Shadow war /swag/

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About to start my Ork gang with just about my favourite model in the Ork line.

A little worried about the WYSIWYG aspect as he'll have a power claw modeled... or maybe I could magnetize it... but magnetizing pewter tho... not sure.

Played the hit and run mission today, I was attacking and my friend was defending. He rolled high and I rolled low for models coming in, so he had his entire army on the board whilst I only had half of my guys. We deploy and he gets first turn and shoots my leader off the board before I can even do anything. I have to take down one of his guys but there's no way to get into charge range without first stopping in the open and taking shots from all of his guys. I'm running dark eldar so I've only got pistols, so that's no help.

What am I meant to have done? I feel like it only takes a couple of bad rolls for me to have basically no control of the outcome of the game.

>>52752904

first, add more terrain

second, keep in mind that this game seems to be aimed at churning out campaigns in a single day of gaming

some matches will not go well for you, just shrug it off and get on to the next mission

>>52752904

You just have to roll with the punches in this situation I'm afraid.

It's a similar scenario to 40k, I played a game where all my reserves came in on turn 2. His reserves all stayed off the board until the fourth fucking turn and it put him in a foul mood, even though I said they could come on automatically in the third, he refused. Shitty rolling vs good rolling controlled that game as well.

I would suggest however you probably need more terrain.

This game is not, imo, supposed to be played running across vast open spaces / killing grounds.

>>52752822
You can magnetize metal minis, I've done this with my second edition warriors. It just sucks ass and you need to make it so the magnet is heavily recessed so there's some friction to keep things from rotating.

>>52753120
>>52753082
It wasn't that the terrain was vast by any means. It was just that the guy that I had to kill was on a long walkway, and I couldn't get onto the walkway without having him overwatch shoot me and then shoot me again.

>>52753120
not more than 20% naked board.

A good solution I have found if you just have standard 40k ruins (or similar) is to get a couple sets of aegis-line-alikes and some shipping container like items (think the armored container sets) and scatter that stuff around in the open spaces to create more LoS blockages and medium height cover.

for those that want an extra twist, try this for barrels: Can be attacked under 'attacking terrain' rules as a small target, T3, if wounded no save goto table: 1-2 dud (empty or something like that), 3-4 minor (use flame result with small blast centered on barrel), 5-6 fuel explosion (largeblast frag effect centered on barrel)

We tried this on saturday over a few games and it added a fun little twist and made the terrain itself more engaging, especially as one mission was centered around a 'resupply dump' with several barrel stacks! It works especially well with the stray shots rule.

>>52753332
Also use the strongest magnets you can get.

So my shop started our swag league this week, one of our players is running elder, and that support turret is stupid. Any way to get around it besides drowning it in bodies? Or are we reading the rules on it wrong. It does not say anywhere that it cannot be deployed on the other side of a wall, and that LoS is drawn from the turret not the specialist.

>>52753584
Yeah use N52 grade magnets, lower won't work out.

lul two threads

>>52752760

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Making errain today, I feel like there is a sweet spot of too much detail and not enough.

I've been going through blogs and pintrest getting ideas but its too high level for me.

>>52753995
Other thread has no title, use this thread.

>>52754064
Yeah also this is one minute older. :)

>>52753941
Pretty sure that would fall under the unwritten "stop playing like a cunt" clause.

For a more specific fix I'd say go with something like the gunner having to be within line of sight of the turret to fire it, and be within a 2" move from it as opposed to just anywhere within 2".

>>52754016
Dude! Your terrain piece looks great. My personal recommendation for using pinterest as inspiration is just to try and see what kind of components they've used. Like "oh, this person used a toy tractor for xxxx" and such. Don't worry to much about copying terrain builds. Let it come from your own creativity. You clearly are on a roll with that piece in your picture. Don't be intimidated by some of the stuff on pinterest. Some of those people have years and years of experience.

>>52754125
Thanks, I'm basically seeing what level of gribble looks like it's enough, for the most part layers of textures look nice as well as even regular industrial shapes. But I'm a sucker for flat places to stand even though it looks boring and sometimes people go overboard with the catwalks and uneven places.

I was thinking about basing my or on the 32 mm bases instead of the 25 mm because I hate how small the 25 mms are. Is this ok? Would you still play with me?

>>52754460
There are no real rules about base sizes even in regular 40k.

>>52754460

Anyone who would not play you over the size of your model's bases is to be avoided like a case of fucking super-aids.

>>52754094
you draw LoS from the gunner anyway, treat the support turret like a token.

"Does not count as a fighter for ANY rules purposes"

>>52754460
Sure go ahead. Makes Your Dudes look more individual anyway.

>>52754354
I agree in part. It's nice for the visual experience if it's cluttered, but you need to find a balance, since it's going to be played on. However, that can be used as a feature as well. A combination of areas where you can move somewhat freely, and other areas that are so narrow that only one unit can pass it. Creating narrow passes can present a tactical challenge later in the game, when you have to decide - do I take this shorter bottleneck route or do I take the longer path where I can move several units in bredth.

It looks like the edges are somewhat uneven. I'd recommend buying a scalpel with exchangable blades and a cutting mat (or a regular cutting board works fine as well). When you cut the edges, work your way through with a new blade. Don't force the blade through to cut it through in one go, but rather make a cut, then trace that cut over and over until you're through. That way you'll get sharp and clean cuts. And even if you get a rough cut, you can go over it and trim the "fluff" with a scalpel afterwards to make it neat and sharp.

>>52754826
No it specifically says you draw LoS from the platform, which makes perfect sense considering that's where the bullets come from.

>>52754983
kick cheesemongering faggot in the balls then.

Argh my fucking eyes and my back. Two arms and one ammo pouch left to clean the mould lines from. Then my starter nine is done.

How well do Tyranid teams fare? Got a trio of warriors I'm looking to dust off.

Tyranid Alpha - Deathspitter, adrenal glands, extended carapace (320)
Tyranid Warrior - Deathspitter, adrenal glands, extended carapace (270)
Tyranid Gun-beast - Barbed strangler, adrenal glands, extended carapace (400)

>>52755149
generally you want to turn your alpha into a CC-monster, adrenal, extended, flesh hooks for wall-climbing, and some choppy (go for paired boneswords later)

strangler and VC both have uses, but the VC is by far the better of the two, regular warriors seem to do just fine with deathspitters and talons

>>52755258
It's not totally dumb to capitalize on his BS4 and use a lower BS regular warrior for CC.

>>52754460
>hivemind

i just looked at GW sector imperialis bases and 60 32mm bases for 26€ is pretty cheap in comparison to like micro art studio ect. and i was just about to ask /SWAG if its "legal" to field GSC on 32mm

>>52754460
>>52755429
I think the worst that can happen if you base your minis with 32 mm is that you can't fit as many on the board in tight spaces. Also a larger base can fit more smaller bases in contact for cc purposes.

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Necrons was my favourite factions since 3E.

> Initiative 2; 33% chance of not falling, get out of pinning or successfully overwatching fleeting targets.
> No High Impact weapons outside spec-ops.
> Specialist has worse weapons than troops.
> Most powerfull gun is S5.
> No CC weapons.

But why would I want to play Necrons in SW:A?

>>52755582
It's your punishment for 4+ reanimation protocols

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>>52755604
I've learned to simply not use the decurium formation against friends.
Losing from time to time is actually pretty ok.

Playing as guard, is it best to start out very barebones and add upgrades later (I have a sergeant, five vets, a flamer, plasma and grenade launcher specialist, no upgrades for anything) or to drop one of the vets and mix in red dots and shit like that?

>>52753346
Could you sneak up and kill the rest of his army instead?

>>52754016
Amazing terrain.

>>52755582
Cause you can get naked warriors with phase shifters for 95pts and play metal zombie attack.

>>52755582
Good BS, sure chance to wound with the high strength reroll wound weapon, good AP, good armour save, good toughness, gets back up from downed on a 1-3.

At least yet better than guardsmen.

>>52755873
That sexy 1A though.
Hope you don't enjoy consistency when skitarii hits you 32'' away at a 2+, through full cover due to clip-harness, Red-dot and Photovisors/omnipex.

>>52752822
Do magnet + pin method.

Basically the magnet is there just to hold the bit onto the pin.

>>52754016
What did you make the ladder from and what did you use for the slatted walkway?

Preorder info for the separate rulebook is out.

It's $40.

Preorders start the 22nd. Release date is May 6th.

>>52756025
They are 3d printed.
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1481146

Finally I'm fucking done with the mould lines.

>>52756104
Link please?

okay, so I ordered 5 grey knights off e-bay, and I've made two list out of them:
List 1
Justicar+Daemon hammer with psybolts and a melta bomb
2 grey knights with force halberds and 2 storm bolter reloads each
OR list 2:
Justicar+hammer+psybolts +melta bomb
Gunner +pcislencer +clip harness
and a Grey knight +warding Stave + psybolts
Which list is better

I just hope we get more options for our kill teams. Fire Warriors, regular marines etc. Also I've always wanted an excuse to get Kabalite Warriors.

>>52755972
Are you playing on an empty board or something?

>>52752822
Which model is this?

>>52756396
Boys>toys

Take as many dudes as you can to start. Only load up on gear and shit after a few games.

>>52756292
You the guardsman? I salute you m8, now I'm gonna go finish mine

>>52756575
I am indeed. I'll assemble them and go over them to see if I need puttying any gaps or such. Then once that's done I'm giving them a basecoat and then I'll post a wip pic.

>>52756400
With these kind of sales I think its reasonable to expect a "Shadow Wars: Expansion", featuring new terrain and a new troop choice for each faction

>>52756602
noice, lookin forward to it. I might post my Fallen to once I'm done

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>>52756317
Just the little spreadsheet they send to retailers.

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>>52756620
I've expected them to release more terrain since the announcement. Unfortunately, I don't really like GW's terrain for the game. It's too tall, doesn't provide nearly enough cover, and doesn't really fit with the terrain they've already made for 40k in general.

>>52756645
Is that the usual codex price? I don't speak freedombux.

>>52756703
Smaller codex's typically are ~$40 USD.

Larger ones are ~$50+.

So yes.

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>>52756504
Pull up either MWG or GuerillaWG batreps. MWG alone got 12 different SW:A videos using Orcs, GK, Skitarii and GSC.

>Notice their terrain.
>Notice how skitarii still gets their 32'' range.
Boards may be cluttered to all hell, but smart positioning goes both ways. If you got chokepoints or high elevation on your gunline the enemy still have to pass through one way or another. if you go the long way round, the skitarii aren't exactly immovable even if they might prefer to be.

>>52756759
So -probably- somewhere around £30. Thanks m8.

>>52756674
I think the SWA terrain goes well with the promethium pipes and shipping containers they sold.

>>52756779
Those fit, I agree. However, the actual buildings and such they sell are completely out of scale with it.

>>52756768
Phase shifters allow you to pass through terrain making it harder for the skiitari to set up fire lanes and chokepoints. High vantage points can still be a problem so deepstriking deathmarks could help.

>>52756635
You should. It's always fun to see what others have come up with.

>>52756645
Thanks

>>52756516

Nob from Ork Kommando set

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>mfw watched an absolute madman run the Green Tide across the board and envelope the Scout player who got the right fucking hump.

glorious as shit famalan

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>>52756842
Spending points on specialists with inferior weaponry in order to get a single round of clear fire before getting shot or charged to shit doesn't really sound too appealing.

What I find hard to understand is why the specialist gun absolutely had to have less range and AP then the standard trooper's without any special abillities.

>>52756635

>Fallen

My Nigga! Are you running as CSM, what Mark are you going with?

>>52757100
That reminds me of the title the other /swag/ thread had: "orks are a melee race, send help theres like 20 and I only have a lasgun" or something like that

>>52757159
Yeah Brother! Here's my starting list for my melee focused Fallen, have you built yours yet?

++ Kill Team (Chaos Space Marines) [1000pts] ++

+ Leader +

Aspiring Champion [280pts]: Camo gear, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Power sword

+ Troopers +

Chaos Space Marine [150pts]: Camo gear, Chainsword, Mark of Khorne

Chaos Space Marine [150pts]: Camo gear, Chainsword, Mark of Khorne

+ Specialists +

Chaos Gunner [150pts]: Assault blade, Camo gear, Mark of Nurgle

Chaos Gunner [150pts]: Assault blade, Camo gear, Mark of Nurgle

+ New Recruits +

Chaos Cultist [60pts]: Autogun

Chaos Cultist [60pts]: Autogun

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>mfw when my brain is running through all the awesome kill team ideas for multiple different gangs, all the different conversion ideas and paint schemes.

Brain please... I can't decide, stop.

>>52756536
warriors and GKs are more or less the exception to this, since your limit is 3-5 you can barely squeeze in 4 and not be very effective, or you can take 3 with useful stuff and then work on getting troopers afterward.

>>52757342
I know man, swa is killing me too but it's a good death.

>>52757342
>>52757375
It's the Your Guys effect.
I don't even play 40k, I'm using my brother's leftover bits, and I'm feeling it too, lookin on the GW store website.

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Is there a way to field Deathwatch as a proper Kill Team rather than just a Space Marine specialist ?

>>52757443
as of now, no

I am working on a homebrew set of rules, but easter's been getting in the way.

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So what's the consensus?

>overall SW:A rating (out of ten or five or whatever you want I'm not a cop)
>best part(s)
>worst part(s)
>number of players in group
>house rules in use
>house rules you wish were in use
>most fun faction to play
>most fun faction to play against
>least fun faction to play
>least fun faction to play against
>strongest faction
>weakest faction

>>52757271

Nice.

I was toying with Ranged (and a melee, but less so)


++ Kill Team (Chaos Space Marines) [1000pts] ++

+ Leader +

Aspiring Champion [280pts]: Camo gear, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Plasma pistol

+ Troopers +

Chaos Space Marine [160pts]: Boltgun, Camo gear, Mark of Tzeentch

Chaos Space Marine [160pts]: Boltgun, Camo gear, Mark of Tzeentch

Chaos Space Marine [160pts]: Boltgun, Camo gear, Mark of Tzeentch

+ New Recruits +

Chaos Cultist [60pts]: Autogun

Chaos Cultist [60pts]: Autogun

Chaos Cultist [60pts]: Shotgun

Chaos Cultist [60pts]: Shotgun


I'm thinking I might just switch the Cultists with Shotguns to Autoguns as I have an idea for a Cultist model.

I was also toying with swopping one of the CSM to a Gunner to an autocannon dude and dropping 2 cultists to deal with bigger threats.

The logic behind MOT is that when big bad weapons do puncture my dudes, the +1 from a MON will be ignored anyway and I'll have another chance to save that damage.

Camo gear would be guys in the full gowns and cowls, side stepping in amongst the shadows in their black armour.

Gah, so excited to start.

Your crazy assault list looks a really interesting concept, 5 Space Marines charging across the board... wew

>>52757443
Count as Chaos Space marines :)

>>52757586
No proper necromunda gangs because GW wanting to sell 40K kits.
Wargear lists are too restrictive due to GW wanting to sell 40K kits.

>>52757586
I give it a perfect 5/7

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>>52757586
THere is no consencus.
But my opinion is as following:

>overall SW:A rating
7/10 (It's necromunda)
>best part(s)
But now with 40k armies.
>worst part(s)
Non-box armies were probably ported without more than an hour each for figuring out details.
>number of players in group
5
>house rules in use
2 advancements per game
>house rules you wish were in use
n/a
>most fun faction to play
not mine
>most fun faction to play against
Orks/IG, you get to feel like your armor actually matters and that the enemy doesn't always hit on 2+
>least fun faction to play
Probably not mine
>least fun faction to play against
Skitarii & Harlequin
>strongest faction
Skitarii & Harlequin
>weakest faction
IG?

>>52756400
Make the jump to Heralds of Ruin.

>>52757607
Interesting point about the MoT, I may have to swap out depending on what kind of threats are in my local meta. And yeah it starts with 7 charging (cultists are there to pin and dogpile) but after the first game I buy the specialists plasmaguns with telescopics and let them overwatch while the other five do the dirty work, cool thing is that I can give the blades to new marines to join in the fray. I am using cadians with converted lasguns as my cultists and the work is easy enough, what did you have in mind?

>>52757872
What is the Heralds of Ruin excluding the obvious Chaos jokes.

>>52757991
Its a well (enough) written homebrew for Killteam that has a lot of flexibility in unit and wargear options and is updated frequently by the community

>>52758062
Sign me the fuck up, playing IG without weapons specialists are a pain.

>>52757820
IG has excellent specialists at their disposal as well as enough dakka to at least pin half the enemy team.
I'd put Necrons below them on the tier list.

>>52758087
http://heralds-of-ruin.blogspot.ca/p/kill-team-rules.html
sent ;^)

>>52757991
Just google "kill team heralds of ruin"; it's a community modification of kill team with optional campaign and vehicle rules.
It's more closely based on modern 40k unfortunatly, but still well expanded, fun and balanced. There are also army lists for unsupported armies like arbites and squats.
Unit count is roughly double that of SWA, with maybe a single APC thrown in.

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>>52757820
TFW your friend is a Skitarii/Harlequin player. :c

>>52757586
>So what's the consensus?
>>overall SW:A rating (out of ten or five or whatever you want I'm not a cop)
ten outta five

>>best part(s)
new terrain

>>worst part(s)
power armour factions, product scarcity, seeing people "make" terrain by gluing cardboard into cubes and calling it a day

>>number of players in group
20 in the store, 2 in my home league

>>house rules in use
none really

>>house rules you wish were in use
more necromunda scenarios, necromunda area control

>>most fun faction to play
orks

>>most fun faction to play against
orks

>>least fun faction to play
'nid warriors

>>least fun faction to play against
'nid warriors

>>strongest faction
grey knights or harlequins or craftworld eldar

>>weakest faction
between 'nid warriors and imperial guard

I've only faced 'nids while playing my GKs which completely fuck them, if you have two psycannons you can't ever lose to 'nids

IG seem in the weak tier because taking 10 guardsmen would get shit on by 10 csm, or heck even 10 space marine scouts, and I'll take 20 orks over 10 guardsmen any day of the week.

GK and harlies seem strong because they have so many sustained fire dice to chuck at you.

campaigns definitely work better only with scouts/ig/orks

>>52758165
>Unit count is roughly double that of SWA

No ples no moar fscking mould lines ples

>>52758165
>but still well expanded, fun and balanced

>balanced

>community rules

HoR has become a bloated unbalanced monstrosity as anons and neckbeards constantly tweak and fuck with rules

HoR has all the negatives of gw's official kill teams (murder squads of t5/t6 nurgle marines) and then weird bloaty nonsense from unbalanced advancement and experience gain

>>52758215
There's no escape from your fate!

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I am going rusted Industrial.
Basecoat Mournfang Brown,sponge black brown then xv-88. Use 2-3 coats of hairspray. Paint
Tamiya Light Blue in a patchy fashion. Remove top layer with flat brush and water.Filter Wash with Mig Fresh Rust fluid.

>>52758062
Can I assume the core rules stay the same as SW:A or is it 40k Melee rules and shit.

>>52758230
That's too bad,last time i played ( roughly a year ago) it felt very balanced. Has anything in particular caused this change?

>>52758373
its 7th ed rules m8 sorry

>>52758215
What do you remove them with? Knife or file?
GW sells a specual tool that is basically just a slightly sharpened edge that makes it no problem at all

>>52758378
yeah whiny neckbeards being able to suggest rules changes

>>52758373
HoR is 7e 40k

>>52758373
It's 7th ed with additions

>>52758392
>>52758403
>>52758424

Oh ok then. Looked over the Necron killteam.
They don't list stats of weapons, some items are changed. Can I assume all listed gear in the 7th codex are available with the same effect for the same cost?

Should I assume I only have access to listed gear? Should I assume the gear listed in the inventroy, but not on the kill-team pdf have the stats of the 7th codex items then?

>I'll be honest, it looked sorta half-assed.

>>52758471
Yes to all questions except the halfassing. I think they want to avoid legal trouble with GW.

>>52758512
Yeah I can see that.
Thanks for making sense of it at least.
But still; calling them Nobles instead of Lords was unnerving at best.
>The rest of the kill-team has the exact same names tho.

>>52758471
You have access to the items noted on the Kill Team lists. You do not have access to codex entries not on the kill team list.
Some entries do not have their rules lised in the kill team list, refer to the codex for those.

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I've got a box of rubric Marines, built 3 of them and botched it on two of them. (Too much primer on one and spilt some glue on another guy so he has "melta damage") is 6 dudes + aspiring sorc enough for a kill team? Too much?

Is it ok to proxy the aspiring sorc as my leader and use the rubrics as regular CSM?
Do I need cultists?

I'm new and these were my first guys just for learning to paint but I'm curious if I could get some use out them as an impromptu kill team? I have the box set still coming (tracking says soon) so I'm excited to build/paint the scouts and orcs anyway but was thinking I could use these spare guys for some variety as I will be playing against my brother only for the time being

I know you guys were saying CSM works best as melee in SW but I need motivation to go and finish assembly/paint on the rubrics. They were much harder to paint than a regular spess marine so far but I'm getting it

>>52758542
Well, it can be reasonably assumed that the Necrontyr hierarchy was more complex than Lord-Overlord-Nemesor-Phaeron, and it's a better Workaround than appointed Immortals.
It also keeps the lords-as-seargent system from pre-7th ed necron codices intact.

>>52757135
Think of deathmarks as wariors that pay 40pts for deepstrike and +1 armor save. They are specialists in a different way from other race's specialist.

It is one of the few things that is unique to necrons in SWA and I think may be what necrons need to figure out how to utilise to gain an advantage over their opponents.

>>52756768
I saw one or two of the MWG videos and noticed a bunch of places where there obviously wasn't enough terrain, that and it felt like they skipped a bunch of bits like moving their guys and all I end up seeing is them rolling their dice again and again to see if they hit/wound stuff.

Rating, 7/10 it's pretty good. Amazing rules, need more options tho. I'm sure I'll be playing this over 40k from now on.

House rules I wish were in use, placing so much terrain that there's cover almost everywhere.

Weakest faction, Imperial Guard due to the lack of heavy weapons to help them on the no-terrain boards and useless lasguns/hotshot lasguns.

>>52758378
When I played it felt very unbalanced, moreso than this. I play guard with commissar leader.

>>52758471
Read the very first block of text on that file.

>>52758565
Lookan great to me. You can make a nice kill team with 6 mahrines. Try and fit a heavy bolter in there somewhere.

You can use whatever models are reasonable I'm sure.

>>52758403
Just had a look at the website and jesus christ did it get bloated

So, who here acquired a new taste of skirmish games with this?

>>52758735
I just like that it doesn't take 3+ hours to finish a game with this. You can actually get multiple games in.

>>52758649
While I agree that MWG might not have the best grasp on the rules which is slightly frustrating; they do have a lot of terrain.

They don't actually use the terrain very efficiently, but I think it would be slightly unreasonable to have more of it then they do.
Less boxes and more scaffolding maybe, but not directly more terrain.

>>52758735
me the smaller size makes it a lot more about tactics and positioning, even if it also makes dice wiffs more likely to have a large effect on the game

>>52758735
I can definitely see myself getting into more skirmish games. Know of any other good systems?

>>52758760
Their water board was a beauty for sure though.

>>52758760
Yeah they have a bunch of it, I just meant that in a match I watched I believed there was just, huge amounts of open ground with nothing to hide behind. I couldn't see anywhere to sneak up to the enemy, if a player desired to do that.

In another map there was a ton of terrain and all that water and whatever and it looked pretty good. Some clear walkways you'd have to risk your guys running across but otherwise pretty dense.

By terrain I mean, not only buildings, bridges and all of that, but also walls, crates and barrels.

>>52758803
It was beautiful sure, but it takes away Low-initiative kill-teams the abillity to actually manouver around without getting auto-pinned/knocked down.

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>>52758758
>>52758769
Time for the ultimate heresy.

>>52758398
I have a set of 20 different diamond files and two different scalpels.

>>52758776
Infinity, Malifaux, Freeboter's Fate, Saga... most of the games on the market are skirmishers, just take a look at other /tg/ threads or at a non-GW FLGS.

>>52752747
>New Necromunda about Kill Teams
>Space Marines get a Faction
>tyranid warriors get a faction
>Kroot dont get a faction

They were made for this!
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

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>>52758865
As much as I like the smaller format, I have no interest in Infinity or other tactics games. The style/lore just isn't for me.

(Plus no one in my area plays it.)

>>52752747
I can't get over the logo. Suckerpunching an ork is fitting, but there is just so little motion in the picture you think you're looking at plastic daemonettes

>>52758931
They weren't made in plastic.

>>52758939
Source on that gif?

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>>52758988
Servant × Service, IIRC.

>>52758931
I get WHY they didn't do it, but I wish they made rules to port over the old Necromunda gangs and such.

>>52758973

Kroot are very plastic.
It's just that all the "Spec Ops" and options are Finecast.
Not to mention that the GW design team has basically forgotten about Kroot for around a decade at this point besides paltry one-sentence write offs in fluff because someone goes "Oh hey right Kroot are in plastic what should we do with them?"

>>52758197
>seeing people "make" terrain by gluing cardboard into cubes and calling it a day

Not all of us have art degrees

>>52758735
I jumped ship (heh) for Star Wars Armada a long time ago

>>52758565
They will be fine for casual games but maybe pick up a pack of cultists to round out the team (its like $8 for 5)

>>52758735
I tried Dropzone Commander and Cropfleet.
While it might not be as colourfull and diverse as 40k they alternate shooting every phase, which makes it so nobody loses 30% of their army before their first activation.

>>52759057
>i iget why they didnt do it

i dont. i mean ok they cant exactly sell the necromunda gangs anymore but it also doesnt hurt their sales of other stuff if they would do it.

>>52759058
Only Sphess mahreens and Anime Gundams allowed.
For once i figured kill team would let me play kroot without space commies, nope, wont let me play em at all.

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Anyone know of a tabletop game with a faction that functions somewhat like VC in whfb?
I miss necromancy as a concept.

>>52758931
Maybe proxy them as orcs?

>>52759208
Warmachine and malifaux.
Also Kings of War kinda, though their wounds are basically just leadership debuffs so wound regeneration works quiet different
Also 9th Age for obvious reason

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>>52759171
>i dont. i mean ok they cant exactly sell the necromunda gangs anymore but it also doesnt hurt their sales of other stuff if they would do it.
It costs time and money to port them over. They also don't sell the models anymore and it would cost even more money to put them back into production without a guarantee that they would even make a profit from it. They don't like having rules for models they don't make any longer.

>>52759336
It's not that they don't like it, they can't do that without losing rights. See chapterhouse.

>>52759266
Which factions in Warmachine and Malifaux tho?
The Stryx doesn't really deal with reanimation as it focuses solely on enemy leader-sniping instead.
>Have I misunderstood something?

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It's still pretty heavily WiP (haven't even started the face), but here's Chaplain Aberforth, leader of my GSC

any ideas what to paint his bandana? I'm really regretting the blue color.

>>52759069
Nah you're jus to lazy and boring and like shit terrain

>>52759069
>Not all of us have art degrees
And those that have use them for greater purposes such as porn and satire.

>>52759581
Black. He looks like a Cuban gangbanger otherwise.

>>52758344
>>52758372
Very nice looking!

>>52759534
Checked out the Malifux system.
Pretty cool that they have a swarm faction.
Too bad there are only 4 and 1/2 factions.

>>52756292
Painting up some Ravenwing last night I discovered I missed the mould lines on one of them :(

>>52756674
My local store has loaded one of their tables with shipping crates etc and it works well.
The 3 story buildings especially seem out of place, though.

>>52759534
Cryx still has a lot of recursion, and the Grymkin faction coming out in June has some.

>>52759581
You could go with a dark green or a gray.

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>>52760122
My store only has the default few building terrain pieces. It's up to customers to supply anything more. (Including the Shadow War stuff.) GW doesn't feel like supplying more.

>>52757820
What makes skitarii not fun to play against?

>>52760785

They gunline really good and ignore almost every negative penalty.

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>>52760785
What >>52760800 said.

Put their specialist(s) at the map's highest point or somewhere overlooking most of the map.
Go on overwatch. Shoot through full-cover at running targets and still hit on 2+/3+ in most cases.

Your options is to either go for the objective or to shoot them in a mexican standoff.

> Skitarii is the defacto best shooty killteam and thus statistically wins most of the shootouts.
> If you have to go for objectives, expect them to be overwatched.

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I feel like ammo checks shouldn't appt in situations where you can ONLY hit on a 6. It punishes armies that are already weak at shooting.

>>52761171
Apply*

>>52761171
I feel like it'd better on rolls of 1. Then you check if you ran out or if it was just a temporary jam.

>>52761262
Nah, because then a weapon could run out of ammo before you get to hit a single thing with it.

Not so bad for a shotgun, but heavy weapons with high ammo would be dissapointing.

>>52758398
I use the back side of an xacto blade.

File leaves the area looking "fuzzy"

>>52761753
the gw files, while expensive, are very fine, they don't leave fuzzy plastic

you need a file which has a finer grit than the one you're using

I have files from a hardware store that I use for conversions, but because they're for metal/wood they're very rough, they take off lots of plastic quickly and leave the area fuzzy

you need a finer file to leave the transition smooth

>>52761753
I've used emery boards (ie. nail files) and it worked well.
The biggest problem was it was a little too easy to over do it and flatten an area.

>>52761171
back when ammo checks were on 1d6 it was a huge problem, for example in gorkamorka shooting was terrible and almost never came up in gameplay

however with the 2d6 method you're very likely to succeed your ammo check, which effectively reblanced ammo checks on 6 to being "not terrible"

>>52762071
I have some extremely fine files. They still leave a little bit of fuzz on plastic, but none on resin.

If I use the files on plastic I go back over the spot with 4000 grit polishing pad.

>>52752747
WHY IS THAT ORK FALLING OVER?

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Stop bitching about terrain and build some toilet terrain people!

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TO COMPLEX FOR 40K PLAYERS.

>>52762614
The bottlecap is a nice touch.

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>>52762614
I bought a bunch of poster board and as I'm not particularly creative I've just been sort of copying a photo of some necromunda terrain I saw, going to be adding more cover and spraying it a few basic colors.

>>52762614
What did you do for the ladders?

>>52762868
That looks moderately intricate, how long did it take you to do, and did you use glue or how did you stick it together?

>>52762868
>>52762643
>>52762614
While this all pretty much looks nice and handy; It still won't deny the Skitarii their 32'' overwatch while you sneakily get into melee with the gits.

>>52762554
because it's initiative 2

>A fighter who changes their weaponry after a game must be represented by a new model, or converted to carry the appropriate weapons

So are people modifying their minis a ton, or just have more models spare to represent an equipment upgrade?

>>52762868
foam melts if you spray it, so you have to airbrush that or hand paint it

>>52762614
>>52762643
>>52762868

needs more LoS blocking scatter terrain, walls, chest high walls, slopes, hills, etc etc

>>52763041
Unfortunately, this is a big problem with a lot of terrain I've seen. We need more big, LOS blocking terrain. 2-3 level tall buildings, with walkways and gantries. Things that you have to go around and over, not just through.

>>52763018
I've been going at it off and on since friday, I've glued everything that absolutely must be together but I've left most of it independent for modularity, right now I'm building containers and railings to add to the complexity.

>>52763076
Yeah that's what I'm working on, me and some buddies have been test running and we had a bunch of random shit lying around by the end because it's definitely more the merrier on that end.

>>52758627

Honestly, I wish more factions got specialists like Deathmarks. Most factions are just 'can have a bigger gun' while Deathmarks actually do something...well, special.

>>52758865

Honestly, a 40k tactics game based on Infinity's Chasis would be pretty damn awesome.

>>52763052
Depends on the army. With Tyranids it's easy enough to magnetize. But smaller models might be better off just having a few extra.

Plus, most people are fine with Counts-As models too. Just paint a roman numeral on the base so you can tell which one is which.

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>>52763181
I'd play the shit out of that game.

>>52763181
>>52763213
After reading over Malifaux's rules, that seems pretty awsome, using a deck of cards instead of dice-rolling.

>>52762868
What he said >>52763064

What you could do is pick up a tub of spackle and coat everything in it.

It'll seal the foam so you can rattlecan it without a problem, and give it a nice concrete-looking texture.

Whenever I build terrain with foamboard I basically only use it as the frame. I then coat it with something.

>>52763213

I started work on such ages ago but well...statting out enough units ended up a bit tiring and judging points values is very tricky.

I had 4 armies properly statted (Chaos Legions, SOB, Tau and Space Marines) with 3 more started (Guard, Necrons, Orks).

Though due to the nature of the game, some units ended up changing a fair bit in effectiveness compared to the TT (See: Anything that's purely melee and snipers as major changes in effectiveness).

>>52763301
Malifaux games can take a long fucking time though. Synergy and combos are a huge part of it, so many people get analysis-paralysis. Each model also has a fair amount of special abilities it can do, along with needing a "duel" (flipping cards off the deck) for almost every action.

It's a fun game, just not a quick game.

>>52763369
I can attest to this, coating your structure in cheap materials and lightly sanding it is an incredibly easy way of making something look like concrete. Plus, it makes it a bit more durable while still being light.

>>52763399
Yeah, I prefer Infinity a bit more than Mali

>>52763399
Oh jees. I have at least 2 gaming buddies whom suffer from that in basic shit like hearthstone.
I've seen them spending 10 minutes simply debating which target to pick when shooting in 40k.
>Your comment scared me man.

>>52763399
>>52763475
Could you give me a quick rundown in how Infinity works?

>>52763499

The main mechanics of Infinity is reactions.

If a model takes an action, other models can react to it. So if you shoot a guy, he can shoot back or dive for cover. It means that the game involves a lot of 'If I do this, how many guys can react to it' and makes trying to solo a gunline a VERY bad idea.

Actions if not oppose are 'Roll under stat'. Simple enough. If actions ARE opposed (Like dodging a shot at you), you each need to roll under stat but the higher roll wins. It uses a d20 for all actions.

In Shadow War it takes an action to go on overwatch, Infinity is a game where everyone is constantly on overwatch in comparison.

Weapons also have multiple range bands. Most weapons have a -3 rangeband, a 0 rangeband, a -3 rangeband and a -6 rangeband (Not all but most). So a model with much better stats (The difference between utter shit and brilliant in a stat is 10 vs 15 for example) than you can still end up the worse off if you know the right distance to engage his weapon.

That guy might be the best damn sniper about but your shithead with a shotgun has the advantage if you are camping by the doorway he just walked through.

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>>52763480
Here's an example of a stat card.

In addition to all the shit that a model can do on the card, there are upgrades you can tack on that add even more abilites.

Add in the fact that each person goes back and forth activating models for each turn means that the board state changes quick and "less tactically inclined" people take a long time to do simple shit.

>>52763625
Oh and each model gets 2 "action points" when activating. Masters (like pictured) get 3.

That's what the little "(1)" at the beginning of each action is for. So since there are actions that cost 0 AP a model could have 4 completely different actions in a turn.

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So my group of friends are planning on doing a campaign this summer and we're thinking about implementing a house rule with resupply

The rule would be that you can bank the 100 points over several games but as soon as you spend some of it you lose whatever is left over

My one friend is wanting this mainly because he's running Grey Knights and wants to be able to get troops without using promethium and be able to better equip them.

Opinions?

>>52763765
There's a reason there isn't banking.

Stuff like Grey Knights and Tyranid warriors are crazy strong in the game. Spending a cache isn't harsh at all.

There's a reason Grey Knight have access to the Guerilla skills. Get scavenger on one dude, spend a cache, and you have 250 points to drop on a recruit.

Also keep in mind that multiple dudes with Scavenger stack.

if GK starts with two specialists then they can't lose the campaign

>>52763765
Recruiting difficulty is one of the few things that GW did really well with balancing. And this is coming from a Tyranid player.

If I could bank a few games and get 2 or 3 Gunbeasts with VC, I would be unstoppable.

>>52763589
>
Thanks for that explanation Anon.
Kinda neat that it's "roll highest, but below stat" to determine opposed rolls.

My only gripe with Infinity is the lack of undead factions.
>Are there any ressurection/recursion factions in Infinity?

>>52763944
Remember the hard-limit of 2 special units if you're not IG.

>>52754016
It''s a good base level, maybe add some 2-3 straw pipes to the tank, then you can do the rest of the clutter with movable crates/barrels.

>>52763947

Not really, no. Infinity is very focused on the idea of 'Losing a guy hurts and isn't hard to do' and the warbands tend to be rather small (20 men at most) so recursion would mess with that a bit.

With one exception (And even then, it's only sorta). ALEPH gets access to AI: Jumper. It's a single mind that can jump between several bodies. Really cheap but you can only have one active at a time. So you buy 1 dude and he's got 3 attempts as each time he dies he can jump to one of his remaining bodies and give it another shot. Comes in hacker, engineer, heavy assault and sniper loadouts so you can mix and match what you need for the situation.

Oddly enough: In setting, Resurrection is decently common (As a CUBE stores a person's mind and lets them be shoved in a new body but it takes time so it's not battle-scale)

Sorry about it not covering an area you'd prefer.

>>52761171
So if you suck at aiming you should just have infinite ammo and blast away all day err day?

>>52764009
Nah man. Can't expect everything to always hit my niche preferences.
Worst case I'll try somthing new.

>>52764035

Actually: A small thing (But sorta related)

Units don't die when they take a wound. They go unconscious. A second wound (Like if they got mowed down by a multi-hit weapon and all of them wounded or a good old double tap) will finish them off.

However, doctors can get them back up on their feet and able to fight again if they are unconsious. If that's an acceptable amount of recursion than Haq and ALEPH are pretty good choices there, having excellent doctors. Though all of them can do it a bit.

Some units ignore this by being No Wound Incapacitation. They continue to fight normally when unconscious (But will die like anyone else on the second wound). So NWI guys can kill the guy who shot them and walk back to the medic for a patchup rather than needing to be recovered.

>>52755258
Strangle canon is fantastic for pinning tons of dudes at a time though.

>>52757354
bits before gits

>>52761171
I always felt like "yeah orks only really hit on 6's. so they ammo check a lot" translated to

THEY'RE FUCKING ORKS, YOU THINK THEY'RE COUNTING THEIR AMMO INSTEAD OF SPRAYING WILDLY?

>>52764095
If I try my hand at INfinity I'll keep that in mind Anon.

>>52760079
Don't tell me you looked at 1d4chan. Their malifaux section is inaccurate garbage and they refuse to let it be updated

>>52764316
I've looked at 1d4chan, their own wikipage and I am currently watching Guerilla Wargaming's Mailfaux Battlereps.

>>52763399
I've had to yell at people for slow rolling in tournaments. The game is amazing once your group is playing at a high level but it can slog hard while people are learning.

Played at the local store tonight, we started our swag league. Can play 3 games a week.

Went 3-0 with nids. My leader picked up scavenger, step aside and +1 toughness and is running around with three bone swords and a lash whip. It's pretty hilarious.

Beat back a dark eldar ambush, where they ran in and shot splinter pistols at me ineffectually.

Ambushed some Necrons, who crumpled when I got to melee (they split fire too much, didn't focus st all).

Fought a reasonable game of scavenge against the guard. Krak grenades hurt, but will they blend? You're damn right they do. Even gun beasts mulch s3 t3 guard without saves.

>>52759581
A green to complement the red.

>>52761753
Just rub your finger over the fuzzyness and it becomes silky smooth.

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>>52764521
>Ambushed some Necrons, who crumpled when I got to melee (they split fire too much, didn't focus st all).

You played a faction immune to pinning, against a faction with no high-impact weapons.
Are you > that focusfiring on your encroaching 3w models would even given them a slight chance at victory?
>it's like you enjoy beating up the handicapped kid.

>>52764629
My opponent took each of his models and fired two at each nid. Even if the dice gods were jerking him off he wouldn't have killed a model.

Was the scenario bad for him? Yes. Could he have been more effective in his attempts to mitigate the problem? You better fucking believe it. Even if he did have high impact he'd have had, what, a 1/6 chance to stop me from charging?

So your options are try to burn down one target and maybe force the bottle or spread your shots like jelly and complain that nothing died.

You can take the low percentage or the no percentage.

>>52764521
I hope you play against grey knights

>2x high impact guns with 2d3 shots each
>3x guys with 1d3 bolter shots each

enjoy being hard countered and losing

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My flgs league starts tomorrow. I know I have some genestealer cultists, at least one tyranid, some tau, some IG. Does this look like a list that can handle most of that?

Sebastian Bachus
Aspiring Champion [290pts]
Assault blade(sword) [15pts], Mark of Slaanesh, Plasma pistol [50pts]

Maynard J. Kanaan
Chaos Space Marine [200pts]
Inferno Bolts [25pts], Mark of Tzeentch Boltgun [55pts] Telescopic sight [20pts]

Robert Hellford
Chaos Space Marine [160pts]
Assault blade (sword) [15pts], Bolt pistol [25pts], Mark of Khorne

Meatloaf
Chaos Gunner [290pts]
Autocannon [150pts], Clip harness [10pts], Mark of Nurgle

Kurt Killbane
Chaos Cultist [60pts]
Shotgun [20pts]

What do you guys think?

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>>52762614
>>52762643

Tell the guys at Castle I said hi

>>52764957
Why mark of slaanesh over undivided?

>>52765041
For now, fluff. And Initiative tests come up more than I expected.

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Working on an Ork killteam now, all I have is the Boyz/Knob that came in the box.

Haven't played any games yet, anything I should look out for when building a team?

I've totally been out of touch with this whole release, but it is looking pretty cool. How are Tyranids? I've got some old Warriors sitting around and this looks like it might be good to use them in.

>>52765345

for orks - boyz before toyz

>>52757820
Man, fuck Harlequinns. Played 5 games against them as GSC, got curbstomped. They are pricey, but too powerful.
>12 charge/run
>-2 run cover
>insane cqc
>ignore terrain
>4++

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How does this look as a fluffy Ork Killteam? I know I'm blowing a lot of points on gear but fuck it, they look like they'll be fun to build and paint:

Leader:

Boss Knob - 160pts
Shoota - 25pts
Power Klaw - 85pts

Total - 270pts

Troops:

Boy - 60pts
Shoota - 25pts

Total - 85pts x4 - 340pts

New Recruits

Yoof - 30pts
Shoota - 25pts

Total - 55pts x3 - 165pts

Specialist

Spanner Boy - 70pts
'Eavy Armor - 25pts
Rokkit Launcha - 130pts

Total - 225pts

Grand Total - 1,000pts

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>>52759069
Damn nigga. Thats a good joke!

>>52765511
Aren't GSC webbers basically a hard counter to Harlequins?

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よく解らないがそんなセットはイギリス人は嫌がると思うぞ

>>52757586
there is no consensus on 4chan sempai go bluewhale yourself

>>52765545
>Knob
It hurts a little bit.

>>52763301
it is - best skirmish game out there - cards are god send

>>52764827
That'll be a fun chance to use the stealth rules to try and close the gap and/or play for scenario.

Faggot

>>52762614
>>52762643
>>52762868

so, i feel like I'm the only one here who wants to assemble terrain with a bit a caution, because guys these table look like mouse traps... like they have 0% functionality. They are constructed for the purpose of playing the game and I think this would sap fun out of me... like what is the purpose of this maze of walkways? do they lead to something? thats why I think its important to include a few pieces that look like machinery so as to give the cat walks functional purpose, other than for the games sake... ya feel me? like add this to the mix >>52758372

>>52765581
Yeah, I figured that out around the 5th game's rearm.
I'm bringing at least one to our FLGS campaign.

Do tyranid warrior biocanons count as heavy weapons? The issue came up tonight, and my opponent said he was fine having them count as heavy but I don't want to cheat him.

>>52765708
I know what you mean anon. When I get around to making a table for this, it's going to be based around several major multi level structures with scaffold/catwalks in between them. Im thinking

>Missile silo
>Storage tanks
>Bunker
>Watch towers
>Generator building
>Smoke stacks

>>52765708
Damn straight. I hate playing on a table that feels like it's nothing more than a fancy laser tag setup.

>>52765832
if they're not called heavy weapons (which they're not), then they're not

>>52765832
They objectively aren't heavy weapons. The word Heavy isn't used to describe them at any point and in regular 40k they're all assault weapons.

>>52765920
>>52765988
Thanks!

>>52763956
Or Skitarii, or GSC

>>52755895
>implying Guard won't stomp necrons

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Going Fallen CSM, lads.

Time to raid Bitz box #17

>>52765478
Only boys. No toys.

=20 orks with shanks

>>52757586
>overall rating
8, I'm pretty satisfied
>best part(s) shorter gamelength and more engaging turns. More balanced than 40k
>number of players in group
8 or 9 at this point
>house rules in use
minor climbing stuff
>house rules you wish were in use
having to assault closest model
>Most fun faction to play
Orks or IG, dem specialists though
>most fun faction to play against
Scouts or Tau
>least fun faction to play
necrons
>least fun faction to play against
Eldar
>Strongest faction
Eldar or Tyranids
>weakest faction
Necrons, hard.

>>52763765
It might be frustrating to not being able to expand your force when you play an elite kill team, but you're ruining an important balancing mechanic.

>>52766188
They won't if you don't bring something like plasma, or if your spec weapons die to deathmarks. Lasguns do nothing.

>>52763947
Not quite, but in gameplay terms Aleph has a few neat mechanics and haqqislam has good medics.
In flufg terms, Aleph probably.

>>52766299
>not using shotguns
>not always bringing 3 specialists
>Appointed immortal 90 more points for literally no benefit
>can't get wargear or upgrade characteristics
>have to spend PC to even get a basic dude

>>52766345
I mean if you load up on specialists IG has at most 8 guys. You can kill 2 of them then make them break. When Necrons hit they are guaranteed to kill a guardsman. Necrons are BS4 so they're good at hitting. They have 3+ armour and T4 and reanimation so the only things that will actually hurt them are the special weapons.

Necrons usually win in an outright gunfight if you're doing it right.

>>52766201
a guy at my store is doing that to
he's using cypher as the leader
we even offered to let him buy the escape artist and gunslinger perks but he declined in favour of getting them on his own

>>52766476
Well, shit, now I have to get that Cypher model. Two guns in hand-to-had work, right?

>>52766383
Necrons also have 10LD on all models so they only have a 1/6 chance of failing a bottle test along side 1/2 chance of recovering from a down. If both sides are taking casualties, IG are more likely to bottle out first.

>>52766486
afaik you can

>>52765581
Indeed they are. Ow and webberz. Whatcha gonna do, clown?

>>52766548
Run? With -2 to hit and any cover, you're hitting him on 7+.

>>52766486
Two pistols give an extra attack die, yes. But if the unit carries a weapon other than melee or pistol you don't get the bonus.

>>52766577
So stay in ow then, until they come at you?

>>52766604
Right. Duh. I'm retarded. No cover bonus for owerwatching a charge, right?

>>52766604
>until they come at you
-1 for shooting at a charging target
-1 for shooting on overwatch

>>52766622

Not unless he's got cover all the way there.

>>52766490
The thing is, while Necrons do have strengths, those aren't what the game is about.

>>52766596
That's no problem, Cypher doesn't carry a rifle... the problem I see is plas & bolt pistol kinda sucks until you get gunslinger (you'd be better off using plas/sword in cc for parry, but that's incredibly unfluffy for Cypher).

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>>52757586
>overall SW:A rating (out of ten or five or whatever you want I'm not a cop)
8-9/10. It's more fun than regular 40K.
>best part(s)
Factions are now specialized. Quick games.
>worst part(s)
Poor wording on quite a few rules and bad balancing in some respects.
>number of players in group
6
>house rules in use
Toxic Rounds can be used against all factions.
No spawning on top of buildings if they are within the placement zone.
>house rules you wish were in use
None that I can think of.
>most fun faction to play
Guard
>most fun faction to play against
Scouts.
>least fun faction to play
I can't say, I've only played one.
>least fun faction to play against
Harlequins.
>strongest faction
Harlequins. They're just flat out broken.
>weakest faction
Guard or Orks, it seems.

>>52766644
What do you mean by this?

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>>52766644

>>52766973
For example, being good at wounding might sound nice, but in this game being able to pin or ignore cover is more important.

Harlies: love the models, love the fluff. Already have nicely painted ones.
Hate to play OP stuff. Everyone says they are.

Fuck me.

>>52767070
No, that is disgusting.

Also you don't have to play them like a dick just because it is possible.

Why is everypne freaking out on the solitaire? It' s a single special operative, let the enemy burn their cache, play the objectives and then bottle out

>>52767070
I don't think they would be that bad of it wasn't for their stupid racial ability. Not sure what GW was thinking giving them a -2 modifier to hit just for moving.

>>52767133
For RUNNING, not moving. Huge difference.

>>52767145
Not really. Run across the map while nothing can hit them, then abuse their strong melee or shooting depending on the situation.

>>52767130
>Why's everyone freaking out about the solitaire? You just have to throw the match.

>>52767070

Harlies are not impossible to deal with but they play such a dramatically different game to everyone else that you'll likely not have the right tools for it unless you know beforehand.

With WS 5+ so plentiful and fear on all of them, most factions can't hope to actually engage them in melee and have enough guys reach it to beat the clown.

With -2 to be charged when running, throwing enough shots at them to actually win is very hard.

The main things that fuck them up, hard?

Flamers. Yeah, they get the 4++ but a coin flip is a lot of risk they are suddenly not happy to have to take when they are expensive and everything else is a lot lower chance to reach saves.

For the love of all that is holy, buy frag grenades. A large blast means you'll likely catch them even on a miss and that 4++ can only take so many before it fails.

Hide from the clowns. Yes, they have high init to allow them to charge you from a long distance. However the distance they can charge a visible model is a LOT longer than the distance they can charge a hidden model and charge is declared before movement. They can't move a model up to spot your hidden guys, then have another charge him.

Shoot your friend to save him. If a clown is in melee with your mate, fire into the melee. The clown didn't run this turn and isn't likely in cover and your buddy has better chances with the randomization for shooting into melee than trying to knife fight the clown. If he goes down? Oh well, no more randomization!

>>52767133
My bigger problem is with their ungodly initiative and 4++. It should've been I5 and 6+, 4++ in cqc.

>set up table / terrain
>determine mission / effects
>roll for deployment
>deploy

>first turn
>player one movement phase
>player two movement phase

>second turn
>player one shoots
>half of player two's team is downed
>fails bottle check
>game over

>>52767179

Not to start the debate again but: Wording how the movement trick of them works should have been closer to the Genestealer thing since EVERYONE gets to move like that not a single SO. Having them have to actually engage with terrain to some degree would have been nice.

>>52767174
>The main things that fuck them up, hard?
>Flamers.
>For the love of all that is holy, buy frag grenades

Now if only every faction had access to those things

>>52766490
>fall off every ledge
>never stand back up

>>52767181

As a long time Infinity player, that sounds a lot like 'Not enough terrain'. It's a game where you are supposed to have rather a lot of terrain to allow blocking LOS quite often.

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>>52766299
Now I don't want to disagree on purpose but Deathmark's only reasons for existing in a Necron team is for the scavange skill and no other necron models having access to that skill.

I mean, they cost I think, 10 points less than a trooper, but they're permanently worse due to having an outright inferior gun.
And I say gun because necrons only ever get one gun and no up/sidegrades.

Death-mark's only abillity is literally to get a single clean shot off that hits on a 3+ unless everyone is running in which case what else should you do?
>It doesn't even have the gauss rule or the codex abillity of always wound it's maked target on a 2+ which i really want to be an oversight as even the harlies have access to that abillity.

The abillity actually also comes with a downside. You have to teleport inn inside 8'' of the enemy model and that is the ChargeMin range of every single model in the game, which means as soon as your shooting ends you'll both get shot AND charged which negates the necron faction abillity.
>Lets compare that to the Skitarii which can shoot you at a +1 bonus at 32'' range.
>Necron snipers actually have a max range of 18'' AND no necron weapons ever get a hit bonus for any range increments.

I also toyed with the idea of making flayer look-alikes, just naked warriors with phasers so they could simply guerilla strike through walls and multiple-charge; but they also get no access to CC weapons outside the invisible dagger everyone starts with.

>>52767211

>Now if only every faction had access to those things

Well, yeah. Didn't say it was perfect but most factions get frag at least. Not every faction but most.

>>52767171
How is getting in, getting the loot and getting out throwing the game? That's very necromunda and what the campaigns are for, you sound like a 40k player.

>>52767171
>He gets 1d3 caches for winning. Maybe more.
>Also gets between 100 and 250pt based on sun-plot rolls.
>Just throw every single match untill he wins guys! That will teach him!

>>52767181
Oh, are you that anon who suggested that you should only play with the terrain from the box set or an equivalent and not more?

>>52767174
How would you propose that say >Necrons deal with it?
They have no grenades, no flamers, no blast weapons, and hits on a 5+ if the solitairs runs every time untill it charges.

>>52767260

Honestly, at that point you are mostly at 'Stay together and fire like crazy into whichever melee the Solitare gets into'.

The advice was more for dealing with regular clowns than the solitaire as they are 1W so making them hit the dirt is a lot easier, then you go kick them in the balls while they are down.

>>52767256
What no

>>52767218
It's not about not enough terrain, it's about two models going down (especially if one is your leader) causing most lists to flee the table half the time.

It's not very satisfying to set up the table, go through all the motions, go through two turns of moving, and then the game ends after a pair of lucky rolls. If you're looking at 4 or 5 to get hit and 4 or 5 to take a wound, and then around a 40-50% chance to bottle, that happens annoyingly often.

>>52767285
How large is your table? How do you place your units? Do you have pictures of your terrain set up? The is quick and brital, sure, but you should at least get to turn 3

>>52767361
*The game is

>>52767361
It doesn't really matter when it happens, it's just baked into the game.

Two units go down, 40% chance of leaving the table. I don't get it and I don't like it.

>>52767221
>naked warriors with phasers

These may be useful just to screen melee units and draw fire from your more important 170 pt immortals. If you are in a campaign, you could start to choose to bottle once your chaff warriors are down just so you don't risk losing your immortals.

>>52767179
Strong melee.
Strong shooting.
4++ Save so it's not effected by modifiers like everyone else.
-2 Modifier when running.
Ignores pretty much all terrain.
Ignores fall damage.
Decent initiative.
High leadership on all units.
Fear.
High movement.

Their costs aren't NEARLY high enough for all the bonuses they can get.

Unless you're SPECIFICALLY building against them and weakening yourself against the other players there is pretty much no chance against them.
>>52767246
We can just as easily decide as a group not to include the person playing the broken faction, which is what we're doing.

>>52767386
That's kinda like how firefights work though, but you are free to your own taste.
You are also free to houserule.

>>52767386
From your vague description, it sounds to me like both players are just pushing up their lines and hoping for the best. Am I mistaken?

>>52767457
>another army is good at something, the horror!
All i'm hearing is whining from an incapable player. You know you need to adjust your gear and strategies for the opponents you are facing, right? Of course you are in for a bad surprise if you treat them like orkz

>>52767386

Have you actually read accounts of real small unit actions? Two guys down and most military forces would recover their wounded and break contact.

It takes 2-4 troops to recover wounded so even if the squad doesn't break contact they are largely ineffective until the wounded are passed down the casualty evacuation chain.

>>52767386
Are you two just running out into the fucking open and not hiding at all or what

>>52766622
>>52766631
Well, you're obv not gonna get away from the minuses, but running harley from cover to cover (fleeting target) is - 3 so you'll be slightly better off taking the shot at a charge.

>>52767511
Sounds like they are good at everything to me, not just "something". That doesn't seem great for balance.

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>>52767419
While it sounds fun, Immortals and warriors are only 40pt difference in points, but a whole world of difference in staying- and firepower.

Having a layer of "chaff" warriors doesn't actually sound all that appealing considering you actually need to spend a promethium crate anyway the first games to get more immortals out of sheer necessity.

>>52767457
Yeah. My group doesn't play with harlies too.

Also, have you guys ever tried using "inndoor" terrain instead of necromunda multi-hight terrain? I'll promise you it's a completely different game entirely without LOS to everything.

>>52766654
Versatility?

>>52767583
Saying something like "strong shooting" is very undifferentiated.
What does it mean? That they hit well? That they do often? Do they hit strong? And in which siutation does that apply?
You could say orkz are strong at shooting as well by the sheer amount of dakka dice they put out

>>52767600
Sweet terrain, got some tutorials?

>>52767474
>>52767537
I don't care about realism in my chinese space depression simulator

>>52767551
>>52767503
Again, it doesn't matter how you play. Unless you're never seeing the other player, eventually somebody is going to lose a model, and eventually two models. And then an unlucky roll and the game ends anticlimacticly.

>>52767644

It's a skirmish game. Not a game of bloody final stands. If you have too many guys go down you'll quickly end up behind in the campaign.

>>52767583
They're bad at staying power, mostly. If they do anything other than runnng or hiding then they're getting hit, and they're only t3.

They ARE annoying as fuck to deal with though, and it's almost impossible to avoid casualties. But any casualties THEY take hurt them a lot. They need to burn a prom cache just to recruit a single t3 model with a 4+. And they have, at MOST, 6 models. If they rush in and suffer losses while dealing heavy losses in return, then they'll be in bad shape after just a game or two. They're mostly bad in one-off fames, but suffer over the course of a campaign.

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>>52767609
Most factions in 40k are unique in that they all bend or break the established rules in cheeky ways. Most simply do it to 1 or 2 rules at a time.

Harlies are unique in that they break several core-rules at once.

>SW:A have detailed rules for pinning and pinning consequences; harlies mostly ignore this as they are immune to pinning.
>You have super-leathal falling damage. Harlies ignore this.
>Armor is scarce and most weapons are lethal for having blasting options to negate mundane armor. All Harlies have 50% chance of ignoring any gunfire/grenade/blasts/anti-tank weaponry.
>If you want superior positioning you have to use ladders as access points; harlies can walk up walls like they were open terrain.
>Some factions specialize in being good at melee; harlies can deny enemy melee-superiority rules like parry. Harlies have fear which makes people trying to charge harlies having to pass a Ld test or simply lose their turn. Harlies have more attacks than you. Harlies heave weapons that automatically wound you on 2+ regardless of toughness.
>Harlies ar harder to hit than anyone else because they incurr more penalities to shoot at while moving than any other faction.
>Harlies have better guns than quite a few factions that also automatically wound on 2+
>Harlies have above-baseline BS which is the shooting stat.
>Harlies are elite unit and thus have very good leadership.
>If you have a bad game, Harlies can opt to not field their army, letting everyone rest, and fielding a single god-model instead with the best stats in the game which is mostly only beatable through luck or webbers. I hope you got both.
>All harly weaponry have good ammosaves if I remember correctly; being 4+ and 5+ which hardly matters as they are a close combat oriented faction.
> Most weapons only reduce the enemy armor. Harlies have cheekybreeky guns that outright say the enemy doesn't get an armor save all-together.

Did I forget anything?

>>52767668
You mean they have a 4++ save and are mostly good in one-off fights.
>on a side note, I've seen harlies doing really good in campaigns. using their first 2 games to get more troops and specialists.
>A good amount of factions actually need to burn a prom-cache to recruit anything of of value, harlies are not the exception.

>>52767600
The difference between a Gauss Blaster Immortal and a naked Warrior is actually 170 vs 80 pts. Necron basic guns are optional. So in exchange for 1 Immortal, you get 2 wounds with 4+ saves.

To me naked warriors are like ork boyz for a power klaw nob in normal 40k. They are there to ensure your damage dealers actually stay up to do damage.

>>52767742
That's actually true.
>I'd kit out one of the chaff with the partial cover-item instead of the phaser in retrospect, It might come out to 110 points but being a literal bullet-sponge sounds appealing.

>>52767697
>harlies can walk up walls like they were open terrain
Wait what lets them do that?

>>52767778
They're very acrobatic.

>>52767778
They have an item that lets them treat impassible terrain as open for the sake of movement.
Not -through- mind you, but across.
>Basically running up walls.

>>52767697

Honestly, Harlequins should have been a Spec Ops for both Eldar and Dark Eldar. Rather than an army.

It's like having an entire unit of terminators. Sure, terminators get together but they are out of scale in this sort of numbers.

They fill the Assault Marine/Raptor/Stealth Suit role rather well.

>>52767881
That's actually a very good comparison.
It would be like having an elite army of only terminators, the con being that they don't have cheap recruits and could only field 6.

>6 terminators ain't nothing to fuck with.

>>52767737
is tehre even a faction that can recruit something of worth for 100 points ?

>>52767775
That may not be a good idea. The shadow loom might make the immortals the easier target to shoot, defeating the purpose of using the chaff.

>>52767901

Yeah. I think a lot of the issue with the Harlequins is that they are just TOO full of special rules to be an individual force. If they don't have those rules they are not really Harlequins, if they DO have those rules they are staggeringly out of scale.

All the other armies are basically 'Troops'. Even grey knights just bring power armoured grey knights which are 'Grey knight + melee weapon + storm bolter'. Harlequins are all elites of the elite with a list of special rules as long as their ears.

Oddly enough, despite people not liking them much I honestly think that Deathmarks in comparison are a good idea of the sort of stuff that could work well as Specialists. Almost everyone else went with really, really boring options that are just 'This dude gets a heavy weapon'. I think more should have gone with a guy that actually feels...special.

>>52767932
If you literally keep the chaff in melee with his target at all times, the chaff should give the immortal the 50%+ cover he needs for full cover at all times. It might be tricky, but it sounds theoretically plausible.
The idea is for him to stand out in the open as is often required to stop flanking manouvers, while still enjoying some bonuses to survivabillity.

>>52767921
Um... Genestealer Initiate with a Bolt Pistol and Chainsword? Maybe?

>>52767954
Problem with that is that the true necron "special" characters are the Crypteks and the minor Lords, as they got the bulk of the armory.

The other problem is that the only way Deathmarks are special is in that they're stricktly worse than standard troops. I can't remember off the top of my head any other faction where their specialist actually underperforms their troops.

>>52767988

Yeah, it's not perfect but I still think the idea of deathmarks is good. A model that plays different to the rest of your force and does something odd other than 'Has a bigger gun'. Most forces just went with 'Heavy weapons dude' for the specialist.

>>52767988
I feel like Necrons should have a higher limit on the number of deathmarks they can take. 2 deathmarks is meh, but 4 could actually accomplish something.

>>52767963
There is always the possibility that your opponent could have high ground. In this case, your warrior would not provide cover for your immortal and opening up your immortal to be shot at.

What about putting the shadow loom on your immortal while the warriors run on the spot whenever he's not hiding? That would give both a minimum of -1 to hit so the easiest target would be the closest unit.

>>52768014
no no, I completely agree with you.
Specialists should be different and be played that way.

If the Deathmark could teleport in 18'' away from his target and still take a shot it would be pretty good. If the Deathmark had any special abillities that let him actually be a sniper, it could be pretty good; like the actual "marked for death" from the Necron codex that the harlequin weapons get.

But right now, you're literally teleporting within chargerange in hopes to get a single shot, at worse stats than the standard trooper, and actually hope to accomplish anything.
>Oh and the enemy knows from the start which troop you're targeting and thus have AMPLE time to prepare his ENTIRE group of overwatch if terrain allows it, for when the poor assassin arrives from hyperstealth.
>I think 'not perfect' is an understatement.

>>52767194
No one in their right mind is going to let them phase through walls. If that's the concensus in your local group or store, then you should find new friends or move to a different store.