>The kingdom is ruled by a Dark lord who Studies Dark magic

>>52389919
Kill the Dark Lord and keep his form of government. A good idea is a good idea but this fuck still needs to be smited.

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>>52389919

>>52389919
Sound like a job for THE MURDERHOBOS

>>52389919
Why is Dark Magic considered dark? Is it just shadow manipulation, or what?

I need more information, can I put this on hold for a little while?

>>52389919
What exactly are his crimes, aside from reading books? Sounds like he's doing a lot of good for his people. Unless he's doing some serious evil elsewhere, killing him would probably harm more innocents than leaving him.

>>52389919
I'm playing in a skulls and shackles campaign. We are pirates.
Apparently pirates pretending to be paladins.
I blame this idea on the anti-paladin. She's a shitface.

Lets loot and plunder?

>>52389919
>meritocracy instead of Nobility
WIll inevitably lead to corruption and nepotism, as anyone, even those not blessed by virtue and kindness, will try to get into positions of power. In a world were the powers of good truly exist, you shouldn't give the power of authority to everybody.
>modernize the economy from an agricultural base to a manufacture and service base
Thousands of people will lose their jobs and be forced to work humiliating factory work, under bad condition. Or will do nothing but slave away selling things they don't own.
>castle towns were developed as the center and basis of local economies
Entire landscapes get depopulated and is now prey to beasts. People are penned up in smaller homes, dirty streets, out of touch with the land of their forefathers.
>And ending the Civil war That Plagued His Country
And yet the new fighting begins.

Hang that man.

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>>52389919
>this thread again

>>52390007
It meddles with things that men should not and generally involves spells that could be described with, "This can not end well" in some way while being used for selfish ends.

In OP's case, I'm assuming he used to claim power and is actively seeking more power.

As a paladin, I would feel the need to remind him, "You either die a hero, or live long enough to become the villain."

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>>52389919
Being a PALADIN of JUSTICE and VIRTUE, clearly I rescind my loyalty to an outdated system whose only virtue was having a dedicated class to the protection of the peasantry and join the "Dark" Lord's empire. Seek to steer him towards the path of at least public righteousness to avoid conflict. If not then this >>52389931 is a good solution, if I can somehow find a way to legitimize myself (or my preferred candidate/puppet) in the eyes of the masses.

>>52390059
>Will inevitably lead to corruption and nepotism
As will every system. Enter the paladin, who RIP and TEAR into corruption for GREAT JUSTICE.

>Thousands of people will lose their jobs and be forced to work humiliating factory work, under bad condition.
...Now I'm stuck somewhere between "rise of the proletariat" and "communism doesn't work". Maybe some vague in-betweeny syndicalism works? Fuck I don't know, I'm just a paladin.

>Entire landscapes get depopulated and is now prey to beasts.
RIP AND TEAR
SELL THEIR HIDES
PROFIT (unless syndicalism doesn't allow profit? Fuck I dont know, I'm still just a paladin)

>And yet the new fighting begins.
RIP
AND
TEAR

>>52389919
>meritocracy
literally impossible

>>52390330
Explained

>>52390074
What's wrong

>>52390291
That's not very paladin like

Just let the thread die.

>>52389919
Enquire about the pension plan for soldiers.

Probably join the Dark Lord's new nation.

Hunt down the rebels like my Dark Lord commanded?

>>52389919
Just because people say he's a dark lord and does dark magic doesn't mean he's evil. I gotta ping that shit first.

>>52395960
>Enquire about the pension plan for soldiers.
Depends on what rank you gave anon.

>>52390291
This is what a Bernie voter looks like.

>>52389919
I ask my DM to stop self-inserting into campaign.

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>>52389919
a) Wait 'til he fucks up control over his dark magic and shit goes tumblin' down to get proper support. It's not called Dark magic for nothing, is it?

b) Research stuff around him, probably he's hiding some vile secrets, reason for suspicion is above.

If he's clean, your dark magic doesn't dark at all

>>52397059
Ranks for the previous or foreign regimes are non transferable.

Dark Lord and his officers do not know you. They do not trust you. You want the good pay then you work your way up the ladder like the rest of the people do. There are no short cuts. Trust is earned, not given.

>>52390330
How?

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>>52397182
>Ranks for the previous or foreign regimes are non transferable.
>Dark Lord and his officers do not know you. They do not trust you. You want the good pay then you work your way up the ladder like the rest of the people do. There are no short cuts. Trust is earned, not given.

Fuck him. Why Should I, a gifted individual, be force to start at the bottom, like some fodder? He must be dispose for the greater good.

>>52390059

- A) Nobility is a form of nepotism, B) in a world where good is unambiguous anyone can be good.

- Factory work is worse than dealing with shitty animals how?

- Good, space for nature and mankind

>>52397096

Good. He is the only decent voice in american politics

>>52389919

>Picture a party of literal hobos
>Wearing rags, fighting with the rusty sword that they found on whichever NPC they shanked first
>Eventually murder their way to the dark lord
>Ask them why all this destruction, all this pain and death
>"BECAUSE YOU'RE GEVIL :DDDDDDDDDDD"

Another successful campaign for the murderhobos

>>52400036
>Decent
>Wants to implement systems from other countries
>No modifications just larger scale
>No way anything could go wrong

I like alot of his points but his ultimate goals without some tweaks and restrictions would lead for ruin. No refunds

>service base in a medieval meritocracy

I don't need to do anything his own hubris will destroy the nation and bring back the civil wars.

>>52400162
>>service base in a medieval meritocracy
Wasn't there a few real life kingdoms that did this?

>>52400186
Yeah, in fact _____________not really_____________

>>52400036
You are either an idiot or painfully uninformed. Watch his debate against Ted Cruz the geriatric gets blown out on every point and constantly resorts to appeals of emotion because he loses in facts.

The best example of this is that his tax the wealthy plan would also include small business owners who are constantly on the edge of losing money due to the costs of stuff like employee insurance and the failing economy (As a whole the world economies are on an upswing but that's almost entirely in the money sectors like banking and it has 0 effect on purchasing power of people).

With an enforced minimum wage and increased taxes most businesses would bite the bullet and automate basically everything they can because the turnover is so high for minimum wage jobs thanks to over a decade of stagnant wages meaning hard work is basically worthless since even in a managerial position people are only making an extra 50 cents an hour.

I think objectively you have to look at setting and ask some questions...
Did he overthrow a rightful, just, and competent ruler? If so yeah play ball, otherwise it can be more complicated.

Assuming the characters are not native to the kingdom, them taking action could be considered an act of war and have political implications. Of course there could be a kingdom that wants to hire adventures (that they can disown in case of failure) to cause trouble if not slay the 'evil king' outright.

Of course how do the locals feel about this? Not all may agree, the question is how peaceful or oppressive it is for the people. It could look great on the surface but actually be oppressive underneath. Of course you could also be dealing with angry nobility upset they have to work for a living...

>>52399639
Because if you are a gifted individual you should have no problems rising to the top.

Throwing an entitled hissy fit is a good demonstration of why you shouldn't be given a position of authority.

>>52400590
It's a shit mentality

There should always been an aptitude test at the start especially in fantasy settings.

"Oh you can bench press an Ox and hold 10 different tournament trophies in your name, well we don't know you so get started on peeling those potatoes because we aren't sure if you are warrior material"

And before you bring up the betrayal/trust shit then literally just don't put him in a commanding or powerful position and instead place him within a group of other similarly powerful people who you can trust and when they eventually vouch for him he can start getting duties that require trust.

>>52389919
Kill him, he's trying to make the life of the peasant better, and he's phasing out the fat-paying nobles that actually pays for killing dragons and so on.

>>52390112
Is there solid evidence that his tampering with the magic won't end well? Is he actively performing blood sacrifice to fuel his magic or something?

I'm sceptical of the whole scenario. He's generally implementing policies that will benefit both the populace and the kingdom, and all I have to count against him is that he is using 'dark magic'.

>>52400664
>"Oh you can bench press an Ox and hold 10 different tournament trophies in your name, well we don't know you so get started on peeling those potatoes because we aren't sure if you are warrior material"
But their right. How does that translate in wielding a weapon?

>>52390059
>WIll inevitably lead to corruption and nepotism
Implying aristocracies are not corrupt as hell to begin with.
>Thousands of people will lose their jobs and be forced to work humiliating factory work
Factory work>Farm work.

>>52390059
A) NIgga What. Nobility is a form of nepotism and its the luck of the draw if your lord is nice or mean.
B)Even if that is so. How is that any different when they were serfs? Besides from the description, this dark lord might try to implement some workers right.
C)Honestly Inevitable. Its Either nor or later.
D)And you are given the chance to decline and perhaps out of the goodness of your heart warn the Dark lord

>>52389919
Consequence be damned, he's still got the title of Dark Lord. Maybe if he was just a werewolf or a vampire he could slide under the radar, but "Dark Lord"s don't get a free pass.

>>52403954
>he's still got the title of Dark Lord.
Does it matter? Of course it does, such titles allow you to break the world into light and dark, categorize it. Perhaps he is neither, and he hold both as what they are, pieces of a whole. Know that he is a leader to a nation, and that is enough.

>>52401186
>Is there solid evidence that his tampering with the magic won't end well? Is he actively performing blood sacrifice to fuel his magic or something?
What if he's merely studying it?

>>52407338
Then kill him

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>>52389919

wait awhile for the paladins to do the most damage they can, then charge in with my horde and kill everyone, it's the only way to secure the throne for myself!

>>52408431
Good plan

>>52407999
By that logic we should outlaw chemotherapy because it's origins are morally dubious.

>>52402739

working your own farm>factory work>working in someone else's farm

Corrected it for you friendo

>>52402739

>turning blind at 16 from chemical burns at the textile mill is preferable to living until a quick death at 48 from being gored by a bull

I don't understand. It's a Dark Lord, his factories are obviously going to be Victorian levels of safety standards at best.

>>52409239
That's making considerable assumptions about how his society is structured.

It's possible that he is more interested in promoting an agrarian society with the industrial needs met by pre-industrial means.

This is going to lead to a weakened nation compared to it's neighbours who are abandoning cottage industry in favour of factory industry. The "Dark" Magic is making up the difference and therefore demonized by the competing neighbour nations who either feel threatened because of their own insecurities or want to annex the fertile farmland.

His title of Dark Lord is intentional, his increased skill at magic is carefully honed and everything from his spiky armour worn on all state occasions to the design of the royal palace are designed to promote the image of evil incarnate so as to intimidate foreigners into negotiating peace.

>>52400025
>- Factory work is worse than dealing with shitty animals how?
Stick your hand in a machine and you'll lose it in the most horrific crunchy way possible. Also you're 8.
Stick your hand in an animal, and you might, key word might, if you did it wrong, get kicked. This is a bit less horrific but probably still lethal.

>>52409122
We should

>>52400664
People who feel entitled are always shitty picks for higher positions. They never feel like it's good enough. In the situation you proposed, an aptitude test could very well be in place, it just doesn't put you in a place of power immediately. If you've scored high, then you're placed with people in positions of little power but that require high degrees of strength or skill. In time, whether it be short or long, you may prove yourself trustworthy and move up.

>>52409343
You do know you die if kicked by a farm animal

>>52410921
>This is a bit less horrific but probably still lethal.
Nah, I had no idea.

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>>52389919
>Rebels will plunge the country into another civil war
>They hire paladingdongs probably because they do it to feel good about themselves, so the rebels won't have to pay them
>They don't want to pay them because they can't pay them, because they are broke-ass rebels
>Paladins, after overthrowing the dark lord, might start looking into other mages who benefited from the loosening of laws concerning magic

It's not that I feel touched by rebels' cause, or appalled by Dark Lord's breaches of natural law, but I never appreciate a witch-hunt, especially a literal one.

>>52411070
Well now you are informed

>>52409326
Is he dare I say /ourguy/

>>52409326
You arbitrarily deciding that a part of the description set out by OP is inaccurate it's an assumption itself. OP said he is a Dark Lord, he is probably a Dark Lord. Plus, OP never said his magic was relevant to the economy.

I'm gonna kill him for being a contrived edgelord

>>52400089
God I hate players

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>>52414034
>Guys just trust me on this! He's DEFINITELY a dark lord! We have to kill him!
>Whoa are you seriously asking for evidence to back up my claim?! Are you kidding me?
"""Dark""" Lord did nothing wrong, and if you keep this shit up I'm going to borrow a gyrocopter from the Gnomes and give you a free ride in it.

>>52395618
Sums up every Paladin thread.

Defeat Assad

Is he overthrowing the local religions of Good Dieties in favor of Evil ones, because his relationship and motives related to religion could be the key point in knowing if he is the Anti-Christ.

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>>52414329
>if you keep this shit up I'm going to borrow a gyrocopter from the Gnomes and give you a free ride in it.

Chuckled/10

>>52409326
Not that other guy, for real that guy is a retard, but you are making shit up to make your argument "correct".

>This is going to lead to a weakened nation compared to it's neighbours who are abandoning cottage industry in favour of factory industry. The "Dark" Magic is making up the difference and therefore demonized by the competing neighbour nations who either feel threatened because of their own insecurities or want to annex the fertile farmland.
You made this shit up

>It's possible that he is more interested in promoting an agrarian society with the industrial needs met by pre-industrial means.
Pure conjecture

>Be named D'arc
>Everyone calls you Lord Dark because peasants
>Distant paladins hear of a Dark Lord and smite first, ask questions later

>>52414599
Well since O.P said he was studying it. I assume no

>>52409326
I like it.

He's a classical Dark Lord in his Dark Fortress, long time in the Dark Lording Business. In fact there seems to be fewer and fewer Dark Lords around these days. Certainly not big menacing bastards in spiky black armour who would call themselves Dark Lords. Now it's all Arch-Duke this or Serene Empress that or Doge something or another. In fact you haven't had word from another Dark Lord in same time.

And you don't care for any of the rulers of your neighbor realms at all. You always followed a certain code, as befitting any proud Dark Lord. But they don't. Back in the old days war was a wonderful thing. Glorious warriors charging forth with blood in their eyes and foam in their mouths swords and axes swinging everywhere and the strong prospering and accumulating land and women and riches from the weak. Now half starved and fearful conscripts barely old enough to grow their first chin hairs are herded into cannon fire. Where is the glory in that?

And you don't approve of how they treat the underclasses either. Back in the good old days productive and compliant peasants were a valued resource. Sure you might have been a bit intimidating, dished out a few beatings and a rapes like all Dark Lords do but it was never with hate. Why would you be hateful towards your own people? It would be like looting your own fortress. But these new breed of rulers? What the fuck dude? How many die in the mines? How many are maimed and poisoned and mangled in the factories? How many starve and fester in the cities?

Is this the modern world? And these are the people that call you evil.

If this is the modern world it's far darker than any of your old friends ever were. The world has grown darker than ye olde dark lords. The new world stops at your borders. In here the old faiths of ash and blood endures. In here the magic of fire and bone survives. This is the Dark Land.

Are you bad enough dudes to keep out the depravities of the Industrial Revolution?

>>52415003
Sounds about right

>>52390330
Worked fine for nearly 2 centuries when the Janissaries did it.
Only fell apart when they started acting like faux nobility.

>>52396659
You shall be rewarded for your loyalty.

>>52400723
dragon killing could be crowd-funded i guess.

>>52420089
This

>>52409198

Since when did peasants own their own land in the Middle Ages?

>>52423153
They didnt. Anon is lying

>>52389931
> the Nobility wants you to punish the merchants for siding with the dark lord and for you to turn back the clock.
>the new class of university educated bureaucrats hate you personally for undoing the man who gave them the biggest break in their lifes and will walk off the job en mass if you change ANYTHING. They will leave the country to find work else based on their strong reputation.
> the merchants hate you also and anything other then a very strong policy of appeasement will make then your enemy.
> the professional officer core is the same way.
> the highly religious common folk, of the same religion as you no less, will see your government as foreign because to them the leader IS the government. Does not even matter that much if you are a exiled member of their royal family because to got in control do to outside help. The Nobility tell them as such.
> banned acts like "Dark magic" take on a air of national pride, of rightful power been denied.
> on the plus side this is what they sing when they overthrow you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMYNfQlf1H8

>>52400590
Transnational officers were very much a thing back in the day. You hired then because they had seen combat, sometimes a lot of it. They were known skilled individuals. If they are coming to a army running on "meritocracy" they see it as code for "we are not letting rich fucks buy rank" and thus view it a a better place to advance. If they do want you are saying they do (and a number of rulers did) they see it as "we do not like foreigners".

>>52423713
What is a Yeoman? There was a lot of people who owned land in fee simple and worked it rather renting it out. A lest in England. In the HRE smallholds were a touch larger so it was common to have payed farm hands rather then doing it yourself or having tenants.

>>52424179
>What is a Yeoman?
A sergeant

>>52416143
Sounds fucking interesting to be honest

>>52414062
How is he a edgelord

>>52390330
>>meritocracy
True Meritocracy has never been tried anon.

>>52389919
Remind the dm his party is rallying behind a Russian plant.

>>52389919
Ask the dark lord to pay me more to deal with the rebels

>>52428163
Name your price mercenary

>>52414526
But he's the good guy

>>52390008
Just reading those books

>>52389919

This man is super-dead. Once he's dead, I'm re-instituting the monarchy, with the grateful nobles owing large tithes to the Church and the Order.

We're going to kill his ass.

>>52407338
Studying blood sacrifice?

I mean, I dunno, seems a little suspect if you ask me, but I'm not gonna send in the God Squad because some bloke is interested in some depraved shit.

If I get the scent that he intends to actually perform blood sacrifice then he's getting geeked.

>>52416143
Sounds like a pretty good setup for a traditionalist vs industrial revolutionary setting, where the traditionalists aren't depicted as backwards. I mean, magic usually fills the gap anyway, but it's still interesting.

>>52431131
But why?

>>52431182
What if blood sacrifice just requires blood, not human blood specifically? Get that magic shit hooked up to a slaughter house. Kind of like a really grizzly nuclear power plant i guess.

>>52416143
I like this. Vaguely reminds me of the Overlord videogame.

>>52432298
No

>>52436649
Yes.

>>52437006
Maybe

>>52424823
a landholder you dumbass

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>>52389919
Smite Evil.

>>52415003
Strangely thematic names are a good sign of a upcoming prophecy, those Paladin's did the right thing.

>>52439191
>upcoming prophecy
This is your answer for everything. Just accept you did wrong

>>52437081
idk

>>52432298
>What if blood sacrifice just requires blood, not human blood specifically? Get that magic shit hooked up to a slaughter house. Kind of like a really grizzly nuclear power plant i guess.
You are no Paladin. A true Paladin would kill him.

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>>52442981
Never said I was.

>>52389931
What if the rebels are the dispossessed nobility who are just pissed off they've lost power and want to bring back the bad old days?

CHOOSE

>>52390059
>the factory work is bad work meme
speaking as a rust belter, please give us back our factories.

>>52443672
i did my part at the voting booth, i hope you get your jobs back.

>>52443672
Those jobs aren't coming back

>>52443672
They're never coming back, you bitch. You got played.

>>52403954

>Consequence be damned, he's still got the title of Dark Lord.

Let's not jump to conclusions here...

What if the title 'Dark Lord' is just in reference to the fact that the Lord is a black guy?

>>52443672
Do you want the work?

Or do you just want to live comfortably while not having to think too hard about what you need to do?

You don't need factories for either.

>>52418601
>no Janissaries were ever promoted due to favors
source

>>52427309
because no one is master-autist/robot enough to put emotions completely aside while still retaining the perfect intellect to judge deeds and abilities accurately

>>52432298
>What if blood sacrifice just requires blood, not human blood specifically? Get that magic shit hooked up to a slaughter house. Kind of like a really grizzly nuclear power plant i guess.

This was the story of A Machine for Pigs

>not using magical methods to determine if any potential noble is good, and testing potential nobles for their wisdom before granting them power, chastising the slothful sons and rewarding the studious
>not governing like Charlemagne and raising up even studious lower class to powerful bishop positions and the like
Step up. Genuine nobles are the best to rule, being well taught to do that were others weren't, or are something like a force of nature with a great capacity for conquest that asserted themselves into power anyways: if they're not those they're just regular men with an extra title, though even that tended to not be as bad as we've portrayed them. They can be dicks but they tended to be functional thanks to the moral restrictions of their spirituality. Genuine meritocracy isn't likely to do anything to those people unless it ends up like what we have now.

Modern "meritocracy" in my experience has always devolved into bureaucratic brown nosing and good old boy systems with no upsides, being divorced from any higher principles: it's an aristocracy of liars. I'd prefer the honesty, honestly.

If the dark lord is evil like the title suggests, it'll be the above but filled with his evil followers.

I'm also not a fan of any kind of early industrialization or most early cities myself and would rather just deal with the animal shit honestly. Less plagues, more self sufficiency as a nation. It could be done right, it's just historically it wasn't and I don't expect the dark lord to care much about sanitation or worker safety standards. Hopefully I'm wrong.

Since the kingdom is ruled by him, ending a civil war seems to suggest there's a rival claim to the throne: if it's better and he's a good guy, I'd support it. Evil needs to be smited or better yet, redeemed, but you have to be cautious with how you go about it so nobody else gets hurt. I'd like to chat with the dark lord about our differing views if he's reasonable.

I seek to learn more.

>>52444428
So you voted for hillary also?

>>52444858
Source

>>52441183
What was the question?