MTG LEGACY GENERAL

>>53609812
>Most magic players cantrip poorly. Most Legacy players misplay Brainstorm. Discuss.
Most people can't even mulligan properly

>>53610322
Nor sideboard.

>>53610332
Or know the rules. Although that one is unfair. Rules in this game are complete clusterfuck.

This I'd the best doomsday list I've come up with since the top ban.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/burning-ant-3/

press f

>>53609812

As a new-ish legacy player (2 months of experience) how do I make sure I'm playing Brainstorm correctly?

>>53610835
>Opponent cast charbelcher
Brainstorm into FoW
>Opponent cast thoughtseize
Brainstorm hiding SnT to top
>Delver turn1
Brainstorm in response to Delver trigger
>Hand with 5 lands and brainstorm
Brainstorm 2 lands on top and fetch

What else was there......

>>53610967
OHHHH!
>Terminus or Entreat in hand (Does new miracles play entreat anymore?)
Brainstorm either on top and draw miracles

>>53610835
Brainstorming too early is one of the mot common mistakes. The longer you hold brainstorm the better it gets. Basically never actually cast brainstorm.

>>53611390
Even at absolute worst it's giving you info how next turns are going to play out.

>>53610967
>hand with 5 lands and a brainstorm
You shouldnt be casting brainstorm here, you should be mulling.

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>>53612072

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>>53610727
>No Doomsday maindeck

>>53612138
It was hard to tell if it was a joke because this sort of hand is something I see people keep because "brainstorm and fetch will fix it"

>>53612222
I know, but I thought irony was quite clear. But it's true brainstorm is helpful with land flood. I remember playing delver and on trigger I get to draw way too many lands, where fetch saves the day. Without brainstorming I would be drawing into lands 2 turns.

>>53612162
Yeah it's not really a doomsday deck. I've been playing a Burning ANT list a bit since the top ban and it felt strong and flexible but weaker to cetrain kinds of hate than doomsday. It originally had Ad Nauseam in it too, but it was pretty bad in a deck with a slightly higher curve than basic ANT and no chrome mox. So I put doomsday in the board to give me another way to make deterministic kills through certain kinds of hate and swapped AN with meditate to facilitate doomsday kills. Meditate isn't horrible on its own either

>>53612311
I guess I just assume the worst in people on the Internet.

Is anyone else surprised that cradle hasn't been banned yet? I know it only sees play in one deck but the card feels so fucking nutty when you're playing elves

>>53613287
Nah it's fine.

>>53613287

I wish they'd finish the Urza's Saga cycle with Black and Red versions, then unban Tolarian Academy so each color can have their stupid-busted Urza lands. Doesn't quite seem fair that only Green and White get to keep theirs.

>>53614404
artifact, enchantment, ceature
so, land for red and walkers for black? You need a premanent type that appears on the battlefield to finish the cycle

>>53614404
Phyrexian Tower is the black part of the cycle and Shivan Gorge brings up the rear for red.

>Dakmor Academy
>T: Add B for each card in your graveyard.

>Flame Lava Fire Burning Burned Land
>T: Add R equal to the amount of damage dealt to each opponent this turn.

>>53614404
What would those lands be?

Volrath's home town cemetery
Add B for each creature in your graveyard

Urza's offfice paper bin
Add R for each instant/sorcery in your graveyard?

>>53614931
wow your red land has a really good name and effect

>>53614932
that breaks the cycle imo, need to be a permanent card on the bettlefield, and while lands would be very good, there isn't another type that would support the mechanic

>>53614931
>T: Add B for each card in your graveyard.
jesus christ, and you thought academy was busted

>>53614932
Creature would make it garbage.

>>53614831

More like the red one doubles whatever mana you have in your pool, and the black one give you 20 - X, where x is your life total

>>53614977
Its no more busted than Academy. Slightly less busted in fact.

>>53614931
>>Flame Lava Fire Burning Burned Land

...i want this to be real

>>53614962

Make the Red one be add R for each land in play

Make the Black one add B for each Planeswalker in play

Bam, done. Black one sucks because It's time for Red to stop getting all the worst cards.

Semi-unrelated, but are any of the Magic video games worth trying?

>>53618200
MTGO is probably worth trying.

>>53615005
I'm not convinced. Academy is certainly Busted Beyond Belief (tm) but requires a critical mass of artifacts in your deck. That proposedan black one could be good in almost any black based deck and Busted Beyond Belief(tm) in a deck built to abuse it.

>>53618659
That guy here. I know it's a bit ridiculous. Black is my favorite color and I wanted this hypothetical card to be on par with academy. Locking it to creatures would make it suck so much and >>53616935 should hang for posting.
Revised proposal:
Exile X cards from your graveyard, T: Add X black mana to your mana pool.
Who am i kidding, that's a cooldown style restriction.

Deck pics?

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>>53621905

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>>53621905
Here you go anon, my WIP deck.

>>53622256
Elbrus? Really?

>>53622256
I'll rate it 13/13 for the fun factor

>>53622312
Lol, yep. It's actually been really good so far in testing.

>titan looses 4 tops AND its best match up
>build mono black pox
>its shit
It seems the amount of fun a deck is, is inversely perportinal to how good it is.

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>>53621905
Here is what I was playing when miracles was still a deck, although now I am thinking of dropping the delvers and dazes and building something closer to 4-color control

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>>53621905

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>>53621905
I refuse to get with the times. And I'm not even that good with the deck since I hardly ever get to practice

>>53624885
Australian detected.

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>>53610967
you forgot
>opponent has brainstorm on the stack
activate aether vial

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>>53625909

*teleports behind you*

Nothing personal, kiddo

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>>53626038
>tfw i tell my mom on you

>>53624885
>UBg Reanimator
What's in your side to justify the green mana? And is keeping cards for countermagic worth not playing Sire of Insanity?

>>53626884
The Green is fetchable with Misty...

>>53626884
I'd assume Abrupt Decay, and maybe something like Reverent Silence?

>>53626884
Would you like to rephrase that second question? Sire is not a significant motivating factor for playing one version over another.

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>>53625909
Talking about the versatility and different usable situations for brainstorm;

"YE BUT WHA IF I GONNA CAST NOTION THIEF?!"

>>53629576
This is why I said never cast brainstorm. What if they have notion thief for the blowout?
>>53611390

>>53629668
Honestly Notion thief should be in any UBx midrange deck for occasional middle finger.

>>53629278
I've seen many lists featuring Sire of Insanity. Dropping it turn 1 seems like an autowin to me, but obviously you cannot play it and run countermagic at the same time.
What made you (or the owner of the deck) decide not to run it at all?
That was essentially my question.

Uhh...
Post SI lists
I missed last thread due to lots of sleeping
Im wondering whether I should try out a UB version with cantrips and fetches for added consistency

>>53630048
Not the owner, but assuming the owner of deck isn't playing it, the obvious answer would be "yes".

The way I see it, is that you choose how you want to play the game. RB with Sire is kind of trying to fish easy wins, while UB is trading the fastness to sustain the game better, even through hard hate. And besides, latest deck results on MtgTop8 feature Sire in sideboard.

>>53630048
Why can't you play sire and countermagic in the same deck? If you mean it's a dead topdeck with a sire out, so is the discard that rb plays, so I don't really see your point. I've played ub reanimator with a sire, and obviously it's better in rb since the turn 1 % is higher, but it's very good on the play turn 1.

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>>53621905
Sure, I haven't taken a new one in a while

>>53626884
Deck owner, abrupt decay and golgari charm. There's also an engineered explosives in there so being able to Sunburst for 3 is relevant sometimes. In a very long game against UW stoneblade I ended up resolving and popping EE on 4 with a petal for white, taking out a Gideon AOZ that was fucking me in the face.

>>53631576
How's your delver match up? Anything giving you fits?

>>53631352
You are a god among men, when no Urborg though?

>>53631673
delver match up is poor. they've always got so much disruption, by the time I stick a fatty they just swing/burn past it and kill me anyway.

lands gives me fits of autistic rage. there's pretty much nothing I can do vs that deck. either maze of ith or glacial chasm make sure I'm not winning through creature beats and I don't have much else to fall back on.

>>53631352
>>53632055
Also with 4 Dack isn't Crucible value town? Why Dust Bowl over Wasteland? What do you think about the versions playing Breya?
AAAAAH it's so nice to see another Tezz player and I have so many questions.

>>53630455
Personally i think PSI is the best SI build. To be fair ive never played the one you're suggesting, which they call Quasi SI, because to me to fun of playing SI is going off t1, and QSI is kinda designed not to. PSI does all the time. Its the best balance of consistency and speed, although it does emphasize speed more. Any SI build is probably going to have its speed be inversely proportional to its consistency. Here's my list, which is definitely a little on the wild side, but it works well:

4x dark rit
4x culling the weak
4x cabal rit
4x infernal tutor
4x led
4x lotus petal
4x chrome mox
4x elvish spirit guide
4x summoners pact
4x land grant
4x charbelcher
4x infernal contract
4x cruel bargain
1x eternal witness
1x ill gotten gains
1x manamorphose
1x tendrils of agony
1x bayou
1x dryad arbor
1x wild cantor
1x deathrite shaman

SB
4x sylvan scrying
4x dark depths
3x hexmage
4x thespian stage

Ive actually neen thinking about making a Which Degenerate T1 Win Deck Should I Play? infographic amd rating them on like a sliding scale of speed vs consistency. Might do it when i get home.

>>53633322
>which t1 win deck
>implies they have different speeds
Must be a retard to play SI

>>53633551
I'd like to play DD but according to you not playing it is better ;^)
If you've got any "good" DD since top ban I'd be very keen. It's a card that has always fascinated me with what can be done with it

>>53633852
I got tons of lists you can try senpai but I can't promise they're good. All of them have tested well enough that I haven't totally given up hope, but not well enough yet that I'd be comfortable taking one to a major event I'd do it anyway but I wouldn't be comfortable
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/current-ddft/
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/old-school-doomsday/
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/bug-explorer-doomsday/
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/ub-doomshow/

>>53622341
>Elbrus
Jitte is for pussies

>Withengar is not even indestructible so dies to push/decay

>>53635371
wasn't there a rule change about this? flipped cards now have the CMC of their opposite side?

>>53635440
Oh my, you are right !

Damn son, that's terrific.

Just played pauper for the first time. 2-1 with a shitty burn list.

>>53632055
That and the swamp are probably fighting for a spot, and I like the swamp more
>>53632972
Yeah Crucible is value town but it's also not a card I'm terribly interested in playing with DRS running over the format. I had Wastelands in the deck previously, but wanted to try Inventor's Fair and wanted to try shaving a land, so when I was left with only one Wasteland I thought I'd try Dust Bowl. It's been awesome; I dust bowled someone 6 times in a single game at FNM last week. Breya is uncastable, and if I'm Transmuting for something I'd rather it be the other half of Thopter/Sword or save the Transmute for when I can set that up.

>>53614404
Cabal coffers sort of fills the black spot. Though you'd probably want to attach urborg, tomb of yawgmoth to make it in the way too powerful part of the cycle.

Red could be something wacky like add R equal to the storm count.

>>53616874
Unglued 3 really needs to happen.

Just went and played U/W/b Stonestill at my LGS, went 1-3 due to having to muligan to oblivion several times. On the bright side I did kill someone with Elbrus, which was hilarious.

>>53633228
What's DRS for? Iirc there was a better g/b hybrid one drop (for the purpose of being sacced that is)

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>>53641965
>add R equal to the storm count
Gotta stick it in standard to be legal

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>>53614931
>>Flame Lava Fire Burning Burned Land
>>T: Add R equal to the amount of damage dealt to each opponent this turn.
>t1 mountain, swiftspear, hit you for one (19)
>t2 BOLTARIAN ACADEMY, Lava Spike you, trigger swifty1 (16), use BOLTARIAN ACADEMY add RRR, Lava Spike you, trigger swifty2 (13), Manamorphose for RG, trigger swifty3, Gut Shot you, trigger swifty4 (12), RG+exile 4 Become Immense target swifty, trigger swifty5, swing 12 gg.

WHAT HATH YOU WROUGHT

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>>53643931
>Chrome Mox

>>53633228
Pact SI is meh. it has a 60% chance of going off T1, half of the time they have FoW or, if you are on the draw; chalice, so in reality it's like 35%. of that, PSI cannot win with a chalice on 0-1.
BR reanimator/TES are better options in the meta right now

>>53644557
FoW decks have force and a blue card a bit less than 40% of the time turn 1 game 1, and FoW decks make up a bit less than 50% of the meta. Chalice decks and other turn 1 decks make up another <10%, and they are no more than 50% to have it (to make the math easy). So you have .5*.4 + .1*.5 = ~25% chance to get fucked, assuming you have the goods to go off. So .6*.75 = ~45% chance to win t1, meta depending. I made some estimates. Factor in the slim chance that they have a hand that actually can go off through chalice or force (unlikely but possible) and you get ~50% chance to go off successfully turn 1 game 1. Literal coinflip deck.

probability is not my strong suit, please correct me if I made a glaring error

>>53643969
Nah, just stick in some EDH/Conspiracy type set.

Of course if they are insane enough to even print cards like that then why not continue the insanity in a standard legal set.

b u m p

How can we spur more useful discussion? The modern thread always hits the bump limit but is full of cancer and shitposters. The legacy thread has a minimum of shut posting and cancer but often doesn't make it to the bump limit. How do we strike that balance?

>>53650295
>shitposters
This is the key. We need to mass import shitposters. Don't worry about balance. The only people that care about balance are racists and white mages.

>>53650385
>shitposters
Where's Folded Guy when you need him?

OP is actually a good point. I am a new player - playing Infect after it stat itself in Modern - and one of the most difficult decisions I find myself taking is when to Brainstorm. Do anons have any useful pointers?

Additionally, considering that deck runs 3 FoW and at least 3 Daze mainboard, should I counterspell aggressively (like neuter a turn 1 delver or a t2 thalia) or instead just hoard them for game-ending threats?

>>53650295

I'm of the opinion that it's okay if a general dies. Generals on 4chan seem to either go two ways: cropping up once a week and having a great discussion about what's new and interesting, or having an ever-present presence on 4chan and being full of cancer.

>>53650641
There were some good answers to this post: >>53610835

But basically brainstorming too early/when you don't need to is the big issue.

>>53650641
Personally, I am pretty conservative with brainstorms. If you don't have a reason to cast it, then don't. If your hand is all gas and you don't want to shuffle anything away, sit on it. You should use it when you are trying to find a specific card/type of card or you already have 2 dead cards you want to shuffle away

>>53650784
I agree, it might even be better to only put up the thread on weekends or on predetermined days, so instead of forcing it with bumps and dwindling conversations we can concentrate the thread traffic.
>>53650641
You don't really want to cast Brainstorm EoT since you'll be forced to draw one of the cards you put back. When I'm Brainstorming I want to be doing it to protect cards from hand disruption, or with a fetch out/before I play a land so I can storm into a fetch which turns Brainstorm into Recall.

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>>53651524
Heh.

>>53651524
I'd rather have a more active general with slightly more shitposting primarily because I get bored at work.

>>53651754

But, I mean, you have the Modern general for shitposting. That's literally all they do there.

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>>53650385
>We need to mass import shitposters
they call me a shitposter over in modern general, but i really only post relating to death & taxes (& squids & red-guys sometimes). modern d&t has the quality of not being 3-color death's shadow, tron or REV FOR 15 so it's a shitpost meme deck over there.

one mans shitpost is another mans on-topic comment. its all a matter of opinion.

>>53651754
we already have the miracles thread on the source for shitty posts

>>53651809
I mean...

>>53651809
I actually have started going to the modern general just for the quicker turnaround times but no one else there seems to play Ponza cause it can't Rev for 15.