MTG March 13 Ban

>>52107475
Standard: n/a
Modern: n/a (although some combination of jtms, preordain, ponder, twin could come off but will never happen)
Legacy: n/a
Vintage: Paradoxical Outcome is now restricted

>>52109395
>Standard: n/a
>n/a
>n
>/
>a
Are you retarded? 100% they will ban a piece of the cat lady combo, they already said it wasn't supposed to exist.

>>52109500

Kitty cat combo is not degenerative enough to ban. It's nowhere NEAR as bad as Emrakul or Smugs were during their time in standard.

I'm rooting for Felidar Guardian and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar to be banned in Standard.

>>52109767

Meh, Gids is going away in about 9 months. I don't feel he's worth banning.

I think Marvel would be the only thing even close to getting banned in standard.

>>52107475
They're banning anything that allows you to play competitively without Gideon, Ally of Zendikar because he hasn't been in enough top8s.

>>52109500
>it wasn't mean to exist
That combo is one of the most forced pairings that has ever existed what the fuck are you talking about.

Gideon is the only ban necessary.

>Standard
-
>Papuer
-
>Modern
-Unban Jace, the Mind Sculptor
>Legacy
-
>Vintage
-

>Commander
>implying Sheldon

>>52107475
Commander: Fetchlands are banned, because you can put Scalding Tarn in a nonblue (that still has red) deck and that's horrible.

>>52112299
Pls no

>>52112518
It is against the SPIRIT OF EDH to use off-color fetchlands that may well backfire on you if you happen to already have everything that's a Mountain already (or just means you're paying life for a basic and a shuffle). AGAINST THE SPIRIT!

>>52112299
Nothing will ever get banned in EDH. It took 3 years of constant pressure just to get Prophet banned, and that card actually NEEDED to be banned.

>>52113427
Yes, but that's because Sheldon and his group liked using it.
He doesn't like fetches because they can search for islands in nonblue decks and That's Wrong.

>>52112299
>not even banning off-color fetches, just ban them in general

the salt would be unreal, fund it

>>52113516
>Yes, but that's because Sheldon and his group liked using it.


>Bazaar of Baghdad is Legal
>Mishra's Workshop is legal
>Tabernacle of Pendrell Vale is legal

>Library of Alexandria is banned because "muh bad feelz from poorfags"

Face it, Sheldon is a hack and only there by the sheer will of the WotC gods

>>52114094
>>52114137
They'll probably claim it leads to excessive shuffling, too, instead of the real reason.
Rampant tutors and commanders that force shuffles every turn are okay still, though, of course.

Standard: Scrapheap Scrounger
Modern: Thoughtseize
Legacy: none
Vintage: Gush restricted
Pauper: none

Commander: none
Dual Commander: Vial-Smasher banned as commander.

>>52109395
Gush still is the best deck of the format. Paradoxical Outcome was just pushed for awhile.

>>52116652
>Thoughtseize

wew
Still mad about the Theros reprint?

>>52116740
Not really, I just think it's the only piece that's bannable and fits with the double Inquisition printings.

Standard - ban Winding Constrictor
Modern - unban jtms, splinter twin, bloodbraid elf,
Legacy - no change
Vintage - no change
Commander - all cards over 6 mana.

Unban Stoneforge Mystic and Jace, the Mind Sculptor.
All other formats no changes

>>52116774
>>52116740
>>52116652
A thoughtseize ban has got to be one of the most retarded cards they could even ban in modern right now.
Modern doesn't need more bans, it needs unbans to push both white and blue as they are leagues behind the other colours in power

Standard: Winding Constrictor, plus part of the cat combo
Modern: Nothing, but Metallic Mimic is going to need one before too long. Elves was already good. They didn't need more resistance against Anger of the Gods.
Legacy: Nada
Vintage: Nada
Commander: Fetches, if only. Print an alternative that removes the shuffling somehow. Bonus points if the alternative is modern legal and doesn't have a permanent leave the battlefield for ez Fatal procs

>>52116906
Nothing is going to be an alternative to fetches AND not leave the battlefield.
It's possible to make ones that don't go to the graveyard and don't shuffle (exile and get from sideboard, for example), but it's going to have to be one-use, and anything involving counters to do that will end up being too wordy and is honestly not worth the effort just to not trigger one card.

>>52113427

>ban Prophet, Rofellos, Primordial, Prime Time, and basically every other good green card ever made
>sol ring legal

EDH is a fucking joke.

>>52116870
Yeah fuck combo and control aggro and midrange all day baby.

>>52117130
Welcome to Modern.

>>52110312
Sam Stod's gone on record that they didn't think of the copycat combo. That doesn't mean that it should be banned though.
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/latest-developments/m-files-aether-revolt-part-1-2017-02-03

I can't imagine banning anything other Heart of Kiran or Gideon for standard.

>Standard now has the same ban mania that modern has.
>The standard format is in such a shit state that Wizards had to resort to banning the 3 top decks as their is no answers in the entire format.
Man Wizards continues to impress with their fuckups in standard year after year

>>52117447
Dont forget that people hate the churn and burn nature of standard and the quicker rotation pushed a lot of people out.

>>52117530
Ya hence they changing it back to 1 year rotations.
You can see Wizards is struggling with Standard at the moment and I honestly haven't seen Standard in this much of a mess in a long time

>>52117297
I'm beyond blaming Wizards for fucking up designs and letting crazy shit through. I don't even think it's too crazy - the cat combo or the snake.

You can energy-bolt or push the snake, no fucking problem; Fumigate is also available. Unfortunately you can't bolt or Fumigate the fucking Heart of Kiran.

My problem is that Standard decks are creeping up on Modern decks in terms of pricing. And that's what is fucked up. Out of a 150-250 card set only some 10 non-land cards throughout all rarities are constructed desirable. Seriously, what the fuck is up with that? I don't want to play one goddamn deck for three months until a new set comes out and that doesn't mean I'm poor, I just feel that that level of secondary market cost for a deck seems completely outrageous.

I think it's fucking hilarious that they're focusing on reforming DCI numbers, streamlining GPs, and pushing some stupid new Duels product when I'm sure the vast majority of players who don't want to make a living of Magic just want to be able to show up to FNM and have some semi-competitive games and play on a fucking online client that doesn't explode after running for an hour.

Sometimes I wonder how Wizards designs the set around the threats they print. I wonder if they look at a threat like Heart and ask themselves, "how does this interact in combat" or "how can players kill this thing"? You're not going to Naturalize the thing because Naturalize is a shit card.

You take a card like Grave Titan and seriously ask yourself if it's a good fucking idea to have it running around when nearly nothing interacts with it favorably except OTHER Grave Titans. For all her nuttiness Elesh Norn can just fucking die to a O-Ring or Doom Blade. Gristlebrand is just hard to cast. But then they let through bullshit like Emrakul 2.0 who is just neither of those things and also has built-in protection.

Battlecruiser Magic is fine. But often battlecruiser Magic is held in check by disruption or Wraths or removal. I can't believe they think that having games decided by one round of combat (like it is with Emrakul and Grave Titan) flies. It's hard to imagine they're that stupid but that is the only explanation why they let it through.

>>52107475
Standard: Scrapheap Scrounger, Felidar Guardian
Modern: JTMS unban, SFM unban.
Legacy: N/A
Vintage: Gush back on restricted list. In a perfect world, either Paradoxical restricted or Necropotence unrestricted alongside Library.
I have no fucking clue why Library is still restricted.

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>>52107475
FREE TWIN

Baleful Strix, make it Mythic and MODERN LEGAL BABY.

Ban Aether Vial :^)

>>52117648
>Seriously, what the fuck is up with that?
Because Wizards believe that they can better predict the metagame and balance archetypes accordingly when the number of playables in each set is low. Their track record is not great, however.

Plsl unban Twin. I'm playing Jund and I want to have a good match up.

>>52107475
only speaking about modern: mishra's bauble is actually on the knife's edge

Nothing is getting banned in Standard because they'd either ban a shitload of things or risk turning the 2 deck format into a 1 deck format
Ban Gideon, Copycat is king
Ban Cat, Vehicles is king
Ban both Gideon and Cat, Snek is king
And for sure they're not banning 3 cards after just banning 3 cards, it would make a lot of people really mad.
As for Modern, please make U great again.

>>52109395
>preordain, ponder
I really don't see this happening, wotc wants to keep the amount of cheap cantrips low and they just banned probe.

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Modern-
>Grapeshot is banned
>Empty the Warrens is banned
>Preordain is unbanned
>Ponder is unbanned
>Rite of Flame is unbanned
>Seething Song is unbanned

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>>52121189
Dragonstorm all day baby.

>>52117557
Last good was in Innisrad/RtR. Things went to shit (playwise, not sales-wise, you pendantic fags) after that. I played against everything but a 5 color deck at that time. Rare mono color, but shocks and buddy lands made so many decks possible. It was great. I had high hopes for return to zendikar and return to innistraad, but wotc can not think. The rely on gimmicks instead of playability.

>>52121420
fucking Ingest and Processing, mechanics so bad not a single card with either saw any play (except Vile Amalgam, only because it had the world Eldrazi and Colorless on it)

well thats actually true of ALL mechanics from BFZ block. Rally, Support, Ingest, Converge, Process, all of them bad.

>No reprint for Tron decks in Modern Masters 2017
Should I be worried?

>>52117762
Don't forget, the Titans were the best designed cycle in all of magic! The guy who designed them said so himself, which is why they got reprinted the very next core set!

>>52121729
Probably not, even if wizards targets tron with a ban it isn't likely that it will hugely effect the viability of the deck, the most you would need to worry about is losing money on one of the win-cons or finding a replacement for one of the tutors.

>>52121852
Unless they ban the lands

>>52121864
I can't imagine they would ever just kill tron in isn't even close to broken or dominant enough to warrant it.

>>52121592
The thing is,they don't seem to realize that the game is old enough to use old gimmicks full throttle. People would love them. Instead to get into modern, you have knowledge of 40+ keywords with vastly different impacts on eachother.

Sure, storm was over powered. But holy fuck did I have a blast playing it, and playing against it. It wasn't a memorization of keywords, it was checking out the board state and keeping track of the game. At least at my local shops, it's 1/3 of the people there, and everyone saying "judge!" When they full well know our judge is the TO who is playing. Because they needed an 8th man.

This started out differently than it ended.

Standard sucks and has for awhile, mainly due to game design.

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>>52121746
>tfw there will never be a good Red or Blue Titan

>>52121729
Yes. Merfolk also needs to worry.

What's the over/under on Gideon getting banned?

>>52124411
doubtful but it probably should have been banned over something like copter, IMO

Gideon will remain unbanned

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>>52122937
Close enough.

>>52122937
Are you kidding me? Inferno Titan is a good card

>>52125127
This is garbage fit only for standard

>>52125127
>>52125859
This card is excellent for any storm deck in any format or spellslingers. only format its bad for is modern I think there are better alternatives

>>52125921
Edh tier garbage

>>52125994
How? It's snappy 5-8, how is this bad?

Always interesting when a Modern scg open has more viewers than a magic hosted standard gp stream.

>>52127210
Lmao no it isn't

>>52127229
That's because wizard's coverage is complete asscheeks compared to SCG streams that have actual, competent, commentators.

>>52127210
Wew lad

>>52127229
Not just scg cobber. Last years modern gp vancouver was on thr same days as a standard gp in the US (That a lot of pros were at).

Modern GP had consistently over 10,000 viewers, standard around 4000

turning in thread
looks like Mishra's Bauble and Thought Knot Seer will be the March 13 bans for modern.
source: a leak via MTGO

>>52127901
Thoughtknot? Fuck off shill. Deck isnt oppressive. Card isnt oppressive

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>>52127210
>It's snappy 5-8

>>52119761
If they only ban uncommons like snake, cat and motorist then only Saheeli-fags lose money because she becomes worthless again. Balista is only used in Mardu because it's great in the mirror because everything in mardu has no health.

>>52127901
LOL I made this up you moron

Opal banned, artifact lands unbanned.

>>52128980
Wizards doesn't do switch bans

Standard: no bans. Working as intended :^)
Modern: unban twin, unban stoneforge. There are so many new tools to stop twin that it's nowhere close to a problem. Twin will also drive snapcaster(read:mm17) sales, as well as bring blue back into the format. Stoneforge potentially brings some versatility into a format dominated by fatties cast dirt cheap. SFM would be a trial unban.
Legacy: no changes to the perfect pure format.
Commander: this is not a format.

>>52109500
>Wasnt supposed to exist

But people dont even play it? I havent seen jeskai decks get much traction in standard compared to mardu vehicles or mardu counters.

If wotc is going to make a major shakeup unbanning, the release of mm 2017 is going to be the time. Preorder your snapcaster now, goyim. The FUN color will reign again.

>>52129387
4c cat combo has put up some results, but you're correct that it isn't super popular. Lots of players see a one dimensional deck that does to shock/disintegration and call it bad.

I think they probably knew the combo when they released it. They were most likely a) probing for the viability of combo in a controlled (small) standard environment with counters available to four colors (not green lol) and b) giving themselves a viable escape hatch if they needed to panic ban it.

Yes please Wizards, ban Mox Opal. Make it easier for me to get a foil again (fucked up and waited too long for one).

>>52127811
>those numbers
If you've ever wondered why corporate Wizards has no fucking reason to improve the quality of their coverage, there's your reason.

Only reason why SCG has such good coverage is because that business is privately owned - and the guy probably cares that quality matters. Say what you will about secondary market bullshit, at least they care about producing quality content.

They should un-ban the banned standard cards.

>>52116652

>ban Thoughtseize in Modern

Rev up those Ad Nauseam decks because nothing is stopping the combo train.

Standard: n/a
Modern: ban: ancient stirrings for the same reason you banned ponder and preordain
unban: jtms and bloodbraid
legacy: n/a
vintage: restrict paradoxical outcome

>>52127210
Snappy comes in turn 3, Blue hulk is turn 6, and snappy can hit sorc. If I have to explain why this is significant, you need to play the format more.

Standard: Nothing
Modern: Nothing
Legacy: Nothing
Vintage: Nothing

In THEORY. I don't think they would ban anything from Standard, that would just go against their incentive to push Standard right now and another ban would just weaken trust in WotC and the format(not like there's much in there to begin with.)

>>52129456
I think its decent, but its too slow and their isnt enough control to protect the combo I believe. If you have a combo deck getting it off turn 2 or 3 is a must, but turn 4 tap out is a bit slow with the removal available in this set.

>>52129783
I dont see BBE getting unbanned, especially with such strong cards that will buff jund having just been printed.

>>52129456
>not green
Just fog it :^)

>>52129364
>legacy
>perfect
U avin a giggle m8?

>>52129387
>>52129456
Do you always make shit up?
Copy cat is right behind Mardu vehicles with a grossly large meta share

>>52125859

>This is garbage fit only for standard

It's Vintage playable.

>>52130162
So is slash panther. Get outta here

>>52129364
>Commander
>not a format
Nigga you need to get off that pedestal youve sat your pasty ass on.

>>52130062
Yeah, that sounds about right. The more important point than the actual deck's performance is that they printed a two card infinite combo that *didn't break the format.* That means that combos are back in the 'fair game' design space for the near future. They absolutely won't be in every standard, but they're no longer off limits and that's pretty exciting for the format.

>>52130194
Oh, I'm sorry, I seem to have forgotten my :^)

>>52130194
but for real, it's not
are duel decks? No.

>>52130158
Fair enough, I havent looked up standard's meta share recently and I was just saying based off what was played at a few ditfferent tourneys I saw a few weeks ago which were filled with mostly Mardu vehicles and BG or GW aggro decks.

>>52130283
Theres a big difference from duel decks and the commander format. Even WotC acknowledges it as a format.

>>52130179

Yeah Slash Panther was played back when Jace was everywhere in Vintage, he still shows up but Vintage is not a Jace dominated format anymore.

No I genuinely say that Torrential Gearhulk is a legitimate Vintage playable card. Most of the strongest cards in Vintage are already instants anyway(DTT, Ancestral Recall, Mana Drain, FoW, Gush etc.) 6 mana is really easily achieved in Vintage and achieved fast and acts as a beefier Snapcaster in a format that plays a much smaller amount of removal. Some decks don't have access to StP and their only removal is Dismember. Generally you only ever play 1 or maybe 2 Torrential Gearhulks.

The only thing you gotta worry about is Dack Fayden trying to steal it but since you have Flash on the Gearhulk it doesn't matter as you can just end step cast and then swing back next turn.

>>52130283
Commander is indeed a format.
A horribly managed one, governed by someone with his head up his ass, but a format nonetheless.
Duel decks are a casual preconstructed product.

>>52130370
>treasure cruise
>dig through time
>bargain
>mind's desire
>wurmcoil maybe

These are pretty much the only cmc 6+ cards that are actually cast in vintage, 3 have reduced cost through shops lands/ delve, so realistically there are only 2, and they essentially win the game. You are saying gearhulk is in this class?

>>52130835
To be fair, Gearhulk is also an artifact like Wurmcoil is.
I have no idea about viability at all, just saying that it also gets to play with workshop

>>52130835
No, he's super wrong. Because while there is a lot of acceleration, you are not casting a 6-cost card ever except off Rituals or Lotus; and cracking Lotus for a 5/6 worse Snapcaster is fucking mega-baka senpai.

There are some people that have experimented with it but ultimately, it's shit. Like - any deck that wants Gearhulk, can just play Mentor+JTMS and have way fucking better threats. Shits stupid, fuck Gearhulk.

>>52130835

In the Mana Drain based decks? Yes he is. Every now and then you see Consecrated Sphinx show up in decks as well but the Gearhulk has the advantage and disadvantage of also being an artifact. (e.g Tolarian Academy, Dack Fayden).

It does not straight up replace Snapcaster but there are times when you want a big beefier Snapcaster.

>>52131012

>Because while there is a lot of acceleration, you are not casting a 6-cost card ever except off Rituals or Lotus; and cracking Lotus for a 5/6 worse Snapcaster is fucking mega-baka senpai.

You clearly don't play enough Vintage if this is how you think that is the line of play in casting cards. Rituals are only played in Storm based combo decks in Vintage, T gearhulk would never be played in Storm decks. The card goes into the U based Mana Drain control decks. There are times when a game has stalled out long enough that I have managed to hardcast a Sphinx of the Steel Wind in Grixis Thieves.

>Like - any deck that wants Gearhulk, can just play Mentor+JTMS and have way fucking better threats

Mentor decks barely even run JTMS, most don't at all.

>>52131142
Still shows up as an occasional 1-2 of, you definitely don't play more than that. Yes, I am aware that you would not play him in Storm, thank you anon - it wasn't me pointing out how silly putting a 6-mana card in your deck that can't win the game on it's own is.

Tezzeret Control is the obvious shell for it but even that deck has just way better things it can be doing. Assembling VaultKey, TinkerBlightsteel, etc.. it's not like you have unlimited slots, Vintage lists are generally pretty fuckin' tight. Finding room for such a low-impact (in comparison) card is not justifiable IMO.

That's also ignoring the part where Mana Drain decks are Tier 3 at best.

>>52121420
I jad a ton of fun in RtR/Theros standard, but I can see where people had issues with it.

>>52122937
Inerno titan was BOMB.

>>52131204

>it wasn't me pointing out how silly putting a 6-mana card in your deck that can't win the game on it's own is.

You say that but in testing and playtime it actually can. Despite the contrary to popular belief, outside of StP a 5/6 dude is quite tough to kill easily in Vintage, it's not a heavy removal format though it is slowly acquiring more due to Eldrazi and Mentor decks. Tezzerator Control decks are almost always based on being a Steel City Vault deck(Vault+Key) as their main way to win. Finding a slot for 1 or 2 T Gearhulk isn't hard in the U based Mana Drain decks.

>That's also ignoring the part where Mana Drain decks are Tier 3 at best.

That's where you're mistaken. They've always been strong solid tier 2 decks for an unknown metagame. You have answers against Shops, Gush based decks and Storm. Only downside is Dredge game 1 but that's normal.

>>52130091
BBE wouldn't likely go into Jund, that deck already has a ton of competing four drops and with graveyard decks being relevant still, Kalitas still remains the default 4-drop. If anything BBE would go into degenerate decks that cascade into a free ancestral recall.

>>52131435

Nah man they'll put it back into Jund because people wanna live the dream of BBE > Kolaghan's Command.

VALUE

>>52117854
>I have no fucking clue why Library is still restricted.
>10/4/2004: You may tap multiples of these in response to each other because the requirement for 7 cards is checked only at the time the ability is announced and not again when it resolves.
I think that might be why, but I could be wrong.

>>52116652

>Standard: Scrapheap Scrounger

Never realized how painful that fucker could be until I ran against two decks that used him while playing Grixis Control last night. Didn't help that I couldn't pull my removal nor Kalitas. Fuck, I didn't draw a single Sideboarded card last night.

>>52122937
Inferno Titan is a good card, hell if it had haste it would be downright busted.
Blue Titan is shit though.

>>52129783
Ponder and Preordain were banned because of storm. Ancient Stirrings is working as intended.

ITT: People who don't actually play standard but talk about it regardless

>>52132616
how old are you?
90% of all conversations can be described as "people who don't understand [subject] but talk about it regardless"

Also, sell your Baubles.

>>52125127
Would only be good if it was just flashback and happens when it enters the battlefield or attacks.

>>52125421
>>52131310
>>52131643
Okay I will admit that Inferno Titan is definitely the better of the two, but for someone who has a hard on for tokens, graveyard shenanigans, and pulling off cool land combos in Legacy, it's not that fun.

>>52107475
Standard: A card that is allegedly important to Cat-Combo but isn't the actual Cat or Sahelli.
Modern: Nothing.
Legacy/Legacy: Implying Wizards cares.

>>52117092
the degeneracy of prophit was not because it was in green decks, but because it was in blue ones

>>52117092
The difference here is that those can only go in decks with green, while Sol RIng can be thrown into literally any deck. Green has enough good ramp as it is, it doesn't need cards that can both reliably and cheaply fucking double the amount of mana it has access to.

Real question here, why is ponder or preordain banned? Could they be unbanned to provide U/control decks flourish?

>>52134046
Because they make Blue too efficient at library manipulation. Blue is in 100% of Legacy decks because of this, among other reasons.

They will never be unbanned. They're too good.

>>52134311
And now blue is in 0% of modern decks. This is the future you chose.

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>>52134046
I wish they at least gave us Accumulated Knowledge instead of Take Inventory.

Snek and/or Rishkar, Felidar Guardian, maybe Heart of Kiran.
As for modern, no fucking clue.
Wizards doesn't really care about Legacy or Vintage, unless there is some REALLY degenerate cards...

>>52134414
Hey man, not my fault WotC only lets Green or Blue be good, never both.

>>52107475
don't really care about the other formats but for modern

PLEASE ban SSG
and do something to death's shadow please

>>52116652
SS: yeah, actually might be legit there.
Thoughtseize: not a chance in hell happening.
>>52116804
BBE sees unban, when Liliana of the Veil gets banned. Fact.
Twin, dunno, might have cooled down.
JtMS: I'd love to see this in modern, just for a testrun at least.
>>52116851
Stoneforge unban would lead to Swords & Batterskull being banned. NOPE.
>>52116870
I agree with the Blue, but white... D&T is doing fine, though it's been largely replaced by drazi and taxes...
>>52121420
REALLY? Khans/ BfZ standard was one of the most retarded standard enviroments around. 4-coloud decks EASILY. Decks that ran BOTH Siege Rhino and Dig Through Time AND cast them reliably back-to-back.
>>52132668
Yes. Baubles gotta go. Thankfully, never cracked any.

>>52134745
Lol Sfm would lead to swords ban? Are you a fucking joker now mate.
You really overestimate SFM in the modern meta.
Then again after reading your post you're either a poor fag or no nothing about the format