/5eg/ Fifth Edition General:

>>52555918
Storm King's Thunder, is that even up for debate?

What would happen if two opposing creatures tried to charm the same target and it fails both saves?

What if the target was already charmed and then someone else attempts to charm it and give it directives that contradict the first charmer?

>>52555944

My group just finished OotA, and another group of mine is about to finish CoS. Not gonna get to start SKT for a few months now though, but strangely enough, I don't really feel as hyped for it as I did for the previous two.

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how well does E6 mesh with 5E's ruleset? My cousin and his girlfriend refuse to play D&D without E6 since that's what they played with 3.5 since high school and they're refusing to try 5E at all unless I cap it at level 6

>>52555918
>https://5egmegaanon.github.io/5etools/5etools.html

I'm new to Roll20, how exactly do you get the information to copy to character sheets after the greasemonkey script is installed?

>>52556070
I'd just fucking play 3.5 at that point. No sense arbitrarily breaking a new system just because they're married to a concept that literally only works in the original system.

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>>52555918
Anyone got tips for a trap using character? I'm thinking either kobold or rock gnome arcane trickster with spells like grease, alarm, arcane lock, etc.
Would have to keep an eye out for caltrops, flasks of oil, hunters traps, and poisonous vermin to fling at people/set above doorways and such.

Seems like a challenging concept since there isn't much to work with in the way of traps for players, could be fun. Would rely a lot on creativity and the environment, I imagine.

>Make a druid
>Play a couple games
>Now I find out they're GHEY
>DM won't let me change
what do I do?

>>52556141
kill yourself, and make a new character.

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>>52556099
>Anyone got tips for a trap using character?

Wear a choker around the neck.

>>52556070
E6 exists because 3.5 is broken. 5e isn't broken (or at least doesn't start until way later) You could make your own E11 or some shit and it would be closer to they're looking for

>>52556141
Too late, just gotta be gay now.

>>52556070
they're fucking retards

What's your favorite cantrip or spell from the new UA?

http://www.strawpoll.me/12670701
http://www.strawpoll.me/12670701
http://www.strawpoll.me/12670701

Why are nearly all Divination spells utter trash?
Is Portent THAT good?

>>52556268
Please tell me that nobody actually thinks that Ceremony is at all okay or acceptable in any sense.

>>52556316
Wizards aren't specialists anymore. The divination spells all divine.

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>>52556099
I think(as someone who admittedly has never done it before myself) a lot of it is about the mindset of taking things slower and planning things out. Even so, I can see a character doing most everything "right" for using traps/ambushing but if the other characters charge ahead and take care of business 2 rooms ahead then you're kind of odd one out. Gotta work with your team and the GM I think, very team-oriented. That new starter spell for wizards in the UA, snare or whatever it's called sounds like fun for a character like that.

>>52556353
>Top on poll
Clearly people think it is

>>52556268
Chaos Bolt seems fun. Clerics can turn a pretty penny selling Holy Water now with Ceremony.

>>52555973
Have both creatures do a contested roll using wisdom. The winner gets control of the target.

Champion or Battle Master for great weapon fighter?

I feel like champion is better in the long run.

>>52556364
>>/pfg/

>>52556437
Why is this /pfg/?

>>52556421
Champion is reliable, but boring. Battlemaster is interesting.

>>52556455
My character is a brutal and strong.

He has skill at arms but not the finesse of it.

What some good feats for an 8-th level Moon Druid? Only other feat I have is Keen Mind. Spoiled for choice here.

>>52556449
animeme.

>>52556293
Nah, Heat Metal deals 22d8 if you can get away and I meant it. Simply cast it and leave.
Its unfortunate that most parties simply don't have the patience or teamwork to pull off a strategy like that.

One PC throwing Spike Growth and another PC throwing Heat Metal before fleeing is a pretty damn heavy duty and low level way to deal with a good deal of encounters.

I made a half orc monk, am I fugged?

I see people keep saying Wizards are one of the strongest classes in 5e but I can't visualize it.

A level 2 wizard at best does what, 3d8 if their chromatic orb hits, but a level 2 bow fighter with sharpshooter does 2d8+26

Can anyone help me out with this Wizard #1 mentality?

>>52556467
Consider barbarian.

>>52555854
The Harpe was a Vorpal Sword (Well, actually an adamantine sickle.)

Against mortals at least, against Kronus it was more of a sword of sharpness for one very special part, but I think most players would actually prefer the vorpal effect.

>>52556537
>Can anyone help me out with this Wizard #1 mentality?

Its a mix of traumatized 3e babbies, molested Pathfailures, and players who have literally had such pushover DMs that they let them start at level 17 with Crawford simulacra abuse.

It has nothing to do with the actual game other than that they're mad that Champions are lacking in utility.

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>>52556537
>He fell for the damage meme

>>52556316
Yes. It is probably the best archetype feature in the game.
>feed barbarians and champs free crits
>enemies auto fail saves on demand when it counts
>stack lucky feat to pass every important save
You basically don't even need stats.

Looking for some ideas here. So the party has captured one of the enemy leaders and are taking her back to a city for further questioning. However right now they are in the middle of a monster infested wilderness, and even if she could escape, she wouldn't because she understands her chances of survival alone would be slim.

She has convinced them she won't try to escape for now and has helped in a couple of fights, to the point where they even let her free of bindings during the day.

My question is: how can she use this limited freedom to prepare for a possible escape once they reach more civilized lands?

>>52556496
Observent
War Caster
Savage attacker, which isn't amazing, but its better for a moon druid than anyone else

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>>52556565
He is an armored and professional soldier.

He just uses brute force and his size to overpower.


Feel like barbarian would not really fit it. A few levels into barb sound appealing though just for axe murder like stuff.

>>52556537
>Playing casters

one of my players finally took up the mantle of DM and went about worldbuilding while I was out of the country. Our original dm(the one I took over for), a bonafide no shower-taking magicalrealm-spewing naruto-loving thatguy that always smells like warm piss, has deeply involved himself in the creation.

Five minutes in to my player explaining his world to me, as it could be cool to try being a player again, and I find out of the old DM is a god that had all his powers and memory stripped away and is playing a heavily modified samurai(fighter+paladin)gemstone dragonborn.

I really want to celebrate my player's hard work but at the same time I want to run away screaming because apparently pisspants has been a "key contributor" to the balance and world shaping departments. I booted the guy from my table after he left a piss stain on my recliner and didn't say anything about it, not even privately. He also played a lot of teleports-behind-you glory hog characters.

what do.

>>52556588
>you basically don't even need stats
seconded, I went divination when i only rolled 14 as my highest stat and the race didn't give any increase to int, either. I was still the most useful in the group because twice a day I could become the DM and know something would 100% work.

>>52556638
It's April 5th, Anon.

Am I wrong or links are down again? =(

>>52556638
Is this a new pasta I missed or something?

>>52556638
Kill him
In real life

>>52556663
>>52556588
Goddamn.
We started at first level in the current campaign I'm in, so I haven't had the chance to abuse it yet.
Any opinions on good spells to take? I'm guessing all the "Dex save for half damage" ones are pretty great.

>>52556692
https://mega.nz/#F!a0x0yDxT!vrjaWifa6I5_gwN0UfxhFA

>>52555973
>First question
It's charmed with regards to both creatures. There is no conflict.

>Second question
Assuming it's an ability that not only charms but also controls, it simply wants to do both.
If it's something such as geas which would cause the creature to be harmed if it doesn't do what it's supposed to do, it would still do the thing most likely as most spells specify it can't take harmful actions.
However, otherwise, it's just 'I want to do both' and thus it would do whichever it thinks is the better choice depending on what's asked of it. The lesser of two evils.

As an absolute last resort, you may call upon the force of will of both casters using contested charisma checks.

>>52556353
>Is at all okay or acceptable

What's wrong with it?

The buffs aren't strong enough to warrant munchkinning it hard to get the benefits and the fact it exists as a spell doesn't stop people from doing ceremonies without magic.

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New subclass!

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>>52555944
I don't get the structure of Storm King's Thunder at all.
There are five different Giant lairs but you only need to deal with one of them. And earlier on there are three different intro scenarios but you only do one of those too.

I understand it's like that to give the players a choice, but it's not a very deep decision. It's less about weighing pros and cons and more like giving them a choice of ice cream flavour. And the choice of first scenario is pretty much down to the GM anyway.
All the optional scenarios put together make up a significant proportion of the book and most of them you are never going to use. Which would be fine if they were like the locations in the Savage Frontier chapter and the players were intended to take a meandering path through, but they're not. You pick one and that's it.

Am I missing something or what?
The art is great though.

Should the moon druid's alter form at will let them grow wings?

>>52556537
Wizards are mostly utility. In combat and out of combat utility.

Also, most adventuring days aren't as long as they're supposed to be, so wizards get rests more often than they should and always have plenty of resources.

Comparing to an action surging featings low level fighter isn't good, though they do have better AoE than most people considering they get, at level 5, 8d6 within a massive radius (20ft radius, wasn't it?) and failed creatures still take half that damage.

>>52556421
If you're allowed to take the Great Weapon Master feat as well, Battle Master is godly just for the Precision Attack maneuver; add 1d8 to any attack roll after you roll, but before you know if it hits or not. With the -5 to hit/+10 to damage modifier of GWM you'll absolutely destroy low AC creatures. For higher AC stuff you can just decide to do normal damage.

You'll get a free reroll on any two-handed melee weapon die if they are a 1 or 2. If you use a Great-sword for 2d6, this will give consistently higher damage than the 1d12 of a Great-axe.

You also get a free attack as a bonus action if you kill or crit on your turn.

And, if you take the Riposte maneuver, you can have an attack as a reaction if a creature misses you with a melee attack.

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I cry every time

>>52556926
Is there anything else they could do?

>>52556860
I guess it's for replayability value?

Certainly, if you made a road with 5 different paths and you said they each lead to different places and they all lead to the same place it doesn't matter in the end, because you never really gave the players any choice. Then you assign each path a completely different adventure and let the players choose, but they don't have much to base their choice off of so it's just as goodas if you had each path end up at the same place.

Seems more of replayability or DM choice than anything.

>>52556395
Only if they can sell holy water for more than the price listed in the PHB. Usually you can't even sell things for more than half the listed price unless you build a shop.

>>52556952
Make a traveling salesman cleric who makes ghostly illusions and sells holy water to cure their ails

>>52556926
On the bright side, they're probably going to compile and readjust all the UA stuff and put it in a second edition PHB, and then /tg/ can stop arguing over whether or not it's balanced... right?

>>52556421
Champion has some very boring mid-levels, and the good features aside from the level 3 one are right at the very end.

Champion is only really good if you have a lot of fights between every short rest, which doesn't normally happen.

>>52556896
I currently have GW fighting which allows me the reroll of 1 or 2 and am using a great sword to take advantage.

I was mostly asking if champion is a feasible option compared to battle master.

getting crits on 19s sounds delicious.

>>52556983
Well I was going for a more mundane flavor on this character anyways so that sounds good tbqh.

>>52556978
And Ceremony goes "canon" and clerics and priests are now one and the same and there will be most crying.
It will be beautiful.

I have a half-orc fighter, planning on going champion and multiclassing into warlock. Is that a good idea? I have 18str, 13cha, 13con and rest are 10/11 or below.
Took protection at level 1 knowing I would have some levels where I can't use it before war caster. Have I made a huge mistake? Would pally or bard be a better multiclass?

>>52555918
Do you guys use feats? There's more feats available in some splat, or the ones in the PHB are the only ones available?

>>52557011
Why would anyone say otherwise? Clerics and priests are the same thing.

>>52557011
Eh, I figure it's like how any priest can bless you, but only a cleric (or paladin, or favoured soul, or theurge) can Bless you.

>>52557057
UA has some extra feats. You should definitely use them, some are amazing.

>>52557057
Yeah we just always use feats because why not

>>52556948
Do people regularly replay a campaign with the same group?
That would make sense but it seems like the issue would never come up.

The material in the book is pretty decent regardless. I suppose a quick fix (albeit a cliched one) would be to make the conch of teleportation come in multiple parts that need to be assembled for it to work. That would solve the redundant material problem if not the choice one.

>>52557048
Warlock is fine for getting some videogame/ anime style 'special moves' for your fighter (over the more mundane battlemaster maneuvers)
Things like misty step and darkness are great because they don't depend on your CHA
Don't neglect fighter levels though, get extra attack ASAP.

>>52557061
Clerics have spells and priests don't necessarily have spells. Priests and other nonmagical believers give power to their god, and clerics take some of that power away from the god in return for advancing the god's interests in the Prime Material.

>>52557067
Exactly. Any priest can perform a wedding or a funeral, but when a cleric does it there's just a little more magical oomph behind it. Which, amusingly, incentivizes lovestruck adventurers to get married in the middle of a dungeon rather than waiting to get to town.

>>52556729
Thanks! =)

>>52556860
I'm running it right now and kind of hate it. Triboar feels like the only good option to send players to, as goldenfields and bryn shander have much less to do in town other than the invasion. I would never run the other two without heavy modification. My group just got done with chapter 4, too, and i'm realizing just how much more should have been foreshadowed. My players have very little investment in anything to do with the giants or dragons. That's very much my fault, but I had to flesh out so much in chapter 3 already that I wish the sidequests that were offered there at least alluded better to the giants.

/pfg/ is talking about how the worst thing to ever happen to their general was actually playing the game right now. For context I think the claim is that by having games hosted for /pfg/, personalities and memes are running rampant.

So it got me thinking, what do you think the impact on /5eg/ would be if people began hosting games with /5eg/ in mind?

>>52557083
What is the point in replaying something if you know what is going to happen?


I mean if it has been a while sure.

I feel like it would only be fun if the sitting DM took a lot of liberties with it and changed it up so much that you may as well play a new one.

>>52557140
I've never done it but I suppose they might want to see what happens if they make different decisions with different characters.

>>52556316
Arcane Divination spells are not for combat. They are for ruining mysteries and solving puzzles. Detect Thoughts solves any murder instantly. Locate Object laughs at thefts. Etc.

>>52557121
>personalities and memes are running rampant.
Memes are one thing.

When you start getting attention whoring faggots trying to make a name for themselves on a anonymous Mongolian basket weaving forum it defeats the purpose of why we are here.

To discuss the game and bounce ideas off of each other.

and also PF sucks massive orc cock

>>52557164
Apparently so.
They all seem to fall in the line of "100 gp focus: Find the plot".

>>52556989
Yeah, you could think of it as a trade off of consistent high damage versus random high damage spikes.

Like; having the option to add to your attack roll on a roll you know you need to hit versus critting at random and killing a goblin who was going to die in 1 hit anyway, crit or not, seems better to me.

Anyone got "Tales from the Yawning Portal" pdf already?

>>52557121
I think its best to just join the discord if you want to make games with other people here, then the majority of the memes and personalities are confined to there

>>52557221
Everyone?

>>52556496
Keen Mind is WRONG!

The correct build is Very.Human with 1-Sentinel, 4-Warcaster, 8-Resilient(CON).

The idea is to cast a concentration spell like Conjure Animals, and tank. This forces the enemy to choose between focusing their attacks on you to get rid of the eight Giant Poisonous Snakes or dealing with your Conjure. With Warcaster and Resilient(CON) You have +6-7 to Concentration checks with advantage.

What happened to the trove?

>>52556507
Yes.

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>>52556952
>Only if they can sell holy water for more than the price listed in the PHB.
I'm not sure why you think you need to sell it for /more/ than the regular holy water price to get rich. That shouldn't really matter at all.

A glass vial costs 1gp, water's not hard to come by in many settings, you could ritual cast Ceremony for a total of ~6 times a day so you're spending about 6gp a day. Even if you sell it for a tenth of the normal asking price (absolute mad man!) you get a net 1.5 gp profit per unit, which would come to 9gp a day. That's well within the range of wealthy lifestyle costs.

This level of saturation probably wouldn't be maintainable in one location, but if it were that would be 45gp for one week or 180gp for a months worth of work (neither total including weekends). This level of profit would also be enough to hire you're own glass blower, if that ever became an issue.

>>52556989
>>52557185
But, play what you want to play. Champion is fine, I just feel it lacks in utility compared to Battle Master.

Now that the dust has settled, what's the consensus on Mystics?

Send help. I have a new player, and he wants to play a skeleton wizard. However, skeleton is not in fact a playable race. However, the player is really enthused about playing a skeleton. What do I give him race wise?

>>52555918
>bit do/5egtrove
Your Trove Link's broke.

>>52557278
Ceremony consumes 25gp worth of material components.

>>52556606
Some help please?

>Official /5eg/ Mega Trove v8
https://mega.nz/#F!a0x0yDxT!vrjaWifa6I5_gwN0UfxhFA

>>52557355
read the thread.

>>52557292
You don't "feel" shit, Champion OBJECTIVELY lacks utility compared to Battlemaster.

>>52556395
The PHB already states that Clerics and Paladins can create holy water: it costs 25gp worth of reagents, takes 1 hour to cast and they must spend a 1st-level spell slot.
So, basically they could make holy water by default with inflict wounds and heroism memorized. You don't need ceremony for that.

>>52556364
This is good advice, I have trouble with the party charging in as a fighter as it is. I imagine I could just leave junk laying around in the entrances to room as we progress down dungeon hallways for the best effect, and my biggest role would be ensuring uninterrupted rests.

Traps feel like they'd be a downtime activity more than anything. I'd probably do a lot of crossbow use at range.

>>52557317
Just give them any stats and racial bonuses, doesn't matter because any humanoid that sees them will either run in fear or try to kill them because they are undead. When you kill them tell them to make a normal character

>>52557375
Thanks a lot

>>52557317
People will say revenant, but don't do that because it requires roleplaying. Just do human minus the ability to speak or drink potions.

>>52557317
Ahem.

UNDEAD RACE WHEN!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>52557317
You say, "fuck it, let's do this shit!"
Head to the DMG p. 282 and make him a bloody skelleton!

>>52556728
Sleep at low levels. Spam CANTRIPS for 3-4 rounds then finish the encounter a round early with sleep.

Color Spray is surprisingly good.

Detect Thoughts and Locate Object make a mockery of investigations.

Shatter is the best 2nd level spell against minions, Scorching Ray vs boss monsters, Hold Person+Portent is good vs NPCs.

Hypnotic Pattern is better than Fireball if your party aren't morons. Counterspell is essential for survival against enemy spellcasters.

Conjures are amazingly strong in 5e. Take them. Polymorph and Banish are amazing. Never polymorph the enemy, instead polymorph one of your weak party members into a Giant Ape orT-Rex then run away behind full cover to maintain concentration.

Disintegrate is strong, use it late in the encounter with Portent to eliminate a boss monster. Kinda like with sleep.

Basically, as a Wizard you must play intelligently in order to be effective. I really like that.

>>52557110
Well hey, it's like that old cliche.

"We're totally screwed, and there's no way we're going to make it through past this dracolich beholder and his deathknight guards, but damn it, I love you and want to die a married man."

>>52556606
They get into a fight a few days from the city, she rushes in as normal to help fight. Make her move so she positions herself away from the group a bit and at the best opportunity have her suddenly take the dash action into the treeline. If you can do it when someone is in need of her help, all the better.

>>52557446
Best answer.

>>52556868
Your basic shape stays the same, no growing extra limbs even though you can appear as a member of another race.

>>52557447
Sounds like a plan! Thank you for your suggestions. A lot of these were things that I was already considering, but you've cemented them as valid choices.

>>52557388
That's by design. People who even think about how much "utility" they're getting from a class are nit the people Champion was meant for. Champion is a dirt-simple option for people who just want to roll up a fighter and get swinging without making too many decisions, people who like the thrill of scoring crits, new players, and people who are on the fence about playing at all. Optimizers and script kiddies have the battlemaster (not to mention the wizard.)

>>52557363
Doesn't consume, just requires

Rate my bonebrew:

Skeleton
Features:
+2 DEX
Darkvision 60 ft
Immunity to poison damage and the poisoned condition.
Disadvantage on non-intimidation CHA checks when body is not concealed.

There we go, playable skeleton.

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>>52557402
If your DM wants to be nasty, he could have other party members(or maybe you) have the possibility of triggering traps on your own party. I can see this working best in a party with no true frontline, or maybe against encounters that are brutal when taken on conventionally. That way you need to be wily after the initial ambush, because butting heads will end badly for you.

>>52557388
>You don't "feel" shit
Of course not. That would be disgusting.

>>52557544
That's got to be a typo. Why would it need to be powdered if you weren't sprinkling it everywhere?

>>52557083
Replayability is for Adventurer's League. But it's also so people who have read or previously run the adventure can have some small measure of suspense.

>>52557566

Why not just modify the existing revenant and add vulnerability to bludgeoning?

>>52556099
make a rogue/ and dip a couple levels into ranger for their spell pool and enemy/area advantage.
everything you list beyond the spells can be roleplayed by any character, but you're looking at a character that has at least 3 stats over 16 to be dependable in what you're trying to pull off.
in addition to what you've got listed, you'll need pitons to stick in doorways to make sure you've got the time needed to make traps, iron spikes and a shovel. plenty of rope and a bell or two.it's all relatively light to carry so I wouldn't worry too much about carrying it.

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>>52557566
It's utterly boned.

>>52557591
Because you would then be coming back to life all the time, which isn't what I imagine a skeleton doing.

>>52557610
>modify

>>52557438
Never because by Kelemvor I will smash your ass back into the ground.

>>52557610

Well, it's a skeleton come back to life in the first place, I don't see it as being that much of a stretch.

>>52557618
That's the main "undead" feature of revenant.

>>52557577
Wall of force requires powdered gemstone that isn't consumed

>>52557317
Use teh DMG stats

>>52557610
And it would also require you to have a motivation and a backstory for your mission of vengeance, which is probably beyond the mental ability of someone who "just wants to play a skeleton."

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>>52557626

>>52557644
That's probably a typo, too. These guys

>>52556507
Depends, if you got decent Dex, Wis and ok Con also staying away from Wot4E unless using the third party rework.

>>52557659
The problem isn't that it requires consideration, the problem is that it locks you into one goal, vengeance, and prevents you from having a long running character.

>>52557575
I would have expected nothing less from my dm.

The party would definitely all need to be in a mindset for having a base that regularly gets invaded. May be more fun in a dungeon management game with a group composed of monsters.

>>52556099
>>52557594
that being said. talk to your DM about being able to write down the traps you're making and how much time/ equipment something like each trap would cost to set up. that way when you want to make them in the future, you know exactly what you need and how to do it, include the rolls and DC if necessary. the less time you take trying to explain this, the more likely the DM will be okay with you doing it in the first place.

>>52556070
E6 Exists because of the balance issues inherent in 3.5; all of which have been amended in some way as 5E doesn't suffer similar breaks until much higher level.

Is Battlerager Barbarian fun? That bonus action punch seems tasty. My DM is letting me go Goliath too, so I don't have to dorf it.

>>52557712
At what point DOES 5e start breaking? If it's at 17th Level that would be understandable. Does it before then?

>>52556728
Depending on what you're fighting, you can use Portent + Puppet + Magic Circle to march your enemies into a place they can't escape.

>>52556537
Wall of Force.

>>52557732
Some people say 11. 17 is definitely broken though, level 9 spells are simply not balanced.

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>all these people wanting to play undead

>>52557110
cler·ic
ˈklerik
noun
a priest or religious leader, especially a Christian or Muslim one.

>>52557696
That's the cost of having a character who gets resurrected for free.

>>52556537
It's not about just their damage though they obviously do get evocation. It's that they have the biggest spell list with the most variety and also prepare them freely while having features that specifically let them cast even more.

>>52557723

It's alright. I only played it for five levels, which is a shame, because it's all about that level 6 ability. Just max your Con and generate a free five temp HP every round.

>>52557754
The only problem with level 9 spells is, specifically, Wish used to cheese Simulacrum.

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>>52557761
Remove undead!

Moradin wills it!!!

Can spells go through a wall of force?

>>52557011
You realize you can still get married without the involvement of the Ceremony spell, right?

imagine a setting where you have to imprison a mind flayer, assuming innate psionics are still magic, would restraining it in anti-magic material, cuffs or otherwise and putting on his face a straight-jacket-like mask to secure his tentacles be enough?

>>52557732
>>52557712
In a game where 20 PCs can be obliterated by CR 4 enemies its hard for me to envision 5e being "breakable" without the use of dumb caster tricks.

>>52557438
R E V E N A N T

>>52557837
Some can, such as Teleport.

>>52557858
As usual dumb caster tricks is probably what does break it. But it would seem it's harder to do since they made an attempt(tm) to watch out for that this time.

>>52557766
That's the real-world definition of cleric, yes. In D&D it's more specific than that. D&D needs a specific term for church leaders who can cast divine spells, and thanks to Gygax they're called clerics. Thus in the D&D world the term "priest" is more general than "cleric," as opposed to the real world where it's the other way around.

>>52557848
Yes.

>>52557879
>YOU'RE LITERALLY JUST A GUY BUT IF YOU DIE YOU COME BACK
That's not being undead, that's having a reset button on mortality.

>>52557771
That's why we want an undead player race that DOESN'T resurrect infinitely.

>>52557438
aberration race when ;;

>>52557811
I think true polymorph being permanent is pretty absurd myself.

>>52557882
I mean attacking someone, like casting hold person on someone, or does it depend on the spell description?

>>52557913
Only if you never even try to achieve the goal that is supposed to have brought your soul screaming back into your body for vengeance. Because if you do achieve your drive you die and can never come back.

>>52557926
Better make sure the group doesn't play in objective morality and have a paladin in it. or just go play pf where you'd be seen as a tame option.

>>52557848
Anti-magic material isn't really a thing in d&d, only anti-magic zones. If the magic cuffs included the mind flayer in such a zone, then you'd still have to worry about him slipping out of the cuffs. The escape DC has to be greater than 20 plus his bonus to Acrobatics to make sure he can't get out.

>>52557447
>hypnotic pattern with an instrument of the bards
oomph

Tg how would you run a d&d murder mystery?

Plan A right now is literally get a Anti Magic Castle and run a Cluedo session

>>52557926
If all you want is an undead that acts exactly like a living human instead of a revenant with actual flavor and basis in mythology, doing that doesn't require special rules of any kind, since it's liyerally just a human with a different name.

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>>52557949
Obviously you'd be playing an evil / monster campaign.

>>52557931
Tiefling subrace UA.

>>52557949
>playing objective morality

>>52557931
When they do a proper psionics book, and they include the Elan.

(And it wouldn't surprise me if they made a psionic origin for sorcerers)

>>52557566
>Disadvantage on cha checks
Why?
That assumes that you'll always be interacting with people who are wary of skeletons.

That's a conditional factor the DM needs to handle - 'You are a skeleton, therefore people will not trust you so easily', not something that needs to be mechanically represented.

>>52558044
It WOULD surprise me because at this point they clearly hate Sorcerers.

>>52557964
Have the killer turn the victim's head into pulp so Speak With Dead won't work.

>>52558015
>If all you want is an undead that acts exactly like a living human instead of a revenant with actual flavor and basis in mythology
lmao

Let me get this straight. You're saying REVENANT is the "totally not like a living human" option that has tons of "flavor and a basis in mythology"? The race that IS JUST YOUR FUCKING PRE-DEAD ASS ALL OVER AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND NO REAL MOTIVATION OR FLAVOR PAST WHAT ANY NORMAL LIVING PERSON COULD HAVE (hatred of someone else and a desire for revenge)?
Repeat: lmao

>>52557949
>Objective morality

Does anybody even bother with this?

>>52557566
how can a skeleton have darkvision when he literally doesn't have eyes you knob

he should have blindsight

>>52558035
fuck tieflings to be quite fucking honest.

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>>52558027
Sounds fair but that wasn't specified

>>52558035
>My fun > your fun

Go fuck yourself with a cactus m80

>>52558027
What class would Alucard be?

>>52558035
>not playing objective morality

>>52558092
This is pre-SotN so he's obviously a Kenku Raven Warlock.

>>52558093
Using alignments is fine, but Forgotten Realms style cosmic good is terrible in every way.

>>52558069
Why not it's interesting to switch it up and see how people handle having to do the right thing and good even if others don't understand or hate you for it.

>>52557453
That would be all well and good if it didn't work in reverse, too. Say two adventurers are in town and want to get married. They have an incentive to wait until they're taking a short rest in a dungeon so they don't waste the combat bonus for being newlyweds.

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>>52557110
But anon, priests can cast spells

>>52558047
What would you include to make it less powerful? Vulnerability to bludgeoning seems a bit too much, so I'm aiming for something inbetween.

>>52558130
>but Forgotten Realms style cosmic good is terrible in every way
Unless, like, you know, you enjoy far-reaching consequences to your actions and actual moral dilemmas.

>>52558067
That's still better than what you're asking for: undeath with no special limitations or restrictions, tailor-made for idiots who just want to play something edgy or superficially special.

>>52558132
>Do the right thing
More like do the wrong thing, because you're following some sort of code like you're lawful. But we already have lawful and chaotic, so why do we need a good-neutral-evil that's based on how you follow an inhuman code?

>>52558162
It's not really too powerful at all.
Sure, immunity to poison is great, but that's literally all you're getting. +2 to dex is worse than most starting attributes, many races already have 60ft darkvision, etc.
What you have is a direct downgrade from the yuan-ti except dex instead of charisma. Though yuan-ti was overpowered anyway.

Needs some more flavour/ribbon things, like 'doesn't eat/drink/breathe'.

>>52558172
FR morality forces you to make choices like "Should I die to save one person, or continue living and let them dir so I can do more good later?"

>>52556842
pointless

>>52558186
>the limitation or restriction on revenant is literally
Nevermind, there is no limitation or restriction on being a Revenant. You keep "dying" as long as it takes to kill someone, unless you never kill him.

>>52558162
This guy will play it even if it's weak, so don't worry about making it weak.

Technically he shouldn't even be able to be a skeleton wizard, since skeleton's can't talk and therefore can't cast spells with verbal components.

>>52557110
>Which, amusingly, incentivizes lovestruck adventurers to get married in the middle of a dungeon rather than waiting to get to town.
In a mechanical sense, sure, but in a narrative sense it still makes more sense for them to actually have their wedding in town so they can, y'know, invite their friends and families.

>>52558234
not that guy but you can give them a silent spell style class feature, turning that weakness into a strength

>>52558210
You clearly don't understand how deontological ethics works in or out of the game.

>>52558172
>Moral dilemmas
You can have those easily without having to add some sort of cosmological court that gets pissed when you don't do what they say.

>>52558210
That only unique part of that dilemma under an objective morality system exists pretty much solely for classic Paladins, not any other class or even 5E Paladins. Everything about that situation bar the example of your character being a specially empowered Good figure, the loss of which is actually greater than the loss of anyone else, exists in subjective morality as well.

>>52556506
Ditch spike growth for a crossbow. Do it all by yourself, even against unarmored creatures. Flaming hot bolt head would be a real bastard to dig out.

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>>52557626
Their CR jumps to 10 if they're armed

>>52558186
is this some "ha ha i trole you" shit or what, because you keep posting as if you're arguing against your own position
or are you just too stupid to see what your own points are more harmful to yourself than the people you're arguing with

>>52558202
>More like do the wrong thing, because you're following some sort of code like you're lawful. But we already have lawful and chaotic, so why do we need a good-neutral-evil that's based on how you follow an inhuman code?

Man it's almost like it's an objective setting so there isn't any room to argue what is good and evil because they are built into the very fabric of the universe.

It's not for everyone and I don't recommend playing it all the time, but please stop acting like one is objectively better than the other because it's a matter of preference.

>>52558237
>implying adventurers have friends and families

Maybe in your campaign. If so, I kind of envy you.

>>52558234
>take skeleton statblock
>change languages from none to common
There, talking skeleton

>>52558237
>Implying PCs have families

I have yet to run a game where any of my friends had family members surviving or that they felt attached to. I blame DMs tending to "rocks fall, they die" for a cheap plot hook.

>>52558268
The cosmological court never gets pissed and doesn't mandate any particular action.

You also don't really have many moral dilemmas when LOL SHADES OF GREY, ANYTHING I WANT TO DO CAN BE JUSTIFIED IF I BULLSHIT HARD ENOUGH

I had to murder that man and loot his corpse so I could use the funds in his wallet to start a vegetable stand which would make enough profit for me to join the merchants guild which I would then take over and levy my immense mercantile influence into provoking a bloody peasant uprising which dethrones the corrupt monarchy and installs me as the head of governance where I will then rule justly and bring peace and contentment to the land. I'M THE GOOD GUY LOL

If your amazing moral problems in a subjective morality setting are things I've seen before in trashy videogames and anime, they're not actually that amazing. They're bad writing that requires everyone involved to turn their fucking brains off and accept a flawed premise from the get-go.

>>52558301
Being a cuck is a matter of preference, too. Doesn't protect someone from being laughed at for being a cuck.

People say stuff like 'It helps add moral dilemmas!' but that's not really a point when all it does it dumb morality down into 'Okay, killing people is bad. Don't kill people.' and thus when you're presented with a situation where you could kill people to save more people, you're left at 'Well, the right thing to do is just literally not kill people, so I just walk away' instead of actually thinking about it.

>>52558336
Any of my PCs*

>>52558311
How is that a wizard?

>>52558294
I certainly don't think the revenant is perfect, nor do I have any interest in playing one. But I'm reading that people hate it because it requires roleplaying to use, and this makes me feel good, because people who play RPGs but don't want to roleplay deserve to suffer.

>>52558336
What shitty, boring players/DMs.

>>52558343
>'Well, the right thing to do is just literally not kill people, so I just walk away'

No where is it stated you can't kill people, hell in fact you are obligated to smite the wicked be they monsters or people. Jesus it's almost like you have no clue what the setting actually entails and what is acceptable and not.

>>52557453
Remember to check with how your god feels about both gay marriage and gay Marriage.

>>52558342
>I had to murder that man and loot his corpse so I could use the funds in his wallet to start a vegetable stand which would make enough profit for me to join the merchants guild which I would then take over and levy my immense mercantile influence into provoking a bloody peasant uprising which dethrones the corrupt monarchy and installs me as the head of governance where I will then rule justly and bring peace and contentment to the land. I'M THE GOOD GUY LOL
This can go exactly the same way the other way around.
>I killed a guy to save an entire nation. I'M THE BAD GUY LOL
At least in the first case you have people thinking, 'Okay, was that really the right thing? Maybe he'll be accepted as good. Maybe he won't.'
But in the second case, it's just 'No, there is no argument, you are bad, the end, there is no moral dilemma.'

Without the shades of grey, there are no dilemmas or arguments or whatever. You could be the nicest and kindest guy in existence but be labelled as evil. What is that even supposed to mean?

I guess, then again, there are some dilemmas you can get out of it. It'd generally be a case of 'Doing the right thing' as opposed to 'Being selfish and not doing the right thing in order to preserve yourself as being good'.

Of course, usually none of this actually matters and so 5e has accepted that and says 'Yeah, uhh, alignments is just a thing. Who cares? Paladins can't detect alignment anymore.'

>>52558420
The wicked, yes, but killing innocents is Evil. Which means even sacrificing a few innocent lives to save countless innocents is Evil, but letting those innocents die by inaction is fine because you, personally, did not kill them.

>>52558343
You obviously don't understand objective morality.

Your problem here is that you're insisting there needs to be some thought into resolving a dilemma under subjective morality; that there is actually a meaningful discussion to be had or choice to be made when there are no moral consequences to your actions by design. Huh, if I kill this person, I can save all these other people. Well, I don't like this person or value these other guys more, so see ya, dipshit, this was the easiest bit of ethical calculus anyone has ever done. You quote Spock and are absolved of any porential wrongdoing.

Under objective morality, you must consider:
>Does my character know about objective Good and Evil? Does he care? If no to either, we function as a subjective morality setting.
>Do the people I'm going to kill or save know? Do those who care about them know? Does anyone involved care?
>How important, cosmically, are the people I'm going to kill compared to those I would save? How important am I? Am I at risk by killing them?
>Beyond the objective truth of the universe and the empowerment of various heavenly and fiendish forces which will either save or destroy the world eventually, can I personally conscience my actions? If it is objectively right to kill this group to save the larger one, can I live with murder or abandonment despite knowing I technically did right? And if it's objectively right to leave the masses to their fate, can I live with that knowing I technically did right? Was there some other choice I didn't try hard enough to find?

Every fucking nuance that exists in subjective morality settings exists in an objective one, often on multiple levels.
You can only ever have more complex debates and moral dilemmas with objective morality, never less. Even in the situation where you can reduce an action in OM to dead-simple moral calculus (I'm the Pope, I can't commit suicide to save one child from a kidnapper), the same is true in SM.

>>52558420
All I know is that there's this one bastard who goes on about how killing an orphanage in order to save, say, five orphanages from death is evil, because you killed an orphanage.


Which leads to
'Do I do the subjetcively right thing and save five orphanages from death but be labelled as evil, or do I just leave them and be a selfish prick keeping my good status?'

>>52555984
how is OoTa? any good?
we just started SKT only 1 session in.

>>52558433
>Paladins can't detect alignment anymore.
No one can.
Detect/Protect Good and Evil is completely different now.

>>52558433
>I killed a guy to save an entire nation. I'M THE BAD GUY LOL
Killing people isn't Evil in a setting like Forgotten Realms.

Killing certain people in certain ways without certain cause is Evil.
You are completely in the clear to behead some nefarious Sorcerer who has enthralled the people or is turning them into hideous mutants and slaves.
You're NOT in the clear to invite the idiot Prince out to brunch and snap his neck after refilling his teacup because the King is on his deathbed and this moron is next in line and if he ascends to the throne his incompetence will fuck everyone.
You're also NOT doing a good thing if you abduct the evil vizier who was responsible for poisoning the King and flay his flesh off in strips until he dies from the pain or blood loss.

>>52558452
Hey you do know and therefore should understand that it forces players to come up with as many solutions as possible to save as many as possible.

Critical thinking and inventive ways of playing to avoid such scenarios are a must.

So once again it's not for everyone but those who want to try shouldn't be discouraged because some asshats on a Russian troll training forum think it boils down to impossible situations because they refuse to try something different.

>>52558452
The Trolley Problem in a nutshell!

>>52558495
>All I know is that there's this one bastard who goes on about how killing an orphanage in order to save, say, five orphanages from death is evil, because you killed an orphanage.
It's
>are you justified in blowing up an orphanage full of innocent children to stop the lich inside from finishing his ritual that turns the entire country into zombies
and obviously the answer is no

Are attribute score increases based off character level or class level?

>>52558488
You shouldn't have to be influenced about some arbitrary cosmological factors when making such a decision. I don't really see how that adds much in beyond 'Okay, that guy was secretly an agent of the cosmos and you're now the most evil guy ever'.
Or, maybe they were a pope so they were obviously comsologically relevant? In which case, why were you reducing 'Do I kill the pope or kill five people' to 'Okay, obviously I kill the pope'?

It's true, maybe there's a bit less because subjective morality is just saying 'Yeah, this is all a stupid farce, alignment is really just something about personality, go forget about it' when objective morality is 'Oh, but there's also some extra guidelines that exist' at which point it's starting to feel like a second flavour of lawful-chaotic that's aligned roughly with good and evil but not quite.

As a DM, I don't see why you'd have to turn to these sorts of cosmological rules that people aren't expected to know. Instead, it's better to face people with dilemmas that actually make sense to them rather than some elder god such as having to choose which out of a group to kill.

So you have a group of people, and you have to kill one, subjective morality it's just something like 'Okay, who would this group survive best without?' for example, but while you say objective morality might add an extra layer of 'Also, I have to be careful about cosmological stuff' that might just take away from the original dilemma.

>>52558054
Good point.

Pity I'm no good with mechanics, otherwise I'd mock one up.

>>52558572
That's one of those situations where even if you know it's objectively right to let the kingdom get skele-nuked, your ass is gonna be real tore up about it and everyone will think you're a monster because they don't consider morality and consequences on the same cosmic scale that you do.

Now there's some character development.

>>52558627
class level

>>52558374
Wish spell

"I wish that skeletons could talk"

>>52558627
Class level - multiclassing loses you ASIs most of the time

>>52558495
In the setting you walk and attempt to bring those you can to justice. That is the way the system works for objective good vs evil, the more good people do evil things in the name of good the strong evil is in the end.

It's once again thinking in subjective terms in an objective setting because the character would know that the objective good thing to do is hunt those who burned the orphanages.

>>52558572
And in this case I don't even know what the fuck's going on

Are you confining yourself to evil by blowing up that orphanage, even though your character's clearly a saint?
Are you confining yourself to good by ignoring it, running as far away as possible and donating to the church instead?

So the good people are dicks who try to preserve their own 'goodness' at any cost, whereas the evil people are saintly people who would damn themself to save others?

>>52555918
>bit do/5egtrove
The mega trove is down, does anyone have a backup?

Also, does anyone have a mega with 4e stuff?

>>52556622
A barbarian doesn't HAVE to be some brute from the backwoods, I had a friend play a Barbarian with the soldier background. He was a professional soldier that would go apeshit once he hit a battlefield.

>>52558660
What? Who's casting Wish? Why does that make a talking skeleton a wizard?

>>52558714
I wish the skeleton was a wizard and could talk

>>52558650
How does that not happen in subjective morality?

You blow up the orphanage, and while the entire nation survives you'll be considered a monster. Because they weren't all in your shoes at that exact moment.

>>52555944
Only every thread

>>52558629
There are cosmic exceptions to unwitting action. You need to make a conscious choice. If you would otherwise be justified in killing this guy but for his secretly being "an agent of the cosmos", whatever that means, but it was obviously unclear that he was and you had every reason to believe he was being an evil shithead deserving of stabbing, you're good, shit's on the dead spacepope for not explaining himself while doing something that looked real bad. Fortunately you're not going to be in this situation very often because the circumstances you are justified for outright murdering a man and the means by which you can do it are such that it's very hard to have this kind of misunderstanding.

>As a DM, I don't see why you'd have to turn to these sorts of cosmological rules that people aren't expected to know.
Are they a Cleric or Paladin or some other devout follower with a direct line to their gods or empowering entities? Then they should probably know. If you're just a Fighter who likes to do Good (or Evil) but has no deeper connection to some divine being beyond saying your Praise Chaunteas or Hail Baals, there's no expectation for this.

And in your "kill a member of this group" example, subjective gives you a pathetically easy out; who's most useless or least good? Even without getting into cosmological, objective morality, a truly good person, even in a subjective setting, should find that bullshit.

>>52558712
The guy I am making is kind of disillusioned with the romantics of war and battle.

He despises knights because they are just as bloodthirsty and cruel on the battlefield than any normal person.

If I had to equate him to a popular figure I would have to say he is kind of like the hound minus the burns.

He went from professional soldier to sell sword and holds no allegiances because he thinks everyone is a cunt out to get him.

And he is prob right.

>>52557848
>>52557951
>>52557910

expanding on the scenario, the mind flayer is fugitive from a colony, captured by drow and kept captive while they negotiate with the elder brain for his return. the elder brain probably just wants to eat his brain to make sure their sneaky octopus secrets aren't seized by a rivaling colony or other psionic creatures, while the drow want to make a good deal for it.

that said, how would you rationalize keeping it alive?
how long can they go without brains, can the eat anything else?
i'm assuming the drow could care enough about the deal as to provide him with some dying slaves for lunch time but how often would that be necessary.

such majestic creatures and so little information on their wonderful life functions.

is there ever a time where it's socially acceptable to play the opposite gender?

>>52558806
If you are just playing them as a normal character and not being a perv

>>52558806
dedicated magical realm campaign

>>52558806
I don't see a problem with this.

I would totally play a warrior type with high bluff.

Pretend to be in distress then murder retards that try to white knight and save me.

>>52557594
Would that be core ranger or UA ranger? Assuming of course my DM okays UA multiclassing.

>>52558806
Just don't make jokes about their tits or flirt with the other male player characters.

>>52558671
>Are you confining yourself to evil by blowing up that orphanage, even though your character's clearly a saint?
Your character is only anything close to saintly in the eyes of ignorant mortals, who might still take umbrage at your detonation of a bunch of babies when there might have been another option. Your intention to save millions, noble as it was, still doesn't detract from the great evil you committed in the eyes of the Heavens, Hells, and cosmos, however, so the level on which this shit is actually consequential has branded you a baddie.

This may not be terrible if you weren't a very good person to begin with. The amount of evil done and the impact this has on the cosmos depends on what you were like before the action; if you were already an evil shithead, blowing up the orphanage does basically nothing; if you were neutral, extremely pragmatic angels might begrudgingly say that was for the best even though they can't publically condone such actions; if you were a good guy, you really shouldn't have done that; and if you were a 3.5-styled Paladin HOLY SHIT NIGGER WHAT HAVE YOU DONE IT WOULD HAVE BEEN WAY BETTER IF EVERYONE WAS ZOMBIES GOOD FUCKING GOD DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW IMPORTANT AND POWERFUL PURE PALADIN SOULS ARE JESUS CHRIST YOU JUST BIRTHED LIKE TWO MINI-MOLOCHS

>Are you confining yourself to good by ignoring it, running as far away as possible and donating to the church instead?
You're supposed to find another way to kill the fucking lich. If he completes the spell, welp, that sucks, but now you have a massive vengeance boner to sate as well.

>So the good people are dicks who try to preserve their own 'goodness' at any cost
Only those who are so good they are cosmically important, know that, and care.

>>52558777
I dodn't know which edition, maybe 2nd or maybe 3.5, but there's an entire book about the goddamn Illithid.

>>52558831
>Pretend to be in distress then murder retards that try to white knight and save me.
................because your character is an Evil twat who wants easy cash, or because you, OOC, really hate white knights?

>>52558759
Well, alright, at least there's the knowledge it doesn't matter for most people.

And how's the cosmological stuff going to make it any harder of an out?

Referring back to >>52558488
>Do the people I'm going to kill or save know?
This is something you'd consider in just a plain morality, too.
If they don't know and you're trying to kill them, a character has to face fighting people he really doesn't want to kill, which has its own problems.
>How important are the people?
Well, the one that's least good or weakest is probably the least important? I don't see the objective changing much about this other than 'Oh, this guy's a follower of my god, I'd better avoid killing him unless I have to'.
>Can I live with murder or abanadonment despite knowing I technically did right?
This is something you'd face on a subjective scale.

Yes, maybe I just don't know what objective morality is, but it sure is sounding like 'subjective morality' apparently means 'Your character can kill innocent people without even a sweat or tear and suffer no mental problems, and everybody immediately acknowledges why you did it.'

>>52558545
>No one can
As a matter of fact, chain warlocks can.

>>52558867
The first one.

I don't care if people want to white knight irl and get no pussy because of it.

>>52558806
DMing.

>>52558874
That's why the post ends with "objective morality can only be more complex than subjective, never less". That's not to suggest that subjective morality can never be complex; it can, but all that nuance AND MORE exists in objective morality.

It's Subjective+5.

>>52558702
Search an archive for the 4e trove

>>52558565
Yeah, I think I ultimately agree with you. It shouldnt be "do we do this ambiguously good/evil thing vs this other ambiguously good/evil thing", I think these dilemmas should be more "how do we solve the problem without doing either".

>>52558841
>Ignorant mortals
No, you'll appear saintly to those who know literally everything that was going on.
The ignorant mortals are the ones who'll scorn you, for they don't know what was going on at the time.

Still, it's sounding that by the paladin 3.5 stuff that a lot of this objective stuff has more to do with previous editions, and 5e's more focused on freedom of setting, even if it does focus heavily on FR. But then, I mean, we're not actually arguing over what the PHB says or what FR means, but whether it's a good thing to have objective morality or not.

And... I don't really see having an extra restraint against doing an already controversial action being anything useful. It sounds like stories like the probably paladin or something guy who had to replace Asmodeus would never happen because-
Actually, at the point where you go from 'good' to 'nice, but god of evil' I don't think you worry too much about angels coming down to smite you, because that was going to happen anyway.

>You're supposed to find another way to kill the lich
Why do you need objective morality in order to do that?
Most people already aren't inclined to kill an entire orphanage if they don't have to, and are likely to avoid doing that.

>>52558910
I can at least give that, and I'm probably wrong about something I said earlier with subjective stuff having better dilemmas, though I'm starting to see a lot of these 'objective' cases are really just adding further restrictions on ideas you're already going to be very cautious about taking, which actually kind of limits your options rather than broadens them.

>>52558901
the only valid answer

>>52559033
The greater options exist on the storytelling level, not the in-character action level. You can craft far more complex moral narratives and challening dilemmas, even if the PCs are a little more hamstrung by what they "SHOULD" do. Everyone has their breaking point, though, and knowing something is objectively "the right thing" doesn't mean a PC will do it.

In a situation like suicidal self-sacrifice, a 3.5 Paladin (or a 5E one if you're going full godly-empowerment objective morality stuff again) reaaaally has to think about what situations it's worth blowing themselves up for, whereas that bar is way, way lower in a subjective setting. Objectively, your Paladin's going to be getting bad looks from peasants and even the other Good members of his party for being a "coward" all the time.

>>52558841
>Your intention to save millions, noble as it was, still doesn't detract from the great evil you committed in the eyes of the Heavens, Hells, and cosmos, however, so the level on which this shit is actually consequential has branded you a baddie.
But you can't have "objective morality" unless it's built into the frabric of the universe and is therefore omnipresent and omniscient. Therefore your while you gain karmic badness for killing innocents, you also gain karmic goodness for saving thousands of people. Whether this goodness outweighs the badness is up to the rating system of the cosmic system. And this rating system can't be malleable, otherwise it's subjective.

What's the most number of attacks a Mystic can make in a turn?

>>52558806
Sometimes it's okay in real life, but only as a 'one-off' type thing. It's something you might do after four characters to spice things up, but not something you should show up with on the first occasion.

>>52559130
Well, with the paladin not killing themself, the bar is still pretty damn high. Subjectively, he should preserve his life not because some cosmos tells him he's important, but simply because he's important.
If the paladin continues to live, he could kill potentially many monsters as he has done in the past which could save potentially many people.
Sure, it won't cause all of heaven to detonate in some big explosion, but is that really necessary?

>>52559191
All of them.

>>52558974
The main problem with playing an objective setting is having a DM who can handle it and players that are up to playing one.

It's about making the easiest route true easiest but has repercussions that are wider than just one plane.

It adds that internal struggle because you know by just doing "this one little thing" it's easier and will for sure work. However doing so, especially as a paladin, will cause far worse things to occur.

>>52559173
>this rating system can't be malleable, otherwise it's subjective
It exists on a sliding scale. The same good act performed by a saint makes less good than performed by a devil, and vice-versa.

The forces of good want to redeem evil, and the forces of evil want to corrupt good for this reason.

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>That "Ceremony" spell in the new UA

How long until some powergamers decide to marry their characters before a big fight for the buff?

>>52559290
I'll bet it's already happened somewhere

>>52559290
>implying there's a problem with that
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkIJYrjUYyQ
do you even power of love

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>>52559322
Do I ever.

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Anon from yesterday who was asking questions pertaining to the Dryad Queen in my campaign.

She's creating her own sort of "Chimera" to defend her city and the surrounding forest from brutes, savages, and criminals.

First head is the head of a Dire Goose. Considering the middle head and body to be that of a Giant Spider. Now it has spider climb and the wings of a goose.

What about the final head?

>>52559229
>It exists on a sliding scale. The same good act performed by a saint makes less good than performed by a devil, and vice-versa.
That's fine and makes sense, as we simply plugged a variable into the non-malleable equation. But when you think about it, it means that the evil person who has less qualms about killing to save does more good than a saint who struggles to make the decision to kill for the greater good. This works great for flip flopping people. And it also points towards the evil people taking the easy way out whereas a good person would normally spend as much effort trying to find another way until this was their last resort.

This sounds easy, succinct, fullproof, but it's really not unless everyone knows about the existence of the objective morality and accepts it. If there are populous that don't, then you have to have both the objective morality of the cosmos and the subjective morality of the ignorant.

>>52559191
>>52559216
How? Highest number I can get is 13 attacks.

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How are Aasimar women like as lovers/wives?

>>52559362
You don't get Good for saving everyone from zombification, is where this whole thing gets tied together. You get Good for killing the lich, but it's one fucking lich, and whether he was having a snack and minding his own business or five seconds away from ending the world doesn't really enter into the number of GBP you get.

>>52559395
Less than Half as good as getting a real celestial woman to fuck

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>>52559395
They all have daddy issues.
Also, this is their daddy.

>>52559395
They're either vanilla or depraved and there is no in between.

>>52559395
I only fuck Aasimar descended from guardinals. They like it in the ass.

>>52559322
why does a robot have teeth like that
I knew these gook robot shows had terribad writing but that's just silly

>>52558404
It sucks, next character I roll is gonna be some type of warrior, not sure if Barb, Fighter or Paladin, who is adventuring to become the hero his daughter thinks he is.

>>52559412
If the system can't account for the prevention of good or evil acts, then that means the system would deem a person who let's more innocents die in order to later harvest greater cosmic good favor is more good than a person who cares not for themselves and simply wants to save more people.

To me, this means the system is flawed. But that's because of my own subjective views on what is good. Of course, the reality is that we're trying to create an objective system out of something that we as 'creators of the universe' view as subjective. So it's logical for it to be flawed, and not actually objective from our OoC standpoint.

>>52559473
Because it's a combination biological-mechanical Gundam intended as a testbed for self-evolution technologies, but a flaw in its programming made it go berserk in the classical AI sense ("gotta save the world, oh shit humans are fucking up the world, best way to save the world is to destroy all humans") and just went fucking nutzo.

It has teeth because of its organic components (including absorbing numerous people, and briefly using one specific person as a weird heart battery), and a bajillion of them because it's malfunctioning and self-replicating like a literal cancer.

>>52559562
This sounds a lot like an Evangelion inspiration if it came first.

>>52555918
>>52557375
The Mega doesn't have Barrowmaze 5e in it, is that file too hot? If it's not going to get bad attention and get the trove taken down I can share the pdf.

>>52559562
okay so why is the badly armored guy and his portable fleshlight in a dress standing outside of their heavily armored robosuit when faced with such an adversary when all that was holding him in pace was silly string?

>>52559589
Evangelion features exactly one robot that gets blown up in the same episode and the rest of the show is about actual fucking alien angels wearing metal armor.

If you want to talk Eva inspirations, there's a Mazinger spinoff manga and Juushin Liger for most of the specifics of the Evas, and Baldios for the overall tone of the series.

Need some ideas

Warforged TWF samurai

I gave him a mega man like upgrade where he has a blue crystal imbedded into his hand - and can deal an extra 1d6 up to 3d6 to his target and himself as electricity that flows through his blade and arm.


They killed a big boss dragon and searching its corpse, he hasn't gotten anything in awhile and need some ideas on neat little flavor things I can give him. Green gem with some power.

>>52559621
Uh no I meant in that the giant robots aren't robots at all and are actually giant cyborgs who were brought into existence through almost unholy fuckery.

>>52559619
Its a super robot show about punching racial stereotype robot tournaments. Its cam is fuck.

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>>52559608
It's just not something I've had shared with me or seen shared around. If you have it I can clean it, send it to [email protected].

How is Primeval Thule? It's been a while since it was released and I wonder how's it's turned out. Worth taking stuff from?

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Are your theives cute?

>>52559539
Speaking only for Forgotten Realms: it's not flawed because that's simply the way things are. It's no more fucked up than gravity having the constant that it does or there being this amount of matter vs. this amount of anti-matter, or iron having X many electrons.

The universe arose and created various energies, and because beyond even morality the whole thing operates under consensus reality, certain actions empower those energies. Those actions were reached entirely arbitrarily, and FROM THAT POINT ON, "life", be it mortal, fiendish, or angelic, developed. They did not shape the rules so much as they were shaped by the rules. The act of murder wasn't decided on as evil by a cosmic force, but a predetermined evil act was decided upon as murder by intelligent beings.

Even angels and demons are the puddle that's found itself in a nice little pothole.

How can I implement 2e-style multiclassing into 5e?

Am I an idiot for wanting this?

>>52559644
Well, the giant robots are all giant robots, it's specifically just that giant robot that's got biological technology in it. There are tons of bio-robots in the mecha genre; some are hybrids, and others are more or less fully biological with a few control mechanisms slapped into them. Eva has biological creatures with computers shoved in by humans, same as the bug robots of Dunbine.

>>52559619
Because for whatever reason, people who are fucking pumped enough can beat the shit out of giant robots in the G Gundam universe. Master Asia is a regular-ass old man and he trashes giant robots on the regular because his kung fu is THAT GOOD.

>>52559670
My thief is a dwarven hobo who wears full plate, talks to a rock on a stick, and teleports everywhere. He's whatever the opposite of cute is.

>>52555918
I showed my players the Ceremony spell, and now there taking about having characters specifically designed to be married, converted, etc. at some point in out next campaign (likely just before entering a dungeon) in order to take advantage of the bonuses. How should I feel about tactical marriage?

>>52559670
My thief would contemplate murder if someone called him that, then sweat remembering he's already on thin ice with the paladin as is.

>>52559513
3:10 to Yuma like a motherfucker. Paladin would probably be too caught up in doing good for its own sake, rather than for dignity and child's respect.

>>52559803
I think it's pretty silly that WotC put that out and actually thought it was a good idea. Instead of doing something that actually contributes to the rp it's a purely metagame spell.

In other words you should shake your head at your players.

>>52559803
It really depends on how stern you want to be about it. You can take a soft-handed approach and say that the spell would require them actually wanting to get married (IC reasons, etc.), but the hard-handed approach would be to have the spell fail since the characters might obviously not be doing it for the spirit of marriage, conversion, etc. Or just immolate them in divine fire.

>>52559688
In universe, it wouldn't be flawed, it would just be, yeah. The problem is everyone needs to know of the universes ways and their subjective opinion needs to be shaped by it. Because if they aren't, then you need to have both objective morality of the universe and subjective morality of the people.

Having everyone be omniscient of the ways of the universe if a very hard thing to do. I'm willing to claim that it's even an impossibility. And that's without even going into whether everyone would agree with it like mindless drones.

>>52555973
spells do not stack.

>>52559803
You're the DM. Just tell them the only mechanical benefit to marriage or conversion is tax-related.

>>52559865
What adds so much to the complexity of morality under that system is that most people DON'T know that's how it works. The few guys with special knowledge have to operate within that framework and try to justify their seemingly selfish actions to people who are too short-sighted to care in most cases.

>hey guys we should do somethign about global warming before our entire state floods
>no i don't believe it also the price of gas would go up five cents a gallon so fuck youuuuuuuuuu
Except we're talking liches and livestock.

So I'm trying to come up with a cool arcane archer build, but am having trouble for a couple reasons.

1. I don't want to go the bard-cher route. Not that I have anything against it, but I've done it before and it isn't really the feeling I'm going for this time. But it might be a solid fallback if I just can't find anything else I like.

2. I can't decide between a fighter EK and a feylock moonbow user (assuming my DM is cool with UA). Or even potentially some kind of cleric (maybe even nature because I could choose which elemental damage to apply).

3. I don't like the UA arcane archer, it's pretty shit.

For the EK I have a couple concerns. I was thinking of reflavoring my wizard cantrips as different elemental shots. For example, firebolt and ray of frost.
Unfortunately it doesn't seem like the 7th level ability is very good, because taking two shots with a regular bow is often better than 1 cantrip + 1 bow shot. Especially if I were running sharpshooter and landed the shots.
Is there a way I can reliably buff that cantrip damage? Might make it worth it.

For the feylock it seems that the moonbow would basically be the only shot I would ever need to take, with the occasional eldritch blast thrown in for when I want to push someone back/hit more people. But for single target, it'd be moonbow all day everyday.

Nature cleric... I kinda like that it's nature themed. But the channel divinity sort of sucks ass unless the DM is willing to throw you a bone. I could probably nature it up better with feylock by simply taking at-will speak with animals, anyway.

Thoughts?
EK also has benefits of being a bigger hit die and a lot more ASIs. So more max stats and feats (yay feats). I guess I'm just afraid I'll do very little actual magic-ing with my shots.

Lastly... I've also thought about just being a straight up evocation wizard and reflavoring all my spells into arrows. Fireball = explosive arrow and such.

>>52555984
My group is purposefully passing on OotA purely because they just finished CoS and didn't want to immediately jump back into a low light long arc with a limited ecosystem. We will eventually but a departure is needed first.

I'm looking forward to White Plume Mountain, then maybe giants (just arrived in the mail today)

So a player in my party playing a Kobold just predominantly grew to the Large size catagory. They're a rogue and I am trying to modify their stats slightly to represent their increased size. Not sure what to do with their HP. Im thinking. Of having them increase it 50 or 75% their max.

What happened was they entered a crazed wizard's tower and activated an invention of his that basically does a more intense version of the wild magic table.

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Do Aarakocra make good Bards?

>>52559842
That does make sense, the only way to make it work for the paladin is he's going out to make the world a better place for her, or making it a whole wife is higher society and he's just a knight who doesn't want to embarrass her.

A Barbarian using rage to make sure he gets home would definitely work, or a soldier/guard kinda idea.

The next thing is to find the options for Fighter and Barbarian that fit.

>>52559948
>Aarakocra
>allowed in most games

No. Though kenku do.

>>52559955
>not a Warlock who needs to become the hero his daughter thinks he is because he signed away his daughter's soul to his patron in exchange for his powers and only through some convoluted bullshit about the power of love can he avoid consigning her to eternal bondage to his own dark master, though he himself will be damned regardless

>>52559948
I've got a friend doing that right now because of Kass.
It's kinda fucking dumb because it's a reference. But it also makes sense that a bird should be able to sing. So yeah, why not.

>>52559803
I had a similar discussion with my DM, and he said that he wouldn't allow the bonuses unless we had a good reason to get and stay married, but that reason did not have to be love. He also said he really liked the idea of two players getting married right before entering a dungeon in case they didn't make it out alive.

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>>52559974
>Aarakocra
The only way to make monks good

>>52559912
would a reflavored Alchemist Gunsmith not feel right to you?

>>52559912
Nature Archer, hmmm... you mean ranger?

Sunite Cleric here. Heard you guys are considering getting married for the bonuses.
Just want to say that you're all fags. Not that there's anything wrong with that, we don't discriminate, but it is pretty gay.

>>52559907
Here's the thing though. By having moral dilemmas in a morally objective universe, you've introduced subjective morality. This means that you need to have two alignments, one for the universe and people in the know and one that describes the tenets of ignorant people and people trying to manipulate their objective alignment. While that can create an interesting dynamic, the rules governing the game in which "objective morality" exists does not support the dual morality it needs to not be flawed.

Basically, objective morality is a sham.

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>>52560087
>sham
So close, Anon.

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>>52559986
I'm trying to play a man with a purpose, not a borderline anime protagonist. That and playing a warlock never interested me.

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>>52560211
>I'm trying to play a man with a purpose
godspeed, anon

>>52560211
Last character I had with a true purpose wanted to make the best fruit salad the universe had ever seen, which is pretty anime protagonist now that I think about it.

>>52560026
It's okay, but again not so much what I'm feeling. Since those are once per turn attacks. Another reason why I'm hesitant to go wizard because then I'd basically just be dropping one bomb a round, as I would with artificer. But to your credit, I do think I like artificer more than wizard now that I think about it for the purposes of this. Will consider it. I don't love the mechanical servant feature though, as those kind of things often becoming more of a liability than a boon later on.

>>52560033
Hah, you got me there. But was more interested in the extra magic damage they do as part of their divine strike in reference to the cleric.
The nature-part isn't a must by any means. It was more just a nod that nature/archer types fit well within a nature vibe. If it were the main goal, I'd probably do a tempest/ranger build and shoot everything with lightning.

>>52560237
it's dumb

>>52559670
Aren't we all theives. We go kill people and take their stuff.

>>52559735
Does anyone in this thread even know how 2e multiclassing worked?

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>>52560229
Thanks m8

>>52560237
That actually sounds pretty funny, and yes.

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>>52556926
Lies

>>52560137
Thankfully 5e doesn't do much of anything mechanically regarding alignments. If someone wants to use a dual alignment system to address the flaws of an objective morality cosmos, I have no qualms playing in that game.

>>52557858
I assume you mean level 20 pcs, and not a group of 20 pcs. What cr4 creature are you thinking of?

>>52559948
Whats the big deal with the damn bird. Sure I liked his little hints, but why the obsession with him

>>52560377
Barafags

>>52560087
Personally my understanding is that those who do not operate in the frame work of the objective do not reap the rewards, however they also do not suffer the consequences therefore any act they do can be justified with a good enough reason. This has no impact other than the person's own beliefs and feelings.

Where as the ones who do operate with in objectivity can have their own doubts there own thoughts and know that "yes this act would save more but it is evil and I will have to live with that for the rest of my days and possibly beyond." It puts the person in a position of trying to come up with new and different ways to overcome the obstacles to avoid being stuck in those situations. This impacts the very cosmos and can lead to far worse evil should a player take this path and fall.

>>52560393
Whats?

>>52560422
Bara is gay drawn porn with huge muscular dudes.

>>52560409
That's an interesting take on it that would allow for only one alignment. I'd have to explore more into what it would mean for characters and the world, but I'd definitely acknowledge it as a potential solution if not already a solution.

>>52559948
>Spend the first 15 years of your life building fame for yourself
>Die because your race only lives for that long

Aarakocra need a buff

>>52560279
That just makes us murder hobos. Thieves can actually take stuff without killing people. Not to say that's how it will end up, but they at least have that option available to them.

>Rogue's Turn: I draw my shortbow and ready an arrow to fire at the first creature to attack the paladin.
>Wizard's Turn: I ready an action and prepare to cast Firebolt at the first creature to attack the paladin.
>Paladin's Turn: I move up and attack the nearest goblin.
>Goblin's Turn: It attacks the paladin and get's raped from all angles
Is readying actions in this manner allowed in game, per RAW? Sorry new to the game

>>52559395
They are hot prudes.

>>52560571
Yes. You can't just delay your turn, but you can ready a specific action in response to a specific trigger. When the trigger happens, you can use your reaction to do the thing you prepared.

>>52560512
Why would a race that short-lived have a wisdom bonus?

>>52560571
Pretty much. Those characters are expending their reaction to actually perform the stated moves, though.

Frankly I think it's all shit and we houserule delayed turns at my table so whatever.

>>52560571
Yes. It's only really useful if your party knows that something's about to come around the corner.

>>52560672
Ok, so things like "I ready my bow and prepare to fire at the first thing through the door" and then when a goblin runs through, you expend your reaction and shoot it. Nice.

Can you say, "I prepare to move to the next ally who takes damage and cast cure wounds on him"?

>>52560571
As long as it happens during the same round, yes. They can't ready an action to take place during the next round.

Also it takes their reaction to act, so they can't do it and also use their reaction for something like an attack of opportunity.

Also, don't forget to apply positional stuff. If they weren't very smart in their positioning, I'm willing to bet that the paladin is providing half cover for the goblin. (You can also use the variant rules on cover to sometimes hit the paladin with the attack if it misses the goblin but would still hit the paladin.)

New thread >>52560738

Oh, delaying a turn seems like the natural answer to what I am asking, but it's illegal per RAW? Maybe a rogue saying, "I delay my turn and act after the paladin" or a healer saying "I delay my turn and act after the fighter" would be better. Why is that illegal?

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I want to make Kenku slightly better for my next game. Which of these options sounds best?

>Climb Speed
>Limited Flight (x rounds/rest)
>Limited Flight (fall at end of turn)
>Some kind of gliding ability (are there established rules for this?)