Who's gonna win?

>>53666112
Orks is made fer fightin' an' winnin'!

>>53666112
In terms of jobbing, it goes Chaos>Guard>Eldar>Crons>Orks>Nids

>>53666138
Crons actually don't job that often.

A no name tombworld fucked the ultramarines in the ass hard and almost killed Cato, they had to write a whole string of novels just to save face.

>>53666112
Chaos. They've already won Baal and probably won Armageddon. This warzone's logically next as the next biggest one without them. After all, GW's fans have been reading all this fluff about the Octarius War while asking, "Where's Chaos?"

>>53666112
Tyranids have won every major ground engagement that Ghaz wasn't personally at, plus they adapt to the circumstances with each wave. Orks are holding out right now because of endless reinforcements via tellyporta, so no matter how many times they get BTFO the Nids can't put them down for good. However, the tyranids know better to target war bosses, while the Orks probably don't know about targeting synapse creatures and just go after the big ones.

>>53666357
Every crons loss feels like major jobbing because of how powerful they're supposed to be. They shouldn't ever be losing unless massively outnumbered

>>53666138
I don't quite know what you mean...

>>53666112
Squats

>>53666420
This.

>The war between the nids and angels was ended when chaos showed up

>The war on Armageddon ended when chaos showed up forcing orks to team up with imperium

They'll probably show up here and a single bloodthirster will kill a whole waaaaagh or some shit

Honestly though, nids win in terms of attrition, but orks have the advantage of holding the entire sector really

>>53666112
>Who's gonna win?
chaos, because shit writing

Been living under a rock, what's this about chaos getting back to armageddon?

>>53667581
Chaos is infinitely powerful. It's shit writing when they lose.

>these chaos replies
>they haven't realized chaos are still jobbers
>they haven't realized chaos still BTFO by the imperium
Read dark imperium guys, chaos gets its ass kicked in the indominus crusade as usual thanks to epic levels of jobbing. Made possible by chaos jobbing harder than any other faction in the setting by capturing guillimans entire crusade but letting them escape.

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>>53666130
'Ere we go 'ere we go!

What adaptations do tyranids have to beat Orks and why haven't they been having the same success they usually do against the imperium

>>53670795
the imperium doesn't have the manpower to constantly throw men into the the tyranid war and replenish losses as fast as the Orks. They also don't have the logistical advantage of being able to set up their ecosystems and infrastructure wherever they go

Everyone falls, even the emperor. Then a single guardsman steps forth from his hiding spot, plants a flag, declares a job well done and fucks off. They just had one more man than everyone else had ammo.

Guard victory!

>>53670795
1) Orks are vastly more numerous than Imperials
2)They don't require infrastructure to build and maintain arms
3) They don't suffer from morale and will keep fighting as long as they can
4) Assassinating warbosses becomes less effective the more often you do it because they become more easily replaced by a Nob and infighting is less frequent because they are fighting a bigger enemy
5) Phage cells and Ork spores combat eachother on a celluar level. So spores can still gestate on occupied worlds.
6) Orks readily flock to conflict so they will get more and more boys to travel from around the galaxy to fight of their own freewill.
7) Technological advantage, Orks are actually pretty advanced technologically and clever mekboys always have a crazy invention or two. So they don't completely rely on a numbers game.
6) They sort of mimic the hivefleets in how they approach attrition: They constantly reproduce extremely quickly. They eat their and their opponents dead. Their physiology is extremely hardy and combats their opponents on every level of the biosphere.

>>53673313
I've say it before and I'll say it again, Orks are designed to be the Galaxies lymphocytes: white (or in this case green) blood cells.

When a large enough threat gathers they explode in activity to combat it and once the threat ends, they no longer have common case. They infight until they disperse themselves and the status quo returns.

Nids are just a lethal virus and Orks are the galactic immune system.

>>53673060
This seems like the logical end to the whole setting.

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>>53670505
>this is what chaos fags actually believe

>>53673060
>Ollanius Pius wasn't actually obliterated from existence
>Horus just smacked him into next week, 12,000 years into the future.

If you so much as mention that "Ollanius Pius was a perpetual" bullshit, I'm gonna smack YOU into next week

>>53673919
>Abbadon gets to Terra
>gets to the golden throne
>Ollanius Pius showed up and gets bitch slapped again
>big E gets up and punches Abbadon so hard all of chaos dies

>>53670602
The two ideas aren't incompatible. Chaos will win against all Xenos forces, wiping the slate clean so that the red team can fight and lose to the blue team forever.

>>53666596

they're always massively outnumbered and majority of tomb worlds haven't woken up.

>>53670505

chaos only exists if there are psychic beings to fuel them, orks have latent psychic abilities and are completely immune to chaos, chaos shits the bed when against necron, tyranid give no shits about them either.

Chaos is only infinitely powerful to Eldar and Humanity.

>>53674121
>Pius is always conveniently bitchslapped into a Monet in time where someone is about to make an attempt on the Emperor's life or destroy something vital to the Imperium of the Galaxy
>Everytime he shows up, he always inadvertently attracts the attention of the big bad, and gets bitchslapped through time and space again, buying enough time for good guys to get their shit together and stop the threat.
>A myth is develops around him as one of the Emperor's holy gaurdian angel's and the Patron Saint of Martyrs.
>He's just a poor schmuck who's just tired, scared, and a bit nauseous from being thrown around time and space so much.

>>53666112
Orks always win, because if they die, they're dead so they can't lose, and if they run away, that's because they'll be back to fight again

>>53674261
The Necrons have vastly outnumbered the space marines they lost to in almost every occasion those type of battles happen, and they usually outnumber the eldar when they fight them

>>53667581
Every warzone involving nids from now on will involve, at some point, nids saying 'I must go, my planet needs me' and teleporting away before CSM and LSM show up.

>>53674297
Kinda this^^

Chaos feeds off of psychic energy and can't manifest in reality without it, some races just have safer methods of using it as a collective or gestalt process meaning that daemons cant actually lash out at individuals or manifest without permission.

Eldar and Humanity get fucked because they are groups of individuals and are much easier prey.

Necrons get by, simply by not having a soul to feed on and being able to shunt the warp entities back to their native dimension technologically. To them daemons are only about as threatening as a extra dimensional xeno race and are only a threat because humans and Eldar keep feeding them.

Do yourselves and the galaxy a favor and shed your soul. It's literally only a burden to a prosperous reality.

>>53674609
>Humanity defeats their own men of iron
>Xenos men of iron show up
Jesus Christ why won't it ever end

>>53674609
Just what the fuck is a soul in 40k anyways? Is it you but as a ghost? Psychic essence? Some sort of spiritual immune system?

>>53674702
Flesh is weak anon, gotta get used to it.

Transcend or die.

>>53674716
It's literally just your psychic shadow, your thoughts and emotions manifested in an other dimension (reflections not the source).

Most people are like insignificant embers but psykers have giant burning bonfires.

>>53674552

everyone outnumbers space marines, that's literally the point of them

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>>53674750
That's what you think, robo-globalist scum

>>53674716
Its the reflection of a living creature in the warp. Everyone's got one, and it gets imprinted with the strong thoughts and emotions you have. Psykers are unique in that their connection to the warp is a lot stronger, so they can draw warp energy through their souls, into their bodies and so into the material world. When you die, if your soul is particularly strong and you have the will to do it, it can maintain its cohesion after the material body dies. This doesn't usually end well.

>>53674840
So basically, if you sell your soul to Chaos you essentially become a doorway into the material world?

Can genestealers infect Orks in the new lore?

>>53675494
I think they can, but Orks tend to be really good at sniffing out unorkyness so I guess it never ends well for them.

>>53670505
>Chaos is infinitely powerful
You don't even understand the point of chaos, do you?

>>53675494
yes

I'm not sure if there's anything biological the genestealers are not able to fuck.

>>53675353
More or less. That's the thing about Chaos, just as material world creatures can imprint onto it, immaterial intelligences can imprint right back. Things we call Khornates are drawn to "anger" type emotional resonances, can identify where its coming from and basically force to become more like it, which in turn makes the creature its attached to much more prone to anger, which causes a feedback loop. Its much easier with psykers because the 'doorway' already exists and its a lot easier to push more stuff through it, both ways. The other thing to bear in mind is that when you sell your soul to Chaos you're going to be actively influencing the material world to be more receptive to certain ideals, drawing more demonic attention. It could be in really obvious ways, like barbaric blood sacrifices, but it could just as easily be influencing others to behave in receptive ways - encouraging subordinates to be more aggressive or manipulative, spreading fear and hopelessness, just generally making the world just that little bit shittier so that those around you are more willing to listen to that little voice they usually ignore.

Its also how demon possessions work. Your soul and the warp-side demon merge, which allows the demon to pump its essence into the real world using the host's body as a conduit.

>>53675799
So really, a soul isn't that essential to have in 40k?

>>53676177
Not having one isn't great. To be alive is to have a soul - if you haven't got one, at best you're going to viscerally upset everything around you and at worst you're going to kill everything as you drain all their otherworldly energy into the gaping wound in reality you represent. Whether its because absolutely everything else in the universe is horrified at your very existence or because you're cut off in a very real way from a sea of emotions and a meaningful connection with the infinite you tend to be have difficulties. You will make the universe just a tiny bit worse just by your presence.

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>>53666112
These things.

>>53677481
TYRNIDS IZ MADE FOR EATIN' N' POOPIN'

>>53677481
Meh, needs more daemonic possession.

>>53675494
Doesn't 1d4chan's article on genestealers say the Hive Mind can't breed out the orkyness? If that's true then how is the Octarius War not a massive Tyranid loss?

>>53680268
>1d4chan

Well, there's your problem

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>>53675494
Yes, apparently here already are genestealers in the Octarius system

>>53676551
So how do Blanks fit into all of this?

>>53682847
How does that even work? Do the genestealers just crawl out of the ground like regular Orks do?

>>53684073
>>53682847
>>53680268
>>53675723
>>53675494
Alright new rule if we are going to talk about genestealers infecting orkz we need to to refer to them as greenstealers

>>53673398
>I've say it before and I'll say it again, Orks are designed to be the Galaxies lymphocytes: white (or in this case green) blood cells.
Huh. Never thought of it that way.

Would really explain why Tuska Daemon-Killa wrecked the other resident 'virus' in the galaxy so hard as well, now that I think about it.

Don you think this conflict is going to be resolved by 8th? I can't see tyranids keeping up that war for more than a few years before saying "fuck it, there's easier food elsewhere" staying in one place for decades using really their thing

>>53686015
The way that tyranid feeding works, as long as more and more orks keep showing up, the eating just gets better and better.

More orks = More biomass, so keep 'em coming

>>53666112
Me, by not spending money on this shit.

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>>53670505

>>53670505
Hi Carnac

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>>53674820
>tfw when you're unironically a globalist
>tfw when you're unironically a transhumanist
>tfw when Alex Jones is afraid of you and the very real agenda you have
>tfw you want to unironically kill Alex Jones with mechanical claws and use his biomass to feed offspring

>>53673919
Uuuuuuugh, what a stupid fucking idea. "YA KNOW WHAT'D BE COOL?! IF WE REMOVED ANY MEANING WHATSOEVER FROM HIS SELF-SACRIFICE!"

Personally, I think the idea of perpetuals in general is fucking moronic too. Just some uncreative author trying to make their character moar speshul.

Hopefully in the next book Cawl is rounding them all up in the name of the Imperial war effort to build a Perpetual Motion Machine.

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>>53684181
I'm all for it

>>53686898
Inspired by this pic, how many romans could a Hive Tyrant with monstrous rending claws and bone sword lashwhip take on before going down?

>>53666112
Orks. Nids cant Zerg against the eternal green sperg.

>>53687740
Hundreds, if not thousands, assuming these are completely fearless romans who will keep charging the tyrant even after seeing whole scores of their comrades slaughtered in seconds by a beast whose armor they can't even pierce with their weapons. Realistically a hive tyrant could route a whole army of romans alone just through its powers of the hive mind. Just standing in its presence would break most men, and that's without it even doing anything.

Neither side is truly trying to win. The tyranids will keep up the stalemate as long as they are making net gains since it supplies them with virtually endless biomass. Ghaz is probably using Octarius as an easy source of veterans, who grow quickly thanks to the constant WAAAAAGH going on

>>53674136
The Necrons are the only ones who know the true scale of the tyranid threat and think that their entire race awakened and united might not even be enough to stop them. They barely notice chaos unless directly attacked, and they don't give a shit about anyone else

Question

Are Orkz progressing in technology? Or has it remained the same the last 10k years or so minus the odd crazy invention?

Tyranids and Orks merge and become one faction.
The Tyranorks.

>>53688484
Their technology is coded into their dna. So they make the same things constantly just customise them.

>>53688646

So technology wise they are basically 99% completely capped?

>>53688656
They just keep making bigger and "better" versions of what they already have. Though we haven't seen their cap, they did get pretty close with the Beast. ork technology is surprisingly advanced in some fields. For instance, their teleportation, both long range and short, are unmatched. Allegedly Ghaz is able to teleport his entire fleet of over 1 million ships.

>>53688656
I think they progressively unlock more ideas but i don't know if their is a lore endpoint.
They start with melee weapons and progress to buggies, guns then onto forcefields and teleporters. There is a consistant goal to make giant gargant ork effigies that will eventually launch into space.

>>53688698
>lore endpoint

The Orks and I guess the Dark Eldar are both living their end game goals.

>>53688631
This was somehow implied when the war between the two factions began. Nids feed on ork's genetic material and implement it in their creation. Haven't got up to date reading lasts editions fluff but apparently (obviously) not so much has changed.
Maybe all the big monster that appeared post 4th are consequence of the ork material?

>>53673313
Don't forget that Orks don't have all the logistic problems with space travel that Imperials have when flying through the Shadow in the Warp.

>boss wez cannai see where we floiin dis rokk~! da shadoow in da waarp is makin tha humie light house all fuzzy and frag!
>uuh... lemme fink... just keep goin full ahead fer three days and den we drop ouuta da warp we'll crash into sumfin eventually.

>>53688727
There's one problem with that. The Old Ones put genetic precautions against that in Orkish genetic code.

Which means that Tyranid creatures based on Ork DNA are so fucking stupid they're almost too dumb to just stay alive by eating, drinking and breathing.

On a sidenote, that's also why the Adeptus Mechanicus still hasn't decoded the technological codexes that are implanted in the genetics of every Orkoid lifeform.

What WOULD an anti ork evolved Tyranid hive fleet look like anyways

>>53689145
Something that ate the spores, but the spores themselves are pretty good at avoiding that.

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>>53683370
Blanks are soulless beings in the "everything alive hates you but doesn't necessarily die if you're nearby" category. Like psykers there is a scale of power, so at one end you have blanks that are like the inverse of someone who gets the occasional precognitive flash or is never gets really sick because they're subconsciously repairing themselves with biomancy, and at the other end you have abominations like Culexus assassins, who can be the equivalent to Alpha Psykers, Eldar Farseers and the like. Its possible to enhance their natural abilities too, or to put "shielding" on it so that they can interact with others without normals trying to kill themselves out of sheer soul-destroying terror.

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>>53688698
>There is a consistant goal to make giant gargant ork effigies that will eventually launch into space.
>tfw Imperial Navy officer, seeing a gargant the size of a moon fly by
>somewhere inside sits the captain behind his steering wheel and the big red button

>>53689145
>the Hive Fleet decides that to fight the ork it must become the ork

>>53690073
>Nids eat so much ork biomass they get assimilated into the Waaagh! sphere and become Orks
>They still fight each other

>>53690145
>Gork and Mork peek their heads into the sky of Octarius
>"Told ya ladz we knowz where da best scrappin wuz"

>>53689145
I say the best path for nids would be to develop their psychic biomorphs, especially the ones intended to fill or even cut the warp out and fight the ork by negating them their collective waaagh powers.

then a constant influx of toxic and devourer swarms, to debilitate the enemy horde and replenish biomorphs.
pyrovores seem strangely useful for this since they can both digest corpses and purge spores with the flamer.

>>53690279
I dunno if that works. IIRC, the Waaagh is similar to the Warp but (completely) different.

Cutting Orks off from the Warp might not even have an effect.

>>53690352
Don't be an idiot. The Waaagh! is the Ork minds in the Warp.

>>53690352
It probably isn't going to outright kill or damage the orks, but they would start suffering the effects of being near soullessness on top of the absence of the benefits the waaagh field has on their tech and psychology, I assume.

>>53690373
No. The Waaagh is something different.

Remember, the Orks were developed by the Old Ones as a way to mitigate the errors they made in developing the Eldar.

>stunted emotions that only allow for joy, anger, hate avoids the emotional despair that eldar are prone to when loved ones die in battle
>alternative use of psyker abilities through the waaagh instead of the warp takes the pressure off the chaotic changes that the emotional turmoil of the eldar caused in the warp
>inherent technological knowledge implanted in the genetics of orks allows for a techbase that doesn't rely on the warp, warpstone and psyker abilities, like the eldar

Unfortunate for the Old Ones, the (Kr)ork were developed too late, and the combined pressure of Necrons and the newly born Chaos did them in.

>>53690507
>warp>psyker>psychic power
>warp>hive mind>psyker>psychic power
>warp>waaagh>psyker>psychic power
it's the same shit, just collected in a localised repository rather than taken raw
cut off the source and the repository doesn't fill

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>>53690352
>>53690373
>Don't be an idiot. The Waaagh! is the Ork minds in the Warp.
If that were the case, the nids Shadow in the Warp should completely destroy the Orks' ability to function as a faction every time they cross paths, just like it fucks up the other race that's extremely psychic, the Eldar.

Thing is, that's not what happens at all.

Hell, Shadow in the Warp should, by all accounts, keep Orks from around the galaxy from reaching Octarius/the planet Octaria to 'get in on the fight'.

Except more and more Orks are a) hearing the psychic call of 'OI! GITZ!! WE'Z GOT US A NEW BRAWL GOIN' DOWN OVA HERE!' from the collective excitement of the local Ork Madboyz in the sector, which is so powerful/loud it can be heard from all corners of the galaxy inside the Warp proper, and b) more and more Orks keep showing up, nid 'Warp blocker' be damned.

>>53690460
>It probably isn't going to outright kill or damage the orks, but they would start suffering the effects of being near soullessness on top of the absence of the benefits the waaagh field has on their tech and psychology, I assume.
One would think that... except for the fact all Ork technology is still works just fine (case in point: Ghaz shows up on Octaria with his fuck-huge fleet and is still able to use his MegaArmour like normal, demonstrated by the fact a Malwoc swallowed him whole and then he clawed its way out of his stomach immediately afterward).

Fuck, even Ork psykers don't get affected by the nids in the fluff. Why do I say this? Well it turns out ol' Thraka's developed psyker abilities (or at least telepathy), that's so powerful he's communicating with his subordinates back on Armageddon through his dreams. You'd think it'd be dulled by the Shadow in the Warp, but nope! Apparently the big green bastard is such a latent psyker he can communicate with people in an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT SECTOR.

>>53682847

Now how did a purple Gargant with six limbs not raise any eye brows?

That should have warranted some Mek putting a foot in someone's rear end shouldn't it?

And when it says "six limbs" does that mean the thing has six arms plus it's feet or four arms and the fifth and sixth are the feet?

>>53690621
>If that were the case
But that IS the case, it is made clear by the authors that practically everything related to psychic powers stems from the warp

the fact that this doesn't play out logically is due to the writers being hacks

>>53690692
Well, it was purple, so they probably thought it was some sneaky Gargant...

Curious, but is it possible the Orks in Octarius were loosing because the bulk of their best units were on Armageddon or in the surrounding sectors causing havoc?

I remember it said that the previous warlord who ruled the Octarius Domain was fighting on Armageddon, leading me to believe that he took the bulk of his military might with him.

And is there any Tyranid creature that is a match for a Gargant in a fight? I've always been under the impression a Gargant would ruin a Heirophants day.

>>53690692
>Now how did a purple Gargant with six limbs not raise any eye brows?
are you asking how purple passed unnoticed?

I'm starting to think the orks aren't actually able to see purple wavelengths, but theorise on the existence of the colour from time to time

>>53690744

>they probably thought it was some sneaky Gargant...

It would be funny to see a purple Gargant with six limbs tip toeing about and the Imperials failing to notice it.

In fact, that sounds like a Kommando Gargant.

>>53690692
>Now how did a purple Gargant with six limbs not raise any eye brows?
Silly humie! Purple is da sneakiest coloah! 'course da boyz didn't notice it!

As for six limbs, depending on the size of the gargant in question, it was probably some 'Four-armed Emperor' genestealer type deal, and Orks probably wouldn't look twice since "If dat mek thinks he can get four arms on a gargant and not fuck things up, who am I to say no?"

>>53690727
>the fact that this doesn't play out logically is due to the writers being hacks
>Trying to apply logic to the race who's Waaagh! field literally bends reality to their beliefs
I think I found the problem. You're trying to use logic against a race that could (in theory) cut down a redwood tree, stick some wheels on it, paint it red and have a 'wooden bus' Trukk that goes faster than NASCAR for a near-infinite distance, without ever having to install a physical engine.

Seriously, Ork Waaagh! field can cause some straight-up 'Wait, they did WHAT?!' moments, even among Ork players, simply for how ridiculous it can be sometimes.

>>53690771
>Curious, but is it possible the Orks in Octarius were loosing because the bulk of their best units were on Armageddon or in the surrounding sectors causing havoc?
Yeah, the original Overfiend of Octarius heading over to Armageddon with his best boyz and leaving a void that got filled by 'whats-his-git' might have something to do with the sector empire's reduced strength.
Which makes the fact they held out for so long on Octaria (official name of the empire's capital world according to the Waaagh Ghazzy supplement) before Thraka burst through the Shadow of the Warp with his zog-off huge fleet to get in on the action all the more amusing to me.

>>53690727
You'z mad dat da boyz don't obey yer rules, chaos boy?

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>>53690727
>the fact that this doesn't play out logically is due to the writers being hacks
Retcons, in MY 40k? Who could have foreseen this?

>>53690896
>could (in theory) cut down a redwood tree, stick some wheels on it, paint it red and have a 'wooden bus' Trukk that goes faster than NASCAR for a near-infinite distance, without ever having to install a physical engine.
that's a gross exaggeration about the level of reality warping powers the waaagh field has and you know it.

>>53670795
because if they outright have an anti ork weapon in fluff it will not end well for the table top game

>>53690910
not every contradiction is a retcon
sometimes a contradiction is just an error.

>>53666138
>jobbing
what does this even mean?

>>53691012
(professional wrestling slang) a performer whose primary role is to lose to established talent.

>>53687740
idk man some hive tyrant can heal Wolverine style, have powerful psychic power, spit plasma ball and shit have acid blood and can just eat to refill biomass

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>>53690981
>5 books, all with the same error in them

>>53691022
oh okay, thanks anon

I learned something today

>>53690621
>more and more Orks keep showing up, nid 'Warp blocker' be damned
All that proves is that the Waaaagh signal is more powerful than the Tyranid Warp blocker. Nothing else.

>>53691047
You ever hear of precedent? When your books establish that x beats y or that certain thing comes from a certain place, then backing down on that and flip-flopping is a bigger contradiction.

>>53688656
i imagine that if they have stable facility and resources over time they can make better shit but ork being orky rarely have that

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>>53691099
Hence it being a retcon. If it makes it past 1 or 2 books without the "original" canon being asserted, it's a retcon.

Original canon which you have failed to cite by the way. Any particular books you'd like to mention at this point?

>>53691047
yes, you keep making the same error if someone doesn't correct you or you don't realise the error, anon, what do you think an error is?

>>53690961
>at's a gross exaggeration about the level of reality warping powers the waaagh field has and you know it.
Given how there's early Ork fluff about some Orks using a Looted Leman Russ that was powered by a FUCKING DRAWING OF AN ENGINE... it's really not that far off.

>>53691078
>All that proves is that the Waaaagh signal is more powerful than the Tyranid Warp blocker. Nothing else.
Uhm, considering all Ork tech inside the various Shadow in the Warp instances in Octarius is operating just fine and dandy, I'd say it's a little more than just the 'Waaaagh! signal being more powerful than the Shadow in the Warp'.

Although now that I stop and think about it, the latest bit of Ork-related fluff has the implication that the Waaagh! field somehow exists as a 'Ork "Warp" (for lack of a better phrase) within the Immaterium as a whole.

>>53691540
>yes, you keep making the same error if someone doesn't correct you or you don't realise the error, anon, what do you think an error is?
Unfortunate official canon I guess.

>>53686122
thing is, orks do the same: they'll eat left over tyranids as well as orkoids.

>>53690621
>One would think that... except for the fact all Ork technology is still works just fine (case in point: Ghaz shows up on Octaria with his fuck-huge fleet and is still able to use his MegaArmour like normal, demonstrated by the fact a Malwoc swallowed him whole and then he clawed its way out of his stomach immediately afterward).

Dont forget all the Roks that were rapid fire teleporting boyz in, they dont even care about the shadow.

>>53686122
Nids have to capture and hold ground to really get in on all that biomass something theyre not doing.

Also the orks are going to be using all that biomass too, some good eatin there, then ya loot the shells.

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>>53688656
No they are plateaued at a faction of what they had at their ancient peak.

ATM they have a soft cap going though, should push past it when they hit that critical mass Ghazzy is shooting for.

So 2018

>>53688689
>For instance, their teleportation, both long range and short, are unmatched.

Theyre also the masters of forcefields.

>>53692403
>Nids have to capture and hold ground to really get in on all that biomass something theyre not doing.
>Also the orks are going to be using all that biomass too, some good eatin there, then ya loot the shells.
You've got a point about 'nids needing to hold ground in order to get the biomass'. They can't really slurp up biomass safely outside of the initial landing site since Orks, unlike the Imperium, are much more aggressive when it comes to combat tactics. Imperium is 'contain and purge' and Orks are 'Oi ya bugeyed git! Get back 'ere an' fite me proppa! WAAAAAGH!!' (they don't stop fighting in a location unless they absolutely have to).

>>53689145
Toxicrene spam like they did during shield of Baal to create huge clouds of toxic choking spores, waves of haruspexes to deal with the hordes of boyz, acid dripping spores that create a rain that will mess up the ground and degrade weapons and vehicles, tons of lictors to take out war bosses, lots of artillery beasts and pyrovores, acid blood on almost every close combat organism, something like the parasite of mortrex

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>>53693092
>Toxicrene spam like they did during shield of Baal to create huge clouds of toxic choking spores, waves of haruspexes to deal with the hordes of boyz, acid dripping spores that create a rain that will mess up the ground and degrade weapons and vehicles, tons of lictors to take out war bosses, lots of artillery beasts and pyrovores, acid blood on almost every close combat organism, something like the parasite of mortrex
If we're talking tabletop maybe. Fluff-wise though? Hive Fleet Leviathan probably already tried all of that that BEFORE Ghazzy showed up and krumped the tendril it sent to the Ork Empire of Octarius capital world. (for the record, the Octarius War has been going on long before Leviathan (?) went after Baal).

Nids need some new units in order to be a real threat against the angry mushrooms, because they're clearly not getting anywhere with what they've got now.

>>53690692
>Now, Big Mek Klawsaw, why is it dat you've put four armz in this 'ere gargant, aren't garagants supposed ta look like gork or maybe mork?
>Y̰̝̣o͔u̺͕͎͎̖͇͈ ̝̳ͅͅs̞̩̤e͍̰̩̤̳̹̗ḙ͍͉̠͚͕,͉̬̜̼ͅ ̳͍̼̞w͈̖̯e̘͔ o̻̻f̞͈ ̬̩̰̼̖͔̯t̰͚he C̯l̙̰͕a̬̭̤̳͔n̯ o̥f̖̗ t̯̜͎he̹̠͖͔̥͙ ̹͉̹͚̖ͅf̟͈͈̺o̤̖̼u͓̯̟̥̫ṛ͙̳̹-̼̜̥̗̺͈ar̦̯̞̗m͈̻̘ḙ̖̦͍d̗̞̹͚ ͖͇͇̦̘̠G͎͚͓̹̼̟o̩͙͔̟͚̱r͕̳̝̩k̥͎̝̻̗a̰͓̙̟̖̬̞m̭̺͖o̟̣r͙k̯͙͔̹͖a̱ ̩̫͙̖͕̣b̘̣̮e͍͖͔͉͓l͈̰̟̤i͕̪̙̘̹̺̥e͕v̼̬̝͍͖̟e͖̰͎ ͍͍̳̠̞̟t̻̩͇̥ha̜̥̞t͇̭̥̼͍̬ ̝̰̳̖͔G̣͎o̫͔r͙k̰̬̪͙͖̼ ͚̜̺̬̬a͕̖̱̘n̥̘̯̮d ̤̰̥M̟͇͖̦͇͈or͚̙͕̠k̦̮̪͖̤̯ ̪̘͔͎arḙ un͇̮̬i͕̜͔̠̭̹̜t̖̪͔̳͉̠e̝̟̫̱̮͍d͎̫̗͔̘̦̭ ̙̯̹̟ͅͅi͕̻n͔̼̟ ̠̠̩̱̼̯o͓̹͍̮̦n̪̮̙̩̥͙͖e͓̬̳̹ ͇͈̜̺b͉̩ody̯ͅ ̮̩͈͍͎̻an̰͇̱̗d͓̣̙̙͚ ̳̬͔͈̮o̩͚̘n̼̳̙̻ͅe̘̥̠̩̮̻͎ ̝̝͙s͙͉̯͍͇͔̻o̼͍u͔̱̬͓̗l̘͙͓̳͉,̯̮͈̥̣ ͙͕̖̥t̠͕h̥e̪͎͈̯̳̱͈ ̫̮͓̤̝f͚̝͕͖̜o̗͎̖̟̤̬̳u̞̦̩r͔͉̝̣͕̦͍-̱̰̺̠͔̤a̙͇͚͔̹rm̥̖̯e̫͓̘d̩͔͖ͅͅ ͔G̝o̯͙̺͙͙̳d͎̱̼̖


>And why is it purple?
>B͔̣̭̠͖̟͎e̹͓c̳̹̘̫͈͕a̙̣̠͓̹̩u̝̫̪̩s̤̳͙̰e͎͙̠̩ ̰I͖'m̳͙͈̟̬̟ ̠̠̪̹̗p̺̙̣̰̻u̠̯̱̩r̥p̗l̫e͔̖̳̫̭,̝̬̜̣̞ ̯͇͖̥a͉n͓d̯̥͓͙͚̬ ̪̰̳̻̞p̞̪͔u̞̳͕̯̫̼r̗̜̱̩̺̗̝pḷ̼̼̮̹̣̙e͖̗̪̮̤̹ ̻͍͙i͓̩͕s̖̥̥̫̮͍ ̬͉̹͉͔̱̼s̻̥͕n̺e̙̪e͍k͉͎͈͇y͉͎.̬̼͓̝̰̹̰


>Fair enuff.

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>>53693092
And then comes the Straight Shootas with Blue Toof and start killing the nids like there is no tomorrow

See: >>53640143

>>53666596
>while the Orks probably don't know about targeting synapse creatures and just go after the big ones.
Aren't those usually the synapse creatures?

>>53692235
Orks eating nids is in no way as beneficial

If a nid eats an ork, it now has enough biomass to make another gaunt, if it eats a whole planet of orks and all its own dead, it replenishes its losses and makes billions of other tyranids on top of that

>>53686015
Nids are getting a constant stream of biomass fed to them, and the orks that survive are getting bigger and tougher, both sides are thriving

>>53692403
Aside from where ghazzy shown up, nids have won almost every ground battle and pushed orks off of dozen of worlds and eaten, Eldar had to doomsday bomb a ring of worlds to slow them down

>>53693474
>Orks eating nids is in no way as beneficial
Makes them not hungry until the next time they're hungry

>>53688656

The ork tech tree is very linear, but it restarts with each ork faction

as grots emerge from spores and orks first appear, they have primitive weapons like blades, axes, and basic guns

as more mekboyz appear, they get better and better gear, approaching modern-day tech like trukkz and motorcycles, then planes and explosives along with bigger and better guns

then, as the warboss appears, they start to get into gargants and such giant, 40k type weaponry

the longer a particular warboss lasts, the better their tech gets. we see this with The Beast, where since they were unified under him they got to crazy shit like teleporting deathstars in orbit of holy terra

usually their faction/waagh dies out before they get this far though

>>53693190
They've won almost every major ground engagement pretty handily. Orrok fell in a day, and even Octaria was on the ropes until Ghaz himself showed up and drove back a single wave of tyranids. Hell, on ghorhala they managed to build their numbers up from a few hundred to a few hundred million without any ships, and wiped out all the Orks there despite being initially outnumbered. The only probl m is that Orks keep pouring in to replace the losses as fast as they happen. There's no real strategy to beat endless numbers.


Good point on this taking place before shield of Baal. Pretty sure Malanthropes, toxicrenes and neurothropes were all "premiered" or developed for that conflict. After their rampant success in the cryptus system I expect those creatures will start showing up in the Octarius sector. Would like to see how malanthropes handle Orks, those things were absolutely terrifying in the fall of asphodex

>>53688656
>>53694327
Keep in mind that the technology Orks use are based on the technological understanding of the Old Ones.

As in, the guys that were so smart, they almost annihilated the Necrons, if the Eldar hadn't spawned Chaos with all their crying and emotions about losing their fellow Eldar soldiers in the war. The Old Ones had a knack for biological technology, but that doesn't mean they didn't know how to give Orks absurd technologies hidden in their genetic memory.

To top that off, Orks are missing an important part of their ecosystem. When they were still called Krorks there was a special caste of (Kr)Orks above the Warboss. The Brainboy. Those are extinct. So perhaps Orks will never be able to utilize their full genetic memory.

How fucked are the Nids if the Orks reach the same levels they were at in the war of the beast? Could they even deal with primorks?

>>53694852
The Primorks were pussies whose heads exploded because the Sisters of Silence gave them cooties.

>>53694771
I though brain boys were just the kr(ork) term for the half remembered old ones

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>>53694625
>They've won almost every major ground engagement pretty handily.
Eh, it took the boyz awhile to quit muckin' about after getting blitzkrieg'd by a bunch of bugs. Not too surprising.

>even Octaria was on the ropes until Ghaz himself showed up and drove back a single wave of tyranids
>Literally every nid was killed on Octaria after Ghazzy showed up and got the boyz FIRED UP! good an' proppa (including the Swarmlord since he was sighted in nid's 5e codex fluff on the war. Since he and Ghazzy never crossed paths in Ghazzy's Waaagh supplement, Swarmy died to non-character Orks. Someone keeps joking about 'death by a thousand choppas', but it was probably more likely the Swarmy ended up on the wrong end of several Dread Mobs or something like that.)
>Leviathan's now throwing multiple tendrils at that one planet (or maybe the entire sector, it's not very clear) in response
>"single wave"

An entire wave of nids getting killed isn't exactly something to scoff at anon.

On a side note: Ghazzy didn't stick around for the Octarius War (at least, that was a plan 100 years ago). Gork n' Mork want him to make the Octarius Sector another Armageddon style sector-wide shitstorm (which the Hive Mind is MORE than willing to help out with) and then repeat that process in 3 or 4 other sectors so the galactic Ork population hits critical mass (whatever that will do. Probably result in Beast-era Orks or Krorks if I had to take a wild guess).

>>53694852
>Could they even deal with primorks?
Considering the Prime-Orks varied in size of 'big as a hab-block(10 m high) to 'the size of a small gargant' and BIGGER, and all the techonlogical advances/civilization developments that follow in their wake...

I'mma say that's a big fat NO. I'm not even sure the Hive Fleets would be able to get in range to deploy their invasion forces without getting gravity-fucked by Ork Attack Moon weaponry.

>>53695331
>I though brain boys were just the kr(ork) term for the half remembered old ones
Fluff explanations vary (and are based on interpretations of the incompetent Magos Biologis gits back on Mars) but brain boyz are either the Old Ones or they are... the Snotlings.

Yes, the tiny green guys who get kicked around by goddamn Grots/Meks occasionally use as ammo/are 80% likely to end up Squig-food have been theorized to be the legendary 'Brain Boyz' (at least at one point).

Or for double the laffs, Snotlings are the Old Ones in disguise! This isn't a real fluff theory, just a hilarious idea that popped into my head I thought I'd share.

>>53695356

>getting gravity-fucked by Ork Attack Moon weaponry.

I wonder how that might interact with the Narvhal ships the Tyranids use.

I recall it being said those operate by using gravity to distort space, allowing them to reach a system easier while causing quakes and other tectonic upheaval on the targeted world.

>>53691620
The Old Ones created the Eldar Webway and the Kr(ork) right? What if the Ork psychic field was a separated area of the Warp by the Old Ones to shelter their minds from Chaos?

>>53690727
Nah, this is logical.
The Shadow in the Warp isn't a literal anti-psyker effect - that's the side effect of trillions of Tyranid organisms using the Warp to communicate to one another constantly. It drowns out everything else and drives things crazy and blocks access to anything needing the Warp like a DDoS.
But the Orks, being Orks, can shout louder than that.

>>53666596
>Tyranids have won every major ground engagement that Ghaz wasn't personally at

No they literally had a perfect opening to the start of the campaign with mass genestealer infestations to kick it off.

Also with the Overfiend gone with his core of armies to Armageddon, the system wasnt anywhere near full strength and the nids still got bogged down untill the Ghazzy came to make it into a farm for Prime Orks.

>>53694625
They had a literal perfect start vs an underpowered ork empire and still lost in time.

The fuck you on about?

>>53690507
No, it's the same thing dumbass. Pariahs and things designed to cut off Warp access effect the Waaagh!

Source is the Beast Series.

>>53697764

On top of that, some Orks may have gotten bored of the fight in the Octarius sector and left.

I think they may have also had a few shake ups in power as there are currentl 3 Overfiends at the moment, counting the one in the Overfiend novels that was easily larger than a Dreadnought.

>>53697764
What exactly is the point of contention here? I literally said the tyranids won every major ground engagement until Ghaz showed up, nothing you said disproves that.
>>53697788
>still lost
They lost one notable ground battle which was when Ghaz actually showed up. He wiped out one wave on a single planet, and leviathan immediately responded by sending another one.

>>53694852
The only thing Beast era Orks are good for is jobbing even harder than chaos
>park death star above terra
>BTFO defenders
>BTFO an imperial force lead by Vulkan
>have eldar level technology and Boyz the size of space marines
>still lose

Fucking embarrassing

>>53703316
No one except Horus has come that close to terra, and the Orks only lost through plot device. Give credit where credit is due

>>53704067
This is true, the beast wasn't defeated militarily, it was only through taking advantage of ork biology and the WAAAGH field that the imperials were able to win. Had that attack failed, the imperium would have been over

>>53689562
I really wish Pariahs were still canon.

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Necrons are going to show up and BTFO both sides, Orks and Nids ain't shit

>>53686741

But that didn't even make sense.

I mean, I love the Ollanius Pius story, but subtle it ain't. Deciding he needed to be more than human is missing the point on the level of, I dunno, writing Last Church and proving something completely at odds with what you wanted to prove.

So, just another day in the GW/BL Fluff Mines I suppose?

>>53687740

25 Unless it was the Tyranid codex in which case 5.

>>53706674
>Necrons
>Being relevant

Necron stopped mattering when they were given personalities, now they're just another second tier villain

>>53707585
>25 regular humans could beat a hive tyrant with bronze weapons
Is there some sort of joke going on here I'm not getting?

>>53709201

Why does the Hive Tyrant have bronze weapons?

>>53707599
They starting mattering more because now the writers can do something with them other than making them job

>>53709226
He thought he'd give the romans a sporting chance, though in truth he could have won with no weapons, if you don't count his tending claws

>>53703316
But most ork boyz are the size of space marines. You're talking about orks the size of dreadnoughts or primarchs.

>>53711524
The boyz were the size and strength of truescale marines, most ork boyz are about the same height as a guardsman but twice as wide. The Nobz were dreadnaught sized, while the warbosses were even bigger. The beast was mistaken for a gargant when they first saw him, then they realized it was actually a huge ork in armor

What would be the Tyranid equivalent of the Beast WAAAGH?

I have a question.

Does attrition work on Orks?

In some instances, such as this one, protracted combat makes the Orks more powerful because "War is good for Orks."

In others, like against the Tau, the Orks fare normally against attrition that is they are shot up bit by bit

Which is it?

>>53713519
Attrition doesn't work against Orkz due to their reproductive nature and the various other things. As with every other piece of their fluff, the reason why they die to attrition against Tau is because the Tau writers are masters of completely disregarding the entire setting in their quest to fulfil their own vision of the 'adaptable, intelligent, logical, perfect, unstoppable, rational, disciplined' master-race.