If Karn joins the Jacewatch I will lose it.

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The Gatewatch was a mistake

>>52368620
>Gatewatch
wut?

>>52371567
basically a super special club of planeswalkers who once got together to stop two fuckpowerful eldrazi titans from turning an entire world into dust and bismuth, while some random fuck demon tries to be a random fuck. It consists of a spunky lesbian, a useless elf, the physical embodiments of lawful good and neutral evil, a special snowflake that doesn't call home, and a bara furry. This club is also slowly growing in ranks with a lot of older characters people recognize because if there's one thing Magic needs it's a recurring theme of cards that get printed every block with a story line that follows these chucklefucks through every plane they visit.

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>>52368620
This got me thinking. The Gatewatch just keeps growing. Each block since their inception they've gained a new member. In a year's time, they'll be nearly unstoppable if the trend continues. With only 5 members, they've already managed to take out the three eldrazi titans, the biggest, most ferocious beings alive. Now imagine the Gatewatch with Ugin and Karn on their side. With such an unstoppable cast no evil could stand up to the Jacetice League.

The Gatewatch are endangering the storyline of magic, and in doing so, the game itself. It goes to say, then, in a metanarrative perspective, that the Gatewatch are actually the villains of MTG, threatening the series with their blandness.

The only one who can save us from this awful fate is the true hero, the Planeswalker who's been with us the longest: Bolas. If Bolas can disband or cripple the Gatewatch in Amonkhek, he can delay the further stagnation of MTG's already poor writing. The fate of Magic is in his hands.

>>52371892
I gonna be honest, I doubt Ugin is joining the 'watch. He's definitely something of a TN character and Wizards is establishing his as having beef with the gatewatch over killing the Titans, Jace especially.

Karn, though, I can definitely see. I hope to GOD that doesn't happen though. But fuck, I'll probably still follow the story anyway 'cuz I dunno.

>>52371567
The Superfriends Justiceleague Communityactionpals Rainbowcoalition.

>>52371892
>seeing their power Bolas petitions to join the Gatewatch
>gets accepted and promises to use his powers for good from now on

>>52371567
It's called the Jacetice league, you alt right trolls

>>52371892
>Bolas kills them all

>>52372050
That's what I hope they're setting up

I don't know about you, but I'm excited for the Injacetice league, starring Nicol Bolas, Tibalt, and Nahiri.

>>52372013
>He's lying.
>Bolas influences recruitment choices until the Jacetice League becomes a Bolashood of Evil.

>>52372091
>Nicol Bolas treating anyone as an equal
>Nahiri willingly allying herself with someone she'd see as evil
>Either of them deigning to even interact with Tibalt

I'd say Nixilis, Vraska, Tibalt, and Ashiok are good candidates for a Bad Guys Team Up.

Bolas is still sorta his own faction, with the only other current member being Tezzeret after the Khans block.

>>52372091
Lilli defects and it'll be fucking worth. Bonus points if they appeal to get better nature, she agrees to join them again, and then hexes them the second their backs are turned because "You dumb shits I already betrayed you once, clearly you're not cut out for this"

>>52372154
>bad boy teenagers club of magic
My body is ready

>>52372154

There's also a cruel irony that a rag tag group of shitty planeswalkers would be far greater writing then what we have in Jacetice

>>52372218
I'd pay money for a TV show about a bunch of kidwalkers who have lighthearted adventures while still being totally canon
> go to Innestrad
> destroy a bunch of eldritch horrors
> realize that they're people who got mindraped by momma
> episode ends without any payoff
> next episode starts with them crossing "Innestrad" off a list and being chipper as always
MtG should be so much darker than it already is

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>>52368620
>tfw Garruk axe murders the entire Gatewatch

>>52372404
I'm still not sure how Garruk was G instead of GB in the first place, or at the least GR. He was all about that freedom, strength is all that matters, despite being trained in some druid powers. He's not exactly the best example of green, which is meant to at least care about all life.

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>>52372427
Green is survival of the fittest, and he's ripped.

>>52372404

>Oath of Garruk
>Just a bloody axe on the floor
>When (x) enters the battlefield destroy target planeswalker.
>"There's one down."

>>52372700
10/10. Little bitch Nissa first hopefully, so Green goes back to being >>52372507
Dwarf planeswalkers when?

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>>52372404
God, I fucking wish.

>>52372427
Because green is about the natural order and survival of the fittest. Gay elves are green white. Garruk should stay green

>>52372759
is this porn

>>52372148
I like this twist

All you guys who don't like the mtg story:
If you don't like the mtg story, that's fine. I don't like it either. I think wizards of the coast aren't doing a very good job right now, and aren't producing anything I like.

That's fine.

Stop following their stories, stop playing in their tourneyments, and play causal games with your friends. You can make up your own rules, allow whatever cards you like, and have more fun.

and if you don't have friends, just go to your lgs and do the same thing with whoever hangs around on off days.! Lol! You won't even have to pay for a tourneyment!

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>>52368620
>still caring about the lore
The ongoing story has been fucked since Time Spiral, and the nuwalkers lost any hope of redeeming themselves somewhere around Return to Ravnica. As a massive lorefag who's currently in the process of buying all the pre-revision novels he can find just to have some worthwhile MtG literature, I say to you: it's time to let go, anon. Make your own stories. Wizards doesn't have any left in them.

>>52373010
Maybe? idk, I saved it a few weeks ago courtesy of another anon.

>>52373090
lol!

>>52373087
lol that's why I don't read it! Just play the game for fun, and go watch shows you like on tv or something. Why do you care about the "official" story? LoL!

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>>52373087
>Make your own stories.
Is that an invitation to start another MTG snowflake thread?

>>52373087
> make your own stories
Can fucking do, I'm planning to run a full quest involving actual games at the end of the year

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>>52373010
It's apparently safe but you never know.

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>>52373114
Looking at that profile I'd invite you to look into pre-Lorwyn Magic lore, which is where the real good stuff is. Wizards makes it hard to find these days but you won't regret it.

>>52373120
Sounds tops, anon, I hope it goes well and I hope you post the results here.

>>52373114
Lol! Absolutely! Those are honestly more fun than reading anything wizards releases.

>>52373120
lol!

>>52373128
That website gets thing wrong all the time! I think its definately porn. Lol!

>>52373139
lol! My dad had a theme deck! It used banding creatures! He always beat me! I think bands with other legends is still a useless ability though.

>>52373010
It is, a porn version of a pilot cartoon called
The Modifyers. It was pretty good. The cartoon I mean, not the porn.

>>52373176
lol~

I'm sure you enjoyed the porn too!

My best outcome would be this
>next big threat faces the jacetice league
>shit is going down, dire straights
>Chandra & Gideon go down
>Liliana has to step up
>out of fucking no where Garruk
>Garruk kills Liliana, finally finding justice
>shit Garruk we needed that black mana
>Garruk changes from Green/Black to Black
>rises to the occasion
>Garruk's Oath
>it's literally counter synergy to the other Oaths and ticks off planeswalker life each turn
If only

>>52373215
lol! Why spend this much time hoping someone else will make something that you enjoy, when you can make it yourself.

Go, anon! Be free! Fly like a biiiird
hehe

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>>52373239
What implores you to write lol! in every post? What lurks in the mind of lol!anon?

>>52373260
loooooooooL!

>>52373139
I've read summaries of the pre-lorwyn lore on wiki's and such. Any novels you'd recommend?

>>52373307
lol! The arena novel is pretty good! It has some good characters and a super steamy scene in a bath house!

>>52373215
>>shit Garruk we needed that black mana
Is that literally why they needed Lilliana? Don't they know that even multiple mages can channel all five colors regardless of their color identity, if they gather the mana bonds?

This new fucking lore man, it's garbage.

>>52373392
Lol! Why are you even paying attention to this story if you don't like it! I don't read it at all

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>>52373307
Arena is indeed fantastic, but that's pre-revision lore. The best of post-revision is generally agreed to be the Urza saga. My favorite book is The Brothers' War, and it and its sister novels are conveniently collected into two anthologies, Artifacts Cycle I and II. Aside from that-

If you like eastern mythology, you'll enjoy Kamigawa and Tetsuo's Legends cycle, the latter of which features Nicol Bolas' first major starring role.

If you like long, character driven storylines, Weatherlight saga is basically everything the Gatewatch is trying and failing to be. The quality has its ups and downs, but everything is highly connected to the cards, so if you like it it's easy to make a theme deck around it.

If you like pulpy detective adventures, then Ravnica will do you nicely. It's somewhat like Terry Pratchett's Night Watch by way of MtG.

Mirrodin and Odyssey/Onslaught largely read like big RPG adventures with lots of boss fights, simple smashy fun with likeable protagonists.

The Ice Age cycle has the quality writing of The Brothers' War at a smaller scale, and features Jaya Ballard, Chandra's much-more-likeable prototype.

As far as pre-revision, it's the best place to get lower-fantasy, medieval, grittier stories. Lots of sex, blood and moral conundrums, and this is where Planeswalkers as terrifying forces of nature were established. I can personally recommend Arena, the Gull and Greensleeves saga, and Prodigal Sorcerer (the novel that created the Viashino) as well as both of the anthologies.

>>52373454
lol! The old stories are much better because they don't take themselves too seriously!

Urza is a badass, who will pass into legend.

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>>52373454
Thanks for the rundown anon, definitely going to see if I can find a copy of Ravnica asap and the rest are going onto my reading list.

>>52373467
Can you please stop posting like a preteen redditer. It's fucking obnoxious.

>>52371892
Oh, I'm sure they'll pull a Marvel and bring out some Civil War bullshit, or Bolas will just nuke everything and PTSD them all into going their seperate ways for a few blocks until most of them come back together.

>>52373632
Lol! I don't particularly care what they do with the story, but the new cards aren't that bad!

>>52373169
>lol
>Four times in one post
>Mix of capitalisation and non-capitalisation

Is this the MtG crowd these days? Holy shit my man, you need to fucking kill yourself.

>>52368620
I'm certain Ugin would rather pull Jace, Candra and Nissa inside out for being retards than even consider joining their little cult.

>>52368620
Then again, let's hope Karn does join. Every faction he has been a part of got absolutely ruined.

>>52373700
LoL! You might not predict what they'll do in the book!

Remember, these are characters that the company uses to sell merchandise!

>Get hyped as fuck that they're bringing back Yawgmoth via Karn
>They puss out

I fucking blame Scars for all of this. It could have been so good. Fucking faggot writers..

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>>52373571
Always happy to spit lore with people. Back in the day some people played for the storyline above all else, and I hope one day that can be the case again. The days of fat packs with entire paperback novels bundled in should not be lost to time.

>>52372154
Ramaz and Baltrice too.
Bolas likes his magic hobos.

>>52373722
loL! There's plenty of good stuff in the game.

You can still have fun

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>>52373641
>>52373467
>>52373412
>>52373325
>>52373286
>>52373214
>>52373169
>>52373107
>>52373710
>>52373757

>lol

>>52373736
lol those were the best.

I was a bit young at the time, so my daddy didn't let me read the naughty bits (.>.)

>>52373684
It's not just the MTG crowd, he's shitposting in at least 2 other threads right now. He's just farming (you)'s.

>>52373805
I wouldn't be inclined to give him that much credit. I think hes new and thinks that vernacular is acceptable here.

>>52373821
:(

>>52373828
Also unacceptable
Call me a faggot and don't uses these faggot ass emotes you fucking pussy.

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So how long is it going to take for WotC to actually do something with all this build-up? Cause it sounds like they should at least be putting out 4 minute webisodes just to get everyone clear on what's happening where and when with each set.

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>>52373632
>Gatewatch: Civil War

>>52373835
lol! You're quite disrespectful, so I don't have do do what you say.

Bleh! :P

>>52373838
I've said it once, I'll say it again. Animated series, it's the only way to go

>>52373867
lol that might actualy be cute!

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>>52373849
If this is bait I take it back, I'm impressed anon
It takes skill to come across as this retarded

>>52373841
It's depressing because it's so fucking obviously what they're gonna do with it.

>>52373915
lol why do u even care

>>52373867
So basically the best way it would work is Jacetice League: Unlimited.
What's the voice cast?

>>52373948
Nicol Bolas by whoever's voicing Aku in Samurai Jack season 5 right now.
Everyone else is literally disposable.

>>52373948
>>52373969
lol they'll do everything slow and dramatic to make people want it even though its bad.

I'll ignore it for 6 months and then watch the good episodes my friends tell me! LOL

>>52373993
I should have been asleep an hour ago but I'm genuinely curious as to when you're going to quit you're shitposting. You are a spectre haunting this board. All the threads on the front page of /tg/ are afflicted by it.

>>52373392
>>52373412
>get enough random mages together and you can channel all 5 colors of mana, no big deal
That's fucking stupid, and broken. Get over your shitty old lore, nostalgiafags.
Even with all its faults newschool story is good. Could be better, definitely, but it's good.

>>52374125
Clearly needs more pandering to transexuals, minorities, and women.

>>52374630
Like I said, could be better. I still haven't forgiven them for making Liliana, the Last Hope have overcompensating swag art when in the context Vs Emrakul (see trailer + article) she was defiant but also somber and lonely.
And when they officially previewed her card that Asian cuck presenter they had on was praising the stupid swag art, fucking gushing like the retarded yes-man he is.

But yeah otherwise pretty good.

>>52368620
>the writing for this property is shit
>become emotionally invested in the writing of this property
>complain about shit writing
You brought this on yourself.

>>52373215
>Garruk kills Liliana, finally finding justice
>shit Garruk we needed that black mana
>Garruk doesn't give a fuck
>he walks out with looking back

>>52374720
Drawing scared women is sexism.

>>52373763
I really want to just filter them but I don't know how to do it without filtering a ton of perfectly fine posts.

>>52373841
>>52373915
>>52373632

So if they DO pull a civil war, which im sure they will, what will the sides be like?

I feel like we'll have Jace and Gideon leading one side, with Chandra and Nissa leading the other.

Maybe we'll have lilliana join one side, then backstab and join the other at the last moment.

Tamiyo will come back and join Jace and Gideon, as will Ajani.

Tibalt will make an appearance on Nissa and Chandra's team, as will Sorin.

Sarhkan will probably be swinging with team lesbian.


And we'll have all the less important plansewalkers slowly picked off by Garruk (helped by Bolas) one by one, who remains neutral, until only the original Jacetice League remains and it looks like he's
Until Elspeth comes back and bands the two teams together, so it's them vs Garruk and Bolas

>>52375066
>Garruk killing off less important walkers
>Tibalt not being the first to die
Shiggy diggy doo

>>52373260
Absolutely nothing. We're not even sure he actually has a mind.

>>52373215
>Garruk's Oath
>Flavour text: "I swear I'm going to rip your fucking head off and put my dick in the hole"

>>52375098
As much as I love tibalt, he would be the first to die 100%.

Probably followed by Dovin

>>52373849
The only disrespectful person is you for going against established board cultures.
Lurk more.

>>52375346
4chan has no culture. We need open borders with other websites like Facebook and Reddit, to be enriched by their cultures. :^)

>>52372050
I would forgive Wizards for all their shitty decisions if they did this.

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>>52375391
You came to the wrong corner of the internet friendo

>>52375870
>sadistic blonde animu grill
I've been in cryonic stasis for 10 years, who is this fluid druid?

>>52373838
I maintain that MTG is far more enjoyable if you ignore the story.

>>52368620
Karn was a mistake

>>52375907
Watch Youjo Senki

It's a pretty much the story of a man who fedora'd so hard that god reincarnates him as a little girl in WW1 germany with magic. Best part of the story is fedora tipper getting trolled by god. Worst part of story is fedora tipper will not shut up about fedoras.

Worth a watch anyway.

>>52375974
I've made a terrible mistake. I'm going back to the freezer now.

>>52374897
Alas.

>>52373114
Y'know, I've been strongly considering doing something like this. Anyone got a template?

I know it's autistic but the mtgverse is highly compelling.
Would dig a discord to geek out on.

>>52374125
Actually, that was a mispost. What that meant to say is that any singular random mage can use all five colors of magic, if they try to. Color identity just indicates what you're good at. Jaya Ballard, a mono-red card, used a blue spell taught to her by Jodah to win a climactic battle that red magic wasn't doing the job in.

And no, it's not "stupid" or "broken," it makes sense in every context except the horrible X-Men esque nuwalker world where everyone is a plucky teen with a single special superpower and the ability to planeswalk.

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>>52376615
Ask and ye shall receive.

>>52376615
Maybe instead you could go kill yourself?

>>52379599
>oh no he's playing pretend on the board dedicated to playing pretend
In the end, you were the one who should have killed himself all along.

>>52379356
Well ajani was monowhite once so either wizards has gotta pull a Sarkhan-esque excuse (I still remember going "the fuck you mean he can only now use blue mana?") or explain this shit

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TIME TO POST SHITTY JACETICE LEAGUE IMAGES

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>>52380422

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>>52380437

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>>52380467

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>>52380542

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>>52380568

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>>52380595

>>52375066

I'd take a third Un- set based on an hypotetical gatewatch civil war

imagine

chandra breaks jace's favourite coffee mug, war ensues

nobody on ravnica can reach the guildpact and strange noises are coming from his manor

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This image should say everything that needs to be said.

>>52371892
>With only 5 members, they've already managed to take out the three eldrazi titans, the biggest, most ferocious beings alive.
Fuck's sake. Statements like this are how I know whining cunts like you don't even care about the lore.
They could only kill Kozilek and Ulamog because they were on Zendikar, where Nissa borders on fucking godhood because Zendikar itself (the plane) (which is fucking alive and sentient) (and has phenomenally powerful mana even among planes) personally pounds her little elf pussy whenever it possibly can. On NO other plane are they anywhere NEAR as capable of wielding such magical power.
And they didn't even beat Emrakul, Emrakul took herself out of the picture by choice. Nissa even says she couldn't kill Emrakul if she could hook herself up to Innistrad the way she hooks herself up to Zendikar. (Innistrad is not as powerful as Zendikar and Emrakul is harder to kill than the other two)
Emrakul literally uses Tamiyo as a sockpuppet to leave because she never wanted to be there to begin with.

>>52371567
A really good idea to create characters that actually hang around across different MtG storylines, creating something that resembles a coherent storyline instead of nonstop piecemeal bullshit that only the most autistic people ever gave a crap about. This causes fa/tg/uys to sperg out because they have shit taste and don't actually know how to play magic.

>>52379584
ty <3

>>52379599
</3

>>52380047
lol

>>52379356
I can't help but approach that from a gameplay perspective, where having access to multiple colors too easily makes things imbalanced.

They have been on a kick about making every color have a stronger identity, so I actually endorse the tilt toward narrower X-Men style powers. I don't think they're being too narrow either.

It actually bothers me they don't seem to reflect this direction in the game itself, where 3-4 color decks are still something you see super often.
I want to see mono and dual color decks be the norm.
I remember reading tourney reports from ye old days when monocolor decks often splashed for a second color. (Much in the way Jaya Ballard splashed blue.)
I'm actually down with that, just not on the other end of the spectrum where instead of X-men style they go Goku Spirit Bomb 'lend me your energy' style.

>>52380422
>>52380542
>>52380568
Also these are gold.

>>52380467
Who is that brown demon thing getting the candy? Ob Nixilis?

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>>52381051

>>52381273
I would enjoy it if the characters weren't boring self inserts designed just to slap on adds. I care nothing about them and making everything revolve around them takes focus away from the interesting worlds and people who actually live in them.

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Spicy new meme coming through. Suggestions for improvements?

>>52381051
>>52381327
Poor MaRo. He gets so much hate.

otoh fucker has everyone's dream job so I understand.

>>52381186
>>52381273
And these. I didn't really read into the Emrakul resolution at the time but now I feel sorry for the noodly spaghetti molestress.
But the Zendikar being a super abundant mana source was quite hammered in, quite explicit.
Nissa was pretty much able to give Chandra infinite combo levels of mana.

Also Tamiyo cucking Liliana by putting out to Jace when?

>>52381771
>"Weatherlight was a mistake!"
Does he say this every time they summon him? lol
>Phyrexian Mana symbol crest
mine sides

Also now I want to see Chandra in shorts.

>>52381276
>I can't help but approach that from a gameplay perspective, where having access to multiple colors too easily makes things imbalanced.
Well, see that's the issue. The new "special powers" approach doesn't make sense from a gameplay perspective.

Planeswalkers are a concept that was created to represent the player. That has been diluted by the Planeswalker permanent type, but it hasn't been retconned yet. And the player does not have super special powers he was born with. The player has access to all the powers every other player does- the ones he uses are determined by the ones he's collected, and the ones he chooses to put in his library.

This is (or was) reflected in lore by the planeswalkers: they constantly seek to gather new spells (collect cards) and expand their reach (play lands) in order to compete with other planeswalkers (players). Some of them may have exceptionally powerful and rare abilities, and that's a reason for other 'walkers to attack them- to claim their abilities.

Furthermore, in the old days, the stories were about the planes and the heroes on them. The planeswalkers were, typically, huge, looming forces of nature rather than the protagonists. This, too was represented well by gameplay: you, the player, can casually summon any Legendary creature, and force them to do your will or sacrifice them to Claws of Gix if you're so inclined. The fluff painted the player as the capricious god gameplay makes you out to be, rather than a feisty teenager going to Ugin's School for Gifted Youngsters.

With the nuwalkers, it's just-
"Chandra makes fire and planeswalks."
"Jace reads minds and planeswalks."
"Garruk is strong and planeswalks."
This is not reflected by gameplay. It's a failure of design. It's fine if you prefer it that way, but do try to understand where these concepts came from and why they don't gel with the modern fluff.

>>52375974
That sounds stupid as fuck.

>>52381925
I doubt they will retcon players being planeswalkers, since that's such a major hook for them in marketing.
"You are a planeswalker." You see that in a lot of their stuff.
Planeswalkers, as a card type, are effectively allies. Fellow planeswalkers you know who chip in to help but can't really be fucked doing more than their tenuous loyalty to you would allow.

As I understand oldwalkers, they were pretty crazy powerful, right? They could live with their heads cut off, needed to be killed by powerstones (read: kryptonite) I'm sympathetic to the concerns expressed by Wizards that nutso-powered beings are difficult to make into regular protagonists.

They would want to involve the planeswalkers into the stories more to allow the players themselves to find it more relateable.

You can reflect the narrow scope of any particular planeswalker in the gameplay. You just build a deck with only spells they would use, like one of their precon decks.

Even the characters you mention have more of a repertoire than you give them credit for.
Chandra has emotional magic, and gets phoenixes+elementals in cards. Jace has Illusions.

Making planeswalkers take the place of legendary creatures in the action is also just a better choice of mascot for the brand. They have these cool dudes called 'planeswalkers' and they're not gonna exploit that? Sheet.

The exploration aspect of planeswalking is relegated to character development. That's not a bad thing.
Chandra could just up and decide she wants to be a necromancer like her big sis/scissorpal Liliana, and change her spell repertoire like a deck.
The thing is being a more fleshed out character, she wouldn't want to, and she likes being a pyromancer. It's actually better than the X-Men thing because it's less about the superpower lottery they're dealt and more about their personality and motivation.

E.g: Ob Nix used black magic before his spark, which he got by taking over a world. He continues to favor it to dom more worlds.

>>52382511
So yeah the characters are just more simple and focused in their motivations. This can make them more shallow but it can also make them more well defined. It often does lead to them at least being strong characters.

>>52381925
What I would like to see is less creature summoning in the game in general to mirror the story feel of a planeswalker.

More cards to express melee/close quarters combat between planeswalkers (not creatures) would be really good.

This would help cement the departure from the omniscient/omnipotent Real Time Strategy overseeing god role the player has.

Ironically, you'd think there's more of a noncreature premise for the old planeswalkers, but they are much easier to imagine summoning hordes of creatures for combat.

In the story, we see zombies from Liliana - Ob Nixilis influencing some Eldrazi minions, but then Jace having his fleeting illusions, Nissa having a Pokemon-like pet elemental plant beast thing.
Nissa has a sword she gets into close combat with, and Gideon gets into the thick of things and brawls.

We need cards we can feel like we're doing the same with.
Let me become a 6/6 human Soldier with indestructible or equip a sword to myself and attack with please MaRo senpai.

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>yfw Tezz was building the Planar Portal to try and pull Gix out of the Blind Eternities .

>>52373010
look for modifuckers

everybody gets one

>>52382768
>What I would like to see is less creature summoning in the game in general to mirror the story feel of a planeswalker.
A lot of people want this but I doubt we can go back to it at this point. WotC has gone full The Tappening.
IMO focusing the game around creatures is a massive flavor fail. You'd expect a Magic match to make you feel like wizards battling with sorcery, not generals commanding armies...

>>52381051
I know Maro owned all those shitty Pop Vinyls, are you telling me he collects fucking Minimates too?

>>52373805
What does he do with all his (you)s?

Can Ugin and Karn join the Competent watch instead?

Can you find me other planes walkers who take their time to not screw things up?

>>52382511
I was going to type up a big long thing about why the new planeswalkers being limited has not led to them being better defined or well developed, but then I remembered you don't actually have a point of reference yet. Suffice to say, I'd recommend you read some older fluff before getting too set in your opinions.

Planeswalkers as gods didn't limit the stories, but rather helped focus them on the planes themselves rather than on recurring marketable characters. Nor did it make them unrelateable- thanks to how the spark works, fan favorite characters who we got to know as mortals could then ascend to be planeswalkers, leaving them to kick around even after we leave their home plane. For example, Karn started out as a mortal, but he's the one who created Mirrodin from whole cloth. This leads to a much more organic universe than the current method, which feels nothing so much like a theme park, where every new plane is just a backdrop for the Manateers to play out their little dramas on.

Even with the more "focused" planeswalkers, they're incredibly poor repreresentatives of their colors. For example, despite being the ostensible face of the franchise, Chandra is limited almost exclusively to flame. You say she summons things, and that is occasionally true- but all those things are on fire. It's hard to envision her summoning even such a basic red staple as a goblin, and red covers so many things – lightning, stone, the forge, creativity and even ice. Even limited to mono red Chandra represents only the literal fire and implusivity aspects. The same is true for all the other nuWalkers- they're incredibly shallow interpretations of their color identity.

>>52383581
One shudders to imagine the inhuman thoughts that drive him to collect (you)'s.

>>52373454
>recommending Onslaught block
>ever
The current stuff is better than Onslaught. Fuck Onslaught.
Especially Scourge.

>>52385435
Them's fightin words, pardner.

That said, Tempest was better.

>>52384667
This. Oldwalkers weren't necessarily the centerpoint, they just set up the plots. Neowalkers have to be the centerpiece, even over the conflict of the plane.

>>52382511
>As I understand oldwalkers, they were pretty crazy powerful, right? They could live with their heads cut off, needed to be killed by powerstones (read: kryptonite) I'm sympathetic to the concerns expressed by Wizards that nutso-powered beings are difficult to make into regular protagonists.
They were themselves fonts of endless mana. Think more Dr. Manhattan than superman: Back in the good ole thran days, Yawgmoth incapacitated a very new planeswalker by essentially sticking a blender in her brain. She still thought she needed her brain to think, so this worked. On the other side of things, after centuries of Urza's anti-phyrexia autism, he'd forget to do things like breathe or physically turn around instead of just reforming his body facing that direction. Most of them held strongly enough to an identity to stay vaguely that shape, but all of them were limited only by what they could direct their mana towards.

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>>52368620
The new plots aren't all that bad.

IT'S THE FUCKING JACEKETEERS, EVERY SINGLE TIME, THAT BRING THE STORY DOWN

I HAVEN'T FORGOTTEN THE ENITRE FUCKING STORY OF NISSA SITTING WHERE ASHAYA DIED BEING A MOPEY DOPEY FUCK WAITING FOR ASHAYA AND THEN GOING "OH, HANG ON, MAYBE ASHAYA RESPAWNED AT IT'S FUCKING RESPAWN POINT"

THAT'S THE THING, THOUGH. ASIDE FROM THE GATEWATCH AND THIER '''INPUT''' ZENDIKAR'S STORIES WEREN'T THAT BAD. HELL OB NIXILIS MADE THE GATEWATCH ENTERTAINING TOO BY WAY OF SEVERE CURBSTOMP.

AND YOU KNOW WHAT? INSANE!JACE ON INNISTRAD WAS PRETTY FUCKING ENTERTAINING. TAMIYO WAS PRETTY FUCKING BALLER. AND, AND, EMRAKUL LORDING OVER THE GATWATCH WAS AN ACTUALLY PRETTY ALRIGHT ELDRITCH HORROR STORY.

SO LONG AS YOU IGNORED THE REMAINING MEMBERS OF THE GATEWATCH

THEN WE GET TO FUCKING KALADESH, THAT POSES A LIGHTER BUT STILL SINCERELY ENGAGING PROSPECT OF WHITE VS RED, GOOD OF THE COMMUNITY VS FREEDOM OF THE INDIVIDUAL, AND FUCKING CHANDRA AND NISSA GET BALLS DEEP IN THE RED HALF AND THE STORY GETS WASHED OF ALL NUANCE, AND NOW TEZZERET IS THE ONLY NOT OK PERSON ON THE PLANE BOO HE IS THE ONE TRUE ENEMY

WORSE STILL? WORSE STILL,KALADESH STILL WASN'T THAT BAD. HELL THE ONE AETHERBORN THAT GOT A LOT OF ATTENTION WAS ACTUALLY PRETTY GOOD.

IT WAS JUST CHANDRA.

IT WAS JUST NISSA.

DRAGGED IT DOWN EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

FUCK

>>52385435
I think I owned the Legions novel, though I can't quite recall. Much less sure about Scourge. Did either one actually do anything with the Riptide Project or the new sliver breeds?

>>52382793
>Implying Tezzeret wants anything to do with Phyrexians of any variety

>>52386593
Personally, Jace is an asshole but his character can work well sometimes.
Lilli is a treasure and must be cherished
Gids is boring elspeth
Nissa is inconsistent anime trope waifu while Garruk is ass-kicking based god
It's a good thing that everyone speaks the same language on every plane, because I don't think Chandra is capable of speaking her own worlds language properly, let alone anything else

,

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DID SOMEBODY SAY FLAKE THREAD

>>52386705
The slivers weren't even mentioned.
>>52385623
I'm sorry that you found masturbating shadows to be good literature.

>>52386884
Plz advise, how do I make a UGB Walker consistent with the alignment system that isn't full edgelord?

>>52386949
Cranky old man treefolk wizard that wants everyone else to get off his goddamned lawn.

>>52386887
It was schlocky over the top nonsense, but I was twelve. Sometimes, you just wanna read the equivalent of a cheese pizza with extra cheese and cheese on top. I'm not saying it was high literature, I'm saying the action was less shit.

>>52385435
Mate, if you hate Onslaught you've just drunk Wizards' koolaid. The unmen were fucking grade A superstars, Stonebrow was a champ, it featured one of the only morally ambiguous Black organizations we've ever seen, and it was an absolute head trip. Akroma was a half-angel-half-leopard-half-Phyrexian by the end. When are we getting a reprint with art of THAT?

Also the way they reintroduced Yawgmoth was stone cold chilling. Wizards is bitches for retconning that.

>>52387812
Just because I said Scourge was worse than the current shit does not mean that the current shit is not also, indeed, shit. And it drags down the other two parts of the block just by existing.
And no, the Yawgmoth bit was not interesting at all, and I say that as someone who loved old Phyrexia. That was King throwing shit in because he felt like it. Again. 'Oh, after all that shit with the previous blocks, they just put him in time out' is not a good thing to just throw in there.

>>52388323
Nah, Yawg's bit was legit great and utterly on point for his character. "That is not dead which can eternal lie," you know- Yawgmoth and the Ninth Sphere are one and the same. Destroying his manifestation on Dominaria would very plausibly merely be a mortal wound, and leave a devastated but living Phyrexia to recover slowly over the coming centuries. Hell, it's less of an asspull than bringing back Bolas was. King probably intended this all along, Yawgmoth has had "undying evil" written all over him ever since he graduated from dickass doctor. I suspect it was a much less cavalier choice than you seem to think, and if I had to guess I'd say you only adopted that stance because Wizards told you to.

New Phyrexia proves that Wizards doesn't consider Yawgmoth's death a holy immutable truth- they're happy to exploit the name for their shitty five-color Phazon mutants and cheapen the victory won in the Invasion block just to give the Jacetice League a new toy to fight. That's a far less dignified return than King was setting up, and that's just a fact.

>>52368620
> Colorlessness oath
"I SWEAR TO GATEWATCH"
> is that fucking it
"YES"
> You fucking automaton, we've gotten more personality from Gideon in the past.

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>>52371892

>Bolas

Please

We all know the true hero who will return from death to save us from the utter faggotry of modern MTG writing.

>>52389978
> Blind Seer
> 3/3
> Has a power to control the colour of magic itself
Those oldwalkers REALLY couldn't hide their fucking powerlevels could they? Lilli must have had trouble talking to people, they'd just keel over from the sheer D E A T H that surrounds her.
Bolas was probably just a cerebral maelstrom of rape. Good times.

>>52390070
>Lili
>oldwalker

Oldwalker refers to Planeswalkers who predate Time Spiral IRL rather than in-lore. Liliana is a nuwalker, as demonstrated by the terrible writing that surrounds her, despite ostensibly being old enough to have had an unbroken spark.

>>52390084
Sorry, slip of the text. Should have been clearer, but the point stands. Pre mending/time spiral, planeswalkers must have had a hell of a hard time lowering themselves to the levels of their human peons. I mean, a blind seer... he's tough enough to wrassle a centaur token. That's fucked.

>>52386593
>pssh nothing personnel kid

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>>52389978
lol! I wish! Ursa would be so cool!

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>>52371892
>your face when Nicol Bolas, the dragon who literally enslaved the "WE WUZ KANGZ" plane, and Garruk "What's green on top and black on bottom?" Wildspeaker are going to Make Magic Great Again

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Bolas is the hero the Magic story needs, but not the one it deserves.

>>52372367
>The Gang Goes to Innistrad
>The Gang Runs from the Lhurgoyf
>The Gang Gets Indestructible
>The Gang Solves the Phyrexian Oil Crisis
>It's Always Sunny in Dominara

>>52390448
super powerful dragon dudes aren't particularly heroic

garruk is the hero

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>>52390548
>tfw we will never see Garruk stalk and kill every member of the Jacetice League one by one, thus ending the worst story arc in the history of Magic
I want off this crazy ride.

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>>52390612
>ending the worst story arc in the history of Magic
That's not Weatherlight

>>52390663
The weatherlight saga, despite its flaws, has a rather conclusive ending.

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dear highest mtg post, I bring you spoilers

>>52390448
I can't help but feel in pic related he was showing Sarkhan the future of MtG
> LOOK AT WHAT THIS KEKOLDRY HAS WROUGHT

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here's another

>>52390692
Fuck yeah bud.

>>52390519
> Like, yikes Nissa! Let's get outta here!
> Ro-kay!

My guess for Exert is "Pay this permanent's mana cost."

>>52390548
>the shittiest most boring member of the Lorwyn 5 is the hero

No wonder nuMagic sucks dick.

>>52390663

Hi, MaRo. Didn't know you liked shitty JRPGs now.

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>>52390692
>Oracle's Vault and Winding Constrictors
>Discard/Cycle and madness
Nice
>>52390745
Retort noted

>>52390158

P/T relations between different creatures has always been completely fucked.

Monsters the size of small mountains have the same P/T as guys who swing a sword pretty good, shit like that.

>>52390692
>>52390710
o lawd yus!

>>52390733
Makes sense. My first thought was grouping it in a secondary attack 'exertion' pseudo-zone.
Kinda like Soulbond Vs Enchantment attachment.

Anyway, cycling is back! I missed it. Long overdue.

>>52390794
If it's something like that I think a better execution might be the long-fabled double-tap.

>>52390692
>more fuel for Atraxa

>>52390812

wow you think this spoiler might get played in commander?????

>>52390710
>Trueheart Duelist

>>52390820
>Rare artifact
>Not played in EDH

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this one is very weird if real and I think it is (can't see loyalty, hope it's 10)

>>52390881
That's one from an intro deck, so it's guaranteed shit.

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oh look another fucking gideon that turns into an indestructible creature

jesus fuck

>>52390887

yeah just saw that. The Gideon too apparently. Ok.

>>52390891
>-10: If you are in a casual game, you win.

>-1/-1 counters are back
I'm getting excited lads, someone bring me back to reality.

>>52390891
>>52390881

STOP PRINTING THE SAME WALKERS OVER AND OVER

FUCK

>>52390881
Pretty sure the second ability is
-3: Destroy target creature with a -1/-1 counter on it.
Ultimate is much easier to make out and looks like
-10: Return all creature cards from your graveyard to the battlefield.

>>52390891
My guess at this guy's ultimate...
-10: Creatures you control get +2/+2 until end of turn for each creature your opponents control.


>>52390942
My nipples are hard too, anon.

>>52391115
>-10: Creatures you control get +2/+2 until end of turn for each creature your opponents control.
It clearly says "tap all creatures your opponents control"

>>52391115

Gideon's ultimate says "Creatures you control get +2/+2 until end of turn. Tap all creatures your opponents control."

They're honestly not hard at all to read, let me know if you can't make out any other part

>>52391154
>>52391156
ty <3, found that one harder to read and took a guess. Yours seem way more likely.
I didn't occur to me that the shorter words of the last clause might be 'Tap all' but Tap looks more obvious now.
I didn't think to process the shorter word as 'tap' and I was pretty stumped on that 'all' - looks a lot like 'of' to me.

>>52390692
Interesting that we're getting simple naked cycling with no twist. Maybe they'll give it a twist in the next set?

>>52390881
>>52390891

These are the intro deck planeswalkers, they are specifically designed to be bad.

>>52391298
Gideon isn't even bad though.

>>52390706

>wanting nu wizards to shit all over dominaria

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>>52390745
Take that back unclean one

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>>52390706
>Dominaria
>Too generic

>>52389978
>Urza
>Not Mishra

>>52390706
Fucking As'kthul. When will he be sent back down to the pit, were he belongs?

>>52390070
Bolas had to find places where leylines of blue, red, and black mana converged to hang out at or else whatever plane he parked his ass on would start to tear itself apart.

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>>52397737
Wait what?
I don't think even Superman is as powerful as some of these oldwalkers.

The plane tears itself apart?! That's some mega bullshit, like he has the density of a star or some shit.

>>52397948
Bolas was really big on that whole ULTIMATE POWER thing way back when, what with being both a planeswalker and an elder dragon.
Premending he was that powerful, yes, and needed that kind of situation because ULTIMATE POWER.
Now he doesn't and he hates that.

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>>52368620
>caring about the lore at all

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>>52398062
>Be Nicol Bolas
>You will never achieve anything close to the power you once knew.

Wow. Y'know, considering how much he cares about power, that's grounds for him to have serious clinical depression since the mending.
See flavor text of pic related.

Poor Nicol Bolas :(

>>52398355
>most powerful sapient being in the multiverse
>depressed because he's a fraction of his former might, and doesn't tower over the ones below him by as massive a margin anymore.
>it's still a big margin, but it's just...not the same

>>52393983
That's the problem its not generic enough.

What sells sets to the maximum number f peole these days are planes that can be summed up in like six words. "Gothic horror plane meets body horror" "Inventor's world with spicy curry flavor" "Egypt as ruled by Nicol Bolas". How do you sum up Dominaria? "Something that started as generic fantasy and grew to have like eight continents each with their own backstory, look, and culture, the place where most of the multiverse began, including the majority of goblins, all dragons, and lots of other stuff also there was a time apocalypse a few centuries ago a phyrexian apocalypse before than an ice age a couple hundreds of years before that and then there was the Thran."

You can't package Dominaria in a pretty little box and sell it to the kiddies in 12 5-page long short stories, and that's what Magic settings do now.

Dominaria was a setting for epic fantasy. Magic: the Gathering after like 2010 is not.

>>52398502
That's why you pick a continent, sum it up that way, and just put in references to the other stuff.
'Shitheads rebuilding after magical apocalypse'
'Wizard School explores random bullshit'
'NotAfrica returns, has resources, others don't'
'Empire flourishes, Bolas is behind it'

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>>52398983
How about we don't and spare the continents of old the modern writing team?

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>yfw the Gatewatch goes to Dominaria to stop some cosmic level threat only to find out that the citizens of Dominaria already beat it because they aren't pansies

>>52399521
>>52392358
This. We all know that if/when we go back to Dominaria it's not going to come with a break from Gatewatch fuckery. Yeah we all wish Bolas would eat them all and the story would be back to Mirrodin-Alara style but you actually have a brain deficiency if you think Wizards is gonna just kill off the group they spent two blocks and the final core set establishing. Standard set means Gatewatch and Gatewath means horrible faux-superhero storytelling.

>>52368620
Why? Karn is one of the most "good guy" planeswalkers there is.

>>52372700
>gatewatch goes to Dominaria
>somebody (Bolas) messes up their planeswalk they end up stranded on different parts of the plane
>Garruk get's tipped off about ther location
>now the Mtg Metanarrative becomes a slasher flick

>>52399544
>the gatewarch go to dominaria and get beaten by thrulls and have all their stuff nicked by post apocalyptic gypsies

>>52399730
I bet people are going to complain if Karn ends up being a giant fuckup, despite that being Karn's entire thing throughout everything forever.
Though knowing Wizards they'll make him be Super Awesome Strong Cool Dude instead of a constant fuckup.

>>52390548
Sarkhan says something else. All dragons are heroic and beautiful

>>52391298
Ajani was better than the booster one

>>52394022
Mishra is not a planeswalker thoough