Exalted General

>leaves this here, waits for triggered fa/tg/uys

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/exalted/1069023-ask-the-devs?p=1078033#post1078033

>>52695958
why would that trigger anyone?

So, someone once mentioned that a bunch of Infernal refugees fled the official forums to another forum called Sufficient Velocity, after Holdorke began aggressively shitting blood all over the game line.

Can someone expand upon what's going on in that community? Are they largely 2e holdouts? Do they have a working 3e Infernal fansplat made? There was something about TAW Lunars - how's that going? Etc.

>>52696231
>Are they largely 2e holdouts?

Yes, though even they don't dare touch it without heavy houseruling.

>Do they have a working 3e Infernal fansplat made?

Doubtful, given how little they care for 3e.

>There was something about TAW Lunars - how's that going? Etc.

Don't know for sure.

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>>52696231
>TAW Lunars

Whats TAW stand for anyway?

>>52696286
Terrifying Argent Witches.

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>>52696337

And what is that?

>>52696363
They essentially focused less on the primal and animal aspects and more on Luna's status as a terrifying, mad witch-goddess and made the resulting Lunars into tricksters and shapeshifter nightmares that had more in common with the Guyver or Prototype than with Animorphs.

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>>52696402

Damn, that actually sounds like a huge improvement. Well, except for the "mad" part. I've never liked forced insanity as a "thing", which is funny, given it's such a big (if incredibly poorly done, mechanically, more often than not) element of Exalted.

>>52696363
You know how official Lunars shapeshift into bears and badgers and stuff, but bears and badgers and stuff are really lame compared to glorious golden godkings that can level cities with their pecks so Lunars are kind of awful thematically?

Terrifying Argent Witches takes Lunars in the direction of more protean shapeshifting, where they can mix and match what their shape is, becoming chimera-like super-predators that are as divorced in power and scope from regular animals as Solars are from regular humans.

>>52696427
The madness more kind of manifests in the monstrous forms TAW Lunars can assume. It's not really forced onto their Chosen's mindsets.

TAW isn't terrible, but I'm waiting to see what the new devs are able to execute in 3e.

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>>52696454

Ok, thats fine. So is this actually going to be a thing in 3E, or is this some horrible fan wishposting or some kind of homebrew thing?

>>52696500
It's an extensive homebrew for 2e.

Official Lunars in 3e are still going to be barbarian furries squatting in the woods with weaker versions of Solar Charms.

>>52696500
>some kind of homebrew thing?

This. It's 2e homebrew, and regardless of how you feel about it with regard to what might be coming in 3e there's no denying it's a fuck of a lot better than standard 2e Lunars.

>>52696532
>Official Lunars in 3e are still going to be barbarian furries squatting in the woods with weaker versions of Solar Charms.

Well, many of them are, at least. They're supposedly going for less "lol fuck civilization let's tear it all down and go shit in woods" and more "lol fuck the Realm let's rip off the Empress' head and shit down her neck", with a lot more room for individuals who don't fit the mold than you had in 1e.

>>52696568
I hope so. I'm just doubtful. Maybe new devs will come through.

>>52696593
At the very least, I doubt that whole "if you don't live the shit-in-the-woods barbarian animal lifestyle, Luna will actually take back your Exaltation" shit is gonna return.

To those who never read 1e Lunars, I am not kidding. That was a thing.

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>>52696532

Aww, shit.

>>52696593

Ehh...

>>52696593

Given Exalted's track record with'em, I now no longer have any hopes up, seeing as this TAW thing isn't going to be the official. Guess I'll just have to ignore as much of the fluff as possible again for a 3rd edition, if I end up playing a Lunar.

>>52696616
>had an entire black text box on just why you're literal, civilization hating, raping, wipe-your-ass-with-a-pinecone-the-wrong-way-barbarians forever.

Fuck, don't remind me of that shit.

>>52696639
>Given Exalted's track record with'em, I now no longer have any hopes up
Focusing that much on Exalted's track record would make more sense if the same people were behind every edition of the game.

>seeing as this TAW thing isn't going to be the official.
This is a good thing, as TAW isn't really that good. Better than 1E Lunars, more interesting (though not entirely in a good way) than 2E Lunars, but those are some exceptionally low bars. TAW doesn't really deserve to be official, though there are definitely some ideas there the devs could stea- I mean, be inspired by.

>>52697339

TAW being official is really one of the only ways they can salvage this shitheap of a setting.

The only logical reason I can think of is wanting to save it for 4e (Which, again, should be done as soon as possible to get away from the abortion that is 3e)

>>52697869
Fuck off.

>>52697869
>This is what Infernal apologists actually believe.

>>52697869
Fuck that, TAW was terrible and it deserves to stay as shitty fanwork

>>52696268
Thank you

>>52697869
>>52697966
Ah, this is the sort of top notch rhetoric that keeps me coming back to /tg/.

>>52698011
No, infernal apologists believe the Charmsets were awesome. And hands down they were, but the fluff was so unsalvagably tainted, that couldn't help.
I hope they get Neph on board for their next charmsets. Dude knows his craft.

>>52698093
Can you elaborate on what actually makes the Infernal Charmset awesome?

>>52698147
Of course. How they are tied to their Patrons, how they perfectly capture the transhumanist alien approach of infernals and the alien nature of hell, how they capture that the Yozis themselves are prisoners of their own nature, how they encourage you to excerises in ingenuity and how they originally fit perfectly into the grotesque environment of perfect spam that is 2e.

>>52697869
taw was crap

>>52698011
no, infernal charmsets WERE awesome.

it makes me angry that they cut charms to free up wordcount for the ch1 and 2 pointless rehashing of exalted history up to shogonate, "these are normal virtues but evil" and the rape scene.

...but that doesn't mean lunars should get twisted into overlaping with infernals or that infernals should get lunar's dbt 9_9

>>52696363
trash everything about lunars, replace with silver infernals and a dash of sidereal(but not just any i infernals. earthscorp-style fappery)

What kind of exalt would want to replace the Unconquered Sun, as king of the gods, with someone more useful?

Not become the king himself, not kill the Unconquered Sun, just find someone who does the job better, and is not addicted to the Games.

>>52699050
What do you mean? Any type of exalt could have a goal like that, so it boils down to the individual characteristics of the Exalt in question. As for what these individual characteristics would be, I think they're pretty obvious. It'd be someone who knows enough about what's going on to realize that the Sun isn't doing his job, someone who either isn't proud and abitious enough to want to tule himself or who can't be nothered to rule because his ambitions lie elsewhere, someone who has enough confidence in his powers and position as an Exalt to see replacing the king of gods as a valid option.

>>52699130
I've been thinking of exalt type.
So it's perfectly acceptable that a Solar would want this?

>>52698833

Didn't most of those cut charms make it into The Broken Winged Crane?

And almost every book wasted time on a history rehash, but yeah, whoever was managing Infernals must have forgotten to tell the 1-2 writer they wanted an anti-heroic tone... and then never paid attention until it was all written... and didn't read it...

Still though, it's not *that* much worse than Abyssals. The bit with Lillun is just a bit more blatant.

>>52699151
Yeah, though a freshly Exalted Solar in RY 768 probably wouldn't know enough to want it. Then again, in appropriate circumstances he might know.

>>52697869
>The devs should make a new edition because my favorite fan interpretation of a splat isn't canon

Damn, this is some pure ideology right here.

>>52699271
Reminds me of the crazy from back in the days of 1e, where we had threads on the WW forums arguing about whether the Usurpation was morally right or wrong, and all that other kind of shit.

Does anyone have the rules for mice of the sun from the second leak? They got cut before the core.

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>>52699670

Page 693-696.

>>52699505
Ketchup Carjack did nothing wrong ok, Solar genocide best day of my life

>>52696532
>Official Lunars in 3e are still going to be barbarian furries squatting in the woods with weaker versions of Solar Charms.

I don't know if this is just echo chamber or what but this is not accurate.

It's a negative interpretation shilled by people who want Lunars to be SHAPESHIFTERS++ first, meaning protean entities rather than animal/primal themed Exalts. Did everyone just fucking forget in all their cosmic jerking off that the Exalted is also meant to model stories in which barbarism and it's facets are a major element?

TAW is not Exalted.

>>52696186
Seconded.

Also, that sorcerer-alchemist is showing admirable self-restraint. Fuck transgender, if I had access to Sorcerous Workings I'd go full transhuman.

>>52699505
>WW forums arguing about whether the Usurpation was morally right or wrong
That doesn't seem crazy at all. That seems like a perfectly valid question to ask. Hell, Batman v Superman was exactly that question. Superman's weird string of motivations and manipulations was pretty terrible, but if you focus on just Batman's perspective then you've got this nigh-invincible but still distressingly human creature that can destroy the entire world; is it worth taking it on trust that he won't? Is it better to keep him around or remove him while you still can?

Chejop Kejak is Batman in this analogy. And also in the Exalted setting.

>>52699969
Too far. Not even Chejop Kejak agrees with Chejop Kejak's actions with that much certainty.

>>52699505
it was

>>52700358
>>52699969
>>52699505

Interesting consensus developing here.
http://www.strawpoll.me/12745151

>>52700575
No option for irrelavent to the game being played/doesn't matter. Flawed poll.

In 2.5E is there a point in developing both Parry and Dodge?

>>52700890
You're free to not answer.

>>52700919
Yes. Unblockables/Undodgeables. Dodge works on ranged and lethal without essence.
Parry raises attack pool.

>>52701083
Sorry, different guy here.
> Dodge works on ranged and lethal without essence
This makes sense
> Parry raises attack pool.
Could you explain this a bit more? Do you just mean that raising Dex and [Melee / Brawl / Martial Arts] raises your Parry but also your attack pool or was there some mechanic I missed?

>>52700053
You said it's not accurate, then instead of explaining why or giving an accurate interpretation... You shit on that dude and then seem to argue why his interpretation is actually good for the game?

>>52701137
>Could you explain this a bit more? Do you just mean that raising Dex and [Melee / Brawl / Martial Arts] raises your Parry but also your attack pool or was there some mechanic I missed?
Nah, just Dex+Ability. Unless we're talking specific charms or specialites ít's generally the same though.

>>52696616
Am I really the only one who looked at that paragraph and thought it had overtones of "Dude, seriously, it totally happened to a friend of this guy who owed my mentor's old packmate a life debt."

I'm not gonna lie and say 1e Lunars didn't have a lot of really shitty ideas and execution. But the "civilization makes Luna take your Exaltation away" line feels, in its phrasing, less like "this is true" and more like "This Is What Some Lunars Actually Believe"

>>52701389
The issue was with the writing style. First Edition Lunars often jumped between in-character statements and out-of-character statements without doing a very good job of making it clear which was which. So it was hard to tell if the "Lunars lose their Exaltation if they spend too much time in the cities," was the game telling you that this was how it worked, or if it was just some Lunars who thought it worked that way.

Does anyone else want Lunar bond to be a pretty big deal? And I don't mean the way it was done in the past. A powerful tool that a Solar and Lunar can use together for both mechanical and roleplay aspects.

Basically instead of making the Lunar listen to the Solar the Lunar wants to hang out with the Solar. And the Solar wants to hang out with the Lunar. Maybe something like make their effective essence 1 dot higher for charm and spell effects if working together on a task. Or discount mote cost for charms. Add bonuses to both of their intimacies for protection or offense in social combat. Or defend each other reflexively if within a certain range. There is a lot of things you can do with the bond to make it appealing for both the Solar and Lunar to buy it as a merit and not make it be a Lunar pet scenario.

Also it would be cool that instead of being bound to each other the Lunar can initiate some pact between themselves and the Solar to create the bond in game between a willing Solar and Lunar. Especially since there may be more Lunars then Solars now.

But I know everyone wants something different from Lunars and I may be the only one who loves the Gilgamesh/Enkidu angle.

>>52701596
I'm pretty ambivalent on Lunar Bond itself, but what I want out of Lunars is the ability to be good lieutenants and bodyguards (teamwork stuff, somehow without stepping on DB toes).

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>>52701596
I didn't know how much I wanted this till now

>>52701596

+1 Essence and mote discounts would be a game defining bonus, quickly and easily blowing everything else out of the water. If it was something like a Hearthstone (better mote regen outside of combat) or something along the lines of "Once per story, spend an hour with your Solar/Lunar mates company and regain 1WP" it'd give a tangible mechanical benefit without forcing everyone to get a Lunar mate in order to keep up with anyone who already has one.

>>52702059

If you make it a variable point merit where the higher points you spend the more powerful the bond and maybe gate it in an interesting way it should not be too bad. The mote discount may be a bit much but Artifacts changing your essence for charm calculations is not out of the question.

As for gating you could make storyline reasons why you can't buy the higher dots until you are in sync with each other enough. There is a lot of ways to balance it (if such a thing could be said about Exalted) while still making a Lunar bond mechanic powerful.

>>52701137
unlike dodge, parry isn't it's own ability, so it's raised by raising an attack stat

>>52701596
I just wanna turn the lunar into my familiar and forget the bond ;)

>>52702525
sense share, extra 5 mote storage available with contact, buff eachother with familiar enhancing charms?

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>>52697339
>Focusing that much on Exalted's track record would make more sense if the same people were behind every edition of the game.

Different people have been behind Lunars every edition, and every edition they have been shit at best. The problem has always been no one knows what to do with them, and no one has ever tried to make their shapeshifting anything interesting. And now this edition they're trying to go with the least interesting possible options.

It's a shame to see potential squandered this long, this many times.

>>52702691
So what would make their shapeshifting interesting? And what makes what they are going with now least interesting?

>>52701596
I used the bond as a shared comittment bonus.
Any artifact attuned by one is automatically attuned for free by the other. Attunements to hearthstones could be transfered with a touch and no duration limit (actually it was "look on the sun or the moon once per day").

This included bonuses for moonsilver or oricalcum or such things.

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>>52702778

To me, something of a cross between what they were going for with 2E Lunar shapeshifting, how you could basically turn into anything, and Infernal stuff. Basically, I want it to run the gamut from Hulk Mode DBT, to the guy who can turn into a flowerbed to hide from a patrol, to some crazy Cthulhu looking motherfucker who is a nightmare combination of things that probably shouldn't exist. Really go buck wild and make them "The Exalted of Shapeshifting" rather than "The Exalted of turning into a tiger when a tiger really isn't very impressive by Exalted standards".

And what they're going with so far from what I've been reading, is basically "Exalted of Animal shapes" which is probably the least interesting thing you could do with a "race" of shapeshifters. It really feels like they just want them to be the Werewolf analog and nothing else by this point.

>>52702691
>>52702778
Shapeshifting into animals is interesting, but very limited. Taking on traits that are more than just animals.

A no moon shapeshfting into a spirit and being dematerialised.
A full moon changing his arm into indestructible moonsilver to parry the teeth of a behemoth.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B4wN-6BdRhC5Q3NvNnFpTERWdTg

PEACH my abyssal antagonist circle

So I'm going to be running The Tomb of Dreams this sunday for some friends. (the recently released quickstart)

Is there anything I should be aware of or keep in mind if I'm running Exalted for the very first time?

>>52701516
This, plus it was a bad idea to even put forward the concept in jest.

So, more good news about Dragon-Blooded.

>Q: So do Dragon-Blooded use the same XP chart as Solars?
>A: Yeah, Dragon-Blooded currently have identical XP costs to Solars. Not necessarily everyone will follow the same table, but they won't deviate from it without reason. (direct quote from Vance)

>>52702901
10/10

Would murder-fuck all of them. Especially Soulsteel Ape.

>>52702846
>>52702857
"Things that shouldn't exist" isn't really part of the domain of Luna, or any other god. That would probably have to be Oramus.
And what I've seen from the devs regarding Lunars is that they want to make it so you can absolutely play a Lunar who doesn't fight with DBT or grew up in the lap of luxury and wouldn't ever trade it for fur and leather, and that they are moving away from "all animal-themed charms" because that's really limiting. The shapeshifting is probably still mostly constrained to animals, but they have said that chimeras will be treated as something acceptable, that you will be able to shift parts of your body multiple times in a turn, and if you can shapeshift into humans as well it's possible that there will be other non-animal shapeshifting options. And rather than being the zoo exalted, their themes are supposed to be rage, freedom, predation, and monstrousness, so even if they can't become sanity destroying terrors from the Beyond, it seems pretty likely that you could still turn yourself into a rampaging cathedral of flesh if you wanted.
But personally I'm more curious to see how they are going to make them interesting and distinct outside of shapeshifting.

>>52703142
I'm still waiting on

>Q: what are you doing about the craft system?
>A: We're making a new one

>>52703517
What? Is that real?

>>52703517

>New craft system

OH THANK GOD

>>52703584
No, its what he wan't to happen. However its never going to happen and he should get over it.

>>52703584
>>52703591
Yes what >>52703650 said.

I was just making a joke.

>>52702857
>A no moon shapeshfting into a spirit and being dematerialised.
>A full moon changing his arm into indestructible moonsilver to parry the teeth of a behemoth.

2e did both of those

>>52704047
And 3e rather than try to make them neat and functional is threatening to throw those out.

>>52699151
>I've been thinking of exalt type.
>So it's perfectly acceptable that a Solar would want this?
For the most part, any goal is valid for any type of exalted.

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>>52703277
>"Things that shouldn't exist" isn't really part of the domain of Luna, or any other god. That would probably have to be Oramus.

That would necessarily come with altering Lunars to support any changes in how they function. It's not like Luna is particularly well defined in any case other than "She's the moon, can tongueblast a primordial's lovehole well enough to get them to switch sides, and sometimes rides the Sun's big ol' chariot if you know what I mean", and she already has a number of different forms anyway.

Without having it as Supernal, about how many Charms should be good into the Single Point style? Just to the Form?

>>52704159

At what Essence level? You can only have the first two at E1.

>>52704100
The Primordials were pretty particular about what they allowed into Creation. Oramus tread the boundaries of what is and what isn't to make sure nothing that shouldn't be got in. Adrian and the Unconquered Sun patrolled the boundaries to of Creation to keep the Raksha and all those non-Primordial gribblies didn't get in and muck things up. So why would they make a god of being that which should not exist? That seems tremendously out of character for them.

>>52704100
Luna aside, one of the few things that actually are well-defined and interesting about Lunars is that they actually have to acquire the shapes they shift into, whether by the sacred hunt or some other means. This is one thing that certainly shouldn't be thrown out. I don't think that taking the shape of "things that shouldnt exist" is entirely inapproriate for Lunars, though, as long as those things are more Chimera-like than anything else. Mixing and matching traits of various exiting creatures whose shape the Lunar has acquired seems both cool and perfectly appropriate to me.

>>52705231
>exiting
This should be "existing".

So I am kind of in need of some idea help. Anybody have any cool ideas for some eye based supernatural celestial workings?

>>52702901
Can we get any backstory?

>>52705376

Heat beam eyes

>>52695958
>http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/exalted/1069023-ask-the-devs?p=1078033#post1078033
Yeah, whatever, that's not even in the runnings for a top 1000 weird shit sorcerers do to amuse themselves. If it makes you feel better I can fake outrage for you.

GOD I HATE IT WHEN RANDOM NON-VITAL CANON CHARACTERS HAPPEN TO MAKE OTHER PEOPLE HAPPY BY CONFORMING TO WHATEVER ODDITIES THAT PERSON HAS ABOUT THEM.

But I am, spiritually, a snake, so good on them for that one snakeman Solar.

>>52705977
Honestly I just hope they're well-fitted characters that don't seem like they're there purely to tick off quota marks.

>>52706149
I mean to be honest, if you replace "Gender Shenanigans" with "Archetypes that are a stones throw from DND classes" then most of the canon characters are that. Unless they are set up as BBEG characters.

I mean, I agree with you, hope it's a cool character. Won't stop some neckbeards from rampaging about the MtF thing whether or not the character is written well.

>>52706149
I agree. There is nothing whatsoever wrong with transgender characters in Exalted, as long as being transgender isn't their entire character.

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>>52706149

Yeah, including that kind of stuff is pretty much to win non-existant virtual brownie points from people that probably don't play this shit to begin with, same as comics, same as video games, etc.

tl;dr Most of this isn't relevant to anything at all, I mean, what kind of campaign is this even going to be featured in? Does it really matter if the local Satrap is a trigendered rabbit fucker beyond being some random tidbit that most likely won't matter?

>>52705376

See through walls, see dematerialized beings, see Essence, turning people to stone (Medusa), burning people alive (Balor), Penance Stare (Ghost Rider)

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>>52705376
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f77gw2Pp3aY

Anyways, so, what's your guy's favorite charm from 3e?

>>52706311
It doesn't matter, true enough. It doesn't matter one way or another. It's the kind of detail that the devs should be able to include when writing a character without it being a big deal.

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>>52706592

Exactly. Honestly, they probably shouldn't include anything like that in most characters profiles. Let the GM determine if they're gay, straight, has 17 dicks, whatever the fuck.

>>52706592
>It's the kind of detail that the devs should be able to include when writing a character without it being a big deal.

Or without making a big deal of it.

>>52706640
True enough. I'd still say that occasionaly mentioning these things is important to establish what kind of shit flies in the Realm - though I guess it would also suffice to just state that the Realm doesn't really give a shit about what DBs do with their free time as long as they do their duty to the Realm and their House. When these things are mentioned, though, they shouldn't make up a big part of a character's write-up. Like, a sentence or two about some Dynast's latest lover is all fine and good.

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>>52706718

Given most everything does fly in the Realm, and you've got an entire House dedicated to being a debauched bunch of wankers, it makes it even less likely any of this is notable.

>>52706647
To be fair, they were directly asked about it. So it was like "Sure, X is Y"

>>52706759
The answer was however delivered in a very "But of course we have X being Y, we will continue to uphold our ideals of inclusivity and representation by including plenty of Y and similar such things!" way. So I don't really blame some folks for worrying these characters might feel shoehorned for the purpose of virtue signaling.

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>>52706849

Like I said, it's just going to be for non-existent brownie points, ala games, comics, etc. They do this to look good to demographics that are both not very numerous, or who don't play/read those sorts of things.

It's always at best going to be a simple detail, and at worst it's going to be a complete focus of the character to the point they're going "LOOK AT HOW INCLUSIVE WE ARE ISN'T THIS GREAT GUYS I MEAN JUST LOOK AT IT", and thus end up with a character that isn't a character, just some random whatever that is defined wholly by being a quadsexual pandakin autistic left handed fedora master.

>>52706923
>>52706849
I mean I can see how it might cause a kneejerk of "Are they serious" kind of thing, but it seems disingenuous to say "these demographics don't play" when it's someone on their forum asking? I mean it's at least a little important to people who clearly have interest. I'll give you small. I'll give you it shouldn't be a focus. But let's not make arguments we don't need.

>>52696186

It triggers an eye-roll from me. I don't have any problem with transgenders in the setting, but their motivation's a bit obnoxious: "transgenders and non-binaries because we want to be inclusive and progressive", not "transgenders and non-binaries because it's what these particular characters demand".

>>52707157
All we can do is wait and see.

>>52702691
>Different people have been behind Lunars every edition, and every edition they have been shit at best

Every edition being 2, so far. Your sample size is a bit small to draw conclusions.

>>52707392
>Your sample size is a bit small to draw conclusions.

When that sample size nonetheless covers 100 percent of the previous examples of Lunars, however, he still has something of a point.

>>52707157
How could they mention it and it not be a part of those characters. Do you think they are just going to slap on. "Oh and She is non-binary." at the end of the character description, and everyone will clap? If they do that we have more problems with writing skill than trying to be diverse.

>>52707157
Eh, you could flip that round and ask if the characters really demand heterosexuality over anything else.

>>52707498
Yeah, in a world with Neomah you don't even need straight sex to keep a bloodline alive.

>>52707469
Not that anon but by "because it's what these characters demand" I imagine that we're talking about using those aspects as part of a greater whole character.

>>52707205

Well, that's what the devs said their motivation was in thread. I guess we can wait and see if they manage to obscure it sufficiently well when they write up the character.

The fact that it seems to be` terrestrial sorcerer miffs me as well. Assuming that she's an actual transgender ( instead of the transgender-as-cultural-artifact the Delzahn have going on) she's in the perfect position to just change her body and skip the drama - Sorcerer, Exalt, presumably Heptagram contacts, resources...

>>52707498
Well, here's the thing. Look at Ledaal Kes from previous editions. He's gay. It's a notable part of his character, and it informs his relationship with his wife, Ragara Szaya (who is lesbian herself, thus their marriage tends to be more of a close friendship than anything romantic). But the really big thing about Kes isn't his orientation, it's the fact that he's a god-tier Gateway player capable of beating the likes of Mnemon and Sigareth.

That's how you do this sort of thing. Give it an impact in their lives, make it matter in some way, but don't make it the only impact or the only thing that matters.

The person asking about it wasn't actually asking about transgender characters and in responding, the dev wasn't actually talking about transgender or nonbinary people.

The issues are wholly secondary to the actual question, which was "Are the Exalted team going to continue to conspicuously wear the gang colours?" And the answer was "yes, we are still in the gang."

>>52707515
Well yeah. I think that is default modern writing. Don't declare sexuality unless you need to and if you need to bring it up then have a reason. Hell that works for pretty much anything rather than just sexuality.

>>52706640
I generally agree, though sometimes it does kind of matter if a character is gay or not. Ledaal Kes' sexual orientation, and his wife's, are kind of important when looking at their characters.

>>52707579
Yeah, I can kind of the conflict arises from that.

It's not that anyone is being transphobic or homophobic, but down to the fact that in RPGs, heterosexual is automatically the default.

So the conflict arises between people who want every detail of a character to be a huge important part of them that can easily be used for games, and people who just want side characters to occasionally be mentioned to be gay, lesbian, trans, and how they've dealt with it in that fantasy setting.

I don't know, maybe the writers should have a few characters with explicit sexuality in their character like Ledaal Kes to show STs and players how to do it well, and the ST section should explicitly point out that if a published character has no canonical sexuality each ST can have whatever they want, like with eye or haircolor.

Feel like sometime people on either side ignore this and go straight to nit picking though.

>>52707579
There's a difference between "the only thing that matters" and "the only thing that matters to gang warriors who treat other people's sexuality like they're waving an enemy flag".

>>52707656
What are the gang colours? Who is its leader? Rich?

>>52707157

As someone who likes to write, I often wonder what niche a transgender/non-binary role a character can fulfill. The last one is a cop out if you use AI, but I'm curious to how to write both without making them feel put in for the hell of it.

>>52707830
I'm aware. I just hope that we see more of characters like Kes. Vainly, perhaps, but dammit I hope.

>>52707903
You don't put them in a niche, you work out how the setting they are in relates to them, and how they relate to other people, and work out their story role from that.

It doesn't have to be anything big on the surface of the story - where do they hang out, where they work, who are their loved ones, friends and enemies.

You don't have to stick them in a t-shirt saying "I am transgender / non-binary" to make it work.

Of course you are always going to get people saying you are doing too little/much, but fuck 'em. You can be a self-righteous busy body about anything.

>>52707656
This is such a weird way of looking at this event. Where on the doll did trannies touch you?

>>52708012
Yes, the important thing to do is to ignore all criticism. Some might say that a self-serving rule that unilaterally invalidates everything isn't actually a point against what it's trying to invalidate, but fuck them, they're just self-righteous busybodies.

>>52707849
>What are the gang colours?
L, G, B, and T. Some might say those aren't colors, but that doesn't stop some people from seeing red whenever they come up.

>>52708385
What the hell are you talking about?

>>52708385
>Yes, the important thing to do is to ignore all criticism

Not what he said. The point is that no matter what you do, somebody will be unhappy and criticize non-constructively. That's not the same as saying to ignore all criticism. It's about knowing how to filter out actually good criticism from the REEEEEEEEEEEEEE.

>>52708447
It's a very comforting notion that Someone Will Always Object. It's easy to feel good about yourself and bad about others when anyone who finds a problem with your behavior is just the One That Is Always There rather than a result of you actually doing something wrong. You can invent excuses about separating good and bad criticism that weren't actually part of the original dogma, but what it's really about is having one simple, easy rule with which to categorize and ignore anything that makes him feel too uncomfortable.

>>52708590
I object to that! Fix your post!

>>52708590
Likewise I'm sure it comforts you to believe that all criticism must inherently be valid when it's on a point you don't personally agree with, and that nobody ever opens their mouth just to shit on things because it's not how THEY wanted them to be rather than any more substantial and meritable criticism.

I can really only assume you're new to 4chan if you're that unaware of this phenomenon.

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>>52707037

Alright, that is true. But realistically, when making a product, you do have to pander to the whole, not the minority.

Like I said, I'd just prefer they not even bother to list this kinda stuff. It's relevancy should be determined by the GM's.

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>>52708818
>Alright, that is true. But realistically, when making a product, you do have to pander to the whole, not the minority.

K, but I don't think people who get triggered by trans people are ever a majority unless you're, I dunno, selling t-shirts to Republicans or some shit.

>>52708409
>>52708072
>Everything must be about LGBT
>All the time
>Forever

Your gang colours are showing.

>>52709245
faggot opinion detected

stop getting triggered you loser

>>52708839

Most people find trans entirely weird and warped. In Asia, we mostly regard them as mentally ill.

>>52709761
Real transgenderism IS a mental condition: body dysmorphia. It's a fucking horrible thing for a kid to grow up with and neither of the two people I know with it are overly fond of "transtrender" types who treat being trans like it's something especially desirable.

>>52708818
>Alright, that is true. But realistically, when making a product, you do have to pander to the whole, not the minority.
They're struggling to grapple with this. It's destroyed American politics. Give it a while.

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>>52708839

I don't think anyone here was triggered by it. Personally I'm a bit curious as to why it's even relevant beyond a dev going "Sure yeah heres whatever so we don't get bad PR, because the last devs loved giving us bad PR".

>>52709929
To me it's just that I hope the characters turn out good and well-rounded, such that I might actually want to use them as NPCs in a campaign.

oh for fucks sake, this sjw bullshit is why exalted sucks. enough already

>>52707803
>but down to the fact that in RPGs, heterosexual is automatically the default.

And, to be honest, life too. Heterosexuality is overwhelmingly more common than heterosexuality. It pretty much would have to be, or the species would have died out long ago. That doesn't necessarily say anything about it's morality, but homosexuality, transgenderism, and all the other flavours of the LGBT rainbow are pretty small niches in human sexuality overall.

>>52710223
>It pretty much would have to be, or the species would have died out long ago.
The giraffe would like a word with you
With his dick
As long as you are also a dude

>>52710217

And here Ii thought it was the natural language and clunky subsystems.

>>52708694
You haven't pointed out any real problems, so no.

See, what I did there was use logic to judge your objections. I didn't need to invoke the "someone always objects, always always always" thought-terminating cliché to dodge valid criticism, because you didn't provide valid criticism.

>>52708697
See above.

>>52710306

AFAIK, giraffes tend to be bisexual rather than homosexual. As long as he still makes little giraffes, what he does with his mates in his spare time has little impact on his species' survival.

>>52709907
A side character being the same is hardly pandering. MAYBE one character out of five in the canon Solars you could make an argument about but even that works to display an odd civilization as much as "Muh SJW"

>>52709245
>reads statements that aren't written in the posts he's offended by
>"Your gang colors are showing."
This is a common mistake by people who treat others' identities like some sort of war on their person.

>>52710351
Your "logic" is a fallacious strawman, disingenuously delivered. Your own argument breaks down into "criticism is always valid, always always always".

>>52710333
it can be two things

>>52710369
And really I don't think Prince Diamond is all that bad either. It's not all that he is and it's an aspect of his character that actually causes him realistic problems in his dealings with other people. It's flavorful, it's good.

>>52710351
See, what I did there was use logic to judge your objections. I didn't need to invoke the "someone always objects, always always always" thought-terminating cliché to dodge valid criticism, because you didn't provide valid criticism.

Ah but it took you valuable energy to reply, so I won. And if you reply to this I'll win again. Winning is fun.

Not only that, but if someone different objects for similarly asine reasons, you'll have to repeat your arguments to them too.

>>52710223
Sure, but so you know, is magic, and shapeshifting and giant sun robots.

> It pretty much would have to be, or the species would have died out long ago.
There still are neomah in this universe - sacrifice some of your flesh, no problems with the realm even if you are both male or female.

Hell there are probably nastier demons that can replicate other methods like what bed bugs do, or spiral ducks.

>>52710518
>There still are neomah in this universe - sacrifice some of your flesh, no problems with the realm even if you are both male or female.

Yeah, but most of them are stuck in Hell and there aren't a whole lot of sorcerers about. Their existence thus isn't really enough of a selective pressure to seriously reduce the prevalence of heterosexuality.

>>52710552
Sure, it's just kind of weird that in a game where you can easily play Gilgamesh, Enkidu, Dracula, Kwai Chang Caine, or Aang, that characters sexuality sticks out like a sore thumb.

I mean sure, if the majority of humanity in Exalted were trans or homosexual it'd be a huge change that'd need to be explained, but more in canon just means more that the 'camera' has focused on to.

It's like that complaint that all the places on the threshold are all special snowflake places that are a thorn in the realm's side.

The obvious answer to that is that there are plenty of boring satrapies that kotow and pay their taxes, but aren't very interesting places to stage a chronicle.

None of this excuses a terrible story that is "redeemed" by including token LGBT themes of course.

>>52701083
>Dodge works on ranged and lethal without essence.
Does parry not work on ranged and lethal attacks? (with melee at least)

>>52710710
it does become a bit silly when exalted literally inverts the proportions though. and its so blatantly token it bugs people anyway

>>52710418
>Your "logic" is a fallacious strawman, disingenuously delivered. Your own argument breaks down into "criticism is always valid, always always always".
I'll just let your argument speak against itself.

>>52711150

With Melee it does, if you're bare handed you need a stunt.

>>52711250
>I'll just let your argument speak against itself.

You've yet to produce an actual viable argument against it on your own, so I suppose more fool me for expecting anything more out of you.

>get into 2e game
>excited, do tons of fun shit for session 0 and afterwards through text
>start spinning up tons of plates for plans
>we dont even have a session one

why are online groups so hard to keep together?

>>52711342
>You've yet to produce an actual viable argument against it on your own,
There's no need. You made one for me. Here, let me provide a literary aid:

>Your own argument breaks down into "criticism is always valid, always always always".
Your "logic" is a fallacious strawman, disingenuously delivered.

How is it going, I am in a bit of a creative slump while thinking of ideas for a modern 3e game.

I have the mechanics down (or more accurately I blatantly copied them from homebrew materials)

Just wanted to ask if you guys if you had any Ideas for stories. (The basic premise is that it is the Third Age. Exalted kind of disappeared for an unknown reason after temporarily fighting back the enemies of creation and mortals had to make due. Now all the Exalted are coming back in the modern Creation)

>>52711728
>Your "logic" is a fallacious strawman, disingenuously delivered.

Nope. My logic is perfect. That *is* what your argument breaks down to. You refuse to acknowledge the possibility that some criticism may in fact be nothing more than pointless whining over matters of mere preference or merely intended to stir up shit for no positive gain whatsoever. I'm telling you that this is a thing that happens. It happens *a lot*. 4chan especially tends to have a bad signal-to-noise ratio in this regard. And that is why I believe you to be either very new, very lucky, or just very stupid.

>>52707803
>ST section should explicitly point out that if a published character has no canonical sexuality each ST can have whatever they want, like with eye or haircolor.


fuck no. not when we're getting charms/mechanics or actual functional worldbuilding setting fluff cut for wordcount as it is

>>52707803
> the ST section should explicitly point out that if a published character has no canonical sexuality

thats a waste of wordcount for something that's a fucking waste of time

you're not an idiot, if you really want your fags to be hetero you can decide that without the book saying anything about it

How would you fluff a PF Vitalist/Other Psion type for magic?

Trying to make something similar to a Vitalist in terms of fluff, since I'm updating a character to Exalted for an upcoming game, but not sure what to do for Shaping Rituals. Something to do with successful medicine rolls giving s.Motes for one of them, maybe?

>>52707803
Snowflake shit, anon.

>>52712287
>How would you fluff a PF Vitalist/Other Psion type for magic?

Trying to port over D&D stuff to Exalted doesn't always end that well. What're they normally capable of?

>>52706311

That's the thing. Most of the freaks and trannies they're trying to cater to do not actually buy or play games.

It's like the Marvel comics furor. They're trying to capture a demographic that isn't interested. When it comes to RPGs, comics and so on, your audience is straight white men. Alienate them at your peril.

>>52712305
Oh I didn't expect it to end well, mostly to just get a starting point and jump from there.

Vitalists, depending on which Method are Psionic healers.

They can manifest powers across their Collective (which is essentially just a mental group that needs at least 1 Wisdom) regardless of distance, so long as they are in the Collective.

Merits are probably going to be simple, but the whole "'magic' doctor" bit comes off as odd to me when trying to make Shaping Rituals.

>>52707441
If I flip a coin twice and it's heads both times, logically that means that the odds of getting heads is 100%?

>>52712412
I feel like a more apt analogy would be...if we'd only shaken hands two previous times, and both of those times I'd zapped you with a joy buzzer, it wouldn't really be unreasonable for you to be less than eager to shake hands a third time if offered.

>>52712370
Most straight white men won't be alienated by something like this, though, not as long as characters in question are still actal characters, who just so happen to be transgender or whatever, instead of character-shaped political manifestos. The kinds of people who'd be alienated by any inclusion of LGBT shit are as rare and as freaky as the people being catered to. This whole thing is just a complete non-issue.

>>52713770
there sure are a lot of people freakin out in here over nothing

>>52713810
No, there arent' There aren't that many people posting in this thread, not all or even most of those people took part in this discussion one way or another, and those who did take part seem to be pretty split on whether this is a big deal or no. Even most of those who are kind of worried about this don't really seem to be freaking out to me. More like they're worried about some character writeups becoming more about real life sociial and political issued than interesting characters who make sense in the setting. Being kind of fed up with everything being so political these days is common and understandable. Being outraged by a bit of catering to minority groups, as long as it doesn't detract from the point of the game, is not.

>>52710518
>Sure, but so you know, is magic, and shapeshifting and giant sun robots.

Yeah, and if they want to make a world were homo/bi-sexuality is more common, that's up to them. But the criticism in the GP was "heterosexuality is the default in RPGs", which is only a valid criticism if you think there's some sort of moral requirement to over-represent alternative sexuality in RPGs.

>>52712450

Except, as previously established, the people behind Exalted have changed every time. So, it's more like you've only ever shaken hands twice in your life time, and got buzzed both times. It's reasonable to expect the next random person to shake your hands would also buzz you, but it's still an incorrect conclusion drawn because you don't have sufficient data.

>>52714528
>It's reasonable to expect the next random person to shake your hands would also buzz you, but it's still an incorrect conclusion drawn because you don't have sufficient data.

That it's reasonable was basically the only point I was aiming at anyway. I'm not personally too overly concerned about Lunars this time, but I don't really blame others for being so.

>>52711406

>2e game

Here's the problem

>>52714500
Incidentally, I don't really remember reading anything indicating that homo- and bisexuality are actually any more common in the Creation than in the real world. It's just that in most of the Creation not being heterosexual isn't a big deal. I know that the "everyone in Exalted is bisexual" meme is pretty widespread, but it's just that, a meme.

>>52714607
Yeah, essentially. It's kind of like how "cult" doesn't have the negative connotations in Creation that it does in the real world.

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>>52707469
>Do you think they are just going to slap on. "Oh and She is non-binary." at the end of the character description, and everyone will clap? If they do that we have more problems with writing skill than trying to be diverse.

It's WW, anon. The author of Beasts: The Sociopaths You Should Feel Sorry For. Do you honestly, in your heart of heart, believe they won't fuck it up somehow?

>>52714613
Incidentally, "cult" used not to have perjorarive connotations either. It used to mean the rites of a particular deity in a pantheon. So you would have the cult of Dionysus, the cult of Athena, etc.

It became perjorative when the old polytheistic religions were supplanted, and the old "cults" were considered heretical. Then the term came to mean other heretical practices that diverged from the religious mainstream. Now it basically means "religious people I don't like".

>>52715115
>Do you honestly, in your heart of heart, believe they won't fuck it up somehow?

Eh, there's a small chance. Mainly because none of the people who shat out Beast are writing Exalted.

>>52713770

Not really. Most people don't accept gays, homosexuals or trannies. A normal person recoils from them, the way you would recoil from a pedophile or a leper.

Personally, any mention of that kind of content means pirate, not buy, for me.

>>52707498

Yes, because heterosexuality is the default. Hetersexuality is the norm because it's the only way we humans reproduce. There are Neomah or whatever, but no-one uses Neomah regularly. When someone says 'sex', we're thinking heterosexual sex.

It's like going "Is it natural to be blind?"

No, the default is being able to see. If you're blind, you're disabled. You're lacking the basics someone needs to function. All those orientations are abnormal because they're not the 'default'.

>>52696427
>Damn, that actually sounds like a huge improvement. Well, except for the "mad" part. I've never liked forced insanity as a "thing"
TAW authors use Apollo and Dionysus concept to write their homebrew. If Solar is the perfection then Lunar is the chaos.
Though if you want to play TAW then just use 2.5e Infernal instead.

>>52712385
theres already the "ascetic alchemist" shaping ritual, magic doctor doesn't seem too out of place

>>52713810
It's something to talk about. Occasionally we get some homebrew, but not often. Sometimes there's news that a book is on the way, but actual new content is very distant. The setting doesn't change, and neither do the rules. Few new people try Exalted, and those that do are unlikely to stay because the rules are, relative to other systems, obtusely worded and hard to learn.

What's left to talk about? This is why so many 40k threads are "could [external thing] beat 40k?". People want to talk about the thing they're invested in, but there isn't much left to say.

This is the same thing, taking an external argument into the thread to try to keep the posts coming.

which two charmtrees should a social-fu lunar favor if they can only choose two of charisma, manipulation, appearance?

what if they're competing with a solar?

similar question, what's better for a warrior dipping into spooky crone: intelligence or perception?

>>52715441
Anon, is it really so hard to accept that you're part of a deviant minority? Most people don't agree with you, just deal with it and discuss Exalted.

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>>52712046
Don't forget this is where people too annoying to function in non anon gaming communities end up. Think about that for a second. Too annoying to function in non anon gaming communities. (pic related)

That's a pretty low bar. Keep that in mind when discussing things here. It helps with levity knowing 95% of respondents here probably have never played any game outside terrible chat rpgs. Most of them will remain oblivious to the fact that carrying around baggage over specific elements of fantasy games is typically the root of the problem.

One fun thing to do is see posters get assblasted on the official forums over nothing and you just know they are going to end up here. They will proceed to complain like a 12 year old boy talking shit about his mom for not making his pizza pops the right way.

>>52716285
What is an "anon gaming comunity", anon? Do you only game with anons or something?

>>52711780
Wait all exalted disappeared for a bit? The Empire would collapse overnight not mention heaven. If you do that you need to make your game setting much more local and isolated from the rest of creation.

>>52716549
Sorry I was unclear, some of the Exalted do remain but they are working from the shadows doing something. Also the Sidereals never left but given the way that they interact with creation, people just stopped remembering them.

What I mainly mean when I say they disappeared is the they ceased most interactions with mortals (Which most Solars and Lunars come from and hence my circle of players don't know what happened other then they disappeared.).

Also yes the Realm did collapse it took a lot of years to put some form of cigilization back.

>>52715884
It's more that I just don't know what to do for shaping rituals for the archetype.

>>52716285
Right, it's easy to mindlessly ignore what people are saying when you have elaborate default assumptions about how inferior they are to you and how their actions are "practically" something stupid and mockable instead of what they actually are.

It's not a very rational mindset, but it certainly helps if you want to "break down" facts you can't deal with into nonsensically extreme strawman arguments.

>>52718113
What kept Creation intact with the Realm collapsing? How much of Creation still exists? When you say modern, how close to current day Earth do you mean? What are the ramifications of Creation not being a globe? How is the Wyld dealt with by the mortals? Who's running things?

>>52712046
>That *is* what your argument breaks down to.
No, that's a strawman argument that you made up completely out of nowhere. My argument is that all-encompassing simplistic absolutes are no substitute for actually thinking about what people are saying; disagreeing with one mindless extreme like "there's always a complainer, end of thinking" is not mutually inclusive with another random, equally simplistic extreme.

This is why it's a bad idea to "boil down" people's arguments. If you're disingenious enough, you can boil down arguments like "you should judge points of criticism on their own merits instead of blindly applying simple rules" into the exact opposite of themselves.

>And that is why I believe you to be either very new, very lucky, or just very stupid.
Alternatively, your strawman is wrong. Since it's completely incompatible with all my words and actions, this is the most likely scenario.

>>52715425
this is what faggotry looks like

>>52697869
TAW is fucking awful, not to mention mostly cribbed from the work of others.

>>52718245
>I cant pattern recognition

>>52718514
These are some very good questions. Here is, to the best of my ability, the answers. Let me know if any of them are insufficient.

1. A combination of Sidereals and successful Lunar conditioning. Also for the first few decades after the collapse, God-Bloods, Half Castes and the Guild have been running things and preventing the collapse of economy wholesale.
2. Most of it, the Wyld was beaten back pretty far during the Second Age in my continuity. Overall as of the time of the campaign 95% of it.
3. Modern day agriculture, personal weaponry, medical technology, computer technology, vehicular construction. Basically the two primary things they don't have include nuclear development (prevented by the Sidereals) and space exploration technology (Don't ask out internet works, it just does).
4. Unsure, I will get back to you on that.
5. Instead of one centralized area like the realm had that kept the stability of the land. There are now multiple large cities that act similarly and their locations have been strategically manipulated by the Sidereals to be placed around the geomantic poles. This means that while the poles are connected by creation the further from any one pole you go the more unstable it gets. As for the Raksha themselves they are kept at bay by Sidereals, the few (think like 4 or 8) high powered Solars and Lunars that are to busy to make any bigger plans, and the remnants of Lookshy.
6. The Guild, God Blooded, A few extremely smart mortals who would have theoretically Exalted (Think Tesla, Einstein for technological progress and Cyrus the Great for bureaucratic skill). As of the start of the Campaign it will likely be a mad rush for those positions or the people in those positions will have Exalted.

I'm going to guess that you've responded to my reiteration of my point by trying to tell my I'm actually saying something else and insulting me for it.

>>52718952
Okay, I'll admit, I wasn't expecting that.

>>52716285
You all realize notanautomaton is the same person who was the ebon dragon, right?

>>52719171
the ebon dragon was banned for an utterly bullshit reason though

>>52718514
think he means like exalted shard. where the modern world equivalent runs more or less becuase exalts simulteniously beat the wyld into remission and faded behind the scenes. occasionally you see a tweet about the fighting at creation's borders and otherwise you're living in shadowrun

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>>52714607
>Incidentally, I don't really remember reading anything indicating that homo- and bisexuality are actually any more common in the Creation than in the real world

Depends on the area. The Realm for example, has a ton of that going on with noble families, because they don't care what you slam your clam or cornhole to, as long as you spit out a baby every so often.

>>52714576
I mean, not to be that guy, but 3e is kind of... really incomplete at the moment.

>>52719675
That'd mean that LGBT Dragon-Blooded can get up to what they want in their free time without having to fear persecution, not that there'd be more of them.

>>52719019
You didn't specify when talking about 'ideas' so I'm going to go with plot hooky stuff.

Sidereals have prevented nuclear development so far, but now there are Solars all over the goddamn place, how long's that last? What comes after?

Modern day agriculture means plants are less diverse, means it ought to be simple for any Exalt who's interested to create some Exalt level famine.

Modern day weaponry turns out to be a lot more effective than swords and spears, being Exalted is no longer an immunity to mortals.

Autochthon's got to be interested in the technological development going on here.

Self-replicating, improving AI created by some newly exalted Solar go apeshit.

DBs come back in force, orders of magnitude more than there were during the 2nd age. There are a couple teenagers Exalting in every high school.

Games of Divinity MMO is released. It's nothing in comparison to what the Incarnae are playing with, but it's enough to grind productivity to a halt Creation-wide.

>>52719563
Ahh, if that is the case.

Part of the reason the Exalted are coming back is because the Exalted who are still alive decided to finally bring back all the other Exalts.

Since the Solars are seen by the Sidereals as being a destabilizing factor and the fact that having one centralized Empress is to easy to manipulate. They decided that it would be better to consolidate their gains (From pushing back the Wyld so far) that it wasn't worth trying to fix the problem of ceased Exaltations.

So they just supported the mortals, however the mortals then through the use of technology accidentally fucked with too many gods. The Infernals and the Raksha then seeing a weakened Creation with almost no Exalted start putting in agents of destruction in the population (See reports of demon possessions etc).

Finally the Sidereals realized, oh shit we are starting to lose ground fast and fixed the problem.

In otherwords the campaign is basically in a setting that is like what would happen if a Shadow/Cold War just went full nuclear, just without nukes and in their place demigods with nigh-infinite potential.

Also keep in mind most of the cities are spread out and part of their own nations. What this means is that the surrounding area is still rural and wilderness. Just with major population centers nearby.


I am going for a very specific type of setting, one where there are cities but also an abundance of wilderness around them. One where the Realm does not exist but still has the same general cosmology. But most importantly one where it is essentially a grab bag of territory, cities and ancient weapons that the players need to get to first. In otherwords less Shadowrun and more like a weird mix of RWBY (For Cities but more than four), Indiana Jones (Finding ancient treasures), Farcry, and Infamous (Kind of), that doesn't feature as heavy a focus on corporations.

>>52719019
I ran something like this a few years back.
The earth being a globe thing was solved with explaiing how the world lost their exalts.
At the end of the age of sorrows, most of the deathlords were made into non-threats, a significant part of the abyssal host were renegades and the key to redemption was discovered by the gold faction and spread, the solars being considered less of an immediate threat than Abyssals or infernals. In general things were looking up.

But the wyld attacked, and now they brought more wyld monstrosities than had been considered before. They had also learned their lessons and gave no respite. No exalt could rest. The world was coming to an end. Something something, the fae had plot armor.

So the exalted host came up with a plan. The wyl was infinite. Yet however, something infinite can't be infinite if there was something that was not part of it. So with a sorcery mightier than anything before, with help from all different kind of exalts, including Gaia and Autochon and a devil-tiger. The elemental pole of earth was remade into a shell around the wyld, forcing it into becoming an infinitly small inside the pole of fire which was inside the pole of earth, followed by the pole of water, wood and air. Spreading them out and shredding them. Forever sealing the wyld inside the glove. But basically destrying all of creation except some small fragments, saved by the terrestial gods.

Shortly afterwards hoever, steeping out from ther secret hideouts, exalts and gods realized that their essence gain was cut off. Not completely, but the gates to Yu-Shuan and many other given truths started to change.

Gods fled to heaven where the powers still worked, though in a much lesser form, many else joined. But the vast majority were still stuck on earth. And within a month, it was accepted that anything but mortals would eventually disappear.

They did.

Cont

>>52720304
However, prayers could get through, but the lack of responses quickly turned the beliviers away.

Some crazy people however got enough right every now and then, sending a few shards of prayer up to heaven. The gods and the few exalts had watched and figured out how to solve things. It required forcing the geomancy flows into their designated shape, setting up worshippers to keep it going and making sure that the world resumed it's course.

One day they had enough to open a gate, elementals by the millions poured though, reshaping the world with no care for lives. It was considered worth the cost. Gods appeared talking to religions that best suited their interests. Exalts popped up. The few shards of dragon-blood still left in man rose up.

It was yet another apocalypse, but less so this time. Most people survived, though the laws of physics changed. Electricty was unstable, industries collapsed and nations were confused when the map was remade.

>>52720232
Thanks just going to go down these. Also when I say Story Ideas what I mean are Adventure Ideas since the book says story when it means adventure for some reason.

1. A big worry of the Sidereals atm.
2. I like that idea it gives the Abyssals something to do besides Zombie Horde.
3. Yup
4. He is back (though he never did get over his 'Cold') so that is going to cause some problems.
5. That is a new idea thanks
6. Basically what is happening.
7. Actually part of the problem and a major factor of why the Fair Folk and the Infernals are getting bedroom eyes for Creations thick juicy existence.

>>52720311
>>52720304
Looking back on it, it was kinda stupid and overdone. But I wanted the world as it was today. Combining post-apocalypse with exalted.

>>52720138

I'd rather play the fan splats than ever touch 2e ever again.

>>52716106
Cha man
Man app

>>52720170
When queer folk aren't forced to be in the closet,there tends to be a hell of a lot more of them.

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>>52720170

It's not just that, it's that since it's a cultural norm for them, it's probably a lot more prevalent. And lets face it, what kind of debauched noble whose entire life is spent being told they're literally better than everyone else and they can do no wrong, wouldn't get up to some very sordid encounters?

>>52719155
Cheers for playing along mate

>>52720848
I'm sure a lot of Dragon-Blooded do get up to some very sordid encounters, but with the sex they're attracted to. I can buy a lot of DBs having tried it both ways, because why not, but I'd still see the majority of them being heterosexual. Well, mostly heterosexual, anyways. Heterosexuality has an important biological function, so I'd assume it is the default and most common sexal orientation even among the Dynasty. It's just that other orientations are also perfectly acceptable. Homosexuality isn't any wierder or more counter-productive than masturbation, oral, anal or sex while using cotraceptives, after all. To be honest, though, I don't think the question about the prevalence of homo- and bisexuality in the Realm is something that needs any kind of canonical answer. Attitudes about different forms of sexuality matter somewhat, but their prevalence really doesn't that much.

perfect soak vs perfect parry. does it matter?

I think you can't perfect parry unblockable attacks, only perfect dodge or perfect soak? and you can only defend other with a parry?

so perfect soak is the most universal perfect defense unless you need to protect somebody else?

>>52720687
iirc census data hasn't actually supported that assumption

>>52721152
It does not however protect against grapples, getting stuck under mountains or the like. One tick later you are still where you are.

>>52721263
ah thanks. knew it had to have some sort of drawback

>>52721183
Idk man I don't know a single queer person over 30 and yet, Most people I know my age are queer in some way shape or form. Looks like the changing social norms pretty handily allow more queer folk to be out of the closet.

>>52721152
You can perfect parry/dodge any attack unless it explicitly says you can't perfect party said attack.

>>52721373
You do realize that no one's circle of acquintances is a representative sample of the society as a whole, right? If statistics disagree with your personal experience, the statistics are probably right.

if I get 30 free xp of thaumaturgy what should I take?

>>52721484
And being in the closet to anyone that's not your close group of friends really fucks with statistics, doesn't it?

Does anyone have that sorcerous initiation someone made for mortal martial artists? I checked the homebrew folder, but either I'm blind or it ain't there.

Thanks in advance.

>>52720170
There's no LGBT Dragon-Blooded, just like there's no LGBT Romans or ancient Greeks, even though they fucked little boys every so often.

When nobody cares if you fuck little boys in your manse's closet every Tuesday, the whole idea of being an 'oppressed' 'minority' that is purely Murrican disappears. You aren't an oppressed minority. You're just a noble who like little boys. Nobody fucking cares except the one that can provide you with little boys, and the one grumbling that you are spending too much family money on little boys and should learn to restrain yourself.

>>52722288
>There's no LGBT Dragon-Blooded
Of course there are. There are definitely Dragon-Blooded who prefer their own sex, and these people are by definition gay. They don't magically become something else because gays aren't an oppressed minority.

>>52721152
Perfect Parry/Dodge means "If it doesn't explicitly say that I can't Perfect Parry/Dodge it, I can", even against effects that can't be dodged/parried.

The advantage to Perfect Soak is that you can activate it -after- the attack, whereas Perfect Dodge/Parry has to be declared before the attack is rolled. The flip-side to this, however, is that Perfect Soak doesn't protect you from bad-touch effects, it just reduces all damage to 0. So, if a Water Dragon stylist hits you and you Perfect Soak it; Congrats, no damage. But you still do lose a point of Stamina, due to the Water Dragon charm they used, and if your Stamina is reduced to 0 you die regardless of Perfect Soak. Perfect Parry/Dodge, however, -does- prevent bad touch effects, cause they didn't actually hit younin the first place. That's the trade-off.

This assumes you're talking about 2e of course, since Perfect Defenses were largely gotten rid of in 3e.

So, any word on wether future books will tone down the use of Natural Language in the mechanics sections, now Morke and Shearer are gone?

>>52723495
It won't be completely gone like some anons want, no matter what we won't get D&D 4e style descriptions. But Vance has mentioned he is seeking to provide more clarity in the text.

Natural language can coexist along with some level of clarity.

>>52722395
Being gay/homosexual, as in exclusive attraction to one's own sex, is a very modern concept and wouldn't apply to the vast majority of ancient Greeks (or the samurai, or whatever pederastic culture).

Bisexuality is more appropriate, but its use still implies a binary of sexual attraction.

Talking about "LGBT" in a pre-modern culture is anachronistic at best and horribly misleading at worst.

>>52723539

>Natural language can coexist along with some level of clarity.

The only time it ever did was the once sentence descriptions in DnD 4e.

>>52723953
If thats honestly how you feel I think the problem probably lies more in reading comprehension on your part.

>>52724026

If the rules for the charms were presented in a clear and actually legible way then this problem wouldn't exist.

Such as the "Ask the Dev's" thread on the main forum fucking full of questions about such clarifications. If the game were competently designed then *this should've never happened*.

>>52724069
Most of those questions are idiotic. 90% of them are things any ST with half a brain could have easily inferred just from reading the book and making a judgement call.

>>52724069
This. There are a couple of questions there that seem to be more born of stupidity or people deliberately scrabbling for loopholes to abuse rather than genuine uncertainty, but those are definitely the minority. Fuck natural language.

>>52724139
A well written system doesn't require inference or ST fiat that often

>>52725237
>that often
So exalted then?

>>52719487
Is not sucking Holden's dick a bullshit reason though?

Jadeborn when? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Id2NcP7m-k

>>52727992
>Jadeborn

Who?

>>52730280
Exalted-setting dwarves.

>>52731096
Exalted had dwarves? Huh. Guess that outs me as a newfag to the game.

>>52731173
They're more like elf-dwarves, really. Jadeborn Artisans, their ruling caste, are closer to elves than dwarves.

>>52731173
They're pretty cool. Basically, Fey trapped by the creation of... Creation. Their patterns solidified within it, and they changed from Fey to a Creation-born race made of the internal rules of nature and scientific principles.

They are very closely tied to Autochton, master of magitek, and nowadays exist in three castes: workers (typical dwarves), warriors (typical angry dwarves) and artisans (typical elves and mad scientists). All the artisans have the Spark of enlightenment, but most workers and warriors don't.

They are every trope about dwarf, elves, magitek and mad scientists in one neat package, and have pretty cool charm trees too. Additionally, they are arguably the most powerful fighting force of Creation, though a geass laid down upon them early prevent them from going above ground unless commanded by an Exalted.

>>52727992
Huh the lyrics are almost a perfect fit too.

>>52731773
Technically Mountain Folk warriors are less dwarves and more slightly short power armored Neanderthals; warriors are around five feet tall.

Still, this. Mountain Folk are cool and apparently they'll get a mention at least in the Realm book.

I miss the pletora of Martial Arts we had last edition.

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>>52731773

Yeah, and should Autobot return, he'd undoubtedly remove that geas and suddenly it's People of Adamant time, with a few Alchemical Charms.

>>52733259
That would imply Autobot is anywhere near coming back and Solar awesome wouldn't, as always, live up to the challenge.
Also, that would imply he needn't help to selfrepair.

>>52732685

We'll get more, lots more. Didn't 2e core have only like two MA styles? I know that none of the Styles that Morke wrote one line descriptions for are guaranteed to get in, but it's nice to see what they're thinking about. I mean, Savage Witch, a style that lets you grow and attack people with a carnivorous beard? Yes, please!

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?753409-Exalted-Ask-the-Devs-pt3-Merged-x3/page192

>>52694978
Any artifact firewands in 2E aside from that one infernal one?

>>52734317

Just the shittily-named Plasma Tongue Repeater and Fuel Bolt Launcher.

They may use an alchemical fuel for improved damage and range, but there's unlikely to be any real reason why you couldn't use firedust instead.

>>52734317
>>52734450

The Fire Lance in WotLA can shoot fire and has he Flame tag, making it compatible with certain MA styles.

>>52710552

Not to mention that sorcerers are usually viewed with kind of a side-eye at best. Not only do they know secret workings of the universe, there are some ways of learning Sorcery that range from "Are you sure that person's sane?" (such as Scarred by Nightmares) to "That's a bad person." (Pact with Mara. That is all.)

Demon-summoning works within acceptable parameters (to the summoner) often enough that it's not an idiot's decision to cast that spell.

But going to a sorcerer to summon a demon to make your baby because the two of you have incompatible bits has enough room for complications (and rumors) that most of the people who can get a sorcerer to do it for them (and really, how many will do it for free?) will likely give it a pass unless they're really desperate.

So in general, it's going to be rare-ish. Among the Realm's Dragon-Blooded, I honestly think it's practically unheard of.

In the real world, especially modern western culture, marriage hasn't really been about continuing the family line--let alone sealing deals between families--for a long time.

Creation doesn't have that at all. In some cases--especially among, say, Dragon Blooded nobility, who have robust constitutions to deal with diseases and frequently access to physicians of discretion and pharmaceuticals of wonder--these are exactly the reasons a character marries, but the idea that the two are attracted to each other or even *like* each other is a tertiary concern on the best of days. Marital fidelity for them is occasionally enviable, if the couple genuinely have a loving, passionate relationship. More frequently, it's an object of subtle ridicule: the Dynasts have an unspoken social standard that lovers are who you want to fuck, spouses are who you have to, and those are two roles best kept separate. It's considered part of the game of high society to not get caught in this.

>>52735426

This isn't to say that you don't have instances where it can happen, but there the families involved are giving tacit permission for any offspring to be manufactured by demons or other strange means.

So when does tomb of dreams go on sale?

Can your familiar be your mount? Can you use Ride charms on your familiar? Is this a good idea? Because I want my flying magical elephant.

>>52736756
Dumbo?

>>52735605
NEVER. IT'S MINE FOREVER.

>>52736756

Only familiars with a Speed Bonus can be used as a Mount. you ca use Ride charms on them. You want Dumbo? Perform a Sorcerous Working on a Yeddim.

>>52737099
That kinds makes me wanna play a character with a flying yeddim and an apropriately named MA style.

>>52737162
Flying yeddim and Air Dragon Style?

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>>52737162
>>52737587
>we will never see people stop trying to force Avatar refs in Exalted

>>52737749
We're also never going to see people stop trying to force ancientmythology refs in Exalted. There is nothing wrong with this. As long as the game doesn't devolve into meme-sprouting and as long as characters are merely influenced by characters from other media instead of just being those characters recreated in Exalted, references aren't even a small problem.

>>52737887

I have legitimately seen no less than 10 DB players actively try to recreate Toph. I don't know why.

All I can say is don't do this. If you're gonna try to rip something off, do it to something obscure as fuck.

>>52738015
>I don't know why.

Neither do I. Dragon-Blooded are not fucking Avatar benders; their elemental expression is one of mostly metaphorical invocations with a handful of limited-scope literal ones. To do an Exalt with similar abilities what you want is an Exigent born of a strongly elemental-aligned god. A volcano or sea god, for example.

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Does the new map of Creation have a scale on it somewhere?

>>52738264
Nevermind, I'm retarded.

>>52738264
>>52738278
Delete your posts. Then delete yourself.

>>52738310
Since I need help, please demonstrate on yourself first.

>>52738015
How specifically were they trying to recreate Toph? Was it literally just Top as a Dragon-Blooded, or was it just some particular apsects of the character?

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>>52739971

Literally Toph as a DB. All different players too, so it wasn't just one guy with a blind girl fetish trying to plop their waifu into a game.

>>52738015
toph was lame, wtf wwf out of nowhere toph

>>52738015
at least be iroh.

>>52740172
then again at least it wasn't that bitch zuko

>>52740013
Well, shit.

It particularly sucks because a good part of the point of that Awareness charm was to let you do blind swordmaster and related tropes. But now everything's gotta be muh avatar.

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>>52740191

Most people aren't smart enough to be Iroh. Hell, most players aren't smart enough to be any fictional character, because they usually have teams of writers concocting their speech and entire situations conceived wholly to show off how smart they are.

>>52731773
>Jadeborn
speaking of that geass....could they technically follow an infernal or abyssal to the surface(not that they would) or does it have to be a solar?

do modified solars count for something like that?

>>52741141
They do for almost everything else, including the Lunar bond, so I don't see why not.

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Are there any rules for swimming? Does movement work the same way in water as it does on land, how about charms that boost movement?

On that note, any way to compare ship speed to character speed?

>>52741671

It likely does and they likely do. Bear in mind that you'll need to take air supply into account (page 232), and that not every set of armour has the "Buoyant" tag.

I think that speed and movement is too abstracted to do anything other than compare apples to oranges.

>>52695958
The problem for the vast majority of players who roll their eyes at this subject has never been that trans characters exist, it's simply the pretentiously self-congratulatory and bizarrely pompous tone a few OPP writers took when dealing with the subject matter. Exalted as a gameline has never had that problem. Even if you disliked Morke and Holden for whatever reason, their design decisions or political views or whatever, you have to admit they never felt the need to insert a preachy sidebar or warp an entire aspect of the setting into a reflection of their political views. They just made Prince Diamond and were done with it.

>>52741808
What would you recommend if one of my players wants to swim around quick enough to outpace ships so he can board/sink them? I think he can actually move faster than non-artifact ships that aren't being magically enhanced as long as he's using his Athletics charms, but I'm not sure about the best way to represent this.

>>52742007

Considering that there are already charms that allow you to run on water and sprint to the horizon in a single turn, i think that you should just fluff it.

>>52742086

>sprint to the horizon in a single turn

How fast would this be in 2e?

>Reading over Total Annihilation
>The orb created in the casting of Total Annihilation can only be parried or dodged through the use of Charms. Any mortal weapon that attempts to parry the sphere will trigger its explosion. If the orb is successfully parried with a Charm and an enchanted weapon, then it is deflected away from the target and will land in a random direction 1,000 yards away. Once the orb explodes, the effect cannot be parried even with the use of Charms and can only be dodged by a perfect defense such as Seven Shadows Evasion or soaked with a Charm such as Adamant Skin Technique. Though this spell’s damaging effects last for more than one turn, such perfect-defense Charms will protect an Exalt from all damage.

Redpill me on Total Annihilation's explosion modo, /exg/. Does perfect defence primacy still trump it, or is it the one spell out there that can BTFO anything that can't soak or dodge perfectly?

>>52742371
Faster than a European swallow, not as fast as an unladen African swallow.

In all seriousness, the yard measuring system confuses me, but that's pretty damn fast considering "horizon" could either mean the rim of a landmass 5 times the surface area of Earth, or a giant robot in disguise which orbits said landmass far away enough to be considered the Sun.

>>52742489

Let's go easy and assume Earth horizon distance.

Does anyone happen to have a compilation that's JUST the stuff from the leak that got cut? Or simhatas, I guess, I'd settle for that.

What's anon's opinion on this idea for a game:

The PC's happen upon a small isolated nation of victorian level technology, steamships, trains and the like. Plenty of indirect references to autocthon thrown in, but there's something lurking in the sewers.

Magical analysis clearly shows this science is nonsense, but some kind of valuable firestone is being generated.

Turns out it is actually a Raksha and God working together by repeatedly boosting up nations over the course of 150 years, let it reach trench warfare and tear itself apart in plague. They've corrupted a few key manses in the area to suffuse certain stone with fire essence traces, creating firestone or coal in that particular location. Similarly they've allowed the discovery of other needed quantities, such as a first age spider, whose silk can be gathered in a material having most of the properties of rubber.

The Raksha gets to partake in dreams of a society not seen since the Shogunate, and unlike it are actually hopeful. The God gets all prayers directed towards itself as a kind of embodied diety of the laws of the universe, and as a puritan work ethic. Both also get a regular diet of criminals given or sacrificed to it.

Their endgame for this nation is still 50 years away, do the PCs deal with them now or later? Cooperate, or destroy their scheme, and the society, but making available a few powerful manses?

>>52743014

>steamships, trains and the like

Into the trash it goes.

>>52741919
Pretty fuckin' much. Ledaal Kes was mentioned as a great example of how to do characters like that above.

>>52743014
Side ideas:
1. The nation is a small island anchored in the Dreaming Sea or the Northern Wastes. Removing the corruption on the manses would mean the island regains its motile capabilities, include potentially short overland flight.
2. Let the God/Raksha have their own minions at DB level by having Sparks or Genius: The Trangression level NPCs, attack.
3. Because of its flimsy paradoxic nature, all the steampunk is naturally weak to Exalted infused essence attacks - it'd be fairly easy for example for a Brawl focused Dawn to lift a train engine over their head and slam it back to the ground.

>>52743042

Ledaal Kes I actually adore. One of the few characters who are gay, but is still an awesome character who has balls made of brass.

>>52743031
But what if the whole thing was a Raksha scheme over a tiny area - and a quite a flimsy one at that?

The issue for the PCs then is that this fake level of tech is making people's lives better, but it's going to all end in tears regardless.

This isn't Industrial Revolution For Dummies, but a trap by a Raksha and a God with memories of the Shogunate and the First Age with what mortals want.

>>52742474

If it's 2E, you'd need a perfect that specifically trumps inapplicability, like the HGD.

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>>52743014

What exactly is the benefit to letting it tear itself apart for the God/Raksha? It seems both keep benefitting the longer the nation stays alive, unless that God is the local God of dying to plagues and shit and just wants to cash in as much Good Boy Points at once as it thinks it can.

>>52740013

To be totally fair, Exalted did have "Blind Earth Aspect compensating with her Awareness Charms" as one of the characters in their Aspect book.

This was literally almost a year before Avatar hit the air with its first season (to say nothing of the second season where Toph was introduced) so WW didn't rip it off of them.

>>52745706
Yeah. Like I said above, that Charm partially draws on the much-older-than-Avatar tropes of the blind swordsman/martial arts master, and was meant to allow you to make that sort of character awesome.

anybody know of a database where I could look up hearthstones possible from a given manse type? or do I have to comb through each book for scattered lists

>>52719171
This is TED/Theion/Whatever Mesopotamian Name I Felt Like Using At The Time

I am not notanautomaton. I have not even thought of that forum in years before my girl just linked me here.

If you know me at all, you know I've never bothered hiding who I am.

>>52747056
that said it does warm the cockles of my heart that literally years after I've completely ditched the community people still think of me as some sort of mystical ghost in the machine

you dumb shits. I don't even write like that guy. when the fuck have I ever said "beyond the pale".

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>>52741141
DB can command them to the surface, so yes, any Exalt ever. The Realm actually considers them a bound state, but they vastly underestimate them. With the active help of Artisans who painfully hide the full extent of what they can do to DBs.

The Realm believes they are some ten of thousands of fancy essence users and have a score of small cities underground. The Jadeborn are ten of millions strong, have the best magitek of Creation, and trains and cars and power armors.

>>52719171
>>52747056
Ah it warms my heart to see that even years after he left, people still jump at my Boyfriend's shadow.

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>>52734450
>>52734522
Why neither of you mentioned me the Firey Solar Cannon?

>>52749033

It doesn't have the flame tag, which means that it's not a firewand.