Shit bad DMs do

>>52103468
>Not respecting the monologue
>Calling yourself a hero
Literal Pleb

>one character breaks away from the party to do something
>online campaign, so the whole thing is whispered
>rest of the party can't continue until he's back
>literal hours pass with radio silence
>almost every session with this shit
Motherfucker, we set aside hours of our week for this. Some of us have adult schedules. If you're not going to include 80% of the party in the game, don't waste our time.

Alternatively, STOP FUCKING RUNNING OFF ALONE RRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>52103651
Sounds like you need to talk to your dm

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>>52103468
No such thing as a bad DM.

Dont like it be a DM yourself!

>>52103783
Arguably true. No such thing as objectively bad, just something you don't like.

I support that second point, if more people thought like that maybe forever gm's would get to play occasionally.

>>52103685
Blah blah shitty passive reason why I can't/won't blah blah everyone should telepathically know how I feel blah.
You're right, I should just rip that bandaid off. I've been having trouble phrasing it in a way that doesn't sound like an insult, since the guy has a habit of taking stuff personally and I really don't think poorly of the GM himself, just a few bad habits in his games.

>>52103783
I agree with you on the grounds that anyone willing to GM is already deserving of some cut slack since it's a hard job, but the thread isn't really about bad GMs, just bad GMing tendencies.

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>>52103468
The rules dictate that speech is a free action. Respect the rules or leave the table.

>>52103783
There's no such thing as a bad DM, only DMs whose players' standards aren't low enough

>>52103468
>Anyone prepped to make a speech has readied an action to attack at the first sign of hostility
>You say "I attack him" but as soon as you move to strike his blade is already thrust your way
>take [shitton] damage

>>52103863
Long speeches are not a free action. Short orders are

>>52103783
Already talked to him about it. My DM is in a sunk cost fallacy right now. I really want to DM, but he already made all the maps and stuff for the adventure and he doesn't want his hours invested go to waste. So we have to, at the very least, play about 8 more hours.

>>52103892
You see? That's a better solution than "no, your character is not supposed do that"

>>52103894
you could bail.

>>52103916
how?

>>52103930
deception, fake your own death

>>52103468
That's why you have the villain monologue on TV.

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>>52103863
>The rules dictate that speech is a free action

But what if I'm playing a game that makes sense

>>52104871
You aren't the DM so it's not for you to decide.

>>52104871
Then you're lying to us

>>52103863
said rules usually have a limit such as "a sentence or 2", or oddly enough the exactly 16 words my system of choice uses.

>>52104890
But my GM gives us max 3 seconds of dialogue in a combat turn.

>The gamemaster should be careful to control excessive, unrealistic conversations within the span of a single action during a 3-second Combat Turn.

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>>52103468
Attack him how?
Over the radio speaker he's speaking through?

>>52103651
>online campaign, so the whole thing is whispered
There is no need for this. Shit GM.

Of course, you sound like you play by text, making all of you shit.

>>52104936
I need to dig up that comic page where a character delivers a huge wall of text as he's leaping towards another character.

>>52103892
>Anyone prepped to make a speech has readied an action to attack at the first sign of hostility

Not a bad way to solve it from a rules perspective, but I don't accept that a readied action is invisible. If you've readied an action to strike, you should already be in a stance and have your hand on your blade.

>>52105178
>Of course, you sound like you play by text
Ya think so?

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>>52103468
As a forever GM, I've had players do that, and I was always ok with it.

Let your player act like they want, especially if a) They logically can do so, and b) It makes for a fun scene.

Any RPG is made to be enjoyed, not to allow the GM to write his novel. If as a GM, you can't allow your players to act within the bounds of their characters possibilities, then why are you even GM'ing ?

>>52103468
>me: I do that
>DM: NO
I think that sums up most of the bad DM practices. If the player is doing something extremely retarded (we all know it happens a lot), let him do the action, but punish it severely. Don't just fucking tell OOC "no, you can't do that" while there's no real reason why he can't.

>>52105325
What if his actions fucks not only him but the whole group over, who didn't do anything wrong?

>>52105345
Group game, group consequences.

Group can also kill the fucker if he keeps putting them into danger over and over.

The group I play with does a lot of 40K RPGs, and there's one guy who repeatedly does retarded shit that could easily lead to a TPK. Instead of letting him fuck things up, his character usually ends up murdered by the party. Happens in their Eclipse Phase campaigns too. This guy always does some dumb shit and ends up dying from it. Every time. And if they let him get away with it, the GM would extend the effects of his actions to the rest of the party, assuming it logically makes sense to do so.

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>>52103468
>DM makes time to create a villain with motives and a story around him. Even wrote him a large monolouge tying everything together.
>you just want to murder hobo everything probably ruining the experiance foreveryone involved like an autist
>come to /tg/ expecting everyone to villify the DM who wouldnt allow you to be a murderhobo for the sake of story
Pic related

>>52105397
>villain's motives are only revealed in a monologue

that's not exactly a good approach

>>52105345
Kill him, let the group escape. It all depends on your inventiveness as a GM and whether or not you can come up with an elegant and logical way out.
Although, if he endangers the entire group, I'd expect the other players to restrain him before he can pull it off.

>>52105397
no, OP is right about the bad DM part. A good DM makes the villain a wizard with hold person mass so that the speech can go on uninterupted.

>>52103468
Wanna know something the absolute worst players do? The kind of players I would never allow in my games?
Use that Pepe punch picture

>>52105397
Nobody cares about motives of your shitty self-insert, Steve.

>>52105325
Yeah, >>52105345 is right. Just because it's possible in the game world doesn't mean you can do it at my table.

>Fucking over the group or a thing the group loves, assuming you have good motives
Will be subjected to popular vote (with a stalemate meaning no). I expect my players to be able to tell "exciting" from "frustrating".
>Sadistic/fucked up shit within reason (IC roleplay, torture for info...) and unexpected silliness
Are both allowed only if they fit the previously agreed upon tone of the game, or if absolutely everyone is okay with changing the tone.
>PVP
Allowed if it doesn't fall into "fucking over the group" and both players consent.
>Lolrandumb or edgy shit
Only in special sessions (see point 2) or you can fuck right off.
>ERP
No.

If individual fun goes against group fun/comfort (GM's included), group fun wins.

Why not space out the villains monologue between attacks?

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>>52105345
> Two of the party members worked as cobblers, one a master, one an apprentice
> Very powerful mob boss comes in and requests shoes
> Specifically from the master who doesn't usually meet the customers directly
> Apprentice doesn't think it'd be too big a deal to call him up to meet the mob boss
> Master comes up
> Mob boss greets him and explains he'd like some shoes
> Master has never really gotten mad before
> Suddenly goes nuclear at the mob boss, ripping in to him for almost 2 minutes
> Mob boss apologizes and asks him to reconsider
> "GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY STORE. NO SPECIAL TREATMENT"
> Spits at mob boss
> Me and Apprentice are pic related
> Mob boss leaves
>"I wasn't paying attention, was that guy important?"
> Nobody can stop laughing to explain to him what just happened.

The store was burnt down and the campaign essentially derailed into an anti-mob vengeance story from that point forward

>>52105397
>>52103468

My group has never waiting for any sort of monolog. Generally, if we're listening to some extended monolog, we're doing it when the baddy has already been defeated, or there's a lul in the fight.

See bad guy, kill bad guy. You should have already tried to find out what you can about him before you even are in contact with him, so that you have every advantage you can against him. This is just how my group has always operated.

Sometimes we even get an OOC after action report on the BBEG. I specifically remember one case in which we found out that the BBEG was basically a tragic hero in a way, but that was after we had already finished the campaign. Our group sees this as normal, and it would have to be some really crazy circumstances for us to surrender the initiative just to hear the BBEG out.

>>52103468
Sometimes not finishing the speech is more powerful.

I fully intend to rip off this scene in a campaign eventually.
https://youtu.be/aLkQfmUEyvk?t=119

>>52103468
>allow OP to play

>>52103468

Fuck your "I kill the bad guy during his monologue" meme. It's not clever. You're not smart for thinking of it.

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>>52105721
>Killing the BBEG before he could make a joke
>Being That Guy

>>52105721
This Amon is better than the official one, and his motivation makes much more sense too.

>>52105549
Perhaps you should fuck off back to Skyrim then, Kevin.

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>>52103468
>villain in the middle of his "epic" monologue
>me: I attack him
>his brains gets blown out with a gun
>villain's ghost shows up
>villain's ghost continues monologue

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>>52103468
>villain takes a moment in his dialog to hit a player character with a maximized disintegrate

>>52105872
At least when I'm playing Skyrim I'm having fun, Steve. When I'm playing your campaigns, all I ever do is roll my eyes from all this "subtle" political commentary you're doing.
No, you're not making it any subtler by shoving all your views into the villain, if the villain is portayed as always right. You're not helping by making the good guys obnoxious caricatures either.

>>52105910
>Furry comic

>>52105325
I think part of the issue is when the player interrupts the gm it can ruin the narrative/effect the dm was trying to convey. I set up a mini boss battle the other day and it had an effective 30 second cut scene at the beginning.
Mad wizard with a huge wagon is warning my PC's not to wake the beast. As he's ranting at them a dragon bursts out of the wagon, kills him then confronts the PC's who were basically flying around to try and get the drop on the boss.

>>52105977
They all waited until the cut scene was over and most of them said they enjoyed the fight which was basically dragon ball z vs a dragon

>>52103892
This when I'd say that I am always readying an action to attack anyone that takes a hostile action against me

>>52105788
Well fuck your 'bad guy monologues in a cutscene' meme too.

>>52103575
I'm not a hero, i'm a murderhobo.
I don't listen to speeches, i murder.
It's right there in the title, murderhobo.

>Not having your villain begin his monologue from a balcony with some kind of magic ward over it
>Not having him send some minions at them to distract them so they dont have time to work out how to disable it
That way if they end up interrupting his monologue they earned it.

>>52105516
Shut the fuck up Charles. Kick me out of the table if you want I dant care

>>52105910

>DMFA

That comic's still going? I don't hear much about it, I always thought a comic going as log as it had would be a bit more popular.

>Uses combat rounds and mechanics to do chase scenes

FUCK

>>52106123
well it's more or less to be expected that your DM treats you like the cunt you are then

>>52103468
stupid frogposter

>>52106587
What are you supposed to do in this situation

>>52106128

I cast Silence on ourselves so we can't hear him.

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>makes every encounter somewhere between 'easy' and 'you don't even have to bother'
>never kills off a PC in combat, only PC deaths are when someone does something really stupid
>gives out magic items with useless fluff attached (yeah, we get that you like writing gay fanfics on your spare time, but that doesn't mean that you should call a +2 flaming shortsword 'The Hillblade' and explain that it was the lost 'ancestral sword' of an ancient gnomish dynasty, nobody cares)
>gets annoyed when the players want to kill shit instead of listening to his shitty OCs ramble about the derivative and fanfic-tier world that he's built
>designs dungeons to be realistic rather than fun to fight in
>wants the PCs to develop attachments or grudges with his one-dimensional and boring NPCs
>creates a villain and tries to give the PCs 'personal motivation' to fight it when the only reason we're killing it in the first place is to get the experience and loot/rewards
>wants to write a deep and engaging story, full of shades of grey and interesting details, forgetting that nobody cares about that shit and that he's a terrible writer

D&D is for killing monsters, getting loot, and leveling up. Go and write a book if you want to tell a story where characters die exactly when/if you want them to die while 'telling a meaningful story with interesting characters and an expansive world'.
Oh, wait! You're terrible at writing, so you'd never be published! Even if you wrote a web-novel or self-published it, it'd go ignored!

So you take advantage of tabletop gamers who can't go anywhere else to tell your shitty stories with your dull OCs. Even though they don't want to deal with any of that shit, and just want to get some loot and kill some monsters.

>>52107159
Oh, and if I wanted to see a good story and an interesting world, I'd play an RPG video game or read a fucking book.

Not play your interactive fanfic.

>>52104871
If you wanted a game that made sense then why the fuck are you playing D&D? If you can accept shit like armor increasing your dodge chance or being able to survive falling at terminal velocity onto a stone floor, you should be able to accept that talking is a free action.

>>52105396
>>52105416
Why would they even invite retard-kun over to play if he's consistently making stupid decisions that can get the rest of the party killed? It's pretty shit GMing to allow one player to disrupt so much of the game just because you're too much of a bitch to put your foot down.

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>>52106128
>Fighting woman who controls people's minds with her voice
>Really tough fight
>She goes down and starts monologue
>"WHAT?" i interupt
>DM is confused
>Remind him that I deafened myself before this fight so I couldn't be mind controlled
> DM laughs his ass off and just stops reciting it
Ruining a monologue is only fun when it's unintentional in my opinion

>>52107371
Because he'll be great for like 80% of a campaign and then just go full-retard, at which point he is murderized. Also, he's the group buttmonkey so we make up for his deficiencies in life by constantly reminding him what a shitter he is. It balances out, in a way. He frustrates us and we relieve our frustrations and he takes it like a little bitch.

>>52107400
>Deafening yourself on purpose to gain an advantage
That's the kind problem solving I love to see in players

>>52103468
not as bad as frogposting

>>52107412
Being great 80% of the time doesn't make up for the fact that he's liable to self-destruct and take the rest of the party with him on a whim. If he's always trying to destroy the party over and over and over again, either talk to him or kick him out.

It's bad enough worrying about the enemy in front of you without having to worry about someone shooting you in the back as well.

>>52105887
That's hilarious.

>>52107159
>>52107218
I can't tell if you are being ironic or baiting.

>>52103468
>tfw I do most of my villains "shonen" style where they divulge tidbits about their actions/motivations throughout a battle, so that this kinda stuff won't happen and so that my players don't have to sit through 5 minutes of me monologuing in character, just enough that once they've whittled him down they're invested enough to actually WANT to hear his final words (which is always meant to ADVANCE THE PLOT) and not just mercilessly deliver a coup de grace
Like honestly, as GM's it's our jobs to make the game world as interesting as possible. If a player that isn't necessarily That Guy does something like that, it's probably because you're boring them to death when all they wanna do is fuck shit up.
S'why most of my encounters are just for PC's to fuck shit up, so that when I want to shift the tone and be more story oriented, they'll be more appreciative and willing to go along with whatever it is I might have cooked up: because they know that whatever it is, they'll *HAVE FUN.* really can't stress that enough.

>>52107479
Nah here's the thing, he doesn't actively try to destroy the party. That's the fucked up thing. He's just prone to extreme fits of stupidity, selfishness, and insecurity. The problem is that if the party can't disassociate with him they have to do something about it. Or he'll do something REALLY dumb that generates direct and deadly conflict with another player (which can be common in 40K games mind you). Trust me, it's not really all that annoying, just hilarious, and it adds to his nature as the group buttmonkey.

>>52103468
>DM: The NPC was secretly a badass and had you in checkmate the whole time.
>Player: Wait, why don't I get to roll perception or insight to find it out beforehand? That's what the skills are there for.
>DM: The story takes precedence over you, sorry anon.

I don't even condone
>muh player agency
fags, but this things was just shitty on the DMs part.

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>>52105178
>you sound like you play by text, making all of you shit.
Damnit Jim, I'm a roleplayer, not an actor.

>>52107724
More like rollplayer

>>52106123
*teleports behind you*
nothing personal.. kid.

>>52103468
Run your own fucking game then, snowflake

>>52107159
Two things.
>designs dungeons to be realistic rather than fun to fight in
Only thing I sincerely agree with.

And what the hell is a web novel?

>>52103468
Play.

>>52107850
Something like Worm, even though Worm is much longer than a typical novel.

>>52106123

That's gay as fuck

>>52106834
I found skill challenges work pretty well.

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>actually having a villain monologue
>not having a wordless, unstoppable force of nature that doesn't give anyone a chance to rest
Good luck murderhoboing against a sapient hurricane.

>>52103468
They post frogs on /tg/.

>>52104871
Minmax looks like he has superhero proportions going on.

Man it's been a long time since I read this shit. Is the author still an emotional wreck who thinks his conscious is Darth Vader?

>>52108389
The art looks slightly better in my opinion since he hired someone else to do the coloring but overall I think that he's in a better place.

>>52103468
Ad lib.

EVERYTHING.

It starts to get suspicious when the DM has to stare up at the ceiling and think for a minute every time you ask for anything that isn't a general, broad description. An example of things that actually happened.

DM: "So, after crossing the forest you arrive at a town"
Player: "Cool, what is it called?"
"... Umm... uh, Smithsville"
"What is it like"
"... it is a small town"
"Okay... I mean, how do the buildings look, is there any interesting place"
"They are... made of wood. There's a wall of stone too. And a tavern"
"Right, we go in"
"There's music, some people drinking, the innkeeper asks what you want"
*in character PC* "How goes there! Hope you do not mind a few weary travellers seeking to rest for a while and get something good to drink. Wine would be fine, and do tell me, have you heard anything interesting tales recently?"
"He says he didn't hear anything, and gives you wine. You drink, what do you do next"

You get the idea. It was terrible

>>52108543
Holy shit, dude needs to go read some books or something. Study history? Fucking something. Sounds like he just doesn't have a good mental library of content to improv from

I have suffered from this as well, it sucks so bad

>>52103468
>He doesn't work with the players to craft a shared story

wew

>>52105397
>Giving your BBEG more depth than "Muahahaha, I'm a very bad guy!"
What a fucking pleb

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>>52108683
You are the pleb here, anon.

>>52105193
It was all according to keikaku. He knew you were going to attack mid-speech and had already planned the sequence of motions that would both launch the attack and bring him into a combat stance.

Alternatively, he's not a particularly intelligent villain and just eats the attack and gets mad at you for cutting off his speech, his anger adding to the ferocity of his strikes for the rest of the battle.

>>52108766
>The joke
.
.
.
.
.
>Your head

>>52108780
I need to clean my face after talking to you, pleb.

I have the opposite problem, as a DM. My players are both desperate to hear the motives of my villains and actively self-destructive when doing so, probably because I actually avoid monologuing characters (they tend to find out villain plans from other NPCs, textual evidence, servants, outer entities, literally anyone except the villain themself). Whenever I capitulate and decide it might be IC for the villain to explain himself, the players either get convinced by his reasoning and switch sides, or get convinced by his reasoning but still fight them because they just dislike the guy personally.

>>52103959
I actually did that once.

>>52107159
Fuck off, you can absolutely roleplay in D&D. Hell, we had part of a session while back where it was just my character and a couple others selling tea, and we all had some fun with it.

Worst DM I ever played with

>roll a neutral good gnome wizard who is trying to find a way to make arcane healing magic
>rest of party is a human fighter, elf cleric, human ranger and half orc barbarian
>party is travelling through haunted forest in order to visit an old monk
>get attacked by werewolves
>get bitten
>fail my save
>DM asks for my sheet because I am now an evil npc
>what the fuck
>he explains he doesn't allow evil player characters
>ask him why the fuck he included werewolves when there is a chance we could have all become evil
>says it's his game and his rules
>pack my shit and leave

never played with him again

>>52108896
Roleplaying in D&D can only be achieved if you ignore most of the rules and go completely freeform with it.

>>52108925
Why do some DMs just make up random shit? Do they think arbitrary rules like that are gonna be fun? Jesus Christ.

>>52108925
That sounds effectively very similar to just having an enemy with a save or die attack. I don't know the specifics of that game, but if it was supposed to be high mortality then that sounds pretty fair.

>>52108969
Isn't that the best way to roleplay pretty much consistently though, barring natural charisma gates for manipulation and wisdom for insight? I can't think of any rules that genuinely satisfyingly simulate social interaction-freeform is always the most fun there.

>>52108925
So let me get this straight. He introduced enemies that are effectively have SoD mechanics and went "it's muh game and muh rules" when you raised an issue with it?

I'd probably leave to tbqhfam.

>>52108972
It's like the DM is a stunningly stereotypical Lawful Stupid Paladin. "Evil PCs = banned. Lycanthropy makes you evil. Lycanthropy = banned. Extenuating circumstances are for the weak."

>BBEG attacks party while they're making speeches

>>52105887
"As I was saying before I was so rudely interrupted..."

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>>52103468

>add love interest to my backstory; also include a mentor/father figure
>DM makes both of them villains

fucking two campaigns this has happened. last time I add a love interest/mentor to my backstory

>>52108925
I'll admit that I also ban evil PCs in a game with a mostly good party, but that's because it always ends up with either the party having to go against their characters to put up with one character's bullshit or kill the character, at which point why even bother making an evil character?

Everybody thinks they're the one who's gonna make an evil character in a good party work, and they're all wrong.

That being said I would never take a character sheet for something that was not their choice. Obviously if they decide to just start murdering peasants for no reason I'll take their sheet, but I'd always warn them first.

>>52107159
You deserve DnD.

>>52109098
Shit, all the DM had to do was make lycanthropy a slow-onset disease, and warn the player that if he succumbed to it it would be the same as death, whilst providing a few opportunities to get them cured before the curse overtook them. Would have let him have his werewolves, keep evil players out, and not fucked someone over horribly.

>>52107454
Literally older than the bible, buddy.

>>52109109
This is such a magnificent insult

>>52108983
The thing is, in most other games, you can still affect the story beyond rolling high on a particular roll.

In nWoD for example, so long as you get at least one success, the action that you're going for will succeed as intended, so a dude who has good social skills will succeed on their persuasion rolls more often than not.

In D&D however, unless your class is a class that has proficiency in CHA based skills like diplomacy, you're never going to succeed at CHA based skills in comparison to someone like a Bard or a Sorcerer. In addition, depending on which edition you're talking about, some classes just won't have enough skill points to invest in CHA because they need other skills pumped up to be effective at their class.

So while most systems don't have good social combat that simulates interactive freeform well, they at least have resolution mechanics that allow one to roll for social actions without being punished by not playing the requisite social class.

>>52105325
>Player: I attack another PC.
>DM: No.
In the majority of cases, the DM is in the right in that scenario. Role-playing is a team sport, and nobody has time for your disruptive bullshit.

>>52109274
My group naturally formed a strong response to team killing. When one person attacks a party member the rest of the party immediately surges on the attacker. Its good incentive.

>>52108543
When I play in a game the DM has a good grasp of their setting but can't follow the rules for their life. When I DM I basically have the rulebooks memorized but can't improvise without turning the campaign into a fever dream. What do?

>>52109274
Also...
>Player: I refuse to cooperate with the group and go off to do my own thing.
>DM: No. Not unless you want to make a new character.

>>52109075
That's when you mindbreak rape them back to normality.

>>52109271
Hmm, I think it's probably a DM thing then. I (and by extension my main DM when I'm not behind the screen, since he learned from me) tend to heavily encourage different ways to win social encounters by playing to mental strengths like wisdom/insight allowing for better empathising stuff and intelligence letting you debate better by just having factually right stuff. Charisma tends to be the best 'blunt instrument' manipulation tool by far, but with some creativity as long as you haven't dumped all your mental stats (which I feel is more on the player than the system), you can achieve a lot without it.

>Only war
>Exploring Tau captured city
>GM: Roll awareness
>We all roll well and he rolls like shit
>GM: Uhh... nothing happens
>5 steps later
>GM: Roll awareness
>He outrolls us this time
>GM: You are ambushed by several dozen kroot who leap off the rooftop and all get to attack you despite having to run 15 meters after literally jumping off a roof
>One player dies instantly while others are grievously injured as some of the tau roll poorly
>Ministorum priest activates whirlwind of death and cleans up the xeno scum, generating a few RF in the process and giving the team some fate to heal up
>Team turns situation around and is in the process of winning
>GM: Uh... the kroot run away and beginc climbing the three storey building
>Team: We shoot them as they flee
>GM: Uhh.. no you can't its narrative time
>Point out that it would take several rounds for the kroot to even begin climbing the wall
>GM ignores me

>One encounter later
>Get into a fight with some Gue'vessa who also get the drop on us with no roll
>Priest kills a bunch of them with his flamer
>Rest of the squad cleans up
>Traitor officer who had a bolt pistol begins to flee
>Priest chases her down and beats her to death
>Priest: I take the bolt pistol and give it to the team's sniper
>GM: Uhh... the pistol broke when it fell to the ground
>Priest: Ok, we take the clips she has on her so the sergeant can have some extra ammo
>GM: Uhh... the pistol ammo was actually carried by the other guy that the priest burned, that is now unusable
>Priest: Ok, we take the last few shells left in the clip, she only got to fire two before she died so she should still have more
>GM: Actually, its empty she only had two rounds in the clip when the fight started

>>52109448
Your GM might be a xeno

>>52109385
Unfortunately though, D&D doesn't really offer a whole lot of incentive to go outside of your class's niche because most of those stats give diminishing returns on their investment since most of a class's features will run off of 1-3 stats as a whole.

It's rare to find a Fighter who doesn't dump INT or CHA while focusing on STR/DEX/CON simply because they're the fighter class who needs to be good at fighting, so mental stats will overall get in the way of their ability to fight, which creates a problem when you have games where combat isn't the main focus.

>>52109521
In my experience, 5e at least hasn't had a huge problem with that, as long as you're good at character building. At least, the only party fighter I've ever run for didn't at all lose out on effectiveness socially. 5e Fighter is disgustingly boring, sure, but the reason for that hasn't been lack of social options so far, for me at least.

>>52109565
5e doesn't have an issue with it but that's only because every skill has an automatic modifier based off of your ability score modifier, with prof. adding your prof. bonus to the roll. That and bounded accuracy being a thing.

>>52109565
>>52109660
Backgrounds also offer some social niches. Like being a war hero or something.

>>52103863
I would only do this for M&M where people fit huge speeches on single panels. Everywhere else you get 3 sentences maybe.

>>52109377
No, because a) magical realm and b) they shouldn't have been in that situation in the first place.

Like come the fuck on people, you want people to make detailed backstories where they have families, friends, hopes, and dreams and yet you're going to go out of your own way to make sure that they have fucking nothing by the time you actually get to play?

Like why should I bother making my character a family when you're just going to murder-fuck them all by the time we actually start the game? I might as well make an orphan since they're going to lose their family/friends one way or another anyways.

>>52108543
This is definitely me when I have to improvise in-person, although not a problem at all when I have ten seconds to type it out over Roll20. And outside of impro I'm usually fine as long as I've got a few ideas about the town jolted down already.

>>52108834
Maybe you need to make your bad guys less justified (for less side switching) and a little crazier (because your players clearly enjoy hammy monologues).

>>52108925
Holy shit. I also turn a PCs who've chosen to become evil into NPCs (effectively killing them) but I never thought anyone would be enough of a drooling idiot to make the choice in the player's place... unless the PC literally put on the One Ring or something.
If the other players were dumb enough to stay after this, they got the DM they deserved.

>>52105151
>Over the radio speaker he's speaking through?

This is usually how I play any semi-competent villains when I'm DMing.

Low-tier villains are the ones I don't mind disposing of. They're the ones who get the "brilliant" idea of talking to the heroes in person and revealing all their evil plans and going "NOW NOTHING CAN STOP MY PLANS, AHAHAHA!". If any of the heroes punch these guys out mid-speech, I'm fine with that, because they're basically just walking XP-caches dressed up in cliches.

But there's also the higher-tier villains: if these guys have to talk to the heroes, they do it through (depending on what game we're playing) radios, televisions, high-tech holograms, magical gems, possessed minions, or that sort of crap. Y'know, the kind where, even if the players punch out, destroy or kill that particular mouthpiece, the actual villain remains safe from harm, due to possessing a modicum of self-preservation.

Of course, this only applies to the villains who feel the urge to actually interact with the heroes in any direct way.

>>52105651
>extended monolog
Like...A tree?

>>52103651
Experienced gm here, your gm should easily be able to make that work. It's sad he apparently can't.

>>52109774
I do give them what they want occasionally with crazier villains, don't worry. As for the justification side, the problem isn't about their motivations, it's about eloquence. Anyone who talks a good game can convince them into basically anything. The fuckers spent three IRL days debating whether or not Asmodeus was secretly misunderstood after he asked them for his souls.

>>52110051
*for their souls. What's worse, this came after several quests filled with devils trying to kill them all.

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>>52109923

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>>52103468
>DM works his butt off to run a fun campaign
>That Guy wants to punch a villain mid-monologue
pic related

>>52105397

>big bad evil guy is planning to kill you
>wait politely for him to start talking before you make the first move

literally why. You don't need to be a murderhobo, just not retarded.

>>52103468
In m&m there's a feat called I think "critical soliloquay", that lets you get out a full speech without conventional interruptions.

I built a character with a reaction power that had critical soliloquay as it's trigger condition. Good times.

>>52108543
>tfw my players know I ad-lib almost everything and they're okay with it

I don't know who's in the wrong here, but it's probably me.

>>52108543
A town made of wood. The horror.

>>52105872
Skyrim literally has NPCs who freeze you in place to force you to hear them talk and then escape.

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>>52110156

>>52110156
>>52111158
>ifunny
wtf is this?
Is this the new ebaums world/9gag or something?

>>52111188
one of them, yes

>>52107159
That was some refreshing sarcasm. I applaud you

>>52109521
>>52109565
>>52109660
In 5e you're meant to roll your stats you munchkins.

>>52112452
Where does it state that anon? Oh wait, it doesn't, you're just butthurt about badwrongfun.

>>52103892
You can't have readied actions outside of combat.

>>52105397
Your self insert edgy speeches are not impressing anyone.

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>>52112527
In the player's handbook.

This removes the problem of statdumps, also. I'm currently playing a barbarian with 16 wisdom.

>>52112555
What does this even mean? When would you ready and action, in combat? Then that would just be using an action.

>>52112601
>You're meant to roll stats you munchkins
>Okay show me
>Shows a section of the PHB that literally gives rolling and arrays/point-buy as an equally viable option
So I was right, you are complaining about badwrongfun.

>>52112682
>someone complains about statdumping
>point out that in the rules you're supposed to roll randomly
>LE BADWRONGFUN

???

>>52112733
Listen, it's clear that you're either obtuse or retarded so let me spell it out in plain English.

I-t-g-i-v-e-s-y-o-u-t-h-e-o-p-t-i-o-n-t-o-e-i-t-h-e-r-r-o-l-l-s-t-a-t-s-o-r-u-s-e-a-n-a-r-r-a-y.

To say nothing on the moronic position that rolling for stats means that you won't have to worry about dump stats.

>>52103468
Know why in the latest captain America film they have the bad guy do the whole ' zis glass is much stronk' thing? Because it would be stupid of them not to try killing/nonlethally rocketing him the second they see him.

If you're intent on staid, played out monologues either make them genuinely interesting or provide an obstacle to combat

>>52103468
Maybe you shouldn't be such an autist and respect the narrative the DM is weaving at the table.

Go play call of duty if you can't be bothered to care about the story instead of needing to kill shit because of your impatience you fucking murderhobo

>>52112733
Depending on how lenient the GM is with rolled stats, you may end up fucking yourself over if you commit to rolling and end up getting lower than average stats.

Like I remember one time when I played, some dude actually rolled like a 3 for his lowest stat and the GM was just like "low stats build character" or some shit and got hit by an effect that dealt INT damage and died by the third campaign.

An 8 in your dump stat might seem shitty but I'd sure rather take that than risk taking anything less.

>>52112867
woah epic dude you showed me xD

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>>52113126

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>>52103468
Absolutely cant wait until the DM gets his revenge by pulling that shit on you and you come crying back to /tg/, pants full of shit, screaming that your DM doesn't let you RP properly.

>>52113156
woah epic

+1 upboat

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>>52109274
Sometimes you really need to slap a bitch

>Be playing rogue trader
>Play a Stormtrooper bodyguard to the rogue trader who owes a life debt to him
>Wounded from close quarters fight with Rak'Gol, healer is patching me up
>Rogue Trader goes ahead with the Navigator and the Astropath to fuck with some rubble blocking our path
>Tell them to wait
>Astropath uses warp fuckery to move the rubble, revealing a fuck ton of Rak'Gol
>Combat Begins
>Rak'Gol tear them apart while rest of the party is 50m away
>All but the Astropath bleed out before we get there because he had fate points to burn
>My characters face when

The healer picked him up and then the GM let me pistol whip the shit out of him before we scrubbed the mission

>>52103651
I stand by the other guy. If you don't give my character a reason to stay together. Role playing wise, he is going to leave and do his own thing.

>>52113371
Why exactly are you such a cunt that you need convincing to work with the only allies that you have?

Like holy shit, why the fuck would you make an anti-social character knowing that they wouldn't be willing to work with the rest of the fucking party?

>>52103651
Why can't he give everyone else a "turn" to explore their own goals and activities in the meanwhile?
20$ they're doing some weird erp or something and you're just accessories

>>52113207
Not them but you're a retard unless you're just shitposting for attention.

>>52112611
A readied action is you say you're going to do something when a situation happens, and the GM holds your turn.

You then interrupt the turn of whoever it is that triggered the readied action to do what you were waiting to do.

>>52112887
Monologue should be delivered over the intercom system before the boss fight.

>>52109354
I believe you mean

"Okay, Steve abandons the campaign to go do other shit. So, now that Steve is gone, at least for the time being, do you intend to roll up someone new, or what?"

>>52113371
If your character runs off to do his own thing, the extent of that being covered is "Steve the orc leaves the party to go off on his own for personal reasons. Now that he's gone, what do you do?"

Steve's player can make a new character, or can continue to play Steve when Steve crosses paths with the party again.

If he can't justify staying with the group, perhaps he should have made a character that was pre-invested in the campaign and the group like everyone else did.

>>52113660
:^)

>>52103468
>Their DMPC is the main character of everything & gets all the attention
>Actual PCs make Yamcha look relevant

>>52105887
>it was a part of his plan all along
>to ascend from his mortal coil he needed to be killed unprovoked by the pure of heart
>you were played like a damn fiddle

>>52113951
XD

>dm uses cut scenes to strip us of all gear or resources
>death by any means you are just knocked out and an inconvenience to the party
>all npcs in game treat you like shit stain kids no matter how much you bend over backwards to help them

Every fucking game.

>>52103468
Come on man, let the fucking DM have his monologue. It's like the only reason any of us do this.

>>52115613
I do it to see how my players react to my sandbox of factions on timelines and many many tables of random events.

I do it to be surprised by what they do in the world.

If someone is going to monologue, the monologue is delivered via magic, while the enemy is nowhere near the party.

>>52103468
>GM proceeds to describe you attack and its consequences in a slow.......flat.....dull......monotone......voice......until going back to normal for all other players and combatants. BBEG continues his speech on his turn.

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>>52103468
This is fake because you claimed the DM said "no, you don't."

A real DM would have said "He deflects your attack effortlessly and continues speaking like nothing happened."

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>>52117321
>villain takes Catch Arrows for the sole purpose of using it during the monologue

>>52117321
I like the idea of the bbeg monologuing while fighting, intersected by banter when something notable happens. The kind of cockiness you see in history/fantasy films whenever two characters are duelling with rapiers.

>>52103468
Monologues are a sign of bad writing, especially when there is no reason for the players to sit around and listen to all of that shit.

>>52109448
What a fuckhead

>>52118207
I don't think they are necessarily in other media, but I think you're mostly right in RPG's. There might be the occasional situation where the game called for it and all the players were on board, but most of the time the game should probably be going for interaction with the player for storytelling. It's the same with video game cut-scenes really.

We were in a cave, I asked the GM what the walls and floor and ceiling are made of.
>"It's just an earthen cave"
We continued, eventually finding and beating the troll we were there to kill.
>"The tunnel behind you collapses, it looks like the roof will be coming down soon!"
Party panics. We were too low level to have teleportation spells. I came up with a plan and start passing packets of air crystals out to my party members.
>"What do those do? Oh, well if they survive being crushed it'll only delay suffocation."
Had the party turn their extra dimensional containers over to me, put them a regular sack. Told the Sorcerer to use reduce person on everyone but me.
>"?"
I had everyone get in my Handy Haversack. With the shrinking magic in place they all weighed 1/8 what they did before, it could hold them. The air crystals gave them a minute of breathable air while I got us out of there.
>"How are you going to do that?"
Was playing a Ratfolk with the Sharpclaw, Tunnel Rat and Burrowing Teeth feats. I had a burrow speed of 10ft and could double move through 200ft of earth before the party started to suffocate. Told the GM I was digging my way out.
>"You can't burrow through stone."

...

He fucking said the cave system was earthen. That means packed earth, I could totally burrow through that.
>"Well its stone now."

Que a ten minute argument about him changing the set piece just to thwart an otherwise clever plan. He wouldn't have any of it and refused to let my plan work. Eventually we were rescued at the last second by some NPC. I quit the group around two sessions later.

What did he do wrong?

He could have let the plan happen and just improvised, maybe have the important NPC meet me at the surface, but instead he decided to stifle player creativity and railroad us into the specific situation he wanted but flat out saying "No" and changing previously established details.

For a frogposter, OP is amusingly right.

>>52103468
>villain in the middle of his "epic" monologue
>me: I attack him
>DM: no, you don't

>Not taking the time, as DM, to have the villain gasp as the sword runs through them, and then spend the next 5 minutes getting really personally pissy and snitty at the PC because they are CLEARLY standing in the MONOLOGUE CIRCLE and nobody can die while they are monologuing in the fucking circle! Like a reverse pentagram do you have any idea how much it cost to set this up. All bets and safeties are off after you finish, though. So come on hero. Go ahead then. Want your turn? YOU monologue. You do it better you rude piece of trash YOU CAN'T, CAN YOU?! GO ON I FUCKING DARE YOU

>>52118920
That's actually pretty crafty of you. I'd love to have a creative player like you at my table.

>>52118207
I'd say they're very realistic. This thread alone shows that it's something quite a lot of people would do if they were trying to be some big villain

>>52118951
The GM and a few party members said the alchemical items I made and carried with me were useless, but truth be told there are several that remain useful even at high levels.

>>52119001
You gotta make it entertaining though. Fuck realism. Monologue? Have the villain pause after each announcement to pose a question to the PCs, try to engage and draw them in and get them emotionally off balance. Play with it, players will eat up ANY cliche if you sell it entertainingly enough. They just want to be engaged and have fun.

>>52103651
>>52103838

Depending on the game, one of three things needs to happen.

If it's something where secret shit is common and expected (Vampire, Paranoia, et cetera), then things need to be taken in turns. Especially in online games, you set aside blocks of time. 10 to 15 minutes for one group, then for another. Less if there are more than just two groups after the splitup.

Alternatively, if it is just one guy splitting up from the party, have the GM run a private session with just the person/people splitting up. Get that shit out of the way (ideally without any extra xp awarded, so as not to set precedent of everyone going off alone to grind) so that when game time comes, you can actually play as a group.

Or if it's not a game that demands secrecy (like most D&D games), have it happen in the open and trust the players to maintain player vs character knowledge.


But yeah, talk to your GM (IN A CALM AND REASONABLE MANNER, YOU SPERG) about your frustrations. There's a very good chance he knows this is a problem, and is working up the nerve to rip that band-aid off with sir-splits-up-a-lot himself.

>>52108389
He's gotten better. His update schedule has gotten worse. Much worse.

Haven't heard anything about Darth Thunt in a while, though.

>>52105189
Ctrl+Alt+Del works as well.

>>52103783
>no such thing as bad RPG
>don't like FATAL? Write a system yourself xxxD
Am I postmodern enough?

>>52107412
What a healthy group dynamic, anon.

>>52119004

Tanglefoot bags are rarely useless.

>>52119428
Burst jars and ghast wretch vials are also pretty useful.

Anything that has an effect that doesn't allow saves, really.

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>>52105549
>>52105872
>>52105921
Mama mia

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>one of the party members die
>two hours later she's back to life by GM fiat
>looking that my character, that is an arrogant ashole to beging with, starts giving absolutely no shit, challenging Charon to a fight by petty shit reasons
>get one shoted and die
>get revived a minutes later
>mfw
GMs, kill your players. Just fucking kill them. Break the sheets and make them cry.

To be honest, my DM is fucking shit

>>52118920
When one values minor plot shit with hints of Deus Ex Machina over making a really creative player feel clever, one has committed the DM deadly sin of Pride.
You made the right move anon. You're a cool guy and this DM didn't deserve to have you at the table.

>>52118207
For most people, killing others is a hesitant thing, and it's reasonable to expect (or hope) that the circumstances change depending on what your target says. But a lot of people are learning that the circumstances don't in fact change, so they just go for the kill right away.

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>>52120053
Cool

>>52103468
How bad of a DM am I if I do that to my players? They never get it, if you sit there talking your jaw off the baddy is going to stab you or leave. He's not obligated to stay and listen.

>>52105620
That actually sounds pretty funny in a slapstick sort of way. I'd play that.

>>52103468
you sound like That Guy

>>52105189
DIO delivering a monologue in what has to be 6 seconds?

>>52109075
>add a cliche to your backstory
>it becomes a cliche
you must have been gutted

>>52109352
work together?

>>52103468
>villain in the middle of his "epic" monologue
>me: I wait for him to finish
>villain continues monologue
>meanwhile my character produces a plank or large sheet and starts writing on it
>after the monologue is done, raise a score card with "2/10 made me listen" on it

>>52114622
This is the worst one. Especially when he keeps cycling through dmnpcs as he finds mor and more broken builds, to the point where he might as well have his own party.

>>52122388
>villain prepares some tables and asks for criticism

>>52107159
Glad I'm playing DSA. People actually care about the metaplot here.

>>52103468
If it's not in character, it's actually okay for the DM to do that.

>>52119301
I recently read that people who create something that's shitty are more deserving of respect people who've never created anything.
I was inclined to agree with it, but bringing up something like FATAL is making me question my judgement.

>>52122549
>I recently read that people who create something that's shitty are more deserving of respect people who've never created anything.
Anyone who thinks that should watch the Family Guy episode "Screams of Silence: The story of Brenda Q."

In a nutshell, it's an episode that starts with one character almost dying from autoerotic asphyxiation which then turns into a story about a woman in an abusive relationship, with the episode teetering between playing the abuse straight and treating it like another "joke".

Nobody asked FG to make this episode, nobody WANTED them to make this episode, and the world would've been better off if they'd decided to do literally anything else but that.

People who make shit don't deserve our respect, because if you make something this offensively shit of your own volition without stopping to question whether or not it's a good idea, you deserve to get shat on for being a terrible creator and a fucking window-licking retard to boot.

>>52118944
Every truly magnificent villain pulls a Dagoth Ur, and just sits at a table with wine in the antechamber. He expects to die or to be able to teleport to the room where the final confrontation can take place. Either way, his phylactery will allow him to meet them when negotiations have clearly failed.

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>>52122670
What happens if the rogue doesn't hesitate, doesn't say a word and just starts shooting?

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>>52122730
What if the rogue shouts "Down you go!"

>>52121979
I'd probably go
>That's a pretty long talk. So you're just standing there while speaking?
just to be fair.

>>52122549
Not that guy, but when it comes to horribly cringy shit, I think the way the author feels about their creations (self-aware, neutral, defensive, insufferably smug?) and whether they should know better (are they 13? are they adults? even worse, are they a huge company?) both matter a lot.

>>52113457

I've been playing with randos at my local game store. Fucking hate it when they choose shit like racist against core/common race. It could add flavor, rp, and drama, but when you're playing with strangers, there is no rapport to base the relationship on, and it just seems like they're a dick for doing it.

>>52119578

Always nice to light a fucker on fire with a touch attack.

>>52103468
Your DM/Villain is such a Pleb that he needs to monologue before the fight.

He should have left no question by the time you got to him.

>>52109075
Would you have rather the BBEG kill them?

>>52118944
I definitely want to add the monologue circle to my next campaign.

>>52105504
>hold person mass
>wizards viagra by choice

>>52124054

If shit like that happens every single time someone develops a character with a background, connections, family, and relationships, that is shit DMing.

Fuck, a younger sibling could be inspired by the PC and take up adventuring too. Maybe they would surpass the PC in power level and develop a rivalry. Maybe an alcoholic family member starts asking for money and shit citing needs, unfortunate circumstances, excuses, blah blah blah and tries to take the PC for all that he's worth like that faggoty ass wood elf Gaenor in Mournhold. Maybe the family gets introduced the adventuring party and the PC's mom goes Jew-mom and tries to dictate the PC's life and get the PC away from adventuring, that she doesn't like the looks of that smelly old man that the PC's with. Maybe a family member develops a crush or romance with another party member.

>>52105325

I have a player I have to do this to and I feel guilty about it every time. I sincerely think he's bipolar and it's the only way to keep him in check without getting everyone in the group pissed off. Most of the time he's a great player, but once every few months he gets it into his head that everything in the game is shit and he will intentionally try to ruin it.

>>52103468
I had a total different scenario with my DM
>BBEG in the middle of his "epic" monologue
>the party all waits for him to finish because we aren't just a bunch of murderhobos
>he suddenly stops talking and uses a spell that kills half the party

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OK, here I go.

GM: you're fucking lazy about checking the fucking rules. You're so worried about making your epic story go the way your want the Wizard is fucking cheating on your face.
Either use a system with less rules or get your shit together, because there's an incredible breach between the honest players and the cheater ones.

The story arc we are right now isn't engaging enough and it just keeps draging at a sunk cost fallacy. There are no leads and no reason for my character to care about the outcome of the encounters. I like gaming, but the sessions have become a chore because of that. I know you try, but still, man.

Also, make the tactical maps fucking bigger. Don't even bother to make them beautiful. That's a work for you as the narrator.

>>52124192
>Fuck, a younger sibling could be inspired by the PC and take up adventuring too. Maybe they would surpass the PC in power level and develop a rivalry
This rivalry goes on so long the younger sibling is joining every opposing faction of the PC, eventually becoming a villain.
>Maybe an alcoholic family member starts asking for money and shit citing needs, unfortunate circumstances, excuses, blah blah blah and tries to take the PC for all that he's worth like that faggoty ass wood elf Gaenor in Mournhold
The PC goes on to constantly deny his alcoholic family member of money and this causes a grudge. The drunk finds other unsavory ways of making money like steeling and also tries to mess up the PC's plans for not being generous to him. He eventually makes it big in the organized crime ladder and becomes an important villain.
>Maybe the family gets introduced the adventuring party and the PC's mom goes Jew-mom and tries to dictate the PC's life and get the PC away from adventuring, that she doesn't like the looks of that smelly old man that the PC's with
PC tells his mom outright that he would rather stay with the party than go back home. Jew-mom is heartbroken but later just blames it on the party for corrupting her child. She tries to destroy the party from the shadows in order to bring back her child, in turn becoming a villain.
>Maybe a family member develops a crush or romance with another party member
That family member has a crush on the other party member and eventually confesses, the other PC agrees and they start their romance together. Although after a while the other PC complains about how clingy the the family member gets and breaks up with her. Heartbroken from her first love the family member blames it all on the other PC and starts dedicating her life to becoming a villain that spells out the other PC's misfortune.

>>52109448
Accuse your GM of being a heretic and execute him on the spot

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Nobody ever notices the hundreds of concessions a GM gives over the course of a campaign. Things that he wanted to do but silently chose not to, for the sake of the players and the game. He puts aside his own pursuit of enjoyment for others, in the hope that maybe next time, he'll have the opportunity to narrate something purely for himself. When the opportunity does come up, the players rarely think to oblige him in turn. More likely, he'll just be fodder for someone's story in the next That GM thread.

Maybe that monologue was something he'd been looking forward to for many sessions. Sure, it'll probably be cliche and cringey but do players think they've never acted cliche and cringey too? Everyone in a game deserves their moments of indulging in the spotlight, especially the GM who makes this all possible.

As players, I understand that playing a single character means you constantly have to keep your scope narrow in terms of choosing what you do in game. But try to remember that this is a game, where a GM is as much a participant as the player. Next time you're playing and not running, I urge you think of the GM as another person at the table. As someone who also deserves to occasionally have their fun, not just be an assembly line for yours.

>>52103468

I attack him!

>As you lunge forward the ground opens beneath your feet, the entire chamber, save for two small ledges where the villain and your party were standing. You plunge into a inky black void and continue to fall and fall, you almost begin to regain your composure before you meet the ground, having fallen some 1500 meters down into a vast vast cavern created millions of years ago by tectonic plates shifting, it currently serves as a habitat for a species of eyeless lizard that is teetering on the edge of consciousness that originally burrowed deep into the ground tens of thousands of years prior.

>As I was saying brave heroes, I shall even disable all the traps this room has to offer and...

That's how smug cunts get dealt with.

>>52122549
There's this old saying
>some people deserve praise for singing, others for not doing so

You can create shit and be aware of it, on the road to creating awesome things there's always the point where you make shit things.
But the great mystery is: you just need to be self aware enough not to publish it.

>>52108543
>>52108595

I fucking feel you guys. Fucking hell roleplaying should be immersive. My DM's narration skills are pretty fucking terrible. I can tell this guy just doesn't read.

Just as an example of my DM's narration...

>Party enters a blacksmith's shop
>DM just describes dimensions and points to the building on a map and says "you're in this part"
>Doesn't tell me what the building is made of
>Doesn't tell me what's even in the fucking building
>Doesn't tell me where the forge and the anvil are
>Doesn't describe any sort of sound, or smell.

For anyone who wants to be a DM, work on your narrations. If you've ever listened to a podcast of a roleplaying game, note that every fucking DM takes time in describing the surroundings and environment. If you don't do that, then it's a shitty roleplaying experience for two reasons:

1. This shit may as well take place in the loading area in the Matrix
2. Without information what the surroundings are, your PCs cant make informed decisions.

You can improve on this just by reading fiction. Write out narrations of surroundings as prep, write a lot of them. Eventually you'll have a good enough mental library to improve really well. Look at generic fantasy art and use that as inspiration to find the words to describe things.

Fuck I want a new DM.

>>52107945
Says the namefag

>>52118207
Lots of folks try to prove they're right to other people. Even people they hate. It's part of a real human need to NOT be the bad guy. Villains get so good at it because they're constantly having to defend their evil actions. Plus it thematic.

DM's just need practice to figure out whats a good monologue and what a bad monologue and logical pace and timing. Like if a bandit is all about what a dog eat dog world it is, stick to that and not wander off to abstracted physics.

>>52107772
Text only roleplayers tend more to purple prosey cunts than rollplayers. Get your shitty roleplayers right.

>>52103468
>not wnjoying the monologue
Plebe

Also thats why I have traps set in front of the villains throne

>>52105721
So what's the punch line?

>DM and player disagreed on matter outside of game
>Player thought there was no hard feeling because both remained civil
>Game night, DM sicced a CR 10 golem on the lv4 party, targeting only said player
>Player ran away but golem used bullshit homebrew abilities to kill the PC
>DM went on a rant, full power tripping mode, that player should respect the DM because the DM God can kill anyone he doesn't like
>Other player chimed in that he got killed at lv1 by an angel because of similar reason. Do you have fucking Stockholm syndrome?

Yeah, fuck you. I quitted. No wonder the campaign couldn't recruit for shit.

>>52103468
Newish DM. I ask my players if they are sure. If they still wanna be edgelords I make sure the NPC calls for help in his final breath.

>>52131995
Was this supposed to be a reply to someone? The way you've worded this sounds like you're replying to a post

>>52107328
>he thinks that an attack not dealing damage means you dodged

>>52132807
How about you take a few seconds to reread the post before responding chief, you'll embarrass yourself a lot less in the future.

>>52107671
>"the NPC succeeded on a stealth check"
Too easy senpai

>>52124654
This is sage counsel but wasted on /tg/. Many, perhaps most, of the posters here seem to believe that DMs are adventure robots whose existence merely serves the players whims. It is deeply tragic actually.

To my fellow Forever DMs: when you find a good group who treats you right, hang on to them as long as possible. You may not find their like again.

>>52132906
That still doesn't address his initial point. In the systems I've played. Stealth is an opposed check against the target's perception/awareness/etc. A character does not 'succeed' a stealth check preventing others from getting a check to see them. A character outdoes another character's check to prevent them from being seen.

>>52132840
Armor increases the chance that the blow doesn't manage to do damage to you or is otherwise deflected, it does not cause you to dodge out of the way better

>>52132980
If that were true than armor would provide damage reduction, rather than determining whether or not the attack hits you or not.

>>52133033
That's not how armour actually works though

>group is sailing on a ramshackle boat in a sea filled with ogres
>ogres have attacked us every single time they've popped up
>a boat filled with, surprise, ogres, shows up
>it has knoblers (goblins with jew noses) propelling it towards us on giant water wheels
>party kills the knoblers
>boat stops alongside us, ogres showing clear signs of hostility
>I toss a sack filled with bombs onto their boat and shoot it
>State I back up before pulling the trigger, and threw it well onto their boat, having rolled well enough for this
>"You're caught in the blast radius too"
>Point out that by the rules the system uses, I'm not
>"There's a wagon behind you blocking your way"
>Tell him this was never described before
>"Yes it was, you just weren't paying attention
>Every other party member backs me up

it devolves into a 10 minute argument that results in my character dying. I'm still salty about this one

Who /GM who gives no fucks and lets players do whatever but if they act like a retard you try to kill them for it/ here?

>>52133102
Armor isn't all or nothing.

>>52133102
It certainly makes more sense for armor to be damage reduction than just allowing you to take no damage because an opponent "missed" you.

>>52133132
It also doesn't allow every single blow to hit you, just weaker, it DOES just stop some things and other times, it just doesn't cover something. If you ask me in real life armor would be both DR and an ac bonus, but that's not great game design

>dm makes a place called the adventurers guild/pathfinders guild/etc. and it is the unified point for ripping all the quest notices off the noticeboard like some sort of goddamn monster hunter game
as if "adventurer" is a concrete profession that has its own government policies or some bullshit

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>>52103783
No such thing as a bad player.

Don't like it be a player yourself!

>>52133217
In D&D, armor works by deflecting attacks. The attack didn't hit you because it hit your armor, which protected you. Kind of like how you can deflect an attack with a shield, instead of being a more realistic representation of armor.

>>52133120
Our GM will frequently escalate minor conflicts or impolite behavior to violent conflicts. We generally don't respond this aggressively to his NPCs that act this way, but he's very quick to drawing swords whenever a player acts like a dick toward even minor NPCs.

I never let a monologue go through because my character backstory won't allow. His family master at arms taught him real combat strategy I.e cheat to win. His favorite saying is A fair fight is a losing fight

>>52133250
Here's the thing though, a shield is basically a disc that diverts most of the force behind an attack away from you, so it makes sense for shields to cause attacks to "miss" you.

With armor though, even if the attack coming at you isn't lethal, you're still going to feel it unless we're talking heavy ass armor that's so heavy that you have to use a crane in order to mount your horse into combat.

So effectively, a shield would make you harder to hit while armor would reduce the damage of an attack that actually hits you.

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>>52103468

Don't play with people incapable of role playing.
People who just want to rush in and stab the villain aren't smart, witty, or articulate enough to give some sort of rebuttal.
Any sort of serious or witty back and forth between characters is impossible with these people.

>>52133108
In situations like these I'd just refuse to believe what the GM says and continue playing my character as if nothing had happened to him. He'd have to either contest every single thing I say, or give in and admit that he was being a shitter.

>>52133317
And if you're role playing someone who isn't smart, witty, or articulate?

>>52126190
Says the regular fag

>>52133231
Stopping things = damage reduced to zero. Hitting somewhere unprotected by armor = some mechanic that bypasses armor (ignore armor when your get a natural 20, or roll doubles on your damage dice, or whatever).

Armor as DR divides the attack into two sensible steps, while armor as accuracy reduction yields an incoherent mishmash.

With armor as damage reduction:
1) Roll to see if you hit.
2) If you hit, roll to see how hard/effectively you hit.

With armor as accuracy reduction:
1) Roll to see if you hit and do so hard/effectively enough to inflict damage.
2) If you hit hard/effectively enough to inflict damage, roll to see how hard/effectively you hit within that range.

>the GM has a history of being a minmaxing munchkin with decades of experience.
>the group is a rag tag bunch of people, most of which are brand fucking new to [pathfinder, in this case]
>partymembers start deciding what they want more or less during the week before session 1
>various party members say they want to play roles that might be more heavily roleplay focused
>a good portion of them choose martials
>GMunchkin makes a sweeping statement that all martials are shit in PF and they should pick casters
>party, with no background to comment proceed to do so, picking witches, bards, and sorcerers.
>we start playing the game and the party gains an NPC follower
>its a minmaxed Slayer built from his own Homebrew race that just so happens to make the minmaxed 1hitkill slayer build damn near unbeatable (even has regeneration)
>"lucky theyre on our side I guess", our inexperienced party says
>we continue onwards
>about midway through the campaign one of our partymembers comes to the realization that pretty much every humanoid NPC that can take a class is a minmaxed super-fuck-you build
>this includes the illuminati-structured final enemy group that Gmunchkin basically modeled off his own country's percieved "shadow government"
>the entire plot is literally just his power fantasy to overthrow his country's evil illuminati
>it begins collapsing miserably because the GM overdesigned his enemies so fucking hard, and gave them such a modern mindset, that literally anything the party did would result in instant death by a teleport blitz with fifty mages and stunlocking AoO bullshit fighter builds
>the same witch who realized and reevealed this to the party confronts the GM over it
>Gm flies off the handle hurls shit at the witch player
>party back him up
>mutiny.jpg
>Gm realizes he's cornered, concedes, and completely castrates his broken wizard guild.
>the campaign went from nigh on impossible to the most unfulfilling bullshit I ever wasted my time playing.

>>52133334
then they get finger of death'd for trying to be witty when they're not and bullrushing the villain thinking they're unprepared.

>>52133339
I don't see the difference between those, the end result is the same. Shaving off 1 point of damage from ten attacks is functionally the same as deflecting one 10 point attack.

>>52133334

Why does that matter?

>>52133359
How is bull rushing someone trying to be witty? Why do I feel like you're more interested in being vindictive than interested in player's accurately role playing their characters?

>>52133369
Because the person I responded to just said that players are only role playing if their characters are smart, witty, or articulate.

>>52133376
>lol I'm going to break tropes arent I cool and creative guys? look, i interrupted an important monologue, I'm so out of place and witty!

>>52133402
So it isn't about role playing at all? It's about genre tropes?

>>52133402
What if all the players attack the villain in a concentrated effort to take him down instead of letting him speak?

I mean sure your 2 INT Orc Brawler might think its funny to say "you talk too much" (as if thats not more cliche than boss monologues) and then attempt to punch the bad guy.
but he'd better be ready for the idea that the badguy will simply eradicate any evidence of his existence for biting the classic cliche bait of "interrupting the final boss"

>>52133388

>People who just want to rush in and stab the villain aren't smart, witty, or articulate enough to give some sort of rebuttal.

People is referring to the player(s), not the character.

>>52133432
There's a sentence before that that states those kinds of people aren't interested in role playing. Not sure how you missed it.

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>>52107159
I actually agree with the first two points, and the realistic dungeon point. It fucking sucks when I go to a game, and there's absolutely no challenge involved.

I'm not saying I want to point every NPC's gun at my head and beg them to shoot me, just challenge my characters a little, alright? Make me feel like, instead of considering optimizing for no fun faggots who want to make fights boring, maybe I actually want to improve my character's stats so I can deal with these enemies that are getting thrown my way. Maybe I want to feel tense with the anticipation that comes with narrowly dodging death occasionally.

>>52133428
>my cliche is more valuable than your cliche so it's okay for me to be a prick

>>52133464
that is the mindset of the fighter attempting to ruin the mood of the final bossfight of the campaign, yes.

>>52133478
It doesn't ruin the mood, though. Like you said, it's just a different trope.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0aWrDcM988

>>52106123
Well in that case the BBEG is in the right to murder you with the power of plot if you interrupt them.

>>52133365
That's 1 damage that you won't be taking from an opponent's attack vs. 10 points that you'll be taking if an opponent's attack hits you.

If an opponent hits you 10 times with an attack that deals 10 damage, the guy with armor as DR will only take 90 damage while the guy with armor as AC will take 100 damage. It doesn't seem like much but it adds up once you're in a situation where an opponent will always hit you no matter what.

>>52107159
>I'm a munchkin who doesnt know what roleplaying is!

>>52132715
Nope, just venting about a game I just quitted.

>>52133482
by the logic of that video:
>the entire campaign is >>52107159 's dream of everyone just rolling dice and fighting with no dialogue
sounds like an interesting game, are these those tabletop MOBAS I keep hearing about

>>52133548
That's not the logic. That video is from a film. People talk in that film. This one scene wherein one of the protagonists opts to shoot instead of dialogue with the man threatening him does not damage the tone or atmosphere of the movie in any way.

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>>52107159
gr8 b8 m8

>>52133593
you mean the same way he was permitted to talk and not just shot the moment he walked through the doors?
almost like the movie has a plot, I think Tabletop games have those sometimes too!

>>52107454
yeah dude, the beeswax earplugs and the sirens, come on now

>>52133485
Still doesn't change the fact that in D&D armor reduces damage by making you get hit fewer times, not for less damage. The implementation is different, end result the same.

>>52133637
Do you know what a plot is? It isn't the minutia of character interactions. The plot doesn't change because characters wait until they are done talking before fighting.

Moreover, role playing games, by definition, are collaborative. Ergo, as the GM, you only only get to decide high level details concerning the story and world. The players fill in the specifics as they play the game and interact with that story and world on an intimate scale.

If you aren't comfortable with that, then why the fuck are playing these games in the first place?

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>>52124654
>players after a GM manages to get a plotpoint in edgewise

>>52133671
because a collaborative story experience relies on the entire group working together with the GM to have a fun and memorable story.
if that includes a player getting 1hitkilled by the BBEG for falling into the oldest trap in the book, then so be it.
he was only there to roll dice anyway.

>>52133654
Armor doesn't reduce damage, it just sets the probability that an opponent is going to hit you with a melee or ranged attack. If an opponent has a better attack bonus than you, they're going to hit you each and every time they take a swing at you, which means that you're going really reducing damage at all.

With armor as DR, even if an opponent hits you, you're still not taking as much as you otherwise would've taken, which works out better in the long run because an opponent always hitting you doesn't mean that you're going to do as quickly due to drawing aggro.

In a scenario in which an opponent hits you 10 times with an attack that deals 10 damage guaranteed, the dude with DR will always be in a better position than the guy who doesn't have it.

>>52133744
But why the story cannot be about player one hit killing the BBEG in middle of a monologue with a lucky crit? That sounds memorable as well.

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>>52113457
Because "party" ,as a concept ,only exists for the sole purpose of time management. In text roleplaying ,DM can share his attention equally between the players making party unreasonable.
>Like holy shit, why the fuck would you make an anti-social character knowing that they wouldn't be willing to work with the rest of the fucking party?
Why does your character has to have allies in the first place?Why is your character so spineless he chooses to go obey party's choice instead of following his own goal?

>>52133740
same gif can be used to describe when a shit GM decides "the enemy will see right through your carefully thought out plan because X and they will drop fifty mages on top of you"

>>52133774
>Armor doesn't reduce damage
I meant to say AC here, just to be clear.

>>52103468

Villain: *talking*
PC: "I attack him."
Me: "Alright, he stops talking, roll initiative."
PC: "WHY DON'T I GET SURPRISE?!"

>>52133786
Presumably if you wanted one on one time with the DM you wouldn't have joined a group with more people than just the two of you. I would think anyway

>>52133744
The scenario presented in the OP can absolutely be fun and memorable. As evidenced by the scene I just provided. It's become a trope in it's own right precisely because people liked it.

Your position is clearly based on some unfounded sense of ownership. Someone violated how your encounter with the bad guy was supposed to go and so you decide to be an asshole and kill a player. You don't seem to have considered the possibility that allowing the bad guy to speak might go against how the player saw the encounter going. You arbitrarily value your own desires for the story over that of one of your players.

So again, if you aren't comfortable with the kind of game in which different players are explicitly empowered to take the narrative in essentially any direction, then you really out to consider not playing those games. All you'll do is get pissy and ruin it for everyone else.

>>52133786
>Because "party" ,as a concept ,only exists for the sole purpose of time management.
The fuck?
>In text roleplaying ,DM can share his attention equally between the players making party unreasonable.
Okay, you're full of shit, continue
>Why does your character has to have allies in the first place?
Because when you're in a group that's trying to survive against everything from goblins to orcs to trolls, it's nice to know that you have people to back you up and cover your weaknesses.
>Why is your character so spineless he chooses to go obey party's choice instead of following his own goal?
The fact that you see cooperation as being the same as spineless honestly speaks more about about than it does about anything else.

>>52133774
>Armor doesn't reduce damage, it just sets the probability that an opponent is going to hit you with a melee or ranged attack
Exactly. If a character gets attacked a thousand times during a campaign and his AC stops 75% of those attacks, then the armor reduced damage he took by 75%. I think what's confusing about it is that in default D&D armor damage reduction is binary, it either stops 100% or 0% of the damage with nothing in between. DR of course works by shaving of a varying percent of the damage, but you'll notice that statement " once you're in a situation where an opponent will always hit you no matter what" is functionally equivalent to "once you're in a situation where an opponent will always bypass your DR."

>>52133786
>party as a concept only exists for the sole purpose of time management
fucking no?
>Why does your character has to have allies in the first place?Why is your character so spineless he chooses to go obey party's choice instead of following his own goal?
do you straight up not fucking know what a tabletop RPG is?
did you come to /tg/ thinking that we play tabletop versions of singleplayer videogames or something?

>>52112591
Why does your self insert edgy character actions supposed to?

>>52133833
No, they are just the actions of his character. Which is why he doesn't pull some shit out of his ass to intentionally fuck over the GM if it doesn't go his way.

>>52133822
>fucking no?
Yes
>do you straight up not fucking know what a tabletop RPG is?
did you come to /tg/ thinking that we play tabletop versions of singleplayer videogames or something?
Have you ever played one?I mean ,besides the one in your imagination?

>>52133815
it can be fun.
if the party and the GM think its suitable and an interesting way to initiate the final bossfight
i will bet money they didnt.
sometimes the GM needs to pull players into line so they don't ruin the experience.
i get the feeling you get pissy when you randomly try to do out of character actions and the GM tells you to back up and at least justify yourself
or when he turns the tables on your shitty cliche

>>52133847
the game in your imagination iss the one you want to be playing if you think tabletops are all meant to be solo stories.

>>52133847
In tabletop RPGs the players usually craft a team of people wanting to work together for a common goal. It makes the GM's job much easier and the play go smoother.

>>52133845
So,why should DM suppose to allow your self insert edgy character to do his edgy thing if it wouldn't impress anyone?

>>52133817
The thing is, it's much easier to work around an opponent's AC than it is to work around an opponent's DR.

>>52133851
Throwing a save or die spell at a player out of spite is not turning the tables on a cliche. It is very intentionally being an asshole because things didn't go exactly the way you wanted them to.

>i will bet money they didnt.
You aren't a very good gambler. Again, a hero attacking a bad guy mid sentence or otherwise "unprovoked" is a pretty common trope. Why you think players would be upset with this trope, but not a villain's monologue, I've no idea.

Once again, the obvious answer seems to be that you claim undue ownership over the narrative. Any divergence from your preferences becomes unacceptable.

>>52133851
>i will bet money they didnt.
What makes you think this way? In RPGs story should be about what the players did in the game, not what the GM decided beforehand.

>>52133886
Because role playing games aren't founded around the idea of impressing people. What are you even talking about?

>>52133862
Sure thing ,lad.Now imagine that you're right and I agreed with you.
>>52133878
> It makes the GM's job much easier and the play go smoother.
So,>time management

>>52133847
>Thinks tabletop games are single-player affairs
>Accuses others of never having played one outside of their imagination
Pretty sure you're a narcissist anon.

>>52133813
The problem is DMs are human beings so they rarely do one-shots.

>>52133909
you straight up dont even have responses. go back to shitting on the streets you illiterate fuck.

>>52133896
True, but that's mainly on 3.5 designers. in OD&D and 5th AC stays relevant for longer.

>villain in the middle of his monologue
>players sit there and listen
>villain stops
>DM admits he didn't write the rest of the speech because he thought someone would have interrupted it by now
>"Let's just, uh, roll initiative okay?"

>>52133816
>The fuck?
Fuckity fuck
>Okay, you're full of shit, continue
Pls no h8 fampie
>Because when you're in a group that's trying to survive against everything from goblins to orcs to trolls, it's nice to know that you have people to back you up and cover your weaknesses.
Why do you HAVE to be in a group in the first place?
>The fact that you see cooperation as being the same as spineless honestly speaks more about about than it does about anything else.
Because cooperation implies mutually beneficial relationship.If you think that interest of a group is more important than personal goal,then you're literally a sheepy.

>>52133899
>boss giving a final speech before initiating spectacular final duel to summate the game
>2 Int Orc player who just showed up to roll dice and level up (OP) I run up and punch him
>"the BBEG knew one of the ragtag mercenaries had a proclivity of interrupting enemies, and as such had prepared several hidden runes should he run up and interrupt his carefully chosen speech, roll fort save"
>WAAAH THATS JUST THE GM TRYING TO RAILROAD EVERYTHING AND BEING PISSY

>>52133909
>So,>time management
Yes, it's a central part of the tabletop experience. I don't quite see where you're going with this?