Was he right?

>>53203162
yes

On this specific thing? Yeah I guess.

In generic? Fuck no.

That thing is over a fucking hour long. What's the gist of it?

>>53203825
The first is that dnd4e is garbage

What happened to his show, anyway? I used to enjoy his shit quite a bit.

>>53203855
Gist not first
>>53203858
I think he still makes videos but I prefer his earlier stories

>>53203858
Something about alcohol, twitter drama, an ex of his got a sex change.
And nothing.

>>53203858
He posted one (1) video in an entire year, because he's a drunk ass lazy fuck.

>>53203162
He's made some good points in some of his videos.

1) Roll stats
2) don't play evil pc's
3) d&d 4 and 5e are garbage

>>53203162
Man Razorfist looks different without his glasses.

>>53203935
>an ex of his got a sex change.
Source on that?

>>53203935
>Something about alcohol, twitter drama, an ex of his got a sex change.
>And nothing.
Well shit...I'd possibly hide out as well.

>>53203858
The short story, from what I get of it, is that he just more or less suddenly went radiosilent. He's had a rocky history that led to him leaving Channel Awesome (he posted some tweet about another content creator, suggesting that after her break-up with her boyfriend he was willing to "tie her to a radiator" and love her "my way". Her reaction to it was basically "lol wtf?" and that could've been the end of it, but some hypocrite who had nothing to do with it blew it out of proportions and it led to Spoony leaving. All of this happened while Doug/the NC was on vacation by the way, so when he came back he suddenly saw that Spoony left). He kept his content going on his own website, supposedly got pills for some mental disorder and then just disappeared. Well, not really. He still posts a shitton on Twitter but none of it related to his content. Not even a single explanation or apology. And this guy still gets a thousand bucks a month through Patreon for doing nothing. Nigga got loads of money through crowdfunding for his "Spoony movie" which he promised in 2014, and three years later not a single word has been spoken on the subject.

>>53203967
Wasn't that the video where he drank Ecto-Cooler or something for the first time? Does that even count as content?

>>53204083
>And this guy still gets a thousand bucks a month through Patreon for doing nothing.
700 now

>>53204159
That ain't gonna pay the rent. He'd best get in gear.

>>53204190
I imagine he gets that on top of welfare, which is nothing to sneeze at. Especially when you have to do nothing in return.

Then again, even if he just uploads a vlog every quarter year, he could earn 2000 a month. That's an INCREDIBLY favorable effort-reward ratio.

>>53204225
Good point.

He's chock full of mental health issues which prevent him from continuing to make stuff that I like. I can't imagine that poverty will help at all.

RIP spoonyone

>>53204225
I'll never understand fanboys/girls.

At this point, it should be obvious that Spoony is a crazy and lazy piece of shit. But people still GIVE HIM MONEY

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>>53204030
>Roll stats

>>53204030
>Roll stats is a good point
>Not mentioning 3.PF in what not to play is another good point
Nope

>>53203162
If you want to train to be a that guy I guess

>>53203885
if its a 2 hour movie, he'll make a 5 and a half hour long review of it explaining how bad it was.

Remember- he hates everything

>>53203568
>>53203169
>>53204030
>>53203855
He likes PF and thinks 4e and 5e are bad, he can't recognize what's good.
His raging out is something to behold though, it's fucking sad but like a car crash you can't stop looking.

>>53204030
>1) Roll stats
>2) don't play evil pc's
>3) d&d 4 and 5e are garbage

Well, he (and you) got the first one right, at least.

>>53203162
Yes, the books do smell funny.

He hasn't played it when he made the review, dingbat. Who cares if someone has an opinion about it, just play the game or don't.

>>53204030
>good points
>rolling stats
>best edition of D&D is garbage
>these are good and correct
why must you troll so, anon?

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>>53204190
>>53204225
Doesn't he live with his brother? I know the brother has an actual job.

>>53203568
'If you stat it, they will kill it' stands as true designer advice.

>>53204059
Probably some bullshit he heard on /tv/

>>53203162
I turned off the vid when he said he didn't play

all I remember about the vid was he said cantrips are OP

>>53203858
his bipolar disorder wrecks his shit. probably super depressed nowadays

>>53203162
It is fun to listen to him talk, and he can tell some amusing stories, but he isn't the go-to authority on game design.

His girlfriend April contributed largely to his downfall.

>>53209682

That might be true, but breaking up with his old girlfriend (used to be his webmistress or something?) seems to have started the second (post-TGWTG?) slide which he just never seemed to come back from fully.

I'm well aware that this is /tg/ and we bathe in schadenfreude but watching Spoony descend just makes me sad.

>>53203858
>tfw no FFXII-2 review

>>53209682
Care to elaborate?

>>53209768
>but breaking up with his old girlfriend (used to be his webmistress or something?) seems to have started the second (post-TGWTG?) slide which he just never seemed to come back from fully.
Can you elaborate on this too? I'm not entirely current on the drama.

>>53210213
Yeah, that sucks. Especially because... well. FFXIII-2 isn't a good game, but at the very least it's a game (more than can be said about FFXIII which is just a LONG NARROW HALLWAY or Lightning Returns which is an MMORPG without the other players and way more retarded sidequests). The protagonists are likeable (mostly because it stars Serah rather than Lightning), there's an ongoing conflict, their motivations are clear, the villain is both understandable and sympathetic, there is the illussion of choice (sadly only the illussion), multiple possible endings, actual variation in combat through monster taming. It's an upgrade of a shitty non-game into an underwhelming game. Even Hope goes from being insufferable to a right lad, until he becomes a kid again in Lightning Returns because IDK, Lightning likes /ss/ or something.

>>53211378

Neither am I. Based on ED (which isn't exactly a great source but for INTERNET DRAMA I don't know of a better one) Scarlet and him broke up in Feb of 11, he wasn't booted off TGWTG until 2012.

Jesus, this is awful shit (the ED article, what Spoony's done, the whole fucking kettle of fish): https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Spoony

He's shit and I think that lindy actually was right in more cases than himwhich says a lot since lindy's full of bullshit as well
>>53207633
ony if you've got shitty players, or shitty game that enables deeply hidden shittiness in players

>>53204059
It wasn't an ex.
The twitter drama that basically broke him was that he made a bad BDSM joke at a Channel Awesome member called Lupa (I think that was his/her name).
Lupa sperged out about how this is unacceptable sexual harassment, called down the wrath of the gods and made Spoony look like he's some sort of deranged lunatic who'd genuinely abduct women off the streets and tie them up in his sex dungeon because he has a bad sense of humour/people skills and said something she didn't like over the internet.
After this Channel Awesome basically broke all ties with him for a while as did others and he got so twisted up about it he proceeded to start burning whatever bridges he had left.
If you watched his Ultima 9 review in his Ultima Retrospective, his rant about how the best you can hope is to die before everything you love goes to shit directly references this.

Now I might be overstating how hard he took it, as he did make cameo appearences on the Nostalgia Cirtic later, but few and far between, and he was basically marked as the Black Sheep from that point on. On top of that, I think JewWario was one of the few people to stand up for him, and you may have heard he commited suicide a few years back so that doesn't help.

Anyway, this Lupa person is the "ex" being referred to here.

>>53204359
What he said, is to try rolling stats if the system allows it.
He very specifically said that a lot of modern systems (name dropping 4e and 3.5 specifically) doesn't really work with rolled stats, but that if you have a system where the game is not forcing you to optimize to a degree, you should try it.
Also most of that video was talking about Heroes of Legend and books similar to it, which less-so roll your stats and more give your character a randomized background complete with bonuses and penalties in certain areas which can help you come up with unorthodox motivations.
He even specifically stated that rolling is not for everyone, and no one should be forced to play a character they don't like if they rolled something they don't want to play, but that people should try rolling before doing something else.

>>53203162
>never played it before
>read through the book in a day
>misunderstands how the rules work and how the game works
Pretty worthless video.

>>53203162
He was right, albeit by accident.

Is it all right to hate 5e now? It took a while longer than with 4e.

>>53212780
You can hate 5e now without everyone shitting on you, but the fanboys are still rampant.

Sadly the 4e fanboys are also louder and more autistic too. Less of them though.

>>53204030
>Roll stats
Can be fun but someone might just as well want to play what they came up with
>don't play evil pc's
This is stupid. Evil PCs can totally be done. Evil =/= Unreasonabl. Evil =/= No allegiances.

>>53203162
No. He ignored half the book then complained it wasn't there.

>>53204083
This isn't entirely how the situation played out.

1) Spoony made a rape joke on Twitter to JesuOtaku (now a man) and JesuOtaku shrugged it off.

2) Months later, Spoony is all like "why don't girls like me" (he's still sad because he got dumped like a year ago or so) and Obscurus Lupa (still a woman) goes "yeah I can't feel too bad for you after you made a rape joke to JO."

3) Spoony flips the fuck out on Twitter. He winds up taking a small problem (very few people actually saw the initial OL tweet) and basically turning it into a raging inferno.

4) Doug comes back from vacation, sees this shit, and suspends Spoony for a month while telling him to stop talking about it, and Spoony says publicly that he agrees with Doug's decision to suspend him.

5) Spoony goes silent for a bit, but is ultimately unable to let it go. He gives an insincere, sarcastic apology to OL and JO (who didn't really care) where he offers to whip himself and cut off his penis and other weird shit. Spoony gets fired over this.

6) Fired, Spoony goes back to kicking up a shitstorm on Twitter. It eventually dies down only because people lose interest.

>>53212832
>This is stupid. Evil PCs can totally be done. Evil =/= Unreasonabl. Evil =/= No allegiances.
That's not the problem with Evil PCs, and he actually makes a point of how it's mostly "Don't run Evil PCs in a non-evil party".
It's that if you're downright evil and not a darker shade of neutral, you're eventually going to piss off someone in the party. If there is a good character in the party, eventually they'll take exception to you coercing money out of the people you work for, using extreme methods of torture or killing people who didn't need to die.

If you're not doing anything that wouldn't piss off a good character, then chances are you're just not evil. The same way as if you're not annoying an Evil character with your altruism/etc, you're probably not Good. You're just Neutral with an edge.

>>53212984
>Someone causes an unholy stink about an internet joke and basically character assassinates the guy.
>You put all the blame on him instead.
Aint gotta ask about your politics.

>>53203825
5e books smell funny.

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>>53212780
>Is it all right to hate 5e now?
Implying it wasn't always all right.

>>53212984
>JesuOtaku (now a man)
Did this actually happen or is it a snide reference to JO's amazing androgyny?

>>53215808
JO is now a man called Jacob who married the guy running Anime News Network

>>53215980
These people are strange and incestuous.

>>53212570
>>53212984
>>53215980
TIL Spoony is apparently the sane one in his circles. Seriously, I would be fucking depressed to if these people were the people I interacted with on anything resembling a daily basis.

I always liked Spoony, it's sad to hear he is (or was) surrounded by the SJW awful.

>>53215980
fucker now looks like Dante from DMC

>>53203162
No.

I remember him going on a massive tirade about how casters now have cantrips that basically act as flavored crossbow attacks. "No!" he says. "Wizards should cast their ONE spell and then not get to be a wizard again until they take a nap!"

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>>53215980
>>53216281
Also they are now the very weird case of a woman transitioning into a man that still wants to dress like a slutty woman, it's not pretty.

>>53212570
He made the comment to JesuOtaku, who replied with a tweet (I think it was something among the lines of "wtf") and that was the end of it. Obscurus Lupa sperged out, despite having ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOTHING to do with the situation and even though JesuOtaku herself had put it to rest. Imagine punching your black friend in the shoulder, your friend telling you "quit it" and some random tumblrina calling the cops on you for racially motivated violence. It's a bit like that.

>>53216189
Maybe that's why he went mad. His mind couldn't take all this bullshit and just cracked in twain.

I really hope he gets better. His content was good and I agreed with him more often than not, plus I'm an empathetic human being and don't want someone to suffer unduly.

>>53216478
Except then the cops would arrive and shoot my black friend.

>>53216298
Yeah, the one thing I liked about 5e is one of his biggest complaints, so despite both of us hating it, it's weird.

>>53216449
Are those humans?

>>53216610
Don't think so, they're probably homosexuals.

>>53216602
I like cantrips as a concept - simple little spells that wizards can cast as often as they like - but they've always been just way too powerful for my tastes, and I can therefore agree with Spoony's argument even if he puts it somewhat bluntly.

>>53216635
I mean, it's a woman who transitioned to a man, who is in a relationship with a man, and dresses like a woman.

I really don't know what to call that.

>>53216449
I can see how that could happen. Feminine men exist. If the idea is that a transman was mentally a man all along, it stands to reason that feminine transmen can also exist.

>>53216478
>He made the comment to JesuOtaku, who replied with a tweet (I think it was something among the lines of "wtf")
Actually, I believe her response was more like "Dude, are you okay?", and she seemed genuinely concerned. So not only did she not care, she saw that he was far worse off than she was and tried to show some kindness. A far cry from dragging up a comment from months ago that wasn't even directed at you and using that as an excuse to kick someone when they're down.

>>53216645
Like I said, feminine transman. Or just feminine man if you want to be really progressive about it.

>>53216664
Or just train wreck.

>>53216664
I meant I don't know whether to call it homosexuality or not, senpai. It's fucking weird.

>>53216700
I guess that would depend on what you think of trans people. If you think the whole thing is a mental illness, then I suppose you'd call it homosexuality. If you believe people really can be born in the wrong body in that way, then it wouldn't really be homosexuality.

>>53216700
Homosexuality or not, it's definitely faggotry.

>>53216478
Ah alright, I seem to have gotten it mixed up.
It was ages ago and I just saw part of the fallout.
Thanks for correcting my mistake.

>>53216610
>Are those humans?

No.

>>53216521
Yeah, I think he needs new friends and comrades, especially, honestly. How the fuck did he get involved with those people to begin with? I'd go fucking nuts.

>>53217137
>How the fuck did he get involved with those people to begin with?
He was a nerdy content creator and Doug gathered many of them under his banner so that they could feed off each other's success and grow larger.

>>53216478
>Obscurus Lupa sperged out, despite having ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOTHING to do with the situation

It seemed more like Lupa just made a snide comment at someone mired in self-pity. It wasn't even a particularly amazing burn and she didn't follow up the comment or repeat it a bunch of times, Spoony just flipped out in defense. I don't think it's Lupa's fault Spoony had a fucking meltdown when she took a jab at him for one of his public twitter faux pas.

>>53212522
>https://encyclopediadramatica.rs/Spoony
Whoo boy, I just got to the Linkara page. This certainly is a treat!

>>53212780
It was always ok to hate 4rries.

They're just more accepting of it with more and more if them realizing just how utter trash they're MMO is.

>>53203162
>Hates 3.5
>Loves PF

Lol

>>53203162
I swear to god Spoony is the OP.
Every few days there's a new one of these go nowhere threads.

Spoony you're a hack prick. Now go away.

>>53203162
Not once in his entire life.

>>53219386
>I swear to god Spoony is the OP.
I wonder about this sometimes myself.

Welp spoon, if you are in here, I hope you can someday recover from your problems.

>>53219302
I musn't have watched enough of his video to see this, but what the fuck? I thought he just really liked AD&D

How the hell does he even justify that onconsistency?

>>53203858
He's certainly got enough energy to post an endless stream of whiney leftist drivel on youtube. If he were half as productive as he were vocal, he'd be living in a mansion.

Karl Marx would be proud of the eternal layabout. The last good thing he did was his talk on psionics.

>>53219607
Not youtube, what is that other service called that has 1/10th the functionality and no ad revenue...
Twitter! Twitter is what I'm thinking of.

>>53219586
He literally says PF is like 3.5 but it fixes ALL of its problems.

>>53219302
>>53219586

I'm pretty sure he hates 4th edition.

>>53219726
He did say 4th edition is fine for what it does, so I doubt it.

>>53219720
But... But it fixes NONE of the problems

Wizard is stronger compared to other classes thanks to the changes to school specialization, feat chains take longer to finish and give less of a reward at each step, skills are even more heavily weighted towards int-classes, the skill list is even more broken despite purging some of the stupider elements thanks to the introduction of "Fly" and for some fucking reason pretty much every spellcasting class has access to UMD

>>53219720
Does he explain further or does he just make a baseless claim?

>>53216645
Their name.

>>53216645
>woman who transitioned to a man
FtM, or F2M

>in relationship with man
Depends on the exact sexuality

>dresses like woman despite identifying as male
MtF Crossdresser?


So... a transgender FtM <sexuality> MtF crossdresser?

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>>53220213
>So... a transgender FtM <sexuality> MtF crossdresser?
What the fuck jumbled alphabet soup am I reading?

>>53216664
>feminine transmen
Yeah, taking male hormanes in order to look feminine ...
I am trans and sometimes I don't get what other trans people do.

>>53220341
It's easy.

Most of the ones like that are doing it for attention and not because of legitimate issues, or have other compounding issues in addition that make them insane.

>>53220341
I don't see why that's inherently hard to understand. It's unusual and presumably very rare sure, but just because someone's a trans chick doesnt mean they're aspiring to pink princess ballgowns and unicorn dildos.

>>53220466
I just find it odd that a woman would try to transition into a man in order to crossdress as a woman.

>>53220747
Cross-dressing is pretty weird in that context, sure, but being a girly guy is pretty eh.

Pretty much all the trans chicks I've known in my life have been massive tomboys; being raised as a guy will do that to you.

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>>53220213
Hitler did nothing wrong.

>>53220747
Look at it this way: There are a significant number of men who crossdress, but who don't want to become women. Take the trans aspect out of it for a second and imagine that JesuOtaku was always a man, because that's how it is from a trans person's perspective. In JO's mind, they aren't a woman who became a man; they're a man who was born in the wrong body and needed to have that corrected, but they nevertheless had some feminine personality traits.

>>53203162

Loved his Indiana Jones - Crystal Skull review.

>>53205618
Yeah.

>>53216791
Words of wisdom.

>>53221593
Actually they are what Tumblr tells them because they admittedly didn't even think about it until Tumblr.

>>53206147
4e may be OK, but it's hardly the best.

>>53219453

This, really. Come back old-spoony. Really.


Not here though, your site.

>>53205618
>>53207633

I meant in terms of everything he's talked about, not just Counter Monkey.

>>53204318
I assume at this point the hanger-ons is "doesn't kill himself" funding

>>53215706
All books smell funny when they're brand new. When they're decades old too.

>>53216610

The one on the right is a famous drag queen, I don't think he's transsexual.

>>53215980
Dang. I remember when ANN and these folks weren't a mess.

I'm officially too old for this.

>>53221593
Makes sense.

>>53212570
I still watch the Ultima Retrospective from time to time. I sincerely enjoyed that shit.

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>>53222596
To an extent you're right, but there are situations of not understanding how to categorize certain immutable feelings about oneself until put into the proper light.

>>53221593
I think I can graph this out.

>>53203162
Right about what? He only spouts opinions:
>AD&D was the best D&D
>3e and 3.5e were shit
>I don't like 4e
>PF is my favourite RPG because it "fixes" 3.5e
>5e book smells funny
>There's no point in multi-classing to fighter from anything else because of the proficiencies
>Multi-class into wizard after one level of fighter and you will basically win everything
>5e is like AD&D, but I don't like it
>5e book still smells funny

Well, I suppose there is also:
>Description of a paladin in the PHB does not describe what a paladin does
But then again, the 5e paladin is pretty far removed from other editions.

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>>53203855
>>53204030
>>53205618
>>53205777
>>53206147
Where are you guys getting he hated 4e from? His review of 4e was really positive. He called 3e "the most retarded Dragonball Z bullshit I've ever seen" at high levels.
Of course, at some point he started liking Pathfinder, so not sure how that works.

>>53212594
Heroes of Legend is an amazing book, and everyone should use it.
>>53212832
>evil character in an all good party is ok
I hope you die in a hospital fire

>>53212984
>JesuOtaku is a dude now
Wut.
Wow, how times change.

>>53226159
You and me both brother. In highschool I always looked up to these guys in a sort of weird way. They never really grew up, and from where I was standing they seemed successful. It was encouraging, like I might not have to grow up either.
Now it all just seems sad.

>>53212556
>only shitty players do things that the system encourages
Holy shit, fuck off

>>53226682
>evil character in an all good party is ok
Why is the whole party good? And if he's lawful, couldn't he theoretically have a reason to ally with them?

>>53216189

What?

If you make rape jokes and then complain that women don't like you, it's not SJWs conspiring to ruin you I think.

>>53227170
>if he's lawful, couldn't he theoretically have a reason to ally with them?
He could have reasons for that even if he were Chaotic. Fucking alignments.

>>53227207
>He could have reasons for that even if he were Chaotic.

Ok let me rephrase that, reasons the other party members can comprehend without doing this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoMiYklHvjk

>>53204030
>2) don't play evil pc's
There's absolutely nothing wrong with playing an evil PC. I don't know why everybody assumes that being evil means you have no loyalty or affection for anybody and are all willing to backstab their friends and comrades at a moment's notice.

>>53227439
Because if you're actually acting evil around sensible characters you're inevitably going to end up being disruptive and cause conflict with the other party members by doing shit that goes against their interests or their morals.
Its not that hard to understand.

>>53227503
You're implying that every party is full of goody-goodies. Just as a Good person could take issue with the actions (or inactions) of a Neutral person, so too could a Neutral person take issue with the (in)actions of an Evil person. But you don't hear people slamming people playing Neutral characters because they fucked up party cohesion for the Good characters.

You should obviously get the pulse of the campaign and the party and make a character who won't be a major disruption, but I don't see that Evil is any more problematic than Good in a party of adventurers who make their living by killing shit and taking their loot.

>>53227193
But women can make dick-severing jokes all they want, right? Fucking hypocrites. It wasn't even really a rape joke so much as a BDSM joke anyway, and when the "target" of the joke is not only not upset by it but also sees it as a sign the person saying it must be going through some bad shit, we don't need uninvolved people bringing it up months later just to take a shot at someone who's depressed enough as it is.

>>53227657
>Just as a Good person could take issue with the actions (or inactions) of a Neutral person, so too could a Neutral person take issue with the (in)actions of an Evil person. But you don't hear people slamming people playing Neutral characters because they fucked up party cohesion for the Good characters.
The difference is that the worst thing a Neutral character is likely to do is back out when things get too dangerous and they don't think the reward is worth it. On the other hand, an Evil character might actively sabotage the party.

>>53227439
Because this hobby is filled with a lot of shitty players, and a lot of them go for Chaotic Evil/Chaotic neutral alignment just so they can yell "It's what my character would do" when they engage in shitty behavior

Not saying that playing CE automatically makes you a bad player, I agree with your points, but I also get why people might have bad experiences with allowing evil characters. I also get why some people dislike lawful good paladins, due to the people who plays them as lawful stupid.

>>53227657
No. I'm implying that parties with people who can roleplay worth a shit have absolutely no reason to associate with an outright evil character who does evil shit. And if you don't do evil shit then you have no reason to be an evil character.

The only reasons why you would ever write evil on your character sheet is either because you want a shitty justification to be an edgy cunt, act like a selfish irredeemable asshole, or be batshit insane. None of which mesh well with anything other than a party of actual murderhobos.

>>53204030
>1) Roll stats
>2) don't play evil pc's
>3) d&d 4 and 5e are garbage
he seems to quite sensibl....

>>53205618
>He likes PF
...oh.

>>53204225
Who pays $2000 a month for four months for a vlog from a youtuber that has waned in popularity? His vlog hits what, 20k views?

>>53227762
My issue is with saying flat-out "don't play evil PCs", instead of cautioning against playing a particular type of evil character who is going to sabotage the party.

>>53227760
Many Evil characters can work just fine in a party of Good characters by holding their ruthlessness at least partially in check. Few Good characters are going to be able to tolerate being in a party of Evil characters.

>>53212984
are people's lives really so empty that they care about random dude's personal problems

>>53227806
History is full of Evil people doing Evil shit. Being Evil doesn't mean twirling your mustache and cackling about how you're going to spread darkness across the land. Well, it very rarely means that. That's cheesy and stupid. It more likely (and less retardedly) means being ruthless in removing obstacles to your power / getting what you want / etc.

>>53227883
Then you're being an edgy cunt. Which will inevitably clash with the other party members who don't approve of your methods. Or you just wont act ruthless and uncaring to avoid that happening thus removing the purpose of playing an evil character.

>>53227899

The average group is made of mercenary-by-another-name murderhobos. It's more realistic than you think.

>>53227899
>Then you're being an edgy cunt.
It's a game about murdering shit for gold. Maybe check the attitude there, Tinkerbell.

>>53227899
>Or you just wont act ruthless and uncaring to avoid that happening thus removing the purpose of playing an evil character.

Wait... so Evil is always "Chaotic Stupid" in your world? No sense of self-preservation, no ability to look at the bigger picture and a crippling inability to cooperate with anyone not sharing their exact world views?

>>53227806

That's contradiction of terms. You can be a good person and citizen, or you can be an adventurer.

>>53216478
As it happened, it was JesuOtaku who had the sex change, from female to male.

>>53227906
Well then none of them are sensible characters to begin with then aren't they? Which was the point. You could get away with it in a party of uncaring actual murderhobos. You can't around actual decent people without causing conflict.

>>53227922
I was under the impression that this was a role playing game an not a dungeon crawler where you just murder shit without context.

>>53227939
Never implied that. Just asking why the fuck you would even be considered evil then if you didn't work towards nefarious ends or used dodgy methods. You can still have a shitty moral compass but then why does it even matter if its never going to come up? You just wanted to write "evil" on your character sheet.

>>53227994

Sensible characters for who? Adventurers are not honest and decent people. They are murderers, warmongers, thieves, scavengers, mercenaries, looters and violent individuals.

>>53227994
>I was under the impression that this was a role playing game an not a dungeon crawler where you just murder shit without context.
Okay. It's a game with a story that centers on providing a context for murdering shit for gold.

And again, there's actual history to consider, which, as I said, is full of Evil people doing Evil things. Or do you think that every conqueror was just being an edgy cunt?

>>53228015
Or you know, heroes, knights errant, protectors, soldiers, hunters, vigilantes, or just people trying to make it.

Its genuinely pretty sad if the only experience you unironically have with player characters is them murderfucking everything in their path with no sense of right or wrong and only ever acting on pure self interest.

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>>53228070

Heroes can be bloodthirsty people too!

>>53228068
>Or do you think that every conqueror was just being an edgy cunt?
No. I just think they they had power and people loyal to them or with the same reasoning as them regardless of if they had reasons or if their reasons were good or not, neither of which is a given in a fucking D&D party.

How long do you want to keep arguing this? Just don't be an asshole if everyone else isn't an asshole too. And if you are, don't complain when people tell you you shouldn't be an asshole or that you never get to act like one.

>>53228070

I think that the problem is that you like the romantic chivalry hero narrative and people playing gritty and down-to-earth heroes burst your bubble.

Oh, hey, this thread is still up.

>>53213174
Lupa was wrong and unprofessional to air her grievances with a coworker publicly in order to shame him. However, Spoony ultimately can really only blame himself for blowing it up out of proportions, constantly tossing gas on the fire, and then not walking away from the drama when given the chance. Initially, all Lupa said was "I can't feel sorry for you any more" in a tweet reply (meaning you'd only see it if you were in that tweet thread, which nobody was). All Spoony had to do was ignore it. Or PM her. Or report it to Doug in a PM and get her suspended/fired for trying to start shit. Instead, like a fool, Spoony took the bait, and wouldn't let go even when Doug came to his rescue.

>>53215808
>>53226682
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2He0zJgNak

>>53216189
Spoony himself is a liberal SJW.

>>53227844
Yes.

>>53204225
how can you get welfare AND hav another income? What a dumb system.

>>53228277
By defrauding the system.

>>53228229
I think you're projecting pretty hard.
There's a difference between playing someone who is down-to-earth or someone who has no qualms about robbing, antagonizing, abusing, or killing people in cold blood and skips all alternatives.

>>53227806
>The only reasons why you would ever write evil on your character sheet is either because you want a shitty justification to be an edgy cunt, act like a selfish irredeemable asshole, or be batshit insane.

What if I just want to multiclass as Blackguard?

>>53228282

You mean every adventurer ever. How luckily you are that goblins and orcs genocide is such a guilt-free experience.

>>53228269
>Spoony himself is a liberal SJW.
He said a black woman should kill herself and her unborn child so that, and I quote, "another nigger criminal isn't born into this world"

>>53228300
Really makes you think.

>>53227994
>>53228282
>killing people in cold blood and skips all alternatives.

This is Chaotic Stupid. Is this how all of the evil villains behave in your campaign? If not, why should players need to behave this way if they're evil?

Everyone knows you act just evil enough to keep your evil bonuses.

>>53228298
I refer to my previous post. If you truly believe there is no other reasonable way to play a character and people are just all shitty and heartless by default I genuinely feel sorry for you.

>>53228319
Do you want me to go fetch a fucking definition of evil from the dictionary for you. Because by default it implies that you do shit that cause harm and affects others negatively. Not necessarily killing despite your cherry picking.

>>53228284
Not for nothing but if you're going to be a blackguard, you are either a major asshole in rp or just a powergamer

People just have no experience playing evil characters. They usually take inspiration from the biggest sociopath caricatures they can think off without any nuance or self-awareness. It requires a more mature attitude.

Good and evil are not real.

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>>53228345
He's right though, there's 0 guilt to be felt from genociding goblins because they're considered a bad guy race. You can literally boil their babies in molten lead and not have to feel bad about it.

>>53228284
This, what if I'm only evil because my class requirement says I have to be?

>>53228370
as a human idea and as means of competition over image and reputation, they are

>>53228473

Then why do people have different perceptions on if something is evil or not? Doesn't that show good and evil are just points of view?

Just because you're evil doesn't mean you're the bad guy in the campaign. Evil is not just kicking puppies for the sake of it, in most cases it just means you're really, REALLY selfish and because Gygax was a devout christian, being Good kinda meant being a goody two-shoes.

>not playing a character so cartoonishly evil that you actually say shit like CURSES, FOILED AGAIN when the party realizes you were going to betray them for the 20th time
>not going full Cobra Commander

You people are antifun

>>53228480
are these people competing over who is more right (as is so often the case in religion or politics)? and could they debate the issue at hand without resorting to concepts of good and evil? couldn't they just argue about whether a given action might cause unnecessary suffering or not?

anyway, good and evil quite obviously exist ideas - we in here are using them as such already.

>>53228582
No one irl believes what they do is evil though, only what the other guy does.

>>53228345
Okay.. so Evil is willing to harm others to achieve his goals , but at the same time able to look at the big picture, have a sense of self-preservation, cooperate with others who doesn't share his worldviews, and it doesn't have to be Chaotic Stupid. A character like this shouldn't really have a problem adventuring with a group of Good or Neutral characters, unless your whole group plays nothing but caricatures.

>>53228582

Define "unnecesary" suffering. Because you can justify a lot of really heinous shit under the cloak of "it was my best option at the time"

I'm sorry we burned down the town and horrifically butchered everyone in it, but the morale loss it caused made the war end and prevented further suffering.

>>53228596
and the reason for that can be found here: >>53228473


>>53228622
>you can justify a lot of really heinous shit
yes. and you can try to do that with whatever concepts are valued by a given group. bullshit artists are going to bullshit. and yes, of course, there will be always grey areas. that is so whether we talk good or evil or whether an action caused unnecessary suffering or not.

>I'm sorry we burned down the town and horrifically butchered everyone in it, but the morale loss it caused made the war end and prevented further suffering.
see? you made your point without resorting to the ideas of good and evil. good and evil are morally/religiously-charged terms of whether something is justified or not. however, one can justify or condemn an action without those (smart/stupid, for example).

which is why I said that good and evil exist as ideas. means of justification. and the act of justification/condemnation? takes place within the context of human competition for being seen as more intelligent and as the more decent human being than the other (whoever that is).

>>53228614
Evil is fucking evil. If you don't deliberately cause harm and suffering then you're acting towards goals that are selfish or at the very least come at the expanse of others. If none of those things apply then you're not really doing perceptible evil and have no real reason to be defined as such.

How many good acts do you have to do to change alignment after murdering, looting, and burning an entire town to the ground?

>>53228070
>heroes
Like Achilles or Hercules?
>knight errant
Like crusaders?
>protectors
Quite a niche role for an adventurer, but okay.
>soldiers
Who, for the most part of history, were *the* looters, pillagers and rapists?
>hunters
Maybe the only thing in your list I've no qualms with.
>vigilantes
The lynch mob.
>people trying to make it
Why would a peaceful guy, averse to violence, make money by being a hired thug? Would he really "make it"?

See, this is exactly why evil characters typically shouldn't be allowed in a good party: they start bullshit moral arguments.

I mean I never actually get shit like this in the table, it's almost like it's only perpetuated by faggots on /tg/.

>>53228300

Wouldn't surprise me if a lot of SJWs bobble back and forth between different extremes like that. It's like communists going hyperreactionary and back again.

>>53228872

Good and evil parties are for faggots. Neutral parties are superior!

>>53228732
>Evil is fucking evil.
in the real world, the truth often doesn't matter much though because people quite frequently will side with someone who spouts bullshit but is popular - for fear of ending up as outsiders. in short: ruthless, popular people might end up defining right or wrong for some time.

>>53224626
>2e has THAC0 horseshit
>3.5 is caster edition
>5e is a steady return to caster edition, healing surges went full retard
How is it not the best of a bad lot?

>>53229141
>THAC0 horseshit
>can't into basic math so I'll bash the whole edition

>>53229149
>system is counterintuitive
>HURR HE'S A RETARD WHO CAN'T INTO MATH
Before we forget, 2e had almost zero playtesting due to shit management

>>53229163
"slightly counterintuitive" still isn't enough to put it on the same level with "caster edition".

>>53229172
You're probably right, 2e is one of my favourite editions right next to BECMI. Still, 4e does all I want it to.

>>53229186
And I'm not bashing 4e at all. It's honestly a pretty big step to the right direction after 3x and all that shit, even if the "right" direction in this case is still a fair bit different from AD&D and the other old editions.

He was the funniest fucker of that whole group.

>>53231128
But he's not Based Brad Jones

>>53227827
And if a tenth of them pay that's still just $1 apiece.

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>>53231140
But that's where you're wrong, kiddo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW9EmlWnKt4

>>53228622
>playing as America
You bastard

>>53232668
Every country in WW2 did "morale bombing" of cities in hopes it would force the war to end sooner.

What are you gonna do, be a shithead DM because I chose to roll an evil character?

Oh wait it's Spoony, of course he will
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJb7ed3ueLk

>>53226346
Yes it is fucking great except for the melodramatic depressing episode in the finale.

>>53228872

Pretty much. I'm playing an evil guy in a group of neutral to good PCs and everything is aok.

His goals align with the party's and he considers all of them this friend who do anything for. That anything just happens to extend a lot farther than what is considered morally right, and if that means using horrifically evil magic on his enemies in order to preserve the lives he cares about so be it.

>>53226682
>Now it all just seems sad.
It's what happens when you don't really grow up, and try to interact with other adults. It's perfectly fine to have hobbies and even make money off of them if you can be responsible and mature about it. No one on ANN was either of those two things. It's amazing it took as long as it did to become a public shitshow, as I guarantee it was secretly a shitshow since it was started.

>>53227806
My Lawful Evil Wizard wants to rule the kingdom. He will take any chance he gets to fulfill this, even dirty deeds (performed, of course, for little monetary gain).

UNLESS it would fuck over the party. He's been with them for years. He knows them better than anyone else, and they're the only ones he knows he can TRUST, even if he knows they'd try to stop some of his more dastardly plots and actions. That's why he does them when they either can't know he's doing it. He'd do anything for them, though, even if they wouldn't go through with one of his vile deeds. Including making troublesome nobles or bureaucrats... Disappear. He's evil because he's selfishly motivated and has no problem doing evil things.

It doesn't mean he kicks every puppy he comes across or causes as much pain and suffering as possible to his enemies, or sabotages the party just because he CAN. Why would he? They're his friends, and even if they WEREN'T his friends, they're valuable as meatshields. That's why I don't get Chaotic Stupid players, in a nutshell. Why would the CE Barbarian try to murder everyone in the party when they serve his needs by being alive and able to cover the bases he can't in a fight? Even if he hated them all and might betray them for a better deal later, there is no sane justification for someone backstabbing the party 'just because evulz'.

>>53219302
Does he actually say "3.5?" I think he was specifically saying "3rd edition." Is there a difference?

>>53207633
The additional statement is that
>If you stat it, there is a good chance you understat it

>>53203162
He's crazy.

I'm not sure it's even relevant if he's right, because he's not coming correct.

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>>53204030
But everything he said, if you're not misquoting him, is wrong.

>not a buddy cop scenario campaign where a lawful good, lawful neutral and lawful evil team up to fight crime

>>53227844
People have empathy, anon. When they see this stuff happening, they care.

>>53236588
Not him but most people have bystander syndrome

>>53228229
I think the problem is that you don't understand that D&D isn't Game of Thrones and it can, in fact, have idealistic heroes.

>>53231140
He is the one who brought us Based Brad Jones, though. Brad got a lot of exposure when Spoony made a vlog about him, and is basically responsible for Brad getting picked up by TGWTG. It's one of the reasons Brad stuck with him even through all that unpleasantness a few years ago.

>>53236664
That's an IRL thing, though. Things are a bit different on the Internet.

>>53228300
Is Spoony, dare I say it, /ourguy/?

>>53216449
Is this race playable?

>>53213126
So the problem isn't an evil PC. It's antagonistic alignment conflicts.

>>53236317

YOU'RE A LOOSE CANNON LE....but damnit you get results!

>>53236861
did Linkara stick with him through that too

I remember the guy was also brought about by Spoony

>>53203162
Post-flipout Spoony, on the whole, ain't right about nothin'.

Pre-flipout Spoony wasn't right about much either, but at least he still appeared to be a semi-functional human being.

>>53241279
>did Linkara stick with him through that too
Yeah. I think it was Brad, Linkara, Bennett the Sage, and JewWario who didn't cut ties with him.

>>53241391
>JewWario

that probably also counts as a reason he broke down

>>53241414
I think it's more likely that JewWario didn't hold things against Spoony because he empathized with Spoony's depression. I never really watched JewWario's videos, but from what I did see of him in some of Spoony's movie vlogs and such, he seemed like a good guy. I hope he's in a good place now.

>>53241570
He's in hell where all jews go

>>53238836
You may not like the way he does it, Chief, but everything LE does is by the book.

>>53241736
But he accepted Bowie as his lord and savior!

>>53241391

It's incredible how little I know of these people, like they were flying beneath my radar at the time they made it big and now it's confusing to see e everyone talking about them pass their minute of fame. I only knew about Sage from his old abriged series and how desperate he was to be part of team four star.

>>53204038
He is Razorfist. He's developed a split personality.

>>53242420

But Razorfistis actually cool.

>>53242379
Bennett also deserves credit for giving us the story of Hinsty David and the Age of Manure:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WA5bq29-Xis

>>53241750

The DA's on his ass because it;s the Book of Evil, but I don't write the fucking laws.

>>53205618
>thinks 4e and 5e are bad

He's right, both the Merals editions at3 complete crap.

>>53203162
I never saw Spoonman before but he could use a consistent viewpoint a less childish argumentative style.
He whines about players that whine, and argues against balance while arguing for it.

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>>53216449
Man, I hate to rag on people's life choices, and do what makes you happy etc...

But she/he does not look good. At all. Eugh. I remember really liking their anime reviews. They were never super hot or anything, but they looked... you know, normal? Man. I understand the trans thing, but not wanting to look like a nightmare Freddie Mercury had once.

>>53243562
>They were never super hot or anything, but they looked... you know, normal?
JO always read to me as the chick who lived out in the sticks who really liked anime. I don't know what kool-aid she drank over the years but holy shit man that is a terrifying look.

>>53243562
I have fuck all idea about them personally, but it's good to separate "con/club" look and everyday look.

>>53241750
I don't want to hear it, Neutral Evil. You're off the case!

>>53244987
Shit, I meant Lawful Neutral. This is what happens when you just get back from playing a NE character.

>>53213126
You can totally play an evil character who is sensible enough not to antagonize the people he's currently engaging in a profitable venture with.
Shit, I'd even go so far as say it's more reasonable for an evil character to want to work with good aligned people, the kind of folks who you can trust and rely on.

>>53203858
He has several diseases because of an unhealthy lifestyle, and he's using his patreon money to pay for it. He's afraid of showing weakness and will never apologize for not making content anymore. Therefore he won't make content and he'll slowly get less and less money from his patreon. Then he'll try to make more videos to try to get some more money. Then he'll fail because people have gotten tired of him and it'll feel forced. Then he'll die.

>>53203162

I think people just have nostalgia glasses when they think of him. Personally I never placed any value in his opinion.

>>53243609
>I don't know what kool-aid she drank
Generally in the sticks when you start drinking the kool-aid, especially leftist kool-aid, you guzzle the entire keg.

>>53244083
Man I suck dick and I'd never wear a see-through rainbow nipple pasty shirt, but... that's life I guess.

Talking about me HMMMMM?!

>>53206743
Used to. Now he lives with his girlfriend/fiance/whatever.

>>53249714
>>53243609

She always had an androgynous look and in the video coming out he normal and well adjusted.

>>53226682
>Now it all just seems sad.
>>53234079
Yeah, same thing happened to me. Came across the Channel Awesome shows shortly after high school, kinda idolized and envied them a bit doing what they seemed to enjoy.

Some years later, most of them seem to have skipped the "growing up" stage and still act like teenagers and college-age adults, despite quite a few of them being in their 30s now, or close to it. And I mean that even when they're "out of character," if they use "characters" at all.

Nostalgia Critic was one of the hardest to watch, with him trying to break out of the NC show and expand into a wider cabinet, only crashing hard with all of the projects he attempted (because they were all pretty terrible), and being forced to return to the Critic since it was the only thing that brought in viewers.

Then you get into some of the background leaks (some of which are probably false, but a fair amount seems legitimate) where a lot of the reviewers on TGWTG are about as irritating outside of their shows as you'd expect them to be, with there being a lot of backstabbing and even a little shady shit (like LordKat and his friends groping a girl drunk off her ass in his hotel room [clearly not wanting to be there] and livestreaming it).

It's just a huge mess of pretty pathetic drama consolidated into one "company" consisting of (wo)manchildren that never grew up.

>Rewatch Spoony's Ultima retrospective
>End of Ultima IX review
Kinda dark and ironic nowadays.

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>>53257751
It shouldn't surprise anyone, seeing as they are all pretty much Tommy Wiseau. They write, direct, produce and star in their own shit and it's all that they're known for.

>>53226121
Books smell like Vanilla when they're decades old though, I personally wouldn't call that bad or funny.

>>53264201

I always wondered what exactly it was my old LotR books smelled like, but I couldn't put my finger on it.