/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

>>53068871
Which of the splats wins in an all female body building contest.

>>53069028
>Why don't you just fucking kill yourselves?
Its a lot more work than I feel like doing.

>>53069028
>>53068985
No its not, thats Ascension magic. Awakening magic is a precise metaphysical system with its own unbreakable internal rules, and thus there is no reason to assume it takes priority over the explicit rules of Exalted's reality.

>>53069045
Promethean, they could be made as the superior muscle waifu.

I still say Doctor Who with a shotgun would beat a Solar Exalted.

>>53069098
>>53069093
>>53069089
>>53069073
No one is saying the Solar would WIN, the Archmage is vastly more powerful. What we're saying is that Supernal Magic can't break through Perfect Defenses, no matter how pedantic the Mage in question happens to be or how indirect he tries to "attack" the Solar.

He could teleport the Solar a billion miles away, or lock him underground, or do any number of things to "defeat" him, but he can't just wave his hands and kill him like he can with Luna, Caine, and every other being we've pitted him against before now.

PD is "Your powers don't work on me" the power, based not in the setting's physics, but as a narrative law.

>>53069060
>>53069122
Okay, no, stop. I had my fun giving magefags seizures in the last thread but this is a fresh start.

Are the Exalted idiots gone?

I don't think they like the fact that the Supernal explicitly fucks with the things Solars specialize at.

>>53069105
But that banks on the risky gambit that disquiet works in their favor by making everyone enthralled with them. That or them using that one power I forget the name of.

>>53069166
>What we're saying is that Supernal Magic can't break through Perfect Defenses

Except it can. But it requires alterations to the Supernal. Otherwise it can't.

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>>53069028

>>53069028
fag

>>53069166
Yeah, what >>53069177 said. We don't need to carry this debate on, we already knew it was retarded and pointless.

So. C20. Does anybody else feel like this is actually a really decent game now?

Rolled 2 (1d2)

>>53069243
>>53069215
Okay we'll flip a coin. 1 is Archmages, 2 is Solars.

Okay go.

>>53069243
>We don't need to carry this debate on, we already knew it was retarded and pointless.
From what I've read, Mage players have a more reasonable argument than the Exalted players.

Perfect defenses don't matter in the face of perfect alterations.

>>53069285
what about perfect defenses vs alterations?

>>53069185
Hmm, true, If we going with Old World too, then i would say Tzimisce, she could change from moderate buffness to hyper easily. Not to mention the alien aspect could be sexy, in a scary kind of way.

>>53069306
Normal alterations won't work on the Solar's perfect defenses.
You really need Archmastery and the ability to seal Omens to affect it.

>>53069045
Let's see
Vampires: A daeva would have a pretty decent edge as long as she can keep the blush of life up, they're made to be alluring after all. Have all the natural dangerous femme fatal charm.
Werewolf: Built hunters, they all probably get pretty natural bodies just by doing what they do, but it might take some work to get them more for show then for use. They have a more primal feel to them, anamalistic in a way.
Mages: Not sure. I know they can use magic to increase physical attributes but I don't know about body shaping off the top of my head. They'd have a nice niche though, they could play into the shy nerd who isn't sure her muscles can match up with the others for good moe factor
Promethian: Can literally be built for aesthetic appeal. Disquiet is the game changer here, as it can either totally ruin them or work naturally in their favor. They give off a nice stoic loner vibe
Changelings: They have the bonus of versatility. Could be beast with primal features, an ogre whos seven feet tall and shredded, or a fairest sculpted from marble.
Giests: Probably the weakest entry. Not alot going for them
Mummies: I honestly haven't read enough. They could give off the whole regal ancient royalty thing.
Demons: Don't have any special advantages I can think of besides making a deal with a body builder.
Beasts: Might get points for the bad girl factor, plus being literal giants at times. Spooky.
Hunters: Pure human muscle, no additives.
In any case, I know what my first crossover is going to be about.

>>53069285
Goddamnit.

Okay, the thing is...that's basically true, but the problem is that Exalted, at least Exalted 2e, is inherently unreasonable. Exaltedfags like myself resort to things like "lol it just works" and "lol there's always an escape clause" and "lol defense beats offense" because that's what we got in the book. Same with the whole "try to alter anything about me, it counts as an attack" thing. That's the disconnect here. We didn't get a highly detailed metaphysical explanation of seals and signs and practices like you find in Mage. So it's just not going to come off as smoothly explained as Mage powers are.

Now, can we kill this debate and go back to arguing about how to kill Caine? Or which splat is best for making 2hu waifus?

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>>53069402
No. Instead lets talk about how to make convincing Shinigami in Geist.

>>53069445
Sure, why not.

>>53069243
C20 is Changeling right? I never had much fun with them, but then the ST had this headcanon that all Changelings had to be wounded perpetual victims on the verge of being triggered 24/7, it nearly gave him a stroke when I goaded a True Fae into trying to attack then dropped dozens of cold iron spears literally the size of telephone poles on them. In his eyes victims had to stay traumatized wrecks.

>>53069445
I was going to say thats stupid but....
You know, shinigamis get alot of their power from their sword, who's given an actual person and personality. You could in theory represent the banki/whatever the weaker one is called, as a really amped up caul with unique affects for each person.

If I made a CofD update to the Highlander fansplat, would anyone be interested?

>>53069478
It is, but you're describing the CofD version of Changeling. C20 is oChangeling, which is less about "you were taken away" and more "you're a fae in mortal guise living in a world that's slowly losing its creative spark".

>>53069445
>>53069488
Actually yeah, that could work.
Represent the inherent powers shnigami have as new inherent powers
All those attack spells and defense spells could come from rage/shroud/curse/some boneyard
And then unique caul affects.

>>53069501
Ooooh, I like that. I love the idea of gods living among mortals, trying to get their way without being exposed. Not because it puts them in danger, but because mortals are a fucking hassle.

>>53069478
C20 is owod changeling the dreaming. Sounds like you were playing changeling the lost with a fag St who doesn't know the game and probs has unhealthy views towards 'victims' in general. The summer court is literally about fighting for your freedom.

>>53069534
Changelings in this setting aren't quite THAT powerful. Indeed being exposed to the most banal people and parts of the mundane world is literally toxic to them.

>>53069045
Technically Prometheans, they literally build bodies. But I'd have to say werewolves, all the added muscle mass when they shapeshift would be hard to beat. Remember shapeshifting says muscle mass, not fat. Their definition would be fucking nuts.

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>>53069522
>>53069488
>>53069445
Beyond that, they even share the same job description. They deal with ghosts. That kind of gets put in the backseat once the whole "Fighting Aizen" thing becomes the main focus but originally Shinigami's main business was putting the dead to rest, by force if necessary.

>>53069445
>Touching anything kubo made with a ten foot poll
neck yourself

Weebs ruin everything

Go back to Japan

>>53069627
Can't, Kuei-Jin will eat me.

>>53069574
>aren't quite THAT powerful
Close enough for me, C20 might match Unfleshed in terms of favorite splats. MIGHT. Because robot people are fucking awesome. Deviant might topple both though, depending on how well it lets me emulate Venom.

>>53069542
He's literally autistic, diagnosed Asperger's. He's a great player because he always accepts the game world you present to him, but when he ST's he is rigid when it comes to canon.

>>53069627
>Implying WoD isn't at least half weeb
食べ物

>>53069627
I don't actually hate weeaboos, even though it's fun to pick on them.

What I do hate it applying anime to WoD. I fucking despise that.

>>53069499
I totally would.

Speaking of that, anyone mind posting it?

>>53069285
>Perfect defenses don't matter in the face of perfect alterations.

Long time Exalted and WoD player here. To get around a Solar you'd literally need to ignore everything about their rules and their setting. At which point you venture into "I win because I say I win" territory and render moot any comparisons.

Per the 2E errata, Perfect Defenses that explicitely ignore inapplicability outright ignore anything that would ever attempt to get around them. Which Solar Perfects do.

Exalted has attacks that try to alter what you can do, Perfects still work on them. Not to mention Solars specifically, have Charms that perfectly prevent anything altering them in mind, body, spirit, etc.

tl;dr Mage loses.

>>53069662
I bet you're a tsundere magefaggot itching for the wereknot.

baka~

>>53069652
Well, the backer PDF is here:

>https://mega.nz/#!yMtBnSAC!-K5Val2vP6kD2x0yAjsfRk0234814CQlgrUSNRm3N_c

Check it out and see if it's what you think you'd like.

>>53069684
>>53069662
>I hate weebshit!
>Laughing Akashics.gif

>>53069652
I've found autisms are usually wrong about the settings they autism about. It's more of a head cannon of their impression they are autists about.

>>53069662
There's nothing to apply, anime is right there.
Celerity movement is literally flash stepping.

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>>53069679
No. Stop. Do not. Disallowed. We finished that debate. It's done. Cease.

>>53069674
Here's the original, the rules just need a little updating.

http://vampirerpg.free.fr/ Rules/ Highlander/title.html

>>53069687
Thanks man

>>53069586
"Magical Japanese Ghostbusters" was a great premise and what little we got of it was executed well. That series is one of my biggest disappointments because that entire aspect was thrown out the fucking window.

>>53069679
>Long time Exalted and WoD player here
That means you're not

The Archmage is going to beat the highest theoretical Solar, this is rather obvious. The argument was whether or not the wizard could effectively dismantle the perfect defense with perfect meta.
It became unanswerable. The Archmage wins 1v1, but the defense/meta debate is strange based on how both mechanics work.

You also need to drop it.

>>53069711
Like seriously, look
>Moving in this way is sudden, jarring, the vampire appears to shift from point to point without crossing the space in-between.

>>53069738
Fucking Christ, stop.

>>53069753
Hell the book even goes on to describe that you can make surprise attacks with it. *teleports behind you* is doable straight from chargen.

There was a magefag over at the OPP forums that made an "anime discussion" Rote, for when you want to have lengthy talks during combat.

It was pretty funny.

>>53069738
The highest theoretical Solar has Siddie MA charms and can choose to win. No explanation, he just wins.

>>53069045
>>53069363
IMPORTANT QUESTION THIS MADE ME THINK OF
IS THERE A SPIRIT OF WAIFUS?

>>53069777
>Vampires can literally engage in zwee fighting

Nice.

>>53069733
Why does every anime with that kind of premise just degenerate into shonen? Yu Yu Hakusho did the same thing, the first few episodes were fantastic but I never even bothered to watch the rest, in part due to dropping the core premise for DBZisms.

I just want to be dead/talk to dead people/fight dead people. Is that so much to ask?

>>53069791
That's not going to be effective. It just won't.
Metaphysics don't apply to beings who can rewrite it on a whim.

Just drop it. Jesus.

>>53069777
>777 witnessed

>>53069810
Probably because both bleach and yu yu were in shonen jump you know a shonen magazine.

>>53069815
Rewriting metaphysics doesn't apply when the Solar acts first. Why? Because they have a power to let them retroactively go first. They are the Kanye West to the Mage's Taylor Swift.

>>53069840
Funnily enough, mages will usually expect you to attack first.

That's how they win.

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>>53069815
>>53069840
Both of you. Or perhaps one of you. Stahp.

Oh hey, speaking of weeb.
I've been thinking of converting some standard Japanese yokai into horrors using the core rules and hunter. What are some good ones to try it out on, and is there anywhere I can go to get a good list of them?

>>53069859
Oh boy. Mages and their contingencies. Ain't no way around it.

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>Magefags encountering a game that works on the same "nuh uh I have an everything-proof shield" bullshit as their own game

This is great

>>53069871
All of them.

Seriously, just Google up stuff about yokai and go to town. Japanese folk monsters are the best goddamn folk monsters.

Can we just stop the solar vs archmage debate? This is a World of Darkness general.

>>53069886
In some areas, sure.

>>53069871
I forget what it's called, but there's this one that I always liked. It's some kind of weird wolf thing that stalks people in the woods at night. It can't just attack though, it only attacks if the person trips over something in the dark. BUT, if you trip you can act like you did it on purpose and were just laying down to rest, and then it won't attack.

>>53069920
Nah. I do enjoy seeing Exalted fans getting their blood pressure flowin'

I was actually on their side until they decided to "nuh uhh" everything.

>>53069920
This. If you guys want to continue autistically screeching at each other, make your own thread.

Let's get back to the real discussion, like could a Demon kill an Archmage?

>>53069954
>Could a Demon kill an Archmage
It could possibly kill a Master, but not an Archmage.

>>53069954
Depends on too many factors, but I'll say that it is possible under certain circumstances for it to happen.

>>53069954
Not funny. It's a little funny.

>>53069945
Exalted book's fault, that. Just stop discussing it.

>>53069800
No but there are several waifu Goetia in the Astral Realms.

>>53069954
>>53069964
Demons, Mummies and Mages are the three strongest playables by design.

Archmages are above all three.
Not sure if any other gameline will ever receive the god-tier treatment though. Probably not.

>>53069938
Isn't there one thats literally just a wall. Like a big wall shaped thing of flesh?

If the God-Machine wanted to kill an Archmage, what kind of Angel could it create to do it?

>>53069979
Exalted was at fault, yes. I was speaking more so of the fact that the Supernal by definition of its function and override the "nuh uhh" abilities of the Exalts.

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>>53069982

>>53070000
A powerful angel? It would probably need to make a whole bunch though.

It takes a lot of infrastructure to produce an angel, while the Exarchs are capable of spawning an infinite amount of Ochemata.

>>53070008
As a fellow magefag, you need to stop.

>>53069982
Good thing you can just go into the Astral Realms and literally kill the idea of Waifus if you really feel like it.

>>53070000
The GM doesn't have to only use Angels. In such a situation the GM might have to use alternatives. Depending on canon it might be the creation of Exarchs or have allies among them.

>>53069679
>Not to mention Solars specifically, have Charms that perfectly prevent anything altering them in mind, body, spirit, etc.
If you need to alter a Solar to win, you are a shitty Archmage.
Here is a short list of stuff you can do instead:
>Give him acute radiation poisoning
>Nuke him
>Connect the space around him to a hostile environment (the sun, outer space)
>Send a bunch of powerful spirits/ghosts after him

>inb4 muh perfect defense
That is a mote-intensive charm,and the Solar can only do it so many times. Chill out in your Golden Road and use Sympathetic Magic to chip away at him.

>>53070035
>As a fellow magefag

You're no magefag. Magefags don't concede. They shit out more shit.

>>53070063
This isn't a concession, this is a "can we please get back to solely discussing WoD/CofD shit already"?

>>53070025
I mean they do mention Archangels which are on the level of Lunes, maybe an Idigam.

>>53069982
My friend, there exists a Goetia for every single Waifu held by more than one Individual. That is by DEFINITION. So long as two or more people hold belief in a Waifu, they shall have a relam in the Astral.

There are likely entire REALMS of the Astral entirely taken up by the worship of the most popular Waifus, with those with smaller followings taking up the outerlying border areas.

With the strange and niche Waifus fighting for scraps at the edges of that grand realm.


Even should a Waifu be forgotten by mankind, their realm does not die, stead it is merely cut off, but a Mage with Time 2 might once again find it.

The flesh will wither and die.
But Waifus?
Waifus are eternal.

>>53070077
You're not worthy of the title of 'magefag'

You have shamed the Seer Imperium.

Why can't you guys be more like /pfg/. They get by on their massive imbalance just fine, plus there's at least ten times the lewd posting over there.

>>53070110
If you don't shit on at least one vampfag a day, you're not a true magefag.

>>53070127
Because vampfags are too triggered by the fact they aren't top dog

>>53070155
Except now it's Exalted faggots.

>>53070127
>plus there's at least ten times the lewd posting over there.
Which is why pathfinder general is shit.

>>53070155
See this is exactly the shit I'm talking about. You're never going to get thread run lewd games full of e puss acting like this.

>>53070163
>"I use seven dots to remove your per--"
>"REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"

>>53070168
>Which is why pathfinder general is shit.

>Lewd posting
>Shit
Literally pick one and only one.

>>53070173
>e puss
What are you, gay?

>these threads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYKPdNvH800

>>53070200
>Not doing multi paragraph RP posts about a hunter fucking a werewolf unsure if this is a sign of love or his last rites before he's killed
Get on my level

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>>53070217
Alright, you've convinced me, luckily I have a hard copy of the book this is from.

archmage > solar > luna > caine

this accurate?

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>>53070257

>>53070217
Hey. Werewolves need to breed with other humans to make more wolves right? And theres that one gift that lets them switch genders right?

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>>53070208
Thanks for the hearty Kek.

>>53070306
That's a thing in CofD 2e WtF yeah. In OWoD the Wyld sometimes randomly fucks with things if you get too tainted, which can also swapsies the ol' sex organs around.

>>53070257

Archmage > Luna > Caine > Solar

Not gonna lie, former Archmage supporter here. This is fucking hilarious watching him crash and burn. But in all seriousness we can't let this guy get the Imperial Practices.

>>53070339
So now to ask the obvious question.
Is it gay?

>>53070392
Well meme'd.

>>53070397
Pooping out a baby werewolf sounds pretty gay.

>>53070392
Wait, I thought the Exalt fags were the ones crashing and burning.

Have you been following along?

>>53070430
Its a pol meme making fun of people who "regret" voting from Trump.

>>53070025
But the Exarchs are the tools of the God-Machine, it's mechanisms. Anything they can do, it can do.

>>53070430
Archmages > Solars

Everyone here knows this.
Now shut up.

>>53070470
I disagree

>>53070465
Wat
Is this the RPG fan fiction general now?

>>53070465
It's actually the other way around according to DaveB.

An Alienated Archmage might have been responsible for the God-Machines upbringing to boot.

>>53070476
>I use Excisions to remove your opposing opinions

:^)

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>>53070465
That's like saying that since a sentient computer uses electricity, it can defeat the metaphysical embodiment of electric current.

Here is what DaveB has to say about it.

>>53070058
>radiation poisoning
Cured
>Nuke
Perfect defense
>hostile environment
Defenses for that too
>spirits/ghosts
Literally nothing to an Exalt, he'll make them his friends and turn on you.

>>53070181
>"I use seven dots to remove your-"
>"Spell Shattering Palm, you remove nothing."

>>53070430
Then you missed the point. Both sides have "lol nope" powers, but in one game offense always wins, in the other defense. There is no way one can come out over the other.

Do anons always get this defensive when they find out super-wizards are capable of buttfucking their favorite whatnots?

>>53070127
Through dick unity.

>>53070509
He literally says the GM uses the symbols the Exarchs embody. As in, using the Exarchs.

>>53070541
You're fucking retarded

>>53070523
>but in one game offense always wins, in the other defense

The difference being that Archmasters can improve on both accounts.
I will admit that Exalts are mighty, they're just not as powerful when it comes to maximum theoretical potential.

>>53070058
>cannot alter the Solar in any way, scene long charm

So none of that works except trying to nuke him, and that can just be batted away without harm.

>>53070537
Anons like to play pretend retarded when they can't refute Archmages and their capabilities, yes.

They have nothing else to reliably use.

>>53070553
No, I just read what he wrote.

"The God-Machine uses the hidden meanings and propeties of things"
"The Exarchs are the symbolic properties of things"

The GM uses the Exarchs.

>>53070572
>when it comes to maximum theoretical potentia

So they can defeat something that can strike you at any range perfectly before you even decide you're going to launch any kind of offensive whatever?

>>53070572
>maximum theoretical potential.
There is literally a Sidereal MA charm that lets the Exalt choose a future where they win the fight. No explanation is needed, no game mechanism, they simply and literally choose to win.

>>53070588
Exarchs cannot be harmed via their perfect defenses, unless of course you alter their respective symbols or use Excisions to remove it, or Transfiguration / Assumption to outright ignore it.

There are far easier alternatives, such as imprisoning the Solar in eternal agony. Invincibility will become the worst possible bane.

>>53070523
>Nuke
>Perfect defense
Nuke him while Perfect defense isn't up.
>hostile environment
>Defenses for that too
Yeah, but the moment he runs out of motes, he's screwed. Also, he isn't going anywhere for a long long time. So even if you have some mote generating munchkinry, permanent removal is basically a win.
>spirits/ghosts
>Literally nothing to an Exalt, he'll make them his friends and turn on you.
We've already established that Archmages can turn Luna into a minion. She uses her spirit powers to recruit some Lunar exalts.

Also, I don't think a Solar has anything to counter the Scry and Fry tactic.

Yeah these threads are officially to far gone.
I'll see you guys in a week or two, it isn't worth it anymore.

>>53070620
Fate is enough to deal with that. Even worse if it's Transfiguration, effectively rewriting it to "you lose" instead.

>>53070648
You don't need Transfiguration to change the Charm, just use Excisions or make yourself immune to it via Entities; the Charm won't have effect on you, ever.

>>53070648
>he thinks Fate can protect you from things that literally break fate

Oh thats a laugh.

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>>53070679
>muh instant win skill beats their instant win skill because I say so
>no, MUH instant win skill beats their instant win skill because I say so

>>53070681
You're a desperate little bugger, ain't ye?

All this Exalted vs Mage is getting boring.

New dick measurement battle:
Level 20 pure wizard, d&d 3.5 edition.
vs
Gnosis 5 Mage with mastery of one Arcanum of your choice, and 4 dots in all others.

>>53070698
Mages, unlike 2e exalts, can actually do multiple things at once though.

>>53070698
Would make sense if not for the Archmage's infinite improvisation.

I honestly can't see how the Solar is going to win against a Gnosis 10 Archmage under the effects of Assumption; permanent Transfiguration.

>>53070713
How does health even translate between these two incompatible systems. But still the mage because unmaking isn't really resisted.

>>53070701
It's just the nature of the beast. See >>53069402.

>>53070735

The same way it translates between Exalted and Mage: It doesn't, because it's two entirely incompatiable systems with each set of players trying to dickwave their "I win buttons" and say one obviously beats the others.

At this point you might as well ask who can beat Droopy Dog or Popeye.

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>>53070679
Reflexive Sidestep Technique+Spell Shattering Palm, Excisions was never used in the first place, sorry.

>>53070648
The Charm is based on controlling the Loom of Fate itself, it's designed to do just that.

>but Excisions
Spell Shattering Palm, your spell is not cast, and the charm functions.

>>53070735
>But still the mage because unmaking isn't really resisted.
Yes it is.
>Certain Unmaking (•••••) spells can slay a target with a single casting, or neutralize them permanently, but even then, the spell is always Withstood by the target’s relevant Resistance Attribute.
2nd edition core rulebook page 127.

>>53070768
Transfiguration is becoming Fate itself. By effect I AM the Charm now. I deny you your freedom.

>image
Not impressed.

>>53070081

What would happen if one of those archangels fell?

>>53070763
Essentially this.

The mage side argues that the Exalted side presents a weaker argument because theirs boils down closer to "nuh uh", but again, as >>53069402 pointed out, the reason for that isn't because the Exaltedfags can't think of anything better, but because the book doesn't go into any more detail on the matter than that.

Now, for the last time, can we please, fucking, for the love of tits, stop this pointless argument that has no logical resolution?

>>53070679
Solars have charms that literally give the player the authority to yell over you at the game table and say they act before you do.

>my mage does-
No, no he doesn't, the Solar goes first.

>>53070768
You're beyond hopeless if you're this biased. I swear, you haven't even posted a single thing productive to your side of the argument yet.

It's an 'unstoppable force meets an unmovable object' debate, only Archmages have the versatility to work around it while Solars do not.

>>53070799
Spell Shattering Palm prevents Transfiguration from being used. Not in reaction to your spell, but before your spell.

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>>53070799
>he thinks being fate is a good idea
>he doesn't know what Exalt's can DO to fate itself

Just...Just stop saying this. You don't know what you're saying. You're basically handing Exalt's a free win by doing this. Keep away from fate. Fate is bad, in this case.

>>53070823
Acting first is literally meaningless to Archmages. They don't give a fuck, they have their Golden Road.

>>53070832
>Archmages have the versatility
Because their spells are undefined? Solars can make new charms, saying they're less versatile is like saying mages can only ever use rote spells.

>>53070834
Nah, I AM the charm now. So I refuse to do anything. Solars be fucked.

>>53070843
It means the Solar "I win" charm happens as written, the Archmage loses by default.

>>53070834
It would be easier to say the Archmage becomes Prime, in which case the Solars can't do anything, period.

>>53070823
>No, no he doesn't, the Solar goes first.
Doesn't matter.
>Rather than meditating into the Astral, archmasters meditate out of themselves; an archmage’s seemingly physical body is no more crucial to him than a mage’s dream form.
Mage the Awakening Core Rulebook 2nd edition, page 252.
Even if the Solar one-shots the archmage, he just wakes up in his Golden Road and proceeds to torment the Solar by spamming sympathetic magic.

>>53070873
Sorry, no. That's not how this works, friendo. Fate 9 says "nope" and rewrites it into "the Archmage wins instead"

>>53070876
You mean the Archmage becomes a concept. Let me tell you about Primordials, and how being concepts didn't save them.

>>53070876
>>53070859
>they think anything can be done to render an Exalt's powers useless

Exalt's have the ability to literally force you to play by their rules. At this point you'd have to fist fight the GM and take an assault charge in real life to get past that.

>>53070890
Not concepts. Symbols. They represent concepts.
This is what the Supernal is, the vast accumulation and representation of everything and all.

>>53070903

We call that "The Wyld" in Exalted. Essence 1 Charms stop it from doing shit to them, you idiots.

>>53070886
Then the Solar eats his ghost, not having a physical form is less than useless, it makes you more vulnerable if anything. Hell, a Solar can grab whatever form the Archmage takes, composed of anything, or nothing definable at all, slap it on an anvil, and hammer it until it's a sword

>>53070896
There's literally nothing an Exalt can force upon you when you're at Fate / Prime 9 - 10, buddy.

>>53070886
no if you one shot a archmaster he dies, he can reflexively enter his golden road though,

ofcourse any archmaster worth his salt has excised the rule that says he dies, so he'll never die anyways.

>>53070903
And that's still useless, Exalted has things like that as mid-level boss monsters.

>>53070909
Amazing how you don't even know what the Wyld is in your own preferred gameline.

>>53070909
So you don't understand your own gameline.

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>>53070916
>nuh uh ur stuff don't work
>no UR STUFF DUN WERK

>>53070916
>>53070924

The Primordials thought the same thing, they were literally incapable of dying. Solars killed them anyway.

http://www.strawpoll.me/12897613

>>53070926
Not really, no. You're thinking of the concepts they entail. How are you getting your Exalted lore wrong all of a sudden?

>>53070936
>>53070929
>an endless sea of every possibility ever forever
>you don't understand it


Uh huh. Ok. You go on thinking an E1 Charm won't stop you if you try that, I'll be over here laughing at you because you're still desperately trying to dickwave over the obviously largest dicks in all of gaming.

>>53070939
There's a difference between being incapable of dying and not actually existing in a sufficient manner to even be alive or dead.

Archmages as existential beings aren't what you think they are.

>>53070910
>Then the Solar eats his ghost
Its a projection, not a ghost. The Archmaster is in his reality proof bunker.

Also, if an Archmage, or any Mage at all, is trying to directly confront another Supernatural, they are doing it wrong.

>>53070939
>they were literally incapable of dying
No they were always capable of dying they just never planned on it happening.

Where did all the Exalted whores come from?

>>53070983
Some idiot just posed the question and now we have two factions of retards going MUH STUFF WINS NO MUH STUFF WINS at each other.

>>53070983
Have you seen the exalted general?
They have even less to talk about than we do.

>>53070924
That is 1st edition. I'm using the second edition rules as outlined on page 252 of the core rulebook.

>>53070983
Someone pointed how to bypass the perfected defenses of the strongest theoretical Solar Exalted using CofD mechanics, and they got annoyed.

Happened last thread and dragged off into this one.

>>53071007
I made this just for you lads.

Unironically the worst current general on /tg/

>>53071011
Oh god, go and fuck yourself please.

>>53071011
Thank you kind anon.

>>53071022
You can honest to god blame the Exalted fags, I actually thought the 'kek mage supremacy' meme was dying down until one of their flock decided to be an ass.

>>53070983
Somebody pointed out that archmages don't actually have a means to get through a maxed out Solar's defenses, and the mage players got annoyed.

>>53071040
No, and also kill yourself.

Can archmages defeat me?

>>53071041
Look you don't understand exalted well enough to defend it let alone other gamelines.

>>53071054
Can an Archmage defeat anon?

>>53071054
You're posting on 4chan you've already been defeated.

can we just delete this thread and start over please

please

please

>>53071064
Not unless the anoon is an ex-amish with a camera phone

>>53071074
The threads need to take a hiatus. I'm not joking or kidding here, all generals go through this to a greater or lesser extent when material runs out. Just give it a solid two or three weeks with no threads, and then see if things are better when we come back.

>>53070783
Unless you get 3 success with a praxis on your at minimum 10 dice pool. Then you ignore withstand. Which makes it effectively unresisted.

>>53071074
>>53071092
Nope this thread is what we deserve.

>>53071092
I'd agree more with this, except material hasn't really run out; new releases do keep coming. Just people would rather bitch and meme at each other than discuss it.

>>53071108
Alright let me rephrase, new material that people care about. Sure changeling 20 just came out, but who the hell plays old changeling?

>>53071041
Starting to think you don't actually care for either Exalted or Mage.
Archmages have mechanics coming out of their buttholes for dealing with things like Exalts, yet you're obsessively and unashamedly goin' "lolnope" left n' right.

Either you're a biased moron or an autistic frog.

>>53070833
Imperial spells have a built in perfect defense against anything except imperial spells. It's pretty explicit. Spell shattering palm wouldn't work. According to exalteds rules people keep insisting on, it can't over come a perfect defense.

>>53071123
Honestly at this point I think people come more for the shitposting than anything else.

>>53071136
Oh fuck I forgot about this. Imperial Spells can't be countered at all by Exalts.

Unless the Exalts somehow turn themselves into Archmages.

>>53071129
The reason for this has been explained. It is now on you to just let it drop.

>>53071139
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OSCiMbMVDLI

>>53071139
Magefag here, can confirm.

>>53071178
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCiFO7qV54E

>>53071177
There has been no given reason.

>>53071040
>>53071041
>>53071056
>>53071102
>>53071129
>>53071136
>>53071139
>>53071169
>>53071177

>>53071007

Hey anon, can I ask you something. When was the last time you played a session of any world of darkness.
Anon come back.

>>53071193
Your lack of reading comprehension is your own problem.

>>53071195
See that's just not the same.
There's nobody in that thread desperately trying to pretend that their general isn't a dead husk.

>>53071214
Not an answer

>>53071214
Says the anon who doesn't even understand how exalted works.

>>53071136
>>53071169
Is this actually explicit? Because I will drop my case for Exalted if you can't actually counter Archmage magic.

>>53071217
And really, nobody actually cares.

You guys are making DaveB cry

Gods weep

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>>53071236
Yep. Pretty explicit.

>>53071123

Maybe someone should set up a game then.

>>53071236
It just means you couldn't use Spell-Shattering Palm. There's other ways to resist it.

>>53071258
Shiiiiiiiiiiiit you got me

>>53071259
Do you want otherkin?
Because that's how you get otherkin.

Okay.

How do I get my group to stop trying to be the Superfriends? They've managed to negotiate a non-agression pact between TFV and the local Consilium, and they did a pretty good job of it, so I don't want to take it away from them. Yet.

Because I DM'd Shadowrun before, I feel it's "unfair" to strike at the players during downtime. However, logic tells me that vampires won't go toe-to-toe with you in a convenient warehouse. They'll just blow up your car or freeze your assets and have you arrested.

tl;dr - how do I provide enemies for a bunch of Mages, Nobles, and Hunters that don't suck?

>>53071267
Can only be resisted, not countered.

Not sure if that's much of a boon.
The requirements to resist Transfiguration is also something Exalts don't have.

>>53071258
Archmages win this

>>53071287
How strong are the Mages?

>>53071297
The Solar doesn't need the requirements because he has the ability to simply negate such effects on his person.

If I were an Archmaster, I would simply just keep teleporting the Solar away. He'd survive every time, but because teleportation legitimately *isn't* an attack, THIS is something he can't defend against. So just keep sending him across the universe until he gets bored and goes off on some other adventure.

>>53071345
>Be Archmaster
>Give yourself the exalted template without any of its drawbacks + extra bonuses (None of which takes away in any fashion from your status as an archmaster)
>Beat literally any Exalt

>Shapechanging — All pooka have an affinity with a particular animal. This is always a natural animal, never a mythological one. This animal affects her appearance and personality, and she is able to shapeshift into the animal at will. If completely alone, a pooka can shapechange for free, but if another changeling or enchanted mortal is present the change costs one Glamour. A pooka can never shift into an animal when being observed by a mundane mortal. Shifting back from animal form is always free and can be done at any time (again, as long as the pooka is unobserved by mortal eyes).

Can I play as a T-Rex Pooka?

>>53071367
Fuck just make yourself double exalted you're an archmage do whatever you fucking want.

>>53071345
You don't need to *keep* teleporting him away. Just lock him up for all eternity.

These invincibility discussions are pointless when it's not even an advantage.

>>53071367
Which spells will give you the exalted template? Because I was under the impression that template stacking was a no no in world of darkness.

>>53071385
>Just lock him up for all eternity.

Not a good idea; Larceny charms could get him out eventually.

>>53071195
Is that an attempt at a containment thread? It won't work.

>>53071414
Can it get him out of outer space?

>>53071414
You could always distort time. A second in his prison equals a million years in the present.

Charms also wouldn't necessarily work.

>>53071322

One of them is a burnout who is playing a Thyrsus Silver Ladder. I literally had to hold his hand how to play his character. All he does is heal and then spend 3 turns buffing.

In the meanwhile, the other one is a Free Council Obrimos, with Spirit and Prime. He solves everything, because he's really smart and inventive and is good at taking optimal actions.

So, one very powerful one, and one that is actively worse than the Hunters and Princesses.

>>53071433
>Can it get him out of outer space?

It might. Though with the right Resistance shit surviving outer space isn't too hard either. Nullifying environmental hazards and the need to breathe and all.

>>53071414
If the prison was made using Imperial magic, there's nothing the Exalt can do. Period.

>>53071438
>You could always distort time. A second in his prison equals a million years in the present.

That might help, yeah.

>>53071447
Oh well. Mm, still though, even one good Mage player is gonna be pretty hard to balance for because anything that can really challenge him is going to be a right pain in the ass for everybody else.

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>>53071411
The entire practice of entities allows for this.

>>53071463
Wouldn't the exalt eventually run out of essence?
Excuse me if i'm wrong have actually looked at the rules for quite some time.

>>53071447
>>53071287
Whats the general plot? Because with that sort of party my first thought is to start throwing some Spirits or Darkness at them.

>>53071481
Using the charms to work your escape from the prison isn't the same as countering the Imperial spell directly--the prison will still exist and all.

>>53071494
So a archmage could just build a new template that does everything the other templates do but better?

>>53071496
Some Charms don't require constant reactivations, or can be customed up to no longer need them at particularly high Essence levels.

>>53071519
lol yep. It also technically allows you to account for any house rule and still be able to tell your players you are doing things 'by the book' if you want to be an asshole about it.

>>53071539
>>53071519
No it doesn't, Archmages can't stack templates on themselves.

>>53071514
Unless of course the Imperial Spell specifically targets the Charm itself.

So you better hope it doesn't.

>>53071556
They can alter their own template though. You can include abilities that mimic anything. Its not stacking, its adding abilities to your current template.

>>53071539
Huh, I have to sit down and actually read the mage books at some point.
If only to see some the stupid shit they can get up too.
Actually any recommendations on books to read about top level mage bullshit?

>>53071556
They can improve on their Template, dumbass. If they wanted to give themselves Exalt abilities, they damn well could do it.

>>53071568
For OWoD mage, which is even weirder, there is Masters of the Art
For NWoD the only real book for top tier stuff is Imperial Mysteries.

Starting to see why the magefags were adamant on Archmages beating Solars.

This is literally metagaming sorcery of the highest degree.

>>53071539
I kind of want to play a completely off the wall Archmasters game now and just see how screwed up everything can get.

>>53071558
Remember that resistance isn't a counter.

>>53071585
Neato.
I'm off to read about shit i'll probably never actually get play.
Just like every other rpg book I read.

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>>53071568
Imperial Mysteries

>>53071596
Yeah, though I also see where the Exaltedfags come from, and why the neutralfags are saying it's really an unsolvable argument.

So any new news on trinity?

>>53071610
Double neato saves looking through the mega.

>>53071623
Hasn't been in a little while. I kind of wonder how the Storypath shit in general is doing.

>>53071638
Scion seems to be doing okayish. There are still previews coming out, even if a bit less frequent, and they look good. Typical delays that I think everyone was expecting honestly.

>>53071653
It can't be as bad as the original scion.

>>53071653
That's good. Storypath really did look interesting, and I really love the idea of a Scion and Trinity with some actual mechanical solidity under them.

This thread has nearly 300 posts
It was just made.
I hate all of you.

So. Very. Much.

>>53071679
Scion 1e was literally John Chambers dropping trou and jamming his cock right into the Exalted 2e mechanics. You ain't kidding.

>>53071679
Oh it isn't. They've been doing previews since forever ago under the name sardonyx, then a bunch during the kickstarter, including an alpha slice to kick it all off. Looks pretty baller all things considered. They seem to be making a conscious effort to let gods be more powerful then stuff below without crushing all opposition. We'll see how higher tiers actually play out though.
Also hey, kitsune in core. Touch fluffy tail.

>>53071701
I hope it turns out good. Sounds like one of the better modern fantasy setting ideas. Theres a certain appeal to a warrior from Asgard arm wrestling a guardian from the jade palace in some bar somewhere.

>>53071695
Your hate makes my sack tingle.

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>>53071801

>>53071831
Just good old fashioned hate based sack tingles.

Think any of the promethian supplements are likely to get 2e updates?

>>53071915
Doesn't seem too likely yet; I haven't heard of any 2e Prommie books coming besides the core.

Have you ever played a character that goes against type? How did it go?

>>53070965
So literally exactly like the Dragon's Shadow. They beat him too.

>>53072086
Lasombra antitribu. Had a sire who was *extremely* unhappy with the rest of the Clan. Ended up falling in with the Anarchs. Made a pretty good fake Brujah, but she probably would have died before too long had that game not ended prematurely due to IRL problems.

The original version of Epic Iron Skin presented in the Beast Core is really underwhelming. All it does is offer 1 point of General Armor that applies against aggravated damage. Here's my version. Feedback is appreciated.

Iron Skin (Epic, ••• or •••••)
Prerequisites: Major Supernatural Template, Advanced Iron Skin 2, Stamina 5
Effect: Your character is nigh invincible. For the 3 dot version, you may spend 1 willpower point whenever you are attacked and roll Stamina + Supernatural Tolerance. Each Success negates one point of damage, regardless of its type. Even if the roll fails, your character is considered to have received 1 Success. The maximum amount of damage that may be negated this way is equal to the character's Stamina. For the 5 dot version, no Willpower points are needed. This stacks with other sources of Armor. At the ST's discretion, characters without a Major Supernatural Template may acquire this Merit if they have at least one dot in the Supernatural Resistance Merit (see Hurt Locker, page 78).
Drawback: This Merit does not apply against Banes.

>>53072101
Nope, you're still thinking too small scale of an existence.

>>53072146
Archmages =/= Ascended.

>>53072101
More so that when you're dealing with an archmage you're not actually dealing with the archmage.
You're interacting with one of an infinite number of projections that archamage inserts into the world because base reality can't deal with actual archmages without substantial alterations to existence that archamges as a whole have agreed not to do in case they break everything.

>>53072170
Archmages no longer exist as beings in the traditional sense. Everything in exalted still existed and had 'bodies' and what not.

>>53072118
Why are you trying to fix beast powers?
Are you actually trying to play beast?
Why would you do that?

>>53072187
Its not a Beast power. The devs have said those Epic merits should be available to other supernaturals. And if you look at how he rewrote it, it also allows other non beasts to take it.

>>53072187
Please read the Prerequisites of the Merit. I simply wrote a new version because the original could be better, even if the book it is from is hated by most people.

I guess this means you don't have any opinions on my version of the Merit?

Imagine what you could do if you could harvest the raw autism of these threads

>>53072228
Organize an assload of legos?

>>53072228
>Quintessence

This was all started by an Archmaster.

>>53072118
It actually sounds like a merit worth buying. My main hesitations about it is that it adds more rolls to combat, soak was always an added pain in the ass that slowed down combat.

The other is that combined with armor it might end up making a character just untouchable all the time, the inherent banes of some templates balance that out, but not all of them have banes, so that could cause problems in play.

>>53072173
This is kind of similar to how the Yozis work in Exalted. The differences being the projections are themselves unique entities while still being projections, and there was no detente preventing the main Yozi from also getting involved for the hell of it.

>>53072315
Oh god just shut the FUCK up

>>53072320
I don't even fucking care anymore. The thread is near to autosage anyway.

>>53072086
Happy-go-lucky Moros that focused on his Ruling Arcana but tried to avoid reanimating human corpses if he could. Opted to focus on taking advantage of local ghosts, offering them deals and such and taking care of their problems to gain their favor instead of outright forcing them into submission.

Other necromancers saw him as foolish and most other Mages were suspicious of his investments in the local ghosts, especially the Consilium's righteous fury Obrimos Sentinel who had convinced herself that he was up to no good when really he was just looking for his dad's ghost.

>>53072086
Does a hunter who's first reaction to learning someone is supernatural isn't violence count?

>>53072303
That makes sense. What if the Merit simply made your Armor equal to [Stamina/Stamina - 1]? That could still cause problems in the case of Vampires (who can have really high Stamina through Resilience) and certain Mages (who can have really high Stamina through the Life Arcanum).

Do remember that the character with this Merit still has to roll, so they are not truly "untouchable". All the opponent needs is a lucky strike. Also, per RAW, even if your Armor, soaks all damage, you still suffer one bashing damage due to inertia.

>>53072315
Actually, CAN an Archmaster make a bunch of different projections of himself with differing appearances, names, even genders?

>>53072109
I know very little about OWOD, so I can't comment on this.

>>53072384
Sounds really fun! But knowing the setting and most groups, he probably came to a bad end.

>>53072424
Possibly. Can you offer more details?

>>53072438
Both don't sound too bad. It seems at the point where it needs some play testing. If I were currently running one I'd say the dice roll is better due to how easy supernatural armor can be to acquire. But that's with Changeling 2e's wyrd/2 armor kiths that can be buffed by a merit in mind.

>>53072483
Yes. It's even more ridiculous once you Ascend.
Ascendants can send down an infinite number of Ochemata.

>>53072508
Ah, that's cool. Though would be a little hard to play that many different identities.

>>53072497
Well most hunters, at least how the fluff text of the books describes them, fall somewhere between paranoid and psychotic. Not actually sure if this is how anyone runs them, but the hunter I play tends to be more curious then anything. He sees someone doing something impossible and he doesn't immediately register them as a threat, he wants to get to know them more, like on a personal level even.

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What would pic related be in the OWOD and COD?

In the latter, I think he would be a Legend Slasher, a Horror, or a broken God-Machine Angel.

>>53072599
Hmm, that does sound unorthodox. Is he a member of the Talbot Group?

>>53072621
Nothing. I wouldn't make him any defined splat, just some nameless thing. Not everything in the WoD fits neatly into published material.

>>53072647
Long night actually. Though again, I don't have a ton of experience with hunter, so I'm not sure how unorthodox it really is. How often do people play hunters that go all the way through the kill on site sort of stuff?

>>53072621

Well, ain't he an attractive psychopath.

>>53072681
That's totally valid, but how would you represent him mechanically? The players need something to oppose. The Horror template in the CoD isn't even a proper splat, it's just a versatile "build any monster" tool box.

>>53072621
If you went the horror route, I'd make him one of those weird things from the end of conquering heroes.
Come to think of it, he could make a good huntsmen couldn't he?

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>>53069445
Not quite a Shinigami, but when I played Geist the Sineaters years ago I was able to make what was essentially Kuwabara's Spirit Sword from Yu Yu Hakusho. It was basically just a Memento that was a Zippo Lighter and I would have to channel my soul through it when igniting it for it to shoot out a sword length stream of spirit/ghostly fire. Could manipulate it other shapes and extend it like the spirit sword.

>>53072727
You mean the Insatiables? Those specifically hunt Beasts. And Huntsmen are more about trickery and traps (physical, mental and social).

When I said Horror, I wasn't talking about the super Goetia that fuse with mortals to create Beasts. I was talking about the generic Horrors that use Potency and Dread Powers.

>>53072497
>he probably came to a bad end
Actually he wifed the Obrimos Sentinel

>>53072843
>only spoilered half of what i meant to spoil
fuck

>>53073158

>>53072599
>He sees someone doing something impossible and he doesn't immediately register them as a threat, he wants to get to know them more, like on a personal level even.

Just how big an idiot is this hunter?

If his basic attitude is to try to make friends with people and other things who are capable of doing the impossible, he'll very soon be dead, something's lunch, or far, far worse.

You do not under any circumstances poke you nose into the business of the creatures of the night unless you have the raw power and skill to protect yourself. It's not a good idea when in the know players like mages or beasts personally engage with supernaturals, and its suicidal for a mortal.

>>53069582
They do not and asking someone's generation is a big faux pas. Additionally, an individual vampire may know their generation or the may not.

Someone with the Thaumaturgical path of blood at rank 1 can determine someone's generation as well as if they're a diablerist or not IF they know what they're looking for.

>>53071556
whatever rule that comes from can be excised away faggot