Modern General

>>51925142
I love how even with preordain this is a fucking pile of shit.

>>51925187
Card selection doesn't do anything when your cards are bad

>>51925187
It's azorius control, it's going to be a steaming pile of shit no matter what.

Is there any good cheap decks that can be upgraded that you guys would recommend for someone starting on modern?

patiently... waiting for spoilers...

>>51925378
i heard spoilers were supposed to come out tomorrow, not sure why though.

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>>51925299
It doesn't really upgrade into anything but as far as cheap decks go I'm a big fan of mono-green stompy. It's about $70 for the whole thing and it has game against most of the field. It's also easy to pilot, which is a big plus for a new player.

>>51925299
depends what you consider cheap.

For less than 100 you can get stompy and mono red burn, where burn can easily be upgraded.

>>51925378
It's been Monday for WoTC headquarters for 12 minutes now, were are our spoilers??

>>51925455
uh no it's not u ritard

>>51925299
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/decks/budget/modern#online

Most of them are upgradeable but the most popular are affinity, burn, 8rack, elves, and w/b tokens.

We will probably have some spoilers up by tomorrow around 10 am central time. My bet is new snapcaster art reveal and two/three rares, most of them being really good.

>>51925627
I'm putting my money on draft chaff

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How am I doing? I have no idea what to put in the obscure decks region and the cheap and beginner's decks sections

What's the best way of going about selling your mtg collection? Should sell by bulk or individual cards? Should I just go to a shop and buylist everything at 50%? I know I'm sitting on about 4k worth of cards here.

>>51926932
Pick of the more expensive cards and sell them one by one.

Most people don't have patience for that and usually loose a good chunk of money.
Unless you reaaaally need that money right now.

Sell rest as "repacks" for fast moniez.

>>51926651
>new
>mill
Change that to Mono R Burn.

No card needs reprint. Only poorfags crybabies need reprints, git gud, git rich and buy things without complaim.

>>51927075
Or maybe, just maybe, I'd like for more people to be able to get into the format regardless of how much money they have, simply because it's fun, and it's good for the health of the format.

>>51927134
don't care, if they want to get into the format they should buy stuff and stop complaining. It's a "expensive" hobbie and people should get over it.

>>51927953
You do realise that there's only a limited amount of cards, right? Even if there's a million people with enough money who want to buy into Jund, if there's only 400000 Tarmogoyfs in the world, only a tenth of those people will be able to play. Reprints alleviate that.

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>>51927075

>>51928011
>10th
you mean a 4th at worst, because you need a playset for constructed and the commander players only need one.

>>51928023
>400000/4 = 100000
>1000000/100000 = 10
You're saying 1/10 = 1/4?

when are the spoilers coming out

>>51928564
Never

>>51928564
Probably some time around lunch in commiefornia

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LOL THE FIRST SPOILER IS STOIC ANGEL

THE SHITBOMB WE ALL ALREADY KNEW ABOUT

TOP FUCKING KEK

>>51928651
Why is this surprising to you? I had a good idea it'd be one of the cards on the packs desu

>>51928651
>"What's that white 4 mana 3/4 angel in the format? Oh yeah..."

>>51928710
The first EMA spoilers were force of will and Wasteland, which got people hype as fuck. I assumed they would start off with something good to get people excited

Hopefully they'll spoil snapcaster later today, I wanna see the new art

Also requesting somebody post the slamcaster mage alter of the promo, por favor

>>51928651
It actually was Restoration Angel on some Asian site.

>>51928747
I got it off the mothership site so this is the first official spoiler

Tbqhwy I really like the new mana morphose art. The old one looked like a crack head trying to sell you shit

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Its something i guess

Liliana reprint where????
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>51928896
>not mythic
I am done with magic.

I am tired of wizards shitting in investors. We help keep the secondary market alive.

In before garbage set with less value below mythic than kaladesh block

>>51929015
It was rare before you manchild. Snapcaster will probably be mythic though.

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This isn't real. Is it?

ENEMY FETCHES HOLY SHIT YES

>>51929071
>itshappening.jpeg

And solid fixing, too. This set looks real promising for limited.

>>51929071
they no longer put text in the center so I guess its fake

>>51929084
Show me

>>51929093
It's on the wotc official site you dumb fuck

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/card-preview/took-us-long-enough-2017-02-27

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>>51929099

>>51929093
They did with counterspell in EMA

How low is this gonna put zendikar fetches?

>they're ACTUALLY using the guild gates

Holy fuck mazes end reprint here we go

Is it still shit fags?

>>51929109
No this is terrible. Never will they reprint it in a set that will be printed significantly, this will increase booster prices and they'll be impossible to get.

>>51929109
No way this is real.

No way.

They wouldn't reprint the enemy fetches... would they?

>>51929166
I expect the fetches kilo snap damn and that's it, I mean really that's it, the estimated value of the box is probably already est value. And how quickly we forget about the poor souls pulling donor as their mythic

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>enemy fetch reprint

>>51929202
Look on the official site

>>51929015

lol fuck you

>just bought 2 lilis at $55 each
>no spoiler
Let me make money off this, wizards. Please

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Here's to hoping it's printrun will be similiar to EMA

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>>51929202
It's real. Now that the format is going to die soon, they reprint all the good stuff.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/get-ready-dual-2017-02-27?

DAMN

FUCKING

NATION

LOCAL COMPANY DOESN'T FUCK UP FOR ONCE

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Someone please buy these now, go on eBay and search newly listed

>Damnation
>Enemy fetches

Is this the real life? Or is this just fantasy?

>>51929267
And enemy fetches

A T R A R E
T
R
A
R
E

>>51929239
There's a zero percent chance Loki doesn't get the bbre

>>51929275
those look like my china fakes

>>51929286

How did they avoid fucking this up? I'm baffled. Speculators, get rekt.

>>51929300
At worst, it's a chase mythic like goyf and doesn't hurt the price much, so I still come out on top.

But if she doesn't get one... I just made about $100-200 bucks

>>51929201
This. Holy shit you people are retarded.

>>51929201
How are you not happy that they finally gave us enemy fetches not at secret rare or mythic?

>>51925425
>>51925450
>>51925607
Thanks for the help!

>>51929349
Because I expected them to be printed in a regular set. Never a standard with fetches again. Expect $15-$20 boosters.

>>51929393
>buying boosters
???

>money cards
>at rare
>not a single mention of mythics at all
I'm so confused right now.

>>51929403
I'll draft this maybe. I'm not opening boosters for value mind you. This will barely decrease the price of fetches and for only a limited time.

>>51929266
They literally ruined it. Now fetch Will be forever expensive. And the worst is that people is happy about it and Will suck wizards dick forever, congratulating on how they do things right.

Thanks god i just bought my chinamen fakes

>>51929461
Pretty much this.

Hey guys, I just read that MM17 is an unlimited print run. Does this mean Wizards will pull a C16 and stop printing it because muh secondary market?

>>51929625
except that it isn't

>>51929639
b-but leddit said

>>51929753
one guy probably said it

>>51929625
Get the fuck out of here

So now that the reprints are good are we going to see a limited print run™ or are we going to see scalper faggots hoarding to keep their precious fetches at current price

>>51929959
>Now that the reprints are good
I love how people say this every fucking time.

HOLY SHIT EVEN GOBLIN GUIDE LMAO
ITS OVER GUYS

>>51930009
Enemy fetches, damnation along with a likely snapcaster and goblin guide aren't good? We haven't even seen the whole thing but this is almost better than og mm and already miles above mm2. If it even has decent value in uncommon/common slot this set will be amazing.

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>>51930014

>>51930081
This literally happens the fisrt fucking day they realease spoilers, seriously every fucking time. People start jerking off and then they release the rest and it's a fucking joke again. Do tell me the first spoilers of MM2015? They did sure look nice didn't they

>>51930014
Does it have shitty new art?

>>51926651

Bubble Hulk is obscure enough yet has had some placings before but is however relatively unknown.

Also Possibility Storm combo works in that category of either "What is going on?" or "That's not a deck"

>>51929071
>Rare
Holy shit this will drop in price now!

>>51930254
Inb4 secret rarity like fatal push.

Enjoy your kithkin rates goyim

Is this the time to sell tron play RW burn

>>51930178
>Bubble Hulk
Not a deck either

>>51930014
show me the proofs

>>51930416
Go on reddit or mtgsalvation or look at TCC video

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>>51930416
New Tolarian Community College video

>>51930388

It has seen several top 4 and top 8 finishes before. Though it was during twin pre-ban days.

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For those not wanting to Google

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>>51930590
>That art

>>51930617
It looks like if you were tripping sack on acid and some crackhead was trying to suck your dick for some money.

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>goblin guide
>resto angel
>damnation
>enemy fetches

muh
fucking
dick

>>51930590
Zen art > Lobster head ass art

>>51930590
art sucks, but i'll take the price drop

>>51930680
GP art > all

>>51930771
Just don't get deck checked at GP's and don't take them out of your sleeves and you'll be fine

>>51930771
>wizards prints the cards that need reprinting
>"time to buy fakes of the same cards!"

What in the actual fuck are you on about? Do you intend to never take your deck out beyond your most casual LGS formats?

>>51930771
Except they don't pass. I have them. They don't look real. Stop being poor

>>51926651

>Just obscure enough to get a nod

seismic swans

>>51929431
Front loading value to ship out as many boxes as possible before killing the format

>>51930729
Promo art is ass too desu

The art and the flavor line up so well on the zen art

>>51930993
Just like they killed legacy, right? Their cards aren't worth money anymore, anyway

>>51931097
Just like khans increased onslaught fetches?

Fuck off poorfag

>>51931097
That's not how reprints work. Ever.

>>51931136
Not the same guy, but comparing a standard release set to a masters set is pretty crazy
I'm with you, I believe the price will fall, but still a bad comparison

>>51931150
enjoy getting banned

>>51931150
How are the fakes? They hold up pretty well against real cards or are they blatantly obvious?

>>51931205

Lands almost never get caught, they're the farthest possible thing from the other players eye and they never get asked to be looked at

>>51931029
Legacy staples keep their price through sheer scarcity. A lot more people play modern, so if it gets the axe the market is going to be flooded

>>51931169
It's the only comparison we have, I mean I get that it's not the same since mm isn't opened like a standard set but its not like the price is going to go up like that retard is saying.

>>51931222
Goyf was at mythic though and is cheaper than he was before the reprints.

>>51930998
Promo art actually like a guide, not some cowardly faggot with a lantern

>>51929015
>Putting resto at mythic

Fucking thank god youre done with magic get out you scrub reeeeee

>>51930164
Hes a tuk-tuk goblin now.

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>>51931330
Promo art looks like some blue faggot with cluttered maps making a "really makes you think pose"

Zen Goblin guide is a cute disoriented gobbo that matches the flavor text much better. Also fuck you the lantern makes the art.

Just look at this lil nigga and his lantern, he doesn't know what the fucks going on.

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>>51931450

>>51931462
Stop kidding yourself, that art is gay as fuck. Kind of like you are.

>>51931487
Not that guy but holy shit dude that was the most autistic thing ive read today. I remember being 12 too but we all grow up someday.

>>51931450
Apparently you don't know how to use mtgoldfish because you only looked at future sight goyf.

Pro tip: look at mm and mm2 goyf.

>>51931450
>goyf being more then 100 these days

>>51931513
hurr durr i got caught being stupid arrrhhhhh duuurrr

>>51931462
>Zen Goblin guide is a cute disoriented gobbo that matches the flavor text much better.
You have that backwards

>>51931513
>why would I look that the version that actually affected the market and changed the price
>has a lower priced currently
Really makes you think

>>51931498
>not that guy
>abloo bloo bloooo
thanks for the (You) fagboy

>>51931552
Continues to call people fags and a piece of cardboard gay hahaha ok guy keep suppressing the need to suck that fat goblin dick ;)

>>51931534
>I've been all over the world, I even remember some of those places
Kind of implies he doesn't know what the fucks going on if he only remembers a few of the places he's been out of the whole world.

Matches it much better than faggy blue gobbo who is about serious adventuring.

>>51931255
mind sharing your seller?

>>51931598
>m-modern is dying
>good art version
Just admit you were wrong man it's not that hard.

>>51931659
>he doesn't know how to ban evade

If modern is dying Standard must be dead and buried

>>51931676
Seriously.
>Go to new shop
>Use a different spelling of your first name
>Get new DCI number
wow so hard. Unless you're like a pro player or something.

>>51931718
>he thinks a couple of /tg/ nerds reporting will put his seller out of business

>>51931794
fuck you

>>51930154
To be fair MM15 was shitty because it all came down to getting the mythics. MM17 has at least 7 value rares in the 5 fetches, Guide and Damnation.

Glad to see the thread and good news of spoilers getting killed off by Standard fags upset that Modern isn't actually dying.

Fucking kill yourself you literal children

>>51931814
gottem haha wow

>>51931818
I don't want to defend mm15 but it had noble, Spellskite and Fulminator all at rare off the top of my head. Obviously less than mm17 right out the gate but not nothing

>>51931868
It had the command cycle, all is dust and twin too. Aside from that though, the set didn't really have anything.

>>51931868
And cryptic

Oh god. Im kind of worried now. I hope these arent the only value cards

>>51931818
Leyline, Hierarch, skite, twin, fulminator, eye of ugin, coronet, blinkmoth, and all is dust. All 20 Dollars or more rares before MM2015. I literally can't wait for them to print like 3 or 4 more decent rares, preorder them boxes real good, then everything else good at mythic. Search your heart you know it to be true.

>>51931933
All of the mythics were good but Comet Storm

>>51931935
With fetches in they don't have to try hard with the rest of the set to sell through.

>>51931949
>bolt and path at super mythic
Desu don't want to warp limited.

What uncommons would make the set great? Path, Bolt and Remand?

>>51931935
>>51931933
>>51931868
>blue black instant control is an archetype
>worried about no counters

>>51931982
>the mythics were good though
Yeah and the rares, commons and uncommons were all trash which is why the set sucked.

>>51931982
>open a box with tezz and prime time
>estimated value drops down to less than 100 dollars
Intradesting

>>51932014
Path for sure. It has a billion promos but not enough actual reprints.

>>51932046
Except the rares werent that bad as you can see >>51931949. The big fault was the lack of value uncommons.

>>51932031
What does that have to do with anything we are talking about?

>>51932064
I mean they are mythics that players like to play in modern or EDH so reprinting them is good. Opening boxes to make money out of them is always retarded, anon.

>>51932093
But what valuable cards see play in Modern at uncommon? Path for 100%, but what else? Wall of Omens? Kitchen Finks? Bolt will be uncommon if they reprint it, but does it really need another print?

>>51932014
Finks

>>51932031
Did you reply to wrong posts or something?

If them not reprinting lili meant they could print 5 other 20 dollar rares I'd take that shit all fucking day. I would so much rather have them print boxes that range from 200-300 than 100-400

>>51932148
Forgot Inquisition of Kozilek, but I'm drawing a blank beyond that.

>>51932014

Abrupt decay
Tron lands

>>51932167
Yeah, my page scooted and its simply too late to delete it.

>>51932215
>Goyf at uncommon

It would be fun to see the investors' tears

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>>51932191
>tron lands with anus mana symbols and new art of crumbled towers, mine and power plant post-time spiral
My dick can only get so erect.

>>51932191
>Abrupt decay


What are the odds we get some good rares rarity-shifted down to uncommon? I'm liking the sound of uncommon Thoughtseizes myself.

>>51932266
Pretty much 0

>Damnation is nearly $80
>Doesn't see consistent play in any tier 1 deck
How? I understand Planar Chaos was a small set, but this shit makes no sense.

>>51932393
Commander and price memory.

>>51932266

Uncommon abrupt decay would feel good and not be broken for draft
It's one of the few I can think of that could be safely downshifted from rare
Maybe.. Uncommon steel overseer? would be dope as fuck

>>51932266
Uncommon Inquisition of Kozilek :^)

>>51932415
Would actually be great in draft if they reprinted Memnite and some other random affinity playables as well.

>>51932449

And this is what I wanted all along from MM. they could probably somewhat approximate certain meta decks. Give us common memnite and uncommon thopter and uncommon cranial plating. Rare blinkmoth. etc

Also give us e wit and aether vial at uncommon and cryptic at rare.

Give us fish lords at uncommon, why not?

Give us bolt at common, delver at common, battle rage at uncommon, kiln fiend, mutagenic at common.

They could make a really powerful and fun draft set that actually approximates the modern experience and contains a lot of money cards. But they don't want to do it.

How many of the swords are we getting at the mythic slot?

>>51932509
I'm not a limited player by any means but I'd play the shit out of that draft.

>>51932509
No dfc no delver

>>51932570
Well crossing my fingers they pull all the stops for mm17. We might see it if we're lucky.

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>>51932393

At this point, this Damnation reprint is a response to meme. It is barely played, and usually as 1-of.

Fetches are cool, but I still can't shake the feeling the whole spoiler is going to be an ugly, steaming shitpile. Early spoilers are always amazing.

>>51932630
Fetches will sell like hotcakes, hence a massive (but still somehow limited goyim) overprinting.

What I'm saying is BUY FRONTIER

>>51932191
>Tron lands
Only if they ban them 6 months from now

>>51932658
If they print tron lands would it be similar to the twin foreshadowing in mm2?

>>51932658

Don't worry the best bomb we'll see for draft tron in this modern masters is haunted plate mail

and wurmcoil

>>51932653

There is no such thing as a massive limited overprinting. Fetches will drop for a couple of months, then they will start climbing back again. One year from now, we'll be exactly where we are now. Same thing that happened with Hierarch.

>tfw no good Koth deck

I've played Skred forever but I just wan't a better deck that can utilize most fun walker
So far only Mardu token like builds have given me any success

>>51932150
Apparently white is going to have a strong blink/ETB effects theme, and they're designing the set around allied color pairs, so this seems pretty likely

>>51932802
>print enemy fetchlands
>It's allied pairings guys!

>>51932815
Nigga read the article

>>51932746
I don't care about draft, I just want them to ban Urza's tower

>>51932892
salty bitch: the post

>>51932776
They'll probably be higher. Mox Opal was at around $35 at its lowest before MM2015. I was eying that shit. Anyway, now it's $55-60. Masters sets tend to raise the prices in the long term.

>>51932393
Honestly it's just a bullshit meme. Sees almost zero play in competitive formats and there are way better Wraths for Edh.

>>51932892
>Banning only 1 Tron piece

Is this how they would do it? Because that would be cheeky as fuck.

>>51932892
>I don't mb ghost quarter and surgical the post

>>51932941
The tears would be delicious

>>51932932
How many of those wraths are black though? Toxic Deluge and what?

>>51932815
Are you trying to be stupid?

>>51932908
>>51932950
>t. Tron players

>>51932959
Decree of pain, black suns zenith, in garruks wake

>>51933029
I don't see how those are better than a 4-mana unconditional wrath. They give additional value, but they won't save you on turn three or four against an explosive boardstate unless you drew a crazy amount of ramp in your opener.

>>51933001
So do you just not pack hate for one of the most consistently played decks in modern or something

>>51932415
steel overseer is way too powerful to be uncommon.

>>51933115
Don't pretend like Modern actually has good hate for Tron.
Also not very healthy that you absolutely fucking need the hate or you lose

>>51933029

Yahenni's Expertise is much better than any of those, and it does not see play.

>>51933100
Edh players usually have a rule where no one can die before their sixth turn or some other such equally retarded bullshit so they always have time to play their big durdly cards

>>51933123
Depends on how many artifact creatures are in the set really.

>>51933100
And I dont see how you need to be saved on turn 3 or 4 against explosive starts unless all your opponents drew nuthands or they are autistic spikes with $1000 edh decks. Edh games tend to go longer so cards that provide value like those are better almost in every scenario but the one you mentioned.

>>51933132
I wouldn't ban Tron outright. I would ban the enablers that make it far too consistent even through removal. Ancient Stirrings and the like. Also Karn or Ugin I wouldn't mind seeing the hammer.

I don't see why we can't just ban Nulamog if we want to nerf tron without killing it outright

>>51933268
They're never going to put Wasteland in Standard again because the newer players get their fee fees hurt when you mess with their lands.

>>51933231
>One mana scry 2 draw a card is too strong
>One mana look at top 5 take one is fine

>>51933156
possibly, but even if you just get 2 steel overseers your deck is probably gonna be pretty dumb if they ever hit the battlefield at the same time. or you get 1 and have 5-6 artifact creatures in your deck.

>>51933300
But it's balanced because it can only grab colorless cards :^)

>>51933255
They would just play another big threat. If you want to nerf an strategy you go for the enablers like Expedition Map or the eggs.

>>51933326
Daze wouldn't be that great in Modern though. Half of why it's amazing in Legacy is that it gives you more useless shit to put back with a Brainstorm to shuffle away.

>>51933333
Quints for memes.

>>51933300
Fucking this.
Seriously how is Ancient Stirrings still even allowed.

>>51933268
Hell, bring back Strip Mine too. As long as you want to make newer payers cry, let's give them a real reason.

>>51933300
>one mana set up next 2 turns draws
Vs
>one mana only grab colorless cards
Two different things, not to mention stirrings only sees play in 2 decks.

>>51933363
FUCK YOU HOWBOUDA? maybe you should suck it up and play green you little faggot

>>51933398
Also you have to bottom the other four so it's potentially worse

>>51933398
Stop trying to justify digging 5 cards versus 2 or 3 cards. Ancient stirring in it's respective deck is super powerful compared.

Real Talk. If I pre-order a box now, while they are at $200, what is the likelihood I make that much back in value from the box?

>>51933483
If you sit on fetchs and maybe damnation for about 8 months you'll probably have made your money back and more

>>51933322

>or you get 1
This could happen even at rare. It's a strong card but not draft breaking. Just print an appropriate amount of removal.
I would print elvish archdruid at uncommon too just to piss you off

>>51933483
47%

>>51933483
We dont know because we dont have full spoilers you dumbass. Get a job instead of gambling with card games.

>>51933452
>in it's respective decks
That's the rub, it's a card that can only be used by certain decks and it can only be used by those decks. People try and cry for a ban by comparing it to the other banned can trips but that's not fair since those slot into 90% of blue decks and fuel actual degenerate shit.

>>51933452
Grow up kid, its perfectly fine and you just need to become a better deck builder. Blue deserves its cantrips because it used to be op. Now that blue is balanced its nothing but tears. QQ less, git gud more.

>>51933483

If you open two fetches you'll have made 50% of your value back.

>>51933414
Ancient Stirrings is so good at getting artifacts you'd think it was a blue spell. The card is crazy good in Lantern Control.

>>51933572
Grave Troll is only used in 1 deck. Summer Bloom is only used in 1 deck. They were still considered ban worthy. Tron as it is right now pushes an entire archetype out of the format. If it takes a hit but remains playable it would be the best possible thing for Modern.

>>51933572
Oh fuck off. Who cares if it goes into a single deck if it's better than other decks can do? Summer bloom was only good in one deck and it got banned, because guess what, being playable in multiple decks mean nothing.

I don't mind seeing ancient stirring played, don't care. But don't go around claiming dig for 5 isn't bullshit, while other cards of same caliber are banned you wanker. I agree with your point about degenerate shit, but look at the modern decks. All of them are degenerate linear fucking bullshit lists, that's how the format rolls.

>>51933603
Fuck you too mister.

>>51933452
And merchant scroll is broken in instants tribal. Being able to get any card makes all the difference.

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Thinking of pulling the trigger on a cheap $20 Maze's End deck. Anyone ever play a deck like this? Is it fun? Is it remotely viable?

>>51933526
>not reading my post
>responding

The whole point is that even if you get only one it would still be very good. the card doesn't need a lot of support just a few other artifact creatures to become very good, which is why it probably won't be printed at uncommon. I didn't say it was draftbreaking just that the effect is very strong at uncommon, think about what other effects you would have to print at uncommon that would compete with steel overseer.

wizards isn't going to print a draft environment with heavy focus on removal, it's not fun. I don't really care about the elvish archdruid thing at all, doubt they would do it cause they're not that retarded.

that being said I doubt they have an artifact theme in this set cause the last 2 mm had artifact themes.

>>51933646
>Grave Troll + Summer Bloom were banned despite being in only 1 deck
Boom, /thread

Ancient Stirrings, Eldrazi Temple and LADIES AND GENTLEMEN MOX OPAL push the most cancer these days.

>>51933656
>while other cards of the same caliber are banned
Maybe you should re read the post, comparing it to the blue can trips isn't even the sane thing
>>51933646
There's a difference between actual engines and a fucking conditional can trip, learn the difference fucktard.

>>51933638
Thats literally just your opinion, any card is fine if its in green. Green is the only color where all of its cards are fairly costed. Who cares that green is allowed to interact positively with colorless cards when its no different than tutoring up a good land. If all the colors can fetch lands then green deserves every card in the current modern pool that is green.

>>51933674
>muu muh muhhhh
typical blue cuckboys, lmaoooo

>>51933685
What the hell are you on about?

But honestly. in minimal case, ancient stirring picks up 5 out of 53 cards, which equals to roughly 9.5% of your library. It's insane at finding the cards you need in it's respective deck.

>>51933800
That's assuming no mulligan of course, but like every other person crying about ancient stirring you seem to forego tho fact that if you hit 5 cards you actually want, you're going to have to bottom four and that's potentially not good. I'm not saying the card isn't powerful but its nowhere near banworthy like some of idiots are making it out to be.

>>51933800
And merchant scroll can get any card in your deck. So it must be broken, because the distinction between actually getting any card and what ancient stirring and merchant scroll do is meaningless to you.

>>51933849
If Git Probe is bannable, it's open season on cards like Ancient Stirrings.

>>51933762
You are just looney mate. I play burn myself.

>>51933730
>Maybe you should re read the post, comparing it to the blue can trips isn't even the sane thing
I'm completely aware of what you wrote. I'm not even the guy doing the comparison, but what I saw was "it's a card that can only be used by certain decks and it can only be used by those decks" which is retarded, when it literally digs up for degenerate thing like tron pieces into ulamog. It's absolutely as stupid as other cantrips, but it's somehow more ok and digging for 5 is somehow less bad, even tho it tutors about 80% of cards your deck has.

>>51933883
What the hell are you talking about tutors that can't even be played on the format. Tutors are good, ok? Ancient stirring is also good, so what's the thing you are trying to point out?

>>51933711
>Is it remotely viable?
Holy shit no.

>>51926651

>I've heard of this
Madcap Moon
Restore Balance

>What's going on?
Possibility Storm
Bird Brain

>That's not a deck
Heartless Myr Retriever
Duskmantle Mindcrank

>>51933885
Stirrings doesn't enable kills before t4.

Try again.

>>51933902
The whole point of writing that was because people always argue for stirrings ban based on blue can trips, which slot in to every blue deck and fuel fast kills whereas stirrings fuels tron and lantern. Again I'm not saying it isn't powerful but arguing for a ban based on blue can trips is retarded since they aren't comparable.

>>51933950
Merchant Scroll was reprinted in 8th you faggot.

>>51933568

I have a job, that's the money that lets me gamble with card games.

>>51933883
Got'em lmao

>>51933711
>Is it remotely viable?
In RTR Standard maybe
Modern? Fuck no.
I wish it was though.

>>51934050
>Get to 11 land
>Scapeshift
>Opponent sighs and tells you to go grab your mountains and Valakuts
>You grab 10 guildgates and Maze's End

>>51933978
True enough, forgot which set is was in. The point is still amiss tho.

>>51933968
Fair enough, but surely they are comparable in twisted sense as they both dig for cards. Just don't like people going around acting like stirrings would be any way less powerful than your good old blue cantrips, because that is just stupid and untrue.

>>51934070
In the same way merchant scroll is not any way less powerful than demonic tutor

>>51934210
If your deck consist of 90% of blue instants and less 10% are not worth tutoring..... In a sense your merchant scroll is just as good as demonic tutor. In fact merchant scroll is so good it's played in vintage and legacy.

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>>51933965
>>51930986
>>51930178
>>51927021
thanks for feedback. i'll update again after school or something
I'm thinkin i'll put death's shadow jund and maybe UR delver/kiln fiend in a new branch on the beat face side

Still not sure about:
-what to put in the box for people who want to play blue
-how to approach the budget decks

>>51934278
Man it's been so long since I've played against high tide. Also if you want to talk about cards played in legacy and vintage ponder is in 60-70% of legacy decks depending on meta and restricted in vintage. Preordain is in some 20% of vintage decks too.
When you talk about 'this card is powerful if...' the condition on ancient stirrings is making nearly your whole deck colorless, the restriction on blue cantrips is having blue mana in your deck. To act like the restriction on ancient stirrings doesn't matter is retarded.

>>51933849

>you're going to have to bottom four and that's potentially not good

That's an irrelevant factor for two reasons.

1) If you cast four ancient stirrings across the first four turns you go with 53 cards in hand putting 16 cards on the bottom of your deck. Put across 4 turns with natural card draw that puts you down to 49 cards in deck. Subtracting another four cards taken that puts you at 45 cards. This would put the very first card bottomed from the first ancient stirrings at the 29th spot from the top of your deck. You are able to take the very best card you need out of a pool of five cards for a single G mana. Considering a deck like Bant Eldrazi which makes 95% of the deck a live draw with Ancient Stirrings does not matter what you bin to the bottom. If Ponder is too strong for being able to look at 3-4 cards for a single mana then Ancient Stirrings is much stronger in allowing two of the most strongest decks right now at finding its key pieces for the low cost of G. Now if my math is right(probably isn't) this means you have just seen 35% of your deck with four cards only and are able to choose the best card each time.

2) Factor two is this is a format that plays fetchlands and can always shuffle what has been bottomed away later thereby nullifying the "negative" effect of Ancient Stirrings

>>51934440
>implying colourless cards are are a hindrance
Artifacts, lands and eldrazi are all extremely powerful

>>51934482
You know what else is extremely powerful? Literally every other card played in modern, all of which blue cantrips can get along with those cards.

>>51934530
Lmao. Ok dude. I can see you don't actually understand what you're talking about

>>51934353
>-how to approach the budget decks

>I'm on a budget
>How budget
>I'm on welfare - Mono Green Stompy
>I'm a wage slave - Mono Black Devotion or Soul Sisters

>>51934530
So blue doesn't get good cantrips or counters. Snapcaster is the only reason to play blue. Seems legit

>>51934530

Too bad that blue is the slowest colour in Modern with the lack of fast mana available and hard counterspells.

>>51934615
I don't think preordain should be banned (ponder is a different story). But saying ancient stirrings is on the same power level is silly.
>>51934641
Damn, if only decks could be more than 1 color.

>>51934615
How about you play a good deck instead of crying about what color wins the game.
>>51934641
Why should blue be inherently faster than colors that actively increase your available mana? Why the hell should I have to sit there and deal with your gay baby counters? If you dont want to play magic thats fine but wanting to be able to fill a deck with counters and somehow jist win because of it is the thought process of a mental midget.

>>51934353
>I've heard of this
Slivers
Skred
Mono U Tron
Free Win Red
Spirits
Storm
Mill
Innistrad Tribes
Humans
Allies
>What's Going on?
Other Lorwyn Tribes
Taking Turns (can also work as "goes to time")
Cherrios
Free Win Red
Madcap Experiment
SaffronOlive Myr Tribal
Trix (Harmless Offering + Demonic pact, steel golem)
Madcap Experiment
Alternate wincons
>That's not a deck
Zombie Hunt/50 Islands
5c Shrines
"14% of the Time it works all the time"/Mulligan Luck based Combo decks
X Tribal (Adaptative Automation, Cavern, Metallic Mimic, other Generic Tribal cards)

>>51934530
You just don't get it. You have to evaluate card relative to deck it is played in. If reason that card goes into many decks is the obstacle, then stuff like lighting bolt and such are absolutely too strong, but that's not how it works right? The reason cards get banned is because it's respected deck is doing too good compared to what it should be doing. Sometimes admittedly and sometimes for retarded reasons, whatever happens to be the feeling WotC has.

Ancient stirring is on the same power level as preordain, well that's absolutely true, but as tron and eldrazi doesn't take the biggest metashare, it's somehow okay. You see my gist? Wouldn't be surprised to see lightning bolt banned if burn took 30% of meta. Not like the ban was right one to make, but that's just how it goes.

>>51934758
>gay baby counters?
Underage pls go

>>51934067
>>51933711
if you were to play that deck, it'd have to be some monstrosity version of scapeshift, amuletbloom, and chromatic loam control

>>51934883
You can close the web page at any time and let the adults continue discussing modern instead of crying about fair cards lmao.

Im relatively new. How much of a difference does modern masters have on the price of a card if its rare?

For example, scalding tarn is in the mid $40s right now. what is a ballpark pricepoint for it to be 3 months from now

Also what I don't get is people whining about counters. Somehow WotC has decided counterspells are unfun and hence shouldn't be supported. I don't see how counters are any less fun to play against than full on combo decks or superaggros. Is it really any worse?

Also quite unsure why anyone not liking counterspells or combos would be playing this game anyway, since they have been key mechanics since forever. Playing the wrong game if they are an issue.

>>51934910
Mid 40$

>>51927075
>>51927953
You're completely retarded for wanting cards not on the reserved list to not get reprinted.

>>51934607
but i'm a wage slave and i have:
legacy d&t
modern e&t
standard grixis emerge

and have owned:
legacy grixis pyromancer
modern grixis delver
modern jeskai (all flavors including nahiri)
modern naya zoo
standard GWx tokens
standard jeskai black
standard atarka red
standard mono-blue devotion
[timeskip]
type 2 pros-bloom
type 2 necro
type 2 ernhamgeddon

i still pay all my bills and rent on time. it's not hard if you're a competent trader.

>>51934758
Because the whole point of Magic is that the 5 colors each have strengths. Blue is too slow for the turn 4mat.
>How about you play a good deck
Just because people play to win doesn't mean that they're fine with bad unfun metas.
>Why should blue be inherently faster then colors that actively increase your available mana
Because Blue is the reactionary color, meant to stop things before they cause trouble. It's why Remand, Mana Leak, and spell pierce are used as they're the best and cheapest.
>Why the hell should I sit there
Because that's how blue is, stopping stop prematurely, if you have a alternative of what else blue can do I'm all ears.
>Wanting to fill a deck with counters and somehow just win because of it.
Counters never win a game by themselves. Draw go control has actual threats you can deal with, like Delver and Snappy.

>>51934883
>>51934907
Not arguments

>>51932892
Weenie Hut Jr. is here guys

>>51934974
If blue is a reactionary color then it should always be one step behind clearing up all the threats until the enemy runs out of fuel. Holy shit you dont even understand your favorite color. Vapor snag is in blue but you need to draw 4 cards a turn and not allow your opponent to even play to stand a chance at winning, you're pathetic.

>>51934974
>the 5 colors each have strengths
All colours are made equal. Green and black are more equal than most.

>>51934910
it may drop $5 7-8 at the most.

The problem with reprints like modern masters is that it has a very limited run and prices are not determined by wotc but rather the cutthroat middleman that the overwhelming majority of people have to buy through.

With the average card value being very high like in this set with fetches and damnation set to rare this just causes shops to either charge more for boosters or crack them open themselves and sell singles. This leads to any efforts by wotc to make the game more financially accessible for people to have a much lesser effect. There isnt much that can be done to fix this without killing the brick and mortar stores that people use to play at.

So if you were looking at a deck that you want to build and are put off by its $900 pricetag rest assured that a reprint like this would only shave $50 or so off the cost if you are lucky.

>>51935170
>qq im a baby who cant adapt to the meta because I have brain problems

>>51934910
Moderately played cards drop a lot (daybreak coronet, fulminator mage, leyline of sanctity). Cards that see a lot of play drop a bit and then slowly recover (noble hierarch, goyf). In three months it will be around $30, then it'll increase in price again.

>>51935410
Except every pseudo-economist and their nan will be hoarding the everliving shit out of evey single Zendikar fetchland now.

>>51934910
Here you can see the price history of Noble Hierarch, another card printed at rare in MM15. It's at about $60 before being spoiled, drops to $50 in response, then slowly goes down to a low of $30 over the next year. It's back up at $60 now (though it sees more play now then it did then) so it's likely tarns won't stay low forever, but you'll have a decent window to buy at a lower price after MM17.

>>51935493
Forgot my link https://www.mtggoldfish.com/price/Conflux/Noble+Hierarch#paper

>>51934692

>Damn, if only decks could be more than 1 color.

They can and giving blue access to either Preordain or Ponder(but not both) would make it a better support colour. As opposed to green that literally gets access to any card with devoid thanks to lol Eldrazi.

>>51934758

Nobody argued about blue being faster, but the fact that blue isn't fast in Modern should allow them to get a few tools to help setup their slow early turns. Because lord knows there's a few non-blue decks in Modern right now that can kill you anywhere between turn 2-4.

>>51935300
It's QQ

>>51935503
I agree. I feel like people gloss over the power difference between preordain and ponder as if they're the same strength but preordain would definitely be fine.

>>51935493
>I got my playset of Nobles at $30-40
Feels good, man. Only up from here until MM19

>>51927075
t. assravaged retard who sinks too much money into a flimsy psuedo fiat currency whos value is determined by the whims of a medium sized company

reprints are strictly a good thing for the game

>>51935161
>>51935300
>Ad Hominem
Well I really don't know how to say what I meant, but blue is only supposed to "destroy things before they start" AKA counterspells. Vapor Snag is only temporarily and the only true removal is things like Pongify.

Card advantage is what Blue has which is supposed to counteract it's lack of aggressive things. Also yes, blue has to prevent it's opponent from doing stuff. That's how it wins and why Force of Will is a Peacekeeper in Legacy.

>>51935503
The problem with fast blue cards is Delver decks.

Once Delver has enough things to allow consistent tempo play, it becomes too hard to deal with (see DtT and Treasure Cruise)

>>51934910

Fetches are special cards for Modern players. They are the main entry barrier to the format because they are the cards that everybody needs to have and they are never getting banned. They are the closest thing to a sure bet, so logically they are one of the prime target for speculators. I suspect their prices are not going to drop much more than what they just did, and they will recover much more quickly. If I needed them, I would act fast after the whole set is spoiled.

>>51935552
Pretty sure peacekeeper is the peacekeeper of legacy

>>51935503
If they're set up by turn 3, then they are fast. Just accept the slowest color sucks and git gud holy shit. The problem isnt the game its you.

>>51935579
I meant something that prevents degeneracy from getting out of hand.

Did anon ever post his Whir of Invention Tezzerator list?

>>51935575
Gee whiz it's almost like Delver itself was a horrendous mistake in design.

>>51935575

Delver sucks in Modern without cheap "free" spells to protect it like Daze/Force etc. compared to its legacy counterparts. Especially when a deck can vomit out their entire hand or has too many threats that your 3/2 flyer just isn't cutting it.

>>51935617
Sounds like hot trash desu.

>>51935617
Some anon posted a Whir list a couple days ago

>>51935639
t. wasn't around when Treasure Cruise was legal in Modern

>>51935670
>Naya Burn splashing blue for Cruise
Healthy format right there.

is 350 for a playset of misty and tarn pretty good, or should i wait a month or two?

>>51935543
I got muy playset of hierarchs at 2,5 USD each, and sold em at 60 each.
I love price spikes

>>51935639
Almost like Delver isn't the only threat in the deck

>>51935670
It wasn't the delver that was broken in that deck. It was the cruises.

>>51935581

The decks that kill you on turn 3 aren't even playing blue most of the time. So clearly being able to find the threat to answer it should not be a problem if you have time to set up.

>>51935670

Mate it wasn't Delver that broke the deck. Cruise broke every deck in a format with fast easy splashable mana with fetches.

>>51935923
But the point is when strong blue cards exist delver becomes the top deck. People didn't just shove delve cards into the core of BGx decks and suddenly have the best deck. Other colors don't just have inherently better cards than blue, blue is just lacking a few cards in needs in modern. Mostly win conditions imo.

>>51936003

Of all the non-rotating formats, Modern plays the most removal and hand disruption and there are an absurd number of ways to answer Delver in the format, it also lacks access to Brainstorm to setup the flip easy. Legacy plays more counterspells than anything(for the most part) and Vintage plays the least amount of removal(slowly increasing) but the most amount of artifact related cards.

>>51936056
But despite this, when blue cards were strong delver was the best deck.

>>51936169
Cruise was fucking ridiculous. Not just a strong blue card.
Name another time Delver was dominant

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>>51933711
I tried this on cockatrice for a second, it was hot garbage

>>51936265
Nobody expected otherwise

>>51935748
That's reasonable, but yeah in a month I think you could do better.

>>51935748
I would wait for a bit, the prices usually go down during spoiler season
I would start snapping them off when mistys get to 30 and tarns get to 45

>>51936325
>>51936443
Cool, thanks for the feedback guys.

>>51934472
>If you cast 4 ancient stirrings
Wew

>comparing it to blue cantrips
read the other posts itt dipshit.
>fetchlands
Only deck that runs them is Bant eldrazi, Tron runs pseudo fetches with stuff like sylvan scrying and map but that's it. Lantern doesn't run any shuffle effects early game unless you count gq yourself or extracting yourself.

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And now that we finally get some fucking good reprints, the community will find out why making a reprint set 10 dollars MSRP with an extremely limited run is a very bad idea.

>>51936985
>Limited print run
Interesting

>>51936985
The original modern masters had MSRP way lower than the expected value of a pack and it was still way better than MM15 with its garbage value.

>>51936985
enemy fetches will be even more expensive than they are now in a year. calling it

>>51937214
Noble went back to $60 like 4 months after MM2, so it'll be even less than that.

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Rudy's are the type of people that's fucking this game over. Cards are meant to be played, not hoarded by storage units. It's a fucking game, not a retirement plan.

>>51937337
You do not know what you're talking about.

>>51937337
Fuck off, I watched wolf of wall street and I don't have enough money to do stock stuff so I do it with a game I like. Nothing you do can stop me either poorfag

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NOW THIS IS PODRACING

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1QTCSoI5zc

>>51937559
>I watched wolf of wall street
Do whatever fuck you want with your money - just don't pretend you know what you're doing.

>>51937337
>fucking this game over
Do something about it. Who the fuck are you to tell someone what to do with their money? Oh right, you're the guy that believes a company like WotC, backed by Hasbro can be fucked over by game shop owners...

what's some of the jankest jank for like 30-50 bucks?
I was looking at Coalition Victory but I can't seem to make it happen for the budget and now i'm all out of ideas

>>51937885
>>51937885
Just register 60 basic lands and relish in the look on your opponents face when you never play a single spell and complain about flood

What would be the fairest way to nerf top tier decks like affinity and Jund without ruining them?

>>51937934
Print good cards for other archetypes

>>51937960
This!!!

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>>51937237
Huh? I got a second playset for $160 last Spring.

Anyway, I hope fetches dip a bit. I definitely need more.

>>51937934
>Nerf Jund
Why tho?

>>51932892
>TFW merfolk player
>Spreading seas their tower
It always feels good

>>51937934
Jund already had nerfs and affinity is perpetually kept in check by sideboards. If you want to give other archetypes a boost do like
>>51937960
says instead of needlessly banning things.

Banning should be a last resort because all it serves to do is fuck people who can't make a deck on a whim and alienate them from the game.

>every single MM or EM spoiler season ever
>*first few cards released*
>"WOW THIS IS THE ONE WIZARDS HAS TRUELY OUTDONE THEMSELVES MODERN WILL NOW ONLY COST A FEW DOLLARS FOR A TIER ONE DECK ITS HAPPENING GUYS"
>*later*
>bunch of shitty filler cards + ultra limited print run + secondary market shenanigans
>cards cost barely cheaper
>all these people are salty

GUYS IM SO HYPED FOR MM2017 WOTC FINALLY LISTENED TO THE PEOPLE!!!!!!

>>51938166
This

>>51938224

New thread boyos

>>51938191
WotC is for the people™ don't you dare say otherwise when they make amazing product like mm2015™ and the soon to be mm2017™

>>51937237

>4 months

Try a whole year. I don't know where you got 4 months from.