Warmachine/Hordes General /wmg/

Rasheth is T H I C C.

Battle Engine and Bane CID week 2 changes (Will be continued):

"Cygnar

Storm Strider – We want to see the “Storm Strider” moving, not just sitting back and shooting to help differeitnate it from other battle engines like the Arcantric Force Generator.
Build Up Power only when advancing.
Protectorate

Vessel of Judgment – Quality of life changes to improve how this model interacts in Faction.
Cleansing Aura does not remove friendly upkeeps.
Doors of Judgement: Changed to destroy so the soul can be collected.
Khador

Gun Carriage – We felt the Gun Carriage was able to stay very safe with Reposition and 12" range on its cannons. This change brings the Gun Carriage in line with what we would like to see it doing on the battlefield. We found the majority of users only used the Trample Power Attack to gain extra threat range on its ranged weapons and Line Breaker should give it a solid bump in melee potential.
Replace Power Attack: Trample with Line Breaker
Reduce the range of heavy Cannons from 12 to 8."

>>53049465
"Cryx (1 of 2)

Desecrator – We felt this warjacks ranged output could use an increase in effectiveness.
Increase the RNG of the Plague Bearer to 12 and its POW to 14.
Bane Warrior Command Attachment – Moving Granted: Tough to the Standard Bearer makes the ability harder to remove from play. Removing the need to box enemy models as a requirement of Void Bringer makes it more reliable in unfavorable match ups.
Granted: Tough moved to the Standard Bearer.
Void Bringer changed to returning d3+1 models.
Bane Knights – Feedback showed that Bane Knights were under performing, please continue to test with this new point value and provide feedback.
Change point cost to 10/16.
Bane Riders – Increasing the threat range of Bane Riders has been a very common theme in feedback. It also has a nice synergy with Vengeance.
Increase the RNG of the Bane Blade to 2.
Mechanithrall – With the increase to DEF, Mechanithrall to cheap at 5/8.
Increase point cost to 6/9.
Necrosurgeon & Stitch Thralls – We want the Necrosurgeon to remain pertinent. Veteran Leader makes the Mechanithralls (and Brute Thralls) more effective on the battlefield while they are in close proximity to the Necrosurgeon.
Gains Veteran Leader [Mechanithralls]
Bane Lord Tartarus – As a passive ability Veteran Leader is easier to use with regards to order of operations, and is a nice bump for Agathia
Change Curse to Veteran Leader [Bane].
Increase MAT to 8.
Wraith Engine – This removes the counter intuitive interaction between Soul Bondage and Cleave.
Replace the text of Soul Bondage with the following:
Once per round when a living enemy warrior model is destroyed while within 2˝ of this model, you can replace the destroyed model with a Machine Wraith solo. The destroyed model is removed from play and does not provide a soul token."

>>53049501
"Cryx (2 of 2)

Dark Host Theme Force – Darragh Wrathe brings magic attacks and an assortment of capabilities that support this theme force. Allowing the Wraith Engine to count toward the points for free models is a solid quality of life change for a model we want to see in this theme.
Darragh Wrathe can be included in the Dark Host theme force.
Replace the first special rule with the following:
For every full 20 points of units and battle engines in this army, you can add one command attachment or medium or smaller based solo to the army free of cost. Free models do not count toward the total point value of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
Infernal Machines Theme Force – We wanted to allow the Wraith Engine to be Infernal Machine theme force.
The Wraith Engine Battle Engine can be included in the Infernal Machine theme force."

>>53049523
"Retribution

Defenders of Ios Theme Force – This change adds clarity and should contribute to greater list diversity.
Replace the first special rule with the following:
For every 20 points of units and battle engines in this army, you can add one weapon crew unit, command attachment, or solo to the army free of cost. Free units and command attachments do not count toward the total point value of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
Mercenaries

Hammerfall Siege Crawler – We are looking to improve the clarity of the Reinforcements special rule.
Change the text of Reinforcements [Rhulic] to the following:
During your Maintenance Phase, return to play d3 small-based friendly Rhulic Grunts to play. Models return with 1 unmarked damage box. Place the returned Grunts completely within this model’s command range, in formation, and completely within 3˝ of another model in its unit. Returned Grunts must forfeit their Combat Actions the turn they are returned to play."

>>53049501
>Necrosurgeon & Stitch Thralls – We want the Necrosurgeon to remain pertinent. Veteran Leader makes the Mechanithralls (and Brute Thralls) more effective on the battlefield while they are in close proximity to the Necrosurgeon.
Gains Veteran Leader [Mechanithralls]
Maybe I'm missing it, but what does the Vet Leader do for the Mechanithralls?

>>53049543
"Trollbloods

War Wagon – The War Wagon was lacking something in the way of accuracy. Shooting Gallery both grants this accuracy bonus and supports the intent of this model as a close in battle tank. The War Wagon also needed a theme force to support it. We found the majority of users only used the Trample Power Attack to gain extra threat range on its ranged weapons.
Gains Shooting Gallery:
This model gains +2 to ranged attack rolls against models within 5˝ of it.
Loses Power Attack: Trample
Kriel Company Theme Force – Kriel Company theme force added. This is the militant United Kriels themed force. Essentially this is the United Kriels militia. We felt this relevant to the testing of the War Wagon.

Army Composition
An army made using this theme force can include only the following Trollblood models:
Trollblood warlocks
non-character warbeasts with ranged weapons
Pyg models/units
Trollkin models/units with ranged weapons
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribe units
Troll Whelp solos
War Wagon Battle Engines
Special Rules
For every full 20 points of units and battle egines in this army, you can add one weapon crew unit, command attachment, or medium-based solo to the army free of cost. Free models/units do not count toward the total number of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
Weapon crew units and solos in this army gain Reposition [3˝]. (At the end of an activation it did not run or fail a charge, a model with Reposition [3˝] can advance up to 3˝, then its activation ends.)
You gain +1 to your starting roll for the game."

>>53049662
"Skorne

Winds of Death Theme Force – We would like to see Battle Engines appear in theme forces more often and this seemed the obvious place for its inclusion.
Replace the first special rule with the following:
For every full 20 points of battle engines and Venator models/units in this army, you can add one Venator weapon crew unit or solo to the army free of cost. Free models/units do not count toward the total point value of Venator models/units in the army when calculating this bonus.
Legion

Throne of Everblight – Adding attacks to the Throne of Everblight makes it stronger against harder targets and can be used to generate even more special attacks. Ice Cage better supports the rest of the army by reducing the DEF of targets giving the model more utility.
Gains an additional Tentacle melee attack.
Replace Winter’s Grip (Attack) with Ice Cage (Attack):
Ice Cage is a RNG 10 magic attack. A model hit suffers a cumulative –2 DEF for one turn unless it has Immunity: Cold XICONX. When a model without Immunity: Cold XICONX is hit with three or more Ice Cage attacks the same turn, it becomes stationary for one round.
Oracles of Annihilation Theme Force – This is a solid quality of life change for the Throne of Everblight in the theme force it calls home.
Replace the first special rule with the following:
For every 25 points of warbeasts and battle engines in this army, you can add one command attachment or solo to the army free of cost."

>>53049682
"Minions

Sacral Vault – These changes should make the weapon more reliable and give the player more options while optimizing the effectiveness of Deathly Domination by allowing the Sacral Vault to collect the targets soul.
Spectral Fury becomes ROF 1 but gains Reload [2].
Replace the text of Deathly Domination with the following:
When this weapon boxes a living or undead non-warcaster, non-warlock enemy warrior model, you can immediately take control of the enemy model and make a full advance with it followed by a basic melee attack, then the boxed model is destroyed. The boxed model cannot be targeted by free strikes during this movement."

>>53049566
Unless I am mistaken it should be +1 to attack rolls within command?

>>53049566
Makes them more accurate and if you spam the Mcthralls that can be relevant. It also makes the McThralls more confident with their Combo Strikes.

>>53049543
>For every 20 points of units and battle engines in this army

Wait, not a particular type of units, just... units? Mein gott this list can do everything.

>>53049662
Army Composition
An army made using this theme force can include only the following Trollblood models:
Trollblood warlocks
non-character warbeasts with ranged weapons
Pyg models/units
Trollkin models/units with ranged weapons
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribe units
Troll Whelp solos
War Wagon Battle Engines
Special Rules
For every full 20 points of units and battle egines in this army, you can add one weapon crew unit, command attachment, or medium-based solo to the army free of cost. Free models/units do not count toward the total number of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
Weapon crew units and solos in this army gain Reposition [3˝]. (At the end of an activation it did not run or fail a charge, a model with Reposition [3˝] can advance up to 3˝, then its activation ends.)
You gain +1 to your starting roll for the game."

Interesting, not to sure about the "no melee warbeast thing" though
>>53049717
>>53049731
Oh right, I forgot Veteran Leader is a universal rule

>>53049682
>Skorne
>Winds of Death Theme Force
GIVE US ANOTHER THEME FORCE ALREADY.

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Will these guys finally see some use?
probably not

>>53049846
For every full 20 points of non-character Cyclops warbeasts in this army-

>>53049465
Gun Carriage is utter shit now.
8 range kills it

>>53049931
Don't you even joke you absolute sadist. Unless we get a Cyclops CID.

>>53050168
- one Cyclops model in your army gains weaponmaster on its highest P+S or POW weapon.

>>53050168

It could work, I tell you guys. ROF2 on Cyclops raiders and free Beast Handlers, let's do this thing.

Trollbloods Army - 73 / 75 points
[Theme] Kriel Company

!!! Your army contains CID entries.

(Gunnbjorn 1) Captain Gunnbjorn [+28]
- Dozer & Smigg [18]
- Pyre Troll [9]
Fell Caller Hero [0(5)]
Fell Caller Hero [0(5)]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Northkin Fire Eaters [7]
Pummeler Crew [0(6)]
Pyg Burrowers (min) [8]
Trollkin Highwaymen (max) [15]
Trollkin War Wagon (CID) [17]
Trollkin War Wagon (CID) [17]

2 points, I can't spend.

>>53049975
Don't forget it's charges are super easy to block now because it can't trample anymore.

>>53050328
Maybe try swapping one of those fell callers for something else?

>>53050328
>>53050386
Also, is a Krielstone really necessary? Consider that the strength bonus doesn't really matter and the armor bonus won't really help because if they manage to get to you you'll probably be dead anyway. Consider if Combat Warding and Spirit Chaser are worth those points.

>>53050328
Why wouldn't you just bring Pyg Bushwackers and a Bomber with Gunnbjorn?

>>53049886
No. Never. Not as they are, anyway.

Be heartened, though - one day you may be graced by the touch of CID, and on that day all your shelf-fillers and dust-claimers will see at least one, maybe two turns of play.

How accurate at a range is "x" really?

>>Rat 10

>>Rat 9
Caine, Eiryss,

>>Rat 8
Hellslinger Phantom, Kara Sloan, Black 13th, Holt, Alten Ashley, Kell Bailoch, Lylyth, Grim Angus,

>>Rat 7
Maxwell Finn, Nicia, Kaelyssa, Cylena Raefyll, Ashlynn, Zira (Devil's Shadow), Saxon Orrik, Taryn, Nuala,
Lord of the Feast, Saeryn, Vayl, Annyssa Ryvaal, Jarl Skuld, Madrak, Rask, The Dreamer, Lord Longfellow,

>>Rat 6
Captain Rengrave, Viktor Pendrake, Jakes, Kraye, Nemo, Stryker, Maddox, Siege, Arlan Strangewayes, Harlan Versh,
Laddermore, Harrison Gibbs, Malakov, Harkevich, Irusk, Old Witch, Sorscha, Strakhov, Kovnik Joe, Malekus, Vyros, Garryth,
Ossyan, Ravyn, Narn, Damiano, Shae, Cyphon, Durgen Madhammer, Ossrum, Magnus, Sam Machorne, Croe, Blythe and Bull, Herne,
Anastasia Di Bray, Colbie Sterling, Hutchuk, Rockbottom, Dougal MacNaile, Raluk Moorclaw, Rutger Shaw, Gunnbjorn,
Savio Montero Acosta, Stannis Brocker, Bradigus, Kreuger, Mohsar, Tanith, Una, Mordikaar, Zaal, Muggs and Krump,
Grissel, Sons of Bragg, Braylen Wanderheart, Calaban, Helga, Lord Carver, The Wanderer,

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Almost finished with my standard bearer.
Does anyone know if there's a list of Troll text? I want to put something on the banner.

>>53048593
His Arcana is countered because if he pops it too early you can defend the model he put it on, which makes it much harder for him to switch it around, and if he does pop it then he can't pop any defensive tech for his list to try and mitigate the damage to his army. And you make sure to work your way through your activations so that your harder to kill stuff goes last, which makes it harder for him to move it around as well.

And the Heretic is absolutely reliant on that damage buff to do any real work, so long as you don't feed him any of your damage buffs.

Arcana seem extremely powerful, but they require a lot of skill on the players part to not waste them. Beyond that, the solution to Grymkin is simply to bring more well rounded lists, making it harder for them to just tech their Arcana against you.

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>>53053251
I'm afraid I don't have the Trollbloods letters. Here's most of Warmachine though in case you have other projects.

>>53049383
Where the fuck is the previous thread OP? SOME OF US ARENT DONE YET

>>53049682

PP is really trying to get me to pick up a Throne, and I think it's working.

>>53053965
In the archive, goofus.
>>52989766

>>53049682

>Oracles gets buffed

PP is out of their god damn minds.

>>53053998
ALL IS FORGIVEN. I MUST CONSUME.

>>53049501
>Void Bringer changed to returning d3+1 models.

Just like that? Can someone post the CID pdfs?

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>>53049662
You know, Fire Eaters don't really make much sense thematically in this theme
>A theme based around a modernized Trollkin army containing all the great weapons of war the Trolls have built with minimal magical support
>And then you just have some dumb assholes drinking beer and spitting fire at people

>>53049383
So a question about IK, I haven't played it yet but is grappling fairly useless? It seems great if you're 4d1ing a weak enemy or something but it takes at least 2 turns to do more than give them and you -5 defense and with fairly low hp compared to damage, a character with low strength would probably die from 2 attacks in that time anyway. Asking because I wanted to make an encounter with someone that set themselves on fire and grappled people, would that work?

>>53052109
>>53049886
You guys are crazy, Sluggers are fantastic

>>53055350
Tell me your ways you madman you.

>>53054733
>implying beer isn't the greatest weapon of war ever devised

>>53055362
They're Rat 6, Pow 13 guns with 5d3 shots for 10 points. That's pretty awesome (for Trolls amyway) and you can get some good work with them in a Grim2 or Horgle list.

They're not the greatest thing ever, but for ten points they do good work

>>53055433
>Horgle
So wait, you can light a few jacks on fire with a bomber and then unload 5d3 (so on average 10) shots fully boosted onto them on feat turn, right? That's not at all shabby.

>>53055433
I mean, I knew about those interactions, but why take sluggers when I can get highwaymen and get more for my points

>>53055651
Because Highwaymen are total garbage?

>>53055735
>Highwaymen are garbage and sluggers are good
Are we in topsy turvy land

>>53055155
I sorry to say that Iron Kindoms RPG rarely gets discussed here. Its not that its not welcome, but thread traffic is lowish in general and generally devoted to the wargame.

Now im just being reminded of how interested I was in playing Iron Kindoms. But I never have. :(

Have you tried it? Is it fun?

>>53056109
Different Anon, but I've gotten to play it twice, once IK and once IK Unleashed. Neither game ran to completion but they were decently fun.
He only got one session, but I enjoyed my Fire Sorcerer/Circle Warlock and his pet Scarsfell Griffon we dubbed "Flaming Hot Wings."

>>53056109
Yeah I've asked a few times before about mostly fluff stuff, it makes sense. I'm preparing for running it, haven't gotten to yet but now that university's done it shouldn't be too long. Just making summaries of the rules to more easily look up now as well as writing down ideas, then I'll get to encounter balancing and making some fire cultists.

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>>53054566

>>53049662
Losing power attack: trample sucks. Also, the theme can't use runebearer, right? If that's the case it's a damn shame.

>>53056109
My problem with the IKRPG is that it's so focused around combat. If you want to run games based around social interaction, politics, or even exploration and investigation, there isn't an enormous amount of rules support. It just feels like an extension of the wargame, and for a setting as rich as the Iron Kingdoms, I think that's a real shame. But the books are an excellent source of fluff, so they're still worth picking up and reading, as are the very old IK books back when it was a DnD hack.

>>53056606
Thanks

>>53056899
I'd love a gumshoe IK or something but I think the reality is that it stemmed from a wargame so most of the audience will want combat-focused, and D&D is the most popular tprg by far and it gets by well with minimal out of combat mechanics.

It's a shame they aren't updating IKRPG for mk3 rules, although I suppose you could do it yourself with enough effort since they're so damn similar.

>>53056281
That sounds like an excellent character.

>>53054733
There's actually a thread on the CID forums right now on whether they're even allowed in the theme, since MK 3 changed how unit types work, they aren't a pyg unit and aren't a trollkin unit even if they do have ranged weapons.

It's a good feeling to know the game isn't dying anymore. People are no longer jaded about edition change shakeups and the sales seem to be at an all time high.

>>53054733
Apparently in the dev area of the CID forums they clarified that it isnt so much as the modernization of the trollkin militia, rather its a drunken possie. I wish I was kidding.

>>53057353
Now if only PP could step away from that cliff for more than five minutes that would be great. But every time things stabilize some guy at PP comes up with a great idea to reintroduce panic and uncertainty. I'm getting really tired of that shit.

>>53057353
I am personally very jaded about buying stuff nowadays though, since it could get nerfed at any second.

>>53057373
>since it could get nerfed at any second
Or just invalidated by theme forces.

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So, are there any characters or creatures in IKRPG that have huge bases? Because I couldn't find any in the monsternomicon and the examples only mention small, medium and large.

>>53057522
It's actually in the monsternomicon. The Dracodile or whatever is huge based. In a later NQ they gave the stats for the WoldWrath and tips for GMs on how to incorporate gargantuans as enemies and as part of a group.

>>53057378
Well, so far they mostly make shelf warmers usable.

>>53057586
Oh my bad, think I got distracted by the nice art. Now I just need to get my players to 50 exp.

>>53057622
Not so sure about that. I mean, look at Cygnar. All they ever play is Heavy Metal and Storm Lance Division. Neither of those made shelf warmers like Reliant or Stormguard viable and actually made some of them worse by comparison. All the while my Cygnar I own from Mk2 is becoming less and less viable. Sure, it's great that Cygnar is no longer just about Gun mages and Boomhowlers, but I'd actually like to still field those units without gimping myself.

https://conflictchamber.com/#b41b_-0B0Z19191v1v1v2Ai22n1Ch-h_h-h_

Cryx Army - 74 / 75 points
[Theme] Dark Host

!!! Your army contains CID entries.
!!! You are using a pre-release theme.

(Helleana 1, Morgaen 1 & Selene 1) The Witch Coven of Garlghast [+26]
- Deathripper [6]
- Deathripper [6]
- Slayer [10]
- Slayer [10]
- Slayer [10]
- Skarlock Thrall [4]
Bane Knights (max) [16]
Bane Warriors (CID) (max) [15]
- Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [0(5)]
Bane Warriors (CID) (max) [15]
- Bane Warrior Officer & Standard (CID) [5]
Bane Lord Tartarus (CID) [0(6)]
Necrotech [2]
Necrotech [2]

Taking this list to a friendly game today, wish me luck minnasan!

>>53049383
Been out of the loop for a few weeks... did we get spoilers for all this new stuff yet? Elves and skorne stuff mainly? Dug through the archives but didn't see much.

If any hero anon has got card pics or warroom screens, please repost.

>>53058361
Take a look at 2-3 threads ago.

The Ret stuff is motly unremarkable except for the Spears, Fane Knight and Hemera. Morghoul3 exists.

>>53052521
Man, are Caine and Eiryss really the only two RAT9 peeps in the game?

>>53058408
>Spears
>remarkable

No.

The Arcanists, though, they're fucking amazing.

>>53058427
I still think running double Arcanist Squad is worse than running one Arcanist squad and 3 solo Arcanists. The +2 Power buff is way too important for Retribution pillowfists.

>>53058595
It also costs 1p more, which is kind of weird.

>>53057373
Except CIDs are announced about a month in advance, take a month to complete and then aren't officially released for another 2 months to become official. Not to mention that community will stop them from making any really ridiculous nerfs.

So unless at least 4 months is "any second" then it's not like you don't get any warning.

>>53058673
>and then aren't officially released for another 2 months to become official
That is just fucking pointless.

>>53058688
It's for further "internal testing" apparently. By which I assume they mean "how can we fuck it up".

>>53058733
Which I really don't get. A Beta is supposed to be the final step in development.

>>53058733
Oh wait, on second though, I know what that time is for: Getting that shit on Warroom. Another reason why Warroom should just be succeeded by some community-handled application. PP cannot be trusted with computers.

>>53058595
It kinda depends on the caster, and what you're trying to do with your list.

It's not as important for Rahn, because his game is about denying the enemy opportunities and setting up finishers. Elara doesn't really need them because Scything Touch so good, and it's not hugely necessary for Ossyan, who just wants to shoot, and Vyros1, who can give his warjacks a turn of effectively being Weapon Masters. Issyria and Helynna also have ways of skewing damage upwards, but not as effectively.

I really wish we could still use Lady Aiyana.

>>53059051
Fair enough. I've simply seen way too many times in which Imperatus or a Manticor charges a heavy and fails to take out even half it's boxes.

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Would it be broken if in the Assault Kommando theme gave all Warrior Models Immunity: Fire, Immunity: Corrosion and the ability to ignore gas effects and clouds?

I would love to convert Widowmakers, dogs and what have you with gas masks.

>>53059215
>Would it be broken if in the Assault Kommando theme gave all Warrior Models Immunity: Fire, Immunity: Corrosion and the ability to ignore gas effects and clouds?

Of course, that would be broken beyond belief.

>>53059249
Even if the only non-caster, non-solo warrior models are Assault Kommandos who already have these rules anyway?

>>53059291

Widowmakers were referenced, anon; people know what that means, now.

>>53059051
>I really wish we could still use Lady Aiyana.

You know her terms, reverse your "no pets allowed" policy, or she walks.

>>53056899

My issue with it is that it really tends to focus on TT factions.

Like, they said they don't ever intend to make non-faction warlocks a thing (Despite there being a couple of solos that are them) and the amount of support for stuff that isn't a unit with a model is utterly tiny.

I understand they also make the TT but with all the stuff going back to 3.0 Iron Kingdoms they've got a broad enough setting that they could expand heavily.

It also runs into issues with the progression of the wargame past the RPG. They played things very, very carefully with 'X can be Y' race/class combos. Like when the Satyxis rules came out, Satyxis gunslingers didn't exist so RPG Satyxis can't be gunmages. With the Iosan/Nyss team up I'm 100% expecting the Nyss RPG rules to completely fall apart when a Nyss Arcanist or Warcaster occurs as RPG Nyss are forbidden to be basically anything that isn't a primitive. Sorcerers but no access to Arcanist for example.

That and the skill system has some serious issues. Mostly that the numbers for it...don't work. At all. A heroic tier interrogator with maximum in both his stats AND the skill for heroic tier has a lower value for attempting to make the interrogation than the RACIAL MINIMUM willpower for a human resisting it. God forbid they actually put that floating point in Phy or Int as failing interrogation not only means you don't get any information but the other guy gets to give you false information you think is real.

I like the game but it would really benefit from a second edition with some more work on the non-combat system/less hardline class restrictions.

>>53059381

Well, that and she's a Seeker. She's kinda not on the 'Kill all humans' bandwagon.

>>53059215

It would be bullshit if for no other reason than 'It hard counters several casters to no end'. Generally a list can't just 100% ignore an elemental type.

>>53059433
>Generally a list can't just 100% ignore an elemental type.

... Storm Division?

>>53059463

I said generally. Storm Division isn't well designed either but that's only one element rather than two.

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>>53049662
> Trollblood battle engine was so bad they have to come out with a theme force to fix it.
> Theme force is horrendous.

Losing Trample is unfortunate, but they want ALL movement like that taken out of the game (hence why you can't charge your own guys anymore), so at least its fair to everyone. Not sure about Shooting Gallery, will have to try.

I can already tell the theme force is garbage, though. It does nothing to solve the fundamental problem with a lot of troll guns: they can't hit anything. Burrowers, Bushwackers, Sluggers and Scattergunners are still going to get left out in the cold. We just have so many other better options and free useless weapons crews are not enticing at all.

Hey guys I played a couple of games with the MkII starter set with a friend who owned it, and I wanted to start collecting Menoth.
Then I saw the Grymkin being announced, they look pretty fun and I wondered if anybody played them on CID already and could tell me if they're worth the wait or if I should keep on bludgeoning people to death with maces set on fire.

>>53059553
I think Shooting gallery is going to help the wagon a lot. RAT 7 within 5" is pretty good, even if it is hurt by Momentum on the mount attack.

>>53059215
It would be extremely polarizing, OP against Horgle and the like, useless against Cygnar. I don't like army-wide hard counters. They're bad design. I get where you're coming from though and something in that direction would indeed be cool.

>>53059783
As someone who went with the other Limited Release faction (CoC) I wouldn't pick Grymkin as your primary faction. Not because they aren't good, but simply because if you get invested in them the lack of releases will eventually frustrate you.

Are the stats for Goreshade4 already released? Had seen people talking about him having revive and stuff, but couldn't find it myself

>>53060321

Warroom, or archive-binge- a kindly anon put up some images

>>53059433
>Well, that and she's a Seeker. She's kinda not on the 'Kill all humans' bandwagon.

Sylys is a Seeker too, and Thyron isn't a member of the Retribution either, he's just willing to fight with them to defend Ios.

>>53059390
Honestly, the GM of a IKRPG just needs to exercise their ability to trump the rules.

A human mage hunter is probably a silly idea as no Iosan is ever going to train a human. A Satyxis gun mage isn't because there's no reason why they couldn't be one.

>>53060321
He's on Battle College.

>>53058413
Anyssa Ryvaal is sometimes RAT9, as she's 7 base with Prey. Otherwise yeah.

>>53060850

>Honestly, the GM of a IKRPG just needs to exercise their ability to trump the rules.

Oh yeah. I'm not saying it's unplayable. Just that it has some annoying issues.

A Nyss Mage Hunter I could see these days though.

>>53060936

I think it'd be a Nyss that hunts mages- not the same thing. Class is among other things, deep background.

>>53057522
A dracodile just ate me and a party member last session :( I passed my PHY check to get out once he died, my friend didnt. rip

>>53061238

With the Nyss joining up with Ios/The Retribution I could see a nyss joining the mage hunters.

>>53061357

Yes, but they'd be a Nyss-generated character in the Retribution hunting mages and being called a Mage Hunter.

niggers

>>53058408
Thanks. I found the spoiler dump from a couple weeks back.. only ones I couldn't track down are Fane Knight Guardian and the House Ellwhoathere Swordsmen. Anybody have either of those cards / screencaps?

>>53061357
Nah. The mage hunters are trained from childhood. They're not going to take in outsiders, especially refugees from another country.

As allies? Sure, they'll do that. But no way they let Nyss into their secret club.

>>53058761
Warroom IS the successor to (an arguably better) community developed app. They're not going to go backward, even if doing so would actually be moving forward.

>>53062064
>They're not going to go backward, they'll keep stepping in the same spot.
FTFY

Dang, what is up with you players, you either have mostly bare plastic/metal armies with maybe one unit having three colors or having amazingly beautiful, fully decked out professional level paint jobs for the entire army that gives me legendary jealousy for days. There's no army in between from what I've seen with my experience of Warmachine/Hordes over FLGS and a few events I eyed.

>>53062549
I play fully painted and I paint like shit, so maybe I'm the exception you are looking for.

>>53062549
WAAC players don't paint. They post their armies during battle reports etc.

Painters paint well. They post their armies to share their paintjobs and receive validation.

Shitty painters paint at a mediocre level. They do not post their armies, because they don't bother with battle reports, and their paintjobs aren't worth sharing.

Nothing wrong with belonging to any of the 3 groups.

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>>53062549
I've been doing this for 12 years and I would like to think it looks good.

>>53063300
>tell me I'm pretty

>>53062549
>>53063300
Is this the point where we post our dudes

>>53063417
I wish my camera wasn't so offensively horrible.

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>>53058427
>7 points
>completely fuel a myrm and a half, or one marshalled myrmidon, every turn from 6" away
HAIL HYDRA

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>>53063393
Duh. Praise me more, you fuck.

>>53063417
Yes.

>>53063467
The struggle, I know.

Is Conflict-anon around? Bunch of CID updates hit last night/this morning.

>>53063300
Yeah, that looks pretty good, but the point is where are the average/middling paint jobs?

It really does seem like it's 99% of the first two groups
>>53062933
mentions

>>53063468
Also they're DEF15 to shooting, immune to blasts, and can if necessary wade in to knock things down.

They're amazing. The only real flaw in them is a flaw of Ret - i.e. they don't have any cheap enough heavies to do true jackspam.

>>53064029
It's actually tough to have bad painting in this day and age.

The lazyman method of giving everything a base coat and dipping the entire model in shade makes everything look good enough, especially from across a table while looking at the army as a whole.

So the only ones who have factually shitty looking armies, are the ones who either don't know about this method (yet) or the ones who are too lazy to fucking care.

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>>53063417
My contribution

>>53064147
So you have winter-themed, Vinter-themed Cygnar?

>>53064147
Nice. I usually see Cygnar either really dark blue or the studio bright. You are in between and I like that.

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>trying to do an inverse Cygnar Scheme with White Primary and Blue Secondary
>mfw trying to paint and highlight the white on the completely flat surface of the jacks
I've made a terrible mistake

>>53064340
Did you start with white white or cream?

If it's eggshell or cream, you can highlight still

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I am the mediocreist painter of all!

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>>53064495

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>>53064515

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>>53064539
And the shittiest camera

>>53064147
Hello fellow winter Cygnar player!

>>53064495
>>53064515
>>53064539
>>53064555
Throw some highlights on there, they're looking a little flat.

>>53064555
This one is really cool. I wish the Spriggan wasn't so utterly overshadowed in Khador.

>>53064589
>I wish the Spriggan wasn't so utterly overshadowed in Khador.
May I ask what happened to it?

>>53064587
I... I don't know how

>>53064602
it was popular in mk2 is what happened to it.
>19 points
>pow 18 weapon
>mat 6
>Ruin and Torch are both cheaper

>>53064638
Since you're new to it, just do some extreme edge highlighting:

1) Pick a panel to highlight
2) Mix a lighter shade of the color you used as a basecoat
3) THIN YOUR PAINT WITH A DROP OR TWO OF WATER
4) Paint a thin line at the edge of the panel, as if light is reflecting brighter off that surface, it also helps to differentiate between shapes.
5) Drink your paintwater

>>53064767
See, I think this is usually terrible advice for Warmachine because there's a bunch of shit where it's just flat surfaces with no edges.
GW's stuff has a lot more edges to make things pop out.

>>53064809
Works fine for someone new. They'll pick up techniques as they go. It's easier to learn than figuring out source lighting and proper highlights. Besides, drinking the paintwater is the most important part for inexperienced painters.

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I have a question:

Are human warcasters categorically unable to control warjacks created by elves and dwarves, and vice versa? If Ravyn told Stryker, "Here, bond to this Manticore," would he be able to do it?

>>53065026
In theory they could learn but it would be like flying an airplane and all the buttons are in Japanese and a different arrangement.

>>53065026
Haley can because she's a sue.

Cortexes have security codes that prevents people from using them at will.

>>53065128
>Haley can because she's a sue.

Are you just saying that or did that actually happen somewhere?

>>53065152
1.) She has a spell that controls Warjacks

2.) She controlled a Slayer to kill her Sister in fluff.

>>53065152
That's how she killed Denny. She took over a slayer which sliced Denny open and Denny made the slayer her favorite ie.Nightmare.

>>53065208
>>53065209
Oh yeah, I forgot. Also for some reason, I didn't include Cryx jacks in my idea of, "jacks made by non-humans."

>>53065152
>>53065208
>>53065209
It's basically written as "Haley is such a powerful warcaster that she can (temporarily) force her way through cortex locks". That includes foreign ones, even those made by different species or the undead.

>>53065026
Cortexes come with a cortex lock, which is a sort of password required to interface with the cortex. The password can be anything, from a series of images, to specific emotions, to tastes or even smells, or simply a sequence of code words. Without the code, the cortex can't be accessed without a long time to crack it or totally wiping the thing(which includes wiping all the stuff that makes it work).

As other have noted, Haley is capable of forcing her way through by sheer power, while Iron Mother Directx can do it both through power and by her sheer intellect(and the fact that her faction created cortexes).

Only Convergence jacks are different, because they have no cortex to connect with(in theory any warcaster can learn to use the Interface Node, but it's an entirely different skill than using a cortex) and Celphex shit, because it's still living with an actual brain.

>>53065504
The thing to remember here is that ultimately all cortexes are roughly the same at their core, because everyone took the initial invention and just used that. You'd never get an Iosan to admit it, but the cortexes they use are a distinctly human invention, as is the concept of warjacks.

Even Cryx stole the technology from the inventors once they were already dead.

>>53065026
There's no reason why a warcaster of any species couldn't control any of the warjack variants, assuming they've been given the correct permissions for their cortex lock.

A human warcaster would probably have to learn a few new mental tricks, since myrmidons have a different construction method and function a little differently, but they could bond with one. The same goes for the opposite situation.

>>53065542
Iosan jacks in general are more of if you expanded the cortex' function to the entirety of the frame. Which is where they differ from human warjacks.

What does a cortex even look like? Are there pic anywhere?

>>53065542
>Even Cryx stole the technology from the inventors once they were already dead.

That's kind of their thing, though. I mean they even cribbed the designs for their Helljacks off the Deathjack.

>>53065726
Shut up Ossyan no one cares.

>>53065726
So how do you think Rhulic 'jacks are different from human ones? Or are they just the same (but still better than the elves' because dwarf>elf)?

>>53066071
As far as we can tell they're the same. And worse than the elves'.

Rhulic heavies have less ARM, DEF, boxes and MAT than Khador jacks.

Why are dwarfs so awful at building things in this setting?

>>53066228
Dwarves actually produce magelocks. Cygnar/Llael actually has deals with them for that.

>>53066228
Because rhul doesn't do open warfare and those jacks are basically heavy duty tractors and bulldozer

>>53066228
With the exception of the Avalancher (which is built pretty much directly off the Driller chassis), the Rhulic 'jacks we see are actually labor jacks. We have yet to see what would happen if Rhul decided to give a shit about war, because for the last few centuries, no one has had the balls to mess with their country.

>>53066228
>Why are dwarfs so awful at building things in this setting?
Most of their R&D went into bunnies.

To be fair, a POW 18 weapon for 10 points is okay.

>>53066389
NO IT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH, MY WARJACKS ARE UNPLAYABLE, WHY CAN'T THEY BE 8 POINTS, MAT9, AND PS20? >:(

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>>53066334
>tfw no industrial purpose

>>53066448
I unironically hear players shit on the Nomad at my store.

I mean, come on. I know MAT 6 is a meme now, but 2" PS 18 for 11 points is super good.

Want to do some scenography for my skorne army (and when I play with friends at home). Is there a good picture on how skorne land look like? What sort of terrain should I make?

>>53066913
Desert and scrubland, maybe a few elf ruins because they were invading Ios for a while.

>>53066913
There's a huge area of Skorne terrain. Desert is the most obvious choice, but there's also some swamp lands and coastal regions. Plus, Skorne have been on campaign in winter areas and in forests.

>>53066559
The problem with nomads is that they don't have much to fall back on when they start taking hits even if they are cheap enough to spam. As soon as 1 system goes down, they are basically not a challenge for any decent unit.

Also no merc caster can force personal scariness like karchev so using them as pure trash spam doesn't work either.

Nomadic is just too balanced to be good

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Oh wow, I just realized that with Reinholdt's extra shot and two Assault Kommandos, Strakhov 1 can make a 6" cloudwall with his Cinderbombs.

You could even Stealth the unit beforehand.

>>53056109
Our group is on too it's 5th IKRPG/Unleashed campaign. We've found the game pretty fun so far. The out of combat stuff is pretty lightweight but gets the job done for the most part. The different classes are not balanced, basically at all with some builds being super dangerous and some others being pretty weak. Warjacks need help from the NQ extra rules to be worth using.
Warbeasts are a bit OP and will likely overshadow other characters if you aren't careful.
Don't worry about balancing encounters too hard to begin with, particularly early on and be aware that a co-ordinated party can be almost untouchable to certain types of fight. Spells like Dark Waters from Unleashed give an overwhelming advantage in a gunfight for example for an all aquatic party, or Fell call cacophony crushes casting enemies. If your player know in advance that the campaign will focus on one sort of fight and build to counter it this can lead to problems.
The GM will need to be ready to houserule stuff that doesn't work well, such as capping Def at 15-16 for starting tier or banning tailored plate armour to avoid party members becoming untouchable. Also the starting gobber and ogrun racials are shit and you should consider using the better ones from Wild Adventures.
Player characters basically do not die unless the party wipes. In 5 campaigns we lost 2 characters who got dropped and then left behind by the rest of the party when they ran and 1 character who went into the Blindwater swamp alone, without the survival skill who died of exposure and gators after about a week, mostly because the couldn't roll over a 7 at all.

>>53066913
The Skorne supplement for IK unleashed has lots of fluff for their homelands.

>>53068404
Isn't it great playing Warmachine and not Hordes?

>>53068404
It's even funnier with sentry on him. As soon as something twitches he can chuck another smoke and it doesn't bother him since has gasmask

>>53068487
Any link?

Reading for now it look like mostly desert, hills, and I guess some swamps.

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psshh... nice shooting... kid...

>>53068533
tfw you quit because you were the only hordes player in your meta.

>>53068533
>>53068648
I'm actually a little down, because I keep getting my ass kicked with Strakhov. He's not easy to play and I haven't figured it out yet.

So I started collecting Skorne back in MKII, but never got around to really playing. Now I'm thinking of picking it up again. Is this enough for some initial lists?

>Hexeris2
>Xerxis2
>Tiberion
>2 Agonizers
>Cyclops Shaman
>Bronzeback
>Titan Gladiator/Sentry/Cannoneer
>Basilisk Krea
>Paingiver Beast Handlers
>Cataphract Incindiarii
>Void Spirit
>Mortitheurge Willbreaker

Well, Soles can go eat a lemon whole.

I asked why it makes sense for a Tank to want to get into melee, and I got banned as a result.

I only posted multiple times because he DELETED my comment the first time so I thought the board had swallowed my post.

Anyway whats goin on at the Gun Carriage Cid? Designers still think it makes sense for it to be a Melee Piece?

>>53069928
You know I actually just looked at the gun carriage model and that thing doesn't look like a melee thing at all. It looks like...a gun...Carriage.

Them banning you seems super lame. Soles is a weird fellow. and Pagani is trying to act overly nice with his smiley faces over there. Creeps me out man

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>>53049383

Hey fellas. How the fuck do you make your metal models stay together? All these spindly bits, they break off if you look at them funny.

>>53070785
>You know I actually just looked at the gun carriage model and that thing doesn't look like a melee thing at all. It looks like...a gun...Carriage.

Yeah, I fucking KNOW. It doesn't even have a RAM. I could see a bison ramming you so hard you fly, but not horses.

That model is 90% Carriage and Cannons, but they want 90% of the rules to be in melee.

>>53070914
Magnets my friend. Sometimes a magnet for it to break off at the critical area means you just stick it on again.

>>53070785
Soles' eggshell ego is a bad thing for the game. His arrogant behavior is incompatible with the levels of humility, transparency, and communication required by an initiative like CID. Toughen up, buttercup; when you encourage feedback, you're encouraging people to question your decisions. Maybe his inability to take criticism will lead Wilson or whoever to fire him when it becomes clear he's the roadblock preventing CID from accomplishing its goals, and he can pursue his career as a (terrible/goth/edgelord) artist.

Side note: how the fuck do you consider yourself a professional artist when you can't handle the reviews of your work?

>>53070785
>Soles is a weird fellow. and Pagani is trying to act overly nice with his smiley faces over there. Creeps me out man

I prefer Paganis niceness too Soles whiny defensiveness. He really hates being questioned. He likes answering questions but hates being questioned.

>>53070961
Wait a second...Don't tell me. The art for the Grymkin...Is the art of Soles?

Also Please guys update me on

>>53070961
Wait...Was he the one that made the artwork for the Grymkin?

If so what an ego trip.

Also can anybody give me an update on the talk about the gun carriage?

Also is there anyway to bypass my ban so I can at least VIEW the development?

>>53070999
There hasn't been a lot of developments. Somebody posted a long thing arguing from the standpoint that it should be a frontline bruiser through its guns rather than the horses since the horses only pull it and aren't part of the armament, only the conveyance. I think it was received positively.

>>53071107
At least that's some better direction.

Still stupid overall, but best possible thing in the stupid hole they put it in.

Mind posting the long thing?

>>53070962
I'd wager that Pagani has been specifically instructed to suck tons of community cock because PP is aware that Soles will make a total cockwaffle of himself regularly and they're trying to offset it.

>>53071156
(Part 1)
"Hey PP, I'm not a Khador player but a long time Swan. I had a battle today against a new player (and new Khadoran!) at 75 points where we both had our respective engines on the table. I think because I was showing him the ropes we both got to digest what was going on and decide the best course of action for multiple models. I want to offer some thoughts from a non-Khadoran based on the intended purposes of the Gun Carriage. I don't have a dog in this fight but I saw some weird things on the table.

First, I really liked the direction PP was taking with the new Engines. As a tank, the Gun Carriage wants to dig in and disrupt the enemy. It's an offensive piece with range support. I don't disagree with this concept. But what I saw on the table wasn't that.

If you look at this thing's aesthetics it's a horse-drawn carriage with Guns. Guns. Big Cannons. The War Wagon has Buffalo, this has horses, which don't seem to be armaments so much as a means of conveyance. As such, abilities like Momentum and Line Breaker and Bulldoze strike me as bizarre. I'm fine with Trample, maybe even mount attacks; but slams seem weird to me. So too are the guns. If the Carriage wants to dig into the enemy lines with guns...geeze, weird right?

I spent some time just staring at the model. I started asking: "What did the Khadoran engineers intend this thing to do?" and "what are the guys inside this thing doing while it's, uh, horsing around?" "What are the guys saying to one another?" "how does the enemy view this thing?" I also asked myself "What does PP want this thing to do?"
Now, as a Swan I'm looking at this model asking myself: "What melee capability?" It just doesn't look like it has any, it's got some horses. Then I asked: "Is there a way to give it what Pagani wants and not have it be a melee model?"

I ran through a couple ideas that included:"

>>53071156
(Part 2)
"After a Trample or Charge attack, models within 2" become knocked down.
The benefits here seem obvious and mesh with the idea of this big rumbling carriage throwing up dust and smoke.

Flak Field - or a similar ability that triggers after/when the Heavy Cannons fire.
Again, another way to get players to get it in close and clear off the chaff. Those guns look big. Would an ability like: "When this weapon makes an attack, models within 2" suffer a POW7 blast damage roll."

I also toyed around with the idea of the Cannon getting an additional damage die on models in it's melee range but that struck me as too powerful, especially with Signs and Portents in the faction. Besides, they are "Cannons", not melee weapons, and such a rule seems to just be an attempt to circumvent what the model is by design.

The last thing that I thought from a fluff perspective is you have these guys in this thing and when they get in close would they be more panicked? Maybe they load the guns a little faster?

Which led me to something as simple as: "Once per turn, when this model is engaged in melee, it can make one additional ranged attack targeting a model in it's melee range." perhaps even "[ability name] can be used before this model advances."

Fluff wise, I imagine this swift carriage tearing up the battlefield and shooting and creating a mobile, mid-field gun enplacement. I hear the Winter Guard Officers shouting: "Follow the Carriage!" as it gallops to a position, shoots whatever is right in front of it, and follows through with several other shots. I do not imagine that Stormblades are overly concerned about being slammed by this thing, I don't imagine the horses as being fearsome melee combatants. I can, however, imagine the Carriage guys being stuck in melee, surrounded by Knights Examplar, and loading those guns just a little bit faster, cursing in Khadoran with cigarettes in their mouths."

>>53071156
(Part 3)
"In short, my two cents: You gotta give the guns some sort of benefit while in melee. Giving the benefit to the horses looks and feels wrong to me."

>>53071269
Thats what I said myself! I just didn't suck as much cock. I wasn't even disrespectful. I just didn't suck COCK.

Im happy at least somebody picked up the fight for me.

>>53071300
>I just didn't suck as much cock. I wasn't even disrespectful. I just didn't suck COCK.
rrrrrright

Can the gun carriage just remain the way it is at 25 boxes?

It's perfectly serviceable the way it is and any changes whatsoever will only not make me buy one.

>>53071300
To be fair to you, I don't think you should have been banned. To be fair to them, your posts (intended to clarify because you had thought the board had eaten it or no) did come across as just spamming the same question and ignoring their responses repeatedly. Not saying I think you should have been banned or that I think their direction for the Gun Carriage is sensible, simply that I understand why you were. Asking "Why does it need to be melee?" multiple times wasn't adding anything constructive to the discussion or getting the carriage closer to being workable.

>>53071344
Fair enough, but I actually mentioned that I thought the board had eaten my post just in case I was spamming by accident.

As in "Why Does it have to be in melee" it means allot. Like its role in faction, and their overall idea where it slots into Khador.

I was also On my phone. So maybe that wasn't a good idea because my thoughts came out simplified.

>>53071300
>I just didn't suck as much cock
Well there's your problem.

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>>53064495
>>53064515
>>53064539
>>53064555

That you paint your models at all is a good sign, in this game at least.
The camera has nothing to do with it, use a backdrop and good light and even a shitty 10 year old phone camera can produce descent stuff (pic related).

As someone has already stated, they look a bit flat, try to ad some highlights and wash to create shade. Use armyainter quickshade if you want a fast and good tabletop result.

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Is this a meme?

>>53071566
Pretty much, yeah.

>>53071566
[URAAAAA intensifies]

>>53070974
>>53070999
As far as I know, his medium isn't 2D drawn stuff. He prefers to create spooky-scary goth-rage teenager art out of various bones, rusty metals, and whatever other black things he finds laying around. He's basically a human incarnation of Cryx, and nowhere near as talented as HR Ginger (his obvious main influence). The man has a fucking cat skeleton on display in his office.

So while Grymkin may be Soles' love letter to himself, PP had other various artists do the heavy lifting while drawing from various folklore.

I don't hate Grymkin, they work as an absurd concept formed out of pastoral fears, but I hate what they represent: Soles' devotion to his own ideas, and a complete lack of willingness to pay attention to what most fans of the game/lore are interested in. Where is our age of exploration that has been teased for years now? Where is Zu? Where is a more grounded threat in the form of a new nation (other than Skorne) that has geopolitical goals opposed to the other main factions?

>>53071892
.....So is that why he has a skull as his CID Image?

Wow....Like THOUSANDS of Dollars worth of Cash Devoted to his own Ego.

I don't hate the Grymkin either, but they are a out of Nowhere faction to appease his own ego?

What a tosser.

>>53071944
>>53071892

Honestly, I keep feeling like Grymkin could have been an expansion for Circle Ouroboros rather than a full faction. They are already 'Spooky supernatural shit that eats people in the wilds' and super anti-Menoth.

Heck, the Old Witch used to be Circle.

>>53071944
Oh man, dubs, you should check out his deviantart page. You think he's a tosser now. It's a magical place, full of bullshit, skulls and autism as far as the eye can see.

mrsoles.deviantart.com/

>>53072414
Wew lad.

It's like Giger, except with skulls instead of genitalia and no actual artistic sense.

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>>53072414
J E S U S C H R I S T
Couldn't quite decide which edgy goth cliche to wear to the highway overpass full moon party? Why not be all three!?

>>53072492
>>53072527
In all honesty, I kinda want to remember the password for my old account I made back in the early '00s just to troll the shit out of him. Doubt he'd reply, though; last actual posting on his page was back during October last year surprisingly not during Halloween though.

How long has Jason Soles been with the Company?

>>53072414
This can't be real.

This can't be one of the people PP chose to represent them to the community.

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>>53072578
>ooooOOOOOOOOOOoooooo
Too scary for you, anon?

>>53072627
Autism levels that exceed the /r9k/ threshold do scare me, yes.

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>>53072578
Oh man, I couldn't make this up if I tried. I can almost feel the edge, and I'm completely across the country from PP HQ.

>>53069928
Welcome to CID. Feel free to give feedback, but it better be fucking positive feedback you asshat!

>>53069388
Feat early, even if it's not optimal, feat early, try to break the opponent's back as soon as possible.

>>53069928
And people here said that I was projecting when I said that Soles should not do any communications what so ever.

>>53070999
>Also is there anyway to bypass my ban so I can at least VIEW the development?
Make a new account. Or wait the .5 seconds it takes for the rules to appear here.

I'm a new player to war games in general so can someone explain to me how to highlight black?

>>53071477
Hey, what color mix are you using for your arcane channels? That's a sweet glow effect.

>>53072874
ctrl + s

Put what you want black in between the two spoiler boxes.

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>>53072874
I use darker black.

>>53072767
>And people here said that I was projecting when I said that Soles should not do any communications what so ever.

The Skorne community kind of figured that out, oh, going on a year now. He's a lot better in a back-and-forth but oh man, let him get going without anybody to bounce off of...

>>53065280
Not just Haley, lots of caster have a Dominate style ability.

>>53073271
Nope. The Iron Mother and Haley.

>>53073389
Oh, just those two? i thought it was more common. /shrug

>>53049383
So I'm getting into Warmachine/Hoards with some friends. I was going to play Khador and downloaded the rules from PP and got the Khador Command book.

The book is talking about Winter Guard being the backbone of the army's units, but I see no entry for them in the book. Do I need another book besides rules and Command?

>>53073618
the books are unnecessary because the models come with rules, but the "winter guard specific theme book" is supposed to come out after all the command books are out. You don't need to buy books for warmachine, unlike buying codexes in 40k.

>>53072567
A pretty long time, I don't think he's as bad as peolpe say he is. It's easy to focus on him because he does such a bad job of presenting himself, but in general like 80% of the things he says I agree with rules wise.

>>53072874
You highlight it usually with a grey or a dark green. There is a P3 color called Coal black that's very handy for highlighting it

>>53073647
So books are primarily for fluff then I take it?

>>53073647
Not anymore. Better buy the decks for War Room, otherwise you got to wait for PP to actually get their shit together and put the cards up online.

So how does Long Leash work with a spell like Rapport? Do you double the doubled range?

>>53074143
Yup. That's how it works.

>>53073926
They did say that they will make the cards free after LnL or I am mistaken?

>>53066071
I imagine the differences between Rhulic Jacks and human would be the usual difference between human and dwarven craftsmenship.

Which is to say that the dwarven one is probably heavier, better made, and harder to break. Likely practical and few frills, but very well made. Sorta like Khador jacks really.

>>53072767
I am usually underwhelmed with the damage output. Without a buff, a heavy can't really take out another heavy and Strakhov lacks buffs.

What's the point of getting the Alpha if nothing dies?

>Our current wording for what an in game effect is: An in game effect is something that a model has done. To use your examples, Both Bart's feat and Rasheth's castigate are both acceptable things to mark out. Passive rules such as counter charge, veteran leader, or death shroud may not be marked out.

>Admonition could be marked out, as it is an in game effect. Stealth could not.

>Finding loopholes here would be very helpful in tightening this definition!

> - Pagani

I always thought I wanted a definition for what "effect" actually means in the contect of WMH. But this definition is a fucking mess.

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>>53072874
Grey. You should try to find your preference with how grey the accents should be (some people go with straight grey for the contrast, others mix it 5:1 black/grey to be more subtle).

You can also paint whatever the black surface is with a really dark grey and smoosh black wash over it.

>>53056899
Honestly, the IKRPG basically IS a wargame. It works best if you look at it as a toolset for designing new models and narrative scenarios / campaigns. It doesn't lend itself to traditional roleplaying at all.

That's not to say you can't roleplay in an IKRPG game, of course. It just ends up feeling a lot like RP back in the AD&D days - the system is there to tell you how to break down doors, punch goblins, and take treasure. You're kinda on your own with the rest.

The best RP experience I've had in the IK wasn't using the official rules at all - it was with a group playing a FATE campaign (actually may still have been FUDGE at the time... this is a little ways back) ported from the old 3.5 Witchfire book.

What if Skorne had Primal?

>Cyclops Savage PS13 + Enrage + Abuse + Primal + Tag Team
That'd be pretty ballin.

>>53075685
>What if Skorne had Primal?
Then we could probably play into Amon.

>>53075707
What are you playing that struggles against him? Crusaders are threat 10", Dervishes are threat 11". Lots of Skorne casters have good game into Amon. The real problem is bringing a list that has both game into Amon, AND game into High Reclaimer.

>>53075739
AND Sevy2.

>>53075609
Is it? The general basis mames sense to me. Anything a player has to choose to activate or use can be marked and nothing that's 'always on.' It's not like you put a marker down for Flank or Fly right?

>>53076688
My point is that "something that a model has done" is ambiguous as fuck.

>>53076698
That's not what you said though. Yesn the exact wording needs work and you should tell them that. But, I'd say the intended definition they spelled out with those examples makes sense.

@All :

Any source to a pdf containing all available Theme Forces?

>>53070914
Gorilla Glue Gel Superglue.

>>53072874
Seconding other anons, grey usually is best. The right blue on edges also works.

>>53076991
Get warroom, you can check out all released theme forces without paying anything.

>>53077907

How do you keep it from expanding past the join?

>>53076953
I can see that. I'm just not sure basing rules on a difference that has not even been defined yet is kind of the wrong order of operations.

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PRAISE MENOTH!

>>53079455
Gel superglue does not expand. You are thinking regular gorilla glue

>>53075563
What khador heavies are you running that you can't cripple another heavy? Anything Juggernaut grade or higher should trashcan most jacks.

>>53081987
PS 19 without a free charge is not enough to trash a Stormclad or Skorne Titans or other Khador jacks or so on.

What if Skorne had Batten Down the Hatches?

After all, they can get it in the ikrg skorne warlock spell list

>>53081539
Nice! could be interesting also in exemplar theme force

>>53082014
Feat gives you a free charge.

>>53082493
You can't feat every turn.

>>53082736
So you feat when you need to.

Git gud.

Also I read some buffs just came out from CID.

Any information?

>>53082769
You don't feat for one heavy you fuck.

>>53083110
Just ignore him.

>>53083110
The Forge Seers and Jaws of the Wolf Really Play into his Strengths.

If your eally need extra hitting power, Marshalled Juggers Hit at Pow 21, or just can powerup your own jugs.

Assasins really like the speed boost so they can charge into better positions.

>>53083110
Then why are you complaining you can't kill the heavy? Do you need to kill the heavy or not? If yes, feat, if not, don't.

Is decision making that impossibly difficult for you?

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>>53082832
Here are Khador and Trolls.

>>53081539
and here is Protectorate

>>53081987
What exactly is Juggernaut grade or higher?
Kodiaks and Clams are all POW 16
Spriggans aren't taken
Character jacks are around POW 18, and much more expensive.

Nothing beats the Juggernaut for damage output for its points, and I agree that it doesn't reliably one-round colossals, skorne heavies, or other khador jacks.

>>53083401
Gotta say the dude who talked about how little sense it makes for the gun carriage to have so many melee abilities.

>>53083588
That was me. They BANNED me for a Month.

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>>53083401
>>53083588
>>53083648
CID is like a battle for the soul of WMH between Pagani and Soles.


I'm not sure where the other Wills fit in, but they do seem like neutral agents of chaos.

>>53083694
Sorry I was ONE of the guys.

I pointed out how it makes no sense for a tank to want to be in melee and how it visually didn't communicate a desire to be in melee.

Some other guy wen't into more detail.

I was still banned though.

>>53083694
It's more hungerford vs pagani with soles in the middle. Hungerford is the one fucking up all the rules and having this crazy casual shit in this game.

I'd bet 10 bucks it's him doing the random game length (and other equivalent bad ideas) shit.

Hungerford thinks it's cool that gale winds can remove terrain effects placed by TOs. That shit is so dumb even 40k players banned it

>>53085165
Shenanigans and things happening for happening sake is hungerford.
Stupid thematic shit is Soles.
Wrong info is Will.

>>53085469
3 months to develop Mk3 Hexeris1 is Soles.

>>53085528
Also "Block the Tank with infantry, and we mean Tank Tank. And MMO tank. So in both cases, it's doing the opposite of a tank" is Soles as well.

>>53085165
Random Game length is a good choice for a competitive game.

Elements of uncertainty are very important to a game's competitive mindset, no matter how much competitive players hate it.

>>53085823
Game already has enough end-game conditions without the battle randomly fucking ending after an arbitrary number of turns. It adds nothing to the game beyond occasionally completely dicking over someone who needed the game to not randomly end at the earliest possible moment.

It's something totally outside of player control. That is always bad.

>>53085823
Get the fuck out of here hungerford

>>53085926
>>53085961
I'm serious.

One of the issues with Warmahordes is a lack of enough random elements to alter the course of the game. This is why they're insisting on this whole limited measurement shit, to create uncertainty. It's a bad place to do it for all sorts of reasons, but they need something in the game to do that.

Random game length after a certain number of turns creatures pressure on the players to force engagement and encourages risky play rather than simply rely on long term statistics and numbers to finish a game.

Look at one of the current issues with SR, just staying a single point ahead while grinding down hard to turn 7. Lot of people don't like it, and random game length fixes it pretty soundly.

>>53086028
It "fixes" it like a shotgun to the head "fixes" brain cancer. All those cancer cells are super dead, that's the point right?

>>53086028
The current issue has nothing to do with turn length. The games are dragging because scoring/contesting dynamic is fucked. You can only go ahead in scoring if you are crushing your opponent which means that games are attrition games for most part and those naturally take the longest time.

>>53086057
So, then, what's the reason why random turn length is bad for competitive play?

Hidden info isn't inherently bad, tons of games rely on conditions neither player is aware of.

The random element to it isn't bad either, because you still have control over the situation to a degree. Sure, you have no control over when exactly the game ends, but you get 5 turns to ensure you're winning when the turn finally comes up.

It's like complaining about double 1s being an automatic miss, it's something entirely out of your control, and you can lose entire games on a random snake eyes. Does that make critical misses bad for the game?

>>53086028
>I can't win unless everything is decided by luck

Found the 40k player

>>53086179
Except everything isn't decided by luck, that's the point. It's not like you roll turn two and end the game there. you've still got at least five turns to close a game out before you have to even worry about random turns.

>>53086177
Because it doesn't add anything of strategic value beyond busy work of tracking turn number. It's nothing that either players can use for strategies. No one controls it, nor can anyone affect it.

>>53085823
No its not man, it's just...not. Every reasonable person knew that shit wasn't going to make it past CID. The fact that it was cut before the cycle even started makes me laugh.

The sad part is that even tried to run that one past us.

>>53086028
Random game length is a bad band aid to "fix" am inherently broken game system. Win by 6 is just broken in its nature. If we can just clock over to each other infinitely and nothing happens, it's a bad game.

Random game length IS a fix to that system. But that system is bad, so you're right but who cares, since the whole thing is shit.

I imagine them taking sr2017 out of the CID early, is because they're gonna do a complete rehaul, maybe even go back to first to 5. Or first to 6, which is what I would prefer

Also seemingly no actual competitive game has random game end. Chess, soccer, football, basketball, Counter-Strike, LoL, DOTA etc dont.

I haven't played magic in years but I imagine it doesn't either?

>>53086177
Inherently there's nothing wrong with it, but competitive players hate random things.
Nobody but competitive assholes play warmachine anyway, so might as well hold on to them instead of trying to introduce random shit that will scare them away.

>>53087741
Hi, my name is Phil T. Casual, nice to meet you.

>>53087741
Why do people always try to shit on wmh for being competitive assholes, we know.

We understand.

You go play your shitty game and let us play our shitty game.

PrivateerPress has given you the chance to design a new warcaster/warlock for your faction however, you must use the IKRPG/IK Unleashed system to build this character. You have:

>150 exp
>enough money to gear the character appropriately
>can use any legal combination of race/career
>any field marshal ability transfers over appropriately
>A feat can be any 4 cost spell (including those not available as an option), or 2 cost spell applied over the friendly faction models instead of a unit.

What do you build?

>>53087897
Focus 5 Nuala 2 with snipe and fury

>>53086028
It's one hell of a bad place to do it. We have random elements in the game. That's why we use dice. We also have ways to mitigate randomness via model redundancy and overcommitting. That is how you do randomness in games. As a calculatable and mitigatable risk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9bXOub_OGw
Gee Xekaar! How come the Skorne empire lets you take EIGHT Rhinodons?

>>53088975
Damn I'll watch that when I get home. That list simply cannot be any good.

>>53088975
Xekaar is arguably the worst option.

>Morghoul2 is a better Mortality lock
>Zaadesh2 nets them a Mat buff, Str Buff, Defensive Strike, Counter Charge and can cover them with clouds early game
>Naaresh nets them +3 str and arm and pain response
>Xerxis2 makes them faster, gives them a dmg buff and a hit/dmg buff on feat

>>53089657
And even then, none of these can even run that many Rhinodons without some frenzies top-off-2.

So anons, what would you like to see in your next warcaster/warlock? By that I mean, any archetypes/unit typing in particular you would like to see display the gift?

>>53090254
Hmmm...Well I would like a more Kayazy Themed Khadoran Warcaster. Old Witch 2 Feels like she will be a bust (BECAUSE GIMMICK)

And I know after her we get a MOW warcaster. All fine things.

Just to bring variety I suppose.

>>53090254
I think venators are the only group without a lock so far for Skorne.

>>53090581
Not for long.

>>53071566
Trade 1 rocket for a war dog and I'd run the fucking shit out of that then call it in the morning and set up another date.

>>53090254

Skorne: Venator warlock, chymist or apothecary-ish warlock. Maybe one of the ones that has something to do with the ghenzoul (or whatever it's spelled, basically skorne undead).
Maybe also a second female warlock.

Mercs: Gastonne2, kayazy warcaster (probably partisan Khador). Something other than 'dude-with-sword-and-gun' in general. Sometimes it feels like 90% of Merc warcasters is like that. Not that there's anything wrong with it, just that variety is the spice of life.

That or I need to finally assemble my Cephalyx.

>>53087897
Need to re get the book to do this. might in the morning.

>>53091726
What faction would you do it for?

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>>53087897
Did it a year ago for 100 exp for Khador warcaster/ kommando/arcmechanik/arcanist-greylord. Get some badass dude hwo was someont between Butcher, Zerkova and Nemo.

>>53091868
What was the spell list like

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Does that look like fun?

>>53090254
I would just like to finally get another model. They teased a new 'caster YEARS ago that would make the Conflux work, but still nothing. Not a peep.

t. salty convergence player who wants to throw money at plastic again

I think that with Arcanist unit Ret has become the best Jack marshal Faction in the game.

Under Elara a Marshalled Griffon hit at POW 19 and can go to full FOC.

It's not bad at all. With Forge of War you get the Marshal for free.

I mean you could do something like that :

https://conflictchamber.com/#b51b_-0hgx1g2w0w0w0v0v3y3y3y4L2w4L2whM

Retribution Army - 73 / 75 points
[Theme] Forges of War

!!! Your army contains a pre-release entry.

(Elara 2) Elara, Death's Shadow [+28]
- Chimera [8]
- Griffon [8]
- Hydra [15]
- Hydra [15]
- Manticore [14]
- Manticore [14]
Arcanist Mechanik [0]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
House Shyeel Artificer [0]
- Griffon [8]
House Shyeel Artificer [0]
- Griffon [8]
House Shyeel Arcanists [7]

All your Jack have Shield Guard, all your unit and solo are immune to Blast Damage thanks to Artificier bubble and you have 2x Griffon that can charge 13" away with POW 19 free charge.

That not bad at all.

>>53093345
>tfw got so salty as a convergence and cephalyx player that I never bought duplicate models, but instead used instant mold and cheap modelling putty mixed in with enough greenstuff to achieve high detail replicas
>tfw copied both infantry and warjack models.

>>53093408
I bought all my models secondhand and now that I'm trying to get the bits to make the quad 'jacks magnetized PP won't let me buy them but they won't send me them either. like. fuck man, are they seriously leaving me with the only option as either making them myself or buying them from a third party?

>>53093352
gross

>>53090254
Pyg riding a warbeast warlock.
Or just a Pyg 'lock.

>>53094293
>>53094293
NEW THREAD
SWIM OR DROWN