MTG: Legacy General

>>53690571
Not sure if it needs a ban, but i wanna know my fellow shitposters thoughts?

>>53690571
I think it's an unhealthy card. If it was banned it would force Delver decks into Grixis or pure UR probably. That would make the URx Delver decks stronger though, since their mana denial package is stronger without DRS running around.

>>53692195
oh, and RUG Delver would return with a vengeance, since it runs the best mana denial package but is gimped by DRS.

>>53692237
I actually went to a win a mox event recently and was blown the fuck out by stifle, it really should return

>>53690571
Honestly, I like where legacy is right now. There's a ton of different decks, there's 10 decks with at least 5% meta share, legacy is easily the most diverse format right now.

>>53692726
I agree, Stifle is criminally underplayed right now. I play 2 in my UW Stoneblade, even though I board it out a lot.

>>53690593
I wouldn't say it needs a ban. It's a very good card, it's quite played, but I don't think it's worth banning. The "issue" is that you don't need to build your deck around it for it to be good.

A bit like FoW, bolt, wasteland, snapcaster mage, top[\spoiler]...

>>53692237
don't know if this is true. Fatal push is still one of the best removal spells in the format. And that's a strong incentive to play Black.

Brainstorm and Wasteland.

>>53696801
Plus black has some of the largest one Mana threats.

What do you guys think of disposses for mono black control? I've been thinking about it a lot lately because it's three mana (ritual range) and can hit explosive artifacts that normally give monoblack fits, things like chalice of the void, charbelcher, lion's eye diamond, and aethervial.

Going to my first locals in a while. What should I be aware of?

>>53697633
What deck are you playing?

>>53697684
ANT in case my name wasn't obvious about it.

>>53697407
Too narrow I feel. Against combo, lost legacy is probably best because you just name tendrils or whatever their primary action piece is. And against prison decks, that's not the type of battle you want to be fighting I think. You are hoping to hit land + ritual + sideboard card just to potentially slow them down, which just isn't worth it.

>>53690571

Yeah, just ban DRS. Might as well ban the cantrip cartel too. Ban force of will, wasteland, and stp while we're at it. I want legacy to be goblins vs merfolk vs eldrazi aggro decks only. What a great format it would be if /tg/ was in charge of magic. Creatures bashing into each other is so cool. Have you guys heard of modern? That's a format that really has it figured out.

>>53697633
you're gonna lose and sometimes there's literally nothing you could have done. Maintain salt ratios

>>53696801
>>53696858
Grixis with Pyro Therapy and Gurmags would probably still be great, but RUG would certainly be a lot better without DRS.

>>53697633
I don't imagine theres anything I can tell you that you don't already know, best of luck dodging the Chalices and Lodestone Golems though.

File: 1495230842598.jpg (10KB, 275x142px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 275x142px

>>53690571
Pls anon, no. We don't need anymore heavy handed bans in legacy. I despise the 1 mana planeswalker, but I wouldn't advocate for it's ban unless its numbers are pushing upwards of 50% of decks running it. Granted It's starting to approach those numbers (45%) being the 4th most played non-land card, but I don't know if legacy can take another SDT level ban this quickly.

>>53690571
Ban drs, then reprint just the black half of him. He still exiles lands and and converts spells into damage, he just isnt overpowered.

What does a good creature look like in Legacy?

As in, like, what's your mental checklist of things a creature needs to be playable in Legacy?

>>53699581
or print the green half. The only reason he would warrant a ban is because he does both I do not support banning him; there might be (doubt it) more diversity in Midrange decks, but Reanimator is super warping when a bunch of decks aren't maindecking gravehate that isn't garbage in other matchups.

>>53701045
Does it cost 1-3 mana and is the effect it has complete bullshit. Other than that cmc can be whatever as long as it wins on the spot.

>>53701326
The green half is already printed on a few cards though, and black deserves to keep mana acceleration and the bleeder archetype.

>>53701045
>low mana cost
>high impact
>immediate value
>cheatable

Note: Creature may require more than one to be a contender. For example, impact and value could be through the roof but it wont matter if it never hits the field.

>>53701366
green half with mana acceleration? Where?

>>53701420
Birds and noble, the lifegain is on scooze

Is BUG Nicfit guy around? I had some questions about BUG vs. Junk builds and if combo matchups were better with the BUG version.

>>53699412
If I splashed color for burn, it would be black for DRS.

Joking aside, if we start to ban cards just because they are good, where the hell will that lead us? It's not like it goes into everything like mental misstep would. Sure it pushes towards BUG type midrange decks, but it's not like they wouldn't go in that direction anyway, although grixis is the most popular delver variant.

>>53701872
The way I see it you are just changing your matchup from reactive to proactive. Are we talking junk as in Thalia+thoughtseize times bazillion?

>>53701872
I'm not him, but BUG is better against T1 combos (Belcher, Reanimator, etc) since it gets Force and Flusterstorm.

If it's not T1, then I'd argue that Junk is better suited because it gets Canonist, Gaddok Teeg, and other hatebears to lock them out, which can get there with a good enough clock or protection of some kind.

>>53702058
>>53702154
I tried the Junk Rhinopod build, even with Thoughtseizes, Thalia's, and GSZ->Teeg after sideboard the fast combo matchups just felt awful. Maybe I just got really unlucky, but the win rate felt around 20-30% vs. storm variants and 30-40% vs. sneak and show.

>>53702171
Hymn -> hatebear is usually good. Then again, sometimes there's just bad draws.

>>53702171
I would imagine you just had worse draws than storm player. Thoughtseize into Thalia seems like one of those uphill battles for storm player. Especially Nic fit and cabal into veteran + cabal.

What do you guys think is the most underrated deck in the format?

for me is classic UB Reanimator (with brainstorm and FoWs)

>>53690571
I'm on board but only because I miss playing Nimble Mongoose.

>>53703001
UB is definitely solid, its still what I think of when someone mentions "reanimator," the main reasons rb is so much more popular are price and ease of play.

Personally I think aluren is pretty good right now, I really like the delver matchups and the deck is very fun

>>53703114
Speaking of mongoose, do any lists nowadays run it?
I kinda want to play some kind of big red/green frog in a blender deck

>>53703001
How the hell is reanimator underrated? Personally I think burn is valid deck (still), but nobody wants to play it. I would love to build some budget jank deck, but everything is either super trash or completely boring.

4x Brainstorm
4x Daze
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
3x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4x Force of Will
4x Living Wish
4x Lotus Petal
4x Ponder
3x Root Elemental
4x Simian Spirit Guide
3x Skirk Alarmist
1x sylvan library
18x lands

rate my meme

>>53705517
>more vulnerable sneak and show, that also has to wait a turn

>>53705605
they will never see it coming. Just wanted to try out the jank morph cards i found in my collection.

File: Unmask.xlhq.jpg (419KB, 745x1040px) Image search: [Google]

419KB, 745x1040px

I'm working on getting the parts to build BR Reanimator. I have a full playset of both Unmask and Collective Brutality. I've seen some decklists run one or the other, but sometimes both. I've been leaning towards Unmask more. What do you guys think is better for the deck?

>>53705517
>Posts deck list with Living Wish
>doesn't post sideboard
Id rate it 60/75

>>53675908

D&T is an easy matchup if you play it right. Fetch basics when you can afford to, play out your artifact mana before Thalia if you can (even if they Revoker it, as long as you have lands they're not revoking your important cards. Bridge is essential for stalling out the game, but if you manage to get two if them it's pretty close to a hard lock. Dack should generally NOT come down as soon as you can play him unless you're taking a vial T2 on the play. It's often better to sandbag him a bit to bait out a Revoker on something else (which you can then block with/Transmute away/sac to Foundry) or to steal an equipment. Use Dack in the late game to make sure that you're not drawing FoW under Bridge. Take out your Chalices and some number of FoW, bring in Wraths for post SB games. Make sure you're not doing stupid shit like playing out Foundry on T2 before you have open mana or preferably Sword of the Meek available so you don't get murdered by Revoker. Unless you get unlucky with your mana or your opponent has the nut multiple Revoker/Mirran Crusader draw, it should be simple to draw the game out to the late game where your deck is much better than theirs.

>>53703277
>the main reasons rb is so much more popular
Is speed. Literally that. You get under deathrite, chalice, your resilient against counter magic, and you have a ridiculously good game 2 for a graveyard based deck. There is a reason UB has fallen off the map and it's not price. I have everything I need to make UB and I'm still rolling with BR.

>>53671442
I've messed around with a DDFT/SI hybrid list a bit but didn't have a lot of success. I might play around a bit more though. I'm not a fan of the unearth-lab man kill. In a list like that I'd play only the tendrils kill. You're never not going to have enough storm, and you'd play fewer "dead" cards.

>>53701781
>Change 4 cards for 12 cards
Sure

>>53708296
Why can't you just throw dark rituals into the ub deck?

>>53708296
Next you are going to tell me burn is played only by highly experienced players who choose that deck because of its complex lines of play. Certainly RB has advantages over UB and can be better in certain metagames, but I'm sure that at least part of its popularity was that it was by far the cheapest tier 1 deck in the format and very easy to play.

>>53709792
That meta game where it was better was a miracles/Drs meta. Now with miracles gone everyone just keeps rolling on RB because it's assumed the De facto best version. It still could be, I don't play reanimator. But having a high density of nut draws is a strong asset in long tournaments.

>>53692726
the bearded dragon?

File: 1484834566372.png (238KB, 285x374px) Image search: [Google]

238KB, 285x374px

pics Maro-related

Why there is no mono red/prison/meme playing magus of the wheelz ?

also :

>merfolk spirit guide (2)(Blue)
>1/2 islandwalk
>exile merfolk spirit guide from your hand: Add Blue to your mana pool.

yes or never ?

>>53709042
A hand that requires a turn or two of cantripping negates the benefit of dark rit and it doesn't pitch to Force of Will.

>>53711430
I would argue that miracles had little to do with the shift in popularity and posit that deathrite and perhaps to a lesser extent, chalice, are the primary factors. Furthermore, the meta in which BR thrives over UB is still very much present.

>>53712018
Black deserves a spirit guide before blue. Then we'd have the jund trifecta. Spirit guides are loopy shaman shite that blue shouldn't be interested in anyway.

>>53698226
>Have you guys heard of modern?
>That's a format that really has it figured out.
I mean, you aren't wrong.

>>53712018
>Why there is no mono red/prison/meme playing magus of the wheelz ?
You're a prison deck trying to kill the opponent before they find an answer to your lock piece. Getting them 7 cards deeper to an answer is WAYYYYY worse for you than you getting 7 more cards is for them.

>>53712018
Also if you want to dig 7 cards down, that usually means you're looking for something. If you're looking for something, you don't have time to play a vanilla 3/3 and wait a turn.

>>53712088
I should have been more clear. I think a long game favors miracles, and ub is designed to play a slightly longer game.l. whereas rb could play like Belcher vs miracles and lean on probability and redundancy. All the counterbalance around made people play drs/decay decks, which rb is slightly better against. Now that miracles is gone and the meta shaken up, reanimator players have just kept playing rb rather than consider ub. On the other hand with all the drs still around rb is still probably better.

Asking here because there's no judge thread and I'm assuming one of you old fucks know your MTG history.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/artifacts-and-color-2003-10-03

At the bottom of the article he's taking about removing Legendary from Krark's Thumb with Artificial Evolution, but did that ever actually work rules-wise? It looks like the answer should be no because Legend was changed to a super type by the time Mirrodin came out

Hey guys. I'm new to magic and was wondering if I should go to FNM tonight for booster draft. I have some questions.

>How much is it to play?
>Do you keep the deck you construct?
>Will I be terribly embarrassed?

>>53715343
Drafts are usually ~$15, you pick a card then pass the rest of the pack along, and do that over and over again for 3 packs. You keep all the cards you pick, but you don't have to play every card (usually you only play around 23 and also play 17 lands that are provided by the store). You won't be embarrassed, aside from prereleases fnm drafts are most oriented towards new players, and people are usually very helpful.

>>53715343
>>53715552
To clarify a bit, the cost can vary depending on the prizes.

>>53714789
Legendary was a creature type until the mirodin set and it would seem it was still classified as such in addition to a super type until the grand creature type update in 2007.

So pretty new to Legacy, but I'm thinking of getting into it since the new LGS I started going to has a pretty big playerbase for it.
Is delver any fun to play? Or do you guys have a good suggestion for an interactive deck? Budget isn't really an issue

>>53717283
If you want interactive id look into esper death blade or nic fit. Otherwise anything with abrupt decays, force of wills, and cabal therapy's in the same deck is quite interactive

>>53715877
I'm honestly surprised and frustrated that they had tribal be a type instead of a supertype.

>>53717283
Grixis Delver is all interaction and is Tier 1 right now, if budget isn't an option. It can be hella fun, as long as you don't care that you'll get riggity rekt by any competent Stoneblade/Midrange player

>>53706106
Unmask increases goldfish speed if your meta is weird enough to not feature drs.dec, Brutality is better in every other way except mana cost since it gains life, wins games every now and then and is card advantage neutral when killing drs or discarding surgical/permission.

>>53705611
> morph cards
> jank

pick one, and don't pick morph

someone post an infinite combo where you can flip a morph card an arbitrary number of times

>>53717751
Thanks anon, I'll look into it.
>>53718082
I played delver way back in 2011 standard, so it might be a bit nostalgic to play a good version of the deck. I guess I'll see what the local meta is like.

>>53718074
They had to for it to function properly. Instants and sorceries cant have creature subtypes, so they created tribal as a noncreature card type that could.

>>53718285
Thanks for the advice. I'll definitely start trying Collective Brutality more.

File: drake.jpg (69KB, 480x680px) Image search: [Google]

69KB, 480x680px

Secret sideboard tech against Show and Tell. Don't tell anyone /tg/

>>53719302
>2011
That was literally more than half a decade ago

File: 1454903826157.png (86KB, 300x340px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 300x340px

>>53720503
what if they put in Omniscience?

File: Image (11).jpg (30KB, 223x310px) Image search: [Google]

30KB, 223x310px

Is this card legacy playable? I think it might be.
my spiral of despair continues

>>53721220
>one for MAYBE one
>non-repeatable in a vacuum
this is no where up to par of what Legacy is looking for...

>>53721220
Digging 5 at instant speed is good for 2 mana, especially when it can hit free countermagic for you to cast. It can also be used to ship cards to the bottom with brainstorm as an imprumptu fetch I guess. The question is really if the restriction is worth getting a card deeper than Impulse.

Hey /tg/, this is my toolbox for Nic Fit

3x DRS
1x Teeg
1x Scooze
1x Tireless Tracker
1x Rhonas, the Abominable
1x Witness
1x Thragtusk
3x Rhino
1x Titania
1x Sigarda

Anyone have any spicy suggestions for silver bullets or finishers?
Also can anyone help me make a decent sideboard for an open (online) meta?

>>53724251
Academy rector + recurring nightmare

>>53720702
You laugh at them when they have no followup action in hand or Ponder into some lands.

>>53721481
>>53721806
So I've been testing it in a UB DDFT list and preliminary results are encouraging, although my sample size is still small. It's in a list that's >50% instants and sorceries so the chance to hit something off it is ~99%. It basically serves the purpose of digging deep to find a Doomsday or a ritual, but it can also draw into a doomsday pile. I see it as a cross between a tutor and a cantrip and it's been working pretty well like that, digging deep and finding specific cards. I certainly don't think it would be good in every deck.

>>53725938
Is DDFT even still a thing without Top?

>>53726730
I'm trying. The loss of top has caused me to try things like peer.

File: 101_DeepSpawn.jpg (149KB, 561x450px) Image search: [Google]

149KB, 561x450px

>MFW I'm putting in Deep Spawn into my UB Reanimator deck for the next Legacy night

Homarids represent! It's got Trample. It can dodge removal. It fills up the graveyard. It pitches to Force of Will.

>>53727589
>ub reanimator
I think ub is the inferior choi-
>with homarids
Carry on.

File: the-unspeakable.jpg (132KB, 450x622px) Image search: [Google]

132KB, 450x622px

>>53721220
Only if you run the full package.

>>53728656
Is it bad that I actually really like cards like this, where you combo them together to get one big bad drop? I find them so satisfying, just collecting all the pieces and playing something big. Maybe I should just become a Yugi-Oh fag.

>>53690593
DRS doesn't need to be banned. there are plenty of ways for any strategy to deal with it.

>>53729873
Or learn to play MtG, because that's literally what many decks do.

Oy boyos, should I finish building nic fit or just build dga/junkblade? Would your answer remain the same under a DRS ban?

>>53731112
Do you want to be the more active player or slow your deck and be on more reactive/controlling side? Nic fit is one of the decks that least benefit from DRS compared to grixis/BUG delver.

>>53731145
I played pox back in legacy like ten years ago when it was semi viable, it was a fun time. I have all but the duals and fetches for nic fit, and there's a lot of spells for dgablade that are bank breaking. Scrims for nic fit are fun but when you're in top deck mode it feels insecure as opposed to how pox used to in the haydays. I like the tap out midrange style of nic fit as well. Basically if I can play black I'm in my element.

>>53731228
Maybe you would like to play Nic fit as recurring type deck. Maybe birthing pod type or play 4 of eternal witness. Should probably proxy some builds myself to get the better feel how the matchup go for the deck.

>>53728656
What I like about this is that all the cards required to get out the Unspeakable are pretty ok and not total crap at all.

>>53733758
Should make a bug nic fit deck with this combo in it. That way if you happened to draw the unspeakable you could just cast it probably.

Noob question coming through.

I'm watching someone play Lands and they check the first card of their deck after the mulligan stage. Is this a Legacy mechanic or is there something in the Lands deck that lets you do this?

Video in question: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkF6N0zacwc

>>53735513
New mulligan rules, been around like a year and a half now guy.

>>53735513
What this guy >>53735583 said. You get to scry 1 if you choose to mulligan your hand.

>>53735583
Is that just for Legacy of for every format?

>>53735624
Legacy or for*

>>53735624
every format.

>>53735624
Every format since Origins.

>>53690571
>A card that might actually need a ban and not fucking show and tell: Edition
This
That little turd honestly is the reason Legacy has turned into this midrange and delver centric mess that it has
I'd rather have miracles than DRS, he pushes so many interesting decks out of the format and he's easily the best 1-drop of all time. It's not like the decks that run him don't have other solid option either. Banning DRS really wouldn't cripple delver, or BUG midrange, or elves, it'd just weaken them a little

>tfw win a legacy event with Dredge
Honestly as long as you can dodge hate this deck will fucking destroy people

>>53738023
Well yes, that is the eternal dredge paradox. The better the deck gets, the more hate people put in their board, which leads to dredge dropping in popularity, which means people drop their sideboard cards, etc. So the "strength" of dredge is always in constant flux but it is a great deck for spiking smaller tournaments

>>53738074
Which is sad because the deck is a blast to play. Didn't always used to be this way either but so much good hate got printed that it's pretty much impossible to avoid, which is a shame because it's one of the coolest decks in the game
Honestly fuck Maro and modern card design, I get that graveyard decks tend to be problems but at a certain point it gets ridiculous. Tormod's is a skill intensive card because you have to know when to use it, Cage is retarded because you slam it on one and they either have an answer or lose
That's why I miss the Miracles MU, because at least it could win without resorting to silver bullet hate

>>53738115
miracles packed rips in the board tho, and thats the shittiest card to play against

File: 1476344392930.png (26KB, 1024x1024px) Image search: [Google]

26KB, 1024x1024px

>>53737986
>I'd rather have miracles than DRS, he pushes so many interesting decks out of the format
2/10 made me reply

Anyone here ever played a coin flip deck with krark's thumb? Might be more of a just a casual 60 card but seems like it'd be fun

>>53737986
I kinda agree with this, no matter how bad it sounds.

>>53740591
I played it in modern and it was fun but bad.. The one big card you get in legacy is game of chaos.

>>53740591
i can't imagine it would ever be good

>>53738115
Its because you need hosers in case shit goes wrong in standard. Just see all the GB delirium decks when EMN came out and Emrakul came crashing down.

Also Maro isn't as fault as much as development, there the ones who actually do the numbers.

What does pack 1 pick 1 mean?

>>53748363
The first pick from the first pack you open in a draft.

>>53748363
Limited fags pls go

I know it's been asked a lot already but anyone going to vegas for the GP?

>>53754131
I wish I could, but sadly New England to Vegas is too much of a hike for my student wallet to make.

>>53754794
New England represent! I'm too poor/busy to go too.

>>53754131
I wish but i live in Minnesota, it's almost impossible to find any legacy events even outside of GPs
Feels bad man

>>53755679
Last I checked we had a pretty large portion of posters in the NE area. Anyways, I've been playing Tezzerator online for about a 2 years now, and the deck is sweet but I'm kinda tired of losing to the variance of not having Brainstorm/Ponder. Is there any other deck I can play sweet cards like Dack and Daretti in?

>>53755958
Three color painter combo
Make it a thing, just go full-on for the combo

>>53756108
Sounds decent enough. I was thinking I would throw all of my favorite cards together in a pile and see what I can make happen. Probably starting with Dack, RB Daretti, Winter Orb, Tangle Wire and Goblin Welder.

So how many of you have a legacy deck? How long did it take?

t. Spike with no money

Also can taking turns ever been somewhat a thing in legacy?

>>53757641
I have a deck. It still has 4 Tops in it.

>>53739072
I firmly believe that RIP is a card that should never have been printed. It completely removes an entire zone from the game.

I'm thinking of making a legacy pox deck now that miracles is out of the picture. I cannot decide if I want it to be mono black with scroll rack or if I want to make it b/g. I know it sounds like a stupid question but I don't want to have to take apart punishing jund to make the g/b version. Any suggestions?

>>53757898
No, it replaces that zone

:^)

>>53757898
Just stifle the EtB trigger

>>53758575
>>53757641
MOno black pox is a fine deck and can even be built very cheaply if it's your style. Not a top tier deck these days (especially a budget build) but a fine deck.

>>53757641
It took about 2 weeks to ship from china :^)

Seriously though, fuck the ridiculous prices of these reserved list cards. If wotc isn't going to do anything about it, then it's up to the chinamen

>>53757641
I built mine over the course of about 3 years while I was a student, but I bought most of the duals and LEDs in one go as a gift to myself for getting a good job that could support my cardboard habit.

>>53738023
Please do bring dredge, I love it.

t. Tezz player

>>53755958
NE has the highest density of legacy players in the US from what i understand. Apparently we also tend to favor combo decks more than other areas of the country.

>>53762797
I thought there was a higher proportion of control players in NE

>>53762797
I thought it was dnt and delver highest desu

File: Doubleface.jpg (117KB, 630x470px) Image search: [Google]

117KB, 630x470px

>>53690571
Hey guys,

What does YOU use to display double sided cards?

Do you take them out of the sleeves and flip them manually? (Even if double sleeved?)
Do you buy two and have one main deck, and one off to the side?
Do you actually use the double-card tokens and have the real card in a clear sleeve?

>>53768370
I double sleeve them and take them out of the outer sleeve and flip them that way

>>53768370
>Do you actually use the double-card tokens and have the real card in a clear sleeve?

This ^

Gonna try to run a league or 2 with some DDFT builds tonight. We'll see how they turn out.

>>53771469
ok well I rage quit the league when I drew dead for so long vs lands g1 that I got pfired out. Think I'm done for the night lol.

>>53771717
Upload video for rekt material pls

>>53759618
Should I run dark confidant in mono black pox? I feel like in playtesting Im in top deck very frequently

>>53773768
theoretically your topdecks should be better than your opponents. I wouldn't run confidant in the main. It think it could be fine in the board for matchups where you really need a constant stream of disruption and a clock.

>>53773792
Okay, I figured that with all the resource denying I can do that bob wouldn't be as crazy as in jund. I'm going to probably play mono black so I can play more sinkholes and run dark rituals. Lands and delver stoneblade type builds are popular in my meta. Any sweet sideboard options. Also something that fucking wrecks D&T?

>>53773927
Dread of night is p good vs dnt. Your delver match up should be decent. I think you should consider running a couple surgical/extricate main.

>>53738023
Dredge is the retard cleanser and 100% fair.

>Be retard
>Don't pack grave hate
>Get Dredge'd

>>53757898
RiP is the 2nd most retarded hate card in the game after BMoon and BMoon gets away because it's designed to rape retarded manabases.