Encounter brainstorming thread how crazy would it be if you

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>magic missile
>soldier dead

If he shot on sight like a retard >>52763432
If not,
>caster use language spell
>???
>a whole new world
But, it would still be like any other encounter with language difficulty and unknown fighting style.

>>52763372
It would made me groan desu. I dislike modern day anachronisms in fantasy settings vehemently.

Depends: what branch, and what MOS/Rate/AFSC?

>>52763867
what's his tax policy?

>>52763881
No taxation without ventilation.

>>52763372
If the party had a wizard or artificer it would probably result in massive campaign derailment as they try to recreate the soldier's rifle (after killing him without much effort, assuming they're level 3 or higher and no one gets killed in the first few rounds, because D&D characters are pretty bullshit)

The 5e DMG puts an automatic rifle as a 2d8 martial ranged weapon with the Burst Fire property, which would be seriously bad news in the hands of a reasonably optimized fighter. There aren't even prices listed for modern and futuristic weapons, but a musket which is just 1d12 is at 500gp

>>52763838
I do too.
Lets be friends.

"I'm sorry could you repeat that? I couldn't hear you over the sound of everyone rolling their eyes"

>>52763881

>I'd fight a mortarman and a rifleman the same way that I'd fight a scout sniper

Let me give you a serious answer.

The first problem is one of conceptualization. A modern soldier can engage from distances that are, in some instances, beyond visual range and certainly beyond the range that anyone in a standard adventuring party can retaliate beyond. A few in-game rounds of sustained fire from someone in cover laying down fmj rounds aimed at the squishiest party members followed by the martials who have no ability to retaliate is going to be more than most parties can handle. Environmental modifiers complicate this further: engaging with someone utilize thermal optics and night vision while engaging from range could make a night-time forest encounter an even worse slaughter.

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I've kinda fancied this image. Like what could have taken place that brought these two forces together.

>>52763372
Depends on the fantasy setting

My fantasy setting involes bunch of F-4/F-104/F-111 pilots that consist of many different kind of fantasy races that triying to protect their homeland that consist of several floating cities from supersonic wyverns, shapeshifting sapient dragons, cliffracers and, of course, other conglomerate of floating cities. And the tech level is basically 1970s with applied magic in them (somekind of bioshock like application), so i would laught at his face while i blast him from above.

>>52763372
>how crazy would it be if you were playing in a fantasy setting and your entire party had to fight a modern day *Big Boss*?
ftfy

THAT is how you make an anachronism worthwhile

>>52764534
I'm sorry, when I was reading that all I could hear was the sound of a /k/omrade furiously jacking off over 'muh guns.'

>>52765569
You have to admit that guns have better range than swords, though.

>>52765611
>fantasy setting

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>>52763372
I miss HeroScape

>>52765623
Not him but i don't remember any fantasy setting having individual combat over 500 meters

>>52763372
>>52764534

He still gets fucked up by Magic Missile as Magic Missile never misses. Your modern rifleman is a low-leveled duelist or ranger with equipment that's above-average for being mundane, but is ultimately just that, mass-produced mundane equipment. He still has to deal with the same martial ceiling that every other non-magical class in existence has to deal with.

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>>52766279
D&D 5e.

>>52766681
Someone should make a 1 mile board just to use this

>>52766666
Ok, Turbo-Satan, as someone who doesn't play DnD I have to ask - at what point MM is capable of one-shotting someone with 100% chance? And what's it's effective range?

>>52766724
No idea about 5th edition, but in d&d 3.5 even a level 20 wizard (pretty much an end of campaign legendary mage) casting it has a range of just over 91m. The damage will be likely be sufficient to kill any commoner, but people with a reasonable number of character levels will likely be fine.

Wizards do far more OP things though depending on their level. Invisibility, spells where people have to make a saving throw or are completely incapacitated and effectively dead (or just outright dead), spells that would provide immunity to non-magical weapons, shapechanging, and so on.

In answer to the OP, it likely depends on how you would convert a modern day soldier into you system. It's possible the soldier would just wipe them out from ridiculous ranges if the party didn't know they'd be facing an opponent like that, but even relatively low levels wizards / clerics in a system like D&D would likely obliterate them.

Okay, so you fire off the magic missiles and they seem to hit, however he seems completely unaffected. You can roll arcana to try and figure out why. In the meantime you hear a thump - he fired some projectile which flies in an arc in your general direction. You instinctively jump away and rightly so, because the projectile explodes like a fireball. Roll dex save. Next turn.

>>52766724
If we're going with an operating operator that operates at maximum operational efficiency, then let's go with a moderately optimized D&D 5e character.

>20th level character
>Loremaster Wizard 6 / Twilight Druid 14
Casting Magic Missile as a 9th level spell, he creates 11 missiles that each do exactly the same amount of damage, which is the result of a 1d4+1 roll. Twilight Druid allows you to add 7 d10 dice from your Harvest's Scythe pool that damage roll, which means you fire 11 magical missiles that each do the result of 1d4+1+7d10. On average, this would do mean each missile does an average of 42 damage each. There are 11 missiles. That means an average of 462 damage. As he is a Loremaster Wizard, he can sacrifice a 2nd level spell to make the Magic Missile have a maximum range of a mile. So that's 462 damage that cannot miss its target or be resisted by the target at a range of a mile.

To put this into context, in D&D 5e, your average human commoner has 4 hit points. And like I said, this is a moderately optimized character rather than a fully optimized one.

>>52766839
>>52766724
>>52764534
>>52763372
Oh, so here we have someone that doesn't even play the game, they just want to masturbate over how a true operator would totally kick any dumb wizard's ass.

>>52766860
I, for one, want an actual answer, but none of the posts has satisfied me so far. So stop projecting.

DnD is shit anyway.

>>52766860
>I can't solve a high level encounter with a single casting of magic missle bawwwww
You've never seen helmed horror or rakshasa's statblocks or heard of brooch of shielding, have you?

>>52766888
If you're the same person who posted >>52766839, then it's evident you'll never be satisfied. You were presented with a method of targeting your precious operating operator that cannot be avoided or resisted and you just pretended it didn't work or had no effect.

Anyone could list a dozen other spells from any edition that would solve this problem but if you're just going to fiat them away with no explanation, there's no point in even trying.

>>52763372
A squadron, maybe? Otherwise, if the party has any caster with a remotely working brain and diverse spell-list, they'll probably find something to shut down a single soldier pretty easily (assuming this is D&D).

>>52766900
not him, but no, I haven't. what are you talking about and what does it have to do with a modern soldier?

Funny how the thread immediately assumed that "fantasy setting" = "DnD".

>>52766952
If you're going with something as vague as 'fantasy setting,' yes, everyone's going to assume that you're going to mean D&D, the system usually used to represent generic fantasy settings.

>>52766937
The creatures I mentioned are unaffected by magic missile and brooch of shielding is an item similarly protecting from it. First word in the thread is "Encounter" and we are building an interesting encounter with modern day soldier. Encounters that are solvable with single casting of magic missile are shit, and we don't do shit encounters, so we grant the modern soldier immunity to force damage and explain it via "that's how modern armor interacts with magic" handwaving.

>>52766964
That's what I dislike, that it has gotten to the point that DnD is assumed to have monopoly on fantasy.

Though to be frank, the biggest faggot here is OP for posting a bait thread.

>>52766974
Okay, fully present the stats of the modern soldier rather than making them up on the spot and state the system that you're using as well.

For example, thermal optics and night vision. That counts as darkvision is a system like D&D 5e, right?

>>52766974
Okay, I can see why you'd do it like that, but I'm getting a bad feeling about it. The same feeling I get when reading "Humanity, Fuck Yeah" stories.

I don't really see how making him immune to the parties attempts at damage helps much. A modern soldier just wouldn't have that much HP (12?) so any situation where he gets into range of any player would end unsatisfactorily, since it's just 1 guy.

This thread is a bunch of guys waving their dicks around.

A modern soldier is just a human ranger with a really awesome bow. How your party handles him is depends on whether he's level 1 cannon fodder or BBEG operating at the highest speed with the lowest drag.

>>52763372
>some level 3 chub with a weapon that does 1d8+dex
We deal with him same as any archer

>>52767101
Wrong.

A green-as-grass modern soldier is CR 10 at the very least, regardless of edition.

I'm not even going to start on how powerful a properly armed veteran would be.

>>52767120
See >>52767117

>>52767117
run up to him and attack as soon as you can?

>>52767028
Don't really think thermal would be an analogue to dark vision because thermal is like YOU'RE A FUCKING GLOWING WHITE SILHOUETTE AGAINST A DARK GRAY BACKDROP

>>52767055
In 5e a gladiator has 112 hitpoints, he'll survive a single round of spellcasting and we should design the adventure so that it's him who can instagib the party from distance rather than the other way round. Make him a marksman/sniper, place him in some tall building in an urban/ruin environment, ton of traps, maybe some drones and/or uncooperative locals. It could be a cool session, direct approach gets everybody killed, so the party needs to somehow reach him while avoiding traps, distracting him and so on. Basically a Stalingrad session except the party consists of fantasy adventurers.

>>52767117
An aimed shot would be an auto-hit like Magic Missile, probably for something like 6d8 force damage.

A burst would probably be three +9 attacks, which each do 6d8 force damage.

A full-auto spray would probably be twelve +4 attacks, which each do 6d8 force damage.

>>52767149
Yup. He can plink at us all he wants, assuming his pea-shooter can even hit our AC.

How fast and strong is a magic missile anyway?
How well would it do against level 4 plates

>>52767167
Okay, thermal is darkvision plus advantage to perception checks. How's that?

>>52765007
that pic triggers me just because of how varied the different soldiers are, especially the two guys in the background with the camo paint and what appears to be a ghile hood.

>>52767186
I think you underestimate how much a copper coated lead ball going a kilometre a second hurts

>>52767199
Sounds about right.

>>52767187
See >>52766843.

Most ancient dragons have around 400 hitpoints. That moderately optimized spell is enough to one-shot a lot of ancient dragons.

Are level 4 plates stronger than the scales of an ancient dragon and is the body beneath stronger than the sinew of an ancient dragon?

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Rolled 6, 4, 2, 1, 3, 5 = 21 (6d8)

>>52767184
>6d8 force damage

>>52767231
Dragons have what, zero damage resistance?

>>52767228
In which case, I play a warlock with Devil's Sight and cast Darkness on an object the warlock's carrying. Darkness can't be seen through by darkvision, but a warlock with Devil's Sight can see through it. So any attack against the warlock has disadvantage and any attack the warlock makes against someone who can't see him through the Darkness spell has advantage, due to the Darkness spell blocking the thermal optics.

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>>52767231
Yes, but it was canned by the military.

>>52767231
I don't know about the plates because that shit is hard af but i guess anyone behind the plate would have their torso turned to goop by blunt force trauma at that point anyway

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The last wizard I played had a permanently hung spell to redirect any bullets that hit him 180 degrees back at whoever fired them. Specifically bullets. Good for any other bullets that hit within a 6 second window after the first.

I only got *one* use out of that spell in the whole campaign and I'm still not satisfied with how it went down, mainly because any mouthbreathing retard should understand that hooking up 3 MG42s on a tripwire to fire at a wizard in order to distract them while you shank them in the back is a terrible idea, because as soon as they shanked me too hard to re-cast the spell I just went prone, removing the one obstacle protecting said edgelord from the next 360 rounds put down range. I still don't know what the fuck that NPC was expecting to happen, to this day.

Like don't get me wrong, it definitely distracted me, and I got shanked REAL hard, but it doesn't seem to weigh up vs. how fucking hard the dude got turned into a fog of blood by crossfire. But I was already past the expendable fodder and summons at that point. He was a guy who definitely knew what was going on and definitely should have had a self-preservation instinct. I just don't understand what the hell he was trying to accomplish.

>>52767265
good, now you're actually putting some thought in instead of casting 'I win'

>>52767265
I guess infrared is still light so that works?
But thermals usually emit their own light so how does that interact with darkness?

>>52767286
Devil's Sight Darkness warlocks are commonly viewed as boring 'I win' buttons in D&D 5e, so a lot of people would disagree with you. The point is, there are established methods of getting around foes like this.

>>52767293
Darkness creates darkness, IE makes a room darker than it should be given the amount of light present. It stands to reason that in order to do this it must be suppressing light and light sources in the area.

If you cast darkness on a fire, the fire is dimmed. Therefore the thermal signatures of anything around would also be dimmed.

>>52767293
Darkness is a spell that creates a magical darkness that cannot be seen through, even by creatures with eyes adapted to seeing in the dark through a variety of means.

Thermal optics have been stated to be the equivalent of darkvision, in the system. Are you stated that's now inaccurate, after it's previously been established in this thread that it's a suitable comparison?

>>52767275
If a guy is at 500 meters, the bullet will be at you in half a second and in half a second, he could easily move away because it would take 1 second for the bullet to eventually reach back at him from shooting you.
I guess it works if you don't want to get hit but not many people are gonna die from that past close range.
If he was further away, he wouldn't even have to move because bullet drop would move the bullet away from him

>>52767184
Depends on what CR you're aiming for. For 10-ish in 5e I'd do something like:
Aimed shot: +8, 5d10 piercing (magical) and DC 15 Con save or instantly drop to 0 hp instead.
Hip fire: +8, take three shots, 5d10 piercing (magical) each.
Burst fire: everything in cone of fire takes 10d10 piercing, DC15 dex save for half.

>>52767293
>>52767265
Depending on power level you could even say the thermal vision basically grants you diminished true sight. I'd have the darkness block it though.
You must remember it's only disadvantage to hit though, and the soldier is going to have burst fire and explosives. Darkness will make you safer, but not safe.

>>52767318
If you cast Darkness on a fire, would it be colder? Infrared is heat.

>>52767319
>>52767318
No i'm just wondering how it would affect the thermal's own light

>>52767348
Infrared is light emitted by heat, that's how they pick up heat signatures

>>52767215
It'd have to first hit, mind you. A low level mook like a soldier would have to hit bonus around +2, meaning he'd hit just on critical success against even moderately geared up party.

>>52767348
Darkness blocks vision of all things that exist within it, no matter how they are viewed. Only a few specific divination spells or passive effects are able to see through magical darkness.

>>52767362
Yeah maybe if you were fighting conscripts
You guys actually underestimate the average soldier. Not that they'll stand much of a chance anyway

>>52767389
A soldier is a common man given training and equipment. That would make him a low level NPC in D&D.

>>52767435
Yeah and guns are designed to be easy to aim. Except handguns. Fuck handguns

>>52767348
Infrared light isn't literally heat, it's just the wavelength of light predominantly responsible for heat transfer by radiation, which in turn is only one of the three primary means of heat transfer. It is for example, totally possible to have massive quantities of infrared light be absorbed by something and only increase its temperature a small amount, if the photon capture is managed correctly.

It certainly does means the fire wouldn't feel as warm from further away, but up close it would be exactly as hot. In fact, setting a shitload of bonfires inside an area darkened by this spell would make for an extremely easy deathtrap, as people wouldn't be able to tell if they caught fire until they were thoroughly alight.

>>52763372
>hex him
>he can't aim
>his gun jams on the second shot
>he drops grenade clumsily at his feet
>BOOM
One dead modern soldier later everything is better with a healthy dose of magic

>>52767357
>>52767372
>>52767487
Don't mind >>52767348 he has no idea how infrared works

>>52767453
Thing is around levels 5-6 the characters start to detach from what's realistic and turn into super heroes. That assault rifle does 2d8 damage and shoots three times in a round, for average of 27 dmg (assuming all shots hit which is not a given by far). An average Fighter at that point has at least 50-60 hp, and his fighting efficiency is not affected at all as long as he has at least 1 hp left.

You can understand the growing horror of that poor bastard soldier when he fires at the monster, seeing him hit his target yet it keeps coming at him, shrugging off what should be mortal wounds like water.

And then there's the actually dangerous classes, like wizards and druids.

>>52767513
You ever tried pulling the pin on a grenade? It's harder than it looks

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>>52763372
That seems like the least crazy encounter the party has yet to fight. Certainly less crazy than giant hair snakes or astrotelepath hive minds.

>>52767519
How long is a round anyway?
I head people say a round is 5 second but in 5 seconds, you would have expended all your rounds and are partway through reloading

>>52767539
A round is six seconds, and you can fire three bullets in that time so emptying your clip is going to take some time. You can attack and reload during the same turn if you don't move.

>>52767584
>3 rounds in 6 seconds
Is this guy sniping or some shit? An AK which shoots slow for an assault rifle fires 30 rounds in 3 seconds. Hell even if you had a semi automatic rifle you could fire all your rounds in 6 seconds

>>52767215
dnd 5e says an automatic rifle hurts for 2d10+dex.

pf says 1d10

>>52767635
You probably aren't going to hit anything If you do that though.

I don't know much about guns but the recoil of 30 bullets in 3 seconds should throw tour sim off.

>>52767773
If the guy has an M16 he could do it. Maybe a few grazes and near misses here and there but a standing man is a pretty big target and most would hit.

>>52767487
>In fact, setting a shitload of bonfires inside an area darkened by this spell would make for an extremely easy deathtrap, as people wouldn't be able to tell if they caught fire until they were thoroughly alight.
I'm totally stealing this.

>>52767635
Perhaps in real world, but we're talking about encounter in a fantasy world D&D, where an assault rifle would fire three rounds in six seconds.

>>52767959
Why would it only fire three rounds per second, apart from Gm fiat?

>>52768042
*per six seconds.

>>52763372
Offer him beer and tobacco. Job jobbed.

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>>52763432
Isn't MM like 1d4 or something? It's like throwing a moderately heavy rock at the other guy, isn't it?

>>52767214
They could be a patch job of different units. Like things have gone so far south that most of the groups in combat are whoever could manage to group up after their main forces were decimated.

Though that's probably a bit far fetched.

>>52768042
Because of the game world rules, of course. It wouldn't be a very balanced weapon if it didn't you know?

>>52763372
>D&D has rules for modern weaponry
>An assault rifle does about 2d10 damage IIRC

Literally can't kill me even if he hit max damage critical hits for 5 rounds straight. So pfft I dunno, mind control him and get his tech or something.

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>>52763372
>first party
>skelly-man with a blunderbus and a lightning cannon
>minotaur that fell five hundred feet and survived by yelling
>bard and mage who are made of paper
>monk who can dodge gravity
>warlock who fires darkfire grenades from his fingertips

Unless the army dude is sufficiently meme-y then this is going to be a very one-sided fight.

>second group
>human ranger with enough STR to tackle a trotting horse
>>decent sneak skills
>>good shot with a bow
>frost troll illusionist
>>adept at misdirection
>>focuses on misdirecting and incapacitating enemy combatants
>human kid, probably a chosen one
>>really lucky
>>cute

Not nearly as meme-tier as the other party. Fight would largely depend on who got the drop on who, and also who got shot down first. The troll is going to make the soldier's day a real pain in the ass if he's allowed to get more than one or two spells off.

>>52768096
>It's like throwing a moderately heavy rock at the other guy
It can very well kill you if it hits your head

>>52763372
>magic missile
I love how people think they'll even see the soldier.

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>>52768327
Yeah, but he's wearing a helmet.

>>52768231
Balanced against what?

>>52768302
Is this a zap lightning cannon or a quake lightning cannon?

>>52768348
not him but THROWING
Not dropping but THROWING
It will be very painful

>>52768349
Balance against things that are not made of APC armor

>>52768361
Probably closer to the Quake one, though I never played the game.

It deals 10d8 in a 5x50 line.

Better idea:
Your team encounters a group of CIA SAD operatives, all obviously recruited from Tier 1 groups like Delta and Seals.
They're 4 in number and their orders are to create a local insurgency against X Kingdom.
They do not need to engage you directly, and their orders are to avoid unecessary direct conflict.
They already have a specialist who knows the local language and all know at least some of it.

How do you handle this?

>>52768398
It's nothing like the quake one. The quake one fires a continuous stream of lightning

>>52768393
Are arrows based against things not made of chainmail?

>>52768399
Cia trained guerillas suck though

>>52768438
Yes unless said thing is made of something really hard... which hammers are overpowered against

>>52768349
Well it's a game so there needs to be balance. A modern soldier just wouldn't be a very big threat because of it, and that's why the encounter wouldn't be very spectacular. It would be challenging to a party of 4-5 1st level characters, but lvl 2-3 would find it fairly easy.

I think the real question is how many riflemen are needed to kill a dragon

>>52768493
What point is there in a game if everything is perfectly balanced against each other?

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>>52768349
>Balanced against what?

DnD basicly flat out refuses as a system to let guns ever make armor and melee combat irrelevant. It gets even worse when a good majority of the player population treats hitpoints like meat-points (see here: >>52767519) in which your heroic warrior will just tank an entire magazine of rifle calibe bullets, run you through, chug a health potion and forget all about you the next day because he's busy killing a giant skeleton dragon that breaths lava.

So please, stop trying to force them it's just depressing, the very rules of physics are quite blatantly bent over backwards to prevent the otherwise inevitable progression out of a fantasy bygone era of quasi-medieval stasis.

If you want a game or system in which guns are actually relevant try GURPS (and promptly lose high point value PCs to a half-aimed spray of smg fire from an unnamed thug.) If you want to shoot machine guns at orcs, elves and shit, then try Shadowrun and hope for big dice pools. I like /k/ but fantasy settings are usually designed to prevent modern technology from making any real impact.

>>52768588
The game rules state that an assault rifle does 2d8 (2d10 in some other editions) damage, and can shoot up to three times in six seconds. Changing that makes the game unbalanced and unfun for players.

>>52768399
>Delta
>Tier 1

>>52768632
Does this statement that the rifle is in the hand of the players or the enemies?

>>52763372
Howsabout the other way around?

You're playing an operator as fuck party in a modern RPG, and encounter high-fantasy murderhobos.

>>52768660
*assume

>>52768634
Actually, Delta are Tier 1, but Seals aren't.
GOTCHA BITCH

>>52768671
So you're a relatively competent guardsmen squad armed with autoguns and come across feudal worlders and a couple psykers?

>>52768660
It doesn't matter who wields the weapon, no. Weapons shouldn't be very powerful by itself, and getting to attack three times per round without feats or character levels is already powerful enough. The damage weapons do should come from having high level characters and their abilities, not from the weapon's stats.

>>52768718
>man the fantasy characters have a bunch of magical or fantastical feats and all that
>better nerf this piece of equipment that equalizes things because balance dictates the modern soldier should be on par with low level adventures (according to... my dick!)

>>52768718
How would you apply the approach you just demonstrated to magic?

>>52768749
If you want to make modern soldier more dangerous then you should give him class levels too, but keep gunpowder weapons in line with other weapons in the game to maintain the game balance, simple as that.

>>52768793
Magic gets more powerful with character levels, yes.

>>52768795
Except an M4 carbine is magnitudes superior to every other weapon in DnD in real life so why can't it be in DnD?

>>52768811
How powerful?

>>52768671

Die when I try to use a grenade because the wizard telekinetic jammed it down my throat?

Or their cleric makes it rain frogs and lighting?

or their ranger/druid makes the trees and squirrels betray our positions before turning into a wolf the size of a fucking Humvee?

Hell, 'Heat Metal' is only second level and will basicly destroy any equipment it's cast on (assuming it doesn't cook off the munitions too.)

>>52768836
Because of game balance, this was already explained to you earlier.

>>52768846
Very powerful, as it should be. It's an integral part of the fantasy genre.

That's it. I'm sick of all this "2d8 dmage 3x/round" bullshit that's going on in the d20 system right now. Assault rifles deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that.
I should know what I'm talking about. I myself commissioned a genuine Colt AR15A4 in USA for $1100 (that's about 1 oz of gold) and have been practicing with it for almost 2 years now. I can even shoot through slabs of solid steel with my assault rifle.
American gunsmiths spend day working on a single assault rifle and machine it up to a microscopic precision to produce the finest gun known to mankind.
AR15s are thrice as precise as AK-74s and thrice as reliable for that matter too. Anything an AK-74 can shoot through, an AR15 can shoot through better. I'm pretty sure an assault rifle could easily penetrate a knight wearing full plate with a single shot.
Ever wonder why Soviets never bothered conquering USA? That's right, they were too scared to fight the disciplined operators and their AR15s of destruction. Even in Vietnam, Charlies targeted the men with the assault rifles first because their killing power was feared and respected.
So what am I saying? Assault rifles are simply the best guns that the world has ever seen, and thus, require better stats in the d20 system. Here is the stat block I propose for AR15:
(Assault Rifle)
1d12 Damage per shot
max 30 shots + reload/round
19-20 x4 Crit
+4 to hit and damage
Counts as Masterwork
Now that seems a lot more representative of the kinetic power of assault rifles in real life, don't you think?
tl;dr = Assault rifles need to do more damage in d20, see my new stat block.

>>52768884
That makes no sense.
It's like saying mythical Excalibur should be balanced to be equal as a rusty old dagger.

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>>52768846
When you get to level 15 niggas start tossing around small-ish black holes and opening portals to dimensions made of magma or hurricanes (Implosion is a clerical miracle if I recall), only once a day, but still. First level wizard start out being able to use an attack that WILL NOT MISS and will basically kill any normal peasant (assuming you arn't hiding behind a solid wall, magic missile actually has some funny interactions with 'concealment in cover that a lot of people forget'.) By 8th level said wizard is starting to fly around invisible and teleport while summoning actual demons to track you down and rape you in the ass while you sleep.

>>52768836
>M4 carbine is magnitudes superior to every other weapon in DnD in real life so why can't it be in DnD?
see
>>52768590
>TLDR: the divine powers of the universe told you to take your firearms and stick them up your ass till you taste the cosmoline. Also your rifle can't steal souls, shoot lighting, or cut through a mountainside can it? Because a high fantasy Fighter probably has a damn golf bag of weapons with obscene and unnameable powers.

>>52768632
i know this breaks the rules, but i would argue that's per attack, which if he has multiple attacks (say the full 4) that would be 12 shots in 6 seconds

>>52768850
Or your sniper picks the mage off at a distance, then you take cover and attack the other three as the squirrels instruct the druid as to your location.

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Hmmm.... nice.

>>52769162
>contingency
You warn the wizard of your presence, he then proceed to teleport the big burly fighter on your head

>>52769240
>hey now, lets not bring contengency into this... it's a brainlessly broken spell and everyone knows it. Lets just assume out of charity they popped the wizard, they still have either a Cleric or Druid who's about to bring the pain, A Martial hero, and a high level Rogue type who just got an assload of 'free' magical items.

I posit that the Divine caster begins his buff cycle (probably starting with conjuring up some hard cover) the Martial either chugs a potion, or pops off their rage while drawing into a support position for the surviving caster, and the Rogue basically disappears from sight.

>>52769355
Without broken spell combinations, it is actually kind of hard to protect yourself from being one-shotted from stealth.

>>52769355
>Okay, so we've got this optimal operator operating at maximum efficiency doing everything he can and using all of his resources to take out the party. What do you do?
>Okay, I'll play optimally as well and use a modified Magic Missile / Contingency / some other optimal strategy for avoiding death or taking out a target with minimal variance.
>But that's brainlessly broken! That makes it a shit encounter! Not allowed! You're not allowed to use those tools in your toolkit! Now let me masturbate over my modern soldier's thirty-rounds-a-round assault rifle, his true sight thermal vision and his resistance-to-all-damage level 4 plates!

If this elite modern soldier gets all of his toys, so do the players.

>>52769752
>>52769463
Actually I'm the one who keeps telling them to abandon any hope of "Muh high calliber assault rifles" being any defense against a high fantasy RPG party.

I just think Contingency Teleport Timestop Delay Blast Fireball wizard is boring and frankly uninspired way to slaughter the Operators, I was going to suggest something lower level and more imaginative, like using Metal to Wood followed by Shape Wood to bind the operators hands with their own weapons.

Or the rogue who could literally step out of their own shadows and stab them with a dirk laced in cockatrice venom.

>>52768399

>CIA SAD recruited from Delta and SEALs
>Doing FID work

I laugh at their ineptitude.

>>52768096
1d4+1. Per missile. And there's a minimum of three missiles as of 5e.

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>>52768671
Can those high fantasy wizards and druids engage, let alone detect, where the rifle fire is coming from when the shooters 300+ meters away?

>>52766843
If your caster even able to visually target someone engaging from 300+ meters away? A wizard doesn't get to point a finger and say "Fuck that one guy that may I can't see and may not even be in that direction."

>>52773256
>druid takes three to the chest and drops
>sinks into the fucking dirt
>thirty seconds later a horrible rock monster explodes from the ground right in the middle of the squad
>bullets are barely doing anything to it as it literally tears your pals limb from limb before sinking back into the ground
Now what?

>>52773319
>>52773256
>what is the divination school for 400?

Caster's first job will probably be to drop a wall of Iron/Force/Ice between them and the 'loud death noises'.

Then they may begin 'scouting' at their leisure with little to no danger to self (Arcane Eye or Prying Eyes comes to mind.)

>>52769240
Assuming high-level murderhobos, you'd get high-level operators as well. Which would be a special forces fire team armed to the teeth.
Mid-range sniper fire would open it, and the fighter would get riddled with GPMG fire as he engaged. Fighters being fighters, that probably wouldn't kill him.
However, wizards are squishy, and a 40mm grenade would put a damper on any further magic.

>>52773423
Retreat, take cover, re-engage. Murderhobos are the ones with the 'engage until death' mindset, operators are used to playing bullet tag and will give ground.

>>52773565
>trying to retreat from something with 60ft of tremor sense and 60ft of movement through unworked ground
Splitting up or running away in that scenario would only get you killed. Earth Elementals would have an unhindered approach anywhere you would find a druid. The best strategy would actually have been the murderhobo way: preparing actions to shoot the damn thing as it pops out of the ground, making sure you have a clear line of sight on everyone.

>>52763372
I like to imagine it would basically turn into the one party member not killed turning into Arnold during the later half of Predator.

>>52773565
>Retreat, take cover, re-engage. Murderhobos are the ones with the 'engage until death' mindset, operators are used to playing bullet tag and will give ground.


>normal humans
>outrunning or hiding from heroic PCs/murderhobos

This is actually a huge problem in DnD, if you didn't kill them outright, actually disengaging from DnD PCs in any fashion short of 'Villain had a prepared a teleportation/collapsing mineshaft/flies away on a giant dragon to unknown location' is incredibly hard.

Even your average high level fighter is probably rocking some sort of crazy footwear that lets them run down their foe and get choppy. That is of course assuming it's a heroic Human who is basically Captain America levels of fit and is slowly leveling towards being Thor, and not 'ye elf ranger' who started out needing only a couple hours of 'meditative rest' a day and ends up doing retarded shit like tracking a 2 days cold trail over bare rock and scrub.

>>52768970
>ar15
>assault rifle
Keep drinking that koolaid

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>>52767055

On the contrary, assuming that this modern soldier has stepped out of a first-world country with a full training regiment under his belt as well as a mission or two, he should be rocking about 34 HP, or the same amount of health as a third-level ranger: this is sufficient to explain how modern troopers survive getting blown up on a regular basis while ultimately remaining in one piece, among other stories of above-average durability. His armor gives him sufficient AC to survive being shot a couple times before failing (which is something rather major to note: ceramic armor will fail after taking repeated abuse), which I think could be said to function as a save, unless he's wearing steel inserts, which while less useful at defending agianst bullets won't degrade from repeated strikes and are vastly more useful in defending against stabbing and slashing damage.

One thing to note about most soldiers is that their loadout is heavy: reguarly over a hundred pounds and much heavier than even a full suit of plate armor as well as lesser balanced, and thus soldiers need to be high-strength for their position even if their primary means of combat is dexterity-based.

>>52774002

A regular soldier won't be outrunning anything unless he dumps most of his loadout. They're built for endurance, not speed, which is what their ride is for.

Everyone pointing out spell range, you still have to be able to see the target to cast

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>>52763432
>Fire real missile
>wizard dead

>>52763432
>soldier initiates fight by firing several lead missiles that shits all over their armour at 300-500 metres range from a concealed position
>1-3 party members dead before they get their first initiative step
>they still don't know where the fuck he is
he may or may not have repositioned

>>52775434
>Every soldier is a sniper

Yeeeeah

>>52767214
I always thought that the humans were mercs which would explain the different gear, or they could be a group from a coalition of nations sent as advisers.

>>52775457
>300-500 metres
>sniping

Even chuckle fuck conscripts will fuck you shit at that range with with a 20 year old Canadian bootleg M16.

>>52775457

The snipers take their shots from 2 miles away and are trained to drop two cherry picked targets within a few second period before changing positions.

>>52775457
300 meters is completely doable, and any SDM can probably hit 500m assuming they were actually trained. This is all assuming an M4/M16 platform.

>>52767214
It's models from X-Com 2. My biggest complaint for which is exactly that, the troops you get have randomised gear.

>>52775495
Don't dream anon

Even on 150 meters nobody in your concript will ever hit shit since the target is already so fucking small, unless they were very goddamn lucky. Real live aren't work like 360 noscope of CoD anon.

>>52775522

Sniper never really wan't to blast anything that was more than 1km nignog, by that range, the wind will fuck you up big time.

Most of record breaking shots require several tries that requires them to shoot like an artillery. Its not fucking effective and fucking waste on ammo.

>>52775742

I'm deliberately skewing things by not pointing out that the sniper doesn't have a sniper since the parameter is "soldier" not "soldiers".

But we aren't even getting into crazy schools catered to top tier SOF guys and guys in Intel.

>>52775742
It really isn't that hard to hit something at 300m

>>52775777

*spotter

>>52775782
Its hard whe you are freshly graduated concript that never get out of shooting range against a dynamic target anon, with only iron sight or 1.5x tac sight that'll-doubly-ever-given-to-your-lowly-expendable-ass-anyway.

>>52776035

>assumes soldier never went to any school beyond basic infantry training and never saw combat

I guess everybody shows their ass in these things.

>>52776035
We had C79A2s on ours. Only the guard had to make due with ironsights because all the drill shit they do would wreck them.

>>52776357
We're talking about conscript, that'll at best only be thrown out at reserves, not a bonafide soldiers m80k.

Well, at least you've tried.

>>52766666
>low-leveled
Says who? If he's supposed to be a challenge for the party then he's at least the same level they are, and a modern soldier is best represented in DnD by a ranger. Also, any solider with two brain cells to rub together is going to shoot at easy targets first. Like say, an unarmored wizard. He doesn't even need to know what magic is (but these days 99% of people from a first world country would reasonably recognize a wizard on sight just thanks to LotR), he only needs to know that that head has no helmet, and will explode like ripe fruit when he shoots it. You're also assuming he'll attack right away, who's to say he doesn't wait for them to make camp? Maybe they make it to an inn, and he plants a shaped charge under the floor of their room to kick thing off? Maybe he marks their route and preps the road with traps like mines and tripwire claymores? The higher level the party is, the more capable of thee things this soldier will be, and the lower level they are, the less he'd need to do them, because they die easier.

>>52776440

>he thinks that's what the military is like

I've known mortarmen in the reserves who have been in shoot outs past 300m on convoy duty during their deployments in Afghanistan because there were no static targets to fire mortars at. Your view on things is pretty fucking skewed.

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Honestly, chances are this squad of VERY LOST soldiers are likely to get eaten by the first hill troll or werecreature they run into and learn what regeneration is, or wake up the angry dead when they decide to 'take cover in the nearby ruins'.

While they're busy trying to set an ambush for these heros they'll find the 'perfect spot' and be absolutely devastated when it turns out they missed the 'very obvious' (to anyone who grew up here) signs it was an anhkeg nesting area.

>>52776501
Since when to random encounters, get their own random encounters?

>>52766860
OP has not specified DnD. Not every fantasy party is subject to d20.

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>Heroic Mortal with a ranged attack that is unblockable and undodgeable without a stunt or a charm

Clearly a candidate for initiation into the tribe.

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>>52776554
Since we started assuming that they arn't a weirdly themed 'level appropriate encounter expending no more than 1/4th of the party's daily resources' and are instead some group of elite soldier badasses who act as true rivals to the standard adventuring party?

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>>52768671
I love the idea of a modern military engaging in warfare against magical creatures such as wizards, druids and other things.

While most of the DnD larpers here would point favor for the magical creatures, modern military's have some insane shit on them and even if you defeat the soldiers in the initial encounter, there will be an army coming for you with tanks, armored vehicles, aircraft and best of all, artillery.

Rolled 3, 5, 2, 5 = 15 (4d6)

>>52763432

>>52776495
>only needs to know that that head has no helmet and will explode like ripe fruit when he shoots it
Axeshually soldiers will shoot center mass, i mean the wizard has no armor and so it's kind of a moot point, but still.

>people who think 300 meters is hard
If you've ever even shouldered a life sized toy gun, you'll notice that most modern guns are designed to shoulder so easily and naturally that aiming is actually quite easy

>how would your fantasy party perform against an F-15?

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>>52778820

It's a construct with numbered Warfare and Strength, but the pilot only has human level Psyche and Endurance. I use the Logrus to establish a psychic connection and deal with the pilot instead of the aircraft.

Shadowites are starting to get uppity these days.

>>52773565
Actually, in 5e a wizard can get more hit points than the fighter if you count Arcane Ward.

>how would your level 3 D&D 5e party deal with a lone Space Marine?
>assume from your favorite chapter.

>>52778889
>jet will be a dozen miles away
>when it goes past you it will disorient you as fuck with a giant boom
>you only have a window of seconds while you're disoriented and he is dropping bombs at you
If you can manage to do that you are actually amazing

>>52779068

You aren't familiar with Amber are you?

>>52779068
>dungeonmastermagic.png

>>52763372

I suffocate him after laughing off bullets as they pierce my useless ectoplasmic flesh.

I laugh as every bullet he fires becomes dicks and rebounds back to his ass.
"What's the safe word?"
"S-s-semper fi..."

>>52766843

Applying bonus damage like that should really be done on a per spell basis, especially for spells that don't make seperate attack rolls.

... Or attack rolls at all.

As for killing dragons, well I suppose the first spell any sane dragon learns is shield, especially since every level 1 wizard in the world is gonna shoot him from over 500 feet when lazily flying overhead.

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>>52776681
>modern military's have some insane shit on them and even if you defeat the soldiers in the initial encounter, there will be an army coming for you with tanks, armored vehicles, aircraft and best of all, artillery.

True warfare is not won not on the battlefield, but in the mind. A war the modern world would be terribly insufficient in waging the moment so much as a single doppleganger, psion, ililthid, illusionist, dragon, or even a lowly aranea makes an appearance. Even a low level wizard or cleric is leagues better at information extraction, terrifying and turning the enemy than the best CIA wetwork team or interrogators.

It would reasonably take years or decades to hope to make inroads infiltrating and subverting with your average medieval culture and alien society using modern methods, a 15th level cleric can literally have the president's daughter sucking his dick within a week if he makes a consciousness effort. Any assets worth seizing would belong to the enemy before they could even be fully mobilized against them, and groups like the Ilithids, dragons or undead will make a far more thorough use of them than we ever could.

>>52768349
An assault rifle is imbalanced against a wizard that can one-shot you a mile away.

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>>52776681

Tanks have been statted in D&D and Pathfinder on occasion and they tend to be roughly as dangerous as a dragon depending on the exact model. Here's the Mark I of 1916 vintage:

>AC 29, touch 9, flat-footed 28 (+1 Dex, +20 natural, –2 size)
>hp 144 (16d10+56)
>Fort +5, Ref +6, Will +5
>DR 10/adamantine; Immune construct traits
>Speed 40 ft.
>Ranged 3 Maxim M1910 machine guns +15 (2d8/19–20), Hotchkiss 6 pounder +15 (8d6/×3)
>Space 15 ft., Reach 5 ft.
>Special Attacks integrated weaponry, vicious trample (6d6+18, DC 30)
>Str 35, Dex 12, Con —, Int —, Wis —, Cha 9
>Base Atk +16; CMB +30 (+32 bull rush); CMD 41 (43 vs. bull rush, can’t be tripped)
>Feats Alertness, Awesome Blow, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Initiative, Point-Blank Shot, Power Attack, Skill Focus (Perception), Toughness
>Skills Intimidate +15, Perception +26

And they only get more dangerous from there. More commonly, low-leveled parties learn to defeat them by using their own large size against them and trapping them against obstacles. Tanks are generally meant to fight in groups, and what becomes managable for a crafty party can quickly become dangerous as two tanks fight with four times as much efficiency covering each other's weak points and so on. By the time the Wizard gets flight though, they lose a large amount of their danger (but not all of it: a 50. cal remains dangerous for a few levels more) unless they're supported by a dedicated AA vehicle.

>>52780322

SPAA are probably more effective than tanks even against ordinary adventurers, due to the higher rate of fire and weapons generally designed for that sort of application.

>>52766211
Heroscape was so SICK

>>52780400
Would the heroscape board pieces work for a D&D game grid, or would it mess all sorts of distance stuff up?

>>52779102
I am. Even Amberites know full well the dangers of modern weaponry, doubly so since Corwin seized Amber with little more than a hundred or so basic riflemen.

If it's full tilt warfare, they're fucked. How are you going to attack the pilots mind when he blazes pat at 25000 feet and has already dropped his payload? SUpersonic means it's miles away by the time you even notice the engine noise mere moments before the missiles and bombs impact.

>>52763838
What if your extremely boring medieval fantasy setting is actually set in the far future and he's a soldier from a thawed cryogenic sleep thousands of years ago.

>>52776677
At least Doomguy can cast BFG

>>52776440
You're assuming that every conscript is from bumfuckistan nowhere with a 50 year old kalashnikov and no training whatsoever beyond walking and shooting in a general direction.

A conscript from a first world nation will generally have a full year of intense education before being finished, much more than many american professional soldiers could boast before going to Afghanistan their first time.

>>52764020
D&D wasn't exactly meant to do modern/future adventures. The Renaissance weapons and gear have prices because WoTC figured it wasn't all *that* reasonable someone might just want to set their game somewhere where muskets are commonplace (between Warhammer and Warcraft it's been popular for years). The modern and future equipment, on the other hand, is pretty much assumed to always be an out of context issue for the setting. Starship crashes in the elf forest, the orcs steal laser guns from it or something. If you're planning on making a setting where people can go over to town and just buy assault rifles, you've probably gone far enough from D&D's home territory you're mechanically on your own.

>>52776495
I thought an optimized D&D party had nothing but wizards nowadays? Or did the metagame change since last update?

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>>52781782
The other anon does not seem to get we live in an Age of Fucking Magic, right now

Like this is it, this is our era of the impossible, our tech has already snowballed to a crazy point and keeps doing so

For fuck's sake when you think words your vocal chords still make sublingual vibrations they're making machines to read WE WENT TO THE MOON

Throw magic settings at us all day long because guess what asshole *we are now on par with a lot of them*

>>52784218
Been smoking that good old bill nye lately huh?

>>52775495
>chuckle fuck conscripts
>turn zeroing to max
>thinking it makes the gun to more damage
never underestimate human stupidity

>>52776681
There's an anime exactly about that. It's very self-indulgent and takes itself too seriously for what it is, but it's a fun show.

>>52786124
GATE doesn't count. It's shit.

>>52773743
>Splitting up or running away

Found the murderhobo. 'Tactical retreat' is not 'running away'. You give ground to gain a better position, and tire your enemy out.

>>52774002
>actually disengaging from DnD PCs
Not disengaging, merely refusing to engage up close and let the fighter make full attacks.

Save-or-die effects from the mage would be ineffectual against a properly conditioned modern soldier; they're pretty much fighters themselves.

>>52775275
Standard procedure is to drop any overland packs once a fight starts, or to leave them on the vehicle, yes?

Of course, adding a vehicle gives fire support. I doubt Mage Armour or magical full plate will protect against a .50cal, or a GMG.

>spooky encounter
>abandoned place
>small hole in wall
>PC encouraged to stick arm through and feel around
>PC feels the top of a person's head, where the hair originates

>>52778543
And that ties back into
>The higher level the party is, the more capable of thee things this soldier will be, and the lower level they are, the less he'd need to do them, because they die easier.
See?

>>52767635
And most people can meaningfully swing a sword more than once every six seconds, but in D&D, you can't do that without feats until "edge of human limits" level 6.

Alternatively, a "shot" is an abstraction just like attacks are, and does not correspond 1:1 with bullets fired necessarily.

>>52766860
Were you touched by an operator as a child?

>>52786423
I apologize. Please explain how operators would tactically retreat from something that can move faster than a sprinting human, strike with enough force to kill a man, is resistant to bullets, and can close any distance without exposing itself? The rifle's range is irrelevant when something can cover that distance without providing you an opportunity to shoot it.

>>52791607
> See it coming
> Anti-tank missile to the chest

> Holy shit those guys are hostiles
> Let's hit them with an ATGM first
> Boom

High-level murderhobos = high-level operators.

You could use phoenix command to find the answer.

I did a fight once between a pathfinder level 1 wizard and a isis fighter, the isis fighter won with a single shot.

I made this because someone asked here who would win 500 lvl 1 pathfinder wizard or 500 isis fighters and I decided to test it using phoenix command and mythic roleplying system.

My idea was to roleplay the entire war, but decided i decided to first, get a better system that has mages to replace the pathfinder wizard, didn't came back to the idea.

of course

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>>52791464

Wasn't there a book that gave rules to most modern weapons cira the 80s? I know 1d20 is a common statline for a pistol, but where does it originate?

>>52781728
They're just about 1 inch bases, so you can use them in most grids.

Heroscape terrain is hex. And it's expensive even in grab bags, so theres little point in building out encounters.

>>52766843
>Twilight Druid allows you to add 7 d10 dice from your Harvest's Scythe pool that damage roll, which means you fire 11 magical missiles that each do the result of 1d4+1+7d10.
That sounds wrong, just judging from what little I know of 5e mechanics. At best it's probably more like 11d4+11+7d10 total damage.

>>52763372
let's say he's a pretty well-trained, well-equipped modern soldier, like an american army infantryman or a marine

let's say 1 of them vs a 1st level 3.5 adventuring party (fighter, cleric, rogue, wizard)

he probably doesn't have a particularly good spot or listen modifier (he might, but not necessarily), but then he won't be all that easy to detect himself, rogue will probably be better at stealth/detection than him, the wizard also has decent detection due to familiar

a magic missile won't drop him, neither will a longbow shot unless the fighter is a specialist or something or its a crit

he can shoot accurately for hundreds of feet, and his bullets go right through armor
he can also get off more attacks per round than any one of them

in a dungeon, the rogue has a decent chance of sneaking up on him getting in a few sneak attacks before he can react
the wizard can drop him with one spell if he's within range (color spray, sleep, silent image and shoot from obscurity)

but if he gets to act, he could drop all of them in one round

its pretty swingy either way

>>52791855
>See it coming
How? It's moving through the ground without disturbing it.

>>52797775
He would get three attack rolls, and only target more than one PC if they clump together. Entirely survivable.

>>52797883
one shot per 2 seconds with a military rifle? id say its at least double that, unless its at long range