>1 int >20 wis

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>20 str
>1 con

>>52777998
1 int is the lowest something can have without being considered "Mindless". As a result, they are LITERALLY not playable as characters due to not being sapient beings

>>52777998
Turtles

>>52777998
How? Like what does a 20 wis, 1 int person act like?

>>52778031
They're literally below the cutoff line for sapience in 3.5 Int scores below three are reserved for pretty much only animals

>>52778010
Izuku Midoriya from My Hero Academia

>>52777998
>1 int

That's dumber than an ant.

>>52778042
So, a wise vegetable?

>>52778031
very wisely, without being "intelligent" or acting logically

>>1 int
>>20 wis
>incapable of speech or independent action
>at peak of enlightenment, beyond mortal limits
Sokushinbutsu monks, if you accept the idea they are "alive".

>>52778055
An actually magic Magic 8 ball

>>52778015
>LITERALLY
Wow, sick latte you got there pumpkin spice

Your opinion is retarded as usual though

>>52778055
More like a particularly clever fish int scores CAN go to 0 (or more acurately, "-" so it can't be raised) in 3.5

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>>52777998
it's one of these

>>52778031
It isn't a person. Int 3 is the benchmark for sapience. At Int 1 it's incapable of any form of higher reasoning. Wis 20 means that its instincts are phenomenal, though. My first thought is a magical beast super-spider which is feral and has very simple thoughts ("feed", "run", etc.) but accurately receives and interprets nearly all information around it. It knows at first glance what creatures are friends or foes, who intends it harm, has insane senses, can navigate flawlessly, etc.

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>>52778070

>>52778072
No, I mean RAW you are not allowed to play as a character with below 3 int. Even races that have int penalties specify that they can't reduce the score to below three.

>>52778085
>>52778099
Wrong

>>52778031
>the druid decides to talk to the carrot for shit and giggles
>it's answer prompts him to repeat it to his group
>the palladin falls, the elf becomes a priest of armok and the dwarf turns into granite

>>52778116
Care to substantiate your claims?

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>20 dex
>1str

>>52778118
There ain't no party like a Zen buddhist party cause a Zen buddhist party lacks lack.

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>>52777998
>>52778031
Like this

>>52778128
You're the one who made the stupid claim to be quite honest family

>>52778143
spoken like a true corpse

>>52778046
Shit, I was going to watch episode 3 of season 2 today. Thank you my man. Thank you.

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>>52778116
n..no?

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>>52778118
>the elf becomes a priest of armok

>>52778156
if wanting for nothing is a meme does that mean that nothing is a thing and must be rejected?

>>52778184
>How to destroy Buddhist robots

>>52778180
like with every question related to crunch, it depends on the edition anon

>>52778198
Then the entire premise of the thread is invalid because unless we know the edition, we can't know what 20 or 1 in a stat means.

>>52778198
What edition did they change that? It kinda seems like the thing you wouldn't wanna touch

>>52778211
I don't know if this has changed, but for years the general rule of thumb is "If no edition given, assume 3.PF"

>>52778184
depends if you're talking about a lack of nothing which implies a desire for it or simply the absence of thing

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>>52778198
lol 5e lets you play characters with Int 1? For what purpose? Probably for the lolz which is why a nat20 is an autosuccess in 5e so you can jump a pogo stick 20 times to make it to the moon. Fuck 5th Edition.

>>52778247
does it?

>>52778260
>x lets you succeed at y so that means z impossibility has to be possible now
lol you mad because you stupid

>>52778231
Alright.

>An ability score less than 3 is mathematically impossible when rolling nd6 where n is any number greater than 3
>3.5's point buy table has no entries for stats less than 9
>PF's point buy table has no entries for stats less than 7

>>52778273
Well the evidence for Int scores of 1 and 2 being reserved for beasts is plainly posted >>52778180

>>52778211
>>52778213
anon, these thread litterally don't have a premise. I'd even add that playing dnd is detrimental to enjoying them, because you then end up thinking "wait, can we do that ?" when the answer is always "depends on X, Y, and Z, so probably"
tl;dr: ignore rules unless it's dnd general, and have >fun

>>52778284
Ability score modifiers. But I'm pretty sure there is some rule against reducing int specifically below 3

>>52778085
I actually love playing characters like this. Basically partially-tamed animals that assist the party in return for tangible benefits like food, protection of numbers, or fire to keep warm.

>>52778308
Find me a core race in either edition that has more than -4 to Int.

>>52778261
depends on how they get caramel into that snickers' bar
tell you what tho, I'll go handcraft one and return in one week with my answer

>>52778309
That sounds like it'd get old fast.
Like, you may enjoy playing it but... well let's just say you must be really lucky if you got a steady group

>>52778316
There is none, but half orcs, for example, make it POSSIBLE in theory to go to an int of 1 or 2

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>>52778308
Well there's this.

It's not a hard rule that says "you can't", but being utterly incapable of speech sure puts a damper on your ability to contribute to the party.

>>52778327
It does desu, but mostly the fun is in the challenge of making a compelling character that has no internal monologue.

>>52778355
Half orcs have a -2 to Int. 7 - 2 = 5

He would be one of those people who was raised by animals, not linguistic abilities or social skills, but great instincts.

>>52778031
Madman that have seen Eldritch abominations.

>>52778367
I coulda sworn there was a hard rule somewhere. Maybe the DMG
>>52778379
>Only point buy systems exist

>>52778367
so there you go, anyone claiming that you can't is a liar or a retard

>>52778448
>Here's my character, mister DM
You have an INT of 1.
>Yeah lol
Your character is incapable of speech and possibly higher reasoning. Make another one.
>But I want to play this cooperative RPG as a character who can't meaningfully contribute!
Please leave and never come back.


//////////

>but anon, that would never happen
Really? Good - then we can stop being asanine about how "lol its technically possible to play a character with less than 3 int guise".

>>52778031
Mr. Bean

>>52778508
>I can't roleplay so I'm mad that you are trying to roleplay, get the fuck out of my fanfiction that I'm calling a game

>>52778527
I'm happy you aren't at my table.

>>52778031
like strange in this scene https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5089pMuwESo

>>52778548
I'm happy that you're too busy pissing yourself angry about rpgs online to actually run or play in any games

>>52778527
>playing a character with the intelligence of a rodent is roleplaying

Fuck off and die, furfag.

>>52778527
>>I can't roleplay
Fucking roleplay 1 goddamn int. Roleplay having the intelligence of an insect. Roleplay being 1 int damage away from comatose. You fucking can't because you're not a character or person, you're a goddamn animal.

>>52777998
a baby

>>52778588
>>52778611
>autistic spastics who can't roleplay because they have autism throw a tism spasm when confronted with someone they can't do but human beings can do

>>52778631
>literally no life experiences at all
>20 wis
what the fuck?

>>52778633
...What?

>>52778588
>>playing a character with the intelligence of a rodent is roleplaying
>>character is actually pack of Cranium Rats in a long coat

>>52778633
I see you're trying to roleplay 1 int but you're still around at least a 7.
Show me how a 1 int character acts.

>>52778633
>can't roleplay because they have autism
pretty sure autism is a requirement for roleplaying.

>>52778649
I would but you've already taken that role and run with it, I wouldn't want to steal your spotlight

>>52778646
Cranium rats form a hive mind though, don't they?

>>52778659
Shut up and do it faggot. Stop dodging the issue and show me how you roleplay a 1 or 2 int character of stop complaining about not allowing such stupid shit.

>>52778676
Get a lobotomy and call it a day?

Rolled 6, 1, 16, 6, 7, 7 = 43 (6d20)

>>52777998
check out these stats brother

>>52778676
>you have to submit an example that I totally won't arbitrarily dismiss and if you don't then I totally can arbitrarily dismiss your point about me being retarded haha looks like I win again

Autism, everyone.

>>52778031
karl pilkington

>>52778713
Still waiting.
>>52778691
So sitting around doing nothing in a vegetative state for 99% of time counts as roleplaying? Would the party just strap you on their backs and run out of the tavern hoping you contribute?

>>52778751
If you dump enough into Con, then they could use you as a weapon

>>52778713
>I grab your dagger from the wrong end and throw it at the orc

>>52778772
A 1 int character wouldn't even be able to into tool use.

>>52778763
True but why even have you at the table if all you are is the barbarian's beat stick? I mean, what are you going to say?
>I twitch slightly more at the mention of orcs, their terrible memory burned into me by my curse

>>52778772
...that's how your supposed to throw a knife.

>>52778789
Well, my original intention would be that the player was the one with the lobotomy, so you'd presumably just let them stay there since you'd feel bad kicking them out

Carry your 1int/20wis friend to the ominous fork in the road. He will point to the correct path.

>>52778812
AH. so he's a dowsing stick?
Or a Dowsing Tard?
Downsing stick?

>>52778355
I can't remember about Pathfinder, but I specifically remember that in 3.5, the rule for half-orcs was that their negative adjustment to Int couldn't reduce it below 3 at character creation.

>>52778804
That depends on them being able to feel.

>>52778854
I think there was also a template in savage species that specifically said it COULD reduce something's int below 3

>>52778713
(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)

>>52778010
>20 str
>1 con
Bodybuilders.

Can suplex a train, but pass out at the sight of stairs.

>>52777998
Forest Gump

>>52778920
1 con is not being able to carry your own weight. Its being so sickly that a common cold will kill you.
And bodybuilders don't actually have functional strength that an actual strongman would.

>>52778850
Laughing my ass off. Congrats.

>>52778965
It kind of depends.
Not him, but there have been cases where a body builder got bulked up so hard, that if he got as much as a simple muscle cramp (which you still can if you're a body builder) he was in serious threat of losing a limb because his own muscles were crushing the blood vessels that would keep them alive.

Granted, it's not a universal CON dump, but demonstrates how fragile in certain aspects an extreme body builder like someone with post-herculian strength can become.

>>52778260
Disregarding memes, a nat20 just means that the character did the absolute best they were able to given the scenario.
Having a gobbo do damage to a walking tank with a nat20 is alright since you can imagine a way that it's possible, but players shouldn't be able to bench press a mountain with a nat20 since they're not capable of it.

>>52778131
kek

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>>52778965
Sounds like an elderly muscleman recently taken ill. Perhaps his advanced age has delayed his recovery from Con damage.

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>>52778947
he was more in the 5 int zone. 1 means animal/vermin level intelligence as I recall. Forrest has chats, it's his thing. 1 int things include oozes I think. they don't chat.

>>52779269
Mastiffs have like 5 int...

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>>52777998
>become aware of all of the complicated natural relationships of all things
>loose your mind and go feral, still retaining your understanding but no longer able to convey it in any way
This isn't hard to understand.

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>>52779269
In the movie he's shown to perform almost all basic life actions (tying his shoes, dressing himself, feeding himself) and learned a number of tasks to a very high degree of competency. He was a master at ping-pong, excellent at assembling his firearm in the military, and could also pilot a ship and catch shrimp.

Forrest was a pretty dim bulb, but he could have been a lot worse off.

>>52779379
So about an 8 or 9 then?

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>>52779410
Somewhere between 4 and 7 in my opinion, since it's easy to chalk up his running, weapon-assembly, and ping-pong to dexterity.

>>52779379
>>52779269
>>52778947
What if rather Gump was 20 Int, 1 Wisdom (With high Charisma)?
As >>52779379 pointed out, he mastered a lot of skills with incredible ease. It's just he didn't understand what was going on around him. Situations he got past generally relied on his ability to retain information and master skills, rather than recognizing even the most basic facts presented to him.

>>52778196
Now I have a new campaign based on Buddhist Warforged.

>>52779615
So Uesugi Kenshin?

>>52778031
Forrest Gump?

>>52778588

I believe rats have an int score of at least 2 anon.

>>52778260
Either you're a shit player who didn't read the book, or a shit troll. Nat20s only work for attack rolls, not skill checks.

>>52777998
Sith lord Jar Jar.

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>>52778155
>>52778180
>inb4 pic related

>>52778072
(You)

http://www.scp-wiki.net/scp-896

>Max STR barbarian is so strong his muscles tear apart his flesh
>Max CON knight has to have his fucking fingers cut open with diamond blades in order to continue playing because his skin is so tough he can't move
>Max INT wizard knows everything but cannot decide to do anything
>Max CHA bard is killed because he compels everyone through body language but doesn't have the ability to use it to escape
>Max WIS cleric is the only one able to make decisions and negotiate but has to be briefed on every possible factor and must be reminded constantly

>>52778183
Holy shit, this image just gave me a great idea for a new monster. Instead of horse body and human top, TWO HUMAN TOPS and then just one set of hips and human legs.

IT'S A FUCKTAUR. It doggy-styles around the world and strikes fear and arousal into the hearts of its enemies with its battle moans.

>>52779379
desu sounds kinda like some sort of high-functioning autism.

>>52779269
In the movie, he's stated to only be *just* below the line of mentally retarded. He'd be like 7 INT.

>>52782199
Except without really any of the social issues or extreme sensory overload.

>>52778183
cacame awemedinade

>>52778010
Kimimaro

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>>52778260

>less than 3 is intelligence of animals
>you can't roleplay that!

I don't see why not. I mean, I don't know why you would want to, but a lot of players already pretty much play attack dogs. Participate in combat and then just peace out when talking is happening.

>>52778611
Honestly sounds like a fun challenge, if not entirely conducive to playing D&D. If you want to play a 1-3 int character at my table you're going to need to be some kind of semi-sentient being under magical compulsion so you actually have some kind of drive.

>>52779459

IQ scores are based on norms, which are steadily improving, so a 70 back then is not the same as a 70 now. Was that taken into consideration? Might boost him some.

>>52777998
>Amazing sensory capabilities and subconscious deduction.
>Dumber than squirrel shit.

Pretty easy.

>>52778031
A potato.

>>52778850
>Dowsing tard
>Downsing stick
Lost

>>52777998
sounds like when someone gets really drunk and says to you, "yo, real talk for a second"

>>52778072
It's not an opinion, faggot, it's literally a rule of the system

>>52782149
What about max DEX?

>>52778965
>And bodybuilders don't actually have functional strength that an actual strongman would

When will this meme perpetuated by DYEL die?

>>52778031
A serene Buddha that just smiles at you, whatever you do.

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>>52778920
Bodybuilders aren't actually that strong. They build muscles for aesthetics, not functional strength.

That's why the guys winning strongman contests always look like picture related and not some chiseled beach narcissist.

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>>52784681
>Bodybuilders aren't actually that strong
Uh huh. Your average male that both doesn't exercise and doesn't do physically intensive labor probably can't even bench over 100 pounds. Any decent bodybuilder is a hell of a lot stronger than most people simply by virtue of needing it to put on the mass, and if you don't think that basic lifts and exercises to get that mass don't give you "functional strength", I don't know what to tell you.

>That's why the guys winning strongman contests always look like picture related
There are several people that do very well in strongman and powerlifting competitions that are relatively low bodyfat. One of the greatest, or perhaps the actual absolute greatest, strongmen of all time, Mariusz Pudzianowski(see picture), was lean as fuck.

>chiseled beach narcissist
This makes you sound like an insecure chode with a high bodyfat percentage, honestly.

>>52784681
i beg you to make this exact post on /fit/

>>52778085
I had an idea about Insighters - species that act entirely through "insight" - able to instantly know the proper course of action and possess inner knowledge of things without conscious thought or any inelligence. Something like scramblers from Blindsight, but turned up to 11 and having brains simpler than slugs.
An example would be to give an alien during its first ever contact with humanity a fountain pen and a couple sheets of paper out of order, with a higher algebra task requiring knowledge of Sumerian and exotic human mathematical notation. The alien then randomly places the sheets on the table, glances at them and writes the correct answer in English.

>>52778284
>>52778042
>>52778099
>>52784370
>feeblemind
>Target creature’s Intelligence and Charisma scores each drop to 1. The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence– or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently. Still, it knows who its friends are and can follow them and even protect them. The subject remains in this state until a heal, limited wish, miracle, or wish spell is used to cancel the effect of the feeblemind. A creature that can cast arcane spells, such as a sorcerer or a wizard, takes a -4 penalty on its saving throw.

>unfortunately she was the cleric with 20 wis, so we're having to lead her around on a leash until we can fix her

>>52777998
>>52778031
Illiterate peasant with an uncanny ability for common sense. Mentally retarded and probably a mute, but has an innate ability to work things out - kind of like an idiot savant. can't talk, but able to do long division in his head or count cards or suchlike.

>>52778010
This isn't that hard to imagine. A guy who has extreme strength and hitting power but for whatever reason can't take a single hit himself. Like an octopus, they're strong as shit and could break your leg bones with their tentacles, but still squishy little fucks who couldn't take a punch to the beak.

>>52778153
>how do you know so much about history
>most of it's obvious
No, it's because the geezer lived through it, dummy!

Also, lol at the Calvin and Hobbes wannabe

>>52778646
That many Cranium rats should easily attain sentinence and collectively be a pretty damn powerful mage though.

>>52779379
>What is your purpose in this army?
>To do whatever you tell me to
This is the line that I think of for low int and high wis.

>>52777998
Forest Gump.

>>52778183
>giovanni orgy

>>52778367
You'd be surprised.

>>52778031
>just made a 16 wis 8 int 8 cha Cleric
>is really shit at converting people

>>52777998
I think a creature could with 1 int and 20 wis, would be able to *feel* things due to their wisdom, but they wouldn't be able to develop those thoughts or articulate what they feel about it.

>>52781924
Alright what the fuck are you going on about you doomaws

>>52786493
Not him, but there's a pretty clear distinction between a Nat20 on attack rolls vs a Nat20 on skill checks to do impossible things.

With attack rolls, you can easily come up with ways to make it make sense.
>Fighting ridiculously agile enemy you shouldn't be able to hit
>As you raise your blade, a nearby light reflects off of it, blinding your opponent for just a moment, for you to deliver an opportune blow!

>Fighting ridiculously well armoured enemy whose plates should deflect any blow
>Emboldened by your weak strikes, your enemy lets his guard down, arrogantly thinking himself impregnable; only for you to prove him wrong, as you stab at a tiny opening near the arm pits!

It's the difference between Smaug being defeated by a miracle shot into the one tiny hole on his chest, and Smaug being defeated by a warrior leaping 500 feet in the air and stabbing him in the eyeballs.

>>52778153
But that is high int, low wis

>>52778031
>Like what does a 20 wis, 1 int person act like?
A talking artifact. E.g., basically Google as a tome of magic. It may respond to your questions in a meaningful, helpful way, in a voice and manner that even sound refined, but it ultimately doesn't really think.

>>52785202
That sounds... philosophically complicated. How would you know they didn't posses conscious thought if they acted as though they did?
>having brains simpler than slugs
At the very least you could say that whatever forces made them behave the way they did were the actual intelligence using them as puppets/remove control robots.

>>52777998
Wisdom as an ability score never really made sense to me. Mostly because I guess i equate it to like, philosophy and the likes.

>>52784639
Never because its true. Strongest men in the world competitions are not populated by Mr. Universe contestants.

>>52787643
Wisdom is non-social awareness and drawing connections and meaning from the events around you. It is physical awareness to see the connections of the material world around you. It is spiritual awareness to see the deeper meanings of things and the connections of the physical world to that of the other planes.

>>52787344
Yep, that's basically the Chinese Room argument, though modified in the way that the person inside doesn't even have any rules for picking responses - they just pick response cards at random and they are always somehow totally correct.
I would make any explanation evade any (super)science thrown at it. No external communication of any kind, so no puppetry. Biological complexity literally too low to permit this level of intelligence. Insighters cloned from DNA samples in secret underground laboratories have the same "insight" abilities. Maybe changing the DNA in any way makes their insight disappear, even for edits that are harmless as far as science knows.
And then someone starts claiming that this "insight" is miraculous, divine in nature.

>>52789251
Interesting premise. If I learned all of this in a game I was in, I would assume we the party were in a simulation of some sort and something was manipulating the underlying probabilities from the outside to make the Insighters "luck into" intelligent decisions. I'd try to investigate that line of thought by experimenting on them, and maybe even learn something about the reality outside of the simulation.

>>52778010
You know that shit where people in a crisis perform outrageous feats of strength, and then they end up fucking up their muscles from doing it? Someone like that, all the time.

>>52788065
all products of intelligence

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>>52778010

>>52790253
"Intelligence" and "wisdom" as they are thought of in D&D do not actually exist, at all.
So don't use real world affairs to define them, you are simply sidestepping the argument

>>52790034
That's one interesting explanation, though I think it would make Insighters too overpowered. An "outside" observer, something like Laplace's demon or even God controlling them would know things that the aliens couldn't possibly know, even with their perfect insight. They should have some limits.
For example Insighters shouldn't know the result of real-life Schrodinger's cat experiment before actually observing inside of the box. People should be able to successfully lie to them. Or maybe not lie in person, since the aliens could gain insight from body language, etc., but maybe lie to another human, who would believe what they were told was true and pass that on to the Insighters.
Maybe they should act only as a reaction to some stimuli, like getting hungry or observing a person getting ready to attack them. Like they don't plan on invading Earth, they don't even have capacity for it, but if they learn Earth is planning to invade them, they will swiftly and perfectly remove our ability to harm them.

>>52790253
>>52787643
>>52788065

It literally always boils down to "book smarts vs street smarts", plus shoehorning in a faith stat.

I understand that the actual psychological concept of "intelligence" incorporates every facet of intelligence, whether its the ability to learn new information, process it, apply it, whatever, but real world intelligence isn't INT. Real world intelligence is a mix of INT, WIS, and CHA.

It would probably be more accurate to call INT "Knowledge", considering the skills that are based on INT are basically collected information.

I never really understood why sorcerers are CHA based. If it is an in-born talent, then shouldn't WIS be more appropriate?

>>52790410
>intelligence and wisdom don't exist
Keep tipping that fedora, I guess.

>>52791387
He said "as they are thought of in D&D." Obviously they do exist but they can't be arbitrarily separated. Wisdom, in real life, is a facet of intelligence.

>>52778031
"Life is like a bawx of choco-lates, you nevuh know what your gonna get."

>>52778031
Our guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hT8h4UmuN1Q

>>52778153
That's just high CHA.

>>52778072
What the hell was this comment? It's like he didn't read what he replied to and just say "LITERALLY"

>>52795568
I presume he thought the word was being used incorrectly, even though it was not