How did Hive Fleet Leviathan Fall?

>>53926432
Dude Octarius is an infinite supply of orc. It's like the nids found an infinite resource to mine in a rts. Some shit is gonna go down in fluff and I'm rooting for orks and hoping for some awesome nid/ork/chaos fluff but I think this one is gonna be the nids victory once the orks pull out to go waagh elsewhere for a bigga n betta foight. Everyone is getting bigga n stronga from this conflict. Even the Chaos boyz.

>>53926432
I think it's more that the main tendril fell. Kinda like how Behemoth was beaten at Macragge, but there are still Behemoth splinter Fleets around.

In any case, it looks like Hydra is just gonna eat up Leviathan's remains and make itself into the new big Hive Fleet.

>>53926432
I think "what the fuck is going on with tyranid hive fleets in general" is a better question. They show up as a massive fleet of ships, rampage through space then lose a single decisive ground action which somehow causes them to break into splinter fleets for some reason and those splinter fleets just roam around aimlessly for centuries without regrouping or behaving remotely intelligently for some reason.

It's almost as if GW is bad at writing and has no idea what to even do with half the factions.

>>53926541
>but I think this one is gonna be the nids victory once the orks pull out to go waagh elsewhere for a bigga n betta foight
It's possible, but considering Ghazzy already planned to leave once Octarius turned into Armageddon 2.0 (never-ending war) and went into the 100-year meatgrinder with the best Ork tek in the galaxy after he and the local boyz purged the nids from the planet in the first round (Leviathan threw two or three tendrils at that single planet in response), I'm not sure about that.

Sure, the Orks might be essentially an unlimited resource, but Leviathan only has so many nids at its disposal/biomass it can get before the amount of biomass left on the field exceeds the amount of biomass being recovered.

On average a Hive Fleet is capable ofdevour an entire Imperial World in 50 days (100 days with heavy resistance). The Octarius War (not just Octaria/Octarius, but the whole sector) as a whole has been going on for 100 YEARS.

It feels like Leviathan run of out nids before the Orks run out of greenskins. It doesn't help that team-killing fucktards like Hive Fleet Hydra are coming in and devouring Leviathan's other tendrils, draining it of resources it needs to keep fighting the Orks.

As for Chaos... the only non-daemon entities that made it off Octarius after the daemons noped out of there via passing Warp Storm to find another planet to slaughter was probably ol' Kharn and most of his World Eaters. Anyone else stupid enough to be on the surface of that death world once the daemons left likely ended up someone's lunch.

>>53926636
Tyranid hive fleets will weaken considerably, or even starve to death if they don't keep up their momentum.

They're very vulnerable when they lose a battle that they've committed a lot of resources to.

>>53926893
>They're very vulnerable when they lose a battle that they've committed a lot of resources to
So what happens when they just have to keep eating their own biomass over and over? Because that's probably a large part of what's happening at Octarius (besides new Orks saying "Shadow in da Warp? Wot's dat?" and straight up ignoring the Hive Fleet's shadow as they charge toward the sector from all across the galaxy).

I mean, can a Hive Fleet just recycle the same biomass it deployed to the planet's surface again and again until it finally wins, or does that biomass suffer from diminishing returns (basically more a person consumes something, the less value it has to that person)?

>>53927014
Entropy is still a thing in 40k. The Tyranids can't just keep recycling their own shit.

>>53927014
Yes since they dont have any super tech or reality bending nonsense they can be brought down by attrition since the tyranids are essentially a giant beast hunting prey and if you look into stuff about giant predators they tend to need huge amounts of food(biomass) to survive which is hard when they need to spend it all just moving around and fighting wars so much which can drain them.
Also keep in mind the hive fleets are entering the galaxy from another one. That kind of journey must have spent a large amount of biomass.

>>53927014
Nids generally don't start mass recycling biomass until the battle is won, not during the battle.

>>53927014
Biomass is easily destroyed. Gauss weaponry, for example, leaves little of the target's flesh remaining. Same is true for simpler flame weapons. The Hive Fleet can eat ash easier than gauss dust, but the simple fact is that 'nids lose biomass in war.

Orks, however, being warp-bound creations of the Old Ones, gain biomass THROUGH war, hence Octarius. Not to mention Ork's preferred method of killing is chopping their enemies up, which would to little to decrease biomass.

>>53927034
I mean, yeah they can. They can just convert a bunch of biomass into plants if they need energy.

Tyranids only need to eat in order to expand their numbers. They won't starve any more than an ecosystem could

>>53926636
They can't harvest a planet until they've eliminated resistance. Nids commit huge amounts of resources to planets. Presumably their ships contain huge amounts proteins and lipids, or the nid equivalent, stored during transit. These raw materials need to be committed once they arrive on a planet.

If a defending force wins, they could burn the tyranid bodies, leaving ships in orbit perhaps capable of void battle, but empty of the stored biomass that makes them so dangerous.

>>53927091
How tyranid hive ships behave during intergalactic travel is not something I think has ever been touched upon by GW (they honestly probably never thought about it) but my assumption was always that prior to leaving the previous galaxy they most likely melted down every non-essential organism and wmthe ships themselves would go into a dormant state with minimal metabolic activity. It's not like they need to be aware or combat ready during this time, so they may as well hibernate for the duration.

But knowing GW fluff writers this is probably not the case and they're likely fully active the whole time even though that serves no useful purpose.

>>53927207

>Tyranids only need to eat in order to expand their numbers. They won't starve any more than an ecosystem could


this is stupid as fuck

they fly massive fleets through space at speeds faster than light, something that could potentially take more energy than earth's ecosystems could produce in years

Tyranids are constantly using massive amounts of energy, they need to eat to simply survive. I'm honestly not sure if you even know what entropy means if you think Tyranids only eat to expand.

While I'm sure the Nid fleets can convert light into biomass through some form of photo synthesis, it's obviously less efficient for them than eating by a huge margin, otherwise we'd see nids doing some form of solar farming, yeah?

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>>53927034
>>53927091
>>53927101
>>53927172
So in other words, Leviathan, which had the rather genius strategy of, "I'mma invade this galaxy from beneath and hit 'em all at once! They'll never see it coming!", ended up taking on the Blood Angels (who, let's be honest, were only allowed to survive because there's no way GW's going to let a founding chapter die in the actual rulebook fluff. Press F to pay respects to the OG Imperial Fists) and the Orks in Octarius/the Octarius sector, and possibly spent the last century throwing so many nids at the latter combat zone that it's starting to run out.

I mean, it did start a war with the biggest race in the galaxy in terms of sheer population/numbers. A race so widespread that, quoting the 2nd line of the Ork entry in the 8e rulebook:
>"No matter how far mankind has travelled, they have found that Orks are either already there waiting or arrive soon after to launch their characteristically crude but devastating attacks."

Certainly explains why the Swarmlord showed up (possibly again depending on how one interprets the fluff) on Octarius before the Blood Crusade showed up. Leviathan was getting stressed out that it was spending too much resources on one single planet and sent/brought Swarmy back to put an end to the matter. Which clearly didn't work, since the Orks are doing very well on Octarius.

If I were Leviathan's Norn Queen, I'd be pissed as hell at Hydra for stealing my already low resources at this point.

>>53927290
>they fly massive fleets through space at speeds faster than light

Which is done using the psychic powers of their weird narwhal ships to manipulate gravity. It's literally magic to allow them to function at all

I'm also not sure you understand what Biomass is. Photosynthesis doesn't create biomass. Fire doesn't destroy biomass. Animals using up energy doesnt destroy biomass.

The reason you don't see Tyranids setting up dedicated solar farms is because theyre driven to be constantly moving forward. They want to Thrive, not merely Survive.

>>53927370
the orks aren't just doing fine, their thriving their having the fucking time of their lives.
That inquisitor was a fucking genius

>>53927370
The Swarmlord probably suffer against Orks for the same reason that Necron with "hyperlogical" strategy does, orks just can't be predicted. They never act the way they're supposed to. You know they're gonna fight you, but when you expect a mob of infantry, they've cobbled toghether bikes and trukks, and when you expect the trukks, the flash gitz looted all of them for more dakka instead.

>>53927267
Dont have a citation for this but I read somewhere that the Tyrannids go from system to system by scewing with the reactions of stars, it involved either turning them into black holes or detonating them.

>>53927433
I was speaking specifically about intergalactic travel.

>>53927370
the Blood Angels have been canonically wiped out twice before, I don't see why they couldn't die again

>>53927611

because if my glorious sons of sanguinius were replaced entirely by an army of primarines I'd lose my shit

as it is we've still got the 1st, 3rd and elements of the 4th companies surviving after the guilliman ex machina, but little else besides. which kind of sucks

>>53927432
>Swarmlord arrives on Octaria with a nid army to put Ghazy down
>Day 1: Swarmlord leads army into batlte
>Swarmy and army are choppa'd to death by millions of Ork boyz
>Swarmlord regenerates
>Day 2: Swarmlord heads out with different army
>All the bugs get run over by millions of green-skinned Mad Max-types
>Swarmlord regenerates
>Day 4: Swarmlord heads out again with a ton of Carnifexes as back-up
>Bombed into biomass paste by Air Skwadrons of Ork fighters/ripped apart by Killa Kans/Deff Dredds
>Swarmlord regenerates
>Day 12: Swarmlord charges out with 10 Biotitans. Surely that'll do-
>Swarmlord's force gets literally flattened by huge rocks thrown down from orbiting Roks in the same manner Ghaz leveled Hades Hive five minutes after the nids leave their landing zone
>Swarmlord regenerates
>Day 18,250 (50 yrs later): Swarmy charges out with countless nid Warriors and Hive Tyrants at his back
>They drown under a tsunami of 'lotz of grotz'
>SWARMLORD REGENERATES

>>53927387
The problem with nids is that they're simultaneously OP compared to the other factions (they're pretty much the go-to "I want someone to get curb stomped and don't want to have to explain too much" enemy) and underpowered compared their fluff, which should make them almost literally unstoppable.

>>53927267
I read somewhere that this is partially true, the Tyranids are in hibernation while in deep space, but while they do consume most non-essential creatures before setting off on their journey, they'll still keep several creatures in hibernation for the purpose of repelling boarders and for the preliminary attacks on prey worlds.
However, they do keep Tervigons awake inside the ships during travel to repel boarders when they first enter the ship.

>>53927790
Yeah, if Tyranids were treated more sensibly they'd be an even bigger threat. The best way to stop them would be space warfare on the fringes of a system. Instead we get cases where the bugs breeze through several planets, growing exponentially, and then suddenly getting stopped by a single defense when logically they should be at their strongest and the enemy their weakest.

>>53927611
>wiped out twice before
I'm sorry, when did this happen again?
The only OG chapter I know getting wiped out wholesale is the ol' Sons of Dorn.

>>53927967
You know what GW are? Silver age comic book writers. I can't believe I've never seen the comparison before. They throw out ideas they think are neat, give some quasi-scientific explanation for it they don't really understand themselves, and never think through the implications of their own creations. You know, like a goofy one-off villain who could wipe out the human race with a thought but instead just makes Jimmy Olsen think he's a dog for an afternoon.

>>53928238
Pretty much. Necrons have finished science, and yet seem to lack technology that we or other races in the galaxy take for granted. Likewise, the Tyranids have supposedly eaten a dozen galaxies and learned every evolutionary trick in the book, and yet they're still pretty limited compared to stuff on earth

>>53927775
>Day 12: Swarmlord charges out with 10 Biotitans. Surely that'll do-
>Swarmlord's force gets literally flattened by huge rocks thrown down from orbiting Roks in the same manner Ghaz leveled Hades Hive five minutes after the nids leave their landing zone

I would probably just call it a day by then.

>>53928238
>>53928348
>>53927967
Just look at Orks themselves. They spawn in ridiculous numbers, need little or no education, but have space flight capability because reasons. Yet they get punked by marine chapters that canonically have less than 2k members total.

>>53927775
I'd watch that saturday morning cartoon

>>53926432
Leviathan "fell" as in its main thrust into the galaxy was halted. Most of the smaller tendrils survived, with some being eaten by Hydra. GW probably realized they backed themselves into a corner with the time skip because reasonably Leviathan should be everywhere by now. They had to push the tyranids back to being a "their main Army isn't even here yet!" Threat since having the majority of leviathan being there would take away from chaos.

Also, it's been too long that Leviathan have been the poster Nids, I'm ready for new hive fleets and color schemes. Hydra is likely going to be the main fleet from now on

>>53928727
So which was the 'main' thrust of Leviathan? The one two Baal or the one that was headed toward Terra before Kryptmann redirected it to the Ork Octarius Empire?

Because you'd think the tendril that directly threatened Terra itself as the bigger tendril than a tendril that threatened a 'much beloved Founding Chapter homeworld'.
F'ing GW and their obsession with space marines...

>>53928348
Or Tau, the dudes with robots and giant mechs and plasma guns that work better than the Imperiums but are canonically like the 2nd or 3rd least advanced of the main races.
>>53928529
That's one of the less egregious ones. If you can buy that marines are so super awesome that 2000 of them can conquer a whole planet of normals (and if you can't, the setting pretty much falls apart), then it's not much of a stretch. Organization and discipline count for a LOT, and those are what orks are worst at.

>>53927387
Nids starve to death. Entire Hive Ships have been found by space marines, dead and drifting in space.

>>53927207
>nuh uh tyranids always win

That's not how it works mate.

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daily reminder:
tyranids will consume ice giants, and gas giants
there is hundreds of times more mass in them than on earth.
tyranids will outnumber everyone by 1000s to 1
tyranid hive fleets are literally the size of dozens of planets worth of mass.

>>53928838
I think they soft retconned it to where the main thrust of leviathan was the cryptus tendril, while the ones hitting Octarius and the one currently being eaten by hydra were originally the main thrusts

>>53929667
>>53929780
Just like how the Earth ran out of energy and starved to death within a few thousand years? Makes sense

>>53930015
>Just like how the Earth ran out of energy and starved to death within a few thousand years?
Last I checked Nids don't drag an entire sun around with them when they travel, so that's not really an apples to apples comparison.
>>53929942
So basically it was retconned into making the BA's survival more amazing.

Figures.

>>53930061
even with magic you can't science some people. Nids can starve. If he doesn't get it, it's only because he doesn't WANT to get it. not even magic can fight reality bending powers like the will to be right no matter what

>>53930061
>Last I checked Nids don't drag an entire sun around with them when they travel

And they also don't have the entire biomass alive and actice at once when they're just cruising through deep space.

It's the same principle as a colony ship

>>53930093
Nods can hypothetically starve in the same instances a planet might starve and over similar timescales. If a Hive fleet can drift to a star over the course of a century, they'll probably be fine.

>>53926432
Because plot device, you stupid fucking prick. Same reason as anyone wins anything in any of those stupid ass books that make zero sense.

>>53930151
>Because plot device, you stupid fucking prick. Same reason as anyone wins anything in any of those stupid ass books that make zero sense.
Sounds like OP struck a nerve.
Let me guess: nid player?

At least the Swarmlord actually beat nearly all of of Khorne's special characters (sans Angron) when they showed up on Octarius trying to start shit.

All while his bugs were still fighting a nonstop war with Ghazzy's Orks.

>>53930139
They can't. The weakness of Nids is that biological technology is ultimately horribly flawed. For example every single "door" on a nid ship is in fact an organic structure along with every single wall and floor. On a ship the size of Manhattan or bigger. Because this is all living tissue it needs constant nourishment, a circulatory system pumping food into it. If it doesn't get this nourishment the tissue dies off and becomes necrotic, rotting away. Every square inch of a Tyranid ship needs to be constantly fed and pumped full of alien ichor or else it will kill the entire ship. The infantry and escorts can go dormant/be absorbed as biomass, but the hive ships can't. And if they starve the entire invasion is cancelled.

>>53926846
>Hive Fleet Hydra
>traitors
>HYDRA
>unknown goal
> H Y D R A
>mysterious
> H Y D R A
Y
D
R
A

alpharius_get_the_tyranids.jpg

>>53930292
(you)

>>53930292
Couldn't have said it better.

>>53930061
Well that, and to get rid of leviathan as the main fleet. even in shield of Baal the cryptus tendril wasn't anything special, it was just one particular tendril pretty far from the rest of the fleet that happened to be heading to Baal. It doesn't even show up on the map for tyranid invasions

>>53930616
The Dante novel has Dante saying that the Hive Mind has a singular hatred for the Angels. That's why it focused its on the Angels. It's not out of the question that the Hive Mind gathered up most of Leviathan and threw it at its most hated of enemies (second only to the Eldar).

>>53930233
>At least the Swarmlord actually beat nearly all of of Khorne's special characters (sans Angron) when they showed up on Octarius trying to start shit.

Eat a dick, you cunt. The Swarmlord beat jackshit. The combined Tyranids and Orks forces fought off the Blood Crusade until the Warpstorm took the Blood Crusade elsewhere.

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>>53930887
>assmad Khornefag still pissed that the WAAC list couldn't beat Ghaz or the swarmlord
Look at all those heavy hitters being sent into one battle, that kind of force should roll through anything. Instead they got fought to a standstill and claimed no noteworthy skulls. They were also here long enough for a shit ton of mortals to show up and join, and only the daemons left in the warp storm. The rest of those Khorne flakes had to fight their way out

>>53927775
>Day 24675: All Tyranid flesh is green, app carapace a brilliant red due to ingestion of metallic compounds. Pyrovores ride upon Carnifices, which are armed with fleshborer hives. Tervigons no longer birth Termagants - Termagants now ride atop Tervigans. All gaunt genus secondary limbs enlarged to be scything talons. Shrikes combined with Venomthropes to limited success - now behave erratically, erraticness deemed within acceptable parameters. All species vocalizations synchronized. Biovores moved to frontline duty.

>>53931034
And again, the Tyranids AND Orks did not defeat the Blood Crusade. For all you know, the Khornates could have claimed tons of huge Ork nob skulls and warrior beasts before the Warpstorm took them.

Get it through you thick skull. The Tyranid and ork presences are massive. It would have taken years to purge them from the world. In most cases, the Warpstorm that the Blood Crusade used to travel around lasts only a few hours in the same location before moving. There is simply not enough time.

>LONG ENOUGH DUUR

Fuck off, you loser. This was addressed yesterday. Warp travel is fast and traitors can ride Warpstorms. There is no LONG ENOUGH. The Khornates mortals won't lag behind the daemons.

> The rest of those Khorne flakes had to fight their way out

And so what? Kharn and his warriors are still around and they fighting the Alpha Legion now.

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>>53927387
>>53927207

you're a fucking idiot. Even re-arranging biomass takes energy, as does using psychic magic, they are always losing energy, which they need to eat again.

google entropy dumb fuck

So this is how nids work right?
>nids do something
>eat to recover energy of commanding all those fucking nids
>make more nids to eat more
>you need to eat more to make more nids
>you will never have enough nids
>YOU NEED MORE ENERGY
>YOU NEED MORE NIDS
>WE REQUIRE MORE VESPENE GAS
>create utterly inefficient method of both travel and consumption to eat more
>you probably end up hungrier than when you began
>fail a consumption campaign despite having magnitudes more troops and orbital bombardment
>your other hungry limb decides to eat the remaining campaign because fuck it
They're stupid as hell then. How the fuck are they a threat?
>muh more numbers than stars in the sky
Big fucking deal if you're starving yourself more than an insecure 15 year old girl. 13 Reasons Why Tyranids Fucking Suck

>>53931133
>Being this mad

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>>53931602
OF COURSE I AM MAD.

>>53931171
>>53931459
Plants you dumb fucks

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>>53931171
>mentioning entropy and psionics in the same sentence
>thinking science has any place in 40k lore

>>53927014
>So what happens when they just have to keep eating their own biomass over and over? Because that's probably a large part of what's happening at Octarius (besides new Orks saying "Shadow in da Warp? Wot's dat?" and straight up ignoring the Hive Fleet's shadow as they charge toward the sector from all across the galaxy).
You're still loosing energy. Sure the nids have hyper efficient recyling, but you're still looking at diminishing returns.

>>53931672
>photosynthesis
>in space
>with no fuckhuge leaves to collect as much radiation as possible
Fuck it, I guess. May as well go full retard instead of half-retard

I remember reading Tyranids would begin cannibalizing if they were low on energy. It's typical nature at work:

Lots of food - lots of people.
Lack of food - lack of people.

Are there any details on how many daemons Ka'Banhda led to go destroy Leviathan or did the hive fleet just kinda get swallowed into the warp rift and torn apart in there?

>nids are the only race that has to follow the laws of conservation of mass/energy in 40k all of a sudden
confirmed for only good player faction with any stakes involved. are other factions even trying?

>>53933042
if they didn't they would be unstoppable

>>53931034
I expected Blacktoof to be on that list. Don't remember if Ghaz killed him or just beat him into submission.

But the Overfiend is a bad ass leader to begin with.

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>>53931069
>Day 50000:Orkoid fungal symbiosis was subverted, and heightened by Tyranoforming growth factors, until the creatures were reproducing at a startling pace, new offspring erupting directly from the flesh of the old. Orkoid psionic resonance fused with Tyranid synaptic control, merged with Ymgarl flesh-shaping and Genestealer phage cells, engorging, evolving, adapting wherever they intersected. wretches grew into grotesques. The grotesques grew into abominations. The abominations grew into nightmares. And when none could withstand the nightmares, they turned on the Orks and Tyranids, plundering their biomass to feed into their own psionic web. A devourer was born, a horrendous new power that expanded from from its hidden places like a metastasizing cancer. A New Devourer.
The Orks unleashed their most apocalyptic weapons from the depths of their arsenals; missiles that detonated into miniature singularities, Waaagh!-powered Gargants that rained down bolts of crackling green psychic energy, and gargantuan reptilian Squigs whose breath was atomic fire. But the Orks could not defeat the New Devourer.

A mighty swarm of Tyranid creatures lumbered out to oppose the New Devourer's threat, towering Bio-Titans that had been held in reserve for a final death strike. But the Tyranids could not defeat the New Devourer.
Eyes bloodshot, but still staring at the countless monitors arranged on his ship's bridge, Inquisitor Kryptmann covered his face with his hands and sobbed.

What nightmares had he created?

>>53931628
>Ghaz managed to supercharge the Orks into wiping Octarius clean of tyranids even though they were just on the verge of finishing off the Orks
>tyranids have cleaned at least 2 planets in the Octarius system of Orks, once was in a single day, without swarmlord even being there
>Khornes WAAC list containing every OP character except Angron failed to cause lastin damage to a planet half full of Orks and half full of tyranids, who had just been fighting each other for decades

Khorne is a shit
>b-but it takes a long time to kill all those enemies
Yeah it also takes a long time to wipe out tomb worlds and forge worlds but there were battles in the blood crusade that lasted long enough to do exactly that

>b-but they probably killed a bunch of nobz and random hive tyrants
Khorne sent his greatest generals to fight a bunch of no names? Pathetic. Khornes probably pissed as hell at the offerings of unworthy skulls

>>53935429
Nah man, Khorne died in that invasion. RIP
Yes I know I'm wrong but it's no less wrong then the idiot from yesterday who would not stop trying to get people to believe that the orks and nids allied against the eternal jobbers that are chaos

>>53935429
>>Khornes WAAC list containing every OP character except Angron failed to cause lastin damage to a planet half full of Orks and half full of tyranids, who had just been fighting each other for decades

Armegeddon was turned into a half daemon world by the Blood Crusade. Please, motherfucker, find where it says that the daemons did no lasting damage in the text.

You are a lying shit.

>Yeah it also takes a long time to wipe out tomb worlds and forge worlds but there were battles in the blood crusade that lasted long enough to do exactly that

Not really. The Ultramarines defeated Damnos in short order.

>Khorne sent his greatest generals to fight a bunch of no names? Pathetic. Khornes probably pissed as hell at the offerings of unworthy skulls

No, jackass, they were there to reap skulls and shed blood fort as long as the Warpstorm lasted above the world. There is no such thing as no names. In only exists in your meta-sense stupidity. Warbosses are warbosses and huge trygons are huge trygons. Each worthy of harvesting. The Crusade like it's SAID IN THE FLUFF had no specific destination or target. They pop over a world unleash hell and then leave regardless what what happened on the world because they are TIED TO THE MOVEMENT OF THE WARPSTORM.

And Ghaz and the Swarmlord aren't dumb enough to expose themselves to the Khornate onslaught. They would be behind billions of Orks.

You utterly lost this debate in the most humiliating of manners.

>>53935458
Not him.

Combined might. The Hivemind is smart enough to direct it forces to ignore the Orks and focus in the daemons. So is Ghaz.

>>53935581
That's not what he was saying though. He was very specific on the allying part.

>>53931459
the'yre basicaly 100% energy efficient, it's been saiid that when 2 hive fleets fight, nothing is lost

>>53935887
That's just propaganda.

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>>53935558
>Please, motherfucker, find where it says that the daemons did no lasting damage in the text.
How about the fact that it doesn't say anything about Octarius getting a daemon world make-over, something really worth mentioning.
Seriouly, you're asking us to prove a negative. The proof is on YOU to prove that the Blood Crusade physically affected Octarius.

>>53935558
>>53935581
>>53931133

See pic related. Also
>still being this mad that Khorne's best didn't do jackshit to affect the war on Octarius

>>53935920
but untill we get something cortradicting that we have to assume it's true otherwise we might as well ignore all of the stuff in the codex's

I wonder if ghaz and swarmy ever stop fight for a day and just watch saturday imperium cartoons

>>53935581
This faggot was acting like they actually allied, as in the Orks and Tyranids stood shoulder to shoulder as brothers in arms and used their combined strategies to overcome the blood crusade. It's not much of a stretch to think the Orks and tyranids focused more on the massive army that suddenly appeared in their midst than they did on each other. It's completely lore breaking to have them ally

>>53935558
No you prove that Octarius was turned into a half daemon world. Also prove that the attack only lasted a few hours, or that the mortals materialized with the warpstorm as well, or that the Orks and tyranids merely survived the onslaught, or that Khorne didn't specifically send all of his champions to the most intense war zone in the galaxy on purpose and they failed to claim any noteworthy skulls. You can't prove any of that because there isn't enough information.

There is equally enough evidence supporting the "it was only a few hour drive by" stance as there is supporting that it was a major battle that lasted for an undetermined amount of time that was meant to claim the skulls of Ghaz and Swarmlord but it failed. Until we actually get the full write up, no one is right or wrong, it's all speculation and headcanon

>>53931171
>Thinks any of the writers at GW put thought into actual science in the lore

>tfw finally thought we were getting a a campaign book not involving the imperium or chaos with the Octarius war
>tfw chaos is still gonna stick its dick into it
There were rumors that Octarius was going to be the center of a campaign book, and I'm pretty sure it's just gonna end with Ghaz and Swarmy fighting off the Khorne crusade without any real resolution. Thanks GW, not even a purely xenos conflict can happen without "HEY GUYS WE THOUGHT THERE WASNT ENOUGH CHAOS HERE SO WE BROUGHT EVERY MAJOR KHORNE CHARACTER TO OCTARIUS!"

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>>53934706
>>53931069
>>53927775
Nice, I'ma save that

>>53927790
>>53927967
IDK, sometimes I feel like you less defeat the 'nids, and more convince them that this particular sandwich is too spicy, and it's more resource efficient to move to a different sandwich.

>>53936674
Asshole, the line of text about the whole event says nothing outside the standstill and daemon leaving. That's what I pointed out.

YOU MADE the claim that the daemons did no lasting damage. I made no claim at all. It's on you, you retard.

Xenosfags are literally the scum of the Earth. Except Necronfags, they cool.

>>53939953
Chaosfags just salty about being bottom-barrel NPC race

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>>53937866
>No you prove that Octarius was turned into a half daemon world.

Nope, that anon made the claim that the Blood Crusade made no lasting damage on the world. I demand that he proves this.

And going by the Blood Crusade devastation and the daemonifaction of Armageddon by just appearing and ALSO every daemon incursion including Shadowbrink caused widespread corruption and alteration of the planet surface, it's a safe bet. That's how daemon invasions work.

>Also prove that the attack only lasted a few hours

The text says that most attacks lasts hours and even if we get generous and say a whole day it won't be enough time to crush the Orks and Tyranids. Such an undertaking would take years.

>that Khorne didn't specifically send all of his champions to the most intense war zone in the galaxy

Easy. The text says that the daemons follow the storms and that they have no specific destination or target.

>they failed to claim any noteworthy skulls

Prove it.

> stance as there is supporting that it was a major battle that lasted for an undetermined amount of time that was meant to claim the skulls of Ghaz and Swarmlord but it failed.

Fuck yourself. The first lines of the fluff says that the Blood Crusade was just a random party that followed the Warpstorms and went with them if they leave.

Eat dick. Your side is the one headcanoning like crazy.

>>53940029
Not an argument. Not like there as ever one. Xenosfags just cannot handle facts.

Except Cronbros. They cool.

>>53940033
Oh so you don't have proof that Octarius got daemon worlded? Nice headcanon you got there. Shadowbrink had an artifact that opened up into a warp rift, there was no storm. Also, Mordian, terra, Iyanden, Fenris, and various worlds of Ultramar all got invaded by daemons and had warp storms open up and didn't become half daemon worlds
>The text says that most attacks lasts hours
>most
Most being the key word here. 2 times it met its match, once was at Octarius. Prove that Octarius, the only battle out of thousands that they felt the need to talk about and make a whole force org chart, falls under the "most"

>can't wipe them out in a day
But again, nothing saying it was only a day. And Orks were able to wipe out a whole planet of tyranids in short order and the tyranids cleaned Orrok in a day. Khornes forces had half as many Orks and tyranids to deal with and they were fighting each other and they failed to wipe them out. They didn't even get close, they were fought to a standstill.

>no specific target
Every single Khorne champion who isn't skulltaker or Angron was there, they didn't all just so happen to show up at one particular battle just cause. The blood crusade was comprised of various armies going in 8 different general directions, so unless you think all of these champions and the greater bulk of the Khorne marines stuck together for the duration of the crusade while a bunch of no-names did the rest, this was a special gathering.

>prove it
Only swarmlord and Ghazghkull are noteworthy enough to make the force org chart, and neither of them was killed. no one gives a shit if Doombreed killed a random warboss, or how many random hive tyrant skulls Kharn offered

Nowhere in the text does it say the attack on Octarius was only a few hours, turned Octarius into a daemon world, or that Khorne had no interest in claiming Ghaz or Swarmlords skulls. You're headcanoning just as bad, go feast on cocks you insufferable slaanesh worshipper

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>>53940033
So how many of Khornes finest do you reckon died ignominiously being pulled down by ripper swarms or Lotz of Grotz?

>>53940418
Everyone of the cults, gors and world eaters at the minimum

>>53940033

>Tomb Worlds, Forge Worlds, Hive Fleets
Tau safe again

>>53940348
>Oh so you don't have proof that Octarius got daemon worlded?

Except that I made no claim only pointed out what the Blood Crusade did to Armageddon.

So motherfucker I asked for proof for that the Blood Crusade did no lasting damage. Ever fork up the proof or apologise.

>Most being the key word here.

And you have no proof that it isn't within the most.

>But again, nothing saying it was only a day.

The span of the warpstoems usually in hours. What have you any evidence that it expended for many years which would have taken to wipe out the Tyranids and Orks.

>And Orks were able to wipe out a whole planet of tyranids in short order

There is no timeline for that.

>the tyranids cleaned Orrok in a day.

I would like to see that in text. Show me where it says one day.

>Khornes forces had half as many Orks and tyranids to deal with and they were fighting each other and they failed to wipe them out. They didn't even get close, they were fought to a standstill.

So you throw more headcanon and ignore the fact that the Blood Crusade objective wasn't to wipe out the Orks or Tyranids. They were there as long as the Warpstorm allowed. Even if they were winning and had their enemies at their mercy, the daemons would have left with the storm.

>>53940514
>Every single Khorne champion who isn't skulltaker or Angron was there, they didn't all just so happen to show up at one particular battle just cause. The blood crusade was comprised of various armies going in 8 different general directions, so unless you think all of these champions and the greater bulk of the Khorne marines stuck together for the duration of the crusade while a bunch of no-names did the rest, this was a special gathering.

Wow you fucking waste of flesh. Motherfuckerr. no matter would you headcanon the text is clear. The Blood Crusade as said in the text had no destination or target. The Storm took them to random places and one of them happened to be Octrarius.

>Only swarmlord and Ghazghkull are noteworthy enough to make the force org chart, and neither of them was killed. no one gives a shit if Doombreed killed a random warboss, or how many random hive tyrant skulls Kharn offered

Moron, there are more Orks on the planet than Ghaz and whatever mentioned. There is the Overfiend the Master of the place and his Warbosses.

>Nowhere in the text does it say the attack on Octarius was only a few hours,

Hours or more. The Warpstorms lasts for a short finite time.

> turned Octarius into a daemon world,

Never claimed it did. Merely pointed out that it's within the Crusade's abilities and it's a safe bet.

> that Khorne had no interest in claiming Ghaz or Swarmlords skulls.

The Blood Crusade came to the place at random They did not come specfically for Ghaz or the Swarmer. Eat the most rancid Nurgle dick, cunt.

>>53940454
The crusade didn't go anywhere near the Tau worlds, but can you imagine how assmad these Khornefags would be if their WAAC list got stood up by Tau instead of Orks and Nids?

>>53940529
>Doombreed killed a random warboss, or how many random hive tyrant skulls Kharn offered

You don't give a shit in a meta sense, dumbass. But Khorne will be pleased with the offerings.

>>53940538
>The crusade didn't go anywhere near the Tau worlds

Prove it. I notice a pattern with you making claims that you cannot back up.

The Blood Crusade was comprised of 8 waves that sailed in different directions across the galaxy. For all we know, wave 6 smashed into a sept or two.

>>53940582
for all we know literally every one of the others ended up on T'au and spreading out from there

>>53940538

It is fitting, make the god of assmad assmad

>>53940514
>I would like to see that in text. Show me where it says one day.
Second to last sentence, faggot. It was even less than a day, they killed all the Orks by nightfall.


You do realize all of this is pointless and until we have all the information, both of us are equally right? Your stance is just as headcanon as mine, and my stance is just as valid as yours. Deal with it.

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>>53940683
Fuck, here's the pic.

>>53940683
> both of us are equally right? Your stance is just as headcanon as mine,

Except that I cited the facts within the pages themselves like how the Blood Crusade waves had no destinations and just rode the Warpstorms to whatever worlds they took them. You insisting that they intentionally targeted Octria is not only headcanon BUT WRONG

>>53930350
>The Swarmlord opens it's mputh
>"I am Alpharius."

>>53940582
>prove it
By the throne, do you get paid to be an insufferable faggot or is it just a hobby? the map for the blood crusade shows a general area, and the Tau empire is nowhere near it. I may have interperated the picture incorrectly, however, so that claim that the blood crusade never touched a Tau world cant actually be proven or disproven. There isn't enough info

>>53940823
>the map for the blood crusade shows a general area,

That's just some of the areas they visited and it doesn't seem to cover all 8 waves. So yes, you did interpreted it incorrectly. Now apologise.

>>53940741
I didn't insist the crusade was sent there to kill them, I just said it's equally possible that that's why EVERY KHORNE CHARACTER EXCEPT ANGRON is present in one battlefield as it is that everyone randomly showed up with their best troops in the biggest (known) war going on in the mortal plane. Nothing in the text proves or disproves that, and I'm not trying to claim that I'm the only one right.

just wait until the full write up from GW comes, we'll see who was more in the right. Until then we're fighting with barely any evidence to support or disprove our claims

>>53940941
Okay, I'm sorry that i said something wrong on this Patagonian taint braiding forum, I apologize to you. I'm also sorry that you've reached a point in your life where an online anonymous apology is the greatest sense of satisfaction you'll receive all week. And I'm most sorry that abortion wasn't an option for your mother back in the day and she got stuck raising the worlds most insufferable faglord

>>53941022
Apology graciously accepted. Don't do it again.

>ITT Khornefags rage about a topic involving Nids, both sides fight, no one wins or backs down

It's amazing how much the fans come to resemble their factions

>>53940033
The Battle ends with no one winning because Khornes forces fucked off/pussied out. But who would have won if they stayed?

>>53930292
this is true, but there are several mechanism to dimish the consumering of bio-fuel, like deshydratation, fat saturation, etc to enter dormancy and survive extanded period of no food (just look at tardigrad)
also, it's not because nids work on biological tech that they can't have non-organic material
a shell don't need to be fed, for example, and in old trees the weight of the plant is actually mostly supported by the dead part of the trunk

>>53941226
They would've been ground to paste between the neverending hordes only seeing differently-colored bodies on the battlefield for once.
It might take a while, but it would happen.

>>53927207
>ecosystem could
Ecosystems gain massive amounts of energy from the stars. Tyranids do not.

>>53941295
I don't think so. See the daemonkin rules. As they fight and more blood is shed, the more daemons of Khorne are drawn into battle and the more powerful they become.

>>53927387
>Photosynthesis doesn't create biomass. Fire doesn't destroy biomass. Animals using up energy doesnt destroy biomass.
You are an idiot. Molecules are not biomass. Metabolism creates biomass using energy, and destroys is to create energy. There need to be an energy source.

CO2, and H2O are not biomass.

>>53931672
Plants do not work that way. You can't just magic biomass out of sunlight and dreams, plants need finite resources from the soil in order to grow. (Resources that the nid dex states that they harvest after they conquer a world, leaving it a dead husk useless even for terraforming) There is always going to be a hard limit to the hive's resources, you can't create matter from nothing.

>>53927967
>The best way to stop them would be space warfare on the fringes of a system.
The best way you can fuck them up is to build some sort of bombs /warp devices andbury them deep into the planets nids want to eat. If you lose/sacrifice the planet, blow it up/take it into the warp once the feeding commences.

>>53941446
And only half the combatants have blood that counts, as per the Tyranid rules - Khorne hates icky ichor even if the skulls sorta work.
So you're only getting half as much blood for your effort as you should, while your opponents are going 'oh hey, some variety for once' and tear up the Named Character Brigade.

>>53932097
The latter

>>53941569
Not really. A daemonkin warbrand boarded two Tyranid Hiveships and the butchery within the two ships caused the daemons of Khorne to be summoned out of the Warp to join the fight. Ulrimately, the Khornates overran the two ships and won.

>>53941226
If Khorne keeps sending daemons then no one wins, it just becomes a meat grinder involving 3 parties instead of 2. If it's just the forces present, and whatever daemons normally would get summoned into this type of battle, then Khornes armies would have eventually been ground down by attrition. Those cultists and beastmen aren't lasting very long since they have nothing to eat except each other (unless grotz taste good). I can't imagine all of those champions tolerating each other for long in a standstill battle before they start infighting or going off to do their own thing. And once that crusade breaks apart, they'll fall much quicker to the fully united forces of Orks and the singular swarm of the tyranids. This is all speculation of course, the real answer is "who does GW want to win?"


And the. GW decides to end the Octarius war so they can focus on more chaos, so the warp storms wipe out all the Orks and Nids on the other planets and the crusade effortlessly plows through the Disorganized armies of Octarius

>>53941594
So what we've proven here is...Games Workshop is horribly inconsistent with what each army is capable and incapable of and never fact check their own stuff.
Cool.

>>53941616
Angron's Dominion of Fire lasted 200 years, anon.

>>53941594
I fucking hated that story, not because the Nids lost but because it made no fucking sense. They couldn't adapt to an army whose only tactic is to retardedly charge headlong into the enemy forces while swinging a melee weapon of some sort? Just fucking shoot them, or send toxicrenes after them, or take advantage of their rash behavior and lead them into ambushes. Tyranids have shown to be more than capable of any of those things, them losing to bezerkers makes as much sense as Tau losing to bezerkers. Literally any other type of chaos marines would have made sense

>>53941697
>as much sense as Tau losing to bezerkers

Tau lost to Zerker bikers in the same codex.

And it's more difficult than you think. The ships tried everything to kill the marines but couldn't. The two ships even flooded, IIRC, themselves with acid to kill the marines but that didn't work.

I mean some of these guys fought in Khorne's Realm. So there isn't much that the Tyranids can do to surprise them.

>>53941569
What part of "does not care from where the blood flow" do people not get

>>53941616
>no one wins
I strongly disagree.
EVERYBODY wins.
Big fucking eternal constantly escalating meat grinder is what all three of this factions call paradise.

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>>53941796
The part where it's been explicitly stated that tyranid ichor is 'worthless' to Khorne.

>>53941944
And the daemonkin codex has named warbands that specialize in hunting Tyranids and making offerings of their gore and skulls for Khorne.

Clearly, this bit is retconned.

>>53941944
Internal inconsistencies in warhammer fluff? Never!

>>53942015
>>53942019
DAILY REMINDER
DO NOT LISTEN TO /tg/ NIGGERS ABOUT 40K FLUFF UNLESS THEY HAVE A DIRECT SCREEN SHOT QUOTING THE FLUFF.

ESPECIALLY CHAOS FAGS.

i do not believe anything you say until you screencap a quote from the books

>>53942033
I in fact do have the Khorne daemonkin codex and unfortunately the wankery is there. A bunch of melee faggots beat the Tau and tyranids

>>53942033
>AGAINST THE SWARM

>Led by packs of snarling Warp Talons, the Harvest audaciously tore their way through the Immaterium and straight into the seething innards of a Tyranid hive ship.

>Spilling into the guts of the mega-beast, the Harvest set about slaughtering the writhing creature from the inside out. Though it sent showers of acid and swarms of weapon beasts against them, the hive ship could not purge its tormentors. Carving a path through the fleshy walls and pulsing viscera that confronted them, the Harvest slew the enormous beast in the name of Khorne, before digging in to resist the inevitable counter-attack. Sure enough, Tyranid bio-craft soon latched onto the hide of their shoal-mate, spewing swarm after swarm of horrors into its carcass. Yet the Harvest counter-charged time and again, the body count rising until Daemons tore through the veil to lend their blades to the battle. Finally, the last Tyranid beasts fell, bodies riddled with bolts and brutally sawn apart. Ichor stained and victorious, the last of the Harvest howled Khorne’s praises into the void.

Apologize.

>>53940418
Hahahaha..Grotz. Snotlings anon. A veritable tidal wave of snotlings. Snotlings appearing out of nowhere, bursting from the ground, being bulk dropped from orbit. They arent even able to really damage anything, but the sheer tonnage of them starts to crush daemonically infused ceramite, bones forged by the emperor himself and now blasphemous, begin to crumble, all the while the snotlings keep raining from the sky, shrieking, before impacting into the writing mass.

>>53942058
>>53942068
SCREENCAP OR I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU.
I DO NOT TRUST YOUR ABILITY TO READ OR YOUR ABILITY TO EXTRACT THE INFORMATION FROM THE READING OR YOUR ABILITY TO INTERPET IT.

SCREENCAP OR YOU ARE A LIAR

>>53942101
>SCREENCAP OR I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU.
Noone cares whether you believe or not.
/tg/ shitposts for the sake of shitposting

>>53942101
The codex is in the 40K general. Download it and then ctrl-F.

I will continue to copypasta.

>>53942068
>946.M41 THE THREAT WITHIN

>The Harvest erupt from blood-portals within the fortress monastery of the Black Ravens Space Marines Chapter. Days of fierce fighting follow, during which the Harvest kill every last loyalist within the monastery’s walls and use its defence lasers to blast apart the Ravens’ orbital shipyards. Bloodied and exalting, the Daemonkin drop the fortress’ void shields and prepare for the true battle as a tendril of Hive Fleet Behemoth fills the skies.

>985.M41 MIRED IN BLOOD

>The Brazen Beasts face a splinter of Hive Fleet Behemoth on Horos. Though all but exterminated, the Daemonkin are victorious, drowning the planet in Tyranid ichor.

>>53942146
Vs Tau

>Many armies in the 41st Millennium make use of bike-mounted warriors for reconnaissance or raiding, but the Daemonkin have no use for such subtleties. Instead, they deploy their bikers as fast-moving line breakers. The Khornate bikers carve through the enemy time and again, looping around after each pass with howls of bloodlust before gunning their engines and charging into the foe once more.

>Nowhere was this tactic more successful than during the Skullsworn attack upon the Tau colony of Ral’eth. Led by Agrand the Annihilator, hordes of Daemonkin fell upon the orbital defence batteries nestled amid Ral’eth’s polar crags. They overran the garrisons they found there, before pouring out of the mountains toward the towns that dotted the tundra beyond. Here, however, Tau resistance suddenly stiffened to spectacular effect. Evacuating their civilian populace south with calm efficiency, the Tau then deployed swift mechanised Hunter Cadres against the invaders. Hitting and fading with practised skill, the Tau forces used the open terrain and the psychotic fury of their foes to their advantage. The Skullsworn were soon strung out across the icy grasslands. They chased furiously after Tau gunlines that rapidly deployed, fired several punishing volleys, then vanished once more like smoke on the breeze.

>Only when Agrand loosed a great wave of Chaos Bikers did the battle shift in favour of the Daemonkin. Racing forward through the Tau firepower, the Chaos Bikers drove their charges home before the foe could make their escape. Suddenly, the Hunter Cadres found their lines smashed and their transports crippled by the headlong assault of the bike-mounted renegades. Soon enough, with their foes reeling, the main Daemonkin forces were able to amass once more and push forward, finally overrunning the cornered Tau upon the marshy Yl’aeth peninsula.

>>53942190
>>793.M41 ALL IS DEATH

>Like the fury of Khorne himself, the Wrath and the Eightscarred fall upon the Tau colony of Shau’Nesh. The aliens fight bravely, deploying incredible technologies to blast great furrows in the Khornate ranks. Still, the Tau are outnumbered and, despite their heroics, overrun. Crazed with battle-lust, the two Daemonkin hosts then fall upon one another, battling frenziedly until both are all but wiped out.

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>>53942015
>named warbands that specialize in hunting Tyranids and making offerings of their gore and skulls for Khorne.
nothing you have posted says that. my disgust for /tg/ chaos fags, and their inability to extract information from books remains 1000% justified.
you are the definition of a /tg/ chaos nigger

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>>53926432
>Hive Fleet Leviathan fell
no it did not fall.
we dont know what happened to it.
all we know is that it disappeared.
the leading theory, is that baal entered a warp time bubble for several years. the nid fleets just flew away when they couldnt get to the planet in the time bubble. it is likely that they are out there, in the cold of space. waiting to hit again.

>>53927387
>They want to Thrive, not merely Survive.

Well then they should be building gigantic networks of solar-collecting ships around stars and just sucking carbon and the other elements they need directly out of the star. A single star contains more energy and matter than thousands of planets do, even ones with life. Nids should show up, dismantle all the rocky planets in a system, and use the resources to begin building Dyson Swarms around the local star.

Which come to think of it is pretty damn grim dark. The advance of Tyranid fleets could be seen by stars in the sky one by one going out as they were cocooned by the harvesting swarms.

>>53941405
Except that's wrong, Hive Fleets are an ecosystem. The Hive Ships draw in energy directly from stars, so does all the Tyrannic flora when they Tyrannoform a planet's surface during invasions.

>>53942146
>>53942190
>>53942200
This is worse than gathering storm and endtimes put together, holy shit. None of those make sense, even by 40k standards

>>53942566
Yeah, the fluff has been getting bad for awhile now.

There's literally no way for a single warband of anything to beat Tyranids on a planet's surface, it's supposed to be an apocalyptic planetary scale war that requires orbital support and millions of troops. But somehow some guys with chainaxes kill "every last Tyranid" when an entire planet's biosphere gets hijacked by alien genetics that spread nests and spores like hyper-efficient weeds all over the globe, constantly respawning shit.

Modern GW doesn't understand scale.

Honestly, biomass is overrated. If you have absolute mastery over evolution and access to speedy space travel, the resources of space are probably easier to exploit and infinitely more plentiful. Asteroids and comets hold all the material you could ever need and stars provide virtually infinite energy. You only need an organism to use solar energy for digestion and another to retrieve the raw materials.

Imagine it, great flotillas of extraterrestrial flora in orbit around a star. Towards them stream enormous swarms of drones, hauling chunks of ice and rock to the flora flotilla to be digested. In return, they are rewarded with various nutritious secretions, which they return to their hives in order to fuel reproductive activity.

In other words, space bees and space flowers operating on a system wide scale.

>>53942602
They have zero sense of scale whatsoever. In the time it takes one warband with chain axes and maybe some bikes to kill 1 million gaunts, the hive mind has been actively consuming the biomass literally everywhere else on the planet and has spawned 1 billion more. There's absolutely no way an almost strictly melee force with very little discipline could have traveled around the entire world and killed all the tyranids faster than they could reproduce or wear them down through attrition. The tyranids could get BTFO in every single battle and not kill a single marine and it wouldn't matter. As soon as the warband moves on, swarms of rippers move in and consume all the dismembered tyranids. Literally no loss in biomass for the Nids. As those idiots keep themselves occupied with waves of gaunts, assuming the tyranids are too stupid to adapt their tactics to the countless ways they have to counter bezerkers, the tyranids have drained the oceans, consumed the corpses of everything the warband slew, ate all the forests, and have begun draining away the atmosphere. At that point the tyranids could straight up ignore the bezerkers as it consumes the planet around them. Even with the tyranids being hit with the stupid ray, that fluff makes zero sense.

Not even gonna start with that Tau shit, it just makes the Damocles debacle look like an even bigger bag of dicks.


Throne, this fluff is so fucking retarded.

>>53942602
To be fair they never ever did, nor their numbers, nor the implications of tech in their narratives. But previously, it wasn't taken seriously and operated on rule of cool "this was on metal albums let's do this"

In old 40k I could see a lone Warband of khornites taking on a hive tendril alone and prevailing through the sheer power of fucking metal. But 40k no longer runs on the power of fucking metal.

>>53942858
Tyranids aren't after raw resources, they're after genetics.

>>53942879
Fucking exactly. No one gets this anymore, not on GW's writing team or apparently in the fandom because I have to explain this shit to retards in fluff discussions every time. GW does such a bad job of representing Tyranids these days half the newfags who play the game and don't play nids themselves literally aren't even aware Tyrannoforming is a thing. You see comments like "hurrr what are Tyranids solar powered" and it's like, I don't know, what the fuck is powering that planet-wide fucking carnivorous Tyranid murderjungle that just popped up in a matter of days? Maybe the fucking sun just like every other jungle in existence?

Give me back decent writers for nids dammit.

>>53926541
>It's like the nids found an infinite resource to mine in a rts.

Other way around, Ghazzy is already pulling boys from his farms Octarius being one.

The nids doing nothing with it are strictly the resource being farmed.

>>53942982
Not quite. The Orks aren't taking any kind of material benefit out of Octarius, they're combat getting experience instead. You could say the Orks are using it for training, while the Tyranids are using it for farming.

The only thing the Orks are "farming" are Tyranid teef, which is currency only amongst their own kind. So really they're just flooding the Orkonomic market with inflation, but it's almost a certainty that the amount of gross tonnage in Tyranid teeth leaving the Octarius sector is less than the amount of mass in Orks and their material assets coming in.

>>53927207
>>53927014

You come off as someone who hasnt been reading the fluff all that long but has made up for it by diving hard into it.

You get things wrong and make assumptions that you just shouldnt beyond even the normal /tg/ fluff wars.

>>53943019
>Not quite. The Orks aren't taking any kind of material benefit out of Octarius, they're combat getting experience instead. You could say the Orks are using it for training, while the Tyranids are using it for farming.


Stop posting, go read fluff.

>>53943058
I've read the fluff. I'm not the guy you're responding to in >>53943034 you dumbass.

Also that guy is pretty much right anyway, so I'm not sure what you're so butthurt about.

>>53942913
A hive fleet could leave some bees/flowers behind after a conquest and then swoop back later (or another fleet passes through) and gobble them all up. Tons of biomass from otherwise unused resources.

>>53943082
There's basically nothing left when they leave to make that worth it. They drain planets into dry empty husks deader than our moon. Just a ball of brittle rock sapped of all moisture, atmosphere, useful minerals, everything.

>>53942913
Shield of Baal was the last good tyranid fluff that actually made them seem like a threat. Now their greatest accomplishments are almost defeating the blood angels and fighting Khornes blood crusade to a standstill.

7e fluff took a huge shit on the Nids with the daemonkin codex and the mechanicum codex. They completely forgot about how tyrannoforming basically turns your world into a death world before the tyranids even show up. They seem to have completely forgot just exactly how tyranid adaptation works, because we see them losing in ways they've shown hard counters to before. There's tons of ways to counter bezerkers.
Shoot them. Bog them down with gaunts before bombarding the area in bioplasma. Huge fields of spore mines they can't get through. Spam all aerial units and watch as they run around chasing gargoyles, not being able to do shit. Spam acid blood units so eventually their weapons and armor melt away. Spam venomthropes and toxicrenes. Swarm them in genestealers. The idea that an entire fleet of tyranids with no other opposition on the planet had no way to counter a single warband of bezerkers is ludicrous

>>53943078
Youre so wrong on so many things, its literally not even worth the time to point it out considering youll just fight it every step of the way.

Just leave it at this.
If it has to be pointed out to you how orks gain from the fighting beyond some sort of made up teef exchange you dont know the fluff enough to discuss it.

Same fagging doesnt change that fact.

>>53943141
It's especially ridiculous because Chaos Marines are one of the factions that have the most difficult time of all replenishing their numbers when sustaining losses, so fighting a war of attrition against Tyranids, the faction with the most expendable and efficient troops, is absolutely retarded. I mean one Genestealer can equal one Berzerker in single combat, but for Khornates to get more Berzerkers they have to spend decades and jump through a million hoops of stealing geneseed and getting Dark Mech to try and create new CSM with it and equip them and so on. A Hive Fleet can shit out ten thousand genestealers in a weekend from the recycled biomass of the last waves digested corpses.

>>53943158
>hurr samefagging
>doesn't know orks use teef as currency
Try harder.

>>53926893
They're like space sharks, and I mean the ones in the water, not the marine chapter

>>53943118
I'm talking about asteroids and comets, not planets. There's no way a hive fleet has time to collect and process all of that before moving on.

>>53930292
>For example every single "door" on a nid ship is in fact an organic structure along with every single wall and floor.
It could be made of fingernail and horn equivalents or other organic shit that's "dead" and doesn't need to be fed.

>>53943246
It's just a waste of time. Not enough gain to bother with.

>>53943288
Not to mention that most parts of a Hive Ship are in suspended animation during space voyages. Those "door" valves don't need to open and close because nothing is moving through them. They can't become necrotic because all of the microbes aboard a Hiveship are Tyranids that are part of the Hive Fleet. Entire sections can just be left to "die" and remain perfectly preserved until they're flushed with ichor and reanimated later. This is of course in addition to the non-living organic materials as you and others have pointed out.

>>53943295
>Colossal amounts of water, carbon, and every variety of metal
>Not enough gain

It's not as "fun" to harvest perhaps, but it's a huge amount of resources just waiting to be exploited.

Everyone in this thread is guilty of one major crime: applying critical thinking to GW's retarded fluff policies. Take everything at face value when it comes to new fluff. The minute you look closer and realize that it doesn't make sense, you lose.
Case and point: Tyranid hive fleets. They don't make sense. Fungus-monsters that increase in size the more they fight don't make sense.
Nothing makes sense. Stop being retarded.

>>53943182
>made up teef exchange

Clearly knew Teef are used as currency, called bullshit on your hilarious headcannon teef exchange.

>Still thinks all orks are getting is experience and teef

Youre so stupid you dont even have the knowledge base to know how you lack knowledge in the first place.

>>53943378
This argument only works inasmuch as it ignores all the older Tyranid fluff that made perfect sense per the laws of the universe they function in, like "psychic powers exist".

>>53943413
That sure is a neat shitpost with nothing to back it up you've got there.

>>53943378
>. Fungus-monsters that increase in size the more they fight don't make sense.

To be fair there are anons in this thread laughing at the people who have yet to realize even this very basic fluff.

OCTARIUS TEEF EXCHANGE!!!!

>>53943433
see
>>53943442

>>53943426
Well, it's more of a rationalization than anything. If GW's policy is "only new fluff matters", then why focus on something written in a book three editions ago?
But if what's written three editions ago makes sense, I would choose to quietly head canon it, rather than throw an autism fueled shitfit on an Icelandic fish fishing website.

>>53943452
I don't think I've seen anyone throwing an autistic shitfit except this guy >>53943413

Then again I skipped half the thread. I've just been having a nice discussion with another nidfan about the stuff that does make sense.

>>53943378
The faggots trying to apply real world logic, yes. But even in a setting as bonkers as 40k, there should still be a general level of internal consistency. The amount of contradictory lore makes discussion frustrating.

For example, One piece of lore has Tau BTFOing an imperial crusade on one world, while in another their entire strategy to outrage the pure melee army was somehow overcome by a few dozen bikes. Depending on what lore you choose as the true showing of power, either the Tau strategy at Damocles should have been rekt by the white scars and the imperial crusade wiped out the Tau empire with ease, or the bezerkers are easily mowed down by Tau firepower and inflicted minimal casualties

>>53943467
Clearly

>Not quite. The Orks aren't taking any kind of material benefit out of Octarius, they're combat getting experience instead. You could say the Orks are using it for training, while the Tyranids are using it for farming.

>>53943484
And what are you trying to imply with this?

>>53943467
>Then again I skipped half the thread.

Yes you fucking did newfag.

>>53943497
>I don't think I've seen anyone throwing an autistic shitfit except this guy >>53943413


>Not quite. The Orks aren't taking any kind of material benefit out of Octarius, they're combat getting experience instead. You could say the Orks are using it for training, while the Tyranids are using it for farming.

>>53943502
>newfag
I've played nids since 2nd edition. Suck my nutsack you fucking Dawn of War refugee child.

>>53943514
>I don't have an explanation so I'll just keep greentexting
Okay? That's nice? Maybe go talk to the other special kids and let the adults keep having their conversation.

>>53943516
Then you have no excuse for the severe lack of fluff knowledge.

>>53943525
>>I don't think I've seen anyone throwing an autistic shitfit except this guy

see
>>53943525

At least youre now slinging shitty insults and not shitty fluff.

>>53943526
What severe lack of fluff knowledge are you referring to, exactly? Because I haven't seen you offer a single counterargument in the thread that wasn't just shitposting with nothing to back it up.

>>53926541
green orkanids when

>>53943158
>>53943413
>>53943442
>>53943502
>>53943514
>>53943526
>>53943534
Jesus who is this samefagging sperg

>>53943560
I don't know it's like Carnac tier but he doesn't type like Carnac. At least Carnac will cite fluff for his arguments even if he twists the wording to suit his bias. This dude is just going >nah ur wrong lol without providing any arguments and then claiming we're ignorant retards for not already knowing what his probably made-up headcanon arguments are.

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>>53943058
>Orks don't use teeth for currency

>>53943606
>the teef must be big sharp ivory like fangs to be of any worth
Gee, I wonder what kind of teef the tyranids have

>>53943661
Not only that, it's explicitly stated somewhere I think in the 7th ed Ork Codex that they love fighting Tyranids for the teef.

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>>53943542
The lack that had you jump in on the same side as the guy posting about the Octarius teeth exchange headcannon?

Are you really that fucking retarded? Or are you the same anon trying to samefag?


Misrepresenting points and preemptive autistic name calling doesnt change that the original discussion point you werent here for by your own admittance here >>53943019

>The only thing the Orks are "farming" are Tyranid teef, which is currency only amongst their own kind. So really they're just flooding the Orkonomic market with inflation, but it's almost a certainty that the amount of gross tonnage in Tyranid teeth leaving the Octarius sector is less than the amount of mass in Orks and their material assets coming in.

>>The only thing the Orks are "farming" are Tyranid teef
>The only thing
>Only thing

If you have to be reminded about the ork eco system, and their critical mass point in both numbers and further on in their evolutionary progress then you need to go back and read the fluff.

You could have literally saved us all the trouble by knowing the basics of ork fluff..

>>53943671
That doesnt mean its the only thing theyre getting out of the conflict which is the point that was being discussed in the first place.

The ones the nid fags had trouble following literally from the get go. Its all in the thread above.

>>53943756
>ork eco system
The one that gets devoured at the microscopic level by the more advanced and rapacious Tyrannic ecosystem? That Ork ecosystem? The one that can't grow any spores on Tyrannoformed ground because they get eaten by phage cells?

>>53943019
>Norm queens figured that they could stop the Orks by screwing with the WAAAAGGH economy.
>Deceided the best way to do that was flood it with tyranid teef.

>>53942913
>Tyranids aren't after raw resources, they're after genetics

To be fair theyre after both, they take metals, minerals, billions of tonnes of earth, water and all the gases, so they do like basic resources, but older fluff did also hint they are in an eternal hunt for new genetics

>>53942259
Not an argument. This just flailing around like a tard.
>>53942440
The fluff says it fell and was eaten by the Warp as in most of it.

>>53942566
>Faction A cannot beat faction B vecause I say so

Go away. A single zerker is easily the match for thousands of Tyranids, not to mention that Daemonkin warbands get daemonic help and each warrior within contains a prize.

>997.M41 ONE HUNDRED SKULLS

>Responding to a daemonic incursion on Hyraq II, a Brotherhood of Grey Knights plunges into battle. Crimson lightning tears the skies as the Grey Knights drive the Daemons back into the Warp, only to face fresh assault by the Bloodgorged. Retreating to a ruined temple, the surviving Grey Knights fight for their lives. In death, every Daemonkin they slay brings forth one of the Daemons the Grey Knights had already banished, until they are overrun by the screaming horde.

>>53942879
>>53942913
Fucking /v/fags. Daemonkin warbands aren't made of only zerkers. They have terminators, soul grinders, Lord of Skulls, cultists, etc etc.

They are a full marine force + daemonic allies. That is something beyond what a Hive splinter can handle.

>>53945423
>A single zerker is easily the match for thousands of Tyranids

Ummm what? Marines regularly get their shit pushed in by warriors when theyre close enough, and fair a zerker is better than a marine but a group of warriors would be able to pull it down likely

>>53945443
Then explain how a Khornate warband cleared a multiple Tyranid ships and in another event wiped out a whole splinter fleet on a planet. I mean the fluff outright says that the Tyranid bioship sent showers of acids and huge beasts at the Daemonkin within it but it didn't do anything but make things worse for the ship.

Zerkers are

>>53945503
>Zerkers fighting a sleeping tyranid force in tight corridors where numbers don't count

ok

>>53945548
There is nothing saying that the ships were sleeping. The ship was frantically trying to get rid of the Khornates when it failed, its fellow biosips latched on and poured more Tyranids within it to wipe out the Khornates proving that the Tyranids are dumb. They should have let the bioship to its misery. Anyways, the ship bowels were big enough for huge Tyranid beasts to walk around it and for the swarms of multiple ships to engage in combat with the invading force.

And zerkers don't make shield walls and take defensive positions. They wade into the enemy as deep as they can.

>>53945593
Except all tyranids (save a few patrols) sleep during flight and are slowly woken by other nids when under attack

>>53945593
Tyranids are always sleeping aboard their ships during transit, you fuckhead. Read the fluff for once.

Catching Tyranid ships in deep space before they reach a system and boarding them to try and kill as many as they can before they start waking up is an established doctrine used by loyalist marines to harass and weaken Hive Fleets before they reach the prey worlds.

>>53945423
>A single zerker is easily the match for thousands of Tyranids
Hahahahaha

>>53945423
Chaosfags are the worst

>>53945612
There is nothing saying they are sleeping, again. They could be awake waiting for deployment. And even if it was asleep, it woke up hard as the Khornate enema was administered.

And remember that in previous event where ships were boarded, the sleeping Tyranid ship unleashed a huge of warriors that it overwhelmed the kaballite raiding boarding. Of course, since Dark Eldar are not zerkers that equal thousands of lesser warriors each, they were massacred.

No one cares carnac, go discuss your headcanons elsewhere.

>muh zerkers can fight off one thousand tyranids!!1!

What a manchild. A tyranid warrior with boneswords would facefuck two berzerkers at once.

>>53945632
I meant the ships as in laying dormant and vulnerable for boarding, not the warriors fuckhead.

And the nid warriors were woken up and multiple ships deployed their swarms to kill the Khornates.

>>53945643
>A Khornate warband that can't be above 1000+ marines plus whatever hardware they have destroyed entire splinter fleets of nids
>anon still doubts that a khornate warrior is worth a thousand lesser warriors

Kharn alone when his pistol exploded and his axe shattered, killed tens of thousands in one battle with his bare hands.

>>53945688
Of course, since Dark Eldar are not zerkers that equal thousands of lesser warriors each

Chaos fags believe this

>>53945726
It's not headcanon. It's fluff. It happened. Each zerker must have a killcount in the thousands for that to happen.

A splinter fleet has a fuckton Nid warriors with boneswords but you know what? The daemonkin wiped all of them out.

>>53941492
THEY DON'T MAGIC UP BIOMASS YOU DUMB CUNT!
THEY COLLECT ENERGY VIA PHOTOSYNTHESIS.

Again, nids do not consume worlds FOR ENERGY, they consume worlds to get more raw material from which to MAKE MORE NIDS.

They are a solar powered race.

>>53945768
>They are a solar powered race.

Source? If they are a solar powered race, then the powers of the Burning One wouldn't have worked on them since he was hitting them with solar energy and heat,

>>53945790
BFG has nids being empowered by sunlight.
Also, just because you are powered by sun doesn't mean that you can withstand focused sunlight. A plant starts to burn if you focus sunlight on them via a looking glass

>>53945748
If Dark Eldar are good fighters, then how come they lost an entire sub-realm to Khornate warriors? Checkmate.

>316.M41 DANGEROUS PREY

>After fierce fighting amid the macrotemples of Skeros, the Wych Cult of Tortured Hopes capture a Chaos Lord of the Skullsworn. Bearing him back to Commorragh, the Dark Eldar throw the Daemonkin champion into their gladiatorial arena. Their sport is spoiled, however, when a Bloodthirster bursts from their captive mid-battle. The Daemonic incursion that follows is catastrophic, and results in the utter destruction of an entire sub-realm of the Dark City.

>>53945767
Khorne Berzerker swings his axe at nid that's twice his size and has faster reaction speeds. Nid parries with bonesword. Still has three fucking appendages armed with claws that peel apart battletanks. It rips the berzerkers comparatively tiny head off.

There's basically no other way for that fight to go.

>>53945741
>killed tens of thousands in one battle with his bare hands.
Killing 1 person EVERY second, to reach 10,000 he would have to have been killing 1 person a second for a straight week with no stop

>>53945790
>then the powers of the Burning One wouldn't have worked on them since he was hitting them with solar energy and heat

What? Plants are solar based but if you burn them they don't get supercharged? they die

>>53945826
This. Kharn didn't do shit. Anytime the retarded nu-GW writers come up with a feat that's literally impossible given the timescale, because they have no sense of scale, that shit can be thrown right out.

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Y'all niggas need chaos. Course the zerkers beat them tyranids, cause they got the HOLY SPIRIT IN EM HALLELUJIAH

Dats just the power of the dark gods CAN I GET AN AMEN BROTHERS

>>53945821
A bloodthirster and group of daemons, bloodthirsters are mighty, they can take on thousands of nids, zerkers can not

>>53945822
The fluff straight out says that the multiple ships sent everything they had at the Khornates. They failed. Th Khornates charged and charged again at the swarm killing tons of them until daemons came through.

A Khorne zerker rage and daemonic strength would overwhelm the defenses of the Tyranid warrior,. Swing after swing, careless of the damage on himself. He would kill the warrior and go to his next victim.

>>53945835
Nope. 40Keks works on rule of cool.

And Kharn has like 2 hands. So he can kill IG twice as fact.

>>53945839
Daemonkin warbands sometimes have napalm blood. NAPALM.

You can't beat that.

>Rapacious and destructive, Tyranid splinter fleets are amongst the most dangerous of the galaxy’s many threats; a fact that leads the Daemonkin of the Harvest to actively seek them out. Tyranid attacks upon fortified positions are utterly relentless, as wave after wave of bio-beasts surge forward into the bloody meatgrinder of siege warfare. Stood atop the battlements of their stolen fortresses, the warriors of the Harvest relish these headlong assaults for the wealth of blood and skulls they inevitably bring.

Also the Harvest are expert Tyranid killers. Veterans of many sieges against Tyranids whom they marked as good offerings for Khorne. Tyranid blood and skulls have earned them great favor from Khorne!

>>53931034
What the fuck is a Big Mob?

>>53945861
Retard rage is not an advantage. Size, muscle density, reaction time, and multiple appendages to overwhelm the space your opponent can defend, those are all advantages. Tyranid warriors are significantly more lethal than marines, regardless of how lolangry they are. One rending claw grabs the Berzerkers weapon arm and squeezes, and he's dead prey.

Shit you don't even need a warrior. Two genestealers or a dozen gaunts would do it. Tyranids aren't afraid of death, you can't intimidate them with feats of violence to keep them at bay. They would just surround a berzerker and latch on with all their claws while he hacks away, but there is physically not enough time for him to cut them all before he gets dragged down, and even Space Marines are basically just as vulnerable as a regular human to having a razor sharp venomous scythe-claw the length of your entire arm shoved through their eye socket.

Regular Space Marines win by using clever tactics, force multiplying equipment, overwhelming firepower, air support, artillery, and so on. Berzerkers are basically medieval era warriors rushing headlong into melee combat where nids excel, they would get BTFO so fast it would be hilarious. Even the rules in BFG support this. Tyranids were more than twice as deadly in boarding actions as the other races while Khorne ships got a mere +1.

>>53945951
Dude, you are overestimating the nids. The daemonkin codex says that the daemonkin are like the deadliest melee warrior in the galaxy. Also the harvest are veterans of MANY wars against the Tyranids and they are still around. Their tally of Tyranid skulls grows absurdly huge as they chase splinter fleet after splinter fleet.

>you can't intimidate them with feats of violence to keep them at bay

The Hivemind would force them to retreat. Khornates would just charge hard after them.

>>53945935
A large mob

>>53946004
>Dude, you are overestimating the nids.
Khorne ships: Boarding value +1 +d6
Tyranid ships: Double boarding value +2d6-choosing-the-highest

From the game written by the guy who wrote all the original Tyranid fluff.

A smaller Tyranid ship outnumbered by Chaos Space Marines would win more than half the time.

Chaoscucks BTFO

>>53946007
How many Orks are in 100 Big Mobs?

>>53946027
BFG is discontinued though and Andy Chamber says that a single marine chapter can conquer the Starcraft sector. He is a shit.

>>53946056
>Andy Chamber says that a single marine chapter can conquer the Starcraft sector

He said conquer the terrans, he claimed for zerg and protoss too they would need more, this seems reasonable to me

>>53946051
A lot of Orks.

>>53940348
its blood for the blood god not specific blood just blood. Quit trying to speak for a chaos god as to worth.

>>53946310
Tyranid codex specifically states Tyranid ichor doesn't feed or empower Khorne.

>>53946373
And daemonkin disagrees. DAEMONKIN is newer.

>>53946385
Doesn't matter. A codex about a specific faction takes precedence for fluff regarding that faction. Daemonkin doesn't get to tell anyone how Tyranids work, only how Daemonkin work. Also, they're not even a faction anymore in 8th. Literally squatted.

>>53946427
Nope, newer fluff takes precedence over older. The rules got shifted around but the fluff remains.

>>53931133
If you beat an attack to a standstill that's generally the, first step towards victory.
So yeah, chaos was losing.

>>53946883
Nope, the Tyranids and Orks standstilled each other many times in the war. Eventually, one of them gained the advantage. So yeah, no, they weren't.

>>53928348
The best example of this is the sickle like blades the hormigaunts use. Try stabbing with a knife held that way, you can do nothing but an overhead downward stab, it's super ineffective for defense and makes it damn near impossible to duel with a knife. When you hold it right side up then you gain stabbed, slashing and thrusting attacks. So why the fuck do hormagaunts hold it in such an ineffective manner?

>>53945767


Aaaahhh, you're the dude who autistically tried to argue that the Daemons getting their shit pushed in at Shadowbrink was actually a good showing for Chaos and a low showing for the Tyranids. I recognize your shitty arguments.

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>>53946385
>>53946512
post screencap of your source or stfu

>>53943479
OR maybe you realize that every piece of 40k fluff has unreliable narrators telling it so they lie about what happened.

>>53946385
Post a screen cap from daemonkin where it says khorne likes tyranid blood suddenly, so far I've only seen reference to skulls and here's the thing: Taking someones skull doesn't mean its feeding khorne.
Taking skulls is a religious practice by khorne followers so I see no reason why them getting trophies would change previously established fluff.

>>53947338
Already posted.

See >>53945933

Source is daemonkin Warp Talon entry page. Download the daemonkin codex and ctrl-F it.

>>53941697
Ships should've vented itself / detached that area and left it behind.

>>53947402
that doesn't say anything about feeding khorne.

>>53947381
Nope, the practices of mortals and worship fuelss the power of Khorne also as it shown that the butchery of Tyranids empowered the daemons of Khorne within the Warp to break through the walls of reality.

And motherfucker learn to read or get out.>>53947402

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>>53947402
>Already posted.
and shown to be wrong.
you typing does not say anything about tyranid blood empowering korne. your ability to interpret information from the books is literally nigger tier. i want you to post a direct screen cap of the book so i know that you arent fucking up the writing with your interpretation. and then you have to show me the exact sentence showing that tyranid blood gives korne power. i want you to circle it in red ink.

untill that happens, you are a nigger. you will be an eternal nigger until you do that. an eternal chaos nigger that shits up 40k threads with your retardation.

everything you say is a fucking lie

>>53947454
Idiot, the Daemonkin only hunt around the galaxy for skulls and blood sacrifices for Khorne. They see the Tyranids as a great wealth of both blood and skulls. If the harvesting of Tyranids blood displeased Khorne and doesn't power him, then the Harvest wouldn't be among the foremost Warbands of the Daemonkin andhe wouldn't have sent his empowered minions to help them.

>>53947455
>also as it shown that the butchery of Tyranids empowered the daemons of Khorne within the Warp to break through the walls of reality.
how?
I've read the short story (as shitty as it was) and I dont see anything that actually referencing that this is good for Khorne.
The only reference to how ichor and skulls actually affects khorne is shadowbrink, its worthless.

>>53947477
>and shown to be wrong.

Nope, you didn't do anything of the sort. The rest of your post is a non-argument.

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>>53947519
>Because suddenly Khorne followers are intelligent
Come back when you have an actual source faggot

>>53947535
You do know how the Daemonkin work right? The Daemonkin slaughter the enemy and feed Khorne a lot of energy and he gives back to the daemonkin in the form of Khornate powers and daemonic help. Fuck sake, do you guys suck at the lore.

>>53947575
Actually, they are. The Harvest are expert siege masters and their slaughter of the Tyranids have earned them great favour from Khorne.

Also Kharn is a combat genius and well as a good tactician.

>>53947541
you posted a bunch of bullshit that you THINK makes nid blood feed korne.
nothing in the actual text you posted shows that.
i want you to post the exact sentence showing that it does.
the burden of proof lies on you.
we have already posted screencapped proof that nid blood does not feed korne.

you have posted nothing but bullshit.

>>53947613
Wrong, again a non-argument when faced with actual evidence.

The Harvest and Beast HARVEST Tyranids for blood and skulls. They wouldn't gain power and favour MID BATTLE if the Blood of Tyranids is worthless. It's the opposite, Khornates become stronger ans stronger as the fight with the nids continued.

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>mfw this khornefanboy is still booty blasted that his WAAC list of special characters accomplished NOTHING on Octarius
>b-but muh headcannon!

>>53947670
>still has no proof

Headcanoning as always it seems.

>>53946512
No ones arguing it didn't happen or isn't canon. What we're saying is it doesn't make sense, even by 40k standards. There's a certain level of consistency that needs to be there, and all of these examples break that. Even if a warband of 1000 bezerkers killed 1 tyranid a second it would still take them a week to kill a billion, which the tyranids could have easily reproduced in that time. a week is about how long it took the tyranids to consume the shieldworlds of cryptus, so those bezerkers could win every battle and there's still no way they could have got everywhere around the world to stop the consumption of the planet. It makes zero sense no matter how you look at it. Yes it's canon, but applying even the settings retarded logic to the situation, it makes no sense at all. It's shit writing, absolute shit, by people who have zero sense of scale and don't read their own fluff.

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>>53947685
>Octarius war is still going
>no special characters died
>no mention of the planet getting daemoned like Armageddon
Considering the previous track record of the blood crusade this is by definition pathetic

>>53929862
But anon, Tyranids only consume biomass

>>53947758
Neither the atmosphere, the ocean (besides what lives in it) or the precious metals they extract are biomass anon.

>>53947728
What event are you referring to? The boarding action or the planetfall fight?

If you are referring to the boarding action, then the Tyranid ships are in SPESS (duh). They can't recovered their losses. The Daemonkin would be a like a chainsaw inside someone's belly grinding away at everything. Also for some reason you ignored the fact that fed by the butchery inside the ship, the daemons of Khorne joined the battle flooding the ships with even more warriors of Khorne. It's like having a second chainsaw lodged in your belly.

As for the planetfall, The Beasts warband defeated the splinter Fleet but was utterly decimated. What more do you want? Your faction cannot win all the time. Also it's not like the Tyranids are good at long wars of attrition was we saw in the Admech codex. They can be grinded down eventually by brute force.

>>53947746
There is just a few lines of text with no details. So you have nada proof. Take the example of the other anon.

>>53947421
>detached that area and left it behind.

The Warp Talons would open another portal to the other parts.

>Ships should've vented itself /

And let go of all that biomass? No, too greedy.

>>53947825
>Also it's not like the Tyranids are good at long wars of attrition was we saw in the Admech codex. They can be grinded down eventually by brute force.
Tyranids are eternal jobbers because no one at GW plays them, they get out adapted by tau, they get out attitioned by Admech, they get out-dueled by any named character.

dont give me the "Your faction cannot win all the time" BS that only holds true for other people who get to be amazing in their own codex, tyranids aren't even allowed to win in their own because of shit Cruddace.

However just a little internal consistency would be nice.

>>53947855
So you finally admit that khorne didn't accomplish jack shit on Octarius because there is as you said, no proof.

>>53947897
>whole thread is about tyranids supposed victory over the blood crusade
>forgets about shadowbrink

Yeah, you will never be satisfied

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>>53947654
>>53947576
>>53947685

>>53947915
You are the one making claims not I. If you have proof that they not accomplished anything please provide it.

>>53947785
Wtf when did they start mining and shit?

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>>53947926
the whole thread is about how much of a fucking failure the blood crusade is to not just wipe Octarius out. The bar for success for tyranids is so freaking low that anyone who doesn't wipe the floor with them is an utter failure.

>shadowbrink
you mean the story you've repeatedly claimed is no longer canon due to chaoswank in new books? Because I dont actually doubt that they just retconned the shit out of shadowbrink because they cant have anything being a threat to chaoses big dick.

>>53947967
They've always done that?

>>53947975
Khorne not wanting the blod of Tyranids is what got retconned, not the battle. Jezz the victim complex.

>>53948035
The battle is literally retconned because the reason they won was that fighting tyranids provided zero sustenance for the daemons.
you cant remove one and keep the other.

>>53948056
The Hivemind was draining the Warp energy of the daemons also so that would have woeked.

>>53947825
The ship one I'll let slide, even though daemons shouldn't be able to manifest directly on a bioship without a nearby warp rift.

The planet one makes no sense no matter how you look at it. I wouldn't give a shit of the tyranids lost if it was in a way that was consistent with what we know about them.
>what more do you want?
Something along the lines of "they reaped an impressive tally of skulls, but even these warriors could not defeat the overwhelming numbers of the tyranids. One by one, the bezerkers were pulled down by the unending tides of gaunts as the planet was consumed around them."
At least that makes sense. Explain how a single warband, even if equipt with everything in the codex, could defeat an entire world of tyranids, or admit it makes no sense even by 40k standards

>>53948091
>so that would have woeked.
Headcanon doesn't count, that explanation has as much merit as both the new and old fluff being canon and the zerkers simply gathering tyranids skulls because they think it pleases khorne and khorne just cant bring himself to stop them.

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If all this Khorne wankery in the daemonkin codex is the newest canon fluff, and we take the feats of single warbands at face value, it makes the blood crusades failure to do anything but fight to a standstill even more pathetic. A single warband of bezerkers is established to be able to wipe a world of tyranids faster than they can reproduce or consume the planet, but a force thousands of times that size, with all the greatest heroes, and many of those aforementioned warbands, couldn't do anything but fight to a standstill?

>>53948107
Maugan Ra defeated a world of Tyranid too. Shadowsun led a fleet action against a splinter fleet that saw it destroyed without a single loss on the Tau side. HIVE FLEET SCARABUS was defeated by the Cadians without the loss of a single guardsmen company It's pretty much in the standard of 40K.

And text says that the drowned the world in Tyranid ichor. Which means they left no corner of the world where the Tyranids could harvest in peace. So the most logical explanation is that they gathered all their dudes in rhinos, bikes, and Land Raiders and road around the world killing all the Tyranids in sight and bringing down their towers and hives preventing any replenishment of the Tyranids.

>>53948209
Splinter fleets are just 6 to 12 ships. Tendrils are hundreds of ships. There are 2 tendrils at Octria plus Orks.

>>53948260
rode around*

>>53948260
>Which means they left no corner of the world where the Tyranids could harvest in peace.
Bullshit
this is the surface area of the earth 510.100.000 km2
and remember nids can burrow, you aren't flushing them out that easily.

>>53948260
>. Which means they left no corner of the world where the Tyranids could harvest in peace. So the most logical explanation is that they gathered all their dudes in rhinos, bikes, and Land Raiders and road around the world killing all the Tyranids in sight and bringing down their towers and hives preventing any replenishment of the Tyranids.

Look who doesn't understand tyranid fluff at all. Go read the lore again and come back when you have educated yourself, because then you will realize how absolutely retarded that sad attempt at an explanation was. I don't ever want to catch you saying something that stupid on this board again.

I love these threads because shadowbrink will inevitably come up and them chaosfags and nidfags will flock to fight and defend their sides

>>53927775
Only Tuska da Daemon Killa can know such pain.

>>53948365
Tyranids eat stuff and go drop themselves inside acid pools.

Khornates find the acid pool and turn them into boiling blood pools and drown the nids in them. There done.

>>53931034
>Kharn the Betrayer- Legend
my sides.

>>53948426
>khornates ruin acid pool
>a continent away, thousands of acid pools remain undisturbed and continue to spew out more tyranids
>spore continue to rain down since the bezerkers aren't focusing on their ships at all
>flying and burrowing tyranids are all but unreachable

>>53948460
Kharn may be a legend, but that is nothing compared to the power of lotz of grotz

>>53948426
>khornates can simultaneously take down all the pools in all the world

Carnac just end your suffering

>>53948611
Well, they did. The Tyranids ran out before the khornates did. Why do you keep forgetting the daemons that come with the khornates as a feature?

>spore continue to rain down since the bezerkers aren't focusing on their ships at all

Zerkers have slaughter fleets.

And the warbands have all manner of wargear, not just axes. Which includes anti-air stuff.

>>53948690
>The Tyranids ran out before the khornates did
See this is why nobody likes you.

Instead of thinking critically and concluding that that explanation is jackshit, you take it at face value like the mong that you are because it supports your faction and defend it even though it makes 0 sense

>>53948747
I am not biased though. If the show on the other side I would have argued in the reverse because fact is fact. Khornates won the day and cleared out a planet of nids.

If Ra manafed it, then so can 1000+ dudes and thir daemon buddies.

>>53948877
If a piece of lore is retarded then it should be discarded.

This is one such piece

>>53948929
Only GW can discard lore. Your lot is to enjoy it.

>>53941796
It's whence you chav cunt

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>>53945951
>Implying their entire force were just normal zerkers.
Anon everyone forgets daemonhosts. Thid is the average daemonhost, when they die their daemon bursts out and keeps fighting. They could make mince meat out of tyranid warriors, as their weapons are adaptable. They even have their own slew if insane chaos powers. What do they trade for this you ask? Their chance at daemonprincehood along with their body eventually explodeing and the daemon popping out.

holy shit thats hilarious

is octarius still going on or what? because that was always my favourite warzone

>>53926432
Razorwire was deployed infront of the fleet, it slowed them enough to allow a victory

>>53949279
>implying the tyranids will just keep sending in waves of melee troops without adapting their strategy

Even if all 1000 bezerkers in the warband were daemonhosts, they'd eventually get worn down. Even if they didn't and every single one of them survived, they couldn't kill all the Tyranids on the planet before they consumed it or replaced their losses, by sheer virtue of that being impossible. They also have the disadvantage of not having any way to attack flying or burrowing troops, and the only way they can beat ranged troops is to run through a Hail of fire that other fluff has show eats right through marine armor.

The story is shit and there is no way it can be explained

>>53950383
>attack flying or burrowing troops,

Daemons and those flying dragin planes can attack them.

>>53948877
>Khornates won the day and cleared out a planet of nids.
and here is why no one but the most rabbit fanboy accepts this.
Tyranids are not dumb animals, even taking at face value that these khorne dudes are so hardcore that they have enough killing power to demolish a planets worth of tyranids (which is completely retarded considering the things a planet worth of tyranids can take down).
But if we just accept this premise.
Unless they have no clip and speedhacks, they will never, EVER manage to actually track down and kill every single tyranid, once the local hive tyrant realizes that a thousand doom guys with the berserker pack are ripping their way through the endless swarms of nids, they just avoid them. Unless you're telling me they can outrun freaking hormagaunts sprinting the opposite way, gargoyles flying away and raveners just straight up burrowing down.
This is a matter of scale, they quite simply do not have the manpower to cover a PLANET and track all that stuff down.
Even assuming the tyranids dont manage to succeed in a single ambush on them, we're talking about an undertaking that would be extremely difficult with battalions of aircraft carpet bombing the planet.

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>>53950531
>those flying dragin planes can attack them.

>>53950531
A few daemon engines and bloodthirsters aren't going to do shit to the swarms of gargoyles so dense they appear as storm clouds from a distance, and they sure as shit can't do anything about the extensive network of floating spore mines.
>>53951126
This exactly. Replace every tyranid with a tree. 1000 bezerkers facing zero opposition wouldn't be able to track down and cut down every single tree on a planet before new ones start growing back. I'm pretty sure there are vast tracks of land on earth that mankind as a whole hasn't set foot on yet, and we're supposed to believe 1000 idiots walked around an entire world, explored every square inch of it, and killed everything

>>53947967
This has been the fluff since 2nd edition.

They don't "mine" the way other races think of it, they have tyranid plants that leech all the minerals and trace metals out of the ground and get eaten, stuff like pyrovores to dissolve surface metals directly, and magma corers to puncture the planetary crust and release all the trapped gasses in the mantle. They vacuum up the entire atmosphere with their feeder tendrils and then the oceans boil and go with them as vapour when the pressure drops.

>>53954047
>This exactly. Replace every tyranid with a tree.
Perfect analogy.

Then imagine all the trees are bio-engineered killing machines with even more modifications than Astartes, many of which are capable of killing several times their own number in berzerkers, and they're faster and more maneuverable than the khorne forces, with better intel because they're all telepathically synced up to function in perfect tandem.

They have the numerical advantage, the mobility advantage, the intelligence advantage, the terrain advantage, the logistics advantage, the morale advantage, and even many of their forces are just straight up one to one far deadlier than a khorne berzerker anyways!

I don't expect an underage b& like carnac to understand this if even the GW writers can't manage to get it but jesus christ. Get someone competent working there already.

>>53927370
The amount of mass that fleet would need in order to successfully mount a continuous all-fronts assault across the galactic plane is so ridiculous that it couldn't possibly have gone unnoticed. Even the Mechanicus would have been yelling about relativistic anomalies and the stars being pulled out of alignment.

It's obvious (though I admit only now that I think about it) that Leviathan simply modified its vector but was of comparable size and power to Behemoth or Kraken - huge, but trying a different sort of approach, since "push everything through an arbitrary boundary several parsecs in diameter" had failed already, or - and this is good - because Leviathan had to have spent centuries moving into position, it must have been expected that the first two fleets would fail.

It's not a series of invasions at all; it's a single, waved invasion fleet, attacking on all fronts, grinding down the defenders of the galaxy. You can rebuild your worlds in the centuries between hive fleets, but in that same time the hive fleets could increase in mass a hundred times, and seeds countless worlds with orphan organisms that nobody sees arrive, providing beacons for navigation, intelligence on any local species, and reservoirs of biomass on planets never inhabited by spacefaring life that will simply lay itself down for the approaching hive ships to refuel.

>>53928069
Once by Genestealers on a space hulk (reduced to 50 marines, which is the same as wiped out - any Chapter could be rebuilt from gene-seed stored on Mars or their homeworld, but the culture and experience of the Chapter is lost), once by the Black Legion on Mackan during the 7th Black Crusade; only the Death Company survived (who are obviously not great contenders for restoring either the culture or geneseed of the Chapter).

>>53955139
>because Leviathan had to have spent centuries moving into position, it must have been expected that the first two fleets would fail.
It was two and a half centuries after Behemoth but only 7 years after Kraken.

Pretty much every Nid loss I can think of at least addresses the need to defeat the Nid fleet in space, it's just that as a ground skirmish game 40K naturally focuses on ground battles.

Tyranids will win Octarius.
Orks will win Armageddon (Ullanor)

>>53945442
>They are a full marine force + daemonic allies. That is something beyond what a Hive splinter can handle.

LOL No.

>>53956781
Betting that the campaign is going to end with Ghaz leaving Octarius after getting a taste of the blood crusade and realizing they're heading to Armageddon.