MtG: Wombo Combo

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Obligatory

worldgorger dragon + animate dead

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Combat Celebrant and Splinter Twin

>swing
>untap
>clone Combat Celebrant
>swing again
>untap
>repeat
>infinite combat phases
>infinitely more attackers

>>53205998
Wouldn't this check the name after exiling?

>>53206504
Close, but no cigar. No life is gained, the life total is changed entirely.

>>53206781
>118.5. If an effect sets a player’s life total to a specific number, the player gains or loses the necessary amount of life to end up with the new total.

>>53206819
different guy here, how does that interact with stuff like Alhammarret's Archive or Dictate of the twin gods?

Say I use that beacon of immortality to go from 20 to 40, therefore i gain 20 life, which means Alhammaret's triggers and i gain 40 and end up at 60 instead.
Or since it says the necessary amount of life, would i only gain 10 which is to be doubled to 20 so i end up at 40?

And what about the opposite event, what if i go from 40 to 20 from something, i lose 20 life, with Dictate out, would i lose all my life?

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I'm all for Junky combos, specially in pauper

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>>53207027
I feel you, nigga.

>>53207013
http://magiccards.info/rule/616-interaction-of-replacement-and-or-prevention-effects.html

tl;dr they will all apply, usually.
>Say I use that beacon of immortality to go from 20 to 40, therefore i gain 20 life, which means Alhammaret's triggers and i gain 40 and end up at 60 instead.
Yes, that would happen.
>And what about the opposite event, what if i go from 40 to 20 from something, i lose 20 life, with Dictate out, would i lose all my life?
Yep. Double damage effects with Heartless Hidetsugu's activation results in everyone on even life dying and everyone on odd life landing on 1, for example.

>>53207013
So it goes like this. The effect, as part of its resolution, attempts to do what it says. In the case of Beacon of Immortality, that's setting your life to 2X where X is your current life. It converts into action by gaining X life. Then, before that can occur, it would be replaced by Alhammarret's Archive which doubles this gain, and so you gain 2X in addition to your current X, tripling your life total. Replacement effects occur at the last stage of resolution.

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I'll probably get shit for this, I don't know, but there used to be a site called "Magic Deck Vortex" and it was the shit because it had a section for combos neatly organized on what where you looking for, iirc combos about:
>damage
>card draw
>creatures
>infinite; life, mana, turns, etc

Is there a cool website like that?

>>53207091
I didnt mean from cards that explicitly say deal damage, but if it interacts with setting life to a number.
Like Blessed Wind or something in a commander game, would cause that player to lose 20 life (assuming starting life total), would that still trigger the Dictate.

I'm asking this because of this:
>118.9. Some triggered abilities are written, “Whenever [a player] gains life, . . . .” Such abilities are treated as though they are written, “Whenever a source causes [a player] to gain life, . . . .” If a player gains 0 life, no life gain event has occurred, and these abilities won’t trigger.
And I'm not sure if the same is true for the damage effect. Does it rewrite "If a source would deal damage... " into "If a source would cause loss of life", or is there a difference?

>>53207027
My favourite Freed target is Izzet Boilerworks.

>>53207292
>I didnt mean from cards that explicitly say deal damage, but if it interacts with setting life to a number.
>Like Blessed Wind or something in a commander game, would cause that player to lose 20 life (assuming starting life total), would that still trigger the Dictate.
Well, then, no, because that would be life loss, not damage, and Dictate of the Twin Gods only doubles damage.
>Does it rewrite "If a source would deal damage... " into "If a source would cause loss of life", or is there a difference?
Put simply, loss of life isn't damage. Damage causes loss of life, but damage is its own word with its own associated rules.

>>53207347
>>53207178
>>53207091
Thanks for the answers.

>>53207292
>>53207347
As answered.
TO add:

118.5. If an effect sets a player’s life total to a specific number, the player gains or loses the necessary
amount of life to end up with the new total.

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Rip Cat Winter

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Also, have a favorite of mine

>>53207470

>does literally nothing

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>32 replies
>no one has posted the best combo

Wtf /tg/?

>>53207331
I actually used to play RUG Defenders on pauper. The idea was to add infinite mana and deal X damage to my opponent. Blue was there just for the Freed.

I'll see if i can make an image of the combo for you guys.

>>53207491
No, it doesn't DO anything

>>53207417
i accidentally discovered this during a game when i copied him

>>53207528

Use conjuror's closet. Then mastodon can actually attack and you aren't down 7 mana each of those turns.

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>>53207491
>>53207555

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>>53207548
That's the basic idea my deck was going for.

>>53207612
>be at game store with buddy
>guy comes up wearing 1000 bracelets on his arm and a hat like the guy in Gorillaz
>hey do you guys want to play commander with me and 2 other guys
>ok
>set up and play
>turn 3 he pulls some shit like this, he probably cheated to get the hand since he was fucking around with his deck so much
>has about 500 myr tokens with him, all very dirty
>puts them on the field
>ok we're going to have a very friendly game, if you want anything untapped just ask
>play a few rounds, he pretty much stops us from doing damage, just lets us kill creatues and stuff
>use lifelink to get over 50 life
>pay 50 life to deal him 50 damage with that one card from kaladesh
>he has tap creature for lifegain too
>i say game is over, his friends agree
>never went back

least fun game I have ever played

>>53206337
I hope you're trolling, because that combo wouldn't work.

You'll only get one extra combat phase, because when you bring in the next Celebrant, it will do a check to see if a Celebrant exerted. Since you're in the next combat phase and a Celebrant has been exerted, the new copy can't exert

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>>53207491
>>53207555
>>53207700

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>>53207491

It does this, for starters

>>53207881
It would work. Celebrant's clause doesn't care if another Celebrant has been exerted, only if that specific Celebrant has been exerted. The Gatherer rulings specifically mention multiple Celebrants attacking for multiple phases.

>>53207553
Behold! The only use for Alms Beast!

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>>53208076

Usually, there would a reference for "this creature" or something along those lines if it cared just for itself being exerted. It's really coming off as a "Namesake" clause that checks for a creature of the same name that's been exerted.

If it's the other way around, that sounds like fun shenanigans.

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https://www.mtggoldfish.com/articles/budget-magic-94-20-tix-modern-possibility-storm

>>53207538
For extra meme value, make sure the card you name is Sarpadian Empire Volume viii

>>53208280
If it just says the card's name, it only cares about that individual card.
In order to care about every card with the same name, it has to say 'if a card named CARDNAME' or similar.

Fastbond+Cloudstone Curio+Grazing Gladehart= infinite mana+life. Add Crucible of Worlds and cycling lands for infinite card draw.

Personally I think Prosperity+Words of Wind would be a fun finish just because all players would have clean boards and their decks as hands.

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Form of the Dragon
Harmless Offering (or Donate)
Brand

Become dragon
Before end step make opponent dragon
During enemy turn become dragon again

I used to play this in Zedruu EDH.

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>>53205998
you're not thinking big enough
>>53206428
ruling: use its name as it leaves the battlefield

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>>53207470
>>53207491
>>53207555
>>53207700
>>53207897
I don't get it.

>>53209621
You. I like you.

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Not really a combo but

>>53206600
stations are cheating

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>>53209649

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>>53206600
Station combos are really cool.

>>53207538
>You can't win, because you cannot defeat what is not there to fight.

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>>53205760

>>53210257
Oh that's smart.

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>>53205760
Conspiracy is a fun card for fun purposes.

>>53210257
You either win with your 357/11, or you win on your extra turn because they had a blocker

>>53210307
>winning with combat damage
Lame. Why win now when you can win next turn?

>>53210307
Unfortunately, you can't target Emrakul with the blades. Fortunately, you can still successfully cast them without a target because zero target creatures is "up to two".

>>53210307
That's only if the Spawnsire doesn't have summoning sickness.

>>53210316
Not my fault they should've gone with Shields instead of Blades.
>>53210331
Spawnsire is still a legal target

>>53210257
How does the legend rule interact with the stack, and how should you stack the triggers? Do you have to go Emrakul > Blades x175 > Emrakul, or can you go Emrakul > Emrakul > Blades x175?

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>>53210385
You need all the blades to resolve and be put into your graveyard before one of the Emrakuls is put in. As long as the second Emrakul is the last thing being cast, you're fine no matter where the first was.

>>53210257

can somebody explain this one to me?

>>53210687

wait nvm i get it now

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I didn't even realize this combo when I put the deck together. Usually only get to do this once per playgroup, but it's still fun.

>>53209649
Judges aren't players. Checkmate planeswalker.

>>53210410
This doesn't work. The cost reduction is {1}, this doesn't account for any colored mana.

Also you're casting gravecrawler, not activating one of it's abillities.

>>53210813
You've missed the entire point.

>>53210813
You use the embalming tools to mill, not to lower gravecrawler's cost. Gravecrawler needs 1 mana, and phyrexian altar generates 1 mana

>>53210879
>>53210833
Yeah, I was stupid. I've seen Ashnod's altar instead of Phyrexian.

>>53210989
Yeah, it wouldn't work at all with Ashnod's.

>>53207470
Need to add nevermaker

>>53208280
Just checked the gatherer, it only cares about the specific combat celebrant that was exerted, other combat celebrants can exert for additional combat phases.

>>53208280
I assume you're a Yugioh player, since that kind of wording would prevent multiples from working together in Yugioh, but that's not the case in MtG.

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Avacyn + Worldslayer

>>53208945
Explain

>>53205721
Honestly this seems a little weak overall unless you have field control already. You have to constantly upkeep the five mana every turn to keep your turn going, and if you don't have a win condition outside of that, you're essentially fucked. Sure I guess you could try waiting your opponent out, but taking the extra turns seems redundant really unless you're just showing off.

>>53211850
Infinite turns means you'll eventually draw enough lands and enough cards that you'll be able to just make a board presence.

>>53211887
You'll also be rebuilding your board essentially from a 5 mana disadvantage the whole time. Seems ineffective when you can just outright win with 3-4 mana using most combos and two cards.

>>53209649
Bolas plz

>>53212012
Who cares, when you are taking all the turns?
You've won at that point, unless you've got no way to win in your deck. You are playing solitaire Magic now.
You've already won.

>>53211850
What the fuck am I reading

>>53207803
The problem with commander is that it only takes one fuckhead to ruin everyone's game and waste their time. Every bloody game at my college is 40 minutes of actual commander fun, people using weird combos and screwing around, making alliances and having a good time, then somebody pulls a combo out of their ass and that's it, the game is just over, literally nothing you could have done about it.
It's a self-destructive mindset. People stopped showing up when every game ended with some insta-win, when all they wanted to do was have fun.

>>53214602
How does the game end if no one wins?

>>53214841
I think his issue is less with people winning, and more with people pulling out cards others are not familiar with to set off unstoppable combos that make the entire game up to that point irrelevant.
Basically what he's saying is that they seem to be unaware that trickery and deception are not the only ways to achieve victory in battle! And what the future of MTG needs right now is not to play THEIR game, but to indulge in the simpleness of a mortal, human mind!

"Ya'll need Rescue Cat", basically.

>>53210257
That's fucking dumb. I love it.

>>53210410
I fell in love with that combo.

>>53205721
absolute shit combo honestly. you would need a way to produce a shit load of colored mana to really do anything with it and at that point your combo is so thin a single card would probably break it unless you have been sand bagging a lot of answers. if you somehow managed to pull it off your opponent(s) deserve to lose

>>53215536
You may end up needing something like Withered Wretch if someone at the table has one of the original Eldrazi Titans in their deck though.

>>53209922
>i attack for the win...
>but did you win though?
>i guess?
>how does it feel then? did you truly defeated anything?
>i-i...
>next time you play, thing about it and apply it to your daily life
>w-what?
>*stands up with nothing to scoop*

>>53211821
When playing MtgO, whenever you name a card, it brings down a whole long list of every card ever printed. The card at the top of that list is always Sarpadian Empires Volume viii. This is because the card is listed as "@i@sarpadian empires volume viii@i@," because the name of the card is actually italicized, and the software isn't able to display that.
So, if you've ever played MtgO, you've probably heard of Sarpadian Empires Volume viii, even if you've never seen the card played.

>>53210257

Spawnsire of Ulamog + 40 Abundant Maw is way more efficient

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Imagine this guy tossing an Emrakul

>>53216577
>Worrying about efficiency

This is maybe not the thread for you.

>>53216577
Does it even really matter? There's dozens of ways for Spawnsire of Ulamog's 20 activation to end the game. It is 20: win the game.

>>53209649
wincon?

>>53216715
It's just a joke. It suggests playing for example 30 islands and 30 copies of Shadow of Doubt.

>>53214841
You can win without infinite combos.

>>53208250
Not true. My friend had a 'flying elephants' deck that revolved around making the Alms Beast evasive for cheap.

>>53205769
This is combo, but I'm sensing a distinct lack of wombo.

>>53217119
If you can't figure out something fun to do with infinite mana then there's not much help for you.

>>53208250
It was tons of fun in draft with a Gift of Orzhova.

>>53210257
i seriously don't get this. please help

>>53217304
Resolve Spawnsire of Ulamog's 20 cost ability. Cast 175 copies of Blades of Velis Vel and two copies of Emrakul. Blades of Velis Vel are instants, so they go in your graveyard after resolving. The first Emrakul comes into play, then the second does and the legendary rule kills them both. They both go into your graveyard, and your graveyard gets shuffled into your library along with the 175 copies of Blades of Velis Vel. Next turn you win in the upkeep phase via Battle of Wits.

>>53206107
Oh woo infinite mana
Think bigger you boring fuck

>>53217304
You use Spawnsire to freecast the Emrakuls and Blades of Velis Veil from outside the game.
You put Emrakul on the stack, then all the Blades, then the other Emrakul.
Emrakul resolves, you get an Emrakul. Yay.
All the blades resolve, doesn't matter what happens, but they're put in the graveyard.
Emrakul #2 resolves, and now the Legend Rule rears its head, saying SAC AN EMRAKUL. You do so, and Emrakul and your graveyard are shuffled into your library, which should now be more than 200 cards. You (rather specifically) cast two Emrakuls, so you get two extra turns, so you end turn and Battle of Wits triggers with 200+ cards in your library during your upkeep.

>>53206881
Or rooftop storm, grimgrin, Grave Crawler. No mana required as you can cast grave crawler for GY

>>53216385
>Sarpadian Empires Volume viii
Volume VII you wretch

>>53217119
Definitely no happy feet

>>53217919
Then you should name volume viii for extra, EXTRA meme value :^)

>>53208280
Is other way around. Commander players were absolutely stoked for this card for that reason.

>>53211372
Bouncing Reality Acid across everyone's permanants is pretty cool.

>>53217965
When naming a card, you have to name a card that exists.
You don't have to name a card that's legal in the format you are playing, but it has to be an officially printed Magic card.
Personally, I'd say Uncards, Conspiracy draft-matters cards, or other cards banned even in Vintage would also work. Shahrazad, Contract from Below, Infernal Spawn of Evil, or Chaos Orb might be good choices.
Or Storm Crow.

>>53218839
Chimney Imp.

>>53218852
Sorrow's Path

>>53218891
Blacker Lotus
Also, make sure you say the name in a foreign language. That counts, right? I wonder, does it have to be a language that magic is officially printed in, or could you say the word in elvish or klingon or piglattin?

>>53215008
So he's mad that people aren't just turning their creatures sideways.

>>53219036
Kind of.
Again, not him, but there are some combos that are in Pun-Pun territory of bullshit.
While to me it's part of the game, it's easy to see why some would be pissed off that there aren't rules to prevent infinite combos, etc.

>>53219036
There's a difference between 'just turning creatures sideways' and 'infinite combo, I win'
That said, it's EDH. It's almost impossible NOT to end up with some sort of infinite combo in your deck by accident just by the nature of the thing.
I know, I've tried to make a deck with no infinites. I had to settle for no infinites that are four cards or less.

>>53214602
40 minutes is obscene. The true problem with commander is the vast skewing of the playerbase. You have people who want to basically play 100 card singleton vintage and others who think the format should exclusively be non-infinite 8 card combos that deal 5 damage to a creature, or just turning dudes sideways. There's no way to have a large, well balanced commander group, if the power level starts low then it devolves into an eventual arms race, if it starts high then only reliable turn 3 infinite combos are viable.

>>53214602
>tfw you're that fuckhead playing yidris storm
>tfw you do nothing, get to about 5 life, then combo off, draw while deck, gain 1000 life and nuke everyone in one turn
Feels so good man

>>53219128
I honestly don't get it. After 40 minutes of the same commander game I want to fucking kill myself and I don't even play in a high power meta, we just don't bitch at players setting up infinite or one-turn kill combos.

>>53219136
There's basically no way to win a commander game without a bunch of dudes to turn sideways or an infinite combo.

>>53218839
>You don't have to name a card that's legal in the format you are playing
Are you sure about this? I've read that the named card has to be legal in the format that is being played.

>>53210257
>>53210257
That's funny.

Won't work for any format other than casual since this ability draws from your side deck in a sanctioned event.

>>53219254
Personally, I feel that it's less about infinites and more about how easy/how much your deck is dedicated to making them.
If all you do every game is search for Combo Piece A and Combo Piece B (both of which you have multiple variations of, and/or one is your commander) to win then and there, it's boring.
If the deck's designed to just only draw shit naturally, or requires a bunch of pieces (thus can be disrupted more easily), then whatever.

>>53207538
Replace Swamp with Lotus Petal and you can cut Dark Ritual and Sinkhole to increase the consistency.

I still don't think a combo will ever impress me more than the "phase out your opponents commander forever" combo.

>>53205721
Any two Wishes that target Sorceries + Shahrazad

>>53207538
But why?

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>>53207612
Could finish with this for lulz

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>>53209621
There are easier ways

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I won a surprising amount of Penny Dreadful games with this 100% retarded combo

Easiest way to execute is use a bunch of cathartic reunion etc to find the pieces and dump Grozoth in the yard, then makeshift mannequin it at oppo's end of turn.

>>53218957
If you name a card to search your library for, do you have to name it in the language the card is printed?

>>53220057
No.

>>53219380
>taking the combo seriously

It's more of a joke or thought excercise rather than a viable wombo.

>>53218661
Yeah

Staff of nin is more direct though and leads to less salt

>>53220967
It's quintessential Johnny Magic. Impractical and stupid, existing only for the sake of showing that it can be done.

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>>53219534
share it

>>53210410
It's weird how I don't think I've seen almost anyone else point this out.

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Can anyone come up with the most overcomplicated combo ever? Sure everyone wants a 2-3 card combo, but I wanna see the longest card combination to ever existed in face of the Multiverse and to actually playable.

>>53223306
I once saw this crazy combo on tappedout that involved giving your opponent infinite mana and control of your Door to Nothingness. You basically force your opponent to use Door on themselves, because if they try to hit you with the Door, the overcomplicated combo resets the gamestate to where it was previously, over and over until your opponent finally gives up and kills themselves with their own Door to Nothingness.

Unfortunately, I remember literally nothing else about the deck.

>>53223306
http://www.soniccenter.org/sm/mtg/megacombo.html

be amazed at this glorious display of autism

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>>53205760

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judge thread is gone, this seems like a fine place to ask

what's the correct order to activate these effects

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>>53223397
Sounds fucking amazing.
>>53223483
>mfw

>>53207401
That's fast and pretty damned easy, and was even in block I am not sensing the wombo here. Might have even seen some play if anybody was running anything but faeries at the time.

>>53223712
use the first effect 4 times, then use the 2nd effect once

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>>53223483

>>53223712
Plot Twist: The order doesn't matter.
Effects that switch power and toughness apply after all other effects that change power and/or toughness, regardless of which effect was created first.

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>Run a deck with 35 of these and lands
>Wait for them to pop a fetch or something
>Drop 4 of them kill him instantly
>They ask to see my deck
>Nah dude just a lucky draw gg

>>53223551
toot too loo tooo tooot
play you the song of my people (homarids)

>>53224543
>Not even casting Shadow of Doubt

>>53223551
it doesn't work...

>>53224968
It works, but you miss out on all the sweet cast triggers.

>>53225014
>It works
how?
you activate the ability of the artifact but you don't have any minotaur card in hand
you cast the spell but there's nothing to target

>>53225104
You change the text on the permanent to say Eldrazi. Any time you activate the ability from then on, it makes an ability on the stack that also says "Eldrazi" on it.

>>53225155
you need a target, you can't say "okay, now some cards are Eldrazi just because".
also, if I remember correctly, cards in hand are not considered permanents...

>>53225229
What do you think Artificial Evolution is suppose to target?

>>53225243
a target that you don't have not in the stack nor on the battlefield....

>>53225271
Did you consider using the Artificial Evolution to target the Didgeridoo?

>>53225275
it's late here
you've right
I need oculist

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That's a nice commander you've got there. Shame they're gone for the whole game now and there's no way to possibly get it back.

Expect for Karn Liberated ult anyways

>>53225727

It will just phase back in next turn with the creature it was equipped to.

>>53225840
Not if you equip it to a token :v)

>>53225867
You have that nose on backwards fuckass it's supposed to look like this: :^)

FUck

>>53223397
There's a better version where you donate a lich's mirror to your opponent then kill them with poison counters, trapping them in a loop of infinite 'losses'.

>>53225898
:<)

>>53225839
If you donate the Obliterator while the effect is on the stack, you can deal 10 damage to the Obliterator instead of 5 for extra kaboom potential.

>>53225924
No dude

FUCK

retard

You have to flip it TURN-WAYS

>>53225915
How does that work?

>>53226186
No you can't, because you have to choose targets as one of the first parts of activating the ability.
In order to donate it, you can't use it's ability.
And on top of that, even if you donated a second obliterator beforehand, it'd just make YOU sacrifice permanents as well as them.

>>53211800
and this is exactly why i target the group huggy fruitcake in EDH first, cause they always do garbage like this.

>>53210257
Cool for casual but the cards you cast from outside the game have to be in your sideboard right? 15 card limit to sideboard

>>53226195
:>)

>>53225727
or any other card effect that resets the game, but yeah that is a nice permanent removal combo.

If you use Imprisoned in the moon instead of song of the dryad you can reduce the colors needed by 1

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>>53225915
>>53226195

>>53223483
how do you even come up with this type of shit god damn.

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It's so complicated and easy to disrupt, but I want to go for it.

>>53226686
>Saffi
Always a sign that you've got a spicy combo on your hands.

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>>53223306
>>53223483 (Obviously not as insane as this)
I use a 10+ card combo to make Wood Elemental not suck (as much).

Have out (or play with some form of haste like Coordinate Crossroads if doing in one turn) Homeward Path, High Market, Isochron Scepter with Standardize imprinted, Noble Benefactor, Eladamri's Vineyard and/or Magus of the Vineyard.
Play Life and Limb, one of either Nature's Revolt, Living Plane, or Earth Surge (only one of the 3 of these are necessary to keep all lands from dying with both Lattice and March out). Play Mindslaver and use it on your victim. Play March of the Machines and Mycosynth Lattice. Worldly/Sylvan Tutor for Wood Elemental (or Brainstorm if it is already in your hand) and put it on top of your library. Play Knowledge Pool. Pass turn. At this point, all permanents should be Artifacts and Creatures and you are controlling your opponent's turn. During their upkeep, activate your Isochron Scepter copying Standardize (since it is not cast from hand, it gets around the Knowledge Pool) and choose Saproling. This should turn all permanents into creature type Saproling and thanks to the Life and Limb, also Forests. Also activate the High Market, sacrificing the Noble Benefactor, we don't care what we get with our deck, but we ensure our opponent gets something they can cast from their hand with the mana from the Vineyard(s) and Lattice. Go to their draw, we don't care what they draw. Cast the card we Noble Benefactor'd for them with said Vineyard(s) mana, triggering Knowledge Pool. Have them choose (Yay, Mindslaver!) to instead cast your Wood Elemental, also choosing to sacrifice all their untapped permanents (i.e. all of them), which are also Forests, to the Wood Elemental. Activate Homeward Path and pass turn. Swing with however big a Wood Elemental that they had permanents for, also they now have nothing in play. Profit?

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>>53227279
I also run Wood Elemental in my mono-Green Elemental Tribal EDH with Titania, because why not?

>>53226730

I just have no idea how to reliable assemble it in an EDH setting.

>>53227351
Never worry about reliably assembling things in EDH. Just play combos made out of cards you'd be happy to play individually and maybe sometimes you'll go off. It's best to think of it as a treat rather than a gameplan.

>>53206337
how does this work if celebrant doesn't untap itself during the additional untap step

>>53227742
splinter twin on celebrant
tap celebrant to make a twin
exert twin to untap celebrant
rinse, repeat

I want to build a aura curse mardu deck

using lots of curses

any combos working in the colors that get curses out quickly or something along those lines??

>>53227648
>filename not being "Crashing this plane with no survivors"
8/10 spicy combo

>>53227648
Don't forget Null Rod and Presence of the Master to finish the lock

>>53227648
>>53228987
Scratch that, Titania's Song instead of Null Rod

>>53210257
Having one of your changelings be Mirror Entity is best. 0 mana sacrifice your entire board.

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>>53228999
I like this idea.

>>53211850
You play Laboratory Maniac.

>>53223397
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/lab/theres-door-2013-10-31

>>53223483
i can't read this science stuff. so how much damage did he do? can someone explain in a way that a retard can understand

>>53229677
The number of permanents passed the number of atoms in the universe early on.
The damage is noninfinite, but it's larger than anything actually able to put in context by the human mind.

>>53207070
>Walking Archive
>Creature - Construct

>>53221223
Usually it occurs parallel to me Cloudforming/Lighforming every permanant in my deck onto the field, and subsequently returning every counterspell in my yard to my hand, and making infinite 1/1 tokens of several different kinds. Scooping tends to follow anyways in either case.

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>>53207401
If you give him trample sure its threatening, but so long as they have a blocker its the same as any other big creature.
you need to add pic related to really be a threat

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every card you own in your hand with infinite mana. Get lit, planeswalker.

>>53229677
The final damage is stated to be 2 -> 20 -> 408

Chain arrow notation has four rules:
Rule 1 (only two numbers): a->b = ab
Rule 2 (last number is 1): #->1 = # where # denotes the rest of the chain (chop off the ending 1)
Rule 3 (second last number is 1): #->1->a = # where # denotes the rest of the chain (chop off the last two numbers)
Rule 4 (otherwise): #->a->b = #->(#->(a-1)->b)->(b-1) (decrease last number by 1, feed chain with second last number decreased by 1 into the second last number)
since we dont end on 1, we can ignore rules 2 and 3 and start off at rule 4

#->20->408
=#->(#->(19)->408)->407, which means we now have a new inner term to expand with Rule 4
(#->19->408) = (#->(#->(18)->408)->406)
repeat a bunch of times
(#->2->390) = (#->(#->(1)->408)->389), here we have Rule 3:
(#->(#->(1)->408)->389) = (#->(#)->389)

So just that initial expansion turns 2->20->408 into:
2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->2->408)->389)->390)->391)->392)->393)->394)->395)->396)->397)->398)->399)->400)->401)->402)->403)->404)->405)->406)->407

Now the innermost term is
2->2->408
which expands into
(2->(2->(1)->408)->407) = 2->2->407
...
4, (2->2->x = 4)

2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(2->(16)->389)->390)->391)->392)->393)->394)->395)->396)->397)->398)->399)->400)->401)->402)->403)->404)->405)->406)->407

And then you have to expand the 2->16->389 again
and at this point I ran out of autism and characters.

Example from wikipedia with tiny numbers:
4->3->2 = 13 407 807 929 942 597 099 574 024 998 205 846 127 479 365 820 592 393 377 723 561 443 721 764 030 073 546 976 801 874 298 166 903 427 690 031 858 186 486 050 853 753 882 811 946 569 946 433 649 006 084 096

tl;dr: think of the biggest number you can and add a few million zeroes.
This is more.

Disclaimer: I have no idea if i made a mistake somewhere in between.

>>53225727
I don't get it...

>>53223306
I sent a friend a silly idea: Donate Scalpelexis to my opponent, force it to attack, win by Laboratory Maniac because my deck is loaded with Relentless Rats.
His response: I'd rather Imprint Research//Development on Isochron Scepter, give to opponent with Bazaar Trader. Have Mind Over Matter. Have a graveyard-shuffling Eldrazi titan in your deck. Have Fecundity in play. Give opponent Platinum Empirion. Mindslaver opponent. Give opponent Myr Moonvessel. Have Aluren, Athreos, Scalpelexis, Elesh Norn. Force opponent to infinitely draw and add basic forests to his deck until it is a statistical certainty his whole library is forests, mill him with Scalpelexis.
I will never delete that text message.

>>53224543
If you have Tamiyo's emblem this will kill the table.

>>53229909
Sometimes mistakes happen. Especially right before they make colorless nonartifact creatures for the first time.
It was errata'd to be an artifact creature as intended.

>>53230810
Play Song on the opponent's commander, so it's a noncreature land.
Use Liquimetal to turn it into an artifact land.
Bludgeon Brawl says it's now an equipment, too.
Use Magnetic Theft to attach this legendary artifact land-equipment to a token creature (not included in the picture), then Reality Ripple the token.
Token phases out, never phases back in because token
First step is required because you can't attach creatures to anything else, for the record.
Also works on things other than commanders, but exiling is a lot easier and generally just as effective at getting rid of it

>>53232240
Excuse my retardness, so the token phases out with the legendary-land-equipment attach to it, token doesn't phase back and neither does the equipment? Why doesn't the equipment return?

>>53225867
Phased-out permanents are actually still on the battlefield. They never leave or enter when phasing in or out. Phased-out permanents are just treated as though they don't exist.

>>53210257
1- You need 20 manas for that;
2- In a competitive game, that rule works differently.

>>53232611
>702.25f When a permanent phases out, any Auras, Equipment, or Fortifications attached to that permanent phase out at the same time. This alternate way of phasing out is known as phasing out “indirectly.” An Aura, Equipment, or Fortification that phased out indirectly won’t phase in by itself, but instead phases in along with the permanent it’s attached to.

If the permanent it was attached to doesn't phase back in, it won't phase in either.

>>53232728
You're looking for the competitive general, maybe.

>>53232744
I understand. But the token *never leaves the battlefield* and therefore doesn't cease to exist. It will phase back in.

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>>53207538

>>53233270
>110.5f A token that’s phased out, or that’s in a zone other than the battlefield, ceases to exist. This is a state-based action; see rule 704. (Note that if a token changes zones, applicable triggered abilities will trigger before the token ceases to exist.)

Get learned.

>>53223306
Cards on the battlefield: Kiki Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Meddling Mage, Pithing Needle, March of the Machines, Intruder Alarm, Moat, Gravity Sphere, Phyrexian Altar, Leonin Relic-Warder (exiling Grip of Chaos), Rings of Brighthearth, Sundial of the Infinite

>Use Kiki to copy Meddling Mage, naming a new spell. Intruder Alarm Triggers, untapping Kiki Jiki. Repeat 16363 times naming every spell in MTG
>Use Kiki to Copy Pithing Needle, naming a new card. Intruder Alarm Triggers, untapping Kiki-Jiki. Repeat 16948 times, naming every card except Kiki and Sundial
>Move to the end step, and activate sundial in response to the delayed triggers going on the stack
>Use Kiki and rings in response, copying needle twice. Name Kiki and Sundial. Sacrifice Relic-Warder using the Altar (mana ability gets around pithing needle). Grip of Chaos enters the battlefield
>Sundial activation resolves, exiling delayed triggers. The copies are now permanent

No one can cast spells or activate abilities. No creatures can attack. If any triggers are put on the stack their targets are reselected at random. The ultimate lockdown.

>>53232728
Source?

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>>53223483
Was about to post that

>>53233500
Just checking, the purpose of this combo is not to be particularly useful or practical, it's just to confuse the hell out of as many players or judges as you can.

>>53207881
Once again proving that the is bad at magic

>>53216058
>Look down to see if he's gonna pick up his deck
>Deck is not there
>look up
>Guy is not there
>Look around
>Building is empty
>Hear sounds of door being locked for the night

>>53234322
Confusing judges you say?
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?29732-Legacy-Judge-Destroyer-1-0

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If someone posted chaos confetti combo I didn't see it. Behold the most needlessly complicated combo that is legal in 0 formats.

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>>53234485

>>53207538
Y lie? The crypt wouldn't exile itself so you would have one card in the grave yard.

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>>53235187
Except that it will.

>>53235187
Sacrifice is a cost and when the trigger resolves, the crypt is in the grave

>>53227648
3 colors. Not just casting wrath and Armageddon. Wtf m8 this combo blows

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>>53207538
Personally, I'm a fan of this variation

>>53235357
>Wrath and Arma only happens once. This happens forever.

Also it only costs me 3W to cast all that >>53229262

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The only cheekier option than omniscience I can think of is to use As Foretold, but that needs 13 counters.
Anyway, you cast emrakul, take control of your opponent's turn and pass. on their turn you sac emrakul, and they choose to give her back for athreos's trigger. then you cast her again on their turn, and they pass. they take an extra turn, which you control as well. repeat. eventually they deck out.

>>53235446
The main problem with that is that you actually *do* something when executing it, and that's bad.

>>53234485
It's missing the step where they call the cops on you and ban you from that location.

>>53234485
In response to Mirrorweave, enter Scoop Phase.

>>53226255
Pretty much exactly what I wrote. Lich's Mirror says "if you would lose the game, shuffle all permanents you OWN into your library, then draw 7 and your life total becomes 20." Because you don't OWN Lich's Mirror, you just CONTROL it, the mirror doesn't get shuffled away. Nothing takes away the poison counters, so the gamestate checks immediately after you 'resolve' the replacement effect on Mirror and see "Whoops, you've got 10 poison counters, guess you lose!" which sets off Lich's Mirror all over again.

Technically it's a draw, since you create an unbreakable loop, there's actually a ruling on gatherer about it.

> If you control *but don’t own* Lich’s Mirror, Lich’s Mirror itself will still be on the battlefield after its effect is finished. If you would lose the game again for any of the reasons above, Lich’s Mirror has its effect again . . . and again . . . and again. An involuntary infinite loop will be created, and the game will end in a draw. (In the case of the triggered ability example given last in the list above, it’s possible that a player could cause the loop to end while the ability is on the stack. None of the loops caused by state-based actions can be stopped at all.)

>>53238820
I thought there was a rule in the CRD that auto-stopped involuntary unbreakable loops after a few cycles. What with Humility and double Opalessance no longer dividing by zero as it once did.

>>53206600
How is this inf damage?

>>53238929
The lattice turns the colorless tokens into artifacts. Therefore Summoning Station's effect untaps Balsting Station, and Blasting Station's effect untaps Summoning Station.

>>53238929
lattice makes the tokens artifacts, sac token to blasting to do damage, sac'd token untaps summoning, tap summoning to create token, which then untaps blasting. Repeat ad infinitum

>>53239067
>>53239058
The tokens dont hit the graveyard because they are still tokens

>>53238929
Tap Summoning Station to put an artifact token (since Mycosynth makes it an artifact), then tap Blasting Station to ping and sac the token, since the token goes to the graveyard Summoning Station untaps, tap it again and put an artifact token, now that a creature entered the battlefield Blasting Station is untaped, rinse and repeat.

>>53239105
>>53239137
Nvm i checked im wrong

>>53239105
Tokens hit the grave (leyline of the void, and rest in piece not withstanding). They just stop existing afterwards when game states are checked.

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>>53239176
This is important to many, many triggers.

>>53238913
Humility and Opalesence got sorted out by timestamps and layers.

>>53238913
No that would be stupid. How would you 'stop' an involuntary infinite loop (ie: 3 oblivion rings and no other permanents on the field) just say 'oh I guess this one fizzles'?

Unbreakable loops lead to a draw assuming they do not progress game state to a conclusion (Interestingly, Sanguine Bond + Exquisite Blood leads to a draw if the opponent has a platinum angel or any sort of way to prevent a loss. Angels Grace would do it too.)

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>>53227648

>>53239741
I'm no judge. I just remember they tweaked the rules to fix the Humility Opalescence loop. I was under the impression that if an involuntary loop starts up that doesn't change the game state it auto ends after X cycles, since getting the game caught in feedback loops is stupid in its own right. Granted the Sanguine Bond / Exquisite Blood vs Platinum Angle is pretty funny, since even with my (admittedly flawed) understanding of the rules that'd still end in a non-stop cycle, since the game state would keep changing by driving the target into lower and lower negatives.

>>53238913

Not in MTG. Some card games do terminate involuntary loops, but magic just draws the game.

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Combo that I find really fun. The Chord is optional if Ob Nixilis is already in play.

>>53239235
Actually Leyline of the Void does not stop tokens from hitting the yard, only Rest in Peace does. Leyline specifies cards, and tokens are not cards.

>>53240402
Can you skip the haze in this combo?
You still get infinite turns as far as I see,so all its doing is giving you double infinite and 10 dam a turn instead of 5

>>53240638
No you need the Haze to get the Second Chance back so it can trigger again on your next turn's 1st upkeep.

>>53240638
When you put the starfield trigger on the stack during first upkeep second chance isn't in the graveyard so you can't target it, thus you need the second upkeep.

>>53240702
Or you just need second chance in your graveyard when you go off.

>>53240679
>>53240702
But second chance just says during your upkeep, so first turn starfeild doesn't grab anything, then second chance triggers, it goes to the grave. Next turn starfield dose grab second chance, its still in your up keep so second chance has time to resolve and trigger, all in the same upkeep with no need for haze.
At least that's how I see it

>>53240937
Gatherer is your friend:
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=12391

>At the beginning of your upkeep, if you have 5 or less life, sacrifice Second Chance and take an extra turn after this one.

>>53241068
In that case having two copies of second chance works just fine.

>>53241068
Ok if that's the new wording then yes now I see the need for haze

I wonder if there is an optimal EDH deck to assemble to maximise chances of pulling off some of these more retarded and overly complicated combos.

Like, having a deck that has a solid 30-40% chance to pull something stupid off after a few turns without using duplicate cards with a maximized probability due to including only the most common reasons for causing dumb combos.

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>>53225727
Too bad it requires 5 cards + a token. Would love to see it in action.

>opponent's reaction when his commander is in another dimension

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>>53221530
>Cast "Word of Seizing" to gain control of your opponents commander
>Enchant the Commander with "Song of the Dryads" to make it a non-creature
>Cast "Liquimetal Coating" and turn the Commander-Land into an artifact
>Cast "Bludgeon Brawl" to turn that artifact into an Equipment
>Use "Kher Keep" to create a token
>Attach the Commander-Land-Equipment to that token
>Enchant the token with "Vanishing"
>Activate "Vanishing"
>Your opponents Commander has now been phased out forever

Rulings:
>502.15i When a permanent phases out, any local enchantments or Equipment attached to that permanent phase out at the same time. This alternate way of phasing out is known as phasing out "indirectly." An enchantment or Equipment that phased out indirectly won't phase in by itself, but instead phases in along with the card it's attached to.
>702.23j Phased-out tokens cease to exist as a state-based action. See rule 704.5d.
>702.25b If a permanent phases out, its status changes to “phased out.” Except for rules and effects that specifically mention phased-out permanents, a phased-out permanent is treated as though it does not exist. It can’t affect or be affected by anything else in the game. A permanent that phases out is removed from combat. (See rule 506.4.)
>903.9. If a commander would be exiled from anywhere or put into its owner’s hand, graveyard, or library from anywhere, its owner may put it into the command zone instead. This replacement effect may apply more than once to the same event. This is an exception to rule 614.5.

tl;dr
Steal enemy commander and turn it into a non-creature equipment. Attach to a token. Make the token phase out.

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>>53223306
Not wombo or anything, but I use this in my Sakashima edh deck for a game ender if needed.
This is probably the most consistent method I have despite it being pretty long winded.

>Have 8 islands, Caged Sun, Teferi and Echo Mage enchanted with Freed from the Real in play
>Have Copy Artifact/Stolen Identity/Saheeli's Artistry and any Extra turn card in hand
>Play a copy spell targeting Sun
>Copy with Echo Mage, untap how ever many times I can
>With Teferi, untap 4 lands
>Play another one of the copy spells targeting Sun again
>Islands normally produce at least 10 mana at this point
>Cast extra turn card, Copy with Echo Mage
>Take extra turns, hope to draw any kind of draw spell that stacks (Brainstorm, Ponder, Anticipate) or Tomorrow, Azami's Familiar
>Stack deck and hand to get Tamiyo, Tezzeret, Chain Veil, Everflowing Chalice (Basically infinite Planeswalker activations) and Blatant Thievery
>Ult all walkers, Tap all non creature permanents opponents control with Tamiyo
>Cast and Copy Blatant Thievery stealing any creatures my opponents control
>Attack with creatures
>Doesn't matter if I have to pass the turn because opponents have no usable mana (stray FoW's don't really do anything at this point)
>Continue to attack until the game is over.

>>53207704
You don't need a lot of defenders.. Just one extra.

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>>53242563
>>53225727

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>>53223483
>>53242563

>"Your Johnny players were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn’t stop to think if they should."

>>53212012
I don't think you get it, nobody else gets a turn for the rest of the game, you have ALL the turns, if you deck can't win you the game in however many cards you have left in your deck I'd be surprised.

>>53243621
Huh...
Brb putting this in my Scion deck.

I made a 5 color chaos edh deck, and tbqh famalam, I'm not even 100% positive how all the interactions work. Eventually each turn ends up taking around an hour to complete, so people scoop.

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>>53243621
As an alternate version

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>>53243813
>>53243621
this one works with lattice too

/d&d

>>53232510
>702.25f When a permanent phases out, any Auras, Equipment, or Fortifications attached to that permanent phase out at the same time. This alternate way of phasing out is known as phasing out “indirectly.” An Aura, Equipment, or Fortification that phased out indirectly won’t phase in by itself, but instead phases in along with the permanent it’s attached to.
Permanent it's attached to never phases in = equipment never phases in

>>53226318
>Activate predatory urge granted ability on obliterator targeting itself
>donate obliterator
>Allow urge ability to resolve
>Obliterator hits itself for 5, then hits itself for 5 again
>Opponent must sac 10 permanents>

>>53242613
Kyle?

It's pretty gross, go from having two non-land P's in play to winning the game in about 10 minutes.

>>53243813
Seems rude. Putting it in now.

>>53217704
I think you're missing the point of gary

>>53243850

I fucking love this card, holding artifacts hostage causes opponents to gun for it while I have a few turns to play stuff and a bit of defense.

Even failing that it's a nice bounce against people that think disk+darksteel+lattice is the most ingenious thing in the world.

>>53223483

I'm almost 100% sure I'm being rused here. I refuse to believe that is a real person who posted on some sonic site.

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>>53223306

>>53226387
How do cards like that work in EDH?

>>53245567
>10/1/2009: In a sanctioned event, a card that’s “outside the game” is one that’s in your sideboard. In an unsanctioned event, you may choose any card from your collection.

Unless you're playing sanctioned EDH, god help you, you can get whatever is in your collection, with your collection just being what cards you happen to have on you if you don't have every card you own in your possession at the time.

>>53245567
>Abilities which refer to other cards owned outside the game (Wishes, Spawnsire, Research, Ring of Ma'ruf) do not function in Commander without prior agreement on their scope from the playgroup.

>>53246130
Anyone who wouldn't let you get enough Blades of Velis Vel to win off a Battle of Wits in a casual EDH game is not the sort of person I would want to play with.

>>53210257
>May 13th
Ugh?
>May 15th
Holy shit, Blades of Velis Vel have Changeling

I really need to stop keeping part of cards

>>53245567
First: everyone at the table has to agree to allow Wish effects to even function.
Second: get whatever you like if they all said yes, or swap the Wish cards out if anyone said no.

>>53224359
This nigga knows his layers

>>53233414
looks like the beginning of my edh deck

i don't run the digger tho

>>53233414
>>53248801

I dun git it

>>53250944
Looks like:
>On board
>Grenzo, Altar, Digger
>Cast Priest
>Get RRR
>Sacrifice Priest
>Get 2
>Spend 2RRR to cast Siege-Gang
>Get Siege Gang and 3 goblins
>Sacrifice a goblin for 2 to use Digger to put Priest on the bottom of your library
>Sacrifice another goblin for 2 to use Grenzo to get Priest back
>Get RRR
>Sacrifice Priest for 2
>It costs 4 mana to return Priest, but you get 2RRR every time, so you can get infinite red mana
>Infinite red mana means you can sacrifice and return Siege Gang commander an infinite number of times, creating infinite goblin tokens
>Sacrifice infinite goblins for infinite damage

It's a good EDH combo because you would be happy to individually play any of those cards, so they're not taking up meaningful slots in your 99 just for the combo, and sometimes you just get to go off.

>>53233500
I don't think this works that way.

If you use Deathrite Shaman's First ability, it won't trigger the Trace of Abundance, because you did not "tap the land for mana"; instead, you activated an non-mana ability that the land had that also happens to produce mana.

If you use his mana ability gained from being a forest, it will trigger Trace, and then trace's trigger will still be a mana ability, so it can't be copied.

>>53252354
Actually, now that I look at it again, you just need Grenzo and Altar on board. You can just sacrifice the third goblin token for the mana to cast Digger, if you need to.

>>53250944
It basically makes infinite gobos, infinite red mana, and the siege can just fling the gobos instead of having to attack cause of all the red mana

>>53252364
This is correct, >>53233500 is a bunk combo.

>106.11. To “tap a permanent for mana” is to activate a mana ability of that permanent that includes the {T} symbol in its activation cost. See rule 605, “Mana Abilities.”

>106.11a An ability that triggers whenever a permanent “is tapped for mana” or “is tapped for mana [of a specified type]” triggers whenever such a mana ability resolves and produces mana or the specified type of mana.

>>53218839
>>53219300
201.3. If an effect instructs a player to choose a card name, the player must choose the name of a card that is legal in the format of the game the player is playing. (See rule 100.6.) A player may not choose the name of a token unless it's also the name of a card.

>>53207339
>The Kalonian word for "ammunition" is the same as the word for "bait"

that's just stupid

>>53219905
This happened to me my very first time playing in a tourny. It was ten years before I started playing again

File: 104.jpg (76KB, 312x445px) Image search: [Google]

76KB, 312x445px

>>53239805
Fuck outta here

>>53255626
Good luck getting Banefire from your opponent's library and good luck getting enough mana for lethal from an enchantment or planeswalker, I guess.