Warhammer 40,000 General /40kg/

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First for Death Guard When

2nd for she who thirsts

>>52625545
riptide with a 4+ save would still be an improvement.

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real first post for best primarch

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>>52625545
Are ratlings shit in the current meta? New guard player here.

>>52625585
They are perfect to fill the gap when you have spare points.

>>52625581
>>52625558

Mortarion confirmed best Primarch.

>>52625585
Some of the cheapest models in the game per sniper rifle. Not very good but bad. Scarper is nice but stealth won't make up for the fact they're T2.

I like mine, they do good work, keep them in, no pun intended, small squads so they're not valuable enough to shoot at.
5 is the magic number because you need two casulties to make them panic.
Go to ground if they get shot at.

>>52625572
Rend -2 auto cannons when?

>>52625621
>>52625651
Thanks lads, I was hoping to use them to fill out the last 50 points in a list.

>>52625654
i hope soon anon, for both loyalist and traitor's sake.

auto cannons should at least be able to kill space marines...

>>52625677
>>52625651
>>52625677
Not very good but not bad*

Expect them to shave wounds off monsters, snipe out the odd special weapon and make nervous biker squads jink but they won't amaze you.

Not bad for 50 points.

>>52625727
It's going to be fun sweeping marines away with heavy bolters.

Would a cyber-augmented guard be a good addition fluff and crunch wise to for my Ad Mech?

I am a newer player and have a Tech-Priest Dominus, 2 Onager Dunecrawler, a Sydonian Dragoon, ten Skitarii Rangers and ten Skitarii Vanguard.

I still really enjoy the Ad Mech fluff but their army structure and double codex design really suck for me.

My plan is to use the twenty Necron warriors + five Necron Immortals to augment the troopers from two of the Start Collecting Astra Militarums. Just an Arm/Hand/Leg here and there.

I already have two Chimeras from trading off other parts of what I had for Necrons.

No one plays IG at my shop so I havent a good reference to the size difference but I could always shave down necron parts to be a bit more fitting.

>>52625727
>for both loyalist and traitor's sake.
But they would be the ones most fucked over by it.
They pay a ton of points on their basic troops for 3+ armour, huge rend values makes that even more of a joke.

Think of the terminators and mega nobs reduced to 4+ saves...

>>52625787
>implying heavy bolters will ever be good
Anon, hope is the first step in the road to disappointment

>>52625813
Please post these when you're done if you end up going through with it.

I can't say whether or not it would be wise or fluff accurate, but damn would it look cool.

>>52625727
>>52625787
I really hope AP 4 stuff only becomes a -1 rend. As >>52625832 points out, that effectively sticks them with guard armor. If they're sitting in cover, that's what they'd get anyway most of the time.

A -1 is reasonable for something just shy of getting past a 3+ save, and will do its job against 4+ armor about as well (leaves them with a 5+, so if they're standing in a forest there's no change)

-2 should be reserved for things like plasma.

Look I know there are Tau haters(seems like everything but orks have haters in 40k) however, I do want to know about certain etiquette between players as a Tau player. Played a 2v2 2000 per person game earlier. Eldar player and my ally wanted to bring in LOWs so we agreed upon one LOW per team(I don't have a LOW and the 4th guy did have one but I told him no simply because I do not have one). The list was Eldar(running a wraith knight, lord, guards, and etc in some super nasty formation) and the other guy was playing some random blood angels formation guaranteeing some bloodthirster from nowhere(he had some big assault flyer thing and vindicator aside from a ton of terminators). We are 2 Tau. My army was mostly infantry but I did run optimized stealth cadre(ghostkeel), riptide, and 1 hammerhead. No other vehicles and a ton of infantry(had some ballin kroot do work to a flyer) and suits. My ally had a stormsurge, 1 riptide, gunrig, gunwall, drone net formation. We both ran hunter cadres as well. I mention all of this cause the BA player got wrecked so hard that he got pissed off and calling cheese everywhere around turn 3. I do want to point out that most of their army was in reserves and could not come out till turn 3 due to some bad rolls from both of them from their reserves pools. The BA player was almost tabled but the eldar player was just fine(wraith knights and lords are super hard to kill and guard d weapons are nasty).
Anyways, BA player begins to complain. States that he should've been allowed to bring in a 500 point imperial knight that it would've been far more fair. I am still trying to wrap my head around this. Do you guys feel we were cheesing too hard despite the terms that were agreed upon before this 4k game? I need clarity!

Sorry for the long post but it was kinda annoying me earlier.

>>52625852
Sure will, I am probably going to pick up the IG Start Collecting in a week or so but hopefully can find a picture comparison of an IG Veteran and a Necron Warrior.

I've found the height measurments but I am more interested in dimensions and distance of joints.

>>52625861
Ap4 = -1
Ap3 = -2
Ap2 = -3
Ap1 = -4

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What's their band name again?

>>52625955
I.. Might have a commissar somewhere if that helps at all, although I think he's a bit skinnier.

>>52625957
>AP4 = -1
>AP 3/2 = -2
>AP 1 = -3

Fixed.

Half the problem with the game is how easily armor saves get ignored despite being so overvalued. There's nothing wrong with having 2+ saves still get a 5+ save against meltaguns. Most things with 2+ armor have invuln saves anyway, and 5+ cover is easy to get.

A -3 as the highest would still do everything you need it to. Unless you want to complain that MANZ really don't deserve that 5+

>>52625922
Tau are one of, if not the, most aggravating armies in the game to play against. They aren't necessarily as powerful as Eldar, but at least Eldar usually come close enough that you can try to fight back. When a Tau army works, it shuts the other player completely out of the game by shooting them down before they can even hope to retaliate.

People are going to complain when they play against you, because your army is designed to stop them from having fun. The exact circumstances will vary from game to game, but it's something you're going to have to get used to. Tau aren't enjoyable to play against.

>>52625922
>BA
>bloodthirster
????

Knights aren't that good, they're paper tigers, stealth cadre will wreck them ezpz.
Sounds like he got mad because you refused to let him bring what he wanted and then humiliated him.

>>52626020
>>52625922

Agreed. Sounds like you were a colossal dick. Then again you DO play Tau

>>52626003
What's the point in shelling out for ap2 weapons if they have no benefit then?
What if I want a weapon that can reliably take out power armour?

Hate that the game has so much ap2, don't hate the mechanics that make ap2 worthwhile.

Manz are already pretty shit, too late to take them in to consideration.

>>52625922
Blood Angels might be marines, but they aren't on the same level as the vanilla codex. He was a mid-tier army next to a top-tier one against two top-tier armies.

You did use a lot of annoying formations and units, and I would argue that of all armies Tau needs formations the least.

Having two riptides and a stormsurge doesn't help matters, even if you agreed on only 1 superheavy per team.

Apocalypse is a wonky place, and it's harder to gauge what's fair to bring. Personally, I would have said to let him bring the knight anyway though.

>>52625957
>>52626003
>guard, tyranids and orkz getting armour saves against tau fire line
Yes please

>>52625982
Mon'keigh Business

>>52625922
SM players are just very whiny despite being way better off than most armies

>>52626085
>No benefit

There wouldn't be any real increased benefit if they were -3 instead of -2. Either they're in cover, in which case they'll use that 5+ save instead of the 6+, or they're not in cover, in which case they get a guard save instead of a t-shirt save.

Against marines in the open, it's still a great improvement. It just also means that marines standing in the open will be more worthwhile.

>What if I want a weapon that can reliably take out power armour?

Power armor is designed to be durable. It's the second best armor value in the game. It should be more reliable at letting things wearing it survive.

>>52625813
Honestly IG don't really do anything that the ad mech doesnt. I guess conscripts for tarpitting would be nice and maybe a flier, if the IG fliers are any good.
Fluff wise I know it's only legal for IG to fight under the command of the ad mech if the IG senior command staff are dead. I think in one of the books a tech priest kills the colonel to take over an IG regiment.

I do know that the ad mech have an unhealthy obsession with Necrons because they're archeotech, so you might do something cool there with the ad mech having accidentally woken up the necrons.

it's a cool idea though, if you do it make sure to post the models.

>>52626100
I mean, the alternative is to make bolters, pulse rifles, gauss weapons, etc. all -1, but that just makes things with high armor saves even more worthless. Marines wouldn't even be able to stand up to their own guns at that point

>>52626136
Assuming you didn't misrepresent anything, not too sure about that bthirster thing

>>52626142
>There wouldn't be any real increased benefit if they were -3 instead of -2.
Other than cutting a space marines save chance in half? Reducing a 2+ to a 1/3 chance rather than a 1/2?

>Power armor is designed to be durable. It's the second best armor value in the game.
And ap2 weapons are designed to penetrate armour, it's the second best AP value in the game. It should be more reliable at stopping things hit by it survive.

>>52626160
>implying space Marines loyalists won't get reinforced power armour to ignore rend -1
>csm will only get that with chosen units and HQ only

>>52625832
>>52625861
honestly though, stuff dying faster is fine as long as everything dies equally fast. im ok with the game taking only an hour to play so long as there aren't any stupidly survivable things on the board.

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>tfw you spend a week building a new 1000pt army and table your opponent

>>52626279
What army?

>>52626275
> so long as there aren't any stupidly survivable things on the board
>2d6 3+ terminators

get ready, anon.

>>52626275
It's only heavy armor that loses out, horde armies are completely unaffected.

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>>52626291

Pic related

Going to start painting this week.

>>52626180
>>52626020
yeah I was confused about the bloodthirster but I let it happen since dude didnt have much on the board. It got shot down by 2 riptides and kroot lol. FYI he summoned it in the psychic phase(it wasn't on the board at the beginning of the game).
>>52626088
I get what you are saying but I am failing to see why this is an issue still considering the point value. There was nothing overtly cheese on the board. They still had plenty on strong units on the board.. They still had quite a few baddies including Dante the douchelord who wrecked my allies commander with fusion blades. Why should I have let him bring the knight? We originally had agreed upon 1 LOW. I played 2-3 games against LOWs and I always get wrecked because I don't have one.
>>52626010
I feel like its all a rock paper scissors type of system. I have never beaten space wolves and I have won 1 time against Chaos so far. Dark Angels are unreal. In one game some guy got a ton of free rhinos. It was like him having 500 points for free. How does one compare to that as tau? riptide wing? lol
>>52626064
thanks for proving my initial point. Not even close to WAAC playing here.

>>52626261
Alright, so you give it a -3. Now terminators save on a 5+ (they do this anyway) and any marines that aren't in at least 5+ cover have a t-shirt save.

So really, with a -3, all this massive shift has accomplished is making marines easier to kill, because now high-volume weapons like heavy bolters bring them down to a carapace save.

Those with lower saves get a general improvement because now they get some saves against things that used to kill them, and anything better than AP 4 loses little when trying to kill those high armor targets.

I do feel like it would make more sense to improve everyone's survivability here by making AP generally less punishing. Having plasma be a -2 means people aren't going to have to hug cover as tightly.

>>52626350
>There was nothing overtly cheese on the board.

Optimized Stealth Cadre and Riptides are cheese anon.

>I always get wrecked because I don't have one.

Then you're bad. Optimized Stealth Cadre and a Riptide should be plenty for taking out lords of war if you're smart.

>>52626370
So here is what I am getting, it is ok for the enemy to bring whatever cheese but I should gimp my army and let them bring whatever they want simply because I am tau? Stupid, its not like the enemy is fielding just infantry. Rule of thumb is 1 riptide per thousand points and this game had 4 k points per side. Explain how in the world that is cheese considering what we were facing? Just seems incredibly unreasonable(and stupid) for me to purposely gimp my army especially when the enemy has brought their nastiness expecting the same. Explain your train of thought. Since it seems to be a very common train of thought for 40k players... "oh you have a riptide? so cheesy! well let me bring in magnus the red and oneshot your army since you have a riptide"

>>52626350
>no cheese
>Riptides
>Stealth Cadre
>lol his bloodthirster got shot to death by Riptides and Kroot
>But why do people hate Tau guiz?

>>52626355
Or

We...

Don't hand 2 ap2 weapons to every smuck in the game?
Nerf it all.

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>>52626451
>Rule of thumb is 1 riptide per 1000 points

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thoughts on this casual list?

>>52626451
>So it's not okay for us to bring maximum cheese with our two top-tier armies when fighting one top tier army and a mid-tier army?

Blood Angels aren't great. I'm explaining to you why he got blown away. If it was normal vanilla gravspam with any of their nonsense formations, he probably would have been fine. But he didn't and clearly wasn't.

Cheese is relative, and you getting all defensive and denying it isn't helping your case.

>>52626370
1 OSC and a 2 Riptides in a 4k match is not super cheese. Yes, it's cheese. But at that point level if you don't build a list to encounter them, you're either in denial or a retard. Tau shouldn't have to kneecap themselves in a large match so they don't hurt your feelings. What do you want him to run at 4k points? 3 Ethereals, a couple of Cadre Fireblades, 3 Squads of Kroot, 3 Vespid Squads, some Breacher teams a few sniper drone teams, and a few hammerheads/skyrays because anything that's not a vehicle and is bigger than a Stealth Suit is going to make you cry? Quit whining.

>>52626462
Gee, it's almost like a big unit was made to fight large units. The only difference between Kroot and other snipers is that they can take advantage of markerlights. They're still going to wound on a 4+ like any other sniper.

>>52626451
Anon, don't try to argue with them. You won't convince them otherwise. It's black and white with them. It sucks having to hide the fact that you enjoy a particular set of plastic army men that, outside of everyone control, ended up getting some broken rules just so you don't trigger some anti-Tau snowflakes while everyone else can discuss to their hearts content.

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I've started building a nurgle army that consists of marines and renegade guard and I have a few questions cause I'm still pretty shit at this.
Hows this looking so far? Do I really need to have a HQ in my allied detachment? What do you think I should add and can you have two allied detachments cause I kinda want to add daemons to it

>>52626558
>Only difference between kroot and other snipers is that they get markerlights

Look, I have nothing against tau, and especially nothing against kroot (unless you're doing supporting fire conga-line cheese), but saying "all they get is the easiest force multiplier in the game" is kind of silly.

>>52625654
>>52625727
>>52625787
if armageddon shadow wars is anything to go by, AP 4 is going to be be rend -1

>>52626624
Just wanna know if Multilasers will have a save modifier. I love the HB Chimera turret, and want an excuse to run it.

>>52626545
This is a thing. I've also seen it on some houserule lists.

>>52626553
Getting defensive when only being called bad for the sake of offending me for not finding other ways for taking out lords of war. OK.. maybe you should've left out that point if you didn't want it to be addressed or approached it differently. I started playing in December and still getting used to stuff. I always thought the riptide wing was maximum cheese... not what I brought(FYI, I never got to actually use the OSC considering how poorly I deployed them and the fact that nothing was in range to take advantage of it the benefits).

I honestly now know that BA is not great. However, is it our fault since he was allowed to bring whatever he wanted aside from the one LOW since the slot was taken up by the Eldar player(the eldar player requested to use his over the imperial knight).
>>52626545
Riptides are the best unit in the Tau hands down but I feel like people make them to be way better than they are.

>>52626558
>just so you don't trigger some anti-Tau snowflakes

Dude, I play Tau. That doesn't mean I lack self-awareness.

That OSC for example. Why bring that? You certainly wouldn't need it against the Eldar player, since Eldar vehicles are more meh and it wouldn't help against the Wraithknight at all.

The only thing it would have helped with is bullying the Blood angels player and blowing up any of the fast tanks he decided to bring.

>But at that point level if you don't build a list to encounter them, you're either in denial or a retard.

And what options does the BA player have to counter 2 Riptides, a Ghostkeel, and a Stormsurge, aside from relying on the Eldar player to do all the work for him? Keep in mind he can't bring a Knight to try and level the playing field, despite the fact that 2 Riptides are nearly on par with a Stormsurge anyway.

So I think I wanna start a dark elder army...i know how terrible they are (never seem someone play thrm) but the models look fantastic and they are incredibly cheap.

Is there anything I should know about the army (other than "they suck")

What does the covers book offer?

>>52626663
>However, is it our fault since he was allowed to bring whatever he wanted aside from the one LOW?

>Is it our fault that I brought a bunch of formations and strong units against an Ork player? I mean, he could have taken anything he wanted!

The opponent being able to take anything they want means precisely jack shit if they don't have anything good to take.

>>52626619
Easiest force multiplier that while also being the army's main strength, is also their glaring weakness. Take out the markerlights and most Tau shooting becomes slightly more accurate than Orks and slightly worse than Guard (because after markerlights die they don't have Orders, namely things like Bring it down or FRFSRF). It seems like everyone forgets that markerlights can be killed before they go into a frothing rage about Tau.

>>52625982
Le Forced Meme

>>52626737
this

>>52626662
Never realised it was a houserule to take an extremely (though not as much as WK) underpriced GC in a 1000 point game.
I mean, in competitive lists I could see it, but as a general rule of thumb?.

>>52626809
The riptide isn't a GMC.

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>>52626809
>Riptide
>GMC

>>52626558
That seems to be the case. I am trying to be as rational about this but it's almost like in many peoples minds that we are fielding these armies about blobs of infantry that are absolutely helpless.
>>52626690
I bring the OSC simply because it is a good formation regardless of there bring any vehicles. I never actually got the true benefit of it except in turn 2 only on my ghostkeel shooting at some marines that the BA player did a deepstrike on in front of the entire tau gunline. How is that bullying the BA player? I didn't know what he was bringing and he was allowed to bring whatever he wanted. BS+1 and ignores cover is great. The shooting rear armor is fantastic but I didn't even get to use it this game.
>And what options does the BA player have to counter 2 Riptides, a Ghostkeel, and a Stormsurge, aside from relying on the Eldar player to do all the work for him? Keep in mind he can't bring a Knight to try and level the playing field, despite the fact that 2 Riptides are nearly on par with a Stormsurge anyway. He can't bring in a knight because I don't have a LOW for fairness. Why should he have a LOW when I can't and it was agreed upon for only 1? If anything the Eldar player needs to deal with the SS with his unit which was breathing down the neck of the SS right before the store had to close. Once again he also was allowed to bring whatever he wanted. You keep treating it like its 1v1 but it was 2v2.

Feels like most of the frustration in this scenario is people forgetting that its 2v2 2k per player 1 LOW per side with no limit on anything else people wanted to bring in. I get BA are not as strong but considering what was brought on the Tau side, I really feel like it could've been much much more cheese.

>>52626690
>And what options does the BA player have to counter 2 Riptides, a Ghostkeel, and a Stormsurge, aside from relying on the Eldar player to do all the work for him?

Ally in some Eldar or Tau, duh.

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>>52625997
>>52625955
>>52625813
I had a few tempestus dudes, I believe they're pretty close to veteran proportions. Hope this helps at all.

>>52626809
>Riptide GMC
haha oh wow

>>52626578
Don't use the allied detachment if you can avoid it: it has a lot of restrictions. Check which detachments and formations are available for the factions you want and see if one fits that you like

Some ass will tell you that you should use that forgeworld homebrew faction instead of IG

There is no limit on the number of formations or detachments you may field.

Give your marines some transports or they are going to spend the hole game walking around.

Consider the really awesome helbrute fomations - take 3 helbrutes and they can deep strike

>>52626809
>Riptide GMC

wow, these Anti-Tau snowflakes are getting more retarded by the day.

>>52626324
the tax spawn makes me giggle every time I see it

>all these shitters mad about being cucked by riptides
>"y-you should feel bad for using a perfectly legal option!"
Stay salty.

>>52626829
>I didn't know what he was bringing and he was allowed to bring whatever he wanted
>I really feel like it could've been much much more cheese.

You're still assuming that 'whatever he wanted' would have been enough, and that the fact that it wasn't 100% cheese excuses you entirely.

>>52626898
Nah, he should feel bad for bullying the obvious special-needs player who thought his Blood Angels could play in the big leagues

>>52626946
Fuck that guy for playing his favorite plastic army guys.

He should've chosen plastic army guys who are actually good.

I as well am a Tau player who is sick of my lists being called cheese for bringing any one thing that is slightly above average. I like fire warrior blocks and hammerheads, I dont even own a riptide, but for support I often bring an OSC. It doesn't matter at all what else is in your list. If you bring a cool, useful, fluffy formation to a game you're automatically WAAC. Shit is so lame

>>52626861
Ok sweet I'll work on that. I'm sussing out the detachments right now. Is combined arms just the one army or is it made up of multiple armies?
But yeah my plan is to use the FW rules I just couldn't find that in the army builder app I'm using but its roughly the same

>>52626998
>cool, useful, fluffy formation

I'm confused. What do any of those have to do with OSC?

>>52626998
Honestly hoping we get nerfed some in 8th, just so we don't need to constantly worry about accidentally being labeled as cheese or WAAC.

>>52626929
That is a fair point but I always made a point before I had a riptide or ghostkeel to let people know that my list was weak and to bring appropriate lists to at least make things fair(usually didn't matter cause most people resort to cheese). The eldar player knows us so he brought his nastiest list(he plays competitive fyi where nobody else in the game does). The BA player brought some formation but I dont remember what it was and brought once again some massive flyer, vindicator, bloodthirster, and a few other things that were nasty if their own right. It's not as if he himself was gimped whatsoever. His biggest problem is he failed reserved roles. Therefore whatever was on the field got blasted since some of his strongest units had to wait extra turns. He also had some very poorly placed las cannons and missiles that could never shoot anything and he didn't move them.
The guy complained that I had 2 MCs and tank on the board and a tank so I pointed to his MC(bloodthirster), vindicator(tank), and flyer. He then brought up the other army and I pointed the fact that he was allied himself and his ally brought in sufficient fire power. Granted I would rather have a riptide than a bloodthirster but try wrapping your head around that. Not even considering the other side of the board was Dante, a dreadnought, and a predator(not considering the rest of his army)

>>52627008
Where did the ghostkeel touch you anon? Was it In your rear?

>>52626998
honestly, i don't consider most tau lists cheese, i just have yet to play against one that was actually a fun game. tau tactics all seem to revolve around making the game as unfun as possible for your opponent, so i just avoid playing tau.

>>52627056
I'm just wondering how anyone could consider a formation whose main benefit is just ignoring the position of things because 'lulz stealth means teleporting magic' as fluffy.

>>52627044
played a 4 player apoc game recently where the tau had the stormsurge formation plus a riptide wing, all four opponents truced to kill the tau stuff.

we didnt kill a single riptide, ghostkeel or stormsurge.

>>52627075
Have you ever played against a Tau player who fucked up and let you break his lines? If ANYTHING gets into CC with a fire warrior block, the block is dead. Wounded and swept almost automatically. It is honestly so frustrating. So good Tau players learn real fast not to let that happen

>>52627108
>losing units is frustrating.

yeah, this is how your opponent feels the whole game.

>>52627124
>losing is frustrating
I guess we should all just stop playing because somebody will always lose. GGWP all, we can go home

>>52627124
>mfw I started playing the game as 7th ed GK
Even though I own 3 armies now, every single model loss stings no matter what army I'm playing.

Anti tau faggots will never stop
Even if tau end up on the bottom theyll bitch about how they should be squatted cause they dont "FIT" in 40k

>>52627101
How?

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>>52627144
This so much. Haters gonna hate

What's the best setup for a Deathwing Terminator squad?

>>52627002
a 'Combined Arms Detachment' or CAD, is one detachment, and it must be of all the same faction.

You can have as many detachments and formations as you want, with a different faction for each, so long as you fulfill the requirements for each.

>>52627155
Apparently it's the Tau's fault they suck at rolling dice, too. Or Tau have a hidden formation bonus of -4 to all to hit/wound rolls.
OR OR OR This is probably another hyperbole and they really only shot their big weapons at the big units and went for the smaller units with the basic infantry.

>>52627101
That is hilarious but at the same time that IS maximum cheese. Couldn't happen in our game. We aren't capable of running the stormsurge or riptide formations(would require one more riptide and 2 more stormsurges). Yes there was cheese on both sides but that is how this game works. I was dumb enough one time to play a game of 2v2 1k per player and let the enemy field magnus the red while we had an imperial knight. Let you guess who tabled who in turn 2. Riptide was one shot in that situation.

>>52627144
There's also plenty of people who dislike Tau just for being Tau, even if they were mechanically awful. I've heard others express distaste in their not being quite as grimdark-y as the rest of the universe.

>>52627175
I think it's mostly just grognards salty that an insignificant alien empire on the fringe gets better rules and models than they do.

>>52627179
To sell them and buy Tau instead.

>>52627202
I dislike tau because while the cheese comes so easily, trying for fun builds doesn't actually work.

You want infantry spamming tau? doesn't work
You want kroot or vespids? Have fun in the trash
You want to play all-drones? Drone net is really good but those fuckers are eight dollars MSRP each

>>52627205
It's just so silly. I mean the ghostkeel isn't even t6, a single strength 10 would automatically kills it. A single psychic scream kills the entire OSC in one swoop. People are honestly just retarded

>>52627228
>space commies
Better dead than red, or whatever color those retarded fucks are using.

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>>52627238
> Try running all-melee suits as Tau
> Be surprised when it turns out you're better in melee than Orks
Tau are a melee race!

>>52627239
Fucker is sitting on a 3+ plus cover save out on the open. Good luck killing all three of them.

>>52627263
Have you tried running the list? I wanna hear stories of their close combat fighting,

>>52627238
I always wondered why GW made Tau with only a few broken models in a sea of shitty ones. It's like Nids and Flyrants.

If Tau had good models besides the disgusting ones, then this would be less of an issue.

>>52626624
depends. autocannons are -3 in that.

all the anti vehicle weapons have high rend (lascannon is -6) so that may be a new trend in the game.

>>52627269
He's got a point. He can be one shot from a psychic shriek basically. I know this cause it has happened to me and I have had my ghostkeel get one shotted by a maulerfiend. FYI ghostkeels are 4up in the open unless being shot at from beyond 12 inches then its a 2up cover save in the open.

>>52627284
Tau infantry are actually good, some of the better infantry in the game, but they aren't a complete force. They can't handle a lot of stuff. They are supposed to work together with the other elements of the army.

If there were more special weapons options on infantry it would help, as would more special infantry types.

Kroot and vespids are not as bad as people say, but they have zero synergy with everything else in the Tau book and are really only taken for flavor. Vespids have really ugly models too.

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>>52627280
Fuck no lol, I just know that crisis suits are strictly superior Ork Nobz. I don't have a fuckload of money to spend on 78 crisis suits. This is my actual tau list that I'm trying to collect. I have no intention of ever getting any suits larger than a Crisis, because anything bigger violates the actual fluff for tau.

>>52627108
>Get into charge range
>Eat BS5 overwatch from 3+ units
>Fail charge then get shot to shit
OR
>Lose combat because fuck all made it in
OR
>Win combat then get shot to shit again

Yeah no, the only thing getting into close combat are SW wolf crap, genestealers, Ynnari bullshit and charge from deep strike formations. You go ahead and try to charge using any other thing and it will get eaten on way or another.

Assault fucking sucks in this edition and trying to get into combat is fucking retarded and thats just without considering how hard it is to breach a decent Tau gunline and if its not a gunline then you might as well do fuck all because catching suits is a pain in the ass.

>>52627132
actually i dont mind losing when the game feels close and is fun. playing against tau is just miserable the whole game.

>>52627284
they don't do it in purpose.
Its just the natural result of low balance.

>>52627202
Which is still a stupid reason to dislike Tau. Every faction has a tragedy or uniquity to make them grimdark. The Eldar had the fall and are a dying race, Orks are honestly comedic relief(but their tragedy is that they have no reason to exist except for fighting, they will never have a peak in society/technology and will remain the same loveable ramshackle bastards forever), the Imperium is self explanatory, the Necrons are cranky old men who want kids off their damn lawn after they got the short end of the stick and became soulless machines(granted, they got some KICK ASS tech), the Nids are admittedly mostly an NPC race, mostly meant to be the cherry on-top to the fuckfest of the current galactic situation, Chaos is the BBEG, so chaos has plenty of deep, inner conflicts and whatnot, and finally the Tau are like the new kid who thinks he's figured out the world, he's naive, he's clean, he's ready to take on the world with full confidence. The only problem is that Tau facing the entirety of the galaxy is the equivalent of a 5 year old standing up to an MMA fighter. If I were an observer of some sort in the 40k univers I'd find it adorable to watch the Tau bumble around in their sandbox, unaware that anyone else who happens to be in the park could potentially walk by and kick their sand castles/piles over, gut punch them, and throw sand back in their eyes and they wouldn't know what hit them. They are guilty of receiving a DISGUSTING amount of plot armor, I'll give the anti-Tau that.

>>52627246
>commies
They're actually closer to Confucianism or a Utilitarian Dictatorship.

>>52627108
So, if a Tau army is on the board, either the Tau are having no fun or their opponent is having no fun?
I feel this army may need a change in design.
(Assuming it's not just being pecked to death by /tg/ memes at the moment.)

>>52627284
When will this shitty meme stop? Tau honestly have pretty good internal balance outside mecha spam. A block of firewarriors with a Fireblade puts out 24 str 5 shots at 30 inches. 36 at 15. That's honestly really good. People have just lost all perspective in a sea of grav spam, Magnus/summon cheese, and Scatbikes/wraithknights. Just because something isn't top tier doesn't mean it's unplayable.

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I was reading up on the Inca, and it turns out they had a ton of similarities with the Tau. I also just bought my first minis yesterday and was trying to decide on a color scheme.

So the question is, /tg/, how do I make my Andean space commies? Like a gold base with checkered emblems and feathers?

>>52627323
Member when Overwatch wasn't a thing? I 'member.

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How's this for a fun list?
I don't really care about the inquisitors too much they're just there cause they look cool

>>52627352
Gold on your fancy dudes. While not Inca, it'd be great if you give your fireblades and Fusion Blade Command macuahuitls.

>>52627238
>You want infantry spamming tau? doesn't work

How is S5 30" guns bad? I get there are better options but that does not make them bad, why do Taufags keep saying that shit when other armies get shit guns for their troops? Its S5 30" Rapid Fire guns that you can make into BS5, how are they bad?.

>>52627338
I forget - was it the Tau who accidentally sold a bunch of their people into Dark Eldar slavery without even realizing what they were doing?

>>52627318
>because anything bigger violates the actual fluff for tau
It's like you know nothing of the fluff beyond 5th edition! Even the farsight enclaves 7 samurais have a freaking riptide in with them.

>>52627378
what is the plan for AV or MCs?

what is the plan for horde armies?

Tau infantry are good, but they have their role in a larger force

I don't even play tau btw

>>52627358
I member when assaulting was just 6 inches.

>>52627388
I hope they kept the receipt.

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>>52627352
Dude, I'm a fucking SUCKER for meso-American themed shit. Like I would hop onto Seraphon in a heartbeat if my group wanted to play AoS. Or play as Blood Jaguars if they were a canon chapter.
I'd aim for similar colors to Inca. So plenty of dark yellows, reds, golds, light teals, like my pic related.

>>52627388
Yes. It was a "cultural exchange". Still fucking hilarious.

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>>52627374
Hell yeah. I also wanna throw some fringe on the fire warriors but I'm not really sure the best way to go about that.

>>52627399
In what universe do you live in where "infantry spam" means the same thing is "literally nothing fielded but infantry" ???

>>52627238
>doesn't work

Works just fine for me

>Have fun in the trash

You could do a lot worse than cheap snipers and Initiative 6 Jump infantry with Hit & Run and anti-marine guns.

Tau are perfectly capable of making lists that are fine in a casual setting. Sure, it isn't going to win you games against cheesy opponents, but that's sort of the territory when you're talking about non-cheesy lists.

>>52626268
At 4pts per model.

>>52627284
Tau have a handful of OP models in a sea of very nice ones. Even Vespid, the worst thing in the book, is still just mediocre by most standards, since it's Jump infantry with an overpriced gun in an army where Plasma Crisis suits do the same anti-Meq job better.

Compare Vespid to a squad of Chaos Raptors or something. They're really not that far off.

All these anti-tau fags are telling me to shelf my 3 $85 dollar models just because their fee fees get hurt when I win at plastic army men.

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Thoughts? I'm not an experienced painter so this is definitely the best looking model I've ever done. I spent extra time on her because I played with her this weekend and she managed to, against all odds, kill Magnus in single combat.

I'm thinking I might try to add a bit to the hair, to make it pop a little more, and touch up the highlights on the parchment. And maybe do a bit more highlighting on the armor.

Which books do I need to build Blood Angels?

Codex, Shield of Baal, Angel's Blade, anything else?

>>52627407
Thinking gold with teal and then a little bit of red for highlights.

Black and white checkered emblems or rainbow flag?

>>52627399
>what is the plan for AV or MCs?

EMP grenades are standard on all guys. Fire Warrior teams can get Missile pod turrets, and Pathfinders can get Ion rifles. This provides you with S 7 shooting for lighter vehicles. MCs can be handles by Kroot or Drone sniper teams.

>what is the plan for horde armies?

You mean aside from an Ethereal or Cadre Fireblade to have your gunline pump out double the strength 5 shots? Smart missile System turrets put out even more firepower, with ignores cover as well. Markerlights remove the cover saves most horde armies rely on.

This is also assuming you do nothing but play 100% pure infantry Tau. Even then, the only thing I could see being insurmountable would be Land Raiders, Superheavies, and MCs like the Riptide that can shrug of sniper rounds easily.

>>52627486
If you put a wash on that it will look pretty damn good imo.

>>52627421
must be an ig player

>>52627284
Tau have a few absurdly overpowered units in an ocean of average ones.

Tyranids have one fairly good unit in an ocean of completely worthless ones.

>>52627399
>>52627505
>EMP grenades are standard on all guys

Meant to say that they're a standard option. Still gotta pay the points, though it's not that prohibitive.

>>52627506
I used reikland fleshshade for the armor, but you're right, maybe it could use a bit more.

>>52627155
rolled tons of dice, nothing died.
4++ with 5++. nothing ever made charge.

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>>52626890

Yea, he was basically there to die and he did. Unfortunately, he also have up first blood because I only managed to stun the top rhino with my Autocanons thanks to being obscured. The spawn didn't even get to see combat because it exploded to HoW.

Pic top is my after my 1 (playing against Deathwatch) pic 2 is after his but before he consolidated to the edge of the landing platform where they got shot up and died to my Lord in CC.

>>52627479
Why do that when you can just load a six shooter into your mouth and remove your shitty taste in armies from this planet?

>>52627407
>Or play as Blood Jaguars if they were a canon chapter.
play as them anyway. you don't need to limit yourself to only canon forces. This isn't a historical game.

>>52627502
I was thinking...Perhaps dark yellow or gold with red on lenses and teal on some segments of the armor/shoulderpads. Think Farsight Enclaves color scheme, but instead of red, grey, yellow, apply it as gold(or dark yellow), teal, and red with black or even red fatigues.

>>52627520
>B-B-But Anon, then we'd have to move!

>>52627525
The armor looks good as is, it is the hair, face, cloak and that white tassel that look like they need it. Face and hair may be fine pic is a bit out of focus.

>>52625813
>>52625955
Necron parts will work but it's a pretty huge waste of expensive Necron minis to chop them up for just the arms and legs. You won't get hands unless you put in the effort to cut down the guns they're molded onto, and the arms and legs are basically metal skeletons with very little detail. You'd honestly be better off kitbashing Vanguard/Ranger kits or buying some random skitarii arms and legs off a bitz seller and selling the Necrons.

Fluff-wise there are plenty of indentured militia who are basically to the Skitarii what IG are to Space Marines; disposable masses who generally serve double duty as manufactorum laborers, starship gun crews, logistics workers etc. You could even use Genestealer Cult minis with human heads and a cybernetic squad leader, since they're generally work gangs of unenhanced humans lead by a junior tech-priest.

>>52627535
>so assblasted about losing at plastic army men you literally start telling people to KYS
Yeah, Tau players are the problem

>>52627479
i mean, i just don't play against tau. problem solved.

the tau players in my area have basically stopped showing up to my game store cause they know they won't get a game.

>>52627546
The conversion process and freehanding gives me nightmares just thinking of it.

>>52626578
Don't use plauge marines
Normal csm's in a death guard detachment do the same thing and cost less

>>52627533
GW finally found a way to move those really old and horrible looking spawn kits, I guess.

>>52627535
Yeah, fuck me right? I bought this army to play giant kickass robots blowing up helpless soldiers, so that's what I'm going to play. Ooh no, how dare he have badwrongfun!

>>52627555
Good call. I could probably put some nuln oil on the hair and tassel, the inside of the cloak I'm not really sure what to do with, I don't want it to end up looking blotchy.

>>52627549
So move? If you're playing all infantry Tau, somebody's gotta grab those objectives. Pathfinders can outflank no problem, as can Kroot if you want.

Have a Rail/Ion Rifle team show up on the backline to blow up an enemy tank, have the 4th guy toss a grenade while he's there. Is it the most reliable thing in the world? No, but not every army has perfectly accurate deep-strike melta teams either.

>>52627567
for freehanding it is just a matter of practice and patience.

the alternative is to get blank transfer paper and print your own custom transfers with the intricate bits.

>>52627578

Then do it.

Just don't come here and bitch when no one wants to versus you because, even by Tau standards, you give bad game.

>>52627578
>i play plastic armies to prevent other people from having fun while playing plastic armies
Enjoy not having anyone to play with then.

>>52627610
>>52627601

People tell me to play weak infantry, then bitch about how playing weak infantry isn't fun. Cognitive dissonance at its finest, people.

>>52626003
>muhreen wishlisting, the shitpost

>>52627575

Except I used crypt horrors, so not even that from me at least.

>>52627633
No, the way you are countering "weak infantry" is what makes it not fun.

And no one is stopping you from playing tanks or bikes or speeders or whatever.

>>52627648
desu it is bad enough that technically all CSM players MUST own a spawn AND a daemon prince no matter the point level

So, new Tau player here, currently own two Start Collecting, an Optimized Pathfinder Team, and a Riptide. How do I avoid people refusing to play with me? I really like the Tau aesthetic and lore, and I enjoy the versatility of crisis suits.

>>52627639
Right, because I'm sure all those other armies will don't want their 2+ and 3+ saves to actually mean anything.

>>52626701
I've recently started looking into them (When I get the coin I think I'll pick up the Shadow War box) and my understanding is they're fast and hit like a truck, but if you don't play them well you're going to die in the most inglorious way.
They're the quintessential glass cannons.

>>52627674
Don't field more than one riptide and don't use OSC

>>52627674
Don't be a huge fag
Have your suits (especially monstrous creatures) be support for the rest of your army, don't base your entire army around suits.

>>52627674
Don't take the Riptide is step 1. If they still refuse after that, then there's not much you can do.

The key is to be aware, and realize that there are more armies that are weaker than yours than there are stronger than yours.

>>52627674
Don't run the Riptide in games under 1500 would be my recommendation but by no means is a law. Talk to your friends about it, and prepare for a lot of people to hate you.

>>52627674
Only play our shittiest models, and lose intentionally. Otherwise, as you can see here, these fags will get all butthurt.

>>52627566
Yeah but I think there is a difference between someone purposely being cheese and people that build a decent balanced army in the Tau without the extra models for cheese. I am purposely not getting a 2nd riptide for this reason. However, it is mandatory to field a riptide in any game above 1k points.

>>52627675
>what are saves on multiple D6
It's like you've never played any of GWs games that have this mechanic or something.

>>52627674
>>52627693
>>52627698
>>52627700
>>52627702
If it helps at all, my friends who are getting into this with me are also total noobs, and are playing Tzeentch Daemons, Necrons and Eldar, if that helps at all.

>>52627674

Don't be this guy: >>52627713

>>52627722
>Tzeentch

I don't know much about them to comment

>Necrons

Things will not die, so have fun

>Eldar

Watch that player because Eldar can become a cheesefest really quickly.

>>52627716
>He fell for the Shadow War is a testbed for 8th meme

The rules are literally copypasted from 2nd edition. There is no reason to assume they're just going back to that instead of this being a different thing.

>>52627722
>Tzeentch Daemons, Necrons and Eldar

You're fine, do whatever you want.

>>52627713
You sound like an Ultrasmurfs fag trying to defend the 5th edition codex.

>>52627722
Pretty strong armies overall. I'd say you're fine to take the Riptide in games above 1000 points. Just try talking to your friends and expressing your desire to make sure the game is fun and fair for everyone, and work with them to achieve that.

>>52627738
They specifically talked about bringing save modifiers back, as in restoring a previous mechanic. While I agree that Shadow war is not a testbed for 8th edition (there's literally nothing to indicate that it is) it's entirely likely that saves on multiple D6 might be a thing like they were the when save modifiers previously existed.

>>52627729
>>52627737
>>52627744
>>52627755
Thanks for the input!

Was just getting a bit worried with all the above comments; I've spent a fair amount of time and money on these plastic army men, and it'd be a shame if they were too hated for anyone to play with me.

>>52627750
Please, Ultras have always been strong, but it's our turn to have the spotlight now. Get over it.

>>52627773
I guess we'll see then. I'd just hate for 3+ saves to become even more pointless if they're more vulnerable to previously AP 4 weapons while barely gaining anything in return against formerly AP 2 stuff

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>>52626279
>>52626324
>>52627533
Ayyy, I saw your army photo a few generals back, congratulations on victory. Only suggestion is to hide your Spawn for the first few turns or hop through LOS blocking terrain; as you learned he's a walking First Blood target.

>First game with Iron Warriors in ten years resulted in opponent conceding Turn 5 with three models left on the table
>tfw CSM are viable outside of monobuild/daemon ally lists again

>>52627783
>it's our turn
>our

>speaking as if multiple people support/agree with you and you speak for and represent them
>implying GW cares about the Tau at all other than them being another scary xenos race of le imperium to fight
Wew, obvious bait is obvious

>>52627774
Yeah, Tau hate mainly comes from armies who are weaker than them, as well as Space marines. The former in somewhat understandable, though for other top tier armies (which your group seems to have picked) it shouldn't be a problem.

>>52627774
None of the armies you mentioned should have too many problems dealing with you. Just keep in mind a lot of Tau stuff seems to have been written with countering Orks/Infantry guard in mind. You will cheese-grate light infantry better than any other army just about

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would this list be considered cheese?

>>52627774

This is /tg/, we hate everyone. Most of The Hobby isn't as terrible as we are. Don't be a faggot and you should probably be ok.

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>>52627812
>those shield drones

>>52627783
You haven't actually played very long or much, have you

>>52627812
Probably not. That is the Drone formation that gives a mess of special rules, right?

Even then, it's not too cheesy. BS 3 marker drones are dependent on what they're boosting, and with the options being Gun drones, Hammerheads, or a Sky Ray, they'll be relatively tame.

>>52627812
If I'm not mistaken, there's nothing here actually capable of scoring?

>>52627865
It's 7th. Everything is scoring

>>52627323
>assault sucks
That's how it should be. We have firearms now. Memelords who want to run into gunlines with pointy sticks are retarded and should play Age of Sigmar.

>>52627783
Marines have always been middle of the pack, even in 5th when they got a boost they were overshadowed by BA/SW/GK . Marines being a top army is a very new concept to the game and even thenits only some marines.

>>52627865
Last time I checked in 7th edition everything is capable of scoring, not just troops. Comes with the new Formations/Detachments system I believe.

>>52627874
>stop playing how i don't like to play

>>52627874
>We have firearms now.

Let me know how that rifle goes for you when you're being run over by a tank.

>>52627871
"Units made entirely of Drones" specifically are not scoring

>>52627890
>>52627894
^What this guy said. Check the "Drone" unit type. All-drone units cannot score.

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>>52627874
The whole point of the close combat focus in 40k originally was that armour had progressed past conventional firearms and the best way to break it was with a disruption field that can't be put on a gun (power weapons). Guns that could reliably trump armour were being slowly forgotten by the galaxy (such as plasma) and were relatively rare. There, the setting has a reason for close combat. You're the one that doesn't fit in.

>>52627789
It's going to require a total re-balancing of weapon AP values rather than a simplistic direct conversion.

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>>52627874
>We have firearms now
>H2H combat is retarded

>>52627850
actually reading the rules for the interdiction cadre, I think the marker drones aren't providing much value. They could probably do better if they were all swapped to additional gun drones

>They all get Interceptor, Jink, Outflank, Precision Shot, and Split Fire. Also, as long as at least 2 squads remain on the field, all drones in your army gain +1 BS. Your Interceptor/EWO phase now has Marker support. Sorry to say, but the GW faq states that no unit can both jink and Go to Ground, so dreams of killer Roombas must now go the way of the dodo.

unsure of the value of the shield drones. I don't play tau but have been thinking about a drone army for a long while now

the only reason I haven't bought into it before is the prohibitive cost of drones

>>52627874
>>52627916

You're playing the game that gave chainswords to the world. If you don't like it go play Dropzone Commander or something.

>>52627935
Hey faggot I was telling him why he should be grabbing a power sword and charging read my post

>>52627916
>armour had progressed past conventional firearms
And yet that was never demonstrated in the rules. Anything could penetrate a marine's armour 1/3 of the time. You're talking out of your bum.

>>52627566
im not the one bitching about the one riptide. 2 at 1500 is even ok if the rest of your army isnt set up for stomp mode.

i get that the riptide is kinda the backbone of your army, im just saying that tau is just unfun to play against.

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>>52627662

>Prince at every level

I don't know about that, especially with legion formations. You're going to be paying around 750pts for a Warband and then another 30 for spawn tax. That leaves you with ~220 points and a naked Prince with wings is 200 points, so he's not really optimal at that level. If you take a CAD, then sure. If you want to dump 300ish of your thousand points into one model, then sure go for it I guess. 1500pts is better for a Prince.

>>52627795

Thanks!

He was running as a speed bump/cover for the Raptors, so he did his job. I was hoping to pop a rhino for first blood, but oh well. It was a bit of a gambit.

This is the last pic I have. The Havoks finished off the rhino, termies dropped and nuked the other rhino, the claw moved and spat out the brute, which then assaulted his heavy weapons team plus Libby, who managed to break away with only the sgt left.

The raptors jumped down and killed the squad down below giving my Lord FnP in the process. They were blown away by the top rhino squad, but the lord was fine. He took fire from some stalkers but thanks to a 3+ cover and FnP, he was also fine. He went on to butcher the top most squad who killed his raptors after they got shot to shit by my fresh troop.

The Librarian split from the sgt for an extra Krak grenade and a forced disordered charge, but failed to wound and both were pasted in the following turn. After all was said and done, he had one guy with a stalker bolter left who proceeded to get nomed by the claw's fly by attack.

>>52627965
>1/3rd of the time
Try a sword that works 100 percent of the time- perspective is everything

>>52627965
Guns would be pretty hard to kill people with if they only worked 1/3 of the time.

>>52627965
Power weapons (with exception of the mace) invalidate marine armor saves 100% of the time. What do? And this is ignoring other stuff like force weapons, power fists/thunder hammers etc.

>>52627974
that wasn't what he meant. chaos boons means your champ that shot that commissar in the head might turn into a prince or spawn

>>52627874
>Tau player detected

>>52627965
>>52627991
And besides, you could essentially use armour and cover together in older editions unlike now. Armour that stops shooting 2/3rds of the time and allowed enough mobility to stay behind cover. Armour was way fucking better

>>52627965
Assuming you actually hit accurately, conventional firearms in 40k aren't that great for killing marines. A close range burst with an autogun has a maybe 20% chance of killing a space marine. And that's assuming you don't miss at all.

That's an 80% chance that afterwards, he closes that 12" gap and cuts you in half.

>>52627965
>>52627991
>>52628003
>>52628027
>>52628044
Taufag being BTFO this hard

>>52628029

Oh shit duh. That's right. Color me corrected.

>>52627991
>>52628003
>>52628027
>>52628033
A sword may work just fine but you have to get close to the enemy while they shoot the shit out of you. That's why melee weapons are bad. I'm glad the rules reflect that

>>52627967
>>52627714
wrong reply.

>>52628071
>only Tau play mono shooty armies
Parking lots, Scatbikes/D-spam, Necron Gauss faggotry, Grav. Why am I even taking your shitty bait?

>>52628085
Transport vehicles are a thing. Deep striking is a thing. Jump packs are a thing. Bikes/jetbikes are a thing.

Do I need to continue?

>>52628085
>you have to get close to the enemy while they shoot the shit out of you

And that's pretty easy when your armor is basically immune to guns. Ignoring the cases where you simply teleport instead and proceed to just cut everyone to ribbons because you're already there.

>>52628096
Then use them but don't whine to me when you run unprotected into rifles and get turned into Swiss cheese.

>>52628111
>when your armor is basically immune to guns
>gets penetrated 1/3 of the time by anything
I'm loving every laugh.

>>52628088
Just thought you were the one angry taufag

Sorry if you're not he is just really retarded

>>52628128
Fuck you too, buddy

>>52627700
Don't take a riptide? Are you some autistic faggot? "hey man, don't take that land raider cause im not taking a riptide"

>>52628126
Yeah, I know! Some great jokes being told here. Like arguing how guns should be better because of realism, then using crunch to try and say power armor is bad? Hilarious! I didn't think someone could pretend to be that retarded.

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>>52628112

How is this for a DELDAR list? Running it as ynnari so I don't have to take 2 allied detachment. The autarch would join the incubi , whyches, or reavers to get them in melee

Part 2 of list inc

++ Combined Arms Detachment (Ynnari Aeldari: Fracture of Biel-Tan (2017)) [1621pts] ++

+ HQ [275pts] +

(DE) Archon [160pts]: Huskblade [25pts], Shadow Field [40pts], Splinter Pistol, Webway Portal [35pts]

(E) Autarch [115pts]: Banshee Mask [5pts], Fusion Pistol [10pts], Power Sword [15pts], Swooping Hawk Wings [15pts]

+ Elites [425pts] +

(DE) Incubi [180pts]: 4x Incubi [80pts]
·· (DE) Venom [70pts]: Chain-snares [5pts], Splinter Cannon [10pts]
·· Klaivex [30pts]: Klaive

(DE) Kabalite Trueborn [245pts]: 6x Kabalite Trueborn [66pts]
·· (DE) Raider [75pts]: Disintegrator Cannon, Enhanced Aethersails [5pts], Night Shields [15pts]
·· Kabalite Trueborn w/ Special Weapon [26pts]: Blaster [15pts]
·· Kabalite Trueborn w/ Special Weapon [26pts]: Blaster [15pts]
·· Kabalite Trueborn w/ Special Weapon [26pts]: Blaster [15pts]
·· Kabalite Trueborn w/ Special Weapon [26pts]: Blaster [15pts]

+ Troops [670pts] +

(DE) Kabalite Warriors [185pts]: 9x Kabalite Warrior [72pts]
·· (DE) Raider [90pts]: Chain-snares [5pts], Disintegrator Cannon, Night Shields [15pts], Splinter Racks [15pts]
·· Kabalite Warrior w/ Special Weapon [23pts]: Blaster [15pts]

(DE) Kabalite Warriors [185pts]: 9x Kabalite Warrior [72pts]
·· (DE) Raider [90pts]: Chain-snares [5pts], Disintegrator Cannon, Night Shields [15pts], Splinter Racks [15pts]
·· Kabalite Warrior w/ Special Weapon [23pts]: Blaster [15pts]

(DE) Wyches [150pts]: 6x Wych [60pts]
·· Hekatrix [45pts]: Agnoiser [25pts], Splinter Pistol
·· Wych w/ Wych Cult Weapon [15pts]: Two Hydra Gauntlets [5pts]
·· Wych w/ Wych Cult Weapon [15pts]: Two Hydra Gauntlets [5pts]
·· Wych w/ Wych Cult Weapon [15pts]: Two Hydra Gauntlets [5pts]

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>you will never fire a pulse rifle
It's a bad feel. gents.

>>52628159
I'm saying that the crunch is how it should be.

>>52628112
No one is whining though?

>>52628154
>Having problem with Land Raiders
>As Tau
>While not having a Riptide

He asked how to get people to hate him less, and that seems to be a pretty big focus for some people. Probably because some Tau players seem to think that the Riptide is something they need, rather than gravy on top of an already good army.

2/2

(DE) Wyches [150pts]: 6x Wych [60pts]
·· Hekatrix [45pts]: Agnoiser [25pts], Splinter Pistol
·· Wych w/ Wych Cult Weapon [15pts]: Two Hydra Gauntlets [5pts]
·· Wych w/ Wych Cult Weapon [15pts]: Two Hydra Gauntlets [5pts]
·· Wych w/ Wych Cult Weapon [15pts]: Two Hydra Gauntlets [5pts]

+ Fast Attack [251pts] +

(DE) Reavers [131pts]: Cluster Caltrops [15pts], 4x Reaver [64pts]
·· Arena Champion [26pts]: Close Combat Weapon
·· Reaver w/ Special Weapon [26pts]: Blaster [10pts]

(DE) Scourges [120pts]: Scourge [16pts]
·· Scourge w/ Heavy or Special Weapon [26pts]: Haywire Blaster [10pts]
·· Scourge w/ Heavy or Special Weapon [26pts]: Haywire Blaster [10pts]
·· Scourge w/ Heavy or Special Weapon [26pts]: Haywire Blaster [10pts]
·· Scourge w/ Heavy or Special Weapon [26pts]: Haywire Blaster [10pts]

+ Primary Detachment +

Primary Detachment

++ Allied Detachment (Eldar Craftworlds: Codex (2015)) [225pts] ++

+ HQ [115pts] +

Farseer [115pts]: Eldar Jetbike [15pts], Witchblade

+ Troops [110pts] +

Guardian Defenders [110pts]: 10x Guardian [90pts]
·· Heavy Weapon Platform [20pts]: Bright Lance [20pts]

++ Total: [1846pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

>>52628174
And we've proven that the fluff states you are wrong. Go play dropfleet

>>52628172
Go be a commie weeb somewhere else.

>>52628174
Yeah I know? Based on the fact that 'durr, gunz kill guyz IRL'

Top tier meme dude.

>>52627812
>look up cost for this
>MSRP of over 500 USD for 40 models
ehh... If I actually ever had a chance to play the game I might consider it more seriously.

Seriously why are drones so expensive? Modern drone sets rare pop up on ebay either. I know everyone always says tau players end up with a lot of spare drones, but for someone with zero tau, I guess the only way would be to find a cheesemongering tau player and buy their gun drones?

>>52628187
>fascism light
>anime
Pulse rifles are just cool you bitch

>>52628126
Sounds like someone lost they're last game to khorne daemonkin. Its okay, we're here to help the beginning of the healing process.

>>52628202
>fascism is bad
>i missed why people call them commies btw
Hello /r/warhammer40k!

>>52628193
The Tau Start Collecting! is a fantastic deal. I've managed to snag it off Amazon for $64 before, and it comes with 8 drones (6 for the suits, 2 for the FW squad), along with infantry and suits which you can always make use of.

Also, warning that that list may have problems with capturing objectives, given Drone-only units can't cap.

>>52628177
Plenty of people are whining about assault and overwatch.

>>52628183
The marines should have better armor in the crunch, I agree with you there. My point was about melee vs shooting in general not melee vs marines. Besides Astartes most things actually don't have invincible armor in the fluff.

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>>52627205
> insignificant alien empire

The Tau have ascended to be a major power in the galaxy to the point that the Eldar name dropped them as among the powers they could ally with to defeat Chaos.

I mean for fuck sake their lore says they are a technologically superior race whose passion and drives burn with such intensity it melts the hearts of dying empires. They have the power of destiny on their side because they are the ones who are meant to inherent the galaxy after humanity.

Of all the races, the thousands of them, why do you think the Tau are always mentioned with the big boys. When Khorne lists the races that are his play things, the Tau are mentioned. When Dante lists the races that stand up to the Tyranids, the Tau are mentioned. When the Eldar mention all the powers in the galaxy that can be allies in their war against Chaos, the Tau are mentioned.

The Tau only flaw is that they are young but even with their youth they showed the older powers their determination and power, taking their blows and dashing out blows of their own. But this youth is already passing and when the Tau finally mature the galaxy will know them as masters.

Tl;dr The future belongs to the Tau

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You have ten seconds

to make Nobz good

>>52628202
Boltguns are cooler and you know it.

>>52628216
Never said invincible. Just incredibly resilient.

>>52628216
Show me one instance of people in this thread whining about that then.

>>52628226
+2 initiative

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>>52628085
one day you'll run out of bullets

>>52628216
>Besides Astartes most things actually don't have invincible armor in the fluff.

Like the Necrons who never die? Or the giant Tyranid monsters that are basically living tanks? Or Orks which regularly shrug off bullets due to natural durability?

If assaulting from deep-strike was a thing, shooting armies would be heavily screwed. For some reason, assault terminators, Trygons, Raptors, and many other things can't suddenly appear in the middle of a gunline and murder everyone, despite how much sense it would make.

>>52628219
Lol sure enjoy being cucked when chaos explodes the universe or when the tyranids adapt to your bullshit or a necron Tombworld melts your suns or the imperium throws Damocles 2, electric boogaloo

>>52628226
Bikes are 10 points

>>52628233
Happy to oblige
>>52627323

>>52628245
4th edition Deathwing was capable of assaulting from deep strike AND turn one deep striking I believe.

>>52628219
Tau literally don't even control a sector. There are empires larger than them in the fluff.

>>52628256
>or when the tyranids adapt to your bullshit
It's canon that Tau literally "out adapted" a Hive Fleet.

>>52628213
I'm aware. The whole premise was to have a skynet army

I suppose some suits could fit the theme if they were modeled appropriately, since they are mostly all jet pack units (like drones), but it'd take some work to disguise or replace all the limbs to make the overall shape less humanoid

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>>52628169
>>52628180

>allthatshit.jpeg

>>52628256
What's happening is the turmoil that will open the way for the Tau to take over. It happened before in history and it will happen again in 40K.

The great powers destroy themselves, allowing a younger power to replace them as the dominant.

And please only Gorgon had the ability to race with the Tau in adaptation. The rest of the fleets can't keep up.

>>52628259
He's whining about shitty luck and his own poor choices of units. Plenty of assault units can take down a gunline successfully and get out before getting wiped out.

So don't worry he's just as dumb as you are.

>>52628271
Yeah and it's also canon that the tyranids couldn't find a bunch of admech hiding underground despite having creatures that actually burrow underground, detect psychic emanations and lictors who literally eat that kind of info for breakfast. Most writers don't know how to write tyranids

>>52628271

It's also generally agreed that that story makes about as much sense as the Baneblade incident. GW has to change how the universe works to make Tau win.

Alternatively, these reports of Tau victories are mostly Ethereal Propoganda.

>>52628292
Sounds like you have a higher opinion of tyranids than the fluff reflects.

>>52628262
Size doesn't equal power. The Tau live in a hyper dense cluster of stars that is rich with resources. They control hundreds of worlds and have the technological and manufactural power to churn out weapons and armour that equals and even surpasses the ancients own arsenal.

>>52628275
This might be of interest:
https://spikeybits.com/2017/03/the-tau-korvesa-initiative-a-full-drone-army-deploys.html

>>52628292

I always wondered, did the Tau not lose a single soldier during that invasion? I mean, one feeder tendril gets into a Tau skull, and suddenly the Hive Mind knows the secret plan. How the heck did they ever pull that shit off? And why didn't the Hive just revert to an old strain when it did?

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>>52627365
>ordo hereticus inquisitor
>working with dark angels

>>52628307
Give reasons for my opinion of tyranids such as but not limited to lictors, burrowers, psykers

>LOL you don't know the fluff XD TAU LMAO

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>>52628307
shit anon, did you have to kick an anon when he's down? i don't have a reaction image prepared for that

>>52628310
> Surpasses ancients arsenal

Ah, you baited too hard. No one will think you're serious after that, C'mon man.

>>52628297
>the baneblade incident
Elaborate

>>52628325
A fire warrior ha zero knowledge of how their tech works because the Ethereals forbid the warriors from understating their own tech and weapons under pain of death and worse.

>>52628343
How has a lictor never eaten an earth caste brain

>>52628307
Sounds like you don't actually know the fluff

>>52628318
>https://spikeybits.com/2017/03/the-tau-korvesa-initiative-a-full-drone-army-deploys.html
thats... really cool

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>>52628339
"The Ancient and the Greater Good". Did you read it or you gonna call all the fluff you don't like bait? See how the Necrons tech fare against the Tau's.

Or maybe you should read the "Patient Hunter" and see how a single Riptide can make mockery of an Admech tank battalion on its own.

>>52628352
We know there are Genecults on Tau worlds. The idea of the Hive never slurping up an Earth Caste is ludicrous.

>>52628297
The story works better if you think of it from the viewpoint that Tau have themselves, their pretty versatile battlesuits, and several auxiliary races, as well as getting help from the Imperial Guard in the final waves of defense.

It wasn't so much that they were out-adapting Gorgon, but moreso that the Hive Fleet was really focused on adapting to new threats, and was clearly more used to fighting a single enemy at a time. Odds are, if Gorgon had fought Tau and Tau alone, they would have actually managed to counter even their array of weapons, since they mainly have to focus on plasma, which counters a big chunk of the Tau arsenal. When they also have to deal with the other Tau weapons, plus primitive attacks from Kroot, plus lasweapons from the guard, plus whatever other Tau auxillaries were there, it becomes more reasonable.

The story is better when one views it not as how Tau technology lets them solve everything, but how their willingness to use allies allowed them to throw so much different shit at the problem that they overwhelmed it.

>>52628360
The fluff says right here that the Tyranids suck though.

>>52628364
Clearly tons of work and it would depend on how okay your local gaming group is with it, but it's a pretty sweet idea. I'm personally a huge fan of Tau drones. I hope to get some Remoras at some point.

>>52628352
What would low level earth caste know about the battleplan and how the fancy stuff works?

>>52628372
Good point.
Story is still shit however.

>>52628367
Yeah check back with us when your snowflakes have bricks that turn off stars buddy

Nids a shit

>>52628367
> Necron Tech V. Tau Tech.

Slow ships.
Relaitvely Low Orbital Presence.
Refined Plasma Rifles.
Reliant on supply chains.

>vs

Slow Ships
Infinite Soldiers.
Molecular Disintegration weapons.
Turn matter into pure energy.
Ability to delete stars from an Armchair.

Hmmmmmmmmmmm......

>>52628399
They do. They have the "Star Burst" that they invented by accident. They are currently working on refining it.

>>52628390
>genestealer cult has canonically overthrown an earth caste world, quarantined it so nobody escapes, and infected several ethereals.

Durr every earth caste there must be retarded

>>52628393
Yeah, probably more due to the way GW wrote it and the way they did focus it on it seeming like the Tau out-adapted Tyranids.

>>52628408
Guess who outperformed who in the story.

Tau AI > Necron AI

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Miss me yet?

>>52628425
No.

>>52628411
Yeah and they don't have living metal either. This taufags drank so much of his own coolaide he thinks that some pulse guns and suits can build anything remotley similar to a world engine

What's the bare minimum of shit I would need to buy to get into 40k, both playing the game and the painting too? I assume Dark Vengeance is a good entry point, but what about brushes, paints, tools, and all that other shit?

>>52628390
Absolutely nothing. But they DO know exactly how their weapons work. Which means the Hive will know exactly how to adapt to it, rather than just seeing how guants die, and making small changes a little bit at a time. They can just pump out fully adapted warrior forms right away.

>>52628419
>infected several ethereals.

No proof of that.

Also earth caste are not born with science knowledge. They are not mekboys. Also genestealer cultists don't transmit their knowledge the the Hivemind. In fact, they are not part of the Hivemind and in the final days of a world being devoured, the genestealer cultists realize their mistake and fight against the Tyranids or try to escape.

>>52628326
The Marines are up to their knees in sweat inside that armor.

>>52628436
The tau would never be able to come close to a Monolith or a Tesseract much less a world engine.

>>52628436
>Yeah and they don't have living metal either.

Actually, the Tau invented nano-drones that fix anything from Armour to flesh.

>suits can build anything remotley similar to a world engine

The Tau built ships that are continent or moon sized before.

>>52628226
Shadow War: Armageddon

>>52628446
And then get eaten by lictors who absorb the knowledge(that the ex earth caste guys would know). And while his infection is only implied the ethereal dropped the quarantine in this obviously fucked up planet. It's either retardation or infection, you tell me

>>52628443
That never happened at all in the fluff. Lictors just use their sucked out knowledge to understand the chain of command and that's the extent of it in the fluff as far as I know.

>>52628446
> Earth Caste don't have tech knowledge downloaded into their brains

Kek

> Genestealers in a cult don't transfer info to Hive Fleet

Double Kek

> Genecult fight against the glorious starfather welcoming them into their glorious biological juggernaught

TOP kek

>>52628226

T5

>>52628425
Fuck no, I think 7th's core rules are almost a strict improvement with the exception of psychic powers, the shit that got worse going from 6th to 7th are mostly codex specific (Why the fuck did they buff Eldar)

>>52628389
the only thing is heavy conversions/counts-as always make me worried. I know a lot of people are very against anything like that even in casual games. Heavy conversions are also a lot of work.

I think the drone list could do OK in eternal war missions but I agree the scarcity of scoring units makes maelstrom missions dicey. I don't think it has the firepower to table an army unless the opponent makes some some really bad mistakes.

Drones are a lot of points too, though it makes sense why. 1500 would give more freedom for some other units (maybe a start collecting or OSC box)

>>52628462
Yeah and they do fuck all with them

Also citation needed etc

>>52628471
> Feeder tendrils only understand who's in charge

> What is Deathleaper

>>52628462
>Actually, the Tau invented nano-drones that fix anything from Armour to flesh.
Living metal repairs itself without use of drones. What do?

>>52628473
>Kek

They have head internet but tell do you KNOW everything just because you have the internet? And you don't have full access to the governments secret files.

>Double Kek
>TOP kek

Someone didn't read the Genestealer codex...

>>52626275
That's not how it works at all, dumb ass. The game plays fast when the rules are elegant and compact, not when models die easily. Also making stuff die fast is dumb as fuck because if everything is dead by turn 3 you have no time at all for maneuvers, making the game yet more casual and boring. In fact the resilience of everything needs to go up, because deleting half the enemies army off the board turn 1 is boring as shit, why even bother with deployment then?

>>52628504
See>>52628467

>>52628489
Dawn of War 3 Last Stand.

The Tau codex 6th ED. Also the ork codex. The Tau stole one of the Tau mega ships.

>>52628219
Lol, Tau don't even have FTL and with no psykers and no C'tan they have absolutely no hope of getting any.

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I revised my Nurgle list and used Plague Colony formation

How's it lookin fellas?

>>52628440

I'm still painting my DV stuff, but the problem I've found is what you want keeps growing.

Just Dark Angels you could probably get away with the starter paint kit (Set me back an extra $5 with the Battle brothers promo, comes with small pots of a few different paints, clippers, glue and a brush), some primer and Calaban Green, but you'd be doing a few things kind of wonky colours, like some of the symbols on the shoulders of the Terminators.

Will you newfags ever learn to stop arguing with Carnac when he's jacking off to Tau?

>>52628504
Uuuh... purestrains can have feeder tendrils, which are explicitly for brain suckage.

Dunno about the Genecult fighting for or against Tyranids though. I'm leaning towards the other Anon's intepretation though, since they're Allies with Nids.

>>52628497
Find me lore where lictors got technological know-how to a hive fleet. You can't.

>>52628498
Living Metal is billions of nano-scarabs that come together to form a liquid like substance that can become anything.

>>52628505
Yeah. Things being durable is good, up to a point. You want squads to be durable or large enough to not get wiped out in one turn of shooting, unless they're heavily focused on. Conversely though, you don't want models with lots of 2+ saves that are re-rollable or hard to ignore.

>>52628219

This is what Taufags actually believe.

E: Fuck you CAP, none of those are billboards. REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>52628283
Not only are the new tendrils of Leviathan adapting just as fast they outnumber the Tau 6 billion to 1.

>>52628525
Honestly he's pretty shit at it. The constant stream of BTFOs makes my willy feel good

>>52628481
I might recommend looking into Piranhas? Sadly they have fleshy dudes in them, but they're great value and each one comes with a pair of drones (which make up the bulk of their point-value, in fact).

>>52628516
The Orks stole*

>>52628528
Just open the genestealer codex.

>>52628530
>Living Metal is billions of nano-scarabs that come together to form a liquid like substance that can become anything
Lolwut? That's not how living metal works.

>>52628425
i miss the old terrify which stole away fearless/stubborn for a turn but that's about it

>>52628518
>Tau don't even have FTL
What is slingshot drive?