Are we being played?

>>52414496
>guys, what if, like, my character knows that everybody is in an RPG and he worships the player?
Said every teenager in 1994.

>>52414519
>worshiping the player rather than the DM

lol what a retarded character

I actually think that humans are spirits possessing the bodies of homo sapiens, which (with various degrees of success) fight us for control, but usually are so thoroughly dominated that we stop noticing them except when we're weakened by something. A homo sapien is probably less intelligent than a spirit but still sentient on the level of an advanced animal.

>>52414551
How would a PC know what the DM is?

>>52414627
How would a PC know what the player is?

>>52414610
That's interesting but dumb at the same time. I think my nose is bleeding. Beer good.

>>52414610
the sooner you learn that a brain produces multiple minds the better

or shave with Occam's

>>52414610
So what exactly does this fight for control feel like, what real world equivalent is this weakened state and subsequent attempted take over?

>>52414835
Not just during weakened states, but also when the vessel thinks you are trying to kill it, it summons all of its strength to try to resist you.

>>52414949
>I actually think

You're saying you actually believe this notion, so what does it feel like to have the homo sapiens fight you for control. What do people like me and other people that don't believe this call that feeling.

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>>52414519
>Said every teenager in 1994.
But Tron came out in 1982.

>>52414551
>The Demiurge (DM) is a sadistic monster.
>Why would you worship him and not his opponents, who are agents of free will?

>>52415249
anon, no one can actually oppose the DM
if you can remember rule 0, you'd know that the fun isn't here, and what the DM want >is fun

>>52415118
Man, we didn't even have a VCR of our own until 1987. Before that we had to rent one every time we wanted to watch a movie.

>>52415047
Aristotle called it the struggle between the rational mind and man's animal nature. Freud called it the conflict between the ego and the id.

>>52415569
Yeah but how do you actually think this? Can you elaborate on your spirit? What is the rational alien of your being that possesses dirty material, and how do you think you are it?

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>>52414496
p sure the whole book explains your question to you anon

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>>52417909
>>52414496
but what about

>>52418152
aw snap thats sideways senpai

>>52418152
>>52417909
>trying to escape submission
>laughingcyclones.jpg
reza negarestani a best

>>52414496
It's a doggy dog world, play or be played.
You might have gotten yourself some control over the lesser characters but there will be always somebody higher up pulling your strings. Like some bizarre pyramid scheme of lives.

>>52414496
thats a fucked up book man hope ur enjoying it

>>52418152
what the fuck is this tho

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>>52420155
Its a pull from reza negarestani's piece in this. I thought cyclonopedia was a good answer to the question posed. More directly deleuzian stuff, less freud (which is funny to say). Less utopian, less anthropocentric.

I have to go back and re-read all the Harman and the Meillassoux after I finish Being & Time. Because I liked it the first time, but I had a different kind of no fucking idea what I was doing than I have now. Ben Woodard is pretty fun. Can't fucking stand ziz tho.

>>52420895
nah i know its from drafting the inhuman/thinking with nigredo, but whys it look like a sequence book?

im not a big fan of harman, i feel like wolfendale did quite the number on him with Object Oriented Philosophy

meillassoux is beyond them all really

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>>52420895
>>52421276
did you find negarestani's essay to be the hardest in this book? asking for a friend

>>52421314
yes, but perhaps simply through it's oddity and his writing style
i would recommend reading the Solar Inferno and Earthbound Abyss by him, its a good follow up for Drafting the Inhuman

>>52420895
ziz can go to heck i say

>>52414610

Nice try archon.

https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vida_alien/alien_archons02.htm

>>52421276
I have no idea what >>52418152's image is from. I just recognized reza's bit.

Yeah, basically the more I read Heidegger the less impressed I am with Harman. I went through the Quadruple Object a bit ago and found most of his discussion on what the receding object's interiority to be unsatisfying and unnecessary. Haven't read wolfendale's thing but I hear its good.

Meillassoux is dank. After Finitiude was great and I think pushes pretty hard at how to do non-kantian stuff. I'm excited to read more of him.

OOO is tricky business. Not as interesting to me now that I've read more and I'm under the impression they've been consorting with accelerationist junk, but I think Timothy Morton's Ecology Without Nature has a lot of neat stuff in it, and I have a weird soft spot for Ian Bogost if just for how accessible he tries to make theory and practice. Bed Woodard seems like he's going to come out with something really interesting eventually? Slime Dynamics was fun, nothing really challenging though.

>>52421314
I didn't have a hard time with it, but I also haven't read everything in the collection. I think having a solid understanding of freud helps for sure though. I'd already read Cyclonopedia so getting into the oddity wasn't very difficult for me.

I really want his new book to come out.

>>52421599
sequence says 'summer', but it keeps getting pushed back

yeah OOO is just kinda fun isn't it, generally lacks the rigor of someone like Meillassoux, which makes me suspicious of it as something I'm trying to support
Wolfendale's take down is good but eventually gets a little mean-spirited, it's also a 400-page book written because of his internet arguments with Harman as a grad student

>>52421314
lol at pic
I found it to be the weirdest by far, but not really the 'hardest', just understanding negarestni's ontology(?) helps moving through it

>>52414949
I try to kill the vessel every night at the bar but it likes it

>>52421938
Lack of rigour sums it up. I understand the need for a more poetic speculative engagement with the material because its necessarily inaccessible as-is, but damn. Harman's answer/bit on what's happening there, or how objects touch at all is to basically shrug and say 'my niece is pretty smart, maybe she'll figure it out'.

>400 page fight over 20 years
academics amirite?

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>>52422118
honestly these days im just reading negarestani and meillassoux

picked up 'capital as power' which seems pretty great
also looking into some donna haraway
too bad Land became a racist...

>>52422426
They seem like the best parts of the lot. I think they're mostly lumped in with rather than specifically being part of the milieu too.

Capital as power does look neat.

I'm mixed on haraway. The companion species manifesto had a lot of good points and worked well as a follow up to her cyborg stuff, but her perspective is fairly structural. Have you checked out Katherine Hales? I read How We Became Post Human a while ago, but want to pick up a copy of My Mother Was A Computer.

I'm rereading Difference & Repetition right now. Basically realizing I read stuff in a weird order and didn't get as much out of the deleuze as I could with a more rounded background.

Land didn't really do it for me.

What do you play/run? I'm always curious what poli/phil theory people play game wise. I've got an apocalypse world group, sometimes we play The Quiet Year/Deep Forest. Want to play Microscope or Kingdom with a bunch of theory people. Seem like it would be cool.

>>52422105
Chimpanzees get themselves drunk in the wild.

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-33050939

I expect that something that wouldn't alarm an animal won't alarm the vessel.

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>>52422667
ill look into katherine hales
so far capital as power has been really well written

i read things in the same way, creates more of a spiderweb of association

im actually an artist who uses collectible miniatures and /tg/ concepts in my work, all through a negarestanian philosophical standpoint

really happy to have found this thread, im fairly lonely when it comes to talking about this stuff.

>>52422862
pic related
negarestani's concepts of the insider/oil/inhuman, tunneling, rats and the cosmic abyss are all kinda present in something like the skaven (and the actual models made from plastic), more so in this picture alone

>>52422862
The (w)hole(y) space around the kingrat swarm works really well with age of sigmar's realms and manifestations as non-linear distributions of malevolence. Skaven as representations of oil-intelligences made manifest is pretty funny when I think about it. Nice.

I'm trying to find ways to incorporate more speculative/radical theory into scifi writing. New wave did a passing thing with anthropology, but everything cyberpunk and afterwards is mostly military/transhumanist stuff and I think there's room for weirder stuff. Neat to see other people finding ways to work with odd theory materials.

You have a site I can keep any eye on for your work?

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>>52415249
>Demiurge

>>52423029

ellisvonsternberg.com

accelerando by charlie stross was still pretty tech oriented but had some excellent speculative economics and functionalist intelligence in it

ill be updating the site soon with my latest stuff
thanks for taking interest!

>>52423239
I've got some stross kicking around I haven't made time to read. I'll check that out soon. Cool thanks.

Its kind of funny that someone could do at least a decent paper on age of sigmar as representative between conflict of the solar/arboresque hegemony and chaos as hegelian dialectics (the end times being the previous iteration) while skaven are gnawing away and trying to undermine/undercode the entire universe.

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>>52423200

>>52423364
im bouts to go to bed but thanks for talking pal
ill be around /tg/ again no doubt

>>52419908
>doggy dog

Most of the time people here would make fun of you for that mistake.

The phrase is "dog eat dog". It's meant to convey that something is incredibly fucked up because dogs, one of the most loyal pack oriented animals, should not be practicing cannibalism, which would be the ultimate sin against the pack.

>metaphysics

>>52426070
No one would make fun of him. People making such mistakes are a diamond dozen

>>52426764
You shouldn't take such things for granite.

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>>52414610
>>52422105
>I try to kill the vessel every night at the bar but it likes it

>>52423865
Never seen someone seriously attempt to claim that a freeform faffest devoid of rules is superior to the most widely accepted and enjoyed role-playing system ever devised.

>>52414519
thats the year i was born old man