Why did Magic the Gathering become so prudish?

>>52431707
Angry PTA mobs.

>>52431707

Because ugly people project their ugly views.

>>52431707
When did people start thinking that just because I don't want to hear about your disgusting fetish that makes me a prude?

>>52431707
>why does a for-profit company take actions intended to increase their profits

Nobody knows.

>>52431759
This

>>52431707
>jungle-woman
>hairless pits

>>52431707
You can't market something for kids and have it be sexual in the US firstly. Secondly, they're attempting to expand their product to a group that demands that women be never be portrayed as more attractive than they are. And thirdly, they don't loose anyone by changing it.

>>52432489
Elves tend to be very sparse on body hair.

I don't see the problem.

If I want to look at titties, I can just go to the club, pick up a girl and look at her titties. Or I grab some porn. Or hell, I open my notebook and look at some of the nudes I've drawn.

If I see some bikini warrioress that clearly isn't depicting a gladiatrix or another warrior woman that fights for entertainment instead of survival on my MtG cards, I just get this rage about the utter stupidity of combat bikinis.

Also fuck off back to Plebbit, you fucking MRA faggot.

>>52434938
I bet you get salty over people occasionally wanting their food to be both nutritious and delicious.

>>52431707
Political correctness is the poison that ruins everything.

It could be argued that they just want the art style changed but the timing and how WoTC acts all signs point to trying to be "progressive" to appeal to a group that would never buy their product.

Before it was Christians calling everything demonic.

>>52431707
Man, I was building a 5c All-Women EDH deck and decided to throw her in just for the heck of it to piss people off. Too bad it never took off.

>>52436133
>but the timing and how WoTC acts all signs point to trying to be "progressive" to appeal to a group that would never buy their product.

How many years are people going to repeat this before they realize that Wizards isn't going under?

>>52431707
It was a continuous thing but I'd say around 2007 when "geek culture" really started gaining steam. It was probably part of the same shift towards trying to bring more people into the game along with Planeswalkers.

>>52431758
>"hey, can we maybe have a bit more sideboob or something?"
>"WOW WHAT A DISGUSTING FETISH EEWWWW"

You're either a prude or a raging homosexual.

There's internet now. If you want to look at pron open a new tab.

Alternatively, the standards for what are attractive have shifted. We live in increasingly conservative times with both far left and right polemics eating away at the liberated liberal consumer subject as seen in the post sexual revolution. Both missing the part where their desires are simply being repackaged with a different box into a diversified market.

Because art like that objectifies women.

>>52431707
That looks more retarded than sexy though.

Look, shit like that sets a tone, you can't just throw a random sideboob wherever without it compromising the overall feeling of the game. Art like that was fine when they were going for pulpy fantasy but right now pulp fantasy has niche appeal while everyone and their yaoi pillow grew up reading fantasy YA stuff where teenage girls with daemon familiars or orphan boys with a head injury are the hero and that's the tone they're going towards now.

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>>52431707
This was censored by Wizards in 1997

>>52436854
Well yeah, that looks like shit.

>>52436854
>>52431707
you know what if this is the general quality of cheesecake from wotc then maybe it's good they stopped trying

>>52432689
>You can't market something for kids and have it be sexual in the US firstly.
The clothing industry disagrees.

>>52431707
When Wizards realized pandering to 0.5% of their player base really pays off to white knight nu-males.

When did Feminists become so Puritanical?

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>>52436854
>This was censored by Wizards in 1997
B-b-but tumblr wasn't around in 1997!

>>52436989
Show me one ad with sexy clothing aimed at kids.

On second thought I don't want to end up on a watchlist

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>>52437042
Firstly, you have to understand that all of these progressive group-advocacy movements always put the movement's survival over the loyalty to the groups they claim to advocate for.

But to answer you question, it all started when they started caring about gender roles. That's when feminism started becoming more choice-negative - after all, if the movement wants women to abandon traditional gender roles, women chosing to become housewives and prostitutes hurts the movement. And remember, the movmement always comes first. Once you become choice-negative, becoming sex-negative is the next logical step.

>>52437254
I can think of those 90's video game ads slapped in the middle of video game magazines.

>>52437256
>feminism as a unified body
>progressive as a pejorative
>clear separation between representation and population
>when they started caring about gender roles
>choice negative

there's so much retarded in this post it hurts

>>52437256

It was rhetorical. The whole "choice negative" spiel you just gave me has very little to do with it. When you track the movement you can see that it clearly derailed in the 70's and 80's and became a bourgeoise movement unaware of its own biases.

>>52437254
Have you never seen a toddler wearing yoga pants with "Juicy" written on the ass? Maybe don't answer if you want to avoid that watch list.

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>>52436854

>>52431707
Same reason this board did. Moralfags everywhere.

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>>52437446

Who else besides a liberal faggot would work for WOTC? Fantasy games aren't designed by engineers, they're designed by idealists.

>>52437514

>uses liberal to mean leftist
>associates leftism with idealism

It's kind of funny to hear stupid people talk.

>>52437383
The first one was a mistake; I meant to write feminists, not feminism in all. I know it's not monolithic.

I didn't use progressive as a pejorateve, although I can see why you'd think that. Honestly, I used progressive because it's an accurate representation of the group I described, and the label they themselves use.

You are confusing population of the advocacy group (what you call representation) and population the group claims to advocate for. Of the two, only the former is of any importance to the topic at hand, since they're the one shaping public discussion.

I don't get what's wrong with this point. Yes, when they started caring about gender roles. First they wanted sufferage, then they wanted employment, then they wanted to abolish gender roles.

I am also not sure what you meant with you last point, also. Do you have a problem with the words 'choice-negative,' or do you not believe me when I say that there are influential choice-negative feminists?


>>52437395
It has more to do with it than you imagine. When the movement becomes bourgeoise/elitist, its members think they know better than the population they advocate for. So when that population acts in a manner they disagree with, the members think it's the population who are wrong, not the other way around.

>>52437514
A lot of the original Magic Devs including Richard Garfield were mathematicians, and at least one of them was an Aerospace Engineer.

>>52437544

Leftism is unbridled idealism, what fuck are you taking about?

>embrace the notion of equality
>it's really just bastardized Christianity
>oh shit, turns out that people are objectively inferior or superior
>quick! we need a powerful state to make everyone equal
>shit fuck, it literally never works anywhere in the world
>but we're going to keep trying!

>>52431707
To a certain degree, it isn't even prudishness. Between Theros, Tarkir, Innistrad, Kaladesh, and Amonkhet, we have a lot more worlds based on real-Earth cultures. As a part of that, they tend to use clothing designs inspired by actual historical fashion, as opposed to random strips of leather meant to look sexy.

Now, admittedly, Amonkhet should have had more toplessness, but looking at Battle for Zendikar block will show you a lot of elves wearing even less than your pic.

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>>52436422
And yet I regularly see women in even sluttier outfits at this mythical land of magic and mystery called "the beach".

Women objectify women. And I'm not exagerating, they LITERALLY objectify themselves.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/02/090216-bikinis-women-men-objects.html
>Brain scans revealed that when men are shown pictures of scantily clad women, the region of the brain associated with tool use lights up
To put this in simple English: if you whine about children's card games objectifying women but wear a bikini yourself, you're both literally and figuratively A FUCKING TOOL.

>>52437683
Kill yourself. No one wants you here /pol/ sissy.

Eat some pills. Bath with a toaster. Slit your guts.

>>52437683

Christ, you are literally unable to hear your own thought process and how cringey it sounds to non stormfaggots.

>>52437683
It works quite well when you focus on equality of opportunity, rather than equality of outcome.

>>52437995
It's so stormfag, you can't even tell if "it's just a bastardized Christianity" is supposed to be a good thing or a bad thing.

>>52437923
>>52437995
he's right

>>52438034
Yes, but his argument was fucking awful, so he hurt his "side" more than he helped them.

Is this just me, or does anyone else prefer people who are "wrong" to people who are "right" but can't explain why to save their life?

>>52438034

If you asked him to expound on what he was saying you would hear nothing but pseudoscience and cringe, and this is coming from a guy who favors a mandatory level of genetic engineering for the general populace.

>>52437544
In his defense, Classical Liberalism (i.e. the Enlightenment ideologies of Locke et. al.) was how the political left was born. So it's not entirely wrong to use "liberal" to mean leftist, it's just a little inaccurate.

>>52438885
That's also how the political left was born. Hell, you could even say conservatism arose as a reaction to the French Revolution. Yet nobody would call conservatism or fascism liberal. It's just that the age of liberalism completely transformed the political landscape. This is why people for example trace communism and fascism and modern republicanism to Rousseau. Not that he was a commie (Marx practically never cites him) but because the French Revolution changed everything.

This doesn't make the American definition of liberalism any less retarded or confusing. It's just yet another strange quirk of American society, like measuring distance in footsize or having creationism as part of the education system.

>>52438885

We both know that's not how he meant it.

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>>52436854
They even made a joke card about back when companies were allowed to not take themselves so seriously

>>52438929
>>52438935

As the prior commenter's subsequent remarks indicate, his primary complaint with Liberalism is its embrace of the fallacy of the Tabula Rasa, and the effort to artificially impose an artificial equality on a society composed of unequal individuals and groups. This fallacy lies at the root of most Leftwing ideologies; from Classical Liberalism to Communism, so it's not unfair to lump them all together on that basis. The prior commenter may not have expressed the idea in that way, but it seems to be what he meant.

>>52431707
when did cardboard sorters forget to put "mtg" in the title or OP?

>>52439079
>artificially impose an artificial

Sigh... I need to stop trying to write when I'm tired.

>>52438079
>Yes, but his argument was fucking awful, so he hurt his "side" more than he helped them.
>I feel this way therefore it's right

>>52439392
You're gonna need a couple more lines of greentext before I can tell what the fuck you're trying to say.

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>>52438079
My favorite kind of person is the kind who doesn't feel the need to start an ideological crusade wherever they go. I don't play MtG for insightful political commentary from WotC nor the playerbase.

I don't care if they are right or wrong, or if they agree or disagree with me, I do not want to hear about it. I came here for cardgames.

>>52439079

The prior commentator hates liberalism because social liberalism calls loudly for forms of legal equality that hurt his feelings. Stop trying to intellectualize this poster's position.

>>52434938
>combat bikinis
>clearly a healer class type
>on a card that heals you

is there any reason you haven't off'd yourself yet

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Shit guys. My argument is that left-wing thought is fundamentally idealistic. The end goal of left-wing politics is a kind of utopian fantasy.

Why are cards so prudish? Well, because American leftists are the new Puritans. WOTC is a business based on the creation of fantasy worlds and left's new moral prescriptions bleed into them. Is it really so hard to believe that idealists enjoy creating their own fantasy worlds?

>>52439537

And you hate the prior commenter because he hurts your feelings by denying equality as an ideal and objecting to the use of the power of law (i.e the state) to enforce it. You both offend each other. However inarticulate his rhetoric, he has a fair point to make. As Aristotle once said, "The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal."

It is an injustice to treat people as equals if they aren't actually equals. It's unfair to pay people an equal wage if they do unequal work. It's an injustice to treat a law abiding person the same as you would a criminal. Most fair minded people would agree with those statements. What trips us up is when we move beyond judging individuals and are forced to confront inequalities between groups. No one should be surprised that efforts to ameliorate inequalities between groups produce resentment and backlash within the groups being disadvantaged to ensure equality, as those disadvantages are a form of injustice in their own right.

>>52439666
The people that complain are in the vast majority of cases not creators themselves, but self-styled critics that care more about tearing down what they find disagreeable than building up what they find agreeable, and they don't support products that have changed to align with their complaints because they care nothing about the product (Marvel comics felt this particularly hard).

This sort of thing has been occurring across all mediums of entertainment, and the content is changing even when the creators are not. It is very obvious that companies are bowing to pressure when they make changes like what wotc has done with regards to depictions of women, and that this is not (or at least not entirely) a result of the beliefs of the creators changing.

>>52439772

No, he offends me because the ideas that he and his ilk have about the underlying metrics of superiority and inferiority are based on nonsense.

>>52434938

Have you considered that maybe she's dressed that way for her own comfort and not for your sexual gratification, you disgusting piece of shit?

>>52439833

Which metrics and values are you rejecting, exactly? IQ? Crime statistics? GDP? Literacy rates? Toliets per capita?

>>52439833

>nonsense

That's debatable, though I would acknowledge that metrics referencing I.Q. or earning power are certainly superficial. The real issue everyone dances around is the question of moral equality. Who is a better person or group? How do you define "better" in such a context? Such questions could be argued from any number of positions are not easily resolved. That being said I can understand the position taken by some that holding groups to be socially equal, when those groups do not make equal contributions to society, is it's own form of injustice.

Our desire for social equality is deeply rooted in western thought and custom. Western folk cultures were extremely egalitarian in terms of the social status of men within a tribe, clan, or other kin group. That tribal egalitarianism has manifested as a universalist ethos within western civilization; a desire to treat all people as equals or at least hold them to the same standards. Sadly, our history does not give a reasonable observer much hope that this is feasible when applied to all groups. Attempts to impose equality by tearing down aristocracies, or even race and gender based social barriers, has typically resulted in chaos, extremist regimes, and widespread blood shed instead of achieving the goal of an egalitarian society.

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>>52439772
>>52439833
>unironically using "I'm offended" as an actual argument

Holy shit.

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>>52440157
That offends me, anon.

>>52440157

Does it offend you? Remember, offense, is not simply hurt feelings. It's the sense that what someone has done is a violation of some significant taboo. Do you think it is beyond the pale of civil discourse to cite moral outrage in response to some else's claims?

>>52431707

I warned the board about what would happen after D&D5th changed certain monster descriptions and depictions. Back then I received at least three angry answers from prudes and a possible feminist playing dumb about those implications. It's like they always played in those magical realm groups and the trauma left them scared of tits for life.

Hold your buttocks tight, cause WotC is going to kiddify things as much as they can in order to pander to new demographics.

>>52437452

Nigga, chill, I'm a moralfag and that doesn't mean that I'm for prudishness. In fact a measure of sexual elements is necessary for good roleplaying and world building.

>>52439666
>>52439810
...It's also important to note that the first ones to oppose this crap change were in fact moderate leftists and centrists. Remember the scandal that we still can't mention, the one that drove original moot away? Most people riding that train were in fact moderate leftists.

Sure, current critics of pop culture are from a very virulent strain of radical left but they don't represent all forms of idealism nor are the center of any broad group of political or economical beliefs.

>>52440422
I don't think it will get much worse. Sure, it's pretty shitty now but I am very skeptical that they will be hiring many more SJW types; not because of an ideological change in the company but because the hard left will soon be dying off.

There will still be dykes and "oooh don't you think having black people wear a suit means that ones that don't are thugs is racist?" running around but it won't be in vogue to act like that anymore and the ones that won't shift with the paradigm will be unhirable street shouting lunatics.

>>52431758
This is a collectible card game played exclusively by nerds, unless you go looking for it, YOU WILL NEVER SEE THIS ART. So why do you care?

>>52440306
tl;dr i'm butthurt

>>52431758
>uses half naked anime sleeves

we all know you're not a chad

>>52440537
I kind of know, still I believe it will drop somewhat, I just wanted to rub in their faces how the steady "sanitization" of the hobby has corresponded to drops in consistency which affects quality in general.

Without delving too much into /pol/ territory it's also sad how such a small group of people has done more damage to the moderate left than the right could in 60+ years. It's always good to have more than one than one opinion as long as both sides remain mildly civil.

Maybe people just want to be angry at something, IDK.

>>52436515
>orphan boy with a head injury

Kek, this is how HP deserves to be referred to.

>>52439514
>I came here for cardgames.
So did I, but instead I got a large serving of political propaganda with that. People criticizing WotC's decisions aren't the ones bringing up politics, they are talking about something that had already been brought into the hobby by the leftists.

>>52440700
I'm with you.

The problem is this hobby is filled with poorly socialized people who have been trained by parents and teachers to default to the social skills of people more socialized than them, this leads to those socialist nerds who work really hard and have no issue paying 40% income tax.

They seem not to understand a lot of the nuance of social issues and just default to what their allies believe and assume they are telling the truth.

>>52436854

>Censored

It wasn't censored, it was cropped though. That's nothing unusual since lot of full art submissions form artists get cropped to fit the card window e.g Living Wall.

What's censoring is changing the artwork from the original Nissa Revane planeswalker so her cleavage is hidden.

>>52442058

Look carefully at the artwork, and then the card.

It was cropped, yes, but it was also altered to hide her legs which would have been in the shot.

>>52442081

Actually you are right but I do not think the legs were altered for censorship but rather it would just looked weird in the cropped portrait.

>>52431759
How have you never heard the simple phrase "sex sells"

>>52432689
Card art has folks getting stabbed, blood splatters and sometimes twisted, mutilated zombie horrors BUT oh no breasts! (Also, nice "loose" instead of "lose" dip )

>>52439537

>implying we don't have legal equality in the USA

We do. And now that we do, people want equality of outcome.

>>52442126
No. It was censored.
>>52437460
>>52439060
Mark Rosewater has told stories about this card.

>>52439666
>Shit guys. My argument is that left-wing thought is fundamentally idealistic. The end goal of left-wing politics is a kind of utopian fantasy.
>Why are cards so prudish? Well, because American leftists are the new Puritans.

I'm sorry, but... *which* national party wants to regulate internet pornography as public health hazard again?

>>52442505

Wut?

>>52436216
>Reading comprehension

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>>52432489
Actual jungle women have no body hair.

>>52442822

Actual jungle women are ugly as fuck though.

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>>52431707
The man in charge of the franchise, Mark Rosewater, is a huge social justice cuckold.

>>52442183
>sex sells

not to 13 year olds with parents doing that parent thing where they make sure they have a handle on everything their child buys. like a parent

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Sexism.

>>52437031
>When Wizards realized pandering to 0.5% of their player base really pays off to white knight nu-males.
Does it really? Serious question. SJWs certainly talk the talk, but do they back it up with enough business to matter?

>>52440650
>Implying chads and anime fans ever care about moral values of sketching.

Face the facts, it's mostly old western nerds that care and scream daily about this kind of stuff.

Was Magic really ever non-prudish? There are just two examples of revealing artwork in this thread so far and that for a game that has been around for over twenty years. Practically every company always tries to never offend anyone because they would lose lots of money.

>>52437900
i think you need to get out and get women friends

How are you gonna sunbathe (or bath) if you keep your clothes on?

You need to realize that neurology is still on its first babysteps and that a "region associated with tools lights up" isn't a sufficient proof of anything (what size is the region? is it exclusive?)

You also need to realize that you can't generalize the behavior of half of the Earth's population.

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Why did they cover Liliana up?

>>52431707
Women can't stand competition even if its made of paper and appeasing ugly robots they'd never touch.

Seriously the freer they are to speak their minds the clearer it is women are devious, attention-starved, sex craving monsters. Socio-romantically dysfunctional and rottenly egotistical to the core.

The purity of women was a lie made by older men to ensure we procreate. Bitches want nothing more than to see a man destroy everything he holds dear for her pussy, like some cthonic, self-divinizing cunt cult.

>>52444996
dead bodies shouldn't be sexy
unless they're skeletons

>>52434938
No armor is gonna protect you from Channel Fireball, Doom Blade, Maelstrom Pulse or Unsummon.

Exactly the same reason I hate you "muh realism" faggots in D&D. Martial are worthless and so are their shitty means of protecting themselves, a fucking loincloth with some minor enchantments protects more than muh "full plate".

I want more Naya/Jund, less women wearing heavy dark dresses in jungle, desert or tropical enviroments because sex negatives can't look at themselves in the mirror without crying.

>>52436133
Thankfully DC dropped that shit last year and Marvel seems to be in SJW purge mode for their next quarter.
Since WotC can't stay too far away from comic books' asshole they should be dropping the SJW fiasco altogether 15 months from now.

>>52436392
Beautiful women =/= porn you fucking sexist faggot. Go choke on a dick.

>>52437683
>>oh shit, turns out that people are objectively inferior or superior
Which is why you, presumably as a member of the superior race were posting on a 4chan board for glorfied board games at 0:40 AM

>>52437514
Good games are designed by STEMfags. Kickstarter scams are led by social "science" literal faggots.

>>52445131
Who the fuck cares about the art of magic cards anyway? play the fucking game

>>52431707
Less tits = family friendly
family friendly = bigger audience who may buy magic cards
bigger audience who may buy magic cards = more cash dollar dollar wonga kaching

>>52438021
>It works quite well when you focus on equality of opportunity, rather than equality of outcome.
Which leftards never do.
It doesn't matter that women and POCs have the chance to be anything they want, they literally want to force women and POCs into industries they're not largely interested in just to match numbers and justify their tyrannical bullshit.

>>52445214
>Which leftards never do.
What is the new deal?
What's bernie sanders?
What's infrastructure development?
What's keynesian economics?
What's increased funding of public utility?
Fucking christ you're stunning, "leftards" have been working on equality of oppurtunity for fucking decades, the views of the electorate don't matter if they elect a party with a manifesto stating otherwise.

The teenagers who played magic in the 90's and 00's are family fathers in their thirties now. Adults with disposable income are the ones who make money for Wotc. They gladly spend hundreds of dollars on carboard, but they wouldn't if they had to believe that the cards look to others like wank off material for 12-year olds.

>>52442505
Both.

>>52444429
Unf, I'm diamond hard now. Guess I'll have to go rape 20 virgins.

>>52431707
I want the things depicted in Magic's art to be exotic, and skimpy "Western fantasy" bullshit could literally be any franchise. It's indistinct. It's trite. It's thoroughly forgettable.

I'd take a fully-dressed woman in exotic and otherworldly costume over OP any day of the week.

>>52444554
Marvel had drastically outsould DC every year since 68. Four years ago when they started their SJW bullshit of replacing core heroes with women and minorities sales started dwindling until finally last year DC outsold Marvel for the first time in 48 year.

>almost 50 years of dominance ruined by tumblr

>>52445241
Trying to force people to choose the career path you want them to chose just so you can pad your statistics.
It's retarded, neurotic and tyrannical. Women don't want to be exactly half the garbage disposal professionals population, but poor men with more brawn than brains do want to take those jobs. Fuck off and let people do what they fucking want to do.

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>>52445297
>only raping virgins
get off my board you slut-shaming shitlord

>>52445311
Problem is we don't get either. Kaladesh costume design is shit. In Innistrad everyone is a cathar or gothic horror victim no.1284023409, and everyone in BFZ block stole Furiosa's costume.
You're not getting some high brow extra mile exotic design that appeals to the upper echeleons of intellectualoud aesthetic. You're getting cookie cutter crap same as any smut with the only distinction that they care more about not showing any curve or "problematic" patch of skin rather than making shit look good. or functional.

>>52445375
I'm not gonna touch your rotten beeflabs, there's a whole ecosystem living there.

>>52442183
>How have you never heard the simple phrase "sex sells"
How did you get all the way through the thread without realizing that WotC probably understands how to sell cardboard better than you do?

>>52434938
kill yourself

>>52443901
>sex doesn't sell to 13y/o

Were you hit on the head and forgot your life before you turned 20?

>>52445625
>when anon wants to post a reply but his reading comprehension is atrocious, but he posts anyway

>>52443901
Your parents looked through all the stuff you bought when you were 13?

>>52445694
Not that anon, but mine did. I couldn't even order Vampirella comics. This was also when my Internet access was text-only, so actual porn was fairly scarce.

I'm sorry your parents tried to be your friends and not your parents, anon.

>>52437395
You might want to look at the first wave then. Which was made up of upper middle class women all the same.

Winners write history. Why would feminists not lie about their true history when they can paint themselves as heroes while being the villains?

>>52445730
I pity you.

>>52445730
>your parents tried to be your friends and not your parents
That's not what happened at all. They just didn't go through my stuff. You must have had a terrible childhood. I feel sorry for you.

>>52445730
Sorry your parents sheltered you like fuck

You know it's really common that 13 year old boys jack off to anything from lingerie catalogues to pretty girls or milfs from cartoons.

Sex sells. Yes, to 13 year olds. Get triggered, prudes.

>>52445790
It's cool how you sidestepped the actual argument of "responsible parents might object to their children purchasing sexualized Magic cards and cause the company to make less money", which was anon's stated reason for WotC's policy decisions.

>>52431759
This was /thread right here. There's no mystery. Why does ANY game company become more and more mainstream over time? Money.

What the hell are the rest of you even talking about?

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>>52445394
God this.

I don't have anything to add. It's exactly this.

It doesn't just apply to the humanoid creatures either. The Eldrazi just became a mass of flabby tentacles or just outright bullshit; so much of the art was just them fucking standing there. Look at the scion tokens. Then in Innistrad they just became nothing but tentacles everywhere.

Ugliest mass of purple ever. I do like that they made the mummy design simplistic.

>>52445882
Liliana has lived long enough. I wish for her to die as soon as possible.

>>52445907
She will never ever die or change from her bad-girl persona; she was designed to appeal to a very specific demographic of players and if she dies it will only because they introduced someone with the exact same personality and "own" the entirety of Black's chunk of the color pie: discard, kill creature, reanimate, tutor.

She'll put on more clothes, which I don't mind, except when they make her look completely fucking retarded like in this art.

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>>52445730
>you aren't trying to be a parent unless you turn your child into a pathetic shit that ends up posting ">>52445694
Not that anon, but mine did. I couldn't even order Vampirella comics. This was also when my Internet access was text-only, so actual porn was fairly scarce.

I'm sorry your parents tried to be your friends and not your parents, anon." on an anime image board

>>52445945
I'm ok with another Black planeswalker as long as:
She is not Liliana.
No more Beefslab.
Even Black has standard.

>>52444429
Why is he looking at the viewer?
>You see this shit, cameraguy? This is what I have to put up to every day.

>>52445075
see
>>52444975

>>52431707
Walmart and other corps with enough market power to dictate the umber of boobs.

>>52446157
He's not. He has yellow eyes on a black background, he's looking at Lilliana.

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>>52431707
SJW artists

Seriously, take a look at almost any comic book or fantasy artists twitter or Facebook nowadays, they are all hardcore liberals and project that into their art.

>>52442845
I dunno, man. One or two of them on that image looks bang-able.

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>>52431707
I prefer it this way. At least MtG is a bit more acceptable to mention in public, unlike my japanese cartoons.

>>52446080
>when you get so upset that you can't even properly make a reply post on an anime image board

Great rebuttal btw, you really disproved the crux of the argument and didn't just resort to childish name-calling.

>>52431707
Welcome to the sex-negative 2010s.

>>52446580
All the pent-up frustration that leaks through in your posts could have been dealt with if only your parents hadn't stifled your personal development.

>>52446773
That really doesn't address WotC's marketing decisions, does it? Honestly anon, I'm perfectly willing to sit here all day and destroy your arguments, but you have to actually make a little effort. At this point we're pretty much reenacting an MS PAINT comic.

>"This is why WotC's decisions make good financial sense in today's social climate."
>"no ur a gay fag"

Eagerly awaiting an actual argument and not just another churlish insult but I know better than to expect it.

>>52443901
Parents already thought MtG was a satan-summoning game just like DnD....so your point is...?

>>52445882
>>52445945
Man that costume clashes so badly with her surroundings, then again I guess ti fits the "Victorian Tourist in Egypt" fad.

>>52442845
That's not the point, anybody who complains about a lack of body hair is being eurocentric. Many ethnic groups have sparse body hair, and many cultures pluck on top of that. Most people living in the amazon rain-forest have no body hair. It's probably not hygienic to let your pits get all hairy and sweaty down there.

>>52444996
>posting fanart as evidence that she used to be less clothed

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>>52431707
>armpit

You all sound like idiots. The turn to censorship in games, tabletop and digital, came from demands from religious right-wingers and soccer moms. Did none of you get affected by the "mtg and Pokémon are trying to make your kids witches"? This is the same shit. All this pseudo-intellectual garbage about blaming liberals is just more /pol/ posting. Report and ignore.

>>52449802
It was the right and conservative soccer moms, now it's the left and the liberal soccer moms. Times change, bullshit doesn't.

>>52431735
got em'.

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I think there is a misconception here. The argument of "If I want porn I'll just go look it up." is flawed because it is not the reason I like MTG art. The only thing I want out of MTG art is cute girls in fantasy style clothing. Be it beautiful adornments of regal royalty or a ornate tribal garb. That sort of pleasant aesthetic appeal is not something you get in porn and does not "itch the same scratch" as it were.

tl:dr
>I just want cute girls wearing cute things

>>52449802
>>52449843
In both cases its coddling parents (on both the right and left) and those who want their support. Politicians trying to prove how protective they are of children trying to one up each other for votes.

>>52445882
I actually think this piece is very well done - the dress has texture, reflections, and sensuality. You can see the thin-ness/sheerness of the material.

Can anyone actually post some art of cards that they feel are "more prudish" than before? I get the sense a lot of it might be just personal divergence in taste. Liliana's outfit in that pic is already pretty sexual.

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>>52450713
I might like it if it looked anything like Liliana. I don't really care about them cutting cheesecake (I'd like it, but I don't need it), though I think it's funny that they've also openly stated they're including more Beefsteak to appeal to the ladies. My issue is that the planeswalkers can't keep a fucking consistent look.

>>52450768
That's probably more a consequence of farming things out to freelancers rather than trying to do it in-house. If you want character consistency you need a style-sheet and artists who are disciplined enough to follow it with styles that mesh; that often means setting up a stable of regulars if not actually establishing something in-house.

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>>52450768
On this particular pic - I don't see how anyone can see Liliana and think she's prudish, either. Look at that waist-hugging corset and the sharply defined boob contours. Every one of her depictions also has her entire upper shoulders and a very-fetishy neck corset.

Like, she's supposed to be a sexy femme fatale - the pics are just sexy in 2010s fashion rather than 90s fashion sexy or 80s fashion sexy. All these arguments about "the old times were sexier" in fantasy art is just selective memory - Luis Ryo is just one artists out of many 80s artists. If you look at Elmore's art his women are still 80s sexy but not really that gratuitously nude.

>>52450938
>and a very-fetishy neck corset

It's called a posture collar, anon.

>>52431707
God, I can just feel the disgusting neckbeard who drew this exuding from the image alone

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>>52451263

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>>52450853
Oh, undoubtedly, and I think the quality of the artwork has suffered a lot because of it. This isn't anything to with "the agenda," it's just a personal gripe.

>>52450938
I don't think Liliana is a fair example since she's the designated sexy chick, though it's like I said, I really don't think cutting cheesecake is an issue in and of itself, I think it's the fact that they're moving away from She-Ra but they're content to keep He-Man around - it's a bit hypocritical to me. I remember there was a time when you'd get a card once in a blue moon that actually had a naked man or woman on it (typically green 'cause nature or some shit).

Consider this: You've been playing since the old days when you had chicks like Elvish Ranger (I think that's Elvish Ranger, could be misremembering) in the OP and slowly as time has gone on you've gotten less Elvish Ranger, and the guys who make the game are way more vigilant about the treatment of women even though you've never really seen any of the chicks at your FLGS having trouble, and a lot of it sounds naggingly similar to the annoying faggots at your campus/workplace/etc. You see why this would seem to some people like there's some kind of agenda, regardless of whether there is or isn't? Either way, have some abs for your trouble.

>>52451263
Nice bait, faggot.

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>>52451263

I know this is bait but here's your "disgusting neckbeard" who drew that image in question.

>>52451194
A posture collar is fetishistic in nature because it appeals to the "training" of a woman into a certain manor or demeanor.

>>52451435
It's obvious he just shaved. I can tell it from the pixels on his chin.

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>>52432689
>And thirdly, they don't loose anyone by changing it.
they lost me, i like the waifus. and i hate postmoderen feminists trying to extend cultural hegemony over my hobby

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>>52451263
>>52451435
I don't get to see an anon get btfo out this bad very often. Thanks.

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>>52451263
>>52451435
>>52452812
its almost as if there is a massive amount of projecting coming from the SJW left

>>52452798
I haven't stopped playing because of the SJWness
so I suppose the previous anon is right about "losing" people but I agree. As a exclusively modern player my entire collection consists of Modern staples and waifu cards. If Wizards prints more waifus in new sets. I have incentive to buy cards.

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i miss old mtg
simpler times
better times
funner times

>>52437514
>Liberal=leftist
How's the ongoing presidential meltdown going?

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>>52438885
Where have you been for the last 20 years of American politics? The term is so bastardized that self-proclaimed "communists" will talk about their "liberal" values without the least hint of irony.

While you're at it you may as well redefine "disingenuous"

>>52449143
That's because we euro descended people are hairy.

Fuck, man. My back hair could make someone a toupée.

On the other hand, my sculpted beard is fucking fantastic, and if wasn't a euro it would probably be all thin and patchy and shit.

>>52431707
Because the 80s are over, anon.
Fantasy art these days is either historical armor, a walking tank worth of ovwrarmoredness, or looks like anime clothes.

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>>52449270
It's literally based off of this greenlit design.
The piece you referred to is obviously making a statement about how family unfriendly she should be, considering the setting portrayed.

>>52451435
To be fair, Terese Nielsen is a humongous dyke, so she probably creamed a little while drawing that.

>>52453740

So what's wrong with that? We can all fap in unison then.

>>52453734
I like how hoop ear-ringed Hispanic she is here.

>>52453734
>>52454181

She looks a lot like Shakira here.

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>>52449270
Did you never have a Lorwyn Lili?

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>>52453734
That art has my favorite version of Kiora.

>>52456871
She's also the only chick in that line-up that doesn't look ridiculous.

>>52444429
Triumph of Ferocity is just that, as well as a national treasure. Garruk did nothing wrong.

>>52442822
They live off berries and have nothing to do except exercise, why are they so damn fat?

>>52451327
>the guys who make the game are way more vigilant about the treatment of women even though you've never really seen any of the chicks at your FLGS having trouble, and a lot of it sounds naggingly similar to the annoying faggots at your campus/workplace/etc. You see why this would seem to some people like there's some kind of agenda, regardless of whether there is or isn't?
To be fair just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

>>52458747
To be fair, just because you do see it, it doesn't mean it's a widespread issue. Of course, that wasn't my point, I was simply speaking to why people might conclude that a conspiracy of some sort (Jews, liberals, the alt-right, take your pick) is trying to fuck with them for whatever reason.

>>52444975
Fuck off tumblr moron, nothing in his post is wrong. Women do judge other women by said woman's appearance and this fad of covering up female characters is tiresome and stupid bullshit. Nor is there anything wrong with anybody objectifying women either.

Piss the fuck off and get lost. Faggots like you do not belong on 4chan.

>>52431707

SJWs aka modern puritans.

>>52440157
I'm offended that you were offended that someone said they were offended.

>>52451435
Something about her face makes me know that there would be no point in hitting on her.

Would buy a beer and talk about wimmin with/10

>>52450713
Problem is that dress is not meant to be thin, it's meant to be thick and warm because she explicitly put it on because Innistrad is particularily cold.
She's wearing her winter clothes in the desert despite having an arabian nights outfit avaliable, and the only non-retarded answer to why when Gideon explicitly took off clothes and armor because of the climate, is feminist sex-negativity infecting the art direction.

>>52454160
Feminism wants nobody to ever fap/schlick, because we aren't fapping/schlicking to the ugly legbeard landwhales that populate the "movement".

>>52458747
The general rule is that it's not players complaining but people so socially inept they're not welcome even in the pits of nerdom known as LGS.

The SJW movement is pretty much useless betas who were told they were precious and perfect all their fucking lives then grew up and the Chads didn't like them and could beat them up, so they became socialist fags whining about how Chad's money should be redistributed and how they should be shamed for being tall, atheltic, handsome and white. Then gaming became popular and the would-be SJWs thought they'd be the king of the hill of the ugly nerds because they were hip and special but turns out nerds like them even less than Chad and can also beat them up because we're fucking fat for sitting all day playing games. So now games are sexist and racist and have to be taken away from us because we're mean and don't want to play with them.

The SJW movement is the temper tantrum of spoiled single-childs who grew up in the "no child left behind" administration.

>>52459108
In fact women judge other women based on their appereance much harder and in much more vile ways than mysogynistic men do.

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>>52454181
>Hispanic with hoop earrings
>hoop earrings in general

never got into magic. Trading card games are a scam, but it just sucks that people feel the need to make women cover up in the game because it's, "more realistic." I'm pretty sure most people who got into Magic didn't start because of the scantily clad women. That was just a plus to them. Learn to tolerate it. I'm guessing theirs a bunch of shirtless barbarian guys in the game too anyway.

>>52456871

Are women in this picture based on eastern-european prostitutes?

And I'd rather not comment on the men either

The only more or less good-looking is Karn

>>52445730
Getting porn used to be a fucking art. I'm worried it's so easy now that it's dumbing people down. Like everything else.

>>52454181
>>52462293
Wasn't there some "street" rule of thumb that the size of the hoop is proportional to how much of a slut a girl is?

>>52453740
I think I creamed picturing this

>>52442845
Depends entirely on the tribe.

>>52463421
>Getting porn used to be a fucking art. I'm worried it's so easy now that it's dumbing people down. Like everything else.

I seriously believe that the rise of the MGTOW-style "movements" are directly tied to the easy availability of porn. When we were horny teenagers, lack of porn forced us to interact with girls because we wanted to have sex. Now horny teenager boys are growing up with instant free porn, and by the time they hit their mid-20s they're socially stunted because they've spent the past 15 years relying on the Internet to get them off and they've conditioned themselves to the point where real women aren't as appealing as fapping to naked cartoon children.

I think it's great because the number of sexually-frustrated 20-something girls is going up every year. More fish for me!

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>>52463960
>tl;dr: alternatives to sex lead men away from women
You probably didn't mean to say this, but you said this.

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>>52434938
>Also fuck off back to Plebbit, you fucking MRA faggot.

>>52432489
That's if you're a monsterfat european white hambeast.

>>52464085
Hey, thanks for bowing out without a fight! I'll be sure to picture you fapping alone in the dark while I'm shooting another hot load into a girl half my age.

What, were you expecting me to sperg out like a white knight because you're too pussy to go for pussy? The self-consoling mewling of betas gets me rock-hard.

>>52463532
Yes. And unfortunately the hoop earring sluts are usually far more palatable than the hidden slut sort.

>>52463960
as someone who once decided to browse the forum of MGTOW I can tell you that's not the case, its just dudes bitter about being burned from their girlfriends and spouses and some who read way too much into how their female friends act, ages vary too much to just be about accessible porn.

>>52461235
>>52459108
I know women that do judge each other very harshly and a few that don't (and I'm very close to them so they aren't just hiding it).

How old are you?
Of course it's a possibility there are only bitches in all of the areas you went through during your whole life, but it would be surprising.

>>52466035
>I can tell you that's not the case, its just dudes bitter about being burned from their girlfriends and spouses
If you've ever been in really badly abusive relationships (whether with girlfriend/spouse or dealing with crazy mothers) that shit can really, really burn up a man especially when dealing with an out of control cluster B personality disorder so is it really surprising these people exist?

>>52431707
Because Identity politics and political correctness ruin everyone's fun.

There's no instance where the two actually made the majority happy.

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>>52466035
From my personal experience a lot of those burned men first go through a stage of MRA, until they realize women will hate them for telling them men have problems too.

But then again, unlike feminism MGTOW is a highly decentralized group with various people who have various motives and various modi operandi. Some become "monks" and avoid women altogether while others pump and dump or become sugardaddies with clear-cut rules on how their relationship works. And of course there's infighting where the so-called monks accuse the sugar daddy crew of being purple pilled.

>>52466500
>while others pump and dump
Those are PUA, not MGTOW. People who take the bare bones of the relationship between men and women (ultimately, we are animals trying to reprodruce) and use this knowledge to simply get what they want which isn't really all that different from those cheesy books women once had about seducing men. It's just seen as worse because, uh, reasons I guess.

Then you hit the crazier side of the PUA community, which evolve past 'dudes trying to understand the mechanics of relationship, dating and courtship' and you enter the....weird...zone. This is where you get the chest-thumping neanderthal, masculinity worship and paleo-diet crap which attract people trying way too fucking hard to compensate for their previous lack of masculinity.

>>52466561
I guess you're right there, but what I wanted to emphasize is that not all MGTOW are celibate. They just limit contact with women to what's strictly neccessary (and for some that includes sex).

>>52466500
>That pic
The thing is, the ultimate weakness of MRA is two fold and I know people will immediately say this weakness is that they are 'virgin neckbeard losers' but immediately this speak of the innate weakness and ultimately failure of their movement.

Nobody give a shit about men. Especially not other men because of competition.

On a simple level, men have nothing to gain from the painful realities of other men due to competition. Not only that but as a species we are simply not geared to feel sympathy for men since they are the expendable gender. It's really that simple deep down. And no, I'm not a feminist, far from it. I'm myself a former MRA before eventually realizing it was not a battle which could be won. The human mind is not geared to give a fuck about the suffering of men. This is why you got shit like reporting on Boko Haram kidnapping girls in africa will ignoring the fact they left behind a corpse pile of boys that was much larger.

So where's the problem, then? Well, basically, the problem today is that men are still treated as expendable without any of the benefits. Sure, traditionalism surely has its issues but if you look at older cultures there was always some sort of implicit 'reward' to men's hard work and extendability. Yes, feminist will say "But men ruled the world!". Yes and no. A few men ruled the world, built on the back of other more expendable men. People always bring up how all major historical figures are male,. forgetting that these are the 0.1% of all men which ever lived. The difference is that back then men weren't told they are 'toxic' or 'subhuman' for doing their work. There was some sort of positive to it, no matter how flimsy.

But no, not anymore. Dismiss my post all you want as 'MRA propaganda' but seriously consider my points the next time you hear about 'toxic masculinity'.

>>52466783
It's that simple fact that's kept me from ever becoming an MRA in spite of the sympathies I have for them, they really are an unfortunate lot. It doesn't help that a lot of them are very passionate about what they do, and when the thing you're passionate about isn't socially acceptable it leads to mockery (as I'm sure we're all aware), which understandably pisses them off, creating a feedback loop of "lol neckbeard permavirgin" and "NORMIES REEEE"!!!

>>52466909
Basically this: there is nothing to gain socially from being an MRA and everything to gain socially for being a feminist. This is particularly true if you look at female MRA and the shit they receive (amusingly, a lot of it from male feminist).

It doesn't matter that some issues they bring are perfectly legitimate ones irrelevant of the fact that yes, there are MRA who are awful people (such is human nature). Things like male genital mutilation, which when brought up gets people a shrug when 10 second earlier they could be outraged at female genital mutilation. This is in spite of how identical these phenomena are.

Unfortunately, it is all society which suffer from the small problems adding up, such as discrimination of male students on campus and the rape hysteria. A future doctor or scientist might have his entire life ruined by one awful hysterical woman. What people don't understand is that MRA, MGTOW and PUA are all symptoms and not 'the disease'. It's a disease which goes deeper than just blaming feminism, however. Feminism is just using what's already in place in the human brain, intentionally or not. The sad reality is that, yes, society has in general seen a decrease in the usefulness of men as automation has increased. Shit like 'a woman need a man like a fish need a bicycle' could not have existed, say, 100 or 200 years ago. The automation of western civilization has a huge part to play in our current state of affair.

Nevermind that, amusingly, most of the goods we purchase are often made by poor, underpaid women and children in some far off country nobody give a shit about. See: the 'this is what a feminist look like' t-shirt controversy.

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>>52467213
I wouldn't mind nearly so much if A) there weren't actual legal inequalities like the aforementioned genital mutilation or rape laws, and B) there weren't women degrading men for being useless thanks to the advances largely brought about by men. It's fucking kafkaesque. Have some semi-related cheesecake from the good ol' days.

>>52467619
Have you ever heard women whining about 'where have all the good men gone'? The sad reality is that gender relations are so utterly fucked beyond any form of repair that there is increasingly less a reason for men to treat women 'right' since:
A) The worst of them are given free reign to be awful
B) Acting in a 'gentlemen' way gets you scorned for being a fedora-tipper or some chauvinist as they will remind you they are 'strong independent women grr hear them roar'
C) So at this point, women start having no worth or use to men, so they either stop dating or go into the pump and dump mentality
D) Even if a relationship is formed if it goes wrong or if the woman gets tired, the man is drained of money and never allowed to see and raise its kid
E) Thus, a new generation of dysfunctional boys and girls are born, continuing the cycle
F) Boys are treated so shittily by feminist mothers they become either what people call 'cuck' or 'numale' (and thus enablers of the worst things women do) while others snap and hate women for reasons which, really, start looking justifiable

>>52466783
>>52467213
>muh biotruths
>muh culture wars
>muh nihilism

go fuck yourself, despite what you say you are pretty much full red-pill MRA

>Nobody give a shit about men. Especially not other men because of competition.
People give plenty of shits about each other, gender exclusive. sounds like no one gives a shit about YOU.

>On a simple level, men have nothing to gain from the painful realities of other men due to competition
welcome to the future man, we've got medicine and voting rights and social mobility here. You sound like a backwoods bumpkin.

>"But men ruled the world!". Yes and no. A few men ruled the world, built on the back of other more expendable men. People always bring up how all major historical figures are male,. forgetting that these are the 0.1% of all men which ever lived.
so in other words, gender has literally no basis on your culture war bullshit because functionally nobody has been in a position of power.

>Basically this: there is nothing to gain socially from being an MRA and everything to gain socially for being a feminist
easy on the kool-aid bucko, you might get a dose of reality if you venture outside your basement and realize nobody of consequence gives brownie points for you claiming you follow one of numerous political movements that do nothing but bitch.

>The automation of western civilization has a huge part to play in our current state of affair.
I'll see your personal anecdote and raise you my own. Despite what blue-collar ninnies whine about automation does very little to replace jobs. I work at a government contractor and the only people who need to worry about being replaced by robots are the the useless wastes of space who are barely more lucid than robots in the first place

>See: the 'this is what a feminist look like' t-shirt controversy.
oh yeah, totally not an MRA.

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>>52467694
You know, it's funny too, because I was going to say that the good women are out there, but I actually think about all of the chicks that I've ever enjoyed relationships with and they've all been older than me. I suppose all I can really say is keep looking but keep your cards close to your chest, to all the guys out there in search of love.

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>>52467801
>This assblasted about civilly presented viewpoints you happen to disagree with.
>"useless wastes of space who are barely more lucid than robots in the first place"

>>52467801
Oh boy, a lovely knee jerk reaction. I could just ignore it but I got nothing better to do right now.
>muh biotruths
Biology is real, sorry to break it to you. It's called science and reason.

>welcome to the future man, we've got medicine and voting rights and social mobility here. You sound like a backwoods bumpkin.
Where did I ever say in this post I was against 'voting right'. In fact, where in my post were voting rights ever mentioned at all? At no point did I ever remotely mention anything related to voting right or even rights in any shape or form. I know you're trying to imply I'm some kind of backwater inbred neckbeard who want to chain women to ovens and shit but this isn't what I wrote.

>>52467872
>I argued like a big boy so I win
>>52467905
>he's mad so he's wrong

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>>52467935

>>52467959
>I have no argument so I'll just claim you're arguing wrong

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>>52467935
>>52467997
You won, here you go.

>>52463960
>I think it's great because the number of sexually-frustrated 20-something girls is going up every year. More fish for me!
Shame the body positivity shit has made them think they can be ugly as fuck and still desserve a 10/10. I've been having to go for early 30's women to find someone who dresses nicely or even brushes her fucking hair.

>>52469224
This is going to sound insane, but just because unattractive girls believe they deserve your attention, you don't actually have to give them attention.

>>52467801
You sound like your brain has been replaced by a gender studies pamphlet.

>>52469471
For future reference, how can I call you a faggot without sounding like a SJW?

>>52469580
Call him a pissjingle instead.

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>>52434938
>I want to look at titties, I can just go to the club, pick up a girl and look at her titties

>>52467801
Not the guy you're responding to, but

>People give plenty of shits about each other, gender exclusive. sounds like no one gives a shit about YOU.
He's obviously talking about "women and children first" bullshit, and how men where the ones that had to go fight in wars. Men were the ones who had the overwhelming majority of the suffering until relatively recently in history.

>welcome to the future man, we've got medicine and voting rights and social mobility here. You sound like a backwoods bumpkin.
Nice ad-hom. Not entirely sure what you're going for here.

>so in other words, gender has literally no basis on your culture war bullshit because functionally nobody has been in a position of power.
Yes, that is precisely the point. People claim men have/have had all of the power, so we should take some of it away and give it to women. The reality is the majority of people had no power, and doing this is now creating inequality where the originally was none, contrary to the perpetrators claims that they are "leveling the playing field".

>easy on the kool-aid bucko, you might get a dose of reality if you venture outside your basement and realize nobody of consequence gives brownie points for you claiming you follow one of numerous political movements that do nothing but bitch.
The same can be said for any political movement, especially feminism or any other modern pseudo-progressive movement. Most women don't even like feminism, yet we have self-styled champions of women demanding things from the powers that be, many of which end up harming women.

>I'll see your personal anecdote and raise you my own. ...
This is quite amusing coming from one of those "every person is equal and a special snowflake that deserves respect" types.

>>52469816
>This is quite amusing coming from one of those "every person is equal and a special snowflake that deserves respect" types.
You're a nigger faggot

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>>52431707
Demographics and Marketing. The people who make MtG need to broaden their appeal to a larger audience to make more money. There's very little to gain from keeping cheesecake art, as the customer base for MtG isn't reliant on having it in their card game. In other words, people buying cards either don't care or if they do care - they don't care enough for it to be a deal breaker.

On the other hand, becoming more 'prudish' is more inviting to potential customers that would have otherwise not considered buying into MtG. Either because they saw what they consider to be tacky fanservice at best and downright sexist at worst.

This is coming from someone who likes cheesecake fantasy art. I only play Magic casually, so, is this notion of less sexualized art even true across the board?

>>52470150
That woman there doesn't look like she's in peril, she's just like "stop waving that thing around and help get my shield unstuck from the ground, also that helmet makes you look silly"

>>52466783
>Well, basically, the problem today is that men are still treated as expendable without any of the benefits. Sure, traditionalism surely has its issues but if you look at older cultures there was always some sort of implicit 'reward' to men's hard work and extendability
Exactly. And not even modern "traditionalists" want that. You can count the number of traditionalists who want to revoke female suffrage for example on one hand. And on the other hand, women simply do not care about making men's lives better.

And this is one of the multiple reasons why I believe female suffrage is a turning point for civilizations: from that point onward it just gets worse and worse. Arguments fall victim to sentimentalism, the arbitrary dogma of equality of outcome is enforced, women are rewarded for being women and men are expected to as always carry the full weight of civilization on their shoulders but are at the same time told they're sexist for doing exactly that. What other option does a sane man who cares about himself have other than retreaat from society and sit things out? That's exactly my plan. It may not happen while I'm alive, but either Western society will collapse or Islam will subvert it. Especially the latter will be ironic, given how pro-migration women are. When that happens, the story will be that men have voted to give women their freedom, and women will have voted for who would take that freedom away from them.

>>52469816
>Most women don't even like feminism
They don't like the label it has gotten. Less than 1% of women actually disagrees with feminism. Most do not disagree with the goodies feminism has given them, none of them want true equality to men and the grand majority will tell you to stop whining if you bring up routine male genital mutilation being legal, or somehow twist it around into being okay because somehow everything wrong is always a man's fault and that somehow means it shouldn't be corrected.

>>52470150
>is this notion of less sexualized art even true across the board
It's just people being whiny bitches. the OP art was done by an artist who was and still is one of Magic's most iconic artists. There's still cheescake, there's also beefcake now. It's just like 5% of the art instead of 15% now.

>>52470207
>Less than 1% of women actually disagrees with feminism. Most do not disagree with the goodies feminism has given them, none of them want true equality to men and the grand majority will tell you to stop whining if you bring up routine male genital mutilation being legal, or somehow twist it around into being okay because somehow everything wrong is always a man's fault and that somehow means it shouldn't be corrected.
nice sources

bring the sexy back to my women!

>>52470204
>That woman there
Her name is Eowyn, you dorkus malorkus.

>>52470345
The former of course aren't literal figures, but actually try to have a conversation about feminism with the average woman. One that goes deeper than "safe spaces sure are stupid, huh?". As for the latter, well...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/jun/27/circumcision-ruling-germany-muslim-jewish
>Women's rights groups and social policy makers also condemned the decision, but for the reason that it would have the effect of putting male and female circumcision on the same footing, when they were "in no way comparable", said Katrin Altpeter, social minister in the state of Baden-Württemberg.
Let me repeat that: German feminists overturned Germany's circumcision ban because protecting male bodily integrity undermines female bodily integrity... somehow. I'm not even making this shit up anymore.

And of course, there were no feminists giving a countersound. None at all.

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>>52470414

>>52470441

ageism

>>52470441

>clearly not runes on the walls

>>52469377
Yes and no.
You don't need to even look at them in the street, but if you go to a nightclub looking for a qt to hook up with they will harpy down on you and get you kicked out for denying them.
It drastically reduces the places where you can go to for casual relationships and some people can't quite take the long and tedious route because we travel.

>>52470414
>Mother of Runes
>>52470441
>MOMMY of Runes

>>52470523
>but if you go to a nightclub looking for a qt to hook up with they will harpy down on you and get you kicked out for denying them
you're so full of shit

>>52469664
That sounds very SJW.
They'd pee themselves at the ease with which we throw out faggot nigger kike retard because they're all fucking babies and as such use babby's first curse words like pissbaby and shitlord.

>>52470308
There hasn't been a single "cheesecake" at since Dragon's Maze and that is being extremelly loose with the term.
But of course we get a lot of beefcake, the game is run by double faced faggots.

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>>52470408
>German feminists overturned Germany's circumcision ban

But the headline of the article literally says
>German court rules that procedure is bodily harm and contravenes right to choose religion in later life

Reading the article, it seems clear that male circumcision is now illegal in Germany. Evil Feminists didn't "overturn" anything, they just "condemned the decision". Feminists in Germany did not overturn Germany's circumcision ban.

It's like everything you typed was a lie and you were hoping that nobody would actually read the article you linked. Why would you post lies on the Internet, anon?

>>52470523
>but if you go to a nightclub looking for a qt to hook up with they will harpy down on you and get you kicked out for denying them.

This is what basement-dwelling NEETs actually believe? That women can actually get you kicked out of a club because you're not hitting on them enough?

How did you manage to type out that post if you're this retarded?

>>52470408
This kind of shit is solved by men's greatest invention: bullets.

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>>52470569
>That sounds very SJW.
Get with the times, grandpa.

>>52470672
You don't know about the context, do you? A court did overturn it, Muslims and women whined, and a law was made explicitly permitting male (and only male) genital mutilation for non-therapeutic reasons.

http://www.bundestag.de/dokumente/textarchiv/2012/42042381_kw50_de_beschneidung/210238

The article was made before that latter law, and only serves to prove what you denied: women actively campaigned to have men genitally mutilated, because forbidding it would somehow hurt the feelings of women. How can you read this and not start believing women hate men? Oh right, by utterly dodging the point just like you did earlier.

>>52470414
I had never noticed the little gnome there.
But yes, Nielsen gets away with drawing pretty women because she's a lesbian and as the only Lgbt+ people that matter, it's socially unacceptable to criticize them.

>>52470769
you sure have strong feelings about circumcision you nigger faggot kike

>>52470769
I can't read German, but I'm wondering why you linked an article talking about how circumcision is illegal in Germany as proof that circumcision is legal in Germany.

If you were trying to convince people that circumcision is legal in Germany, you probably shouldn't have linked an article explaining that circumcision is illegal in Germany.

It doesn't matter that you later posted "but that article doesn't count, trust me!"

>>52470567
>>52470701
You've not been to an american club in the past five years.
Bitches will go tell security you're harassing them and you will be "invited" to leave.

>>52470848
>You've not been to an american club in the past five years.
Incorrect, but let's see where this is going

>Bitches will go tell security you're harassing them and you will be "invited" to leave.
Whatever you say anon

>>52470701

to be honest, a club is the most retarded place to meet women unless you're rich, 9/10-10/10, or have coke.

It's a profoundly retarded place for the majority of men.

>>52470778
>Nielsen gets away with drawing pretty women because she's a lesbian and as the only Lgbt+ people that matter, it's socially unacceptable to criticize them.
Steve Argyle draw the famously censored Liliana, got hit with a cease and desist for drawing unofficial ChandraxLili fanart, gets constant complaints for his sexist artwork, and still does art for MtG.

>>52470829
I don't know whether you're stupid or willfully missing the point. The point, the point that you deliberately asked a citation for, is that feminists campaigned in favor of male genital mutilation and AGAINST a ban on it.

>>52470888
Yet he hasn't been allowed to draw a woman for MtG ever since. Swifty should have been done by the time they harassed him for the ChandraxLilly playmat since that happened late in Theros block and art is done 9 months in advance of sets coming out.
Since then he has only drawn machinery.

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I wish Rebecca Guay still did art on a consistent basis for MTG, and it'd be awesome if Terese Nielsen was more prolific. Lots of classic sexy art.

>>52470923
SJWs can't accept reality. It hurts their fee fees, and fee fees are the only thing that matters in life.

>>52470923
where did the Mohel touch you anon?

>>52470940
Where's the cheesecake art Neilson has drawn in the last 9 months?

>>52470923
>I don't know whether you're stupid or willfully missing the point. The point, the point that you deliberately asked a citation for, is that feminists campaigned in favor of male genital mutilation and AGAINST a ban on it.

That's nice. Can you link me an article written in English that states that circumcision is currently legal in Germany? That was your point here >>52470408 right?

>Let me repeat that: German feminists overturned Germany's circumcision ban
Proofs? (In English?)

>>52471005
Yavimaya Enchantress and Sydri, Galvanic Genius were reprinted recently and both would fit comfortably in a fantasy pin-ups book along stuff by Royo, Bell or Frazetta.

>>52471158
>Yavimaya Enchantress
no cleavage, no thighs, not even navel or vagina bones
>Sydri
whatever you say faggot, you're clearly grasping at straws

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Do you think we'll ever see something as lewd as a suggestive, slithering snake sliding down a sexy vamp's breasts in MTG again? Ever?

>>52471203
>Tits make a pin-up
>Not posing or mood
Now I really know you're just a puritanical SJW or an autist.

>>52471436
I don't know how to argue against this because you're calling me a SJW for saying the art aren't sexy enough.

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>>52439514

>>52458672
Fat is Beautiful :^) see, it's just western culture corrupting mens minds.

>>52461225
I don't know man I've seen how "anti-SJWs" act online.

If you can assume SJWs bring their behavior offline then I really don't want to imagine how the other side of the coin acts.

>>52471118
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.bundestag.de%2Fdokumente%2Ftextarchiv%2F2012%2F42042381_kw50_de_beschneidung%2F210238&edit-text=

On 12 December 2012, following a series of hearings and consultations, the Bundestag adopted the proposed law explicitly permitting non-therapeutic circumcision to be performed under certain conditions; it is now §1631(d) in the German Civil Code. The vote tally was 434 ayes, 100 noes, and 46 abstentions.[66] Following approval by the Bundesrat and signing by the Bundespräsident, the new law became effective on 28 December 2012 a day after its publication in the Federal Gazette.[67]

Seems pretty clear to me.

>>52471736
not that anon but what makes you think it's feminists and not, say, christians

>>52471760
I didn't say it was feminists or muslims or jews or whatever. Just that it is in fact, law in germany that circumcision is legal.

>>52442183
apparently, for major marketing groups for large companies, the new thing is "activism sells". so if you even faintly portray your company to be supporting a marginalized group, it'll sell just as well as titties did in the 90's and 00's

>>52450713
the dress has texture, but it's not very well done, like it was done by an art student, and not a very advanced one at that. her legs are placed and an extremely awkward "one leg over the other over the other" pose. and then there's the thigh-high-boot gloves. how the hell do you put those on? nevermind even trying to lace them up yourself. hell, those gloves seem more like a fetish thing than anything else in the entire picture.

i mean, goddamn. it looks like the artist spent more time doing the fruit on the side than working on the central figure of the piece.

>>52471812
Exept it doesn't. The SJW marketing push coincides with Marvel comics' dip in sales, Magic's abrupt end to continuous growth and video game company mergers as studios went down.

It's not surprising Holywood blockbusters don't adopt this shit because those jews know how to make money and to keep that crap away from the golden goose.

>>52431707
Hasbro wants to sell cards to kids.

>>52471919
>i mean, goddamn. it looks like the artist spent more time doing the fruit on the side than working on the central figure of the piece.
Wouldn't surprise me.
Hell, after going back to university to teach a workshop and interacting with the dimwits that populate and administer education today, I wouldn't be surprised if they started pushing drawing women as "gender violence" in the near future.

>>52472042
>13+
Those "kids" would pay premium for the slightest focus on thigh or cleavage.

>>52450049
Decrying cheesecake art with "Why don't you just look at porn instead?" is a bit like looking at, say, a honey-glazed roast (or some other food with a bit of sweetness) and asking "Why don't you just eat some chocolate instead?".

sure is /r9k/ in here, hope this thread drops off soon.

I really don't remember any cheesecake in mtg then I'm a goblin player so...

>>52431758
>Cheesecake is now considered a fetish

This is what you get for inviting reddit.

>>52472093
>You want your morning coffee? Why don't you overdose on opium instead?
That's how they sound to me.

>>52472093
>sometimes when I want to eat junk but pretend I'm sophisticated I eat gourmet hotpockets

>>52470150
>On the other hand, becoming more 'prudish' is more inviting to potential customers that would have otherwise not considered buying into MtG.
[CITATION NEEDED]

I dont even get how people just casually spout SJW-Rhetoric without even checking it, jesus christ.

>>52470748
Smells like SRS trying to language-police people.

>>52470778
She also drew dreamy Gerrard once upon a time and said in an interview "I just like making attractive people." I can't knock that.

>>52472093
>>52472328
It's just strawmanning.

It's how any-wing demagogues people demonize their opponents.

If you like pretty people, it must make you a rapist, sex appeal apologist, or forced appearance roles, or a pornographer, or pervert, or any number of labels that both conservatives and liberals use. It's just not okay to say that person looks pretty because it obviously must be an objective statement about how that person must set the gold standard about prettiness - and that you want to rape them.

At some point, women go from being children who know how to take compliments to just forgetting how to take compliments that they look good (so long as those are not the only compliments you give them) and just assume you're out to fuck them. I've seen so many HR cases of (newly hired) women just losing their shit and screaming sexual harassment because someone threw a compliment their way, and I know it's bullshit because the guys complimenting have worked at the company for years and everyone knows they're nice people and it's typical for them to be welcoming to the new people. But everyone's just out there to get offended.

It's like telling people to get vaccinated and someone uses the "if everyone jumped off a bridge" line on you. Usually I turn around and show them a picture of me jumping off a bridge with a bunch of people and explain it was one of the most thrilling times of my life as it was perfectly safe and I overcame a slight fear of heights. If people hate on porn you just tell them, "porn is fucking fantastic; I love naked people; I love seeing my girlfriend naked don't you?"

>>52473193
>"I just like making attractive people."
This is heresy nowadays.

>>52473434
It's such heresy that she can't even play the lesbian card to protect from it.

>>52456871
The women are pretty cheesecake, but there's one character that sticks out the most - Garruk

Holy shit, he must have to consume over 15,000 calories a day to even maintain that supra-natural physique. Probably weighs at least 450lbs His arm is as big as chandra's torso

>>52473392
Do you attach pictures of your naked girlfriend to your game materials and bring them to your lgs?

>>52431735
Fuck this entire thread second post fucking exemplary post.

>>52473392
>that post when you realize this motherfucker has been on 4chan too long

>>52472340

who are you quoting

>>52473587

>there are people who don't do this

>>52472401
Here's one article that suggests that women find sexual advertising unappealing unless it's paired with a highly priced consumer goods, (not $5 booster packs for a card game)

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-12-women-sexually-explicit-ads-unappealingunless.html#inlRlv

Since there are a lot more women than men into MtG, maybe this is the market that they are trying to tap into? Certainly, posts like >>52470308 and >>52470644 seem to suggest there is an attempt to reach this market through its own specific sexualization, though it does contradict my article's findings.

But perhaps framing it in a purely profit seeking frame was a bad solution to begin with. It certainly is known that 'sex sells', but I question how important that axiom is to a brand like MtG which already makes a lot of money. Perhaps its more of a desire by the creators to change Magic's image for reasons outside of profits, like maturity or reputation.

I don't know, I'm just speculating - I'm not a market analyst, nor do I work for WotC.

>I dont even get how people just casually spout SJW-Rhetoric without even checking it, jesus christ.
I dont even get how people just casually spout political labels in an attempt to poison the well of someone's argument without even checking what they're commenting on, jesus christ. I wasn't even claiming that this was a good or bad thing, just that it might be a case of WotC trying to broaden the demographic of its consumer base. There are plenty of critics and fans alike who decry 'watering down' a franchise or style for the sake of mass appeal.

>>52466783
>not geared to feel sympathy for men since they are the expendable gender

This isn't true. We only see MEN as expendable, whilst, if we follow your logic, we should see post-menopause women as useless as well. But we don't. We expend the same attitude of "women first" to women who are by reproductive standards completely useless. It is much more societal than biological.

In reality, if it was entirely biological, a ranking would go like this:

1. Women = Children
2. Young - Adult Men.
2. Old Men
3. Post-menopause women.

>>52470955
Patrician taste.

>>52472015
Or the manchild bubble is bursting.

>>52474822
Yeah, but at a primal level binaries are much easier than ordered lists. Woman or not woman.

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>>52442058
no it was censored, in fact that card is the reason women have to have their legs together in MTG which lead to other amusing shit like the boner vampire.

all it takes is one idiot...

>>52475859
Nope, DC and boardgames started making more money in response.
SJW pandering drove clients towards the competition.