/swg/ Captain Phasma Gonna Get You Edition

Once, I both opened AND closed the blast doors, simultaneously.
I was pretty proud of myself.

Phasma was such a disappointment... Even on shrooms this movie sucked. I'm glad Rogue one was better

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>>52136459
*Blam* You're dead, Bitch! Phasma got you!

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>>52136459
>literally gets thrown in the trash

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>you will never have the feeling of watching star wars for the first time as a kid again

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>>52136583
If you've never played Wing Commander, go and do it now. It's very nearly the same feeling. Don't watch the movie, though. It fucking sucked.

>>52136459
Phasma was basically this generation's Boba Fett; hyped like fuck in promotional materials, sick-ass outfit that looks cooler then most of the cast combined, totally irrelevant to the rest of the story and really easily taken out.

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>>52136608
Unlike Boba though she didn't become ridiculously popular for no reason.
That went to Mr. One-scene-wonder

>>52128049
I'm interested in playing, just need to make a roll20 account. In thinking a very Martin Freeman character, Arthur Dent mixed with Bilbo Baggins. Absolutely average stats and just wants to be comfy and rich. He got tricked into this whole thong by criminals who hired hom to fly them out to the rim in his Sorosub 3000. Long story short he ends up with a criminal record he doesn't deserve by association, and is on the rim while trying to clear his name while doing shady stuff to get by. Despite his ship and average stats he'll ve a damn good pilot since I intend to max out the specialisation tree.

>>52136622
Clearly, it's because nucanon didn't follow the formula by making her first appear in a holiday special.

>>52136622
No, Boba Fett's popularity was planned.
Seriously, my brother (who is old enough to have been a part of the generation that grew up with it) said he appeared in promotional materials a LOT for Empire and Jedi, especially Empire.
This was the era of the badass gun-toying vigilante hero's greatest popularity, and they kept playing up Boba Fett in promotional materials to be this kickass Man With No Name mysterious hardcore motherfucker. Not exaggerating that last bit either, explicit comparisons were drawn between Eastwood's character and Fett in this one magazine apparently. Fett might have had a reduced role in the film then originally planned or something, but Boba Fett was apparently hyped as cool before the movie even came out.

According to my brother;
>"In retrospect he basically does nothing and Phasma was basically the exact same thing, but when I was twelve years old I didn't even give a shit that he did nothing and was too stupid to recognize an obvious marketing ploy back then."

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>>52136608
>Boba Fett
>hyped
Pop quiz: where is Boba Fett on the original 1981 poster?

>>52136688
He was the fucking explosion. THe one guy too cool to be seen as his character so you only see the by-product of him

>>52136688
Not talking about the poster (which by the way he has one of still), but in promotional stuff like magazines and interviews and shit.
Our generation did not invent hype and promotional materials anon, we just got REALLY really good at it and made it standard practice for everything.

Empire was at the time a HUGELY anticipated film, especially among 80's nerddom, and they were no different then us when it comes to how excited we get over absolutely nothing of substance. They just didn't do it on the internet so it happened a lot less fast.

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>When you find nudes of that hoochie staff sgt on the holonet

>>52136650
I'd legit buy a SW Christmas special 2.
Life day probably caused Kylo to turn evil anyway.

>>52136391
>What's your favorite moment playing any Star Wars game?
Going Rambo with a droideka in Battlefront II and winning the match.

>>52136391
Holy Force, I always forget how much I hate the First Order stormtrooper helmets until I see one again. They look like helmets you'd see on a cartoon duck in a Star Wars parody. Quack quack, nerfherder.

>>52136650
Not just the Holiday Special, but she also wasn't released as a unique action figure that could only be acquired by mailing away proof of purchase from all the other action figures.

By time ESB came out, Boba Fett toys were already sought-after items. His armor was dope as fuck and he was a badass bounty hunter. It only took the "No Disintegrations" line from Vader to cement his reputation as REAL in the film, and the rest is history.

In contrast, TFA put Phasma in because Kathleen Kennedy saw the chrome stormtrooper concept (which had been intended as one of many possible options for Kylo Ren) and insisted that J.J. Abrams use it. And after there was some minor backlash for announcing "only" two female characters in the film (Rey and Leia, of course), they had a meeting and shit themselves straining to think of another role for a woman.

What resulted was Captain Phasma, who was ham-fisted-ly played up in media to counteract aforesaid backlash, and yet had no significant role in the film.

>>52136968
>and yet had no significant role in the film.
She did though.
She shut down the shields :^)

>>52136968
Do you work at LucasFilm? you know too much.

>>52136968

I'll always love reading fanboy theories that can't help but chase at FEMINIST CONSPIRACIES instead of the much simpler answers: toy sales and mediocre writing.

>>52137002
I wish. But no, I just spend all my time on Star Wars speculation forums.

>>52137026
>2017
>not knowing how Disney/the politically correct business world works

You consumed the same interviews and press releases prior to TFA that I did, right? No? Well, let's go down the rabbit hole:

An interview with Michael Kaplan, costume designer for TFA, gave us the following:

Said Kaplan, "When I was trying to tackle Kylo Ren's character, I thought, what if he were The Lord of the Stormtroopers, in bright shining silver armor? Concept artists (Dermot Power). He produced a stunning illustration which was immediately shot down by JJ; not right for Kylo Ren! The drawing remained on our design room wall. One afternoon, Kathy Kennedy came in for a meeting, pointed at the illustration and exclaimed: “What is that? It’s fantastic!"

There's more, but I'm on the way to work. I'll do this later.

This thread is making me realize just how low my expectations for the next movie are. Hopefully they are a few cool ships for Xwing in it. That's all I ask for at this point

>>52137158
That sounds more like she just saw a random design sketch, and thought what if?
>>52137179
that's kind of pathetic, man, just saying.

>>52137179
I've got a good feeling about VIII and can't quite place why but my feelings are often pretty spot on about these things.

Any ideas of a good starting ship for my players in an old republic Saga game?

>>52137239
>>52137179
The good news is no JJ and its got at least one A-Wing in it.

Hopefully they take it in a direction that isn't just "Nu-Empire Strikes Back" but I'll need to see some real trailers to start getting hyped.

>>52137239
I hope you're right. I really wanted to like 7 but it was just disappointing.

>>52137268
Depends on what the game is going to focus around.

Fringe, military or whatever?

>>52137268
Give them a centurion-class painted red. It's missing most weapons and there's no crew.

>>52137158
>Said Kaplan, "When I was trying to tackle Kylo Ren's character, I thought, what if he were The Lord of the Stormtroopers, in bright shining silver armor? Concept artists (Dermot Power). He produced a stunning illustration which was immediately shot down by JJ; not right for Kylo Ren! The drawing remained on our design room wall. One afternoon, Kathy Kennedy came in for a meeting, pointed at the illustration and exclaimed: “What is that? It’s fantastic!"

You're only proving my 'toy sales' point.

>>52137378
Basically whatever. We're smack bang in the middle of the Mando war ats but until we're more comfortable with the system since we're all new there probably won't be much in the way of massive space battles so something simple will probably do best

>>52137158
>A w-w-woman did it!
>Must be a feminazi conspiracy attack on us True Fans (tm)

Grow up. Phasma can be a shit character without being some massive assault on your masculinity. Women can write schlock and push cheap marketing gimmicks too.

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>>52137411
Previously owned by an ancestor of Booster Terrik?

For the force move upgrade that lets you rip items out of opponents hands, is there any opposed roll? I want my players to be able to use it, but I also dont want them to just yank everyones light sabers out of their hands whenever a fight starts.

And when it comes to crafting items (mainly in the Tech book) there are a lot of options that you can spend despair on in the crafting rolls, but outside of being a dick and spending a darkside destiny point on their roll how exactly would they get red dice on the check?

>>52137421
Consular class cruiser.

It can have a shit ton of customization points but comes most times with no guns. Modify the required crew to 2, this gives them a vessel with two people involved and room for a good amount npcs for quests/bus fare.

>>52137317
>no JJ
Abrams does fast, flashy and explosives stuff fairly well. But I think the lack of attention to detail tends to trip him up and that leads to plot holes later on as the roller coaster gets going- ordinarily in a stand-alone movie that isn't too much of an issue but his recent work has alienated quite a few Star Trek fans and a few Star Wars fans in doing that. The reason being is that we really get engrossed in the detail, while I quite liked TFA, when you put it next to R1 that lack of attention to detail and integrating it into a larger 'thing' that is the SW Universe, does make it a lesser film.

Rian Johnson is a bit of a wild card for the next movie, not a lot of experience, but what he has done with things like Looper and Breaking Bad means he can string a pretty solid story together.

>>52137614
For the roll, I have been giving skilled rivals and nemesis opposition dice to the pcs. So like any other opposed check.

For crafting, you could say with a despair everything is working properly but they messed something up that does not come out until combat and it upgrades so many attacks to get them used to it.

>>52137317

Even if it's Nu Empire Strikes Back, I'd be okay with it. Empire was good shit.

I just dont want some HURR YOU CAN SEE THE SUPERWEAPON IN THE SKY SOMEHOW IN REAL TIME ALSO YOU CAN SEE THE CAPITALS BLOW UP FROM HALF THE GALAXY AWAY BECUASE REASONS.

Im still fucking angry about that.
Fucking Abrams has no clue what 'scale' is/

>>52138174
Neither do most writers in the Scifi genre, so it's nothing new and this is Star Wars, fantastical, impossible shit is kind of the standard and to be totally fair, nobody has really delved into what firing a projectile into hyperspace would do, or how it would appear in the sky of any habitable planet not in the path of destruction.

Not saying it's not ridiculous just giving a more level headed opinion.

>>52138300

Oh sure, you can come up with some insane handwaving, which they actually did. It's on the wookie, and its pretty hilarious reading.

It's just so annoying to me that they did it the way they did, becuase they could quite happily have made it actually make sense.

Just remove everyone at Maz's looking up into the sky and inexplicably seeing superweapon fire from halfway across the galaxy.

Replace that with a sudden holonet news broadcast taking over the majority of the cantina's main room, so all the main characters are caught up looking at it as it announces the complete annihilation of the Hosnian system.

Then they hear TIE whine and "Those beasts, they're here!"
It's decided less retarded and works just as well.

>>52138408
Handwaving has kind of always been a part of Star Wars though, I don't disagree that they could have done it in a different way that didn't require as much of a handwave. I just don't see as much of a problem with it, I guess.

>>52138408
I still choose to interpret that as the Imperial ship projecting a fuckoff huge hologram into the upper atmosphere to demoralize them.

>>52136459
>I'm glad Rogue one was better
With people like this being the majority, I have lost all hope that we'll ever get to see an actually good big budget movie again.

>>52138477
Oh, for sure.
I dont mind handwaving per se - this is space fantasy in the truest sense, im not asking for some hard realism.

But i mean shit, they didnt even explain in film why you could see the weapon fire across the entire known galaxy.
They just said you could and rolled with it.
And that shit bugged me hardcore.

>>52138513
That's one way to handwave it I guess.

>>52138557
What's wrong with Rouge one?

Has anyone here gone to celebration or intending to go this year? I have questions.

>>52138613
>>52138408
The problem I had with the scale of the scene was that it turned the galaxy into a very tiny place thematically. When Alderaan blew up, the only inclination anybody has of it happening comes from Ben getting a massive case of the jibblies and even he's not sure what just happened.

That and there's no real tension in the scene. We get a tiny glimpse of Hosnia without it being identified, or without any kind of emotional connection to the place. We don't know any senators (Leia only shows up after the event) or have any reason to care about the place since everyone, including members of the Resistance are saying that the New Republic is too busy sitting around with their thumbs up their asses to do anything about the FO.

On a plot level, yes FO destroying Hosnia is very bad, but without an emotional anchor to care about, the whole scene comes off as dull.

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>>52136459
>>52138557
>fans arguing over whether TFA or R1 was better when both movies were garbage

This makes me lose hope that we'll ever see a good Star Wars movie again in general. The nuance, subtlety, and substance are gone. All we have now are fanboys screaming "AT-STs AT-STs!!!" and craving more poorly-written Mary Sues, atrociously-coordinated action scenes, and fanservice to the originals.

This makes me lose the most hope.
>TFA comes out: "man they ripped off a new hope scene for scene this sucks they better not do it again"
>next movie is announced: "i hope they do Empire Strikes Back remade this'll be a good movie"

Yes, let's keep recycling plots while the House of Mouse keeps wiping their ass with half-assed scripts and throwing them out into production for another 400 Star Wars movies all made as marketing vehicles just like TFA and R1.

Christ, even Lucas didn't rape the franchise as hard as Disney is. At least Lucas used lube and a condom. Disney's greedy fatfuck CEOs are going in dry and raw and fucking the license for every centavo it's worth.

>>52138674

Exactly.

Set it inside the bar with a news report, see a newswoman freakng the fuck out on the holonet, see everyone in the bar lose their shit - the ones who are pro FO get set upon by the ones who are pro Resistance.
Han freaks out, worrying that Leia mightve been on Hosnian Prime trying to talk the Republic into doing something about the First Order.

Then the FO show up and the fight starts.

>>52138557
Has there ever really been one of those? I mean even Star Wars was relatively simple and cliched when you strip away the cool skin, and the mysticism about the force.
>>52138613
Yeah I understand, and that other Anon's explanation makes sense as well and would actually make more sense than most things in Star Wars.
>>52138674
I disagree on the it shrinks the galaxy part, because it's hyperspace that shits like shrooms on steroids, kidding lol, but I think the lack of a reason to care was intentional we're supposed to be following Rey's journey is and what reason does she have to care, save for basic decency and compassion?

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>>52138704
>AT-STs AT-STs
Now that you mention it, I'd pay to see a series/show about walker crews.

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>>52138704

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>>52138746
That'd be a relatively interesting show, but it'd have to follow Imperials, and in Disney NuCanon the Empire is evil and bad and so we can't have them be the stars. It has to be standard, it has to be bland, it has to be inoffensive.

>>52138674
This I put down to TFA's lack of plot structure.

A New Hope is 3 acts plus interludes. Prologue: Leia's starship, Act I: Luke & Droids on Tatooine. Interlude: Alderaan is destroyed. Act II: Death Star escape. Interlude: Yavin Briefing. Act III: Trench Run.

Each Act is it's own mini-arc, with a different texture and feel as the stakes mount.

TFA in contrast is: Poe vs the FO, Finn & Poe Crash, Rey's intro, Rey & Finn on the Falcon, Han Solo & Co vs Loan Sharks and teeth things... and so on and so forth.

The movie has some pretty pictures, but it never really provides the differences in pace and difference in kind the way that the original movie did (and Empire does 3 acts as well, just with two of them occurring simultaneously).

The Force Awakens isn't a bad movie. It's just got the problem of being in the same series as two of the greatest films ever made, both of which are absolute machines when it comes to structure, pacing, and cinematography.

>>52138796
Calling someone who doesn't like the new Disney films a baiter is basically shouting "STOP DISLIKING WHAT I LIKE"

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>>52138830

>>52138811
>the Empire is evil and bad and so we can't have them be the stars
If Vader and Thrawn can be stars in their own nucanon works, then so can a bunch of grunts. Just have it be about a bunch of moralfag Imps who question if they're the bad guys in the first half and eventually defect with their walker(s). Or do what muh Gundums does and have them be half of the story, while the other half is good old Johnny Reb. Or have them fight Saw's brand of crazy extremists. Nobody likes Saw's faction, not even the main Rebellion.

>>52138904
Except they're not the bad guys. Why does every Imperial story have to be about defecting? For fuck's sake, there's only been what, ONE Star Wars game where you play as an Imperial and nothing but an Imperial? TIE Fighter? It's been said in /swg/ many times before, but it apparently needs said again, the Empire isn't fucking evil. That meme needs to die.

Why didn't the Emperor clone himself in case he was defeated?

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>>52138933
>the Empire isn't fucking evil
Yes it is. Doomsday weapons, genocide, and the goddamn Sith are evil according to the setting's rules.

>>52138957
He did in Legends.

>>52138993
According to later material and the Expanded Universe? No, they're not. The Rebellion in many ways is just as bad, if not worse, than the Empire, while the Empire is worse in some areas. The Rebellion isn't good and the Empire isn't evil, they're grey-shaded. If you analyze it and think critically about it rather than taking one episode's opening crawl as undisputed fact, then you arrive at that conclusion.

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>>52138957
He did

>>52138933
>>52139026
Because they are the bad guys, AND always have been, that's it! discussion over!
Personal opinions of imperial policy do not matter.

If you want to go there, lets talk about the fact that Palpatine is pretty much the most evil bastard that's ever appeared in the Star Wars Universe in Both continuities. That his policies while they say they make things more secure and safer they move the fear and danger from outside of the former Republic territory to within it, transferring that fear to literally every Imperial soldier, and Stormtrooper ,and Officer, and Moff, and Governor, and so on. That is not a good thing and never will be.

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>>52138993
>evil because the "good" guys said it was evil
stay pleb

>>52139026
>Legends works of highly variable quality and faithfulness to the OT's vision are more canon than the films which form the foundation of the setting
The films have always been taken precedence over everything else. The Rebels are the heroes, the Empire are the villains, and there are a few exceptions to the rule like Pellaeon and Borsk, but they remain statistical anomalies who do not disprove this rule.

>>52139068
We have a place for you friend it's here >>>/pol/ go there, be with your kind, we promise there are no jews there.

>>52139055
They've never been evil and never will be until Disney decides to fuck up the lore and make them that way.

Palpatine is a pragmatic Sith Lord. Yoda and the Council weren't evil for wanting to run the Jedi Order and maintain indirect control over galactic affairs, were they? How is Palpatine any more evil than they are for wanting his order to be in control? He's not. Order 66 was an act of war, not genocide. Get over it.

The Empire has numerous good qualities, and hell, the Rebellion does too. This isn't a stupid argument of "Rebels = bad, Empire = good", it's that the Empire and Rebellion BOTH have qualities to them. The Rebellion's great for aliens, the Empire's great for humans. The Empire's great for security, the Rebellion's great for lessened restrictions. The Empire's great for order and stability, the Rebellion's great for democracy and senate representation. The Empire's great for the Core Worlds and nearby areas, the Rebellion's great for the Outer Rim and nearby areas. The Empire is not wholly good nor evil, the Rebellion is not wholly good nor evil. Both have their good and evil people, and both have ideas and qualities of their own.

>>52139068
>>52139107
>everyone i disagree with needs to go to /pol/
>opposing opinions are /pol/
>if you like the empire you're /pol/
>if i don't like you you're /pol/

shut up

>>52139068
But the Empire hires smugglers, deals with crime lords and starts wars too.

>>52139113
>How is Palpatine any more evil than they are for wanting his order to be in control?
Because he blows up planets.

>>52139142
>hires smugglers
Depends on the type, and often it's penal service to avoid jail sentencing themselves.
>deals with crime lords
Yeah.
>starts wars
Not really. Regardless of what you think about the Alliance vs. Empire argument it was the Rebels that started the conflict with the Empire. Other than that the Empire only conventionally fought Separatist remnants, which was a continuation of a war already in progress.

>>52139068
>evil because the expository opening crawl that establishes the Star Wars setting says so
Yes. The original author defined the rules of the setting. Complaining about the Empire being evil is like complaining Mordor or Zeon being evil. The official rules of the setting, established by the author right from the get-go, say so, and the actions of those factions within the primary source material all scream "typical fictional bad guy."

>>52139182
>Tarkin blew up Alderaan which was harboring millions of rebel sympathizers and was actively supporting the rebellion with huge quantities of supplies, manpower, and weaponry, all while lying to the Empire and their own people about it
>blown up as a show of force after numerous rebel raids, insurgencies, and acts of terror committed against Imperial forces

That's war bud. Alderaan knew exactly what it was signing up for when it decided to supply the Rebellion. It was like the Germans sinking our ship that brought the US into WW1. You can't blame them for sinking a ship we used to supply their enemy behind their backs, and you can't blame the Empire for destroying a strongly-fortified planet that was heavily supporting their enemy behind their backs, all while the Rebellion had been doing shit to mess with the Empire for years prior.

>>52139113
>>52139126
I say that because you are from /pol/ and that screencap looks like it was from a /pol/ thread or a mini/pol/, (also known as /b/) thread, go back, because the empire is not good and has never been good, sure some good things happened like the Emperor's death, and the rise of the Rebellion, but Palpatine and the rest of the imperials didn't do those things.

>>52139234
>mini/pol/, (also known as /b/)
Fuck off back to tumblr or where you crawled in from.

>>52139272
Really? nazi/pol/ hasn't been trying to take over /b/ for years? am I the only one who's noticed that and also seen the archived /pol/ thread where they planned it?

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>>52139193
>Mordor

Interestingly enough, Tolkien paints Sauron in a sympathetic light before the Lord of the Rings trilogy. He differed from his master Melkor because he wanted to truly bring order and peace to Middle-earth, viewing those descended from the Valar and Men as corrupt and inefficient. He also had a love of architecture and engineering. It wasn't until the Third Age when his hatred boiled over that he became wholly evil, began to claim he was more powerful than Melkor, and started his violent quest of domination.

Long story short, if Tolkien, a guy who did write many strictly good and strictly evil characters, can say that Sauron wasn't always a bad guy and had redeeming qualities, are you seriously telling me that Star Wars, a series started with the idea of being a classic sci-fi adventure serial that was grittier and more mature than then-sci-fi monster Star Trek, can't have shades of moral grey for its factions because of a single brief line in one of its movies' opening crawls?

>>52139182
So? The rebels do the same equivalent thing in the first movie.

How many people do they kill blowing up the planet-sized death star, again?

And if you're gonna make an argument about a military target, so was Yavin. Alderan shouldn't have been blown up, but that was all Tarkin - Big Emps had nothing to do with that decision and neither did Vader.

Tbh on a galactic scale Alderaan is more like Dresden or the US firebombing of Japan.

>>52136608
Naaaah.
ADB has a very solid analysis of why Fett is MUCH better turned than Phasma.
https://aarondembskibowden.wordpress.com/2016/01/09/we-need-to-talk-about-captain-phasma-and-boba-fett/

>>52139233

>an entire planet is at fault for the actions of its leader and members of its people.

I bet youre okay with drone strikes that wipe out entire villages to kill one guy.

Ah yes, the great debate for the 100th time.

The Force doesn't give a shit about what you think, the Empire was always destined to fail. The Sith are evil, the Empire is evil. That's it.

Sorry you can't fulfill your autistic fantasies in Star Wars without feeling good.

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Any novel that is about Stormtroopers and the wars they wage? I'd like a book about the standard army of the Empire, to read about the bad guys through their eyes.

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>>52139302
>shades of moral grey for its factions because of a single brief line in one of its movies' opening crawls
Sauron's days of being non-evil were long past by the time of LotR and they, in no way, absolve him of the sins he committed or the body count he racked up. And there were shades of gray in the Empire--you had people like Thrawn and Baron Fel--but they were still considered statistical anomalies.

Nothing the Empire has done absolves it of Alderaan, Ghorman, the Krytos virus, Honoghr, or Thrawn's off-screen genocide. Promises of order and safety do not absolve it of using WMDs. Many viewers (and George) also oppose totalitarianism. The Empire is very much a totalitarian state. The dissolution of the Senate is a clear sign of taxation and legislation without representation.

>>52139378
Their government and half their population knew what they were getting into, and they knew that they had to lie their Imperial loyalist citizens or else they'd spill the beans to the Empire.

Let's also not forget that Leia lied about the location of the Rebel base to Tarkin KNOWING that her planet was at stake. She could've told the truth and spared them, but she didn't. It's pretty apparent Tarkin knew this. If anyone's to blame for Alderaan's destruction, Leia shares equally with Tarkin in that regard.

>>52139417
Tarkin was never going to spare the planet, and she did tell the truth, Dantooine had a rebel base, idiot.

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>>52139411

>>52137614
For the rarer or high powered items I usually give the pcs a mission or two to acquire special materials, Cortosis for example. How well they do on the mission and how much they get can influence their rolls. IE red dice

>>52139417
>half their population
WHere are you getting those numbers from?

You've decided that an entire planet of a fair few billion needed to die so that the Empire could make a point, and this ISNT morally bankrupt in any way.

You desperately need to stop trying so hard to justify the empire.
Theyre a larger-than-life evil empire in a series of films. They're not the good guys.


Dont get me wrong, I love seeing the Rebellion not being portrayed as the perfect good guys, but trying to pretend that the Empire in the films isnt most definitely the 'bad guys' is just ridiculous.

>>52139487
A mostly-abandoned Rebel base that was basically an outpost at that time.

>>52139414
>muh totalitarianism is wrong
>muh lucas didnt like it

Yeah, and Lucas let Solo live in Episode VI so he could sell more toys, and also didn't know how to pronounce "Gungans", and also thought JarJar would be the most important character of the entire Star Wars saga. It doesn't matter what he liked or didn't like. The galaxy's a shitty place with shitty people who want to do shitty things to each other. The New Republic and its disarmament policies and peace didn't do shit, and their period was even more violent and disastrous than the Empire. You gotta have weapons and armies and technology and force in Star Wars or else you get stepped on. Fuck off with that "give muh peace a chance empire is bad because muh weapons" bullshit.

>>52138811
It doesn't have to follow the imperials. Rebels use clone wars era tech all the time, and that includes walkers. They'd also be strapped for parts which helps with being gritty like 08th MS team.

>>52139234
We're not from /pol/, and you don't have to be from /pol/ to think the Empire isn't evil, dingus.

>>52139494

>millions of workers to die
>"The first Death Star is depicted in various sources of having a crew of 265,675, as well as 52,276 gunners, 607,360 troops, 30,984 stormtroopers, 42,782 ship support staff, and 180,216 pilots and support crew."

So even at best, that's less than a decent sized city, versus the entire population of a planet.
The Empire definitely isnt in the right here.

>>52139565
Also no disturbance in the force = the force wills it

>>52139591
>the force willed the death star and all of its crew to die

That's an even more retarded theory than midichlorians.

>>52139559
Never said you did, but the opinion that the empire is good, is shit tier and sounds like /pol/.
It may, be 40k inspired, I think the Imperium is just as evil as Sidious' Empire, but thats not really relevant.

>>52139330
>planet-sized death star
>160 km across
>Earth
>6,371 km across

>And if you're gonna make an argument about a military target, so was Yavin.
But we're not talking about Yavin, we're talking about Alderan all you've really done is conceded that the DS was a legitimate military target.

>That was all Tarkin
Oh my God you're right Plaps obviously built his super laser and never intended it be used on a civilian target which is why he gave very clear instructions oh waiiiiiiiittttttt....

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>>52139193
>>52139234
>>52139300
>>52139378
>>52139411
>>52139414
>>52139487
>>52139494
>>52139528
>>52139565
>>52139591
>>52139622

>>52139535
The nucanon New Republic was undoubtedly a disaster. Legends' New Republic without Bothan bullshit would have been the ideal model.

>muh totalitarianism isn't evil
By the rules of the OT, yes, it's evil. It's like how the Imperium of Man is the least evil option for humanity by the rules of 40k's settings, and how Big Brother is evil based on the rules of Orwell's setting. The Empire isn't bad because it had weapons. It's bad because it used WMDs on civilians, committed multiple genocides, and turned peaceful protests into parking lots and shooting galleries. It's bad because it attempted to impose taxation and legislation without representation. It's bad because it was controlled the likes of Palpatine, Tarkin, Isard, Zsinj, and Thrawn. Totalitarianism, by the rules of OT and the Cold War in which it was released, is evil.

>>52139732

Im interested to see how many of these you can pull out of your ass honestly.

>>52139759
it's surprisingly accurate honestly

say totalitarianism is wrong all you want but the rebellion did some really fucked up shit and were definitely the aggressor, not the empire

>>52139735
>the rules of the OT
Wtf are you going on about

>>52139785
Empire evil, Rebellion good.

>>52139735
>rules of the OT
>imperium of man
>taxation without representation

what the shit are you even talking about

>>52139735
The NR wasn't that bad when Mon Mothma was around, but once she got too old it all fell apart. Then you had people who didn't fight, or weren't born to remember the GCW running things. You also had cunts who pretty much wanted the Empire to come back and latched onto that nostalgia, which the FO took advantage of.

>>52139796
Factually wrong.

>>52139796
Protagonist vs antagonist is not good v evil kiddo

>>52139778

Of course the rebellion did some fucked up shit.
That was my favourite thing about Rogue One actually - Cassian straight up just murdering his informant at the start rather than letting him be caught and talk was good shit.

But at the same time, to try and imply that the Empire is a good thing is next level dumbassery.

They're the 'legal' government, because of the senate (being manipulated into voting for) it, and they're technically lawful.

But they're also an amoral totalitarian state, which has no problem murdering its own civillians at the drop of a hat.

So yeah, nah.
The empire are definitely not the 'good guys' here.

>>52139838
Don't bother convincing critical thinking with them my friend. If A New Hope's opening crawl says the Empire's evil in one sentence then that means the Empire will always be evil and everything else be damned, because they don't want to think about anything.

>>52139778
>were definitely the aggressor, not the empire
all the terrible shit that the empire did to various people, groups and planets that made up the rebellion makes them the aggressor in this situation, pal

>>52139856
>implying the rebellion also didn't murder its own people when they started shit

The Empire wouldn't kill people if they wouldn't aggress the Empire and try to attack its personnel. They wouldn't blow up planets if the rebels didn't start blowing up bases. They wouldn't intimidate populations if the rebels didn't start coercing populations. The Empire wouldn't be so bad if the rebels didn't make it so bad to try to prove a point.

the age old saying sums up the whole civil war and every action the empire took against the rebels friendo: talk shit, get hit

What's your favorite era to play in and why? No bitching about other's choices.

>>52139861
>ROTS opening crawl has "heroes on both sides"
>The era is morally grey
>no one says anything

>ANH opening crawl says the Empire is evil
>The Empire proceeds to be evil
>"WHY ARE PEOPLE NOT THINKING? T-THE EMPIRE CAN'T BE EVIL I'M SO INSECURE!!"

>>52139891
Nigga the entire universe is canon from an outside perspective that the Empire is evil.

>>52139891
>Regimes are only oppressive if you resist them

This is some funky fuckn' logic we got here boys, do you also think the right to self-determination is a bit overrated?

>>52139868
they appealed to aliens and that was about it

the rest of the rebellion was initially composed of clone wars leftovers, republic loyalists, separatists, and senators who wanted to regain personal power they lose when palpatine booted them out

only after alderaan did they get anyone who felt mistreated

the alliance to restore the republic was just that: led by people who wanted power back in their hands and followed by people who wanted the republic back, nothing more and nothing less

it was never started or intended to be anything heroic or freedom-fighty, they had political differences and folks like mon mothma wanted to manipulate people to get back into a position of authority

>>52139891
>The Empire wouldn't kill people if they wouldn't aggress the Empire and try to attack its personnel
that's factually incorrect. the empire would regularly rock up to random planets and make impossible demands before beating the shit out of the locals for no doing what they demanded

>>52139907
Prequal in a heartbeat so much room for for the kind of intrigue and cloak-and-dagger I love.

I also love de-railing canon or presenting my players with an Alt-history scenario and the prequels have more divergence point I feel.

>>52139929
>they appealed to aliens and that was about it
>the rest of the rebellion was initially composed of clone wars leftovers, republic loyalists, separatists, and senators who wanted to regain personal power they lose when palpatine booted them out
>only after alderaan did they get anyone who felt mistreated
>the alliance to restore the republic was just that: led by people who wanted power back in their hands and followed by people who wanted the republic back, nothing more and nothing less
>it was never started or intended to be anything heroic or freedom-fighty, they had political differences and folks like mon mothma wanted to manipulate people to get back into a position of authority
do you have a single fact to back any of this up or are you just jacking off with reddit-tier "alternate character interpretation?"

>>52139891

Except the Empire cracked down before the Rebellion even existed.

And when the Rebellion does something, the Empire's response is, always, massively out of scale.
>>52139929
>senators who wanted to regain personal power they lose when palpatine booted them out


All the rest not-withstanding, that parts bullshit.
Those Senators still had their jobs for 20 years after the Empire was formed. The senate was only shut down in the middle of New Hope - for all that time, those people had power.

>>52139929
That's not the case at all, where have you been for the past two years?

>>52139924
The Empire did nothing worthy of resistance until the rebellion came along. Aliens had it bad. Who gives a shit? Humanity first now and always. Otherwise, nothing they did was anything worthy of resistance. Fuck, they did a lot of good shit. Coruscant no longer had daily food riots that the Republic had to violently repress.

>>52139912
>the separatists never do anything heroic and genocide like it was a for-fun activity
>but the era's morally grey because the title crawl says so

>the empire blows up one planet in the movies and never does anything else evil
>but they're evil because the title crawl says so

The title crawl isn't the fucking bible.

>>52139907

Galactic Civil War, current shitposting aside, because in non-film places you can actually see Imperials who arent film-evil, and rebels who arent film-hero and explore the whole thing.

Also, because I just fucking love X-Wings man.

>>52139962
I don't follow nor care about Disney canon because it sucks for discussion, because we have barely anything to go on.

>>52139961
The Empire cracked down on dissidence and lawbreaking, as any government would.

And yes, but the Senate lost most of its power after Palpatine and those he appointed took power. It's not hard to see the Senators who supported the Rebellion missed their days of greater control.

>>52139958
think about it instead of just reading a title crawl

>>52139929
>it was never started or intended to be anything heroic or freedom-fighty,
You're absolutely right that would only be the case is some populist fuck broke all his promises about giving up emergency powers and shattered the democratic institutions you and your people had held dear to them for almost a thousand years.

But that would be a very unique scenario.

>>52139808
>reading comprehension
"Rules" was the wrong word, but look at the conventions of the setting. You complaining that the Empire totally isn't evil is like someone going to a 40k thread and complaining that Chaos is totally the good guys and the Imperium is the bad guys. You're complaining about the foundation, tone, and narrative rules of the setting. If you want a story about how totalitarianism is the answer to everyone's problems, then Star Wars is probably not the right place to look.

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>>52139997
>thinking the alliance founders gave a single shit about democracy
>thinking they didn't just oppose palps for selfish reasons

>>52139995
>think about it instead of just reading a title crawl
ah, so what you mean is
>ignore what canon stuff says and listen to my fanon instead

>>52139995
They crack down *disproportionately*, which is the entire point.

"Oh, the princess of this planet wont tell us where a military base is? We should destroy an entire unarmed planet of multiple billion civillians."

This is not the way to be the good guys, anon.

>>52140008
No one in this thread or discussion has even said that the Empire is the good guy and the Alliance is the bad guy. They've said that the Empire is not entirely evil and the Alliance is not entirely good. It's very naive to disagree with that notion and somehow believe everything in Star Wars is either absolutely heroic or absolutely villainous.

>>52140025
You disgrace that character in your lust for (You)'s.

Whatever you may think of TFA, at least it hit the nail on the head with the First order based on this thread.

>>52140074
I unironically love that the FO is just the Hitler Youth all grown up, I adore them and squirmed whenever someone said SUPREME LEADER!!!

>>52140046
It's widely acknowledged that both factions have their anomalies. Cassian got his hands dirty. Keyan Farlander nearly fell to the Dark Side. Pellaeon and Fel were honorable men. Saw was so spicy even the Rebellion proper distanced itself from him. But the Empire is still the bad guy by dint of having more people and policies that would be considered evil by its creator and most of the audience. That's the point I'm trying to make.

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Empire-Rebellion debates always end the same: everyone hates each other and nothing is gained.

>>52139956
Not to mention that sexy close armor

>>52139970
Good taste, great ship. Just hard to fit the force/jedi in imo, and it doesn't feel like star wars if those are excluded

>>52140074
They are the least threatening villains ever though. Was it mandatory for all their leaders to look like teenagers?
>General flux flubbing his valedictorian speech infront of the army before firing the lasers
>Not Jacen solo looks like he's twelve with the ears of dumbo
Haircut didn't help I guess

>>52139970
>>52140154
EotE is very hard to do with force users, yeah, and some people feel like it's not Star Wars enough without them. I look at it differently though. In the OT Jedi and Sith action is almost never seen, and is limited to only a few characters out of hundreds. It doesn't have to be super-prevalent to feel like Star Wars. Plus, force users tend to have a very hard time of things. The Empire either wants them dead or wants to recruit them, the Rebellion won't stop bugging them to join up, and everyone they meet either fears, admires, or despises them, no in-betweens.

>>52140154

Eh, you say that, but I really quite enjoy the whole dichotemy of jedi wanting to help people but knowing that if they reveal themselves, they are dead and so are a lot of the people around them.

When turning on your lightsaber is in itself a significant event, it makes jedi a lot more of a powerful story even I feel.
The prequel trilogy, jedi stuff happens all day every day all over the shop, and it feels a bit less magical, to me at least, than in the OT with only a couple of them in existence.

>>52140186
That's why it was good.

>>52140127
The Empire being "the bad guy" is just them being opposed to the protagonists of our story, which all happen to focus on Jedi - who are naturally opposed to the Empire because it's run by a fucking Dark Lord of the Sith.

The fact is, the Empire did a lot of good, and in most respects, was better than the Republic it abolished. It ended the separatist threat, ended the weird alien species-ism that dominated galactic politics beforehand, was substantially less corrupt and more efficient, and it improved the lives of humans everywhere.

Now obviously it did some bad shit and it was good that Sidious got taken down, but many of its most important accomplishments outlasted its destruction and could be taken as a free boon by the whole galaxy.

For instance, whatever you say about the Empire, they got rid of the Geonosian problem, and even after they're gone, the rest of the galaxy will be glad that that problem has been solved.

>>52139907
OT to Post endor, especially post endor for imperial games. Then you can chart your own future in the greatest galactic free for all ever.
Secondly, I like eras like the mandalorian wars/jedi civil war. Lots of jedi, lots of baddies and on occasion tons of dark jedi to fight. It's just good adventuring fodder.

>>52140228
Geonosians dindu nufifn

>>52140228
>It ended the separatist threat, ended the weird alien species-ism that dominated galactic politics beforehand, was substantially less corrupt and more efficient, and it improved the lives of humans everywhere.

Do we actually know if any oh that is true? Also why did the Empire not the Republic end the separatist threat?

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>>52138704
>The nuance, subtlety, and substance
>Star Wars

>>52140258
Because there were numerous CIS holdouts left after the Clone Wars, and the Imperials destroyed them.

>>52140228
>was substantially less corrupt and more efficient, and it improved the lives of humans everywhere.
the empire was in many ways more corrupt than the republic, and actually on a numerical basis fucked over more humans than nonhumans

>>52140228

Palpatine STARTED the separatist threat.
Of course it was easy to end it when he was no longer orchestrating it.

And "Lmao fuck aliens" how is that an acceptable response?
I know HUMANITY FUCK YEAH is a meme around here, but holy shit its supposed to just be a meme.

>>52140228
>The fact is, the Empire did a lot of good, and in most respects, was better than the Republic it abolished. It ended the separatist threat,
The Republic had thousands of years of history behind it. In both Legends and nucanon, most of that time is unexplored and, for lack of evidence, presumed to be as peaceful as Obi-Wan described. Most of the wars of the Old Republic era were instigated by other factions--the Sith and Mandalorians, chiefly, and both of those factions are naturally aggressive.

The separatist threat was also manufactured by Palpatine and the Sith. We have no idea if they would have existed had the Republic been allowed to run without Palps and his allies manipulating its politics and legislature to their ends.

>less corrupt
In some places, yes. In others, it was worse. Imperial officials in Legends, at least, regularly cut deals with Hutts. Remember that Palpatine was buddies with Black Sun, and favored people like Isard.

>Geonosian problem
I'm unfamiliar with this beyond their role in the movies. Did the Geonosians commit aggression of their own volition or were they pushed to do so by Sith shenanigans?

>>52140308
It's not really a meme. Humans were the most numerous, the most advanced, and accomplished more than any alien species during the Civil War era. "Humanity fuck yeah" isn't exactly a wrong meme.

>>52140290
It fucked over humans who fought against it once the Civil War started up, but overall was very beneficial to humanity across the galaxy.

>>52140332
>most numerous
That's a fair point, but
>most advanced
Not true
>most accomplished
Based on what?

The heroes we have are human but that's because its a film series made by humans for humans, so of course the heroes are human.
Its worth noting that (certainly in the PT) those humans get their asses handed to them by supposedly inferior aliens all the damn time.

But either way, 'yeah the galaxy turned into a terrible place for everyone other than humans, but that's okay, humanity fuck yeah'.
Straight up, go back to pol my man.

>>52140228
>It ended the separatist threat
Started by the Dark Lord of the Sith you mentioned
>ended the weird alien species-ism that dominated galactic politics beforehand
By shoving them all to the side so they couls take all their shit?
>was substantially less corrupt and more efficient
Traded one corruption for another by taking out the middleman. Same reason they were more efficient. Those off limit planets the empire ruined for resources say hello.
>and it improved the lives of humans everywhere
No examples of this.

>many of its most important accomplishments outlasted its destruction and could be taken as a free boon by the whole galaxy.
Not really, and they stole a lot of shit they didn't make anyway. Even corrupted good ideas into weapons.

>For instance, whatever you say about the Empire, they got rid of the Geonosian problem, and even after they're gone, the rest of the galaxy will be glad that that problem has been solved.
They only got rid of them for Death Star secrecy reasons. They weren't a problem at all and even if you like the Empire, would be more valuable alive.

>>52140379
>no examples of this

The Core worlds were more prosperous than they ever had been.

>>52140403
Okay, but humans don't just live there. Many human dominated planets in the Outer Rim were turning to shit.

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I started the Empire v Rebellion shitshow, and honestly, I'm sorry it got this far. I didn't intend to derail the thread and turn it into a hateful shitting ground for people to attack each other.

This is Star Wars. This is something we love, and we're all fans of it together. The point isn't to fight, it's to come together to celebrate the thing we love.

Whether you like the Rebellion, whether you like the Empire, whether you're Jedi or Sith, I wish we could just come together as fans of some nerdy-ass fictional world and embrace it together no matter what our personal opinions.

On this Life Day, we shouldn't be attacking each other.

>>52140379
I mean damn bro I'm not gonna argue the Empire was great, but all I'm sayin is, even if I was a rebel, I'd have been glad that the Empire did my dirty work for me.

>>52140403
Clearly, a whole lot of Core worlders didn't think so. The Rebellion's large Corellian representation indicates considerable resentment towards the Diktat and Imperial occupation of Corellia. Alderaan exploded. Many expats and aliens on Alderaan also resented the Empire's economic restrictions, IIRC. The post-Endor celebrations on Coruscant, even at its surface level, also indicated considerable discontent in the seat of the Empire's power. Not to mention Isard's massive urban restructuring project as part of a ploy to hide Lusankya.

>>52140489
>post-Endor celebrations

Added into the digitally enhanced edition, which also added things like a "new and improved" Jedi Rocks scene to Jabba's Palace.

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>>52140441
>Life Day
Get out of here

>>52140502
Not him, but... your point is? They're canon. The newest version of the films has always been the canon version.

The above-mentioned scenes are even referenced in canon materials, and the Coruscant celebration pretty much immediately turns to riots.

>>52140502
>Added into the digitally enhanced edition
Also mentioned in the Wraith Squadron series, which, IIRC, happened before the digitally enhanced version. Castin Donn mentions witnessing stormtroopers lethally interrupting one such celebratory gathering.

>>52140533
His point is that he can't back up his stance with canon so he will ignore it conveniently

>>52140489
>>52140502
>>52140525
>>52140533
>>52140541
On a planet of two trillion people, there's inevitably going to be some who supported the Rebellion at that point, and that was also during wartime when policies were different. The heavy civilian resistance the Rebellion faced taking the planet also shows that not everyone was happy with their arrival.

>>52140533
>>52140547
You don't have to take the digitally enhanced versions as canon.

Han shot first, no matter what Lucas says, for example. What was in the first films with no back-and-forth digital "remastering" will always be true canon.

>>52140579
No? That's not how Star Wars canon has ever worked. It has literally always been the official stance that the latest version of the film is the canon one.

>>52140579
For minor things it doesn't matter honestly, but the celebrations have been referenced in other material.

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>>52140560
>(You)
I didn't even say anything pro-Rebel. All I did was post R2 with a gun.
Anyway enough fictional politics, have a Tie gif.

>>52140630
Didn't mean to include you in the post.

>>52136391
>You see Ivan, when armor is of mirror, a light cannot saber through.

>>52138704
>Lucas didn't rape the franchise as hard as Disney is
Yeah he is too busy fucking over the movies and rereleasing the once good movies as bloated messes

>>52139622
Thinly veiled "Hitler Did Nothing Wrong" screencap didn't help the argument either.

>>52140630
I'm literally hearing the Robotech battle theme in my mind.

>>52140937
Am I on /leftpol/?

So many people complaining about totalitarianism and saying people who like the Empire are nazis. It's a fictional scifi universe. Chill the heck out.

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>>52141011
Sorry, I didn't think I was overreacting.

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Post OC

>>52136391
>Captain Phasma Gonna Get You
Who?

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>>52141616
>he hasn't installed the text data files

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>>52141710
I didn't even know that was a thing, awesome.

>>52141743
http://pastebin.com/xHL41i36

>>52141771

Oh shit, I was considering putting together the details for my group to use this coming week or so, fuck yes /swg/ you beauty.

What would be the absolute minimum amount of Imperial ships a real bumhole of a sector in the outer rim would have. Would they have a capital ship? I was thinking the fleet would be centered on something really old, really shitty. Maybe even a retrofit CIS cruiser basicly used as an orbital platform.

>>52142017
They'd still have Imperial ships, just not top of the line ISDs.

Possibly an Arquitens or two and some smaller tug supports, squadron or two of TIES.
I guess it also depends on the population of the sector, regardless of bumhole status.

The thing they could have though is local militia forces who might use anything and everything.
Closer core they'd likely have Imperial stuff too, but on the outer rim they'd probably just use whatever - probably not uglies unless we're talking REAL dirt cheap bumhole tier, but some older shit, maybe some old Clone Wars gunships only just still running, etc.

>>52142017
Maybe a Victory or two, lots of artiquens, gozantis, and auxiliary CR90s. Maybe some sort of specialist vessels like a light carrier or a Golan I platform.

>>52142017
An Acclamator or understaffed Venator might be the centerpiece of the fleet. Tartan patrol cruisers, IPVs, CR90s, Nebulon-Bs, Carracks, Raiders, Strike Cruisers, and other assorted small warships would make up the bulk of the actual fleet, I'd reckon. Early in the Imperial era, starfighters would likely be old Clone-era milsurp, but older TIE/LNs would eventually replace them as you moved the timeline closer to the New Republic era.

I am running out of room to store my cardboard plates for x wing. What is a good way to store them?

>>52142017
>>52142105

Im retarded, I was reading 'sector' as system - it'd have to be REALLY fucking poor for a sector to only have what I listed.

>>52137472
Wait, did you somehow miss every person who was involved in TFA praising it for having the first ever capable female lead in a Star Wars film?

You know, despite Leia being a pop culture phenom back in the 80s?

There were tons of articles and interviews focused on how revolutionary it was too have a multicultural and gender-equal Star Wars.

Various people gave talked about how the #1 first thing decided for both the TFA and R1 scripts was that they would have a female lead to be "different."

There was no consideration of writing the best story possible - no, instead, the focus is on making female-focused Star Wars films.

They've been pushing the "pro-fem" issue since Kennedy took over. She said she's looking for a female director for a Star Wars movie. There hasn't been a movie yet without a female lead.

The thing is, the strategy is a cynical one - they're not doing it to "better Hollywood for women" or something. Women are in all sorts of movies, even sci-fi franchises. No, they're pushing it because getting chicks to like Star Wars means twice the amount of wallets ready to buy tickets and merch.

>>52142017

An entire Sector Command? Well, considering that in Legends a proper sector command would have several dozen ISDs and a command dreadnought (Like an Assertor or Mandator), let's not lowball.

Assuming this is a proper entire sector command and not just a fleet ordered to patrol a sector the Empire otherwise isn't in, minimum you'd have for a command ship is a mothballed Venator, and then probably some old Acclamators and a few Victories as primary ships. A few Gladiators as escorts. Bulk of your fleet will be in Dreadnoughts and Neutron Stars probably with carrier conversions. A few flotillas of Gozantis because those are impressively multi-role ships, and then your pickets and escorts are going to be Arquitens light cruisers, maybe some CR90s with anti-fighter loadouts and IR-3F light frigates or the Carracks. If the ranking officer is very well connected, he might drag a Maelstrom or a Secutor fleet carrier from somewhere.

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>>52142330
What I don't understand is how, despite all that marketing and all those resources, the best they can come up with are Rey and Jyn. How hard could it possibly be, with that much money, to hire someone who can write female characters who have entertaining personalities?

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How often did Sheev go 'Holy shit this is turning out so much better than I expected?'

Rewatching EP 2 right now, and holy shit is it 90% Anakin being incompetent but puffing himself up, and 10% him getting his ego deflated by literally everyone not buying his bullshit.

>>52142596

The chart measuring that would probably be a fairly big Bell Curve that peaks around about the point that he hurls the whole Senate at Yoda, then falls off a cliff around about the point that he forgets that electrocuting all of his problems isn't ALWAYS the answer, and that he really should have had the interior decorators put some flooring down over those huge impenetratably deep elevator shafts.

>>52142330
>>52142560
Feminists don't want interesting or well-written characters, because feminists are complete dolts who are inept at doing anything. They write shit, call it great, and if you disagree then they call you sexist.

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>>52136391

How would you build this guy for a FaD campaign?

I put my game on hold because I realized, when asked by someone here how I'd make it stand out, I really had no answer, and not much plot to go on. While I don't want to take ideas from anyone, I'm curious as to what some ways are to truly make an Edge game stand out and be "unique", not feeling like just another Star Wars game. Thoughts?

>>52142945
Ancient Jedi from thousands of years ago thrown through a nexus in the dark side of the force by an unspeakable evil Sith. Now, he arrives in an where the Sith are law. He must seek to undo the evil that is Sheev.

>>52142945
Shii-Cho Knight/Sentry with Enhance and Sense.

>>52143000
For one, most people have a struggle making it feel like Star Wars and not just some generic space opera. You have to take true inspiration from the epics and classical tales of old. Think something like Hamlet: an evil duke on a rimworld has betrayed his brother and proclaimed himself king. Aligning himself with the Empire/Hutts/no one at all, he seeks to dig up an ancient weapon from long ago while oppressing his people.

>Edge of the Empire characters are paid to smuggle the true heir, a beautiful princess, out of her prison and to help overthrow the duke.

>Age of Rebellion characters seek to prevent him from aligning with the Empire and restore the princess to the throne, gaining a powerful ally.

>Force and Destiny characters seek to find what he is digging up, and learn from the relics he is beginning to unleash.

For Force and Destiny.

Using the Harm power with following assumptions:
enough force points are generated,
magnitude upgrade at rank 3
all enemies are within range
control upgrade for converting inflicted wounds to healing.

The Question:
Would you count wounds inflicted upon targets beyond the initial target (via use of magnitude) to count towards total amount healed?

For example:
Assuming user would inflict 5 wounds with basic power and has a total of 3 valid targets (including primary target), he would inflict 15 wounds total and be able to heal himself or someone at engaged range for 15 wounds? Or would you only count the 5 wounds inflicted on the primary target for the healing?

I'm leaning towards the former, seems fairly clear from RAW, but I'd like a confirmation.

Force and Destiny/Age of Rebellion during the clone wars, y/n?

>>52143821
We have this question every thread. The concensus is that it's easy to put in the Clone Wars.

>>52143909
No I'm asking if I should run it.

>>52143993
If your group wants it or is open to it, I don't see why you shouldn't.

Gonna be starting a new edge of the empire game with my online group. Since google is ending API support I can't use roll20 for my game if I want the edge dice unless I pay for a subscription. Anyone have any experience running games with tabletop sim? I realize this might be more of a new thread question but you guys are generally more elegan/tg/entlemen here on /swg/

>>52144067
Tabletop Sim isn't great for any level of serious RPG work.

With some effort you can convert standard dice to work with FFG's system. It's more getting-used to, but you can make it happen if you so desire.

>>52144067
I just use discord and this
http://game2.ca/eote/#
for dice rolls, i guess there is an assumed level of trust with the rolls but my groups is good for it.

>>52144473
There are quick conversion charts for using regular d8s with FFG Star Wars. If my memory serves FFG had a pdf of it on either their site or forum

>>52144067
If you have a decent computer and so do your players, just bite the java bullet and get map tool.

>>52142945
>Long ago in the Old Republic, I, Ak'kku, the Sith Alchemy master of darkness, unleashed an UNSPEAKABLE EVIL
>But, a foolish Jedi warrior, wielding a special lightsaber, stepped forth to oppose me
>VWOM
>KRASS
>KSHH
>Before the final blow was struck, I tore open a portal in the force, and flung him into the future, where Sith evil is LAW
>Now the fool seeks to return to the past, and undo the evil that is Ak'kku!

>>52144932
shut up and take my credits

>>52142657

Obi-Wan was in WAAAY over his head. Maybe if Qui-Gon had hung around to moderate, or Anakin been seconded to someone like Plo Koon or Windu, things wouldn't have gone off the rails. Giving him a padawan failed to do anything other than generate a somewhat hyperaggressive padawan washout and something else to feel guilt, shame, and loss over.

Great fucking job, Jedi Council. You broke the chosen one. No refunds. That bit about Sheev? >>52142596 Yeah, that's what you get.

>Finally get around to watching the Rebels episode where Thrawn is hunting Fulcrum
>Everyone including the governor is a CQC specialist now

They sure are trying to make up for how crappy the Empire has been

>>52145424

Governor Pryce has been a CQC master since the Wedge/Hobbie intro. She would have beat Sabine if not for SUPERIOR MANDALORIAN ARMY COMBATIVES.

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>>52145804
>DON'T FUCK WITH THIS GOVERNOR

>>52144067

My group and I have basically been using Tabletop sim for group rolling of dice, but playing using roll20
It's a bit cludge-y but its worked pretty well so far

>>52136391
Pastebin for Edge of the Empire got deleted

>>52136391
What does Force Move + Hurl do if you throw Silhouette 0 objects at people?

>>52147040

5 Damage. Plus successes.

>>52136391
Is there a good place to buy bootleg x wing cards? There should be some company printing these out for cheap.

>>52147222
>he doesnt just print them off himself

>>52139912
>>52139965
Heroes in the Greek sense of the word, meaning Champions.

>>52145882
I mean they did give Thrawn his own version of Rom "Senator Armstrong" Mohc's droid wrestling workout.

>>52136391
What's the best way to get FR2 if I'm a Niman Disciple?

In the tree itself I'm 115 XP away. If I go Sage and beeline the nearest FR, it's 90 XP. Is there a faster way, and is the 25 XP difference worth getting into that tree?

How do you run an EotE game which doesn't become Murderhobos in Space?

>>52136391

Captian who?

>>52149943
By being a competent DM with players who aren't stupid

>>52150118
I guess that was my problem last time my GM was a fool

Is the old RAC/Soontir still competitive? If no, why not? Coming back from 2015, and don't want to use Kylo Ren. This is the old list:

RAC, Predator, Engine upgrade, Gunner, Ysanne, Rebel Captive
Soontir,

Soontir, PTL, Autothrusters, Stealth, Royal Guard

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>>52139413
Allegiance is pretty close to that as I can remember, been awhile since I read it.

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>>52138993
>Doomsday weapons
>evil

Why do you hate America?

>>52139193
>or Zeon being evil
If they existed, I would follow them to the grave.

>>52141616
>fister roboto

>>52149943
You involve the players in your story, rather than just giving them a malthese falcon to chase after.

Is there a pdf of the Corellian Conflict rules around?

>>52151337
Maybe not the exact list, but RAC and friend is running around.

>>52149943
If they become murderhobos send something nasty after them.

Dark Troopers, Stormcommandos, Alliance Specforce Veterans, Renegade/Rogue Squadron, Jedi-in-hiding, something like Zann Consortium Defilers, elite Bounty Hunters, etc.

Good thing about Star Wars is that very powerful enemies that are very mundane can be used if your party is too big for their blasters, so you don't have to have a dragon come along to teach them a lesson.

Let them know right off the bat that things have consequences and that they're not the strongest people in the galaxy.

>>52151527
>>52151632
Good and evil aren't objective and good fiction doesn't have purely blacks and whites.

The Rebel Alliance is good in some ways and shitty in others. The Galactic Empire is good in some ways and shitty in others.

Not everything is all or nothing.

>>52149939
Does your character use a lot of knowledge skills and force powers? Can you wait 2-3 sessions for that force die?

>When the 6 ships you ordered arrive and it's like christmas opening them all
:D
>When the Shadowcaster doesn't fit in the case you use for X-Wing
D:

>>52140332
>most advanced
>LaughingDuros.holo

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>>52152902
>Duros
>Advanced

>>52139965
Have you ever heard the term "Word of God" when related to canon? It means that the information is coming directly from the creator. The crawls are the only time in the Star Wars movies that we get that.

So actually, they ARE the fucking bible.

>>52153027
The fucking Mon Cal are more impressive than humans in terms of achievements.

>>52152212
while the rebels werent perfect, and the empire wasnt pure evil

i would like to think the rebels were nice guys on the whole, and much closer to good than evil

>>52152212
Even at their shittiest, the Rebellion is better then the Empire.

On Jedha, while Saw's Partisans were playing Taliban, the Imperials were using Dr Evazan's lobotomized cyborg experiments as pleasure slaves.

And enslaving entire races, including ones that were allies during the Clone Wars such as the Wookies.

And genociding races and peoples. The Geonosians were used as a slave workforce for the Death Star and when the framework was complete they were gassed to death. Alderaan was filled to the brim with innocent people. No declaration of war was made, they just murdered 2 billion sentients on the whim of the Outer Rim's regional governor.

The Empire is evil. The Empire always was evil, and it's successor the First Order is evil. No ands, ifs, or buts about it.

If you want to call the Rebels sketchy, that's fine. Until 2 BBY, they were an informal collection of defectors, former CIS and neutral parties, and randos who the Empire kicked in the teeth, backed by Senators who at the end of the war were members of Padme's cadre who wanted to take away the Chancellor's emergency powers with the end of hostilities.

But any atrocity you can lay at the feet of the Rebels, I can lay tenfold that at the feet of the Empire, and still only cover a drop in the ocean of evil.

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>>52153664
>Implying the Mon Cal can even come close to the glories achieved by Sienar Fleet Systems

>>52153717
The B-Wing is fucking insane, and the capital ship from Rogue One was a goddamn town hall they strapped engines to.

I think they can keep up, they're just not in a position to operate autonomously.

>>52153705
The Imperials weren't using The Decraniated. The rest is accurate, but they were just slaves being used in tea houses and shit.

>>52153705
they also knew when their actions were amoral, and knew to cast them aside when they were no longer needed, and were genuinely remorseful for their actions

>>52153785
The only guy I buy that for is the Legends guy who pulled the trigger on the Death Star. And him only because he realized that he had just murdered countless people, and delayed firing on Yavin for as long as possible.

Remorseful Imperials defect to the Rebellion. "I was just following orders" is never an excuse.

>>52145288
How would the series have gone if Obi Wan died and Qui Gon lived?

>>52153717
Must this picture be posted in every thread?

Sympathetic imps have there place but the empire is pretty clearly evil. Even if you count the attack on the death star as a bad thing cuz the rebels killed a lot of people, it was a legit military target. Military bases get bombed all the time

>>52153871
Anakin wouldn't have fallen. He and Qui-Gon would have cornered the Emperor together and ended his reign before it started.

Do you guys end all your clone wars campaigns with order 66?

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>>52153878
Have another TIE series/derivatives image, then.

>>52153954
No way Qui Gon could have turned Anakin against papa Palps.

>>52153967
No way that Palpatine could have turned Anakin against Qui-Gon.

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>>52138704
>The nuance, subtlety, and substance

>"Jedi cut them down like butter. They really are pretty useless"

>>52153993
That might be a decent point Qui Gon also probably would have snuck off to free his mother.

>>52154034
Right. And he's not so dogmatic that Anakin would have felt isolated by his emotions. Anakin would have been way more open with Qui-Gon.

Obi-Wan and Anakin were like brothers, but they were too close in style/mentality to really catch each others' faults.

But Qui-Gon was way more spiritually-oriented (as opposed to Obi-Wan and Anakin who are action-oriented), which would have provided him a unique viewpoint into Anakin's struggles. When Anakin had dreams about his mother in danger (AotC), he wouldn't have had to seek out Yoda. Instead, he'd go right to Qui-Gon, who would immediately bring the two of them to Tatooine.

Instead of slaughtering the Sand People, Qui-Gon would have somehow negotiated with them.

Anakin's mother would survive. Et cetera.

>>52153871
Qui Gon would have made the Dude version of the order, where you could have your wife and keep your job, and just basically chill.

>>52138704
On the topic of Disney fucking Star Wars, have you noticed how they turned the Empire into cardboard cutouts? Literally every single redeeming factor of them: gone, now they're a banana republic that dies within a year.

>>52155436
I like the "Palpatine wanted the Empire to be destroyed and orchestrated it's destruction" idea a lot. Fits his character.

What I don't like is how quickly it happened. Imagine how much more impactful and shocking the reveal would be if, in the new canon, the GCW lasted for about 3-4 years after Endor. We see the warlords and splinter factions similar to those in the old EU (a lot of focus on Imp factions fighting each other). Over the course of a book series depicting these events we see Rax slowly consolidate the Imperial remnants into a single faction. After 3 years, he's done it. Then the Jakku stuff shown in Empire's End happens.

Essentially, take the Aftermath series, remove Cuck Wendig, stretch out the in-universe plot timeline-wise and add more events. You get the Palpatine contingency plot, but also get the heavy Imperial-infighting and stuff that the new canon lacked.

A few days ago I made a post here discussing how the Aftermath series conflicts with Lost Stars and other post-RoTJ new canon conflict

>>52155655
Based dubsman. Yeah I'd have accepted something like that, the differing warlords would also show different ideals. Some may want to be Sloane/Pellaeon reformists, others hardliners etc. Just a huge missed opportunity in exchange for some feel good pacifist democracy wins ez courtesy of Cuck Wendig..

>>52155669
Yep. They also totally fucked themselves over; we have a 30 year span where nothing happens.

Really all that's interesting that could be done at this point is a conflict between the Imperials in the unknown regions; Sloane vs. Imps with differing ideals, ideally involving Thrawn.
Perhaps the First Order takes 29 years to strike because of infighting?

Other than that we have very little of interest (from a political perspective at least) that happens in a 30 year period. Only serves to exacerbate the poor worldbuilding in TFA. TFA feels more isolated and uncreative; as though the universe only started when the movie did.

I was describing X-wing miniatures to someone who was familiar with the old Tie Fighter game and that sort of stuff, I summarized how some of the Imp ships are good, Tie swarms etc.

But then he asked "so what do Rebels usually take?" I honestly don't know since I've only played a couple games and read a bunch online.

What is the Rebel equivalent of triple Defenders?

>>52155763
Plus the whole no military thing is extremely stupid. The Senate fell and Sheev took over BECAUSE the Republic had no military to resist the megacorps of the CIS so it was his clone army or nothing.

One thing I really hate about Aftermath and a select few other newcanon works is how hard they try to make it serious and "real", primarily as it applies to the Empire.

The Kashyyyk stuff in Life Debt really stands out. It goes into such gruesome detail, and as a result feels inconsistent with the rest of the universe from a tonal perspective. Obviously the slavery should be portrayed as horrible, but that can be accomplished with decent writing that manages to convey a sorrowful and harrowing tone, but the actual content is less extreme. Wait a sec...

>that can be accomplished with decent writing
>decent writing

Nevermind now I know why Wendig just dropped Auschwitz into Star Wars.

I'm planning an AoR adventure set in 2 ABY where the PCs are going to be sent to Kashyyyk to aid the Wookies in reclaiming their world so they can formally join the Alliance. I have a few ideas on stuff they can do to make this happen, (convincing the trandoshians to withdraw their own occupying forces, liberating slave-camps, raiding old clone wars-era bunkers for gear, all culminating in an assault on the Imperial stronghold and capturing/killing the Imperial governor/moff (depending on whether or not Kashyyyk is or is not a sector capitol)). But I was wondering what else I could have the PCs do that could improve their chances of success in the big final battle?

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>>52155897
>When you want to distance your government from the militaristic dictatorship that took over the last galactic republic, so you decommission your entire military to avoid looking like a militaristic dictatorship, which leads to your new galactic republic becoming toothless and spineless, thereby making it ripe for a takeover by a militaristic dictatorship
Need a Mothma ball for this one.

>>52155920
Maybe it's just me but I just figured that the Kashyyyk occupation would have a more "confederate slave plantation" thing going on than going full Nazi.

Does anyone read Fredrick Douglass anymore?

>>52155897
Well, no unified military. Systems and planets had militaries, they just weren't under the central control of the Republic.

>>52153871
>Palpatine assasinates Qui gon later
>Anakin goes on dark side fueled revenge streak
>Palpatine helps him in killing the murderer and hiding the off books action from the council
>Anakin is now well on his way to becoming Palpatines apprentice
It's fate, yo

>>52155972
Maybe take out supply convoys going through the jungle to the stronghold.
Destroy or steal TIEs from a nearby airbase that would support the stronghold's defence.
Subvert local shield generators in order to protect the base from subsequent imperial bombardment, but not protect the base from the initial assault.
Take out particular Imperial officers whilst theyre on excursions away from the base to weakn the imperial position / morale.

>>52155972
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Liberation_of_Kashyyyk_(Galactic_Civil_War)
The Galactic Battlegrounds campaign has some good stuff. Shut down Imp supply lines, hunt down traitors, destroy airbases, establish comms with the Rebellion. Maybe you could take a page out of RepCom and have the PCs take over an anti-ship weapons facility to damage Imperial orbital assets.

>>52156052

That's almost what happened in that three parter of Clone Wars where Obi-wan pretended to be assassinated to get in with the bounty hunter ring.

Anakin got full mad and went on a rampage which only just stopped short of murder, and Palpy encouraged it with a cheeky grin.

>>52156002
This is effectively what happened in the United States with the Articles of Confederation.

Our forefathers were so afraid of central control that they left a weak and useless national government. The federal gov't couldn't tax, couldn't enforce laws, and there was no national army or navy.

Shay's Rebellion made it clear that these weaknesses were critical, which resulted in the new Constitution that the US uses today.

It's not that unrealistic. The colonists fighting the British were underdogs, but under far less tyranny than those under the Empire. It's only reasonable that the anti-centrist beliefs last that much longer between initiation of the New Republic and the realization that they led to weakness (the rise of the First Order).

TFW you realize you learned something in history class.

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>>52156137
>the destruction of NR's capital happens approximately 30 years after Endor
>the War of 1812 also happened approximately 30 years after the end of the American Revolution
So the First Order aren't just Space Nazis. They're Space Nazi Canadians.

>>52152503
Knowledge skills no, Force powers yes.

>>52155838
Well, Empire usually takes Aces, Elite Generics, or Swarms, focusing on numbers or mobility/positioning.

Rebels focus mostly on having shields, lots of red dice, and regen aces. They also have the Fat Turret. Rebel lists tend to contain FCS-B-wings, Z-95's, K-wings, and super/fat loadouts on big ships.

Scum is focused on being tricky.

>>52156186
You are now imagining Kylo and Ginger Hitler fighting over the maple syrup bottle.

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>>52156186
Oh Canada!

>>52156620
>Japanese sun rays
>weird ass cross with angled top
>"legion" of disruption

It's like someone made an algorithm that just combined random shit.

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>>52156614

>>52156721
Its an inuksuk, not a cross.

>>52157072
Well it looks stupid. That shit inuksuks.

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>>52157124
Its supposed to be a stylized version of one of these. There's one on a Canadian provincial flag that looks less stupid. I agree that it looks terrible in that picture though

Giggled

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Stupid question: if you're dark side aligned, do you still take Conflict for every dark side Force pip you use?

>>52157251
I think you'd instead take conflict for using light side pips, but I don't know if conflict would be the right name anymore.

>>52157301
>>52157251
I ask because it seems a bit silly to me, like you'd be racing towards 0 Morality in a heartbeat, because all of your effective Force pips are automatic Conflict.

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http://www.starwars.com/databank/imperial-listener-ship

it listen

>>52157326

AWACS Gozanti.

I wonder if it can still haul a few TIEs around?

>>52157342
Looks like it can carry two

>>52157326
>>52157342
I see two hatch-tubes on the bottom instead of four.

>>52157251
>>52157322
Yes, you still take Conflict for Dark Side point use as a dark sider. It's basically there to make it even harder to climb back up to Light Side since you need to rely more heavily on Destiny Points/Strain so you can use Light Side points.

>>52157403
Interesting, I guess I just find it a bit odd because then you're basically going to go from 29 to 0 Morality in the span of a few sessions, at most, without very careful and stingy usage of Force powers. I guess it makes sense for the decline to happen rapidly and be hard to crawl out of, but, like, damn, you're probably generating 10 or more Conflict a session even without doing anything overtly bad, just by spending Force pips at that point.

>>52153852
What book/comic do we learn about that guy? That's mighty interesting.

>>52157403
>>52157441
The Hydian Way podcast and the Order 66 podcast both talked about this a few weeks back. The intention is that once you become darkside, things start rapidly spiralling out of control and it's very difficult to crawl your way back.

>>52155838
Fat Falcons and K-wings that spend the whole game running away to plink with turrets, and maybe Corran Horn if you feel like flying dangerously.

>>52136391
was anyone at Pax East? I was with Vader, and I'd like to see some pictures if anyone has them

>>52158951
Someone please deliver. Nothing like a fa/tg/uy as Darth Vader

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Has any Sith other Vader Ben full on redeemed to the light before in canon? Not taking about the video games where you choose their fate, but books and lore including legends

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>>52159041
Ulic Qel-Droma. His rise, fall, and redemption were major character arcs.

>>52159041
>Legends
Ulic Qel-Droma. I don't know if Tahiri counted as a Sith--she was Jacen's apprentice during the Caedus silliness, but I can't remember whether she ever got formally recognized as one. While Revan's fate could be chosen in vidya, later works, including books, declared the Jedi ending to be the Legends-canonical one.

>>52159285
Wait, they let the bitch who killed Pellaeon get a "Redemption" arc?

>>52159400
Sadly yes. The scene at her trial where the jury goes from
>aw, she's not bad, just manipulated by the sith
To
>GET THREE COFFINS READY
after hearing pellaeon's last words on tape is pretty great, even so

>>52159041
Revan was brainwashed into the light
Uliq Qel Droma
Possibly http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Gravid
Bastila became a sith apprentice for a super short while against her will before the power of love redeems her back
Ajunta Pall is an interesting case because he's redeemed after death/as a sith ghost
Kyp durron
Starkiller might count?

>>52157540
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Death_Star_(novel)

>>52153957
I've actually started a few campaigns with order 66. But it certainly is a good place to end it, though it is just as good a place just to shift it into a new arc or "sesaon" for the campaign. Could also work ending right beforehand, with the implication of what's about to happen to the players characters left for them to imagine.

>>52159813
Thanks!

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Decided to watch clone wars after some recommendations from here, what are these ships made off? Paper?

>>52160552
Paper doesn't exist in star wars, idiot.

They're made of flimsiplast.

>>52160552
They're made of alternating layers of optimism and disappointment

>>52160552
The various shows are sorta shit at making ships feel durable, too much "Things break at the speed of plot," it only gets worse in Rebels.

>>52160618
I've seen planets with trees. YOu're the idiot, idiot

>>52160727
Wood exists, paper does not. Wood is too valuable to be used as anything but wookie lightsaber handles.

>>52159041
>Vader Ben

He's probably a character on Fanon wikia somewhere

>>52159628
Revan was brainwashed into the dark too though by Darth Vitiate :^)

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>>52160974
Vader Ben? More like Kylo Ren, am I right?

>>52161210
Vitiate does not and never did exist.

>>52161489
Kekd

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>>52160792

>>52162214
I think the anon you responded to is about to have a stroke.

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Inevitably, brave rebels or notorious scum will be captured and taken to a proper Imperial prison with pill lights and hissing hydraulic doors. Because this is Space Opera, they're going to get out somehow. It's inevitable. But what will give them the chance?

https://coinsandscrolls.blogspot.ca/2017/03/star-wars-imperial-prisons.html

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>>52162282
>what will give them the chance
Orders by the Emperor himself that the PCs be released and shipped to a backwater Chiss colony because of reasons.