR will go back to being crap even if takes Hoover Dam. The Legion can't possibly survive with only Lanius, Vulpes and Lucius to compete for leadership when Caesar dies. They'd just dissolve into one of the civil wars Rome suffered from every century or so. Wildcard or House are better, because at least they create a third faction to compete with the first two. It screws up the dialecticism of the conflict, and forces both factions to adapt to constrained boundaries. NCR reaches its a sustainable size with a reasonable excuse to halt expansion, and the Legion is forced to modernize itself or perish. Who the hell thinks Hoover Dam and a city in the middle of the desert can fix either faction?

I went with House and encouraged the Khans to build their "northwest empire," just to challenge the NCR and Legion. Better to keep them (relatively) smaller, and in constant competition. That seems better than anyone's final victory

>>53936785
But if you remove the dialectics you also remove the synthesis. Without total war neither will be forced to integrate the ideas of the other.

Without subjugating a civilization, the Legion will never civilize itself.
Without facing a massive army with iron discipline, the NCR will never discipline itself.

>>53936977
>Without subjugating a civilization, the Legion will never civilize itself.

It will when faced with the dilema of not being able to launch conquests anymore while still having whats essentially an army for a nation.

>Without facing a massive army with iron discipline, the NCR will never discipline itself.

They will be in that scenario and wether theyre facing a dangerous army or massive internal struggles the NCR will still need to get its act together. Outside threats are useful for getting peoples shit together but that doesnt mean it will definatly happen.

>>53937082
>It will when faced with the dilema of not being able to launch conquests anymore while still having whats essentially an army for a nation.
Where would they learn civilization from? There is no learned class in the legion. Even if they had the books and the means to do so, it would take far longer than Caesar's remaining lifespan remake society from the ground up.

>They will be in that scenario and wether theyre facing a dangerous army or massive internal struggles the NCR will still need to get its act together. Outside threats are useful for getting peoples shit together but that doesnt mean it will definatly happen.
Civilizations can rally against an external threat, but they cannot rally against corruption. Societies have a massively difficult time of recognizing internal decay as an existential threat. People don't see inflation, lack of civic virtue, hedonism, political corruption, massive debt, etc as a threat because it seems benign. Convincing the masses that the degeneracy is actually eroding at society is nearly impossible with words alone. For the NCR to reform the people need the threat of death and torture for them to understand the gravitas of the situation they're in.

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Reposting here:
>>53925308
Looking back my English is horrible, and I can't format for shit.
Atleast I had fun creating it.

>>53937303
Well if the legion cant stop warring for a month to do some actual nation building then its double FUBAR.

How would external threats prompt them to purge corruption from NCR society and instead just prompt them to think they just need to throw another army at said threat.

>>53937419
>Well if the legion cant stop warring for a month to do some actual nation building then its double FUBAR.
To convert the legion into a civilization from a nomadic army would take a generation at the very least. Caesar is 55. You do the math.

>How would external threats prompt them to purge corruption from NCR society and instead just prompt them to think they just need to throw another army at said threat.
Raising an army is no small task. For the government the whims of the corporations would have to be discarded to mobilize the economy. For the people, they would immediately recognize the need to sacrifice their own comfort and safety for the survival of society. Those who are too weak to fight would either die or be shunned by society. Kids would stop eating sugar bombs and huffing jet real quick if it meant they could avoid being lashed up on a cross, or save their family from the same fate.

And if the NCR weren't to reform itself into a hardened, stoic, society it would be crushed and consumed by the Legion, who is.

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>>53935752
> best guys in the whole fallout universe
That's funny coming from tribal trash.

>>53937572
You don't really understand how countries work do you?

>>53938335
Clearly I don't. Please enlighten me.

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>>53936330
Wasteland kids, abducted by Vault 113 for use in memory wipe and replacement tests. They escaped the vault after sabotaging it's water chip and holding the overseer hostage with an improvised explosive to barter for release. After escaping, they eventually ran into a legion scouting patrol outside of El Paso and accidentally revealed the location of the vault (and by accidentally I mean straight up told them), so now they're detained in Las Cruces, waiting for the scouts to return with news. Spoilers, the legion party will never return, because the vault security staff realized they have MASSIVE loose ends to tie up, and are now forming a killsquad, led by their old football coach and surrogate father, to go silence them.

>>53938389
Corporations, even in the darkest wartime, have working for the government in their own best interests. German companies were still fighting each other for contracts into 44 and even 45. America's arms, food, and supplies were being produced almost entirely by private interests working for the government. This is incredibly lucrative work. The most lucrative, because it pays the most upfront and is the most stable. Large scale corporations are engines of a non-socialist countries production capabilities. The government shouldn't just be supporting them, they should be subsidizing them for the time being.

Moreover, no amount of stoicism or strong morale fiber is gonna win a war. It comes down to production capabilities and supply lines, both things the NCR only has problems with due to unforseeable circumstances (the divide) and enemy action. Again, look at World War 2. Do you really think the Germans lost due to a lack of conviction?

Kids huffing jet is never gonna go away, even if you're in the middle of a ongoing existential conflict. It's certainly not going to stay away after the conflict due to some nebulous social epiphany about their individual part in the machinery of their country. People have never behaved that way, and won't be changing in the present conflict in the Mojave regardless of the outcome.

I won't say the NCR doesn't have problems with nepotism, corruption, and corporate boondoggles, they can also be compared to Nazi Germany in that respect, but at the same time nothing about fixing that has to do with turning a conflict into a protracted or more threatening one.

>>53938715
Also, just to comment on the Divide problem, Joshua Graham straight up tells you that if it weren't for that happening and fucking up NCR supply lines and troop deployments, the Legion would have had no hope to win at Hoover and would have gotten steamrolled.

I never would have imagined these two video game factions qould have inspired this much debate. Like I seriously can't believe people cared enough about either of them to either research or extrapolate this much fucking information.

Strangely amazing.

>>53938715
>almost entirely by private interests working for the government
Exactly. The corporations would restructure themselves to fit the will of the state, not the other way around as it currently is. The Brahmin Barons, one of the largest cancers on the NCR, would be mostly stripped of their wealth as the meat industry would contract because of the rationing of food and water.

>Moreover, no amount of stoicism or strong morale fiber is gonna win a war.
Hardly. Morale is crucial in warfighting. The Nazis took the combined weight of the entire planet for six years to crush, despite being numerically, technologically, logistically, territorially and financially inferior.

Or look at Viet Nam. The US had every single advantage over the North, and lost because of poor morale on the homefront. The US lost specifically because of lack of conviction.

>Kids huffing jet is never gonna go away, even if you're in the middle of a ongoing existential conflict.
How can you say that hedonism doesn't grow and contract while referencing the Nazis in the same post. Weimar Germany was a nest of vice and debauchery, which was radically changed when the Nazis came to power which I'm sure you are aware of.

>the Legion would have had no hope to win at Hoover and would have gotten steamrolled.
He said the aftermath would've been worse. The NCR was set for defeat until Graham fell for the trap in Boulder. If the NCR had more reinforcements who knows what the outcome would've been. It's possible the trap wouldn't've worked, after all Graham sensed that the NCR was numerically inferior and unprepared for such an assault and charged in.

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Hey guys I've got a question that's been rattling around my head. So, do you think there are any surviving Enclave...enclaves anywhere? One idea I had is that their roosted in what would be today's US territories, like Guam or Puerto Rico:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territories_of_the_United_States

>>53939297
Doesn't ED-E's Dad reference the Enclave in Chicago?

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>>53939297
As >>53939330 said Chicago is a likely candidate, odds are they would have come to odds with the Midwest Brotherhood though. Hard to say who would have won that war, or hell maybe the Midwest Enclave went rogue too and joined up with the Midwest Brotherhood.

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>>53939388
Also the Enclave whipping out the Midwest brotherhood would explain why their power armor in 3 looks so much like the Midwest Brotherhood power armor.

I'm almost inclined to remake the entire Boston Area/the Institute for a Fallout game, but I don't really know where to cut back to and what to add.

What would you guys do to the region to make it more interesting/compelling?

>>53939276
The US did not lose in Vietnam. The US signed a peace treaty in favor of themselves and then, year(s?) later, the North violated that treaty and invaded the South. You can see it as a loss, if you wish, but understand this.

>>53939388
Given FO:T's dubious cannon status, we can't really say for certain what's going on in the Midwest. I've tossed most of it out just because it's written like shit. Mutants in the BoS? The Calculator? Nah.

In the headcannon for my games I have the brotherhood having settled as far East as Iowa, and fighting the Mutants who are in Eastern Iowa, Minnesota, and Wisconsin. The Enclave in Chicago have bases under Fermilab and are doing science. They've irradiated the surrounding area on purpose to keep the locals away. They've have been sending some patrols out to sneak around, so the locals in the area think the place is haunted.

>>53939297
yes...The Enclave is honestly that villain that never quite goes away..they always show up again. Elder Lyons says at the end of broken steel that he suspects they will be back in time..they are the series real primary antagonist..they are in it for the long game. I would say they are in a bad way eastern seaboard wise but probably have another sizable base in Chicago and doubtless a few other places in the interior of the country...not to mention possible overseas holdings or bases in canada.

>>53939676
According to Bethesda the main events of Tactics did happen, the only non canon details would be overtly modern designs and some minor plot details, both 3 and new vegas confirm that both the brotherhood are in Chicago and that super mutants are there as well, weather or not they teamed up is up in the air.

>>53939632
Part of the Paris Accords was that the US would support the South with materiel and air support. After Nixon resigned the Democrats, almost all of whom ran on anti-war sentiments, cut funding to South Viet Nam. The US pulled out fully by '73, but the North wasn't able to invade until black April of '75. The midterms, where a new congress was elected, were in November of '74.

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>>53939297
The Enclave are the power armored cockroaches of Fallout antagonists. We know they have an outpost in Chicago, but whether it's an actual base or another Enclave Remnants situation is unknown. They can conceivably pop up anywhere in the U.S. or its former territories (including Canada) but they've really been done to death by this point.

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>>53939040
I guess it's part of the success of New Vegas - it gets you to legitimately care about what options there are and what faction you pick, and how you justify your choices. If you compare it to Fallout 4 and its factions, this sort of debate would never be. There is not enough real difference between the factions, or not enough that could be argued for/against.

>>53939297
I like my own headcanon >>53935132 where basically the Enclave is set up in North Dakota and Minnesota, at least partially. I think it makes the most sense especially in explaining how the Enclave got from the West coast to the East coast for Fallout 3 - they used the air bases in North Dakota to fly there.

>>53939754
The New Vegas portrayal of the remnants is probably the best way to handle the enclave post 2 or hell 3 in the west coast. I kinda wish we got a bit of that in 4, old remnants trying to out run the advancing brotherhood but no that could have lead to some good story telling and interactions can't have that.

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I posted yesterday about a D% based Fallout system I've been working on with
>SPECIAL
>SPECIAL derived skills and stats
>Action Points
>Balanced and Tuned Weapons and Armor
>Survival rules: food, water, illness, heat, etc
>Vehicle rules, in and out of combat
>Traits and Perks
>Spreadsheets which make calculating stats, skills, and item weight a snap
>and much much more.

Some people said they wanted to see it. I could post it tonight if you guys don't mind it being a bunch of different PDFs and spreadsheets.

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>>53939911

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>>53939933
Meant to say "Do it" but hit post too soon.

I've been running a Fallout game for the past year or so using some Savage Worlds Fallout ruleset I found online. It works pretty decently and my players enjoy it, they're getting a bit too strong for some things though.

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>>53939945
Comin' right up then.
Do you want me to include the google map I use for my games?

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>>53940016
Yes.

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>the Enclave retreated after Fallout 3, but nowhere on this earth
>instead they've taken the fight to space, trying to destroy the aliens that have been toying with humanity for centuries

It's such a stupid idea, but why does it make me happy?

What country would be the least affected by WW3 in Fallout?

>>53940224
Australia? Given the state of the world pre-WW3 though, it's probably still all Mad Max-esque, just without the radiation.

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>>53940224
I'd guess South America or Africa, since they wouldn't have as strong a stake in the resource wars, which seem to be mainly centered around China, the US, and to some degree squabbling European and Russian states.

>>53940224
South American counties. No nukes, just regular retrofuture tech shenanigans

>>53939805
ya...they will never have the strength they did in the eastern us again after the events of fallout 3..thats for sure. they probably dont have much left in the rest of the eastern seaboard either..maybe a few outposts...down past virginia way.

>>53940224
South Africa or South America are the kind of places where we don't have a record of fighting taking place between the super powers or other catastrophes taking place before the Great War. They almost assuredly ate themselves alive due to infighting and resource shortages before the end, but they're unlikely to have been nuked except out of spite and geographic isolation due to distance and the hemisphere difference means fallout would be of a much lesser concern.

>>53940224
>>53940252
I wouldn't be to sure Australia's THE country when it comes to Uranium mining operations considering it has 31% of the world's proven estimated uranium reserves:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranium_mining_in_Australia

Because to me that sounds like a big ole target on the outback. Funnily enough that also makes it a decent location for some Enclave remnants do to plausible US invasions, as well as Chinese remnants for much of the same reasons.

>>53940277
No retrofuture tech, that was strictly a US thing as the US was the only nation to adopt nuclear power to avoid the oil shortage.

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>>53939933
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-Fgo8uM9IArOHd5ZkQ2V0hNSVk
>https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-Fgo8uM9IArOHd5ZkQ2V0hNSVk
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-Fgo8uM9IArOHd5ZkQ2V0hNSVk
>https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-Fgo8uM9IArOHd5ZkQ2V0hNSVk

Here it is lads. First revision of Fallout 100. Take a gander, tell me what you think.

>>53940838
Well before I start reading Todd, I have to know.

Does it work?

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>>53940927

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How easy is it to produce new weapons and equipment in Fallout? I know scavenging, scrap-building and 'prospecting' is a mainstay of the series, but is every laser rifle and set of power armor an irreplaceable relic, or is it actually possible to make more?

>>53941792
Depends on where you live really. Power Armor is pretty much irreplaceable for everyone that is BoS or Enclave, maybe some parts of NCR.

Laser weapons, and computers and shit for that matter, are a trickier question. There are definitely some groups that make them in the more developed parts of the wasteland, like the Gun Runners or Van Graffs, but for the most part I'd wager they're pretty irreplaceable. You could jury rig one from parts, but it's never gonna reach the same quality as an original. I'd wager the same is true of most conventional weapons in the shittier parts of the wasteland.

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>>53941830
Everyone that isn't*

>>53939388
>or hell maybe the Midwest Enclave went rogue too and joined up with the Midwest Brotherhood.
That would enplane the MidWest Brotherhood's armor looking like the enclave's X-02.

>>53938474
Football Coach? Project Brazil?

>>53941792
it varies, factions like the Gun Runners in FO1 managed to scavenge a mostly untouched manufacturing facility and make everything from plinking pistols to plasma rifles.

One of the things FO4 got wrong was a weird obsession with salvaged weapons, it makes sense with maybe a plasma weapon as those were modified industrial tools or repurposed equipment but we're talking 200 years post war, people should be capable of dependably making revolvers and shit. (at least the ones in decent settlements anyways.)

Powered Armor is outside the reach of most factions, in part due to complex mechanisms like artificial myomer bundles and in part due to their fission power plants. (another thing FO4 got disastrously wrong, only the T-45ds were powered with fusion batteries and you'd need to actively downgrade all post 45d units for such a system.)

Electronics and complex mechanical devices vary. Your average tribal is probably making do with pistols or spears but a city dweller should have a hunting rifle, and a tech hoarder will probably have an energy weapon or robot.

Thoughts on implants?

Should the number of implants be based on Endurance or should they be tied to perks?

>>53939911
>more pdfs

Bring it on.

>>53940838
>>53940967
Rules for Range seem very generous

9 mm firing for 100 meters for only a -20 hit chance penalty seems to easy on the players

>>53935878
those great kahns who back out if thier leader isn't a revenge hungry old man?

>>53939040
Fascist and fascist sympathizers love organisations like the Legion.
They also love to argue And by arguing I mean "spout their opinion endlessly without listening to what you have to say.

>>53939276
>which was radically changed when the Nazis came to power
Pure bullshit.

>>53939465
remove all the fo4 stuff. start from sctacth from fo3.

>>53943569
>>53939465
I actually think a lot of the fallout 4 stuff is fine.

If you change a couple of characters so they make sense or so they're compelling for the players i think its perfect.

Also depends on what your players want/need

>>53943591
Addendum

Desdemona for example was probably a lot deeper of a character than was hinted at in the game.

Shes got some kind of lover called Sam for example and presumably she's got a lot of relationships within the railroad.

She also should have some kind of philosophy that makes her rescue so many synths

Problem is none of that is explored in game

If a PnP were to explore that it would be really fucking good, especially because a lot of the factions + places in the commonwealth are there. A lot of the stuff in that region isn't fleshed out is the issue.

A lot of locations just lack interesting content

Anybody got a character sheet for Fallout 2.0 - Wastelands

>>53943569
>>53943591
Primary issues facing 3:
James is some manner of bizarre sociopath who somehow has the charisma to convince a team to build a giant water purifier in an old world monument of all things , something most settlements don't explicitly need.

Honestly lets just stop here, this is well tread ground. Suggested course of action;
Remove the main plot from fallout 3, keep the brotherhood, move the enclave presence back, like 100 maybe more years and turn eden into a rogue AI that takes over. Remove Enclave new plague FEV from the equation. Your new conflict is the Brotherhood fighting with the Enclave remnants to conquer the Capital wasteland.

No supermutants, Bethesda's abuse of them in a desperate attempt to maintain 'iconic elements' of the fallout series is juvenile and shows their lack of understanding on anything with even the mildest nuances.

Replace supermutants with raider gangs who serve a Lord Humongus figure out of paradise falls.

Mirelurks are cool but the capital wasteland needs more unique mutants.

>>53944336
How to fix four:
again ditch the main quest, its even more poorly written than 3's main questline and that's genuinely impressive on some levels.

Have MIT (CIT sounds asinine honestly.) get taken over by increasingly detached and pointlessly deranged academics. One of the possible conflicts is contacting rogue elements of MIT who want to assassinate the inepted leaders of the faction and take over to do things. Maybe good, maybe bad.

Carry on the character development the Brotherhood got in FO3, I'm the first person to complain about the BoS becoming knights in shining armor but since they're so detached from the West Coast it works and its a solids foundation to build on.

Again no super mutants.They're the Master's personal soldiers and the product of anyone stupid enough to tool around the ruins of Mariposa base.

The raiders of FO4 are actually a surprisingly diverse group of factions and characters.

something something settlement of sapient robots and cast off synths.

TL;DR: significant portions of FO3 and 4, and even Tactics are dubiously canon in relation to 1 and 2, easiest fix is to rip out all things super mutant related, patch up glaring plot holes and ignore dumb shit like making every place and arid shithole because Bethesda apparently doesn't know what california wilderness looks like and can't be bothered to make a forested wasteland to explore.

Ease up on the Lolsorandom shit, Zeta is too in your face, The Pitt, Far Harbor, Point Lookout and so on were pretty decent in tone. Even Operation Anchorage works as a wild wasteland encounter.

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>>53944408

>>53944336
Im fine with this

What about more plants and Fo3 settlers not being retards?
>>53944408
Why not make raiders into genuine factions you can talk to?

>combat rules
>.357 Revolver has a range of 35+2xPER hexes
>if enemies are 36x2PER hexes away it subtracts 5% from the chance to hit

If enemies are at 34+2xPER range does that add 5% chance to hit?

>>53944336
I like the idea of the Raiders replacing the Supermutants in the capital wasteland. Especially if the Humungous type is actually just interested in them remaining raiders. The region suddenly has two foreign civilizing forces trying to whip the region back into shape and this guy is standing up saying "you can't take the apocalypse from me". Sort of a hedonist-survivalist. Might be interesting if the raiders have some low key local assistance being "freedom fighters" to some people, in an ironic way.

That said, you'd have to boost them a little more than just giving them a strong leader if you want them to compete with two armies of power armored goons. What would the raiders have that puts them on a slightly more even field other than numbers?

>>53939465
Glowing Sea is cool
Remove Super mutants
Synths are interesting, do what you want with them if you do include them, just make sure you do more with them than Fallout 4, make it seem like there's a legitimate issue/threat/moral dilemma posed by their existence, instead of just "slaves you barely see"
BOS is okay
Colonial references are fun, but make the natives competent
Witch stuff/witch hunts are fun, weird pagan forest/swamp cults would be cool to see, and a witch trial meets synth accusation would be a fun idea.

>>53944336
>>53944408
I really like most of your ideas.
I actually thought of a minutemen style faction for my ideal Fallout 4 before it was announced, but it worked as a much more loose confederation of towns and factions, with disorderly moots rarely achieving much beyond agreeing to contain raiders.

>>53943536
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oph14OIUdQ0

Try learning something kiddo

>>53945530
Minutemen without the radiant quests would be an amazing faction.

Make sidequests based on the guys you first meet and everybody killable and everything is fine

>>53939760
>I like my own headcanon >>53935132 where basically the Enclave is set up in North Dakota and Minnesota, at least partially. I think it makes the most sense especially in explaining how the Enclave got from the West coast to the East coast for Fallout 3 - they used the air bases in North Dakota to fly there.
They also were listed as having bases in Chicago.

I don't know if that was an attempt to retcon FO:T to star an Enclave branch instead of a BoS branch, or if it was trying to say the Midwest BoS took over the old Enclave bases (Which would explain why they can build new power armor and that power armor looks like a missing link between West Coast and East Coast APA.)
>>53940166
Very stupid, I disliked anything taking the Aliens as something more than a goofy easter egg.
>>53940375
I had an idea for a crashed US fleet in Australia, with a FEV tanker spill and the highest ranking officers staying buttoned up away from the rads and FEV while working with the Enclave.
>>53942573
>Powered Armor is outside the reach of most factions, in part due to complex mechanisms like artificial myomer bundles and in part due to their fission power plants. (another thing FO4 got disastrously wrong, only the T-45ds were powered with fusion batteries and you'd need to actively downgrade all post 45d units for such a system.)
I figure that the Fo4 Modular-Frame suits were experimental and to prevent shortages of full reactors on the front lines were rigged to use only T-45 batteries.

>>53939717
New Vegas confirms there were ENCLAVE in Chicago, not BoS, but I think they were trying to say that the Midwest BoS either absorbed the Chicago Enclave or found their bunkers deserted and moved in.

>>53939388
>>53939421
I had it figured that the Enclave were just gone by the time the BoS showed up and took over their Power Armor factories.

DO you guys think the tunnelers are actually as much of a threat as they seemed to be in-game and from what Ulysses said? Would a traumatized courier in an independent/House's right hand ending feasibly grabbing every working excavator and digging to bedrock around the divide to create a securitron killing field be a potential plotpoint that would force the Courier/House to use people as well as securitrons since so many are tied up garrisoning the divide?

(Hilariously Fo4 kinda shits on the idea that subterranean enemies are civilization killers by giving Radscorpions burrowing abilities, then again, maybe it WASN'T the Institute that kept the Commonwealth from establishing a government, maybe the Radscorpions did it?)

>>53946386
The tunnel era are kind of a retarded concept. I don't know why Oblivion felt the need to drop this weird implication that the world is gonna be destroyed by underground lizard men. Especially the bit about them being more dangerous than deathclaws, which is just a slap in the deathclaws face.

>>53946421
Obsidian, not oblivion. Weird autocorrect.

>>53946386
The tunnelers would definitely fuck shit up if they expanded to the Mojave. A House ending would probably be the best to deal with them. The courier could just tell House about it and he would devise a way to handle them.

As for radscorpions in F4, they weren't really much of a thing outside the Glowing Sea, were they?

>>53946386
I think the tunnelers are overrated, and I don't understand how many there are. I just can't believe they're a threat to the Mojave, and Ulysses is full of himself so he's probably wrong. You're right that some securitrons and living "volunteers" could hold the divide in a House/Wildcard scenario. Maybe even some BoS in Wildcard.

>>53946421
>Little lizard men are gonna kill us all, unlike deathclaws
I couldn't believe it, especially because anyone's courier is most likely a death-dealing machine by the time they enter the Divide. If you had half your companions, a halfdozen upgraded securitrons you could conceivably kill a ton of them. If they're so bad why haven't the fucked up the whole of NCR yet?

>>53946421
>>53946430
I mean they were more dangerous than deathclaws when in packs. Especially with their leveled HP, like Big MT nightstalkers.
>>53946436
House or Indy, yeah, I also thought "If my character was as traumatized by these fuckers as I was he may even go back to the Madre to gas the fuckers with the Cloud." (After testing to make sure it didn't turn them into ghost-people-tunnlers.)

>>53946479
>>Little lizard men are gonna kill us all, unlike deathclaws
>I couldn't believe it, especially because anyone's courier is most likely a death-dealing machine by the time they enter the Divide. If you had half your companions, a halfdozen upgraded securitrons you could conceivably kill a ton of them. If they're so bad why haven't the fucked up the whole of NCR yet?

I guess they haven't started ranging out east OR West of the Divide. And the bigger issue is how small the spaces you have to fight them and how much HP they have if that carries over to their "lore" durability. A deathclaw you can see coming, and a securitron can fight it. A tunneler pops right up into someone's shack and eats them.

Hence digging down to bedrock so they can't go any lower and NEED to approach the Securitron gunline on the surface.
>>53946479
>Maybe even some BoS in Wildcard.
Not without minorly retconning the BoS endslides for wildcard. How the BoS can make peace with the NCR and act as road cops for them but won't do it for you I don't fucking know.

>>53946421
I think it was to make things seem a bit more hopeless, to further paint the Mojave as doomed, a lost cause. Lonesome Road was heavy on that kind of defeated atmosphere. As for them being more dangerous than Deathclaws, that's only in swarms. If you look up the stats, the only thing the Tunneler Queen has over a regular Deathclaw is 50 more melee damage.

A few things really miff me decision wise in FNV. Even after reading the journal entries on the Fungal Zombie spores you can't choose to censor the spore part of the Vault 22 farming data to put the rest of it to good use. (There are no end slides for an NCR plant zombie apocalypse, but that's apparently due to time constraints, not the team realizing they had presented a false choice.)

>>53936201
I made a Fallout: Arizona game a couple years back. I basically modified Golden Geckos and gave them an enhanced version of the Radscorpions venom. My PCs definitely learned to avoid provoking them.

So, after a failure at the dam and Caesar and Lanius biting it, what would the Legion's dissolution look like. A bunch of wannabe Caesars? Or would his cultural homogenization break down and the older tribes re-form?

>>53946386
I always thought the design of the tunnelers was really weak. They look like shit, and it makes no sense that a pack of mutated humans with claws can dig through solid rock and rip apart deathclaws. The concept of super dangerous mutant swarm is fine in concept, but their backstory makes no fucking sense.

Literally every hyper lethal mutant was created in a lab. Super Mutants were made by the Master, Deathclaws and Wanamingos were made by the Military, Nightstalkers, Spore Monsters, and Cazadors were made by the Think Tank.

Tunnelers were made by ???

The concept that radiation or random FEV exposure can create super predators is retarded, and totally inconsistent with the rest of the setting.

>>53946776
I think Lucius has the experience, drive and respect needed to keep the Legion together. I don't know if Vulpes or someone else would make a move against him.

>>53946812
>>53946812
>can dig through solid r
We don't actually see them dig through solid rock, they have mounds of propped up concrete blocks that they can go between but I don't think they can just dig into any surface.

Radscorpions, Fire ants, and Geckos were made in the wild, Ghost people too seem to have come about on their own.
>>53946897
What if those two are dead? Assume every major officer on the Dam campaign is dead. Do we know anything about the other Legates?

>>53944336
One thing that I thought would've made Fallout 3's main story better without changing it too much was just acknowledging how it's almost a mockery of the resource wars. Both factions are repeating the mistakes of the old world in the very capital of one of the powerhouses that destroyed it. Muse on whether humanity is destined to destroy itself for something that never truly mattered, something like that.

And the Yao Guai were pretty cool.

>>53946919
None of those are very threatening. Scorpion and Ants can be be easily killed with even basic firearms. Geckos are hunted by tribals with spears. And the Ghost people were side effect of the Cloud.

>>53946919
Pretty sure there's only one Legate at a time. It's mentioned that Joshua previously and now Lanius is the military commander of all Caesar's forces in the field.

>>53947109
True enough, but they can be a major pain at times in numbers, and that's what the tunnlers are, tough-to-kill swarming assholes.
>>53947171
I could have sworn Caesar said he sent in Lanius whenever another Legatus failed.

Been working on a game set in Texas, with Houston/Golden Triangle as a sort of El Dorado for people. Rumours of Pre-war tech and stranded ships along the coast tempting people. Maybe a Vault Tec HQ somewhere in there. Current thought is northern bits are covered in an almost perpetual storm wall, kinda like the Divide. Breaks do happen, and usually around the same time of year, but the width and duration is erratic. Trans-Pecos region has an even larger desert than currently, pockets of civilization in the higher elevations. Central Texas is where civilization proper has survived, in the hills and river valleys. Most of the coast is now a tidal marsh, with skyscrapers drunkenly leaning against each other or being sucked into the bog. Those who call it home get around on giant rafts or zip lines between the Old Worlds bones. Not sure what to do for southern bits around the Rio Grande. Use giant boars as my deathclaw expy, and maybe some sort of 'thunderbird' in the windswept west.

>>53947202
Lanius replaced Malpais, alias Joshua Graham, who became the Burned Man. I think Lanius wasn't a legate before that and was promoted to the post.

>>53947202
>True enough, but they can be a major pain at times in numbers, and that's what the tunnlers are, tough-to-kill swarming assholes.
But only tunnelers are an existential threat to the wasteland.
>>53947171
>>53947202
The Legion was pretty poorly fleshed out in NV, largely because of the incredibly short dev cycle. For your own games you need establish your own set of internal politics for the Legion.

How I run it, within the Legion there's smaller Legions, each with their own Legate and specialities. Graham, and Lanius are the Legate Primus, commander of the First and most elite Legion. They also hold authority over all other Legions, obviously.

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>>53947783
>Giant boars as apex wasteland predator

Nice.

>>53947850
Called them 'gristlebacks'. The hair on their backs have a keratin(or similar my research has been lacking) sheathe, and so when they sweep their heads up to gore, they'll send prey flying. Larger stuff, like brahmin or other predators such as adult geckos, they then buck and try to impale on the barbs. Cue deathroll. Have no fear of humans, but are lazy bastards who'd rather run you off of the farm and eat it bare, than fight you.

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>>53946776
I think it will last for bit, but splinter in the end over the typical "NO, WE WUZ CAESAR N SHIET, NOT YOU" that befell pretty much every empire driven by individuals (e.g. Alexander the Great). How badly it will end, tho, depends on wether Lanius croaks it ot not.

If Lanius bites the dust, I think you will have several people either claiming to be the TRUE Legion (probably headed by Lucius, since he is the most respected of the lot), opportunists trying for power grabs (the POW in Camp McCarran and Vulpes dialogue regarding Lanius as successor present a facade with a few little cracks), people returning to their tribal ways as well as raider warlords imitating CL, since that's what they grew up with.

Lanius still being alive at the end of the game could be very interesting. The Legion would still be somewhat intact thanks to being the appointed new leader, but remember,he is NOT loved, "just" feared. I could easily see morale slowly breaking down, and people deserting without imitating the Legion thanks to the original still being around, trying to curb uprisings etc.

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>>53948443
>get the Great Khans to join the Legion
>make sure the Legion breaks down
>Great Khans rise to prominence as one of the recently brought in tribes that still remembers its old ways and incorporates many former legionnares into their gang

Would origin bonuses not fit well with a Fallout RPG?

Like +5 explosives skill and +2 guns or repair for starting as a Boomer.

>>53945530
Minutemen worked well as a militia of the people, I had no problem with them as a basic concept. Laser muskets are kinda stupid though, especially when you see 'another settlement needs your help' hold the weapon by the wooden extension dingusas a red hot laser bores through his hand.

could base them on a literal Militia that is actually trying to do its job but has, over the years, grown increasingly dissolute.

>>53946180
>Modular frames
Don't like the idea frankly. Who built them, MIT? Why are they compatible with post war armor then?

also the T60 looks like hot ass. Literally just the T45-d but beefier. With a designation like it has it should look more like a T-51 or something wholly unique.

>>53949338
I have them in the one Ive been writing. But thats because its based partially off DH2e

>>53949616
They should have just replaced the 45d, because it's just a visual upgrade that they decide to rape the lore with.

>>53947086
shaved bears are kinda terrifying looking, I like the design of Yao Guai but the random chinese name strikes me as off. Would've called them 'Haints' or something. Minor complaint though.

And honestly, yes, remove the purifier and make it a struggle to control as much resources as possible and make it a three way struggle between Enclave remnants, Divergent BoS, and a Raider Empire and you have a nice sandbox.

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>>53949772
I think the Yao Guai were a lot scarier/cooler in Fallout 3 - they had those long gorilla arms and looked recognizable as bears, but were obviously more than just a shaved bear. Not quite as cool as a mix between a rattlesnake and a coyote, but different enough so that it stands out.

Raider Empire could be interesting - could get the Pitt involved in things. Or maybe you actually make use of the Chinese remnants somehow, I don't know. I would have actually kept the water purifier, but actually make it clear that most communities have access to water - drop hints that the BoS, Enclave remnants, and raiders are fighting less for the sake of the wasteland, but for survival of their own organizations/to prevent the others from getting ahead. But if there was some other resource that could feel like it mattered, I'd replace the water purifier in a heartbeat. I just don't want it to be too vague.

>>53949616
>Don't like the idea frankly. Who built them, MIT? Why are they compatible with post war armor then?
Maybe the Enclave specifically made their XO-1 to use the frames since tehy were being sent to make contact with the Institute and they knew there were plenty of frames and power cores in the area?
(And there were shipments of frames to the Pentagon for testing, dug up when the ECBoS had time for further exploration of their home.)

>also the T60 looks like hot ass. Literally just the T45-d but beefier. With a designation like it has it should look more like a T-51 or something wholly unique.
I personally like both the T-45 and T-60, I feel like the T-60 was made to be better and cheaper than the T-51, something of a back-to-basics approach.

>>53949979
Then why are there frames sitting around in locked military installations?

As it is, it's just a not totally elaborated upon retcon.

>>53950003
I like the idea of keeping both Frames and Compact power armor canon because sometimes I just like the smaller ones better looks wise.

Also I miss the Industrial doors from Fo3 and FNV.

>>53949911
honestly you have a point, its not deathclaw tier in terms of differing from the source material (seriously, chameleons?) but its clearly a mutant.

Anyways, remmember the metros? Clear 'em out so you can use 'em to traverse the whole of DC, have Enclave, Raider, and BoS tunnel fighters trying to control subterranean routes and expand them. Make project purity into rivet city's water purifier and any fight over it will be about patching it into the metro to send clean water places.

We'll need a source of food, so another thing the metros do, have fortified stations nearby small town ruins that are converted into farms. Can be greenhouses, slave plantations, and traditional farms.

We have a system of tunnels that covers a staggering distance by certain standards, lets use them.

>>53950046
The compact armor was never canon either though. It was always big like the frame versions, but ran itself like the old stuff. They just changed how it looked for 3 and NV because they couldn't figure out how to do bulky stuff with gamebryo.

>>53949911
The motivations are the easiest part.

The Enclave wants DC because a) it's got lots of government secrets and technology to recover and b) it's the fucking capital. The Brotherhood are there partly to fight the Enclave, partly to try and "uplift" the population, and partly because they also want the technology that's around. The raiders just want them both to fuck off so they can go back to being essentially the feudal slaver hedonist lords that they were.

Raider Empire- Keep the Pitt, have it be a mecca of sorts to east coast raiders. This is where raiders get their education and how their culture is maintained. Its why they raid, why they slave. The Pitt is a toxic shithole incapable of supporting human life and anyone who lives there outside of carefully maintained safehouses goes trog.

Change the baby into a small group of adapted people who are nobility of sorts there. Keep the science angle.

>>53950111
I mean the legs were always kinda tiny.

The enclave sprites all looked like top-heavy ballerinas.

Here's some notes on a Florida Fallout Game I want to run at some point.

The island of Florida was separated from the USSA during the Great War by extensive bombings. The Jackson Divide is a mountain range that sprung up due to tectonic shift along the northern edge of Florida. The entire north is a glassed wasteland of radioactive ponds.

Everglades are referred to as the Kingdom of Atom and is ruled by the religious group. This is a different sect than the northern east coast believers a warn nd the leader of this sect is called the Nucleus. Resembles the Papacy and the throne sits deep in a nuclear waste storage facility 15 miles below a US military offshore airbase which is visible from the delta coast.

Crashed American super heavy cargo plane leaking radioactive waste into river, river glows green

Atom lake hit by 3 nukes, extreme radioactivity mutated a species of plankton that acts as a super organism, resulting in the entire lake being sentient. Children of atom consider it to be an avatar of Atom. Really it just wants to be left alone.

Cult of atom inhabits tanker that has been washed inland by tsunamis caused by gigantic nuke hit in Gulf of Mexico, sits near Atom Holey Preservation Park.

Atom Holey Preservation Park glows red and can be seen from across the Kingdom of Atom.

Alligators suffered one of four fates; Allighouls, became infected with FEV and became hulking Toadline level 45 foot long monsters, lost their legs and became completely aquatic and emit very high levels of radiation, or rarely gained intelligence and live tribally though cannot speak and are hostile to all outsiders

Mosquitos exist at all sizes between normal and three feet long.

Florida experiences mini hurricanes caused by a radioactive cloud off the east coast. They incessantly hit the island, causing the highest levels of rainfall in the world. Combined with the increased nationwide average temperature,
Southern Florida has become a tropical rainforest.

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>>53935752
>Hypocritical gay cannibals who fanatically worship a very mortal man who will not last a year without brain surgery (which he's banned, though he still keeps an auto-doc around that he just never uses apparently) and their only choices for leadership are him or a retarded berserker who will quicken splitting the Legion into nothing via infighting
>Best guys
Eyup

>>53950235
A radioactive G.E.C.K. Has created dozens of mutant plant species that range from beneficial to potentially world (re)ending.

Mutated Mangroves now grow as quickly as bamboo, and they desalinate bodies of water that they grow in, forming incredibly salty nuts. Mutgroves

A captive population of ringtailed lemurs was exposed to FEV and they now possess six limbs arranged on the torso like an insect and four muscular tails. Their entire coat is now ringed like their tails and their faces are eerily manlike and set into the top of their torso, though their intelligence has actually decreased. They are referred to in the Kingdom of Atom as Inmates due to their coloration. Their population has exploded and constantly harass travelers in the swamp.

A population of super mutants affected by the same strain of FEV as Inmates possess an extra set of arms and two vestigial atrophied legs that hang from their groin. They call themselves Spiderkin and range in intelligence from doglike to a dim human. Their ears are non existent and their noses are just holes in their face.

A gang of raiders called the moonshiners inhabits the southern coastal swamps of the Kingdom of Atom

Gulpers resembling those found north of the Commonwealth inhabit all of Florida

Abominations called Wendigos inhabit the swamps, they are twisted deer-like humanoids with thin but extremely powerful limbs ending in meter long scythe like talons. They stand 12 to 18 feet tall and are aggressive to the point of insanity. Those who've seen Deathclaws up North say the resemblance is striking. They have multiple esophaguses and they make a sound like multiple people making blood curdling screams. Fortunately they are rare enough that many consider them a legend.


The Brotherhood of Steel has a decent foothold on Central Florida.

>>53950286
A private Vault below Walter World houses an entire city with pre-war technology and standard of living. This vault remains sealed and is free of Vault Tec experimentation. Their sensor equipment is experiencing serious bugs and is registering false positives for continued nuclear blasts for the last 200 years. They believe the war still rages above between the Chinese and the Americans. Mick Walter remains cryogenically frozen in the vault.

The Southern Florida Fusion Center lies on the outskirts of the Miami ruins. It has been modified by unknown persons with dozens of lightning rod-like structures all over the campus and buildings. A series of 50 foot tall Tesla coils on the roof are powered by the fusion reactors inside and it causes a cage of electricity. A byproduct, or perhaps the actual purpose, of this is that a large amount of the electricity discharges into the sky feeding generating incredibly severe thunder storms. The fusion center is also dotted with a dozen unexploded nukes as it utilized a brute force hacking program to disarm them. Somebody has built faraday cages over them.

>>53950171
I like the idea of it being something of a Raider Republic, with the leaders of the various gangs/tribes/settlements all meeting up at the Pitt for trading and council. They're interested in keeping their debauched raider lifestyle as sustainable as possible, but also struggle with internal power plays and such.

I dunno if I really agree with the whole trog thing being kept. I'd prefer if the Pitt is just a regular industrial hellhole, with people maybe trogifying as a result but it's not really an epidemic that they have to find a cure for. Just poor people who they force to live in filth have it happen but the raiders who live above don't have to worry.

>>53950305
My "overall story" was that a bunch of groups are trying to use weather control to stop the incessant hurricanes, but their combined efforts are actually making it worse.

>>53950401
well that was my thinking, Trogging happens when all they have to eat is trog meat, filthy water, and have to live in tick infested shithole dorms.

So perhaps ironically you'd see Ashur trying to improve the Quality of Life for the slaves so they stop turning into mutant cannibals.

>>53948759
So why is Bethesda bad for bringing back the enclave from the dead, but Obsidian us ok even though they brought on and back from destruction twice?

>>53950452
>bethesda brings them back as a major faction despite the Enclaves main base being destroyed rather explicitly in 2, somehow they're at full strength again.

>Obsidian has the Enclave remnants as like, 5 washed up old coots.

yeah totally similar.

>>53950500
Sorry forgot to mention I was talking about the khans.

>>53950171
>>53950401
>>53950447
I am not so sure I'd like to see the Pitt go more pure-raider. I like Ashur's "Trying to do something decent." motives.


>>53950452
>>53950517
The Khans are fairly resilient and able to plausibly bounce back because they're not exactly reliant on tech and infrastructure, and provided they sell themselves dearly enough their "Final battles" can become legends that inspire more people to join.

Rate my setting idea.
Most of Texas is a radioactive desert filled with radscorpions and other beasties, but a semblance of civilization beyond tribal raiders has appeared in the East around of the great ruins of Houston. A confederation of five "tribes" controls the region, regulates the slave trade and defense against the "primitives" and Louisiana.
The Galvez, from the ruins of Galvston, who essentially returned to be a scum of hive and villainy. They're snobbish and don't like the others much. Some engage in piracy.
Los Muertos, a large number of ghoul scavengers, prospectors and traders who set up shop close to Houston.
The Ghost People, who live in small underground bunkers and never take off their hazmat suits. Viewed with much suspicion by the others.
The Red Dogs, warriors and petty raiders who elevate their dogs to practically human levels. Primitive, bellicose, but on good terms with the other tribes because they're considered loyal.
The Wranglers, the most powerful of the "tribes". Originally Vault dwellers, they are now brahmin ranchers who control many of the small towns of the region.
On the other side of the Sabine river is Louisiana. The old state is now a republic centered on Lafayette and Alexandria, almost intact pre-War cities reclaimed by Vault dwellers and Catholic missionaries almost a century ago. They solidified their rule over Acadiana, but can't expand towards the ghoul infested necropolis that is New Orleans nor to the northern radioactive bayous, so they unsuccessful tried to conquer Texas. Louisiana suffered a catastrophic defeat at the hands of the tribes a couple of years back, but it's now ready to try again.
Meanwhile, rumors of a large army of raiders from the West led by a god are starting to spread like wildfire among the "primitives".

>>53950560
Ashur is but do you think his soldiers give a fuck? Or that people would live in the pitt willingly?

>>53936201
>firearm-obsessed raiders that cant find any ammo, and have to resort to just smacking people with guns. Their leader is Johnny Twelve Guns, wielding a flail made out of 12 pistols attached with chains to a stick.

I didn't know that I needed this until now

>>53950560
That's where the raiders having political strife within the upper portion of the society comes in. Some raider leaders think what they do is important to maintain some civilization in the wasteland and to slowly bring it back up, others are more social Darwinists who think that by having a brutal society they make sure that only the toughest or most cunning survive, and honestly most of them are just in it because it's the fastest/funnest way to make life cushy for themselves and their gangs.

>>53950171
It would be interesting if the Raiders have a hub in the Pitt, but everywhere else they behave as normal. Big camps or forts on the fringes where they raid more civilized settlements/caravans for slaves and supplies. The Pitt, for most wasteland inhabitants, is something of a urban legend or spook story. They know it exists, but what actually goes on there is relatively secret and mysterious.

So when the BoS and the Enclave start really going to war again in DC, the Raiders get together and decide that this is bad for their future so they March as an actual army down to the capital. That would help to explain how they could be equals to the BoS or Enclave.

>>53950563
> A confederation of five "tribes" controls the region
This is GREAT
>regulates the slave trade
If you want to keep the option of playing a good guy open to players i'd suggest two of those tribes not to do slave trade, los muertos would probably work for those

>elevate their dogs to human levels
Idk how to rationalize that, wouldn't everybody just view them as retards then and not do business with them?
>The Wranglers, the most powerful of the "tribes". Originally Vault dwellers, they are now brahmin ranchers who control many of the small towns of the region.
Reminds me of pic related, sounds great!
>Meanwhile, rumors of a large army of raiders from the West led by a god are starting to spread like wildfire among the "primitives".

Wouldn't it be smart to just reuse the legion here? Another faction seems like overkill to me

Actually, as it is, I think it would be best to have the entire East coast become a war zone in the 2270s between the Raiders, the Enclave, the BoS, and the Institute as the major factions. From Boston down to DC there's sporadic fighting between the four groups.

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>>53951051
forgot pic

>>53951086
Why would the Institute fight with any of the other factions?
Wouldn't it make sense for them to stay in the Commonwealth and not bother anyone?

In my mind the Lone Wanderer fucked everything up in 3 and leftth at part of the US as a barren wasteland and Nate/Nora joined with both the Institute and the Raiders to fuck shit up there.

Lone Wanderer and Fo4 Protag then team up to be the major antagonists of East Coast pen and paper adventures

>>53951051
>>53951090
>If you want to keep the option of playing a good guy open to players i'd suggest two of those tribes not to do slave trade, los muertos would probably work for those
I was thinking about the ghouls not being slavers, as they have no real use for them. The others are either the Ghosts who don't want "strangers" in their bunkers (but aren't against "trading" captives) or some of the Wrangler towns.
>Idk how to rationalize that, wouldn't everybody just view them as retards then and not do business with them?
I wanted them to be a bit like the Hangdogs of Denver, who raised large packs of dogs and used them for war. They're really attached to their dogs and find sacrilegious to eat them, putting them at odds with more pragmatic tribes. They're also useful to deal with the "primitives" since they're good fighters and know all the tricks in the book for small scale skirmishes.
>Reminds me of pic related, sounds great!
Yep! They're basically the brahmin barons running a small country.
>Wouldn't it be smart to just reuse the legion here? Another faction seems like overkill to me
It actually is the Legion, but the tales get distorted. Caesar claims to be the son of Mars after all, and is basically a god for his people.

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>>53951264
>I wanted them to be a bit like the Hangdogs of Denver, who raised large packs of dogs and used them for war. They're really attached to their dogs and find sacrilegious to eat them, putting them at odds with more pragmatic tribes. They're also useful to deal with the "primitives" since they're good fighters and know all the tricks in the book for small scale skirmishes.
I really like the premise but my problem is how would others in the fallout world react to them given that most of the people there (and the factions you've made atleast thats my impression) act mostly rationally.

There'd atleast have to be a reason for them treating dogs that way - maybe an ancestor had a dog save his life or something

>It actually is the Legion, but the tales get distorted. Caesar claims to be the son of Mars after all, and is basically a god for his people.

Thats clever! Nice setting i might steal some of it

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>>53950171
Actually, Fallout: Project Brazil has something similar like this as one of the joinable factions called the Survivalist. Essentially a band of multiple raider groups between NCR homeland and the Mojave, the NCR's effort to a) clean up their land from raiders and b) get their grubby mitts on the fuel the locals have been cooking up thanks to mutated exploding corn, got cornered and decided to band together to halt their enemies progress.

Actually managed to deal a serious blow to them by baiting them into their cornfields, and then burning these down, causing a large portion of NCR's army to get roasted by exploding popcorn.

>>53951086
>the Raiders

But they aint a solid group of people

>>53951342
There's probably a cultural reason behind it, but they're still backwards compared to the others. Maybe they were recently admitted because they weren't dicks and could hold their own.

>>53935008
Fallout in Japan.

>>53950563
Other anon up thread who mentioned Houston/Texas as a setting. Consider that Houston has a large history of theater, and has top notch medical tech alongside aerospace. Another fun bit to give you ideas, all the food that's imported from Central and South America comes into that port. So mutated bugs and other things that stowaway could show up. As for your own ideas very solid interactions between factions, and I like the idea of Louisiana. I didn't go with them because I went with Mexico Rising Again and the Arizona Rangers putting feelers into Texas.

>>53951264
I was expecting something sillier, like the Red Dogs found a way to make every dog into a cyberdog, giving them human intelligence. Their leader could even be an old dog, one of the first cyberpups.

>>53951603
Genius.

>>53951603
Could be very plausible too with what happened in OWB.

Courier could just have travelled there and given them the blueprints to the facility in Big MT

>>53951603
Actually, that's a good idea. It's silly, but not too silly for Fallout. Their leaders are the old cyberdog, who is "reincarnated" in a good dog when his systems start to fail and the descendants of the cyberdog's old owner.

Alright /tg/. I gotta know where you all stand on this.

Guns? Or energy weapons?

>>53951987
Double barrel plasma/deer slug shotgun

>>53951642
>Could be very plausible too with what happened in OWB.
>Courier could just have traveled there and given them the blueprints to the facility in Big MT
Even with the brain put back there's still programming against spreading TOO much detail.
>>53951987
Generally a guns and explosives man till I hit the Gauss rifle. Especially in New Vegas.

>>53951987
Im a rifle with a scope kinda guy

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>>53951987
Unarmed.

>>53952228
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jHeUrmiKgU

>>53952487
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnsObgFucE8

>>53951987
Energy Weapons. Nothing more satisfying than watching your enemies burn to glowing ash or melt into goo.

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>>53942189
Shhh. None of them have played it.

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>>53950702
I'm toying with the idea of them throwing old rusted-out Mosin Nagants like spears at the PC's. They also worship a shipping container full of guns that got fused together in the nuclear blast forming an almost...cube shaped object.

>>53953072
I have, and I'm waiting for it to be finished. That, and the Frontier.

ITT: Sad faggots can't argue against me and just tell me to leave because they're a bunch of butt blasted children

Sad!

Daily Reminder that the legion is the only way forward for the mojave.

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>>53951987
Melee. Only manlets need to use guns.

>>53950260
>Hypocritical gay cannibals

Lol love how the only arguments against the legion comes from NCR propoganda and fear mongering.

>which he's banned, though he still keeps an auto-doc around that he just never uses apparently)

Primitivists is about limiting the use of high tech devices not banning it altogether. You nerds need to read By the Waters of Babylon ffs

>and their only choices for leadership are him or a retarded berserker who will quicken splitting the Legion into nothing via infighting

Except Caesar most likely has selected consuls to elect new dictators once their terms are up , although /tg/ is too mentally inferior to accept this fact.

>With the abolition of the Roman monarchy in 509 BC, the imperium, or executive power, of the king was divided between two annually-elected magistrates, known as praetors. In time they would come to be known as consuls, although probably not until the creation of a third, junior praetor in 367 BC.[4] Neither consul was superior to the other, and the decisions of one could be appealed to the other (provocatio). Their insignia were the toga praetexta and the sella curulis, and each was attended by an escort of twelve lictors, each of whom bore the fasces, a bundle of rods topped by an axe; but by custom the lictors had to remove the axes from their fasces within the pomerium, the sacred boundary of Rome, to signify that the people, and not the consuls, were sovereign.[5

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_dictator

>>53953401
Wild Card or bust. The NCR, The Legion, and Mr. House are all either stupid, assholes, or both.

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What are some cool ideas for tribal factions that are on the same level as the Legion, but aren't the Legion?

If there's one major failing of Fallout, it's that the Legion is the only tribal-based faction that has been set up as a serious threat, most others being small enough to only hold a small amount of territory or otherwise being weak even if they're more widespread.

>>53953725
The only thing I can think of that would be more of a threat than the legion while being a tribal based society would be akin to what the Techno Barbarians are in 40k. So basically its the Legion but it employs trans humanism instead of primitivism, so there is gene splicing, mechanic implants, mutations etc.

If it had a central cult to the tribe like the Legion does it would be a much bigger threat to other factions in the wasteland.

>>53953852
Or...bear with me here.

Injuns on horseback with guns, who know how to maintain guns and make bullets. Who have large tracts of land that are tended to by serfs.

an alliance of multiple tribes with a loose caste systems, warriors patrol the lands on horseback, farmers farm and ranch cattle, medicine men practice medicine and tribal rituals with a council of chieftans ruling over The Rez as a whole.

>>53953901
I mean maybe if they adopted some sort of imperialistic religious order then they would be a threat, otherwise they just sound like a regular civilization in fallout. I wouldn't call them tribals desu because all of that sounds relatively civilized, I mean say what you want about feudalism but at least it's an ethos. Tribals just want to murder, loot, kill, and maybe build something on the side.

The injuns here sound pretty organized

>>53953401
That's because arguing with you is like convincing a talking poo that hes not a human even if he came from a human, at the end of the day you're just yelling at a pile of shit.

>>53954026
In other words, I bring up actual points, historical context, evidence from the game, stats, etc

Meanwhile you write ad hominem like your post here. /tg/ isn't /his/ I guess , so I shouldn't be expecting much from it , but still...

>>53953994
Tribalism isn't about rape and murder you idiot, you're just talking about raiders. Tribalism is related to animist religion and primitive social structures.

words have meaning, use them properly.

>>53954026
don't give it attention.

>>53954077
>muh inteclchual /his/

>>53953994
It's a matter of perspective, I would say. Indians were considered to be pretty savage to outsiders, but they were relatively civilized. Plus, not all tribals in Fallout are just primitive raiders. The protagonist of Fallout 2 came from a tribe, and there were the tribals in Honest Hearts.

Anon's idea sounds all right, I would just say that instead of having them be gun based, have them use their own weapons they make, like bows and spears and tomahawks, but also whatever they can get their hands on. Rifles, energy weapons, explosives, etc.

>>53954100
>Tribalism isn't about rape and murder you idiot, you're just talking about raiders. Tribalism is related to animist religion and primitive social structures.

Mmm... No. African and Native America tribes practiced animism, but tribalism isn't just animism. Ever heard of the 12 tribes of Israel? Also , feudalism where there are serfs maintaining plots of land owned by nobles is not a primitive social structure, I think you're mistaking tribalism with the stereotype most people have of tribalism.

>Tribalism
>Tribalism is the state of being organized in or an advocate for a tribe or tribes. In terms of conformity, tribalism may also refer in popular cultural terms to a way of thinking or behaving in which people are loyal to their own tribe or social group

"Tribals" are usually slang in the fallout universe for organized raiders/ primitive tech civilizations. Maintaining guns and all of that organized society by default makes them non tribals.

>>53954128
M8

>That's because arguing with you is like convincing a talking poo that hes not a human even if he came from a human, at the end of the day you're just yelling at a pile of shit.

? That is intellectual to you? It's a long ad hominem and most of the time whenever I bring up any point people just say "that's mean", ignore my points, or they give me ad hominems. /tg/ also can't write for shit.

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>>53953136
>murdercube
I wanna be in your game
>tfw you group only want to play fantasy dnd and shoot down any suggestion for other settings or systems

>>53954206
guns honestly aren't that difficult to maintain, granted the tribes of isreal didn't practice animism but they did have a pantheon of gods at one point.

Tribals isn't really slang for murderers and rapists even in 2 where it was featured most prominently. It refereed more to relatively primitive societies. The van buren docs mention tribal civilizations who have guns but don't know how to make gunpowder.

'Tribal' has never meant 'murderer and rapist' except from characters who are prejudicial towards the animist and primtivist cultures that exist outside city ruins. The Arroryo tribes are actually fairly well educated.

Granted the Serfs part of the equation was kind of random and not suited to Namericans but whatever, some of the american tribes did engage in fuedalistic arrangements.

>>53954192
eh, I figured they salvaged and looted most of the guns, though they could also use muskets and stuff.

>>53954241
Are you actually responding and trying to argue with a literal shitposter? There's no argument to be had there, why are you even trying?

>>53954206
There are no hard definitions of "tribal" in Fallout. In a general sense they're usually just small primitive communities, but as far as I know that's not a rule.

>>53954300
Well to be fair, Arroyo had some help compared to the other tribal villages because they were founded by someone in a Vault who left behind a lot of knowledge before he left.

Most tribals aren't like that. Didn't the People in Klamath in Fallout 2 call Mr handy by the crashed vertibird a "devil" or something like that? When people mean tribals they either mean low educated , often illiterate, primitive tech people or a raider tribe.

>Granted the Serfs part of the equation was kind of random and not suited to Namericans but whatever, some of the american tribes did engage in fuedalistic arrangements.

Meh I mean the amerindians as a whole did on the Maya and Aztec but I don't know of serfdom being practiced North of Mexico. I know minor forms of slavery existed but it wasn't really serfdom.

>>53954206
Different anon, but in this case I think it'd be more a state of mind. If a group of Indian descendants survived on a reservation only to spread out into the countryside in the ensuring years and establish such a government and still call themselves a tribe, then aren't they? The Boomers are a good example of a sophisticated group who consider themselves a "tribe."

>>53954330
Probably because I want to see if the New Vegas posting outside of /pol/ is any good. Neither /v/ or /tg/ gets as in depth with the factions posting , which is just kind of disappointing.

>>53953725
Tribals in Tanks, they worship the tanks they have as godly instruments of death, all decked out in tribal paints and motifs, not as many numbers as the legion of but the tanks make them a huge threat to everyone.

>>53954353
I mean in fallout 1 & 2 there were different tribes of raiders with the Jackals, Vipers, and Khans, but I guess you're right it's more just meant to refer to low tech people

>>53954485
>/pol/
That explains it then.

>>53953510
>Except Caesar most likely has selected consuls to elect new dictators once their terms are up
>Muh headcanon

>>53954485
>/pol/lack
>has a massive hard-on at the idea of living in a despotic military dictorship ruled by an absolutist daddy figure

I am so shocked.

>>53954536
/pol/ actually likes NCR and Yes Man more than Legion.

Also /pol/ is the most diverse board on this entire site. I've talked with probbaky every political idealogy imaginable. Even extremely esoteric folk like Anarcho monarchists, some radical environmentalist fag who thinks that all carnivores need to be shot, pretty sure Jordan Peterson one time...

It's fine if you ignore the frog posting.

>>53954637
>Children see politics by how much shit they can get away with vs how much shit they can't get away with

You should really study psychology some time so you can get the gist of why the modern liberal is an overgrown child.

>>53954670
Get back to talking about fallout world building already, you wanna talk about liberals then go back to /pol/

>>53939297
Excluding Fallout 3's Bullshit the most likely have a very small group of descendants in the Midwest doing fuck all or just gutting out what's left of their bases.

>>53954640
>/pol/ actually likes NCR and Yes Man more than Legion.

/pol/ here, you're full of shit.

>>53954577
>Caesar says he bases his government off of a Roman government
>Is a dictator
>Roman dictatorship had counsels to elect the next dictator once the dictator was dead or the term was up
>Caesar doesn't wish for Lanius to succeed him
>If you kill him Lanius succeed him against Caesar's wishes
>Entire Legion is fine with it

It's almost like there was a greater structure that decided who got to succeed Caesar behind the scenes... Or maybe Bethesda just sucks at writing there is always that.

>>53954747
/pol/ also here, and it's still a half libertarian board you dipshit. Legion posting is a minority in all of the threads compared to NCR, House, Brotherhood, and Yes Man.

NCR is still the majority.

>>53951987
For the sake of saving money and recycling material I'd say guns.

>>53954736
Hey you were the one who brought up politics, stop getting off topic here
>>53954637

>>53954670
>I need discipline!
>Punish me daddy!

You've fallen for the classic 'dictatorships are stronk' meme. Liberal democracies are the world standard for both economic and martial power for a reason m8. Dictatorships give the illusion of strength with lots of decisive, broad actions (that fuck up more than they solve but look impressive) and military displays (which do nothing but waste resources) but are invariably riven with infighting and distrust since the dictators grip on power is so fragile.

Democracies are indecisive, slow to react and often give the appearance of being chaotic, but ultimately are far more robust and able to weather political and military shocks due to their leadership's power being based on law and popular consent to be governed, rather than a single individual's charisma and/or personal influence.

tl;dr praising dictatorships over democracies is like going to a race and betting on the massive hummer with tons of custom extras like spinning rims and flame-burping exhaust, over the boring-looking car that's been designed by capable professionals to go fast and corner well.

>>53954640
>It's fine if you ignore the frog posting.
/pol/ack ethno nationalist here

Our board is complete trash my dude. We are like the UK. We colonized reddit with t_D, and now the reddit is swarming in. The board so infested with redditors, shills, trolls it's near unreadable.

>>53954817
>/pol/
>half libertarian

t. still living in 2012

>>53954796
There's nothing that implies the existence of consuls. Lanius succeeds Caesar because he's the most forceful personality after Caesar, and because Obsidian needed to account for the possibility of Caesar's death at any point in the story instead of making him unkillable, which is what Bethesda would do.

>>53954796
Yeah, so headcanon. Crying about how much sense your headcanon makes doesn't change the facts.

>>53954949
>strawpoll

>>53954882
>Generic dictatorship only give the illusion of strength meanwhile democracy being slow and inefficient is actually a strength

Lmao the only reason liberal democracy survived the 20th century is because communist and fascists were too busy fighting each other.

>The you realize that after Dunkirk, and the invasion of France, a dictatorship had completely destroyed all of the democracies in europe in less than a year

Main fight was the Soviets vs Nazis, and the Nazis only lost because of the Russian winter

>Member when liberals uses to worship Napoleon? I member.

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>>53954882
>Liberal democracies are the world standard for both economic and martial power for a reason m8.
Democracy is fucked my dude. Universal suffrage was a mistake.

>>53954972
Straw poll > your personal opinions. Just because /pol/ don't post Doom Paul much anymore doesn't mean /pol/ isn't still mostly libertarian.


BUT

Can we not do this pl0z this isn't /pol/ ffs

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>>53955019
>Universal suffrage was a mistake.

For globalism.

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>>53955019
>De Tocqueville

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>have promising threads that might actually produce something great and fun
>evolved legionfag appears and shits it up with his autism, nutjob politics, and headcanon
Fucking why?

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One thing about Fallout that worries me as far as RPGs are concerned is the little details that really fleshes it out enough to play in. The games have been treated - obviously - like videogames where the main character's ability to interact with the world is fairly limited beyond some topics to discuss and quest dialogue, and what works in a videogame might make the world of an RPG feel flat and lifeless in comparison.

What I'm roundaboutly getting at is, what sort of evidence do we have for an average day in the Fallout universe? Is there room for romance? What sort of jobs are normally needed in a community - and not just the sort of stuff that an MC in a videogame needs, I'm talking about basic supplies and clothing and food. What sort of interactions are there between most groups, like tribals and settled communities? How much detail can I go about adding so that a character could spend a whole day in one city and not feel like something's flimsy or artificial?

>>53954915
So in other words, Obsidian couldn't be asked to write the reason of Lanius succeeding Lanius despite Caesar's wishes and Caesar this guy who had conquers half of the South West, couldn't be bothered to plan out his death. Hmmm...

>>53954915
Yeah it's not head canon unless what Caesar says in the game isn't canon. When he bases his government off of the Romans, did he not mean he was basing his government off of the Romans? Pretty sure he meant he was basing his government off of the Romans when he said he was basing his government off of the Romans.

>>53955106
The way I see it, you can never write too much detail. You just have to be careful in how you deliver it to your players.

>>53955015
>because communist and fascists were too busy fighting each other.

Thanks for proving my point.

>>53955159
He literally never says he's based his 'goverment' of the Romans, he doesn't have a 'government', it's just him and his personality cult. Your delusion is amazingly detailed, but I'll wait and see if you can find the dialogue segment where he says the Legion is based on the Roman 'First Citzen' system as you're suggesting.

>>53955182
>Survive by accident like a cockoach scurrying our of an atomic blast
>"Another victory"

It's not so much that you won, it's that everybody lost and people returned to a shitty manner of living because communists and fascists couldn't stop bickering instead of dismantling international finance .

>>53955159
>""""Society""""" based entirely around physical prowess and raw brutality ends up being led by the biggest retard-strength bruiser once Caesar dies

Who could have predicted this?!?!?

>>53955229
From the wiki

Caesar chose the concept of the Roman Empire as a model for the Legion because of its parallels to what he considered the "status-quo" of the post-apocalyptic world; he believed the concept of individualism had no place in facing the challenges of the wasteland.

Also, just play the game and talk to Caesar lmao

>>53955256
>Being unable to avoid being dragged into wars because of relying on 'outsider threat' to maintain popular support for the dictator/oligarchy isn't a weakness!

I'm done. I hope you get to live in a Caesar's Legion-style society some day.

>>53955264
A priori reasoning is a priori

>>53955159
Lanius took over because he was the guy right below Caesar. The military leader. This isn't complicated, and he took over despite Caesar's wishes precisely because Caesar did not have a plan for the Legion beyond his death. His goal was to take New Vegas and absorb the best qualities of the NCR to transform his roving army into a proper empire with a basis for sustainability.

This is all explained in the game. I seriously doubt that you have even played it.

>>53955300
>>Being unable to avoid being dragged into wars because of relying on 'outsider threat' to maintain popular support for the dictator/oligarchy isn't a weakness!

Wait you mean like the endless capitalistic wars started by international finance that eventually culminated into WW 1?

>Democracy can avoid going to wars AND sustain ad infinitum growth.

I'm done. Enjoy plugging your ears when the US invades the next country for oil.

>>53955287
Yeah, their costumes and faux-latin. No where else is there indictations that the Legion is in any way Roman beyond that, certainly not their political system, which, as far as we can see, has no non-military roles at all.

This is like claiming the NCR is Roman because it has a standing army and a senate.

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>>53955103
The reason the Legion-NCR question always derails the thread is because it resonates with us, it asks the fundamental question about the 21st century. Something is definitely wrong in the West. Is the solution to revolt (Legion), or hope that democracy can fix itself once again (NCR)?

Also, check out my new D100 systemIt's got skillsand action pointsand balanced weaponsand much much more

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B-Fgo8uM9IArOHd5ZkQ2V0hNSVk?usp=sharing

>>53955323
>This is all explained in the game. I seriously doubt that you have even played it.

I've played through it 3 times, and I guess tour memory isn't what is used to be because they don't say "well Lanius was the toughest guy and the military commander so he took over" they said, if Caesar is killed, that he takes over command of the dam assault, and then they just say he "takes over" after that without giving anyone any mechanics as to how this happens.

Caesar is dictator and his word is final, hif he wished Lanius to not succeed him then he wouldn't , and Lanius would honor that because Lanius is completely obediant to Caesar.

This implies there is someone else making the decision of Lanius taking over the Legion.

>>53955419
>3 playthroughs
scrub

>>53955287
Because he chose it as the base for the Legion does not mean that he has a Roman style government, or even a government at all. Try again. Also looking through his dialogue files, he literally says this:

>The NCR has all of the problems of the ancient Roman Republic - extreme bureaucracy, corruption, extensive senatorial infighting.
>Just as with the ancient Republic, it is natural that a military force should conquer and transform the NCR into a military dictatorship.

Unless I'm mistaken, consuls were a part of the Roman Republic, and Caesar explicitly wants to transcend that into a military dictatorship. Guy doesn't have consuls, or any government leaders aside from himself. That's a big part of why the Legion isn't sustainable as it exists during the game.

>>53935752
>Post apocalyptic state

Sort of missing the point of Fallout, isn't it?

>>53955450
>Unless I'm mistaken, consuls were a part of the Roman Republic, and Caesar explicitly wants to transcend that into a military dictatorship

No consuls refer to the military dictatorships of the Roman Republic which Caesar irl tried to bring back to restore order to the Republic before he was assassinated by corrupt senators.

Consuls elected the dictator when he either died or his term expired.

>>53955419
He takes over the Legion after he takes over the assault because the Legion is literally a roaming army. They are the assault.

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>>53955447
why u do dis

>>53955542
stop being such a fucking scrub

>>53955517
All I can find on consuls is that they were elected officials. Which seems out of keeping for Caesar. But either way, from his dialogue Caesar expresses contempt for the idea of a republic, and also says that his Legion is incomplete, and that it will finally be truly formed when he absorbs the NCR and changes it into a military dictatorship. Not only does nothing he say imply the existence of other government leaders aside from himself, a lot of what he says goes against your headcanon.

>>53955534
That's a priori deductive reasoning , like I said before there is no evidence to suggest that Lanius is disloyal to Caesar in fact he seems to be a total sperg about it.

He wouldn't disobey the dying wish of his superior , and you have to keep in mind how large the territory of the legion is and that ruling a territory so large as that requires more than just brute strength and coercion to rule over. It's much more likely that the Legion is more organized that it appears.

>>53955450
>or any government leaders
Given that we never see what life across the colorado is like you cant say that. And given that the Legion's lands are probably larger than the NCR, it's incredibly unlikely that there are no administrators.

>>53955640
There might be administrators or regional leaders who rule in place of Caesar in given areas, but it's doubtful they would have any executive power, for lack of a better term.

>>53955632
Lanius explicitly only cares about slaughter and inflicting pain on other people. He kills legionaries he kills profligates, he usually does it in the most excruciating manner he can think of. If the Legion takes over Vegas and cesar is dead the first thing he does is engage in mass pogroms where as ceaser clearly wanted to subdue the populace and put them to work feeding his war machine so he could march on the NCR.

you're not just wrong, you're stupid.

>>53955640
>>53955697
its pretty much explicitly stated that all his governors are centurions or military officers of equal standing.

>>53955632
Loyalty doesn't factor into it. Lanius winds up taking control of the Legion by taking control of the assault because those actions are one in the same. Any regional leaders left to oversee Caesar's conquered lands are most likely part of the army as well.

>>53955369
I'm a total pleb, Todd. Help me. What's the SPECIAL stuff in parenthesis next to the skills on the char creation page mean?

>>53955781
That's how your base skill level is calculated. So for say Unarmed, you take x3 your ST + your EN.

If make a copy of the "character sheet" spreadsheet, you can change the SPECIAL values, and it will automatically calculate your starting skills.

>>53955369
Got an idea for a CHA perk, if you want it.

>Can't Bullshit a Bullshitter
Can spot lies and manipulations in dialogue if you have a higher Speech (or CHA, whatever you think is better) than the lying character.

>>53945425
It'd be cool if the cit destroyed the other factions to increase resources for synth production and then used the synths as a work force to clean up the glowing sea.

>>53955865
Ah, okay. Thanks.

Do you guys have any specific areas in the 3d games that appealed to you? I for some reason am mildly in love with the various stormdrains in Fo3, and really love Hamilton's hideaway from the same, just wish it was more intact instead of a little dungeon full of raiders and radscorpions.

In FNV I love all the caves-with-houses (So, NCR ranger safehouse and the Prospector's Den) as well as Elijah's BoS bunker

>>53955781
Probably the SPECIAL skill that feeds into them.

>>53945425
>Remove Super mutants
Eh, I kinda like the Institute messing with their own brand of FEV, gives players a reason to hate them even if they agree that synths should be slaves.

>>53955950
Personally, the Sierra Madre is one of my favorite locations in any game. Other than that, all the places that are particularly reminiscent of a Spaghetti Western in New Vegas are great.

>>53955950
lonesome road hands down was the best location, setting and story

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>>53955900
Without this perk would the players not be able to use a skill to tell if the GM is lying, and have to rely in their wits alone? Should I add a scrutiny skill? Or should it just be a function of speech to detect others' lies?

>>53934900
What are some cool or interesting creatures you've thought up for Fallout?

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>>53955987
>>53956050
I meant more small-scale than that, but both of those DID have great stuff.

Like this Ticker-Tape lounge in Fo4: pre war smoking lounge with a few hints of luxury still remaining. http://imgur.com/a/lT5ed

>>53955950
I really liked New Vegas and Freeside. The casino quests were really fun. I would absolutely love to play a campaign centered around that whole region, but just have New Vegas itself be bigger with more locations within it.

>>53955542
>Namefag is a scrub
Get out of here

But you did remind me I wish we got a DLC for NV going into the Legions territory, rather than the Divide. I wanted to see those subjugated tribes, and the backend of the Legion.
>>53955950
I love the Kings School of Impersonation, but that's cause I love the Kings. They're just young guys trying to look tough and fancy after the apocalypse. I can't help but laugh and love them

>>53956173
The Kings are genuinely one of the best factions in all of Fallout, both in terms of likability and in terms of morality.

>>53956117
Don't let it work on GM, just have it be a function of speech. That's how I would do it, anyway.

>>53940265
>Turkish Presidency-for-life
gosh, that could never happen
some funny ha ha guy made this map!

>>53956151
In that case, hangman's alley in Fo4, there's something about a little outpost type settlement nestled between tall buildings that I love, I always imagined it as a stop over for my supply lines.

>>53956390
So speech checks should be a sort of one way street? Where the GM can't compel the PCs to do things against the player's will, but at the same time he can't give them tell them that a character is lying through a speech check?

Makes sense.

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>>53955159
It's literally a plot point that the Legion is Roman only in aesthetic, not ideology. Multiple characters observe that it's simply a very, very swollen Raider army.

>>53956644
Also Gunners Plaza, I really wanted to take it over and make it my mansion

>>53955950
I played Fo3 a lot, so there was a lot I passed over, but I actually liked Rivet City a fair bit, and there was always a little more to explore to the capital that I hadn't done yet - I liked finding the remains of clothing stores and stuff. I regret that they didn't play with that more instead of just using metros, since there's less of a ruined urban environment in NV.

I liked the gas stations in NV, but I honestly haven't played enough of it to say much more.

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>>53956644
This is how I set up my Hangmans Alley. Pretty comfy senpai.

>>53951987
I honestly never thought they should be separate. Imo it should be guns and big guns, with the energy weapons being assigned to each group.

>>53957839
That's a bit too much like Skyrim's One-Handed and Two-Handed for my taste. I can understand wanting some overlap because they are still similar types, but I imagine there would be some difference between using a traditional firearm and using one that fired lasers or plasma, whether it was a pistol or a machine gun.

>>53957878
I guess there would be some difference, but it's completely ridiculous to me that someone could be a master shot with a regular rifle but be a complete amateur with a laser rifle.

>>53957953
rifle bullets have drop, that is the bullet is influence by gravity and wind. Lasers are not.

Rifles have recoil that needs to be mitigated. lasers do not.

the maintenance of lasers is entirely different from those of guns.

Now a Gauss rifle on the other hand...

>>53957839
Eh, they're might not be much of a difference to a player, but I imagine that they're would be nuances and differences in-universe. But you also have to consider that having energy weapons in their own skill group helps character building. For example, energy weapons have their own perks and such, and it means more to have a character specialize (or not specialize) in energy weapons if they are their own category. If anything I would say that you could apply gun or big gun skills to energy weapons that could fall in either category, helping you with accuracy and such while not giving you access to energy weapon perks, but the only reason to do that would be to soothe some people's autism.

>>53936115
>legion
>unsustainable
Explain please
When Caesar dies wont Vulpes just take over? And even then, theres a massive amount of proven leaders from the captured tribes that could also run the legion seeing as its run in a manner that would lead to loyalty as opposed to Alexander's Greece where the leaders were divided after his death due to the lack of favoritism towards his generals.
They have adequate food and water, electricity despite them not using it, they can definently fight.
So whats the issue?
Will their balls drop off?
Will the Mormons take over?

Also Enclave is the same as the Legion, they just wear power armor and have plasma.
They still kill, raid, and enslave pretty much everything, and its completely unsustainable as there arent any humans in the waste that havent been exposed to radiation, meaning that the Enclave has to kill everything, despite only being the wealthy who fled to an oil rig before the war.

>>53957953
This isn't a very fair argument, but imagine you've been using muskets all your life, and suddenly you're trying to use a bolt-action rifle. You won't know how to load it properly, you won't be used to how accurate it is and how far you can shoot, you might not even know how to hold it properly or how to use its sights. And that's not even taking into account how a laser rifle works completely differently, how it probably weighs/is balanced differently, and things like bullet drop and recoil that no longer matter compared to the dissipation of a laser or how to compensate for a faulty lens.

It might be fair to say that having a high Small Guns skill should give you at least a small advantage to your Energy Weapons skill to represent some basic knowledge - you know which end is the shooty end and how to aim. But you wouldn't really know how to handle it properly and have to get used to the fact that it won't function like your instincts and muscle memory expect it to.

>>53958128
The Legion is a cult of personality, pure and simple, it's stated several times by multiple people in New Vegas. Even Vulpes and Caesar themselves are worried, because if Caesar dies, the successor will be Lanius.

>>53957995
>>53958135

That really seams like something that an experienced shooter could adapt to. Maybe there could be a penalty of some kind for using energy weapons, and then it after using them so many times you get a perk that reduces/nullifies it.

Also games that feature weapon maintenance typically have it be based off repair skill, which works equally well on both kinds of weapons.

>>53958079
You don't really need to have energy weapons as a separate skill to specialize in them. There are already perks for different kinds of small guns despite them being based off the same skill, you could just do the same with energy weapons

>>53958208
anyone whose built a computer or maintained a machine knows that repair is semi-ritualistic, do the thing over and over.

presumably you could just boil ranged weapons down to 'Personal' 'Heavy' and 'Melee' but that's a matter of taste. From there you're looking at circumstantial bonuses and malluses.

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>>53958208
I admit the fact that there aren't four separate repair skills isn't as realistic as it should be, but it's a sacrifice I think is necessary to make it so you can properly invest in a variety of skills, instead of making sure you have all the repair skills you need.

And that skill doesn't really convince me that the weapon skills need to be rolled into each other any more than they already are. And the penalties you're talking about based around usage and getting used to things...it's honestly fascinating, maybe the idea you could get temporary bonuses for stuff through regular use that you'd eventually lose due to lack of use, but that's also super complicated and not something I'd want to include in an RPG especially - in a game it's doable, but I'd have to ask the purpose of leveling up at all if by constantly using any gun you could potentially work your way up to 100 skill points in it.

And on another note, I have to ask - why would someone that's an expert in Small Guns start using an Energy Weapon regularly? It doesn't really make sense from a character perspective, due to preference and experience - it'd be like playing the guitar for years and deciding you'd rather play the pipa all of a sudden, and being frustrated when you realize it's completely different. And it doesn't make sense from a stats perspective either - it'd be like playing Morrowind up to the highest level of skill in Blade, and only then realizing that now you want to do Blunt Weapons. Why even bother?

>>53958208
>you could just do the same with energy weapons
And it is, when it applies. For example, you can take Run n' Gun with either Energy Weapons or Small Guns. But the more technical ones that specifically pertain to energy weapons require the energy weapon skill, like Meltdown or Plasma Spaz. And that makes sense to me, both in-game and in a meta sense as providing another path of character specialization. It has more meaning to specialize in energy weapons if they are their own category. I mean, maybe you would like it if your character could go along just one path and yet trade out a hunting rifle for a plasma rifle and have there be virtually no difference, but that just doesn't sound appealing to me. And to bring up Fallout 4, it definitely makes the most sense to put conventional firearms and energy weapons in distinct categories there, given the weapon modification system.

>>53958128
Currently the Legion operates on a plunder economy. Even Caesar admits that it's merely a nomadic army. Unless they change they will eventually run out of territory to conquer, and as such their economy will run out of steam. Currently the Legion has no true system of government, or education. It's an army without a nation. Presumably all of the Legion's territory is geared for war, with no real development in place for peacetime.

Caesar's view of the Legion is that it's a temporary mechanism to conquer, and rebuild California. This was his plan from the beginning.

The Enclave's plan was nothing at all like this. They wanted to totally discard everything from after 2077, and start fresh. What about their plan is unsustainable?

>>53958128
When Caesar dies, Lanius takes over because he is the military commander but also the second most prominent personality after Caesar.

>>53958128
>>53958128
The view the legion is unsustainable is mainly based on the assumption that none of Caesars subordinates will be able to peacefully ascend to power, and that anyone who does gain power won't be nearly as good a leader as Caesar. That vie is partly affected by the death of the real Julius Caesar, who had did have a successor picked out but it was his nephew who was 19, and had to go through a decade or so of civil wars that he could have lost to restabilize Rome. Caesar has no one young, charismatic, sophisticated or forward thinking as him ready to take over. Lanius is a great military commander, but not an empire builder. Vulpes is a great scout, intelligence master and mouthpiece of Caesar, but not a commander, politician or intellectual that can make a nation. The problem with the Legion is there's nobody as good as Caesar, unlike in Rome where there was a whole senatorial class (and equites class) that could be drawn from for new Princeps and Consuls. If Caesar had a clear successor who wasn't just a brute there'd be more hope for the Legion. Unless somehow conquering New Vegas makes Lanius a sophisticated philosopher he cant build the empire the Legion was meant to create.

The Enclave may be tyrants, but at least they have a system of government that can survive one mans death and still maintain roughly the same level of effectiveness.

But maybe the Legion could've survived without Caesar, if the devs had actually finished their side like they planned.

>>53958747
>Vulpes is a great scout, intelligence master and mouthpiece of Caesar, but not a commander, politician or intellectual that can make a nation.
Dude Vulpes is Octavian. He's cold and calculating and takes great pleasure in purging what he sees as moral sickness. He even had blond hair in the concept art.

And to say that he's neither a skilled commander or politician is just wrong. Nipton was sacked purely through politicking. How about when as a Decanus he smashed through the enemies' lines and captured their commander? Or the bombing of searchlight?

Clearly he is as cunning, as well, a fox.

>>53958862
cunning as a fox but he rules through fear, doesn't have much in the way of charisma. His entire resume boils down to "I've horribly murdered a lot of people in increasingly sickening ways."

which is great for leading a bunch of Roman Larping raiders but useless for leading normal people.

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What is your stance on Super Mutants?

>>53959707
have no business being on the east coast as anything other than a curiosity. The Master's super soldiers, they vary from being deranged monsters to soldiers who outlived their purpose and who want to make the world a better place.

people. nothing more. But ones with a very specific origin and set of abilities.

Everyone currently in/running a fallout game, who are your PCs? I'm looking for ideas.

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>>53959742
I do find at least the idea of Fo3's supermutants interesting, if nothing else for showing that it's not impossible for super mutants to be created outside the Master's work, and how it could seriously go wrong - what happens when 'the next stage of human evolution' happens by accident, far away from any guidance, and grows up savage. The main problem for me is that I don't think Bethesda really thought that way, and just misunderstood what Super Mutants were and used them as an easy way to explain why no one had really settled the ruins of the D.C. area.

The east coast Super Mutants could have developed their own civilization or something if Bethesda had wanted to actually see where they go from their horrible origins - imagine of Fawkes and Uncle Leo weren't just lucky individuals, but part of a group of Super Mutants that had either remembered some of their past lives or hadn't lost all their intelligence, or even gained some, and ended up leading Super Mutant groups by their whims since they'd have smarts and brawn. It would've been a fun way to explore what Super Mutants would develop into without any sort of guidance like their west coast cousins got from the Master, who developed their different ideologies but still all started from that same place. It's not a bad idea, it's wasted potential to turn a bad idea into something good.

>>53959707
East Coast super mutants should not be canon
There's not much else to say but I genuinely liked Jacobstown in NV

>>53960077
Super mutants are explicitly the product of the master's brand of modification and cannot be created in any other manner, save perhaps being exposed to the remnants of his special batch of toxic chemicals and and FEV that remains in mariposa military base. (something to be said for the NCR exposing volunteers to the stuff for super soldiers.)

You could do something along similar lines if you made the mutants more unique. Personally? I'd push an 'MIT run by deranged scientists who need to be removed' and go full OWB with the products.

Centaurs for instance are created by tossing random animals into vats and watching them fuse and the result that crawls out is put to work by the master's telepathic abilities. Could have them all be a product of off again on again augmentation experiments that lose and gain funding depending on the whims of MIT's funding committee,

So what does this mean if people are closer than the max range?

Do my players get a +5% bonus to hit chance per hex?
Sounds doable but it might be a bit too strong for snipers because those could just take out anybody at close range

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>>53961639
pic related

It's starting to look like Starfinder will be a fuckin good game to adapt to Fallout

>>53961639
>>53961651
can i get some fuckin assistance over here you guys

>>53958878
>2017
>still upset about Nipton
Wew lad.

His resume boils down to "I've constantly surprised the enemy with unexpected and devastating strikes". Razing Nipton was done to send a message. Not only was it shocking to the NCR that a town so far West was razed with no resistance, but that it was done so in such a theatrical manner. Are you forgetting that there was a whole quest dedicated to spreading word of what happened?

Searchlight was equally shocking to the enemy, and was an act of pure cunning. One day the NCR's most fortified Camp is fine, and the next it suddenly get irradiated and everyone inside dies or worse.

There's no examples in the game of him brutalizing Legionaries, unlike Lanius who actually rules through fear. Vulpes is respected because he gets shit done.

>>53963525
stop posting vulpes, technology is a sign of weakness

>>53959707
They should be hunted to the last. Almost all of them are Auschwitz guard tier warcriminals, and a lot of them still support the Master's ideology. Even in NV Marcus, the "good mutant", thinks that the Master was right.

They should be eradicated because of the threat they pose to humans, and as justice for their crimes. There is no statue of limitations on mass murder and torture. They don't get to walk free just because they're "oppressed" or "were just following orders".

>>53963525
>no resistance
False. If you explore the town you can find dead settlers with weapons, specifically I remember one with a laser rifle out by the trailers, and a pile of ash with legion equipment nearby. There are also other legion corpses found throughout, if you look in the houses and in the town hall. Nipton didn't just roll over and die. Some people fought back. And is it any small surprise that Vulpes would be full of shit?

>>53963828
Yeah, i think there were a couple corpses in the Mr. Gutsy house, one ashpile by the trailer and maybe one more somewhere else.

>>53963828
A few townspeople fought back. But the Powder Gangers and NCR troopers were killed without much resistance. My main point that the NCR military did nothing to stop the slaughter.

>>53964239
The gangers were armed, but the NCR were not even armored just in fatigues, i don't think they had guns.

>>53964239
His point is that the Legion was so covert about it that the actual NCR military didn't even know it happened, let alone respond in any way.

>>53964239
Do you mean they couldn't do anything? It's not like they knew and elected not to act. And that "whole quest" where you spread word of it ends after you tell one person. Also, Vulpes is a straight-up liar. He'll go on and on about the townspeople. How they were cowardly, how they didn't fight back or try to resist even once. And yet there are clear signs of resistance throughout the town.

>>53963525
>Searchlight was equally shocking to the enemy, and was an act of pure cunning. One day the NCR's most fortified Camp is fine, and the next it suddenly get irradiated and everyone inside dies or worse.
I don't think it was the MOST fortified, though it did have a lot of sentry turrets and intact buildings it generally lacked for walls.

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>>53964459
>It's not like they knew and elected not to act
The reason the raid came as a shock to Ghost is because they didn't even know it happened. The whole point of the raid was to strike fear into the hearts of the NCR, to put them on edge knowing that the Legion can appear seemingly anywhere and burn whole towns down. Which is why there's a quest to spread the word of what happened.

>how they didn't fight back or try to resist even once.
When did he say that? Here's his dialogue.
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/VLegionaryVulpesInculta.txt

His description seems to be that of the people who were rounded up none resisted and simply waited to die in the vain hope that their lottery ticket would save them. Obviously the few townsfolk who did decide to resist didn't get rounded up.

>>53964748
>Which is why there's a quest to spread the word of what happened.
To one person. It's not like you actually run around telling everybody.

>When did he say that?
http://fallout.gamepedia.com/Vulpes_Inculta%27s_dialogue
>Cowardly, though. They outnumbered us, yet not once did they try to resist.

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threadly reminder that robots cannot be gay

>>53965070
Do you think Bethesda realized what they made?

>>53965105
With regards to KLE0 or to Fo4?

Because i don't think they know what both of them are

>>53965070
>>53965105
I think they did. KLE0 was just hanging a lampshade once they realized Assaultrons were smutbait.
>>53965114
That's fair.

>>53954796
Bethesda didnt write NV dipshit.

What attracts you to the Fallout universe?

>>53965740
The setting, although I realize that's not much better than saying "everything". The post-post-apocalyptic angle interests me, especially when more of a survival emphasis is put on it. I like the lore, the different factions and creatures, and I enjoy the games, and more specifically the kind of games they are and the kind of games you can play in the setting. Exploring, questing, interacting with characters, uncovering the history of the old world, making characters and playing them, fighting people and monsters, etc.

>>53967281