Politics in Tabletop

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>>51941689
We're gonna build a wall around the town and make the Orcs pay for it.

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>>51941689
D&D doesn't really do politics well because the nature of PC class characters and magic is such that, generally speaking, their very existence breaks the idea of almost every political system that ever existed in the real world.

The only form of government that really makes sense in D&D is a Mage Oligarchy or some kind of Autocracy run by a God-King who's really just a high level wizard or bard or cleric. Or maybe he's actually a god.

For games with strong political themes you either need a very disciplined group who can suspend their disbelief (not bad things at all, in fact D&D groups tend to be pretty good at this once they've been playing together for a while) or you need to play a game whose mechanics support that sort of thing.

Personally my favorite games for this sort of thing are Cyberpunk 2020 and The Riddle of Steel, but obviously you can make it work with GURPS, Shadowrun, Cyberpunk 2020, etc.

As for getting the players involved, it helps for them to have something to latch on to. It has to be something understandable to them, not everyone is a polsci major. It also helps a LOT if you're not doing modern politics. Modern politics are really depressing when you look under the hood, medieval politics just get cooler.

>>51941689

You'd probably pee on them.

>>51941842

>The only form of government that really makes sense in D&D is a Mage Oligarchy or some kind of Autocracy run by a God-King who's really just a high level wizard or bard or cleric. Or maybe he's actually a god.

Well, in 3.5. Not so much other editions. In 4e a Fighter could kick the shit out of said wizard if he's a comparable level.

>>51941875
That is probably true, I did not play 4.0. The point however is that the existence of magic that can influence people or do other powerful things does change fundamentally what kind of governments would be viable. If 4th edition limits magic down to a more manageable level then it would fall into the other type of game.

>>51941875
>implying a fighter would get to 1v1 an archmage for the leadership position
I don't think that's how it works.
But even accepting your point, this only means the autocracy may be run by a God-King who is the biggest baddest most lethal dude in the realm. Still nothing that you see IRL for anything bigger than a jungle tribe or bandit group.

>>51941967
>Still nothing that you see IRL for anything bigger than a jungle tribe or bandit group.
Right, but it's a pretty accepted trope for someone in a position of authority to be a tremendous badass. It's not like being a huge fucking nerd makes you an able ruler either.

>>51941965

It doesn't limit magic (Well, a bit. Rituals take time rather than a standard action) so much as it brings non-mages up tot he same level.

>>51942098
I mean what people can do in combat isn't really the point, it's how much that can help you run a country. Can you charm large numbers of people, force your viziers to tell the truth, essentially mind control your own bodyguards so that they can't possibly betray you, etc. The ability to like physically beat the shit out of your enemies whether it's with magic or with a sword isn't what breaks D&D from a political perspective, it's the far-reaching powers that magic would give someone in government.

If you really feel like you have to quantify a form of government Pathfinder feels the need to make mechanics for pretty much everything under the sun. You can take inspiration from that or just play it

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>>51941689
politics don't belong at the table any more than you belong out of /pol/

>>51941689
>monarch
>WE MUST OVERTHROW HIM TO ESTABLISH DEMOCRACY
>innocents killed, lives wasted and shit tons of destruction later democracy established
>Wait what do I do now I didn't have a plan for the government after the bloody and ideological revolution I just staged
Every.
Fucking.
Time.

>>51943025
political intrigue is one of the best things out there, its too bad 90% of GMs just fail to do it right.

>>51941748
I'd vote for it

Play a system that works well for it:

https://mega.nz/#F!HZEQ2AZL!F1asY2YmYM8d74vTZHayDw

>>51943394
Wat

>>51941689
You're going to have to be a bit more specific, OP. What kind of game are you trying to run here and what part of the political process are you looking to play? For example, I can see players going on a campaign trail from town to town helping townsfolk with the sole agenda of getting voted and climbing the political ladder. That isn't too far from the standard DND game, just that now you have a bit more at stake than just the next piece of loot from the dungeon.

Now if you want to focus on political wheelings and dealings a la Game of Thrones, there is very little mechanically within DND that supports that. You might find something in a third party splat book for 3.5 and that can be repurposed for Pathfinder, but nothing from the Wizards for either 3.5, 4e or 5e. At that point you should be looking at other systems though which ones I don't know. Maybe someone else can point you in the right direction for that.

>>51941967
That's not how it works, anon.
Usually the one on the top will be the one who has the loyalty of the biggest, baddest dudes.
Often the biggest, baddest dudes don't want into politics (or can't because they're not fit into it and get just used by better players), they just want to keep being big and bad, and loot ancient dungeons.

>>51943252
Thus i make them loose every time my players do that shit.

>Start and win democratic revolution.
>Powerfull merchants overthrow you to install an oligarchy hiding behind democracy.

>>51943307

I suspect that OP, being the faggot he is, isn't going to do "political intrigue," he's going to "modern politics equivalent of Monty Python references."

>>51943668
>(((powerful merchants)))
Oy vey

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>>51943252
>America isn't a thing that exists
>The problem is the Republic itself, not the fact that literally everyone around it tries to destroy it multiple times until it's suppressed for about 4 decades when everyone suddenly agrees Republics are kind of okay and these Republics and faux-monarchies start outshining the conservative/'real' monarchies like the sun outshines a candle
t. Reactionary

>>51943739
>supporting anything post-enlightenment

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>>51943767
>There are people who actually, unironically believe Louis XVI did nothing wrong

>>51941689

Bizarrely, Aberrant Worldwide Phase 1 has an ENTIRE module about winning a presidential election.

>>51943025
sheltered baby pls go.

>>51943252
But enough about history, let's talk about politics in D&D.

>>51944117
>in a big elective monarchy king just died with no son
>one of the competitors to the throne is an adult red dragon
Maybe your party is brave enough to kill a dragon - but can they stop it from rising to power?

>>51943025
>Libcuck sees Trump image
>gets triggered

every time

>>51945257
Fuck that, he's a dragon, he gets my vote.

>>51941689
You create an chaotic evil dictator known as "Drumpf". Drumpf got his army of drumpfkins which are corrupted subhumans who got snow white skin and about the intellect of an orc.

Your party is a rag tag team of brave diverse individuals out to kill drumpf and end his evil reign.

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>>51941689
>>51943252
>>51943767
>>51943898
>>51945290

>>51945376
>using mspaint comics as arguments.

>>51945257
>king just died with no son
As a guy coming from a country that had elective monarchy - yes, and?
In elective monarchy you pick any condidate you like, not from specific dynasty. Being a son or in any way related with currently residing son won't guarantee shit. In fact, son of the the guy who get into throne by his sheer popularity was completely ousted by next election. And the previous king was a completele bumpkin who happend to be a son of regional lord and was elected into kingship due to how easy it was to manipulate him.
Not to mention the first elected king turned out to be a guy who promised a lot, but did nothing. Fortunately, he abdicated himself two years later, since there was a chance to grab French throne instead.

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>>51945392
>using /pol/ and then posting outside of it

>>51945413
Ironic shitposting is still shitposting m8.

>>51945290
>Not even American daytime hours yet
>Posting Trump
>Amazed people get triggered
How long /pol/ is going to wank with new US president?

>>51945431
Then what are you doing here? Have you actually though what the fuck are you posting now? Or just opened the sentence assembler to get a reply?

>>51945356
>liberal magical realm

>>51945441
You are the one bitching about /pol/ and fucking up the discussion about how to incorporate politics to a game.

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>>51945455
You really must try harder, /pol/

>>51945472
Not everyone disagreeing with your rampant shitposting is from /pol/.
Just because Trump is the OP picture, doesn't mean that you can just come in a shit all over the discussion taking place, you massive fucking cunt.

>>51945491
Maybe you didn't notice, but there is no discussion here. Either blatant /pol/ posting or people taking bait OR counter-/pol/ posting.

But hey, let's shitpost some more! That totally is keeping up the "discussion" you are having in your fucking head.

Seriously, what the fuck? It's like this anon >>51945436 said. It's still not daytime in States. And it's already too late fo Australia.
Why the fuck this thread even exists then?

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Lately the /pol/cucks and the orange loser lovers are polluting this board, trying to normalize a massive failure (like their own lives).
Go back to /pol/ with this crap to plan a tiny rally for the tiny-fingered!
http://www.rawstory.com/2017/02/monday-pro-trump-rallies-a-massive-flop-as-event-photos-show-tiny-crowds/

>>51941689
Matt collville does a video series on running dnd, which I've mined for information.

One of the episodes talks about creating an interesting political situation in your game. He specifically talks about creating a central tension which drives much of the conflicts in the setting. He suggests using the american civil war, or the cold war, or really all sorts of scenarios from history as inspiration.

It's worth a watch.

>>51945491
Why every time I read /pol/tards I feel they are either extremely ironic about themselves, or suffer from complete lack any self-awarness

>>51945506
Except there is, or at least was, before you started shitting up the thread.
>>51941842
>>51941875
>>51941965
>>51941967
>>51942016

You made this thread about /pol/.

>>51945517
>everyone I disagree with is from /pol/.

>>51945491
Just because it looks like a nigger and is stealing your shit, doesn't mean it's a nigger, right?

Fuck off, /pol/tard.

>>51945514
>An American internet nobody suggest adding more noninteresting American "history" to your setting
Thanks, but I'll pass on such advice. Average court intrigue is more engaging than ripping off American "history".

>>51945532
>I-it's you shitting up the thread
Just for reminder, this is my post >>51945376

Eat a bullet. Or just crawl back under the rock.
And yeah, everyone who is so fucked up to make thread like this is from /pol/. That's a fucking given.

>>51945514
Thanks, I'll try to check it out.

>>51945514
kek
It would help if you didn't fuck up his name.

Matthew Colville

>>51945532
>/pol/lack makes a thread
>IT'S YOUR FAULT THIS IS /POL/!
Why the alt-right is even more stupid than average right when looking for enemies?

>>51945543
>And yeah, everyone who is so fucked up to make thread like this is from /pol/. That's a fucking given.

Baseless assertion.

Also, your post is blatant shitposting.
Fuck, every thread should start with a Trump picture, so you easily triggered morons would fuck off from this board.

You are not the board police. Nothing in the OP broke the rules, and the topic was completely /tg/ related.
And I am not even the Op.
I was interested in talking about incorporating politics to games, but you decided to shit up the thread because of the OP picture.

>>51945560
>everyone I don't like is from /pol/.

>>51941689
>How do I insert politics into a game about dungeon crawling
You don't.
But how could you know, if you never played, just trying to do "ironic" post on /tg/?

>>51945550
My bad.

Here is the video in question
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpiT6RTlLYc

>>51945571
>Fuck, every thread should start with a Trump picture, so you easily triggered morons would fuck off from this board.
Thanks, we already have board for that. It's called /pol/.
Where you rightfully belong with your cyclical logic and blasted ass.

>>51945582
>everyone I don't like is from /pol/.

Again, why do you get so mad about a fucking trump picture?
I'm not a murrican, and I don't give two shits about who rules there. Help me understand what motivates you to shit up a thread because it has Trump in it's OP.

>>51945506
This thread was started when it was evening in States. People just kept it bumped long enough to not get archived

>>51945594
Because it doesn't belong here.
The question by OP doesn't belong here.
This is /tg/. A board about "traditional games". If you want play political game, you play Diplomacy. Not D&D. Any fucking person on this fucking board knows that.
Which means this is blatant /pol/ posting and you are seriously trying to pretend otherwise.

And this thread was fucking dead anyway,. the only thing keeping it going is our argument right now. Otherwise, it would be already page 7. I've checked that already.

>>51941689
Get players who are interested in politics, and write a premise which enables their characters to be involved.

Don't try to force politics onto people who aren't politically inclined. At best you will have them drag along behind the more interested players until they quit out of disinterest, at worst you will create antagonism and animosity between you and damage social relations. You can always go start your own group elsewhere.

>>51945594
>Every /poltard/ comes from /pol/
Here, ftfy

>>51945616
>You can always go start your own group elsewhere.
It doesn't work that way at all. You can TRY start new group elsewhere, but it's not guaranteed to succeed in any way.

>>51945376

It's more like a bunch of hippies sitting around smoling dope and trying to lead without understanding the world, then a man comes in with facts and actual evidence, and their worldview would crash unless they violently lash out at the reasonable man.

>>51945594
Why every single fucking /pol/ user is always amazed people don't like them outside their hugbox? What is this? Reality shock or something?

>>51945616
>Don't try to force politics onto people who aren't politically inclined.

I don't think the OP is talking about real life politics, but politics in a game setting, which of course should exist. The players might not involve themselves heavily in it if they're not interested in that sort of thing, but it should still exist.

>>51945376
You started it, you stupid fuck.

>>51945638
Why is it that the only argument you have is that the person disagreeing with you is from /pol/?

>>51945610
Anon, you are trying to hard.
Your primary bait fuckup was implying that politicking can't be done in an rpg, an idea that only has grounding in white room 3.PF games where any and all sensible limits, mechanical and GM, are done away with.

>>51945622

If only, man. If only. /pol/ is small, but /pol/ is only a symptom of a very common strain of utter retardation these days.

>>51945630
>other friends
>their social networks
>the FLGS crowd
>the bulletin board
>gamefinder threads
>the thousand+ online websites, forums and IRC channels dedicated to nerds playing D&D over the internet
If you're willing to DM starting a new group is only limited by how much you want it.

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>>51945644
The same fucking rule applies, regardless if they are into real or fantasy politics. If they are playing a game to kill things, then let's make them a game about killing things. They want pirate adventure? Here is pirate adventure.
Forcing them to play something they don't want is the best way of antagonising people for no fucking reason. And inserting politics is literally on the same tier as magical realm. I don't know, you never heard that saying? Political believes are like dick - just because you happen to have one doesn't mean you need to wave them in front of everyone's face

>>51945644
Doesn't matter. >>51945664 beat me to it.

Candidate Drumpf the red dragon responded to accusations of mysogny earlier today. In response to eye witness accounts of Drumpf's kidnapping of the princess of the kingdom of Elia Drumpf said, "Look, this was a long time ago, like a hundred years, I'm not proud of it, but it's just dragon cave talk, certainly I'm not proud of it, It's just dragon cave talk..." Drumpf went on to speak about the orcish warband "Da Terror Boyz" claiming that the world is a chaotic evil place and finished with the following statement "No one has more respect for women than I do."

>>51945655
>All those assumptions
Try to assemble a new player group in a town with population of 800 people. Actual, real people you can sit with and play a game.
I dare you.
I double dare you.

But no person in such position would even try to alienate the only players at hand in the first place, so it's a non-issue for them. It's rather about you and your believe that there is in fact infinite supply of players and eventually you can bump on those that will fit you like a glove.

>>51945664
>Forcing them to play something they don't want
Stop reaching, anon, you are torpedoing your own point with your foolishness.
You are trying to compare politics in a game with magical realm. You are seriously doing that.
You have eclipsed any /pol/tard in this thread with your retardation.

>>51945644
I agree.

The more nuance and verisimilitude a setting has, the more I enjoy roleplaying in it.

>>51945681
>Stop stating the obvious, because I can't stand reality
Not my problem, chump

>>51941689
If anyone really likes political intrigue I recommend checking out the ASOIAF rpg. It's very neat. You play as a house and try to advance in Westeros. In fact there is a way of playing where you have several different parties (houses) like the Starks, Lannisters, Mormonts etc. and you can ally with NPC houses or PC houses and go to war and assassinate people and stuff. If I had all the money and time in the world I would organize a very elaborate ASOIAF campaign with competing houses and factions, multiple GM's.

>>51945681
>Missing the point this bad
It's about forcing people into playing the game they don't want to play. It doesn't matter if it's magical realm, politics or fucking Shadowrun with guys who wanted to play oldschool cyberpunk. It's just not the game they want to play. And if they don't want to play it, then there is no fucking way to "make them", because there are under no obligation to do so.
They came there to have fun, remember? Not indulging in what their GM considers fun for him or herself.

>>51945679
>Try to assemble a new player group in a town with population of 800 people. Actual, real people you can sit with and play a game.
I had one back when I lived in a town of just over 1,000. Sometimes it takes introducing new blood to the hobby.

>Actual, real people you can sit with and play a game.
If you're not willing to go online for it when you clearly have an internet connection, you didn't want it that badly. Thus "only limited by how much you want it".

>But no person in such position would even try to alienate the only players at hand in the first place, so it's a non-issue for them.
That's pretty optimistic of you.

>It's rather about you and your believe that there is in fact infinite supply of players and eventually you can bump on those that will fit you like a glove.
My belief is that there are thousands upon thousands of people out there who have been interested but have never had a group to join, newbies who would play if they could find someone to take on the responsibility of teaching them, or are between groups but don't want to take the step of hosting and running a game out of a desire to fill a player slot.

You're just being picky about your options and then pretending they don't exist. It's like when a teenager looks into his mother's fridge, sees all the ingredients to make something delicious, then whines that there's nothing to eat.

>>51941689
If anyone really likes political intrigue I recommend checking out Legends of the Five Rings.

>>51945696
It's a mess on the crunch side, but the idea itself is good. Shame the execution of it is so wobbly.

>>51945720
It's good for lifting ideas from but not ideal for playing yeah. I would love to have like 100 players divided into ~20 houses, each with their own GM communicating with other GM's. It could be a generic fantasy setting, Westeros, or Europe and they would try to compete for power. A bit like Crusader Kings 2.

>>51945681
>The Point
>2.8km
>Your Head
You'd be forcing a theme and tone your players neither asked for nor seemed interested in for your own personal enjoyment. The boner isn't what makes Magical Realm shit, it's the group of people who don't want to play with it.

>>51945716
>If you're not willing to go online for it when you clearly have an internet connection, you didn't want it that badly
Yes, because internet connection is going to create flesh and bone people at my table.
I want to play with human beings. This can not be substituted with anything. Not my fault you are not getting it.
It doesn't matter if the RPG scene of NY is bigger than entire scene of my country, because they are on the other hemisphere. You are purposefully neglecting the part where those pople need to sit at your fucking table, just to pretend you didn't post utter bullshit and now you are digging yourself deeper.
To claim such bullshit like "playing with people means you are picky". If that's the new definition of picky, you fucking need to check dictionary.

>>51945737
The thing you are looking for is tournament-style builder game.
Not exactly /tg/ stuff in a sense of tabletop game, but the guys from /builder/ usually post some of their games during summer to get fresh blood into their groups.

>>51945576
This is exactly what I was looking for, thanks for sharing.

>>51945760
Neat, I'll check it out.

>>51945708
Who said that, anon?
Where in OP's post does it say "I want to run a primarily political game whether the players want to or not!"?
OP ask how to engage the players in something more than murderhobo'ing, which usually ends up being a goal when playing D&D, and you have run clear off the deep end with screaming assertions.
Yes, you can run politics in D&D, it's simply a matter of establishing the world, culture, characters, and how the players interact with them. They need not even be involved with politics as you are thinking, but aligning yourself to a group to aid them against another is politics right there.
The mayor or council of a city meeting with the player party to discuss an objective or task they would like them to do? That is politics of a sort on it's own, especially if the party haggles over reward, more information, etc.
You are REEEEEE'ing to the wrong song.

>>51945769
Word of advice - if any of them will be named Baz or Bazrael, then it's an evil fuck looking for gullible allies to use and abuse.

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>>51945748
>Yes, because internet connection is going to create flesh and bone people at my table.
Metaphorically. It's not like they're not human beings, the only imaginary thing is the table.

>I want to play with human beings. This can not be substituted with anything. Not my fault you are not getting it.
You would be. You're specifying that they _must_ be local and they _must_ be physically present is just you limiting your options. Again, teenager in the fridge. "There must be something ready to simply pull out, maybe microwave and then eat with no effort, otherwise mommy is neglecting me."

>It doesn't matter if the RPG scene of NY is bigger than entire scene of my country, because they are on the other hemisphere.
And yet, in this age where you could see and hear them through cameras, speakers and microphones in real time with only a few scant miliseconds of delay between you, or the fact that you don't even need to see or hear them to work a game as one can easily find text-only IRC campaigns all over the internet, you shut yourself down instead.

>You are purposefully neglecting the part where those pople need to sit at your fucking table, just to pretend you didn't post utter bullshit and now you are digging yourself deeper.
The fact that there are entire businesses dedicated to providing programs that let people play in online campaigns together proves there is no need. Only you whining because it wasn't your first choice.

>To claim such bullshit like "playing with people means you are picky". If that's the new definition of picky, you fucking need to check dictionary.
Iunno, pic related seems to be in effect here.

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>>51945777
The fuck it has to do with OP, you fucking moron?
Were you even following the conversation at all?

You are literally arguing with yourself now. In your fucking head.

>>51945786
>Still trying
Which part of "you have a town of 800, assemble me a new player group" you didn't get the first time around to completely ignoring the given requirements and instead talk bullshit nobody cares about?
You MUST provide alive players to the table. That's literally the only requirement. If you can't do it, you fucking failed. It's that fucking simple.

Drumpf the red dragon and his running mate Pence the Protector of the unborn a cleric of the protection and fertility domains
Ted Cruz the half-orc american
Bernie Sanders is a gnomish druid who is popular because of some sort of grass or roots or something
Hillary is some sort of undead posing as a mortal.

>>51945795
To quote >>51945716:
"I had one back when I lived in a town of just over 1,000."

I'm not going to go to your home town, find people, set them up and hand the group to you. I'm not your mother, make your own fucking dinner.

Don't whine at me just because an easy option is available for you but you don't want to do the abhorrent and be a fucking adult for once in your godless, miserable life.

>>51945786
Not him, but he clearly talked about loosing one's group and inability to replace them with other people you can physically interact with. Instead you keep posting about internet, which he also specified as a non-option.

And stop making those stupid food comparisions, since you are basically advocating "if you can't eat a normal, full meal, then two bags of crips are going to work as a dinner".

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>>51945820
>There are people who unironically consider playing over net a better option
Either you are desperate, as in - really desperate - or just trolling

>>51945788
Because your entire argument is predicated on bad faith in the GM to run a sound game, and unless you can point me to a non-troll post that says "You should run politics whether the players want to or not, and punish them if they don't engage", you are a REEEE'ing faggot that needs to hang from yonder oak tree.

>>51945820
What are you trying to achieve here, really? The guy stated more than once that online game is not an option. You kept ignoring it, then you started assaulting him for having such simple and basic requirement and now your posts are just a stream of "yo mama" jokes.

If you want to chew out people for acting like kids, grow the fuck up first.

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>>51945847
>Projecting this hard
Jesus...

>>51945788
You won't answer any of the questions of the OP because you are dead set in thinking that his players don't like politics. So you just keep on repeating the same "If they don't like it, don't force it on them." argument.

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>>51941689
/thread

>>51945820
I'd rather kill myself than play another net tabletop.

>>51945870
Do us all a favour. Read those:
>>51945616
>>51945644
>>51945664
>>51945674
>>51945681
>>51945708
And then explain to us all why are you imagining things that aren't there?

>>51945867
>can't point out the posts
>relies on reaction images instead
Status: BTFO

>>51945889
Read again: >>51945888
Can you read at all?

>>51941689
You dont, thats how.

No one want to deal with more politics right now. Unless your whole group is of a political party and its just in there for the lol and has no real meaning to the story, its just going to cause people to groan.

Just dont OP.

>>51945888
I have. Your only answer was "Get a new player group." when you don't even know if they don't like it. A better option would be to just set it up and let the players get into it if they want to.

>51945897
Yes, I did.
It had several people actively approaching OP, then a shitposter who hijacked the thread.
No one in this thread has said to throw things at the party they do not want, and unless you are actively penalizing them, a pc party has the ability to usually simply walk away from the situation.
This has become a very successful troll thread, to the point where I wonder if OP and the shitposter are one and the same.

>>51945576
>actually useful info
Cool, and here I thought this was just gonna be a troll thread.

>>51945616
>>51945664
You sound like a GM I knew. Man, that guy was a fucking doormat so his campaigns were boring as shit.

>>51945922
OP could have made the first anti-/pol/ post because he knows that both /pol/tards and anti-/pol/tards are easily offended.

>>51945919
>A better option would be to just set it up and let the players get into it if they want to.
No, the better setup is to ASK your players what they want to play. Hell, that's literally the only setup you can use if you are not just forcing people to play shit you made, their opinion be damned

>>51945937
You sound like a someone who due to lack of any arguments at hand will start with ad hominems, because he thinks it's still 6th grade.
Oh look what I've just did!

>>51941689
>How do politics in dnd

I would say DND isn't the best system for good political intrigue, but don't let that stop you.

>how do I get my players involved?

Depends. Players vary in how much they want to be involved in creating and shaping the setting you're playing in. Some players are far more passive, and that's ok. Assuming that they do, and you've established some sort of theme and tone for the game, literally sit down and have brainstorming sessions as you try to put their ideas on the map, so to speak.

If all else fails, watch this video. He seems to be doing it just fine. >>51945576

>>51945394
There were different kinds of elective monarchies, not only the Polish kind. HRE had elections too, but often it was held by single dynasties for a long time.
Nevertheless, the premise still works.

Another idea: shapeshifters grow ever bolder. Some say they've infiltrated the government already. Are you bad enough dudes to foil their plans?

>>51946419
HRE wasn't a country, you know?
And electors could vote on whoever they wanted anyway.

Also: everyone was already replaced by shapeshifters, the big twist of the campaign is the PCs learning that they are pod people too

>>51941689
look at real life politics in china, africa or something. most of it is retarded people wanting retarded things and everyone else being forced to care because of that.

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>>51946841
>Implying it's any way different in other parts of the world
>Especially with such picture posted by OP

>>51946823
HRE was a country, you're just sloppily applying definitions that were created after the French Revolution.

Another another idea: You were hired by the local prince to find out the reason for peasant unrest that started recently. Could it be that illithid is behind the charismatic leader?

>>51945664
Anon, having politics exist in the world doesn't mean players have to interact with them. A world where the players are pirates will still have nations that would otherwise get the loot they steal and maybe some competitors would want to pay them to steal it from other nations for political reasons your players will never have to care about, but which would be necessary to justify the payment offered. You don't have to shove any ideology down their throats to have a dynamic world which can change even if they decide to go do other things so they can see that time is actually a thing and that they aren't the only people doing things in areas of conflict. It's just trying to make the world seem like it follows it's own logic consistently: there are nations, ideologies like religions, resources to be fought over, and plenty of strong people with various different cultures to clash: of course there will be politics of some kind.

>>51947307
>HRE was a country
And you are American.

>>51947307
If HRE was a country, so is Principality of Sealand.

>>51947307
>Current Year
>There are people who seriously think HRE was anything else but extremely loose confederation of states
>They unironically call it "country" and looking for stupid excuses to do so

>>51945257
Dunkelzahn 2057!

>>51947363
>"countries"
>before the Revolution
>or, the very least, Olivier Cromwell

>>51947673
>Americans trying to grasp history before formation of their country
Why you even bother?

>>51946217
>You sound like a someone who due to lack of any arguments
You're just going to go in circles with your arguments so why bother go for anymore than insults?

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>>51948070
Why bother posting then?

>>51946217
>No, the better setup is to ASK your players what they want to play
No shit, Sherlock. That's usually what happens at the start of campaigns, however a little bit of political intrigue helps flesh out the setting whether the players choose to deal with it or not.

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>players go around trying to destabilize the setting and shake up the status quo
>I have the status quo police murder them

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Our 4e game got pretty political.

Started out as a game where we had to rescue a king who was kidnapped by another kingdom. Party members were all part of the same military platoon.

My bard made a deal with a politician for more military funding... Which led to said politician cursing my bard character to kill the king the moment he found him. Luckily I was able to get the curse removed, and got my revenge by using a Trickster's Guild to smear his name and get him removed from office.

Also turns out the king willingly got kidnapped. Was sick of all the political bullshit, smear campaigns and assassination attempts and just said "screw it, I feel more free in captivity here than I do at home".

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>>51948805
>Ask players
>If they say no, persist anyway

>>51949385
It's an option not a path. I'm not saying you should force anything.

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>>51941875
>In 4e a Fighter could kick the shit out of said wizard if he's a comparable level.

That's because 4e fighters ARE wizards.

>>51949465
Nah, if anything they're the kind of uncanny super martial artists that monks were before.

>>51941689
What's the biggest problem in the region? (curses, enemies, weather/natural disasters, etc.)
What's the most profitable thing? (goods and services, treasure, land, etc.)
Who has their hands on said things? (the people solving the problem, the people causing the problem, the people making the goods, selling/transporting the goods, etc.)
And who has leverage over those people and how? (bandits threaten with force, lords own the land the craftsmen live on, merchants dictate the price of local goods, etc.)

Now where are you going to insert the party? At the ground levels out in the field and on the streets? Or at the higher levels with the people pulling the strings? If you're fucking around with nobles and shit don't forget why and who has what at stake. Maybe you're negotiating a wedding between two families so that one can gain access to a mercantile empire, so they can devalue the price of trade goods from a certain town, so you can devalue the land to buy it cheap, so they can kick the people living on it out of their homes, so they can get to the buried ruins of an ancient wizard's vault of magical items. Or maybe you need to intimidate a theif guild boss into tightening regulation on some loose cannon goons that are extorting merchants who are then losing business and money, which is hurting the town's economy, which is pissing off the town governor, who doesn't want the greater area's lord breathing down his neck about it when he's about to help fund a coup of said lord and doesn't want the extra eyes on his fishy behavior. Playing a game of 6 degrees of separation to get from the party's immediate actions to a larger or distantly related effect is a good way to make sure that the politics of the world remain in flux with every action they take.

>>51941875
>In 4e a Fighter could kick the shit out of said wizard if he's a comparable level.

But what if I charm him long enough to throw him off my tower?

>>51953001
>not understanding that orbizard>everything
Uh huh.

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>>51943025

>>51943668

just like real life holy shit