/WMG/ Warmachine and Hordes General

>>52951921
So, as of this, are Hexeris, Kaelyssa and Stryker the only warnouns to have actually killed another named warnoun?

>>52952148

Vlad! That so counts.

>>52952148
who did Stryker kill?

>>52952271
Terminus.

Also, almost forgot. Haley's got herself a kill count of one.

>>52952271
Hmmm.

It's dubious, but I'll allow it.

>>52950901
So they got a 2 point discount then. That's too good.

>>52952148
Carver killed/ascended Barnabas

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>>52952148
Vyros kind of killed Goreshade before he became Goreshade, but he's since gotten better.

>>52952271
Garik Voil

>>52952308
Terminus isn't dead, his body was simply broken. His soul was elsewhere and is fine.

>>52952688
Voil wasn't a warcaster or warlock though, just divinely empowered.

Also, Cryx Command in Zippyshare form.

http://www42.zippyshare.com/v/kAGpNygA/file.html

>>52952916
Technically the same can be said of all the warcaster kills.

>>52952995
Not really. Denny really was dead for a while, as was Zaal. Terminus has been "dead" for centuries and Stryker breaking his necromekanichal body only slows him down insofar as it takes time to make him a new one.

Bane Thread has closed. Lots of things to try out and experiment with. Looking positive overall for the Banes and the Bane Theme.

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I want Barnabus to come back on a huge base as big Devourer-powered godzilla thing.

>>52952434
>>52953161
I've been wondering about this.

There's no way PP will keep him Ascended, right? He's the face of the Congregation.

>Political tension in Cygnar
>Political tension in Protectorate
>Possible tension in Khador over Vlad marriage
>Possible tension in Is over Ghyrrshyld

Is PP gearing up to divide all the factions?

>>52953386
Cygnar's political tension is basically resolved.

>>52952949
sorry I fucked up the command link. Will try to be better next time.

>>52953386
I think they're gearing up to divide the Protectorate and Khador.

Cygnar's internal issues have been resolved and I doubt many Iosans are going to tell their two remaining gods that they can't offer forgiveness to whoever they please. In fact, the elves seem to be undergoing a unification of sorts, what with the Nyss returning.

So wait I'm confused, which one is the Starscream again?
Feora or Kreoss?

>>52954139
Feora

>>52954155
So what does that make Kreoss? Soundwave?

Anyone know what the new Shyeel guys do?

Aside from throwing even more Empowered around, that is.

>>52954139
Feora.

Kreoss is to my knowledge best example of "Good Guy Protectorate" that isn't also disliked by protectorate high command.

>>52954164
If I'm remembering old transformer corecttly, kinda. Basically Kreoss is a slightly nicer man than most of the high tier Protectorate, though not Paladin level. However, he is an exemplar and as such he must obey the Scrutators and especially the grand scrutator. Son he obeyed Sevvy 100% even if he was reluctant sometimes. The Final MK 2 book shows this off very welln where he's uncomfortable betraying the Khadorans and when Durst charges in to help, Kreoss toes the line to persuade Sevvy to give the order to join the battle. Despite wanting to help, if Sevvy hadn't changed his mind then he would have sat on that hill while Durst's force was killed.

Goreshade coming back to life and ditching the "Kill all gods to save my race" thing was the dumbest shit, killing him would have been a better end to his plotline than this garbage.

>>52954309
I think Goreshade being forgiven and becoming redeemed was cool. The search for the true way to save his people is more interesting than him just being an edgy atheist shitter.

>>52954358
He was never not an edgy asshole, he dashed his newborn nephew's brains out just to prove a rhetorical point while he was still alive.

This is like blatant 180 degree character reversal.

I have a 37 point khador force I usually run sorcha1 with.
How easily does a new warcaster slot into an army?

Its all the khador I have so I don't have wiggle room, but I got an Oleg Strakov model cheap off of a friend and was looking to try him.

Anything one should know jumping from sorscha to strakov? Also, didn't he get a new model or something?

>>52954416
I thinks its more of a case of why him?

So many great heroes died, and so many people unfairly got devoured by the cryxian armada.

But Goreshade Kills babies when he IS alive, but he gets forgiven because? And surrenders because?

But the 4 Makes me worried that the Old Witch may one day return to Circle.

>>52954416
Yeah but he did it for a reason and he's one of the only people in power who were doing shit about the soulless problem. Even when he went epic the first time he was confronting Nyssor because he thought it would save the elves.

>>52954416
He went through his whole life an unlife fully believing that his edgy atheism was the only way to save his people. He gets right to the end of his quest and right when he's about to commit double deicide, the gods wake up and show him how he's wrong. His whole being is remade by this revelation and now he's working towards redemption while still trying to solve the whole soulless problem, only now he's on the true path: the path of the seeker.

>>52954416
I get the impression that he's still a huge dickhead.

Really, the only thing that's changed is that he's finally gotten the approval and vindication he was looking for. Nyssor ans Scyrah have basically said he's their chosen agent, and presumably shown him the ways in which he was right and the ways in which he was wrong.

He hasn't actually changed all that much as a character. Goreshade was always in the game for his people's sake, though he was too proud and deluded to believe that he could be wrong about his methods. He's just been given the validation he always wanted, from the highest sources it could possibly come from.

>>52954309
t. cryxbabby

>>52954309
Go to bed Vyros.

Looking forward to reading what's in the Scyrah Command book.

>>52954202
The last line of their blurb ("manipulating kinetic force for both offense and defense") and their battlemage breastplates give me the impression that they might have the standard Shyeel +2 vs ranged and immunity to blast damage, but it's just a guess until I see the card.

Since stealing heroes from cryx and making their characters radically change in character is cool now, how long till Asphyxious realizes he's being a cunt and goes back to being a druid for the Circle?

>>52955217
cry some more cryxfag

Are there any decent Nyss Hunter proxy models out there? I'm hyped about the Nyss getting all these goodies, but I'm not spending $50 on a box of lumpy goblins.

>>52954309
t. Dawncuck Vyros

I'm convinced that Skorne is still shit. Maybe the problem is we don't have theme lists. I played the Iron Fang theme today, felt really fucking bad playing against a bigger list full of better models than mine. Threat 11", MAT7, PS13, with shield wall to get up the field. I'm sorry but what infantry does Skorne have that comes CLOSE to that?

>>52955768
Uh, bring Void Spirits and murder the entire army in one turn?

>>52955792
>Bring Void Spirits
And if he fields Karchev instead? This is my major complaint about Skorne. We're a faction full of answers to problems our opponents might not actually field. Hindsight is 20/20.

>>52955810
Well and what if he does and bring the anti-Karchev list instead?

List chicken is never an advantage for either side, it sucks for both parties.

>>52955831
So in a Steamroller he just fields Karchev anyway because my other list probably can't crack that much ARM, and Mordikaar certainly can't. At the moment I'm debating buying into Zaal1 + Immortals just because it feels like a problematic list for opponents. Infantry that isn't ARM17+ crossing the table just doesn't cut it.

>>52955885
To add to this, Mordikaar is a complete non-warlock in Steamrollers. Even against infantry spam, it has to be the RIGHT infantry. Undead infantry? You don't get a bonus dice to hit and damage. Construct infantry. You don't get bonus dice OR your 8" teleport. It's not even like flipping a coin with him, it's worse than that. I really want to like Mordikaar I really do, but DAMN son.

Have we had any fluff with Ossyan since Goreshade came back to life? At this point he's going to eclipse Harry Kim in 'Nothing good happens to me'

>>52954703
>>52955297

Someone is being a salty Sally over the latest justice for Cryx. What's wrong, can't beat better players anymore?

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>>52955973
Oh god, that's too accurate. Gets talked down for being the guy taking the initiative, his accomplishments go unnoticed or overshadowed, it takes severe tinkering with time itself to keep his life from being a complete failure...
>inb4 Helynna develops a nasty case of arcantrik radiation sickness that erases her existence from reality and also makes Ossyan's dick glow for the rest of his life

>>52954482
We don't want her. One thing I like about circle is we don't really have "joke" models like the troll pygmys or the old witch of the west riding a walking robot house.

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>>52954202
>>52955205

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>>52956266
I don't know why I'm the only one here who is sharing cards

>>52956261
>old witch of the west riding a walking robot house.

You mean Baba Yaga and her chicken leg house? That's...not really a joke model at all.

>>52954482
Old Witch? I want Tartarus 2 in Circle.

>>52956261
>we don't really have "joke" models

One of your warlocks is a tree.

>>52956266
>>52956278
Unf, I like it. I still want a Mechanik or two around for Concentrated Power in a lot of lists, but those Battle Mage elements and +3 RNG on Empower are pretty sweet.

>>52955768
>>52955792

Or they don't bother be cute and shove Zaal2 and All the Immortals at you.

>>52954041
No problem man. It's in the OP so it's not a fuckup. I just know not all people like or have Dropbox so I figured I'd toss up the other format in case people were interested.

>>52953205
Why wouldn't they? Old Witch and Wurmwood are both deity level characters in the fluff and are present in the game. Haley3 as well arguably.

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>>52956316
HOW DARE YOU MOCK THE DARK AND INSCRUTABLE TREE OF FATE!

TREE CURSE!

>>52956266
>>52956278
These are most definitely the best part of Ret Ramadan.

6" Empower is fucking amazing, and two units of these can pretty much power an army. Forges of War is looking pretty fucking viable right about now.

>>52955973
>>52956249
Isn't this good for him?

The gods have basically decreed that everything Goreshade and House Vyre did is forgiven. Ossyan's entire thing is trying to redeem House Vyre.

Vyros is the one who has real reason to be salty. He hates Goreshade and pretty much built his career on being the guy to defeat him. He's aiming for the job Goreshade used to have too, so he must be pretty furious that the dude is not only back, but back with the explicit blessings of Scyrah.

>>52956405
As powerful as Old Witch and Wurmwood are, I don't think either is a match for any of the real deities of Caen.

Wurmwood after all is just one aspect of the creature that Menoth spends all his time kicking the shit out of.

>>52957009
>Forges of War is looking pretty fucking viable right about now.

Come to think of it... aren't Battle Mages basically perfect infantry right now? They're hard to with shooting, they straight up ignore the blast damage that is annihilating hordes right now, and they have attacks with good POW and useful effects.

Why don't we see more of these niggas around?

>>52951921
Is Severius kill?

>>52957068
>Vyros is the one who has real reason to be salty. He hates Goreshade and pretty much built his career on being the guy to defeat him. He's aiming for the job Goreshade used to have too, so he must be pretty furious that the dude is not only back, but back with the explicit blessings of Scyrah.

Just goes to show that even when there is no justice, there's justice.

>Ah, Vyross. You've spent a solid generation systematically eroding the Iosan power-structure, legally and religiously, so that you can soon plant your ass down into the dictator-shaped hole
>guess who stole your seat at the very last moment

>>52957264
Yep
rip

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>>52957316
How'd he die?

>>52957364
Herexis gibbed him

>>52957068

Ossyan devoted his life to redeeming his house and has gone through hell trying to prove them after Lord arcanist babykiller was cast out. Now it's turning out that the guy who nearly died trying to save the God from cryx gets to watch the necromancer who nearly killed him become the champion of the gods he was trying to kill. It's a sick, sad joke of a world for Lord Arcanist Harry Kim.

>>52957364
Actually, this.

Did Hexeris just charge him and kill him?

Was this at Imer? How did the Skorne get there so quick, aren't there any forts or cities on the way? Sometimes it seems like there's no battles in the IK that don't take place at a famous fort or city. There's a lot of sieges, but we rarely see the Warmahordes equivalent of the Somme.

>>52957555

Hexeris was going to just push his army over the walls of the Tower of Judgement because it's garrison had been depleted as part of an unrelated Feora machination (Ios 2.0 there, kind of). Sevy showed up out of nowhere with a relieving force going on Tristan's visions. Sevy and Hexy get into a fight, Hexy almost pulls off a "yoink! got your soul!", but Tristan ruins it. Then Sevy fires up Ye Olde Light of God and most of the Skorne army is burnt to ashes and all the Menite dead from the battle up to that point resurrect. Tristan observes that for a race of conquers, the Skorne really are damned good as fighting withdraws- practiced, even. Sevy has a meaningful death scene (tm) a bit later. Technically that just kicks off the plot.

>>52957656

So even when the skorne win they lose.

You know which Model I want to see get a 4 Version?

Haley.

As a 1 Point Mercenary Solo (Works for all factions sans Cygnar), whose only ability is to attract all fire at her.

After Cygnar finds out that the mary sue gains all her power by draining all of her surrounding casters of anything interesting, she's summarily kicked out of faction.

I think she singlehandedly makes Cygnar 90% more blander.

>>52957864
Haley4

Now with loli Haley, Haley past, present, future, and ~ara ara milf Haley. w/ futa haley as an attachment.

>>52956316
But it's a very serious tree.

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>>52956294
Not a joke at all he says. Some legends look dumb.

>>52953088
Deneghra really wasn't dead for long at all.

>>52957687

Imer gets a much more thorough fucking, but it isn't really Skorne's book.

>>52952148
Asphyxious sent Terminus to Urcaen once. Vlad killed the Harbinger.

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>>52958025
>what kinda dumpy ass king even uses a sword from a lake hahaha like nigga isn't that shit rusty
>ayy why'd they cross his legs before nailing them to that cross, where's that nigga supposed to pee like that
>yo how's this bitch puttin Osiris back together when he's all in pieces and shit, like nigga super glue ain't gonna work

>>52958135
>Vlad killed the Harbinger.
Didn't she get better though

>>52954645
In Escalation he didn't seem to care about his people anymore.

So what happened to Tartarus? Was he killed in Ios?

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>Halberdiers get Advance Move
>Stormfalls and all solos get Reposition [3"]
Rate my theme trash

>>52955768
Not necessarily. We just can't attrition versus Khador (not 100% convinced of this, need to try out a few things first). Which is okay, attrition is their thing. It's just a bit worrying when SR17 is supposed to shift the focus massively in favor of attrition.

>>52958664
fast/10

>>52958916
In fact let me revise my statement. We can play some fair attrition against Khador, but we cannot rely on it in a list pairing as the plan just falls flat vs. Protectorate which offer similar problems.

>>52952148
Goreshade almost killed Vyros and Ossyan
Vyros is the reason Goreshade is an eldritch
Abby almost killed Naaresh
Vlad killed Harbinger
Vindictus captured Vlad
Kromac almost killed Borka and Madrak
Venethrax was gonna fuck Everblight's waifu till he gave Abby the powers to run away
Rhyas almost killed Thagrosh and killed a dragon
Xerxis almost killed Grayle and Kaya and killed an Iosan warcaster
Kreuger attempted to kill Lortus and got his shit fucked
Mohsar teleported an entire Skorne contingent including warlocks (notably Mordikaar) away iirc
Baldur had his shit pushed in by Lylyth
Asphyxious killed a lich lord and sent Terminus to the void
Haley fucked up a bunch of people, Deneghra included
Stryker fucked up a fair number of people, Terminus, Magnus and Voyle included
Caine almost killed Macbain, and killed a king and a merc warcaster I can't remember the name of
Karchev killed Cathmore
Sloan almost killed Karchev and Irusk
Deneghra fucked up Karchev and I think Strakhov
Kaelyssa killed Zaal and fucked up Zerkova
Butcher fucked up Siege
Terminus held his own vs. Damiano and Kreoss
Vinter fucked up Makeda for days
Hexeris killed Kallus and Severius
Magnus killed Vinter
Carver killed Barnabas and fucked up Midas

I think that's about it.

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>>52957241
They can't really kill much by themselves, and if you're jamming with them things are not going well.
Still my #1 dudes though

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Rest in pepperoni, Warmahordes

>>52959406
>Abby almost killed Naaresh
If Naaresh had his Mk3 feat, he would've killed Abby.

>>52959406
I thought Vlad didn't finish her off at the last moment.

>(Makeda 2) Supreme Archdomina Makeda [+27]
- Archidon [10]
- Basilisk Krea [7]
- Molik Karn [19]
Paingiver Bloodrunner Master Tormentor [4]
Paingiver Bloodrunner Master Tormentor [4]
Tyrant Rhadeim [9]
Legends of Halaak [8]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Praetorian Swordsmen (max) [13]
- Praetorian Swordsman Officer & Standard [4]
Praetorian Swordsmen (max) [13]
- Praetorian Swordsman Officer & Standard [4]

>(Rasheth 1) Dominar Rasheth [+28]
- Agonizer [6]
- Basilisk Krea [7]
- Mammoth [38]
- Titan Gladiator [15]
- Aptimus Marketh [5]
Extoller Soulward [3]
Mortitheurge Willbreaker [4]
Paingiver Bloodrunner Master Tormentor [4]
Swamp Gobber Chef [1]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Praetorian Karax (max) [11]
Swamp Gobbers Bellows Crew [2]

Okay guys it's time for me to stop playing bad lists.

>>52957943
wtf I love Haley now

>>52962927
He did.
In order to deny Asphyxious her soul.
Then Testament found her and brought her back iirc

>>52956278
This guys with Rhan are fucking good.

COC THEME LIST WHEN?

someone to play online when?

>>52963763
niggers

>>52957864
I've never really found Cygnar bland. They're the token good guy faction, but they have a lot of cool characters.

Nemo, along with Goreshade, is one of the few Warmahordes characters that feels like a real person.

>>52957943
>loli Haley
>ara ara~ Haley

Shit, looks like I'm getting on with playing/painting my Cygnar.

How is Haley3 without Trenchers?

>>52959406
Does Vlad v Harbinger really count?

IIRC she pretty much let him do that.

Wait a minute.

Is the Fane Knight Guardian not a caster attachment?

Fuck, that makes him great.

>>52965003
Wait, no, War Room error.

It's totally a caster attachment.

>>52959406
>Kreuger attempted to kill Lortus and got his shit fucked

Which book? Also, you forgot Vindictus vs. Feora.

>>52958106

There's some interesting scenario ideas in there, though. Skorne's forces inside Imer only have Cyclops for warbeasts (the nature of the breach kept everything else out), and they're drowning in a sea of Zealots.

>skorne's raiding forces have to bring along Reptile Hounds to feed menite babies to
>dead scenario

>>52965309
Wrath of the Dragonfather. Lortus decided that Kreuger's 'dragonblight the leylines to find Everblight' was one fuck up too many. Kreuger survives because of the Wurm breaking in to Caen forcing the omnipotents to go deal with it.

>>52957656
Where are y'all getting this from?

I wonder if Cylena will go epic as a Retribution warcaster.

The "what if" warcasters they made back in the day teased the fact that she has dormant warcaster talent.

>>52965569

Godless, you'd figure.

>>52963865
>I've never really found Cygnar bland. They're the token good guy faction, but they have a lot of cool characters.

They don't ever struggle with anything and if anything good happens to a faction, it happens to them.

If Khador wasn't an aggressor it would be the much cooler good guy. Sans that its got WAY cooler characters that have to struggle every moment for what they want to achieve.

Cygnar just doesn't really STRUGGLE with internal problems that are not obvious

>>52966212

Well, defense is virtuous. They were on their back-foot constantly until recently. Now everyone else is, and they have the strength to spare to finally be absolute assholes.

>>52966212
What are you even on about?

Khador has had zero internal struggle until recently and has had the easiest time ever taking massive swathes of land. Cygnar have constantly been losing ground and beset on all sides throughout the fluff.

>>52966212
I know my side of the Motherland vs Southern Dogs argument, but Cygnar in the fluff has been bumfucked since forever.

The Protectorate, Khador, Cryx, Skorne, butthurt Trolls and this whole "who gets the crown?" business have damaged Cygnar notably.

>>52965702
It would be kinda weird being locked out of Nyss Hunters because you're already using Cylena as your 'caster, unless they reworked the unit's card somehow.
Still, it would be pretty cool to have a Nyss theme someday. I can hear the Legion players shitposting furiously on Facebook already

>>52966212
Well, luckily for you, Cygnar is about to become the interesting aggressor real fuckin soon. Let's hope Vinter's vicious cunt gene didn't skip a generation.

>>52968241
He's already started Project REMOVE KHADOR

>>52968367
I wonder if any of the named Cygnar casters are going to stop and think, "Wait a second, maybe we're the baddies, even though we're only conquering a barren snowy Orgoth-wannabe shithole."

It's something I could imagine Stryker and Haley doing, but Magnus has already gained too much power for them to oppose him.

I wonder if Irusk finally gets his head chopped off, since he failed the Empress a second time.

>>52968428
So far they're just retaking Llael.

>>52968475
Technically Ayn failed herself.

She signed a treaty with Julius when it became clear that his army was no longer tied up and could pish back, removing her forces from Cygnaran territory to legitimize Khador's rule over Llael, on the condition that Khador is only considered the rightful rulers if a true heir to the Llaelese throne never appears. Right after she signed it Julius revealed that his agents had saved Kaitlyn di Martyn, heir to the Llaelese throne, from Khadoran assassins, and that therefore Khador no longer had any right to Llael.

>>52968560
Yeah, but the book also says that Ayn now disregards that treaty, so it's back to Khador and Cygnar fighting over Llael while Ord does jack shit and Cryx poses ominously.

>>52968642
Well yeah, she was never gonna just hand it over.

>>52968428
>The "Make Cygnar Great Again" crew
Magnus
Caine
Maddox
Kraye
Sloan
Darius (?)
Ossrum2, Cygnar Partisan

>The "Julius, are we the Baddies?" bunch
Stryker
Haley
Brisbane
Nemo
Jakes
Darius (?)

>>52963763
Your theme list is called ADR.

>Play the new SR 2017 packet
>I play in 3 games, buddies also 3 games each
>Every game went to deathclock

Is this the future?

>>52969660

Yes.

>although who knows, maybe CID will actually count for something in that area.

>>52969660
I don't think playing for scenario is an option in any of the new scenario options. Having to win by 6 over the opponent ruins any chance of the scenarios being live. This heavily rewards attrition and assassination strategies.

>>52969660
>>52969761
I honestly think even 3 points ahead would be too much.

>>52969761

That part isn't so bad. It's just anybody is bound to be good at least one of these three things- Making you use your clock, keeping his army intact, keeping his caster alive. Any one of those gets the game to 7 turns or (you) bust. It's either a baby-seal clubbing or a slog.

>>52969660
>>52969701

You guys are just really fucking slow. I played in a 14 player tournament that went 4 rounds for SR2017 CID, only one game in the entire tournament went to deathclock.

>>52964211
Vlad is a Mennite so him killing his own Messiah is a pretty big deal. The battle was more with himself than her so I'd say it counts.

>>52969835
>>52969761

The 2016 meta (and realistically, the entire Mk2 meta before it) heavily favoured a big alpha strike that rode on the back of a powerhouse feat/combo to gain a large amount of momentum to hit 3 CPs in one turn.

This big alpha would force their opponent to stabilise or spend a turn muddling through the effects of shit like a Denny/Haley feat turn while the alpha striking player would either simply cruise to victory by mopping up another easy 2 CPs off safe dominations, or would force their opponent to bleed themselves dry by hurling assets in over extensions to just contest far objectives.

This kind of meta heavily exacerbated caster power level disparity, favouring casters with L O L go fuck yourselves power feats like Haley2, or casters like Skarre with incredible throughput and alphastrike potential. It also made the concept of a reactionary army/list weaker by design. Factions, animi, spells built around helping an army/model absorb damage and then react through counterattack inherently weaker than they should be. Even if the abilities worked as advertised, too often you would find the army losing purely on scenario.

So enter the 2017 design goal. CPs are designed to force a fight without prematurely ending a fight. Because the game doesn't threaten to instantly end on scenario over one single alpha strike it lessens the effect of casters with power feats/combos and allows for far more skirmishing and trading between armies.

Positive effects I've seen so far is it increases the amount of viable casters, and control casters focus is moving the control effects to facilitating creating opportunity for their army to actively fight rather than just cheesing out CPs.

>>52965518
I hope that if we ever get to field Lortus on the table, he's a lot more impressive than Mohsar even though Mohsar is technically supposed to be stronger than he is.

>>52970659

cont.


Additionally it has opened the option of retreat or repositioning models. I have had games where Ferox spend most of the game barely out of my deployment zone racing back and forth between either flank with the goal of zoning models away with their threat range to create room for other models to move, or alternatively baiting other models to try and chase them or intercept them.

Compared to 2016, there is a constant impetus to drive forward and only forward. Your only option is to attempt drive home a big alpha strike otherwise you put yourself in the position that you will take the backseat on scenario and quite possibly lose to it.

I've found 2017 to be much better than previous SRs. There is a far bigger focus on piloting your army to fight and the game is slower in the sense that it gives more chance for you to maneuver and your opponent to maneuver in response, there is more back and forth, more action and reaction between the two players.

I've found the back and forth between the two players rather than one army just looking for a big alpha strike sperg attack far more fun and rewarding so far.

>>52970800

cont.

I will end this with saying that 2017 hasn't fixed jackspam shit like Karchev and Amon lists, but I wouldn't expect it to. Realistically that's something that needs to be looked at between offering shit like free focus, lots of free shit and points from tier lists and giving it to casters with shit like Mobility and Synergy PP have just fucked up in the balance department and created certain casters that are able to benefit from too many bonuses at once.

>>52967285
>What are you even on about?
I don't mean that "Khador is Internally Divided"

I mean that Cygnars "Power Caster" is a Mary Sue thats so awesome she gets time powers and magics through any struggle she has.

Khador has a guy who refuses to die out of sheer force of will and love of da modaland.

This isn't a purely Khador thing either. Retribution, Trolls, Circle, are all more compelling because they are sort of bad guys with their own reasons.

But Cygnar lacks a hook. They just tech tech harder then they ever tech tech before.

>>52970874
Well then post your positive reaction on CID. Otherwise, your voice won't be heard.

>>52970800
>>52970874
>>52970659

I kind of agree..I guess..maybe..meh.

The worst kind of win in this game is deathclock. It's not a satisfactory end or conclusion to a game that's lasted 2ish hours.

Why they are encouraging this I have no idea.

>>52971302
The most interesting characters in Cygnar are the non-warcasters. Julius is fucking great, as is Leto.

Personally I don't find many Khadoran casters interesting at all. They're mostly all just some variant of super loyal Russian military guy.

>>52971302
Cygnar's hook is being babby's first powerhouse army on the tabletop.

>>52971508
That's why we have Sorscha, Zerkova, and the Witch, not to mention Ayn. Khadoran males are dull as spoons.

Someone link me to the Bane CID pdf.

If Skorne gets an exalted theme list I think Zaal1 will become one of the best lists in the game. Man I wish PP weren't laughing at Skorne with that pathetic Venator theme. Any ideas when we're even getting ours?

>>52971413
Look I completely agree on the clock not being a satisfying end to a game, but nobody can really do anything about that. The reality is tournaments and events need a timed format and there's no way around this.

>>52971593
KARCHEV SMASH YOU. THEN BUTCHER WILL SMASH YOU. THEN VLAD WILL MARRY YOU AND SMASH YOU.

Irusk will just watch while Strakhov also watches, but from within Irusk's shadow.

>>52971593
Sorscha is so much more boring than Butcher, Vlad or Strakhov.

She has been around since mk3 and we still barely know anything about her. Butcher actually has a really good book.

>>52965702

That would make RPG stuff kinda entertaining.

As right now, Nyss are forbidden from being Warlocks or Warcasters (Unless they are corrupted).

It is sorta an annoyance I have with the RPG. Unless it turned up on the Tabletop it's basically untouched. So we don't have any odd warlock or warcaster traditions unless people buy it as a TT faction.

>>52971302
>Well then post your positive reaction on CID. Otherwise, your voice won't be heard.

Feedback has been given.

>>52972021
mk1*

>>52971508

Alt-Universe Leto was honestly really cool and I kinda wish that was the main universe at times.

That and hey, Trolls would finally have a good ranged focused caster.

>>52967905
As a Legion player, I'd not be mad about Ret getting a Nyss theme. The new models look nice. I'd also like a real Nyss theme in Legion though (Children of the Dragon rework when?)

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>>52971612

>>52972475
Arigathanks gozaimuch

>>52971815
Around october.

>>52972501
You better be LITERALLY taking the piss. First I had to wait months just for my faction to be ported over to Mk3, and now I have to wait months before other people stop pasting me around with their stupidly powerful theme lists that I can't compete with?

>>52972023
To be honest, mate, a good GM for IKRPG plays fast and loose with racial restrictions like that.

For example, IIRC Satyxis are barred from being Gun Mages, despite there being an actual Gun Mage Satyxis unit.

>>52970874

All this is true... and then people lose on time.

I predict the unintended consequence of this particular flawed masterpiece is jack-smash warlocks to the fore- we have not even begun to see big alpha strike sperg- only, it'll never stop after one turn.

>>52972545
Well that's when we're getting the command book. After Grymkin. I mean, it could also be September, but I certainly don't expect it before that.

>>52972374
A Nyss theme would also give Defenders the tiny boost they need to be worth it over Sentinels. Right now, they're situationally sturdier at the cost of a significant damage drop.

>>52972545
Nope, that's the expected timeline. On the plus side, it'll go through CID so hopefully we won't end up with shit like the Legion lesser warbeast theme.

>>52972657
>On the plus side, it'll go through CID
Command books don't go through CID, unless otherwise stated. Do you have any source on your claim?

>>52972567

>To be honest, mate, a good GM for IKRPG plays fast and loose with racial restrictions like that.

Yeah, the issue tends to be (Especially with Warlocks) that it often involves homebrew. They were really opposed to making a generic 'Warlock' class so anyone who wants to be like the multiple already existing minor warlocks is shit out of luck.

I do like the RPG but I think they cleave a bit too close to the TT at times.

>>52972570
That's the thing though they shouldn't be losing on time like this.

14 player tournament, with several jackspam lists. There was 1 clockout and it was a Cygnar player using Stryker2 Storm Division against my Xerxis1 list, and that player has a reputation for being slow in all game systems he plays.

The jack smash shit is a problem, I agree, but it's a separate problem. It was a problem in the previous SR and will continue to be a problem in the next SR.

It's not the SR format that's causing this issue it's just the jack lists are flat out too good and need a nerf, they were over buffed with the Mk3 transition and it's only been exacerbated by giving them access to stupid tier lists (while other factions have fucking terrible ones).

tl;dr PP need to git gud at model balance.

>>52972680
Not a reputable one.

The pdf doesn't have Bane theme list, is that online somewhere?

I think the easiest way to fix jackspam would be to limit the number of jacks that get free focus from power up.
Only like 2-4 every turn.

>>52973031
Or to balance those jacks.

>>52972021
Sorscha is likely going to do something drastic in the mk3 story. She's growing tired of being a cuck to Ayn.

>>52973062
And how would they do that?

Trying to do something with the new units that isn't in theme.

This looks pretty good. The Arcanists can keep those warjacks fully fueled from way, way away from the front lines and can wade in to knock things over if necessary. Hemera provides a hugely useful arc node and her gun is actually pretty legit. The Spears harass from the sides and basically deliver Eiryss while acting as bodyguards for her.

DiscoSents does what DiscoSents does.

What do you guys think?

Are Banes still the way to go with Cryx?

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>>52972998
Seperate pdf. Ment to post it right after but got distracted.

>>52973175
Presumably by adjusting their stats and point costs.

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>>52973184
It would probably have helped if I'd actually posted the list, huh?

>>52972604
They're only sturdier in melee and have to cross the board as a slower, less damaging, no pathfindery 12/15 steady tough clump whose full boat costs 3 points more than Sentinels+UA. That's their main problem in my opinion. To justify taking them you need to also field Nyss Hunters and find a caster that likes both units. That might be Ossyan desu. I might test that out.

>>52973062
This.

Certain warjacks are way undercosted. Like, I know Juggernauts and Kodiaks only do one thing, but holy shit dude they do it really fucking well.

>>52972570
You want a prediction? It's not the Jack spam you need to be worried about under 2017, Karchev jackspam is going to get replaced by Manowar spam.

>>52973257
>Karchev jackspam is going to get replaced by Manowar spam
And by Harkevich jack spam. Which replaced it a few months ago.

>>52973257
I mean that's basically jackspam when you think about it

>>52971921

I don't agree that there is nothing to be done. They can keep a timed format and still encourage wins in other ways. For example;

Deathclock
1 hr per player
First to 1 Control Point wins

Now, obviously this would both fit within time constraints AND make players win in non-deathclock ways. Would it be silly? Of course...

So they need to find a way to compromise time with scenario. It seems like in 2017 they just said FUCK IT, play a full 7 turns or 2 hours and off you go.

Don't like it.

>>52973187
Thanks again

>>52973319

Your idea doesn't work at all. Tournaments/Events have strict time constraints. You can't have someone clock out then go "well fuck it I'm going to take 10 minutes figuring out how to score a CP". That will put the entire schedule behind.

I assume you've never run tournaments before. You can't spend hundreds of dollars booking a venue for X amount of time and then have players cumulatively take an extra hour or more resolving games that run late.

>>52973319
>Now, obviously this would both fit within time constraints AND make players win in non-deathclock ways. Would it be silly? Of course...

What? No it doesn't you fucking mong. You've just taken the time constraints off an event that requires time constraints.

Also good luck convincing anyone with the words "Would it be silly? Of course." for a rules packet that is trying to be balanced and competitive. 40k is over that way.

>>52973257
Why is the Juggernaught always picked on but not the Crusader?

That's even cheaper and even more powerful.

And no way. Warjacks buffs where miniscule. What amounts to a free charge isn't a large upgrade.

What happened was a meta shift:

Guns got allot better because of pre-measuring, thus killing the weaponmaster infantry that would be making quick work of Warjacks.

>>52973479
>>52973509

What in the literal fuck are you two autist lords on about?

What I suggested is exactly like SR 2016, except it takes 1 CP to win instead of 5.

The point, that both (Maybe one?) of you missed is that there is a happy medium to be found between "Every match is a deathclock game" and "Every match is won in 5 minutes by getting 1 CP". I'm sorry if that concept is difficult.

IF SR 2017 holds, many games will end in Deathclock because winning by 6 CP is fucking hard.

The more games that go to Deathclock, the better chance the tournament has to run late yes? Plus, Deathclock not a rewarding win no?

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Non-player here.

I think this guy looks cool. Is he good in-game?

Are all the cards in PDF form yet?

>>52973771

A TO budgets X amount of time per round. Right now many major tournaments have player deployment on the clock. So a TO will give players 5 minutes to get to their table, select lists and start, another 5 for potential stoppages like Judges needing to get involved and he will know his rounds will need to be 2hrs10mins long with another 10 mins between rounds.

Players clocking out can't fuck this up. The only thing that can fuck this up is players doing what they're not supposed to do and pausing the clock, nobody but a Judge should pause the clock.

>>52973771

I didn't realise you were being even more fucking retarded than you were. I assumed that you meant the first to 1 CP rule came in after the clock out and not:

PLAYER 2 HAS THE FIRST OPPORUNITY TO SCORE SO LOL YOU WIN THE GAME IF YOU GO SECOND BECAUSE YOU ONLY NEED ONE POINT.

You fucking retard. Rofl. KYS.

>>52973900
Middling. Not the best but not the worst.

It is cool and things may be a-changing.

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>>52974072

I can't even. So you couldn't read my post right the first time and you can't understand the point of it the second time around. And you resort to 12 year old insults.

Warmachine Community. The Post.

I know I know, you were only pretending to be retarded.

>>52973771
You should probably never try to do game balance. Or talk about it.

>>52973900
He's a fine option, especially with the right Warlock.

Basically, his shtick is that he can guard your warlock by taking damage for it, and he has two pretty nice attacks with the ability to knock stuff over. Theoretically this makes him very useful, but he's expensive and very slow, so sometimes leveraging his impressive murderization power against the right foe is hard.

Of course, Circle, being the faction of teleportation and movement shenanigans, can always get around this if you're willing to put some thought into your turn.

>>52974154
There already is a medium. Every game isn't a deathclock game.

People are already testing this shit in tournaments and deathclock isn't the primary method of victory.

Now somebody who just plays casually once a week yeah, they might struggle. But steamroller isn't for casual players, they can just go play a game without the clock.

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>>52974047

That's a more nuanced post than the idiot here >>52974072.

However, I still disagree. So imagine you are running a tournament where 32 players are playing. Let's say 16 of those go to clock, the other 16 win via scenario/assassination.

That means, while that round is going, you can process half of the fields win/losses, have those players start picking up their shit, getting packed up and making sure tables are setup again.

Now imagine where EVERY player deathclocks around the 2 hr mark. You have nothing to do as an organizer except make judgement calls, then suddenly you have 32 sheets to get wrapped up. Then everyone is moving/packing at the same time from table to table.

And yeah, I've ran tournaments since Mk 1 where Vlad would make it easier for you to get the rounds wrapped up and BaneKnight vs BaneKnight would make you want to vomit when called over to a table.

Plus, again, Deathclock is just so unfuckingsatisfying.

>>52974021
Its pp. of course they fucking aren't.
If they did the on time, timely, or in reasonable time thing the sky would fall.

>>52974237

I "have" tested this shit in tournaments and have ran two SR 2017 events so far, in a meta with people you would recognize.

Deathclock is now the primary method of victory in our games, with Assassination being the 2nd.

And gunlines are looking strong, very fucking strong.

>>52973771

It did take me a second to understand that you were laying out boundaries, anon. If I had an itchy posting finger I might have made an ass of myself.

Hey guys, I've been looking for an alternative to Warhammer AoS/40K due to how retardedly expensive it is to get into the hobby dropping 500 dollars for a single army, and have been looking at Warmahordes/Warmachines. How popular is the game? It's been out for quite a while and just wanted to know if the game has become more popular over the years or it's faded like a phase.

The wisdom of Sam Vimes holds true here, anons. "It is very hard to kill a man that doesn't want to be killed."

When there's no reason to expose your caster more than you want to (scenario's great gift to assassination), or got more done with him in a turn than he's capable of doing comfortably (it's other, smaller one), assassination chances diminish.

>>52974253

You don't get 32 sheets at once even if 32 players deathclock at once. They don't all deathclock at the same exact moment unless there is some really really weird convergence of fates. Five guys clock out with 20 minutes in the round, another five with 10, another couple with 5 minutes left, maybe a couple of games literally go to the wire. You're not going to get everyone clocking out with 10 seconds left on their opponent's clock.

>>52974281
Your local group needs to hurry up then. I saw 28 games on the weekend with only 1 deathclock win.

>>52974385

Pretty popular, seems to have staying power. If it was going to roll over and die it'd have done it last year and it didn't. Please leave us to our foodfight.

>>52974385
PP tried their fucking best to kill it over the last year but have managed to somewhat pull their shit together. I think anyway. Don't know if you could get a decent amount of models for $500 anymore though there's been a fair few price hikes over the last 3 years.

War Room Army

Retribution of Scyrah - fight in the shade

Theme: Defenders of Ios
1 / 1 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army


Lord Ghyrrshyld, the Forgiven - WJ: +28
- Sylys Wyshnalyrr, The Seeker - PC: 4
- Banshee - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18)
- Chimera - PC: 8 (Battlegroup Points Used: 8)
- Griffon - PC: 8 (Battlegroup Points Used: 2)

Houseguard Thane - PC: 4
Arcanist Mechanik - PC: 2
Arcanist Mechanik - PC: 2
Fane Knight Skeryth Issyen - PC: 0

Houseguard Halberdiers - Leader & 9 Grunts: 13
- Houseguard Halberdier Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 4
Stormfall Archers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 9
Stormfall Archers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 9
House Ellowuyr Swordsmen - Leader & 9 Grunts: 16
- House Ellowuyr Swordsman Officer & Standard - PC: 5
- Soulless Escort - PC: 1


THEME: Defenders of Ios
---

GENERATED : 04/29/2017 13:26:41
BUILD ID : 2039.17-03-16

Feat with halbs just out of enemy threat range. Concealment makes both units hard to shoot. Opponent is forced to either run to engage and be stationary or give ground to SPD8 halbs. Swordsmen are second wave, probably minifeat the turn after feat to hold a zone.

Not sure if it'll work but it's the clearest plan I've come up with for him

>>52974281

I dunno I saw a Sloan gunline get basically tabled by a Baldur double Wrath+Megalith on Recon. Shooting will get more valuable as a method to skirmish and push your opponent to move out of his comfort zone, but I think outside of very few specific casters like Ossyan a pure gunline will be weaker than a hybrid force or a pure attrition focused army.

>>52974574
Makes me kind of wonder if we'll get a houseguard theme list in the command book.

>>52974385
Well Id say good things.

PP is at least trying to get community involvement in balance and whilst the prices are not the lowest, they still try to keep it low.

Still relatively popular. If you wanna get an army, you can get a good starting one for about 100-150 Bucks in the all in one army boxes.

But the realistic army costs about...200 Bucks Id say. But each section is mostly re-usable (The buffing thing will buff all things, so no need to but the Demon Buffing thing and the Demondad Buffing thing) and its increasingly less investment heavy after each purchase.

What faction catches your eye?

>>52974441

Of course not at the same exact moment in time. But with good players, it is rare to see someone get clocked with more than 5-8 minutes left on the other players clock.

>>52974584
Maybe but I'm not convinced. The main weakness of gunline is scenario.

Then again, maybe 90 McThralls will be an issue too.

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>>52974021
>>52974266
>really want to playtest the new Ret stuff
>cards are on Warroom and that's it
God damn it, I'm not spending $9 minimum on what I find to be the least satisfying format for storing rules.

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>>52974635
There is a Houseguard theme lists in the command book. That's in-theme.

>>52974385
I got half of the options for my faction in one secondhand purchase of $170, although Ret isn't a huge faction to begin with.

Definitely look for people selling decent quality collections if you're interested. Plenty of people and extreme tryhards, who are not people pick up and drop factions frequently in this game.

>>52974528
>Don't know if you could get a decent amount of models for $500 anymore

Mate, my troopspamiest lists have generally cost me under $300. Where are you buying from?

>>52974751

Huh. Does Reposition work with Swift Hunter?

>>52974882
No, you must choose one end of activation movement type.

>>52974911
Swift Hunter isn't end of activation, it's immediately after you destroy a model.

>>52974574
I think this might work. Just keep handing your jacks focus to cancel spells and/or boost. Enough Sentinels will probably make it to kill hard things. Two Shield Guards so that 4Shade doesn't die to pot shots and Hyperion is a huge Arcane Denial bubble and all around great.

https://conflictchamber.com/#b51bhH4G4Gc49v3y3y3y2V312V31

Retribution Army - 75 / 75 points

!!! Your army contains a pre-release entry.

(Goreshade 4) Lord Ghyrrshyld, The Forgiven [+28]
- Aspis [6]
- Aspis [6]
- Hyperion [36]
- Sylys Wyshnalyrr, The Seeker [4]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Dawnguard Sentinels (max) [18]
- Dawnguard Sentinel Officer & Standard [4]
- Soulless Escort (1) [1]
Dawnguard Sentinels (max) [18]
- Dawnguard Sentinel Officer & Standard [4]

As far as the Defenders of Ios (Houseguard) theme goes, I think Ossyan can make a pretty decent list in it.

https://conflictchamber.com/#b51b_-0z464E4l3y3ydPdP4J4J35363u393d3x3x

Retribution Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Defenders of Ios

!!! You are using a pre-release theme.

(Ossyan 1) Lord Arcanist Ossyan [+28]
- Banshee [18]
- Hypnos [18]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Arcanist Mechanik [2]
Houseguard Thane [0(4)]
Houseguard Thane [0(4)]
Heavy Rifle Team [4]
Heavy Rifle Team [4]
Houseguard Halberdiers (max) [13]
- Houseguard Halberdier Officer & Standard [4]
- Soulless Escort (1) [1]
Houseguard Riflemen (max) [15]
- Houseguard Rifleman Officer & Standard [4]
Stormfall Archers [9]
Stormfall Archers [9]

>>52974707
Good players shouldn't be clocking out on a consistent basis, and if they are they're pre measuring waaay too much shit. First turn should take less than 5 minutes, period (if you're running something retarded like 90 McThralls I think this is your own fault).

On the highly unlikely assumption that your game goes to 7 turns (again, really unlikely. Every game I've played so far the board is practically bare if the game gets to turn 6 and I've never seen a single one go to 7) you have more than 9 minutes per turn. That's a long time.

>>52975354
Or not doing enough planning on their opponent's turn.

>>52975375

Or brought two units of infantry.

>>52975511
I played in a tournament on the weekend with over 30 infantry models in both lists plus beasts and went 3-1.

Didn't clock out once. I'm sorry I'm not buying your argument at all.

>>52975616

That wasn't my argument.

So when someone floods the board with 70 McThralls, you think you'll beat them by 6 CPs before the clock expires?

You'll either assassinate or it'll be a clock win.


>>52975354
So, you have to win by 6 more CP than your opponent in this edition, only certain types of units/solos/warbeasts can score in certain scenarios, warriors can contest anything.

Do you expect there to be more or less deathclock victory in this edition?

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What's the worst looking model in the game?
My vote goes to this dude. What even is that pose?

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>>52975870

A lot of the early Nyss sculpts were terrible.

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>>52975870
The original Thunderhead was pretty goofy.

But those nyss hunter globgoblins are pretty bad.

>>52975870
Obviously he's off to rumble with the Sharks.

>>52975742
No, we'll go to 7 turns and the game will end assuming I didn't get assassinated and they didn't clock themselves out trying to resolve the actions of that many models.

As for more or less Deathclock wins? I think it will stay pretty much the same. As I said earlier, there was only 1 clockout and it was by a player who has in the past taken 40 minutes on a single turn. On the game he clocked out in he took 18 minutes on his first turn.

So yes, I think the status quo won't shift. From our testing in an actual tournament format the people who struggled with the clock before still have issues, and the players that know what they're doing don't have issues.

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>>52975870
These guys are pretty bad too, with their comically oversized hands

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Helynna is extremely cute.

You did gud, Ossyan.

>>52976173
>cute
>bald

>>52976201
Bald is best.

>>52976173

The only good thing to happen to him in his entire life.

Winter Argus, what's the fucking point?

>>52976260
Well, he is the first arcanist to figure out how to do time magic without having it as your 'element'.

>>52976424
Wait, so Haley's a sorcerer, not an arcanist?

>>52976260

Bet he never thought he'd have to explain himself to Goreshade about it, doh.

>>52976458
Yep. Haley and Deneghra are both sorcerers.

>>52976458

Pretty much. Time magic is something that comes to her easily and naturally. She understands it like a fish understands the sea.

Ossyan understands it like a marine biologist understands the sea. His view is likely more wide and more complete but it's not as naturally or easily come to him.

>>52976201
>>52976230
Bald IS best

If going from the Ret battlebox, what would be some good next purchases?

>>52977094
Arcanist Mechaniks are 2pt solo models that are easily a double/triple auto-take in most lists. Each one can boost, buff, or repair a myrmidon, and you'll always have at least one jack in your lists. Put one or two of these at the top of your list, and keep an eye out for the Shyeel Arcanist unit coming out this summer that gives you a trio of Battle Mage/Mechanik gestalt models.

Dawnguard Sentinels are your meme melee bruisers. They can present a significant threat by themselves, and they synergize well with a lot of Ret casters. Helynna herself can pump their armor well into the 20s.

House Shyeel Battle Mages are what got me into Ret. They come as a unit of six, and each model can cast a spell that lets you push or pull whatever it hits a few inches. Chain them together, and you can rearrange entire units or pull one model across the board into your melee beatsticks.

>>52977503
>Put one or two of these at the top of your list
What that anon wants to say is "buy three of those now".

How did Aiakos make out when he went full caster?

>>52978504
He's functionally Cryx Strakhov1 in rules
In fluff, he's a pirate king in the Sharde Isles

Is team elemental lights for trolls a viable list?
Or is it at very least fun?

>>52976422

There isn't one.

>>52978894
Back when Una2 was a monster, mirrormatch tech was having an Argus in Specialists to swap in for its animus to take the "Feat, Run, Surround" strategy. Nowadays there's not much point.

>>52968560
And all that treaty is total bullshit. Ayn newer signed such toilet paper if PP dont make her suddenly dump as duck. She wipe out Llael with intrigue and brutal force. And fight with Signar for 6 years. Why she must suddenly fear it, when her army ALREADY conqure 1/8 of that southen dogs land and give that land back without fighting?

>>52979005
After Gaspy's forest adventure, all three of the non-Ord Iron Kingdoms wanted to stop fighting. Their armies were run absolutely fucking ragged. Later, when the treaty was presented to Ayn, she knew Khador wasn't 100% ready to start another war, and she had no idea whether Julius was the type of king to start a war over her refusal of the treaty. So she agreed, because she thought all the de Martyn family was either dead or in hiding; she had no way of knowing what Julius planned.

And besides, it's not like her signing the treaty made any difference in the end. When Julius tried to pull the rug out from under her, she outright disregarded her previous agreement because fuck giving up Llael nigga.

Do the Command Books have all the MK11 models in them?

>>52979335
MK2

>>52979335
Besides the Legion of Everblight one, no. Other model entries will be forthcoming for the other factions in Theme Books (ManoWar, Storm Knight, Exemplar, Bane, etc).

>>52979482
Do the missing ones exist as cards or not at all yet?

>>52979502
They have rules in Warroom2 and PP is in the process of putting up printable card-format rules for all of their models for free on their website, although that's slow going so far.

>>52979555
I think I have the card leaks from last year, would they all be in there? Thank you for your time.

>>52979613
put the card leaks up and I'll check for you.

Actually could someone put those up I didn't get them I could use them.

>>52979613
Not all of the rules from the card leaks are valid anymore since we've had several erratas. Woldwyrds are better now, and all of Skorne is generally better and rather different than it was in some cases, for instance. PP does have free versions of the errata'd cards on their website.

>>52979670
Oh its not anything not already in the thread on top

>>52979672
Thank you for telling me! Was hard to find this with Google Fu.

>>52979682
No problem.

>>52979672

yeah I need the cards for some of the unchanged models, bought a second hand army it's got missing or mk2 cards and I prefer cards to warroom or shit while playing.

>>52979901
They said they are going to stop packaging cards, so you'll have to use Warroom or wait for them to put up the printable cards.

>>52973184
>>52973202
I think you are overdoing it with the empower models. You don't really need to pay 16 points on Jack support if you only bring 3 Jacks.

Consider the following
>All Dire Troll models naturally have Hyper Regeneration - This model heals d3 damage at the start of its activation.
Balanced?

>>52979970
Yeah printing the cards myself is no trouble.

>>52970702
The Mohsar we see ingame is him using a fraction of his power and generally messing with people. I suspect the same holds true for the Old Witch.

Who does heavy spam the best right now, Warmachine or Hordes? I just want a stompy list.

>>52980354
Khador, nugga
Jaws of the Wolf theme lets you spam like eight heavies and then take their support solos entirely for free.

>>52980354
Khador. If that doesn't appeal to you Amon's jack spam list for Menoth is also very good and brings like 5-6 heavies plus some lights.

>>52980354

Jack spam is better than Beast spam for the most part right now. Some of the key fury manipulation abilities for Hordes got nuked from orbit so going HAM with beast heavy lists is alot harder than it used to be.

Hey WMG, I've been out of the game for a bit and dipping my toes in. I'm a couple NQ behind the sticky up top is a few issues behind too.

Anyone have downloads for NQ 69, 70 and 71?

ALSO, anyone have any news on when we're getting more RPG books? Feels like fucking ages since Wild Adventure

>>52980012
Negligible difference that invalidates doomy. Troll beasts are pretty good but could use a point reduction or better beast support (not handlers level but something like stones or whatever the legion model was called) or higher base dmg on non ranged ones. As it is they have the tools but lack the stats to play attrition as they should.

>>52980429
8? Try 10+ lmao

>>52980587
lmaoooo even better
Fuck, how does one even stop that shit from creeping up the board and giving your caster a pat on the back?

>>52979123

I really hope that Julius gets more than he bargained for with the heir of Llael rather than her meekly accepting 'Llael is part of Cygnar now'.

As he's not exactly liberating it so much as conquering it with that stunt.

>>52980643

Depends on their jack composition and which caster is in the driver's seat. If you've got a brick list alot of their jacks quite possibly aren't a decent threat at POW16, as long as you can dodge or remove the couple of jacks that can actually threaten your heavies you can get away with a win.

Another key is sniping out their snipers if it's a Karchev list. If you pick them off 90% chance he doesn't have any other models to proc Road to War which kills the list's threat range.

It's a horrible skew list though, can be quite hard to beat if you didn't bring something to handle heavy jack spam.

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>>52980643
Welcome to my reality

>>52980146
>suspect

We know shes holding back in game. Just recently in the fluff she teleported 3 mountain kings across the country. She also literally opens the gates of hell for the Grymkin to get out.

>>52980807

Yeah, she's one of those warcasters like the Harbringer that are more or less WAY out of scale to turn up in the TT.

But then, Warcasters in general are kinda out of scale. They've been given fair fights by Satyxis and Manhunters. Actual fluff stat levels would likely put all TT warcasters in very different places.

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I think Power-Up is necessary to make running more than one Jack viable, but maybe it should get a slight nerf or something?

For example, if Power Up! was bound to the Focus stat (as in, you can only power up jacks equal to your current Focus), wouldn't that fix some things?

Notorious examples,like Harkevich, Amon, Karra and Ossrum could still run 8-10 Jacks, but only 6 of them get a free Focus, rather than all of them.

On first glance, this might seem like casters with high Focus are getting a buff once again, but none of the FOC 7/8/9 casters run more than 5 jacks anyways. Control casters usually want an expensive unit like Storm Lances or Dawnguard Sentinels to abuse in some way, leaving not enough points to go mono-jack.

>>52980854
>For example, if Power Up! was bound to the Focus stat (as in, you can only power up jacks equal to your current Focus), wouldn't that fix some things?

Not much really, like Haley2 Heavy Metal spams like 5-8 Jacks and she can handle all of them. And like in Karchev list you could replace a couple of the jacks with ones that can run/charge for free.

They realistically just need to hard cap it at 3 or something because right now letting it scale infinitely is what lets it get out of hand when you allow a list to skew high ARM plus lots of hitpoints.

If you're spamming more than 3 jacks you're probably doing it with a caster who has a skillset that can handle it.

>>52980854

Honestly, I'd really like to see them give Jack Marshalls a boost. Right now they really can't compete with power up so you'll only go with them if they have a special rule that is REALLY nice for the jack to have.

>>52980905
4+ Heavies per Army obviously was the intention of mk3, regardless of what caster you play.

3-5 Jacks is the new 1 Jack.

>>52980959

It was, but they're starting to notice it was a mistake it's causing a god awful high ARM lots of HP skew that in some respects is just replacing the heavy infantry skew lists which were high ARM lots of HP skew they tried to nerf out of the game with Mk3.

>>52980955

I agree

>>52981083
>>52980959
The problem is that we transitioned in MK3 with all the anti infantry hate that was present in MK2.
That plus the general buffing of Jacks and infantry price increase made infantry harder to play.

>>52976173
Will Ossy get cucked by Goreshade return ?

>>52972680

The speculation is it's going to go through CID. During the December FAQ last year it was mentioned the Skorne forces book was being delayed until last, for release during late fall, because Skorne in general needed fixing.

However, they also mentioned that the models slated for release with that book would not be delayed and would release in the middle of the year (Morghoul 3 being the next one up most likely).

The only reason to delay the book but not the models for balancing purposes would be to adjust the tier lists in the forces book, so they're probably going to be pushed through CID at some point much like the Bane one is being tested now.

>>52978840
I'm not sure if it's 'viable,' per se, but I got a sweet assassination with a Swamp Troll the other day. A lot of our lights are pretty good, they're just not great.

>>52980524
not the original anon, but wouldn't giving them Hyper Regen. give them better attrition?

>>52982091
No, check the errata.

>>52980663
It's already been determined that Llael would not become part of Cygnar.

They'll just have an even tighter alliance than before.

So i picked up my khador battlegroup, what units should i get first to bolster my forces?

>>52982416
A unit Widowmaker Scouts, a Widowmaker Marksman, a War Dog and a Heavy Warjack kit (which you turn into a Marauder).

>>52982416
Alternatively, if you like being in melee, a unit Iron Fang Pikemen and an Iron Fang Kovnik.

>>52982155

As tight as Kaitlyn when Julius stuffs an heir in her.

You know the writer's going there after Vlad an Ayn got hitched. Shipping characters is so hot now.

>>52982514
The only person who actually ships AynxVlad is Ayn. Even Vlad doesn't ship it. He probably spent the whole wedding trying to find an angle from which Ayn looks like Sorscha.

You know there's been at least one
>"I love you, Sorscha."
>"Who's Sorscha?"
>"fffffffffff"-
moment.

>>52982793
Vlad married voluntarily after the Old Witch told him to get his shit together.

>>52982849
I'm aware. He just doesn't like it.

His character text literally says that he's sacrificed what he wants for the good of Umbrey. He doesn't want to be married to Ayn, he's just doing it because declining would have catastrophic implications for his people.

>>52982875
>for the good of Umbrey
Also, if Grandma Krueger tells you to do something, you do it.

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>>52982931
>"You better put a baby in her, Vlad. I don't care if you leave the pauldrons on, just do as you're fucking told."

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Vlad is starting to remind me of pic related.

>ugh these fancy parties are boring
>i hate these formal clothes i wish i was in my armour
>wifey's whining about my job again ffs why did i marry into royalty what fresh hell is this?
>i just wanna serve my country and gut the enemies of the motherland in peace
>i wish i was with my qt subordinate, neck deep in the shit, fighting heathens and traitors

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This build makes Ellowuyr Swordsmen DEF20 (against shooting), ARM15 and immune to blast damage. When they get into close range they can pop Serpent's Coil and be pretty much unapproachable to anything not significantly tuff.

I may actually make some room for a Lys Healer so they can't be knocked down, too.

FUCK. YOUR. GUNLINES.

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>>52980500

The dropbox link for Cryx command up has the last 5 NQs in there as well.

>>52984860
She'd look so much better without the pauldrons.

>>52979123
And with that signing she give Julius deploy his army directly on the old border, when Dragons Tong river, wich were perfect natural defense line, stay deep in Cygnar territory with all thats brand new bridges, raillines and fortres, bild on her moey. That's just extra stupid. She may just tell him go an fuck his new queen from some ordric whorehouse and send more troops fore death in attemt to bypass that river.

>>52979005
Ayn signed it because she was expecting to fight a shattered Cygnar in the midst of a civil war. Then Magnus punked Vinter, Julius was enthroned, and suddenly she had an actual fight on her hands. Her armies were overstretched as fuck, and ragged from years of constant fighting against basically every other human nation on Immoren.

Note that the only times Khador has ever really pushed against Cygnar, it's when Cygnar is being fucked by something else. When Cygnar was invaded by Menites, Khador attacked and took a bunch of land. When Cygnar was invaded by Skorne, Khador attacked. When Cygnar was dealing with Cryx, Khador betrayed them an attacked. When Cygnar had a civil war, Khador attacked.

Khador has only been able to make its current gains because it went on the offensive at times when Cygnar's military might was spread across multiple fronts. Ayn thought she could do it again with Vinter's return and the resulting civil war, but it ended before she could take advantage of it, and suddenly Cygnar was not only united, but had its armies free to counter Khador's advance. Skorne and the Protectorate are too busy fighting each other to distract them, and Cryx became relatively quiet for a little while after Terminus got his ass fucked by Stryker. Ayn knew that the forces she had station in the Thornwood territories could never hold out against the entire Cygnaran army, especially not with Morridane clans, Tharn tribes, and unusually active Gatormen interfering behind the front lines. If she tried to hold Northern Cygnar her forces station there would have been devastated in the ensuing conflict.

>>52985603
Zerkova starting shit with Ios was also a pissing against the wind move. Khador really didn't need any more enemies in Llael.

>>52985603
I think the nature of writing a Plot that can't go anywhere is really starting to irritate me.

At least in 40K there is SOME space for fuckups or stuff to happen (Even if it also never goes anywhere).

Is the next story arc just gonna be about Khador getting its face kicked in?

>>52985795
>Is the next story arc just gonna be about Khador getting its face kicked in?

Maybe. They're in for some shitwrecking, they've been doing far too well.

>At least in 40K there is SOME space for fuckups or stuff to happen (Even if it also never goes anywhere).

Like in 40K, it's the individual characters of Warmahordes that actually move forwards (everything else moves sideways). Sevvy for example has just moved forward into his grave.

>>52983572
Nice parallel, though I doubt Vlad is getting openly cheated on by his haughty royal wife
Toma is second best Unsounded guy, nobody beats paladin lich dad

I played a Skorne game today and won, /tg/! I forgot how good Rasheth is at assassination.

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>>52984363
*Hyper-Aggressives behind u*
*unsheathes Thresher*
Psssh nothin perssonnel kids

>>52986259
>21 points

Why does it hurt so much, Senpai?

>>52986259
>Feat: The Vanishing - Friendly Faction models in control range gain stealth and can't be charged or slammed.

Good luck breh.

>>52959406
So all those "killed" are not crawling back from their graves in the new editions?
Barnabas killed? Hell you better be kidding me, same with Severius (who is in charge of PoM now then lol?)

>>52986259
Beast 09 is probably the worst thing to bring against Kaelyssa.

With her feat, it's never getting into combat before the enemy stuff charges, and Hyper-Aggressive is utterly neutered if it keeps getting knocked down by Phantom Seeker'd Banshee shots. 21 points for something that will probably spend most of the battle behind your lines, on its ass.

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>>52986404
>who is in charge of PoM now then lol?

>>52986404
Barnabus was never killed. He ascended to at least demigod state. As for who's going to lead the protectorate, that's what the next 2 novels and no small amount of bloodshed will decide.

>>52986404
Barnabus didn't just die, he ascended to godhood. There'll probably be a Barnabus2 with the same sort of fluff status as Old Witch, OR a new warlock will be introduced as his prime prophet on Caen.

>(who is in charge of PoM now then lol?)

This is a legit plot point PP has bee building up for a while. Things are being set up for Feora to make a power ploy and Kreoss, recognizing that she's a complete lunatic, to lead the opposition. It's time for some Menite civil war.

>>52986247
Is it really that bad for them right now? I have a small Skorne army I never got around to full assembling that I've been thinking of pulling out. But if its really that bad, I'll just let it gather some more dust for now.

>>52986939
It's probably not that bad, Skorne just doesn't have any dumb meta crushing lists, which means we lose to the dumb meta crushing lists. A lot of the time we have to play list chicken against shit like Amon/High Reclaimer or Harkevich/Vlad1. It isn't THAT bad, but there's zero wiggle room for you in list building. Unless your list is nigh-perfect, you might struggle.

>>52986996
Then I may keep them shelved for now. I know the stuff I like best isn't that great, so I'll wait to see if we get some themes to boost them.

>>52987055
>I'll wait to see if we get some themes to boost them
Hope you like waiting. But hey, we have a gunline theme to play with. Skorne is a gunline faction, right?

>>52986996
>>52986939

They're still pretty shit right now, but they're alot better in SR2017. 2017 as it stands right now lets them leverage their attrition side to far greater effect.

>>52987072
Considering some of my favorite models for them are Bloodrunners, Karax, and the Rhinodon... yeah...

>>52987188

Bloodrunners do not fit the meta at all. Rhinodon still isn't worth the points.

Karax are actually viable though. Decent jam unit for Zaadesh 2, and they're still a go to infantry choice for Zaal1.

>Skorne is bad
>Post-errata

wew lads

>>52987188
>Bloodrunners
Pretty awful. Everyone is playing high ARM infantry that may very well not be living.
>Karax
Very good unit. I was using them in the Rasheth game I mentioned. They're an excellent jamming unit and make great throwaway arc nodes. Protip, you very rarely want to Shield Wall them. They're all about just gumming the board up.
>Rhinodon
Honestly it's not as bad as people make out. I like to think of it more as a warjack than a warbeast in terms of damage output. It won't really kill an enemy heavy, but 11/20 is a strong defensive statline. Opponent fails to kill your 11/20, they take a bunch of Spiny Growth damage trying, then you kill their heavy. Any caster with a damage buff (Morghoul1, Naaresh, Zaadesh2) can turn them into VERY strong models since then they'll be able to kill just about anything while being faster and requiring less resources than an equivalent warjack.

>>52987288
>[Karax are] still a go to infantry choice for Zaal1
Really? The strongest Zaal1 lists I've played against are just Immortal spam. That shit's obnoxious because of the synergy pile of Guardians powering Immortals then turning into a Kovaas and raping your boipussy.

>>52987494
>Really? The strongest Zaal1 lists I've played against are just Immortal spam. That shit's obnoxious because of the synergy pile of Guardians powering Immortals then turning into a Kovaas and raping your boipussy.

Immortals are good but Karax are still very useful with Zaal1 there's no reason that you can't have both.

Firstly they're just flatout cheaper, they're the most cost effective unit you can run with Zaal for soul/feat fuel.

Second you can abuse the interaction with CMA and Last Stand with them.

Lastly Girded is actually really fucking good. The passive trait works out of formation, you can have 1 or 2 Karax wandering around your backlines preventing your opponent from drifting AOEs and shit onto your support models/caster

>>52987494
anon, I agree with pretty much everything except the bloodrunners stuff. Those guys are fantastic - what high arm non-living infantry exists out there? CoC is too busy wanking it in their theme list, cryx doesn't do arm skew on infantry, what is there that actually sees play? Skorne has immortals and multibox medium infantry are around, but man bloodrunners just go do something else with how fast they moved compared. Everything else - sentinels, ironfangs, etc - they are solid at thrashing single wound high damage infantry.

The real issue I can see people having with them is that beast/jack heavy lists are so common that the bloodrunners dont feel like they do much more than jam against it, but thats not the unit being bad, it's just putting them in the wrong job.

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Aww yeah, I was so hyped for this Artwork ever since I saw it on the ADR update.

>>52989766
>>52989766

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