Legacy General

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Ive been playing an old as shit BG list on xmage and it been super fun. Ive herd it called eva green and suicide black. It runs hypnotic specters and snuff outs, as well as that one demon with delve. I'm surprised how good of a threat specter is, people are always gunning to counter/remove it if they can.

>>51888787
I've gone to 3 events in the last couple months.

All I've seen is Shardless BUG, BUG Delver, BUG TNN, Miracles, Death & Taxes, Reanimator, Sneak, Elves, 12-post, ANT, and Turbo Depths.

Has anyone ever read the entire OP?
Also reanimator is the GOAT combo deck.

>>51890352
Op list is a bit old. Was probably made before r/b reanimator was a thing, or relevant. Although, has RB ever been the deck before? Or had theblue been more important than raw speed until now?

>>51890463
Are you telling me UB reanimator isn't the premier reanimator now?

>>51890526
At least locally the only version that gets played is RB. People like it better for the speed. And they are legacy vets that could easily build UB if they wanted. I haven't seen anyone play UB for years.

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I could go play tonight, but i dont think i want to. Id have to go to the rich neighborhood, and loose to snobs.....The laugh at 12post(except the one miracles guy) and see burn as baby's first legacy deck. I dont want to drive up there just to be around assholes.

>>51888787

What is everyone playing? I'm on a spirit heavy stoneblade list right now. Spell Queller is so goddamn good.

>>51892260
Ive been running green 12post for the last while with burn as a backup. I like stomping all over miracles. It fun, but also sucks cause its a bitof an uphill battle vs almost every other relevant deck.

>>51888787
Fringe decks eh? I recently played against a guy (who crushed me) with a RUG Delver deck, but Sans Delver. Just ran 3 TNN and 4 nimble mongoose. "Why?" I asked. He responded with "Delver sucks ass it does to removal" he had a fair point I didn't manage to kill a single one of his creatures

Currently I am playing False Cure and the deck may not be that good (though positioned well against Miracles because of free spells and mainboard Reverent Silence) but it's perpetually a blast to play.
I wish there was a modernized False Cure but there is no way that they'll reprint the precise wording that lets False Cure do what it does.

I play a lot against DnT, UR delver, a little Miracles, TES, cleric tribal, old school Pox and some maverick variant that looks like a pile but will eat you alive. Also Werewolf Stompy which is a super dumb deck.

>>51892926
Mongoose used to be a bit of a powerhouse. Had a very similar build to delver decks. I mean if you really think about it, the creatures in delver decks could be easily substituted. Most of them are just value, delver is good just cause its fast and flys over stuff.

>>51892988
Cleric tribal in legacy? Iv'e herd a tiny bit about werewolf stomp before, it used imperial recruiter and huntsmaster. But it seemed more like a jund or nicfit splash from what I saw though.

>>51893038
Yeah, Daru Spiritualist combo. Runs Thoughtsieze, Duress, Fatal Push and s2p.
Wins off infinite life or infinite damage.

It's not very good, but it's good fun to play some lower tier games against. Still powerful and consistent enough to win games against high tier legacy decks, but just not quite good enough to play with the big boys all day. Much like The Cure in that respect.

This Werewolf Stompy is a pretty standard Blood Moon/Trinisphere/Chalice prison deck with the 3 drop werewolf defender as the finisher. Plays about how you would expect, and about as weak to mulligans as other monored stompy variants.

>>51888882
May I see your decklist.

>>51892926
>Rug Delver-less Delver
So Canadian Threshold. Got it.

Haven't been able to go to locals for a while because work, which is also keeping me from going to the legacy classic on sunday qq

>>51893002
Yeah I realize that but it was so weird seeing a mongoose. It was really relevant to because if any of his 7 creatures were a Delver instead of a TNN or mongoose either would've won but I couldn't kill any of his creatures

>>51893860
Yeah I guess now that you say that it's what it was. The guy playing just described it was Delver sans delver

>>51890837
Burn and 12post are fine decks, fuck those guys.

Know how you feel though, the know-it-all-ism among people who have splurged for tier decks is obnoxious as hell.

Maybe just consider packing dedicated hate against that meta instead of trying to make a 'generally' good build. You'll have better odds at winning, and if they complain tell them they're free to build different decks if they like.
There's no shame in tuning against a local meta. Eidolon of the Great Revel and Scab-Clan Berserker against Storm (heck plenty of people even main that shit to hate better) or some kind of heavy stacks effects to fuck with Miracles as 12post, who knows.

If you enjoy playing Burn and 12post, then just keep practicing and have variant lists tuned for both local/wider metas.
Don't let snobs get to you, they're everywhere.
I live in a poorfag area and it's full of snobs too. (They shell out for the tier deck they expect to win for them, and sell it for the next fotm tier deck if they have to. You'll find it really is a common behavior.)

TL;DR: Play what you like, proxy and then shell out later for stuff you can't afford yet, and work to gain percentages with tight play.
So long as you grow and have fun in your gameplay, it's worth it <3

Is it just me or would anyone else like to see some more tribal in legacy? I mean we have goblins, Merfolk and elves and [insert creature type] stompy, but I'd love to see some more tribes get enough love to become atleast tier 2 decks in legacy

>>51895550
>Casualfag detected

>>51895550

I've heard good things about Soldier Tribal, personally.

>>51897760
>I've heard good things about Soldier Tribal, personally.

Aka stompy aka abuse sol lands plus chalice plus whatever undercosted creatures wizards prints nowadays

>>51897732
Lost Legacy always looked interesting in pox to me. Be sure to tell us if it ends up being shit or not

>>51897760
I remember that to, I think it was at an eternal weekend thing. I mean they have their own goblin lackey. Their dudes are decent in terms of mana cost. I would see it being a thing.

>>51897760
I've had it come up before. As for most stompy decks, they'll smash you if you aren't prepared.

It's good to be back, thanks op

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>>51893614
I actually found this deck reading though old forums.
x3 bayu
x4 bloodstain mire
x4 dark ritual
x4 hynm to tounarc
x4 hypnotic specter
x4 nantuko shade
x3 seal of primordium
x4 polluted delta
x4 sinkhole
x4 snuffout
x6 swamp
x4 tarmogoyf
x4 thoughtseize
x4 tombstalker
x4 wasteland
SIDE: I just threw this togeather quick without really thinking. Didnt bother reading the fourm on the side.
x1 pithing needle
x4engineerd plague
x4 leyline of the void
x2 choke
x4 ashen rider
This is kinda what got me into wanting to build black pox. This deck kinda evolved into BG pox/loam pox. Shade if fun though. This deck eats though its hand quick, twards mid game, you dont really have anything to do, so you just sticm a shade and pump him with sick gains.

Mind Twist unban when?

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So what are your favorite cards that are amazing in lecagy, but total shit in other formats/non erstablished metas. pic related.

>>51900843
For me I guess it'd be terminus or EtA. Though I don't particularly love those cards

>>51900737
too slow
why bother

a better move will be a format with no bans, all cards allowed, loops == draw.

>>51901405
My buddie and I did that for a bit. Literally turn t: the format.

>>51888787
"when you gotta take a shit, run"
words to live by

>>51892988
Tainted Remedy?

>>51902873
Tainted Remedy doesn't allow the Kavu Predators to get HUGE. It's okay as False Cure number 5 but I don't run it because if my Predators aren't getting fat I don't really see the point.

>>51903123
No, not really.

So ive been playing pox in lew of 12 post and have been squeaking out a few more win in general. Its so slow and grindy. shits on eldrazi and delver, but has issue4 vs a lot of other things. Is there a non blue non combo deck that has fairly even matchups across the board thats not D&T?

>>51905482
Eldrazi

>>51905482
I'm sure you take some stompy decks to good finishes if you try hard enough

>>51905482
Stompy decks are fine as others have said. Maverick is the typical non-blue midrange deck with pretty balanced matchups, nothing too extreme, although I think miracles is pretty bad. Then there is also jund, which gets shit on by combo but also slaughters small creature decks. 4c loam is probably the best if you are looking for a deck of this kind of style. It can grind pretty well and also lock out combo decks with chalice/teeg. There aren't any too terribly lopsided matchups

>>51890837
If you are losing with 12 post frequently there's something wrong with your deck or the way you play it.

>>51905482
Maverick already got mentioned, but Nic Fit is also decent, I'm not sure but I would imagine both decks got a new toy in Renegade Rallier.

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I'm still jamming on this.
Pic related, copter eldrazi Stompy.

>>51908665
Also cut the wastes and put in a 3rd wasteland

>>51900843
his buddy Veteran Explorer is also pretty shitty

a friend of mine once asked to play, all I had was Nic Fit, and all he had was a Standard deck. He said he didn't mind if mine was a legacy deck.

This dood is dropping Atarka's and shit on me with all the basics he's pulling, biggest thing I have is a Grave Titan, and only one. It was shameful.

>>51909225
Yeah I love the contrast between legacy and standard some times. I have countertop active but I can't counter anything because they're all 5 and 7 mana spells

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>>51888787

>be fish player
>keep Misdirection in SB
>tfw T2 Misdirect Hymn

>>51910146
A bit off topic but I remember someone wanting to show off his old extended affinity deck and picked me and my jank-ass standard deck as the dude to do it against.

Turns out Cranial Plating-based affinity runs into issues when your opponent gets a turn 2 Doran and knows to hold crib swap for your ravagers. The salt was ungodly.

does anyone else like running legacy affinity?

I love artifact land based explosive plays and all-in blowouts. I also like how full artifact land affinity is more comfortable going for the long game.

On a similar topic, is anyone playing Legacy Twin these days?

>>51912238
I get my explosive artifact kicks with Tezzerator, but I can see why affinity would be fun.

I've played vs a few Twin decks, it didn't seem very good though. I did end up learning something from the matchup though and I'm testing 1-2 Izzet Charm mainboard, it's pretty versatile and looting is great when you have Sword of the Meek to pitch.

>>51912303
I just found I had nearly all the pieces for affinity lying around. Much of them are straight 1-1 modern to legacy. Been having a real good time losing terribly but winning game 1. In my meta it's probably very poorly positioned, with people playing artifact hate because of Stompy variants but it's still good fun.
Twin seems fine, but it also feels like counterbalance + top is a better combo, ya know?

>>51908499
Well most of what I end up playing against is delver, DnT, renimator and Storm. Delver and D&T are evenish....reanimator is a blow out, as is storm most of the time. Occasionally their will be a lands and thats just god awful.

>>51888787
Is omnitell really this unpopular? I'm one of two omnitell players at my LGS.

>Question for the thread
You are playing against miracles, on the draw in game 3. They lead with tundra and pass to you.

What 8 card hand+draw do you dream of having from your current deck?

>>51913898
Two chancellors in opener, lotus petal, land, dark ritual, seize, entomb, exhume

>>51913898
FoW, Top, Counter balance, strand, strand, brainstorm , surgical extraction, ponder

>>51913898
Just about anything with cloudposts I guess. Maybe a needle to name top or somthing?
cloudpost,cloudpost, forest, expedition, forest, prime time, and maybe another prime time/land/greensun. So long as I dont open like shit, its pretty much a free win for me.

>>51913898
LED LED land, breakthrough, faithless, ggt ggt cabal therapy

>>51913898
Swamp, ritual, ritual, doomsday, LED, probe, duress, duress

Hi fa/tg/uys. Long time Casual/Standard player. I'm sick of the speed at which sets rotate, the rapid decay of card value, and overall, the game has been getting stale for me.

I'm considering building Charbelcher since it's one of the cheapest Legacy decks. Is it worth the time/money? Is a set of Lion's Eye Diamonds worth the investment? Are there other Legacy decks I could build easily with a set of LEDs? Worth it or nah?

Pic related

>>51915396
Greetings standardbro

Charbelcher is one of the cheapest decks but it does fold to any dedicated hate. Still fun though.

As far as LED is concerned, it's used in pretty much any combo deck in the format - all manners or storm, dredge, and I think reanimator plays it as well.

If you're willing to go into legacy and eventually move to other similar decks, LEDs are worth the $500 investment.

>>51915561
>and I think reanimator plays it as well
Nope.

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>>51915396

If you're interested in playing combo decks, a set of LED's is a must. They'll allow you to build out ANT, TES, Doomsday, or various Painter builds later. They're reserve list, so barring unprecedented shenanigans, they're not going to be reprinted any time soon. You can get by without original dual lands in a storm deck, but there's no replacing LED's effect.

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>>51915396

Forgot image.

>>51915561
>>51915611

Thanks for the input.

>>51915561
>dedicated hate

Could you be more specific? Are there more common decks that shut it down pre-sideboard?

I'm not familiar with the popular decks or any sort of meta I might run into.

>>51915803
PIthing Needle/Null Rod for Charbelcher, cheap permission, sweepers for goblin tokens.

>>51915803

The most common is Force of Will on Charbelcher or, if they're smart, the last ritual that lets you get to 4 mana. It is a reality of playing the deck that you often cannot beat FoW.

>>51915856
Quite a few combo decks are like this.

>>51915834
>>51915856

Does Burning Wish for either Shattering Spree or Red Elemental Blast in the SB not help my odds much in these matchups?

Honestly, the robust Wish package is what lead me to believe that this is a somewhat resilient combo deck.

>>51916019

Burning Wish helps, but the deck often doesn't have the extra mana to be able to Wish for protection and then cast a win condition. Burning Wish should usually get FoW'd as well.

>>51915996
That's true, but Belcher is the least likely to be able to rebuild afterwards.

>>51916118
I'm not contesting that Belcher isn't a tier 1 deck, but in my research, I've seen it bounce back from hate, albeit anecdotally.

Footage from a 2013 Legacy Tourney:
https://youtu.be/QLK4UYqk8s0

(In case you don't want to listen to Patrick Chapin's cringey commentary):
>Game 1
>Belcher destroyed
>Bounce back from no hand and no Belcher
>Build up 7 mana
>Belcher 2 electric boogaloo
>Flip deck for game.

Granted, Perry doesn't have to play around counterspells in this match.

From a guy who grew up with Mana Leak and Rune Snag: How shitty is playing against/around things like FoW and CounterTop?

>>51916393
>How shitty is playing against/around things like FoW and CounterTop?
You can't (in game 1 at least) so you don't. You can once in a blue moon go off after t2 counterbalance if your starting ritual costs 2 and your opponent doesn't flip accordingly.

>>51916393

That was an impressive game, but if his opponent had been on a deck with counterspells, I don't think he ever has a chance.

Belcher does best in a metagame full of non-blue fair decks. If that's what you're walking into, Belcher will do great.

>>51916393
Empty the Warrens goes a long way towards beating force of will decks. If they counter the wrong thing they just add to your storm count, and force can only hit 1 Empty copy. Even so, a lot of Belcher's sideboard space is dedicated to beating blue, which is telling. But the deck is fun and cheap and a good gateway to legacy.

reminder that the Legacy meta is extremely stagnated and even Modern is better for brews.

>>51916418
I play 12post and burn. Burn i dont really care, counter a burn spell, i have like 20 more down the pipe. Similarly with 12post aside from crop rotation. Crop rotation suck balls when you have it counterd, just cause you have to sac the land as part of the cost. But its just somthing that comes with the format. If they have it, they have it, if they dont they dont. I mean, if they are keeping 2 cards back in their hand and keeping mana back ect,ect you can try and get an idea off that.

I play with a few guys who run ~$700+ decks and I can beat them with my hexproof aura deck 40/60 of the time.

I want a cheapish deck that can beat these money decks and piss them off. AKA a denial deck or super mill deck.

>>51917506
Painter decks look pretty saucy for super mill.

>>51916934
I'd rather have a healthy meta that hasn't shifted much in the past 10 months than have to shell out $1000 for a deck that won't be playable in 2 weeks.

>>51916934
Modern is better for brews because good cards in standad can be good in modern but in legacy the power level is too steep/ too niche

>>51913898
Swamp, Ritual, Entomb, Exhume, Unmask, Thoughtseize, Chancellor.

Unban Necropotence.

>>51916934
>Gitaxian Probe banned

>>51915996
The only combo decks that fold to force of will are the turn 1 gimmick decks like oops, belcher, and si. Almost all other combo decks have interaction/ways to play around it. Otherwise there wouldn't be any combo decks, because more than half the field has forces.

Not sure if this belongs in the modern threads or this one so if I'm breaking rules I apologize:

Am I correct in assuming Foundry Inspector's ability does not work with Prototype Portal's ability? Also how would something like Metalwork Colossus work with Portal's ability? Would the reduction in cost still apply? I've been toying with an old artifact deck and I was wondering about these two specific instances.
Note: this deck is for casual play only (and I really didn't want to make a 6th mtg thread..) so sorry again if I've ignored any banlists/rulings.

>>51920834
>>51916019

Force and Pals are generally terrible news for combo of every stripe—not just Poops and Charb—and there's not really any way around that pre-board.

With that said, it's infinitely more beatable than, say, hatebears. I've fought through countermagic with Belcher, AnT, All Spells, and (today) Reanimator. It's not a universal knockout. Breaking through takes practice and luck, though.

Speaking of Reanimator, 3–1 today on my maiden voyage with the deck. Even after having to throw my sideboard together this morning because I had a power outage in the midst of my tinkering last night. 10/10; will play again.

Standard Guy, LEDs are definitely worth it. I started playing Legacy on Oops, and getting the sideboard LEDs was my first step to Belcher, Dredge, Storm (both kinds), and Reanimator. I haven't looked back.

>>51921760
Foundry Inspector does not reduce the cost of Prototype Portals activated ability, yes.

Prototype Portals ability will cost 11 to produce a titan. Metalwork Colossus' ability reduces the cost to CAST it but does not change the cmc.

>>51921760
>Prototype Portal and Foundry Inspector
You're correct in thinking that it doesn't reduce cost, this is because Portals ability is X, Tap: Cast for free. Portal only cares about the CMC of the card, so Colossus' cost reduction ability would also not apply. There's usually an Ask a Judge thread where gA answers questions, but this is as good a place to ask as any.
I would like to think Legacy players have above average understandings of the rules, but you wouldn't believe the number of times I've had to explain to my opponent why they can't cast Unmask for it's alt cost through a Trinisphere without paying.

>>51921760

Hello!

I'm no judge, but as far as I know, here's the deal:
—Prototype Portal checks "converted mana cost," not "what you pay to cast a spell." "CMC" is what's listed at the top right of a card, with the only variation being that spells with {X} in their costs have a CMC equal to X plus whatever else is part of the cost (e.g., Logic Knot for X=4 has CMC 6 while it's being cast, but CMC 2 when it's in your hand/graveyard/library). Note that tokens and cards with no listed mana cost (Living End) have CMC=0. So the {X} in Prototype Portal's ability doesn't change.
—Metalwork Colossus's cost takes both reductions (number of artifacts AND Foundry Inspector's reduction), but Colossus's cost can be reduced only to zero.

Anyone and everyone, correct me if I'm wrong!

>>51921760
>>51922071

Whoops! Misread your second question.

Tezzerator Guy and Anon beat me to it, but yeah, Portal's ability will still cost 11 for the Colossus regardless of the number of artifacts you control.

>>51922110
>>51922039
>>51921760
Thanks guys, I had a feeling that was the case for the colossus. I've seen the ask a judge threads before and was surprised one wasn't up for once.

Any ideas for fun stuff to do with prototype portal? The deck I have it in focuses on using splicers and unwinding clock/pristine talisman(with portal) to get a ton of mana/life. It's slow sometimes but nobody I play with really runs artifact destruction.

>>51922482
Try imprinting Spine of Ish Sah. Or Tangle Wire. Don't forget to activate portal and make a new copy of table wire or your upkeep before you resolve the tangle wire trigger(s). Then just keep making Tangle Wires. Forever.

>>51922700
Maybe throw an unwinding clock in there and make more tangle wires off turn.

>>51922482
Like anon said, you can't go wrong making stax artifacts. Unwinding Clock would be good, tap the artifact you made + another to untap Portal and go again.

>>51922700
Flash in a Shimmer Myr and then a black vise to get the pain train rolling.

>>51922700
Nice, I kinda like those two.
>>51922722
>>51922734
Already have unwinding clocks in there. As I said before the main thing I portal is pristine talisman and sometimes a couple of my golem creatures.

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>>51923017
Smokestack my son.

>>51923060
Dang that's nasty. 6 bucks for one though, seems like a lot.

>>51923060

I once watched someone win by landing Sundial of the Infinite and Smokestack, then just sitting back and skipping turns with a single counter on the Stack.

His opponent (a kid; I felt a little bad) just sat there for about ten turns with no permanents, discarding to hand-size every turn, until the spectators pointed out that things were going nowhere fast.

In short, if I were to play a prison deck, I think Stax would be the way forward. Fucking Eldrazi and their KNazis...

>>51923407
It's a modest investment but we'll worth it.

>>51908665
How is it? Notice any major differences from the typical list?

The days of a diverse legacy meta are over. I have made the perfect deck. Every deck will either be this 75 or will have 4 null rod and 4 stony silence. Prototype portal will be more expensive than Goyf within 24 hours.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/tangling-portal/

>>51924427
Now if I was sane I would hate this deck,I am however in love with deck and therefore insane

>>51924427
Umm...
What is the win con?

>>51926236
>http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/tangling-portal/
Clearly it's letting your opponent mill out whilst saving yourself with Ruins.

>>51926313
Oh, of course. Reasonable.

>>51926313
>Not discarding an Emrakul to handsize until you've played enough lands to hardcast Emmy and saccing ensanring bridge to Phyrexia's Core

Been trying this build out lately. Still on the fence. The mana is a bit wonky, but silence is really good against certain decks.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/ddft-feat-white/

>>51898964

>Turn 1: Dark Ritual, Hypnotic Specter.

Still a classic after all these years.

>>51890837
>smugness
They are asking for a dredge

>>51927034
>Orim's Chant
r u havin a giggle m8

>>51900843
cabal therapy is good in non-established metas, just bad blind.

>>51921902
>storm (both kinds)
>both kinds
Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition anymore.

Also whoever makes the next thread should put Turbo Depths in the OP list, probably in the uncommon section.

>>51928848
To be fair no one ever expected it.

>>51928495
No giggles here m8. Old school doomsday and TES lists ran Silence effects. I've been thinking they might have some merit again. Better combo matchup, stops miracles from floating flusterstorm on top, safer labman piles against decay decks, and they can be used proactively to stop sorcery speed threats, lockpieces, and disruption. It's a strong effect. But 1 extra mana on the combo turn and being solidly in 4 colors is a suprisingly steep cost, so it needs testing.

I've heard that over the past couple years, counterfeit reprint policy cards have become more and more common.

If I'm trading/buying singles from a private seller on MTGS or MOTL, how do I avoid buying a Chinese knockoff of a $100+ card?

>>51930978
There isn't really a good way that I know of if you're buying online. When you get them, check them out thoroughly and see if anything feels weird (they're really flimsy or really stiff, the print quality is terrible, stuff like that) and if they're weird, hopefully thereshe a good return policy.

>>51930978
You can ask for high-res scans before trading, and hope that they send you the card in the image, but there's no way to really prevent yourself from being sent fakes. You've probably gotta inspect the cards you receive, with a loupe if you're really serious and contact/report the seller if you get fakes.

>>51931173
The trading sites have official policies and what have you, but I'd ultimately have to file mail fraud and piss and moan over a refund via PayPal.

I guess I'll wing it and try the flashlight test. It's nothing super obvious like ABU duals or P9, just LEDs.

>>51928407

Prepare for the salt as they declare dredge to not be a real deck.

>>51928888

Agree with this. Turbo Depths has been more and more popular lately. I played against it at GP Louisville and a guy has been bringing it around to the shop locally.

We have a Doomsday player though, so my local meta certainly isn't an indicator of what's common.

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>>51931293
>Dredge is not a real deck
Said by someone who's just asking for the gas chamber.

>>51931831

It's the common opinion of people who can't handle losing to Dredge

>>51931323
This sounds suspiciously like the meta that I'm a doomsday player in. You're not from New Hampshire, are you?

>>51932192

No, I'm from Dallas, Texas. I was wondering if you might be our DD player, but he's not on a silence build.

This is his list if you're curious:
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=14810&d=289195&f=LE

>>51932244
Oh ok, yeah he's one of the few to put up good results recently. My normal list is pretty similar to that. Just been messing around with the silences. Gotta settle on a list soon so I can practice for SCG Worcester.

>>51932477

He was testing Silence recently too, along with a spicy Terminus sideboard plan. Didn't like it at all, then went back to 2 AD main and 5-0'd a league. He's been playing that deck for at least 3 years now.

>>51932495
Yeah I think I'm leaning towards No on the silences. Ive found I do like karakas in the main though so I might play that over the 2nd abrupt decay. I also like 4 burning wishes main. But it's good to see someone else championing the deck. I've had some good luck with it but no SCG classic top 8's yet.

>>51932477
Hey famalam, you know if prereg for scg worcester is open yet?

>>51932718
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=SCG+Worcester+preregistration

>>51932870
I appreciate the help. I'm too busy to do that myself.

PS I know where u live m8

I'm a Noob but I want to make an Eldrazi deck, please send help.

>>51935152
If you want to build a competitive Eldrazi deck, get the pain out of the way and buy 2 City of Traitors and a playset of Ancient Tomb. From there, the rest of the deck pretty much builds itself.

4 Mimic
4 Thought-Knot
4 Reality Smasher
2 Endbringer
4 Reality Smasher

4 Chalice of the Void

4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Eye of Ugin
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth

That's an average start to a list right there, minus 19 flex slots that depend on play style. Some builds want 4 Mishra's Factory, while some opt for extra 2 mana lands like a Crystal Vein.

>>51935369

Forgot to say that after the manabase, all of the creatures can be had for about $100.

And Cavern of Souls might be reprinted in MM17, so you might want to wait on those.

Hey guys, what do you think of this proxy rule for a non sanctioned lgs Legacy fnm?

if you have no proxies entry is 1 pack
if you have 4 proxies OR 100$ worth of proxies in your deck (whichever comes first) entry is 1 pack

If you have more than 4 proxies or more than 100$ worth of proxies in your deck buy an extra pack for each 4 cards that are proxies or for each 100$ of proxies that are in your deck.

the guy who runs our fnm decided on this rule, but also runs legacy elves and burn with no proxies

I don't know what to make of it.

>>51935648
>Non-sanctioned
How about
Any 12 proxies you want enjoy the fucking game?

>>51935648
70% of proxies will be lands/list cards (they're EXPENSIVE 100+ each) 30% are random cards you forgot about (<20 each prolly).

Make of this what you will

>>51935648
Could do something like 10 proxies, plus 1 dollar extra for each proxy over 10

>>51935778
This.

>>51935765
>tfw went to a vintage event with my trusty dredge and proxied 4 baghdad and 1 bloodghast

>>51935648

This is way too convoluted and I can guarantee people will show up and be confused as hell. Every store I know of that runs proxy events has a set number of allowed proxies and the entry is the same for everyone. 15 seems to be the common number.

Not to mention, the goal of a proxy event should be to let people who don't have the cards try out the format and encourage them to build out their decks for real.

>>51935648
Just tell your friends to buy fakes and Play as if they were the real deal

>>51935648
Our LGS does it so entry is $5 plus a 25¢ fee per proxy. That jumps to 50¢ per proxy if it's an uncommon or common the store has in stock. (Force is 25¢ because the store doesn't have any of the uncommon ones, only the mythics)

It works pretty well at getting people to buy the cards they need when it's feasible.

Zoo wee mama lads, apparently a month is too long to go without playing real legacy. Just played a few games on MTGO and I punted just about every single one. I even managed to lose to mono-red goblins. I've been busy in february but it's time to get back at it.

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Holy shit this is unbelievable, are modern players really this autistic
>2 already sold

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>>51935152
wants "an eldrazi deck"
>>51935369
recommends not 12post
FOR SHAME!

>>51937438
No, but they probably can't into reading comprehension.

>>51939947

I said that's what he wanted if he was after a competitive deck. If not, by all means, 12Post it up.

>>51937438
the fucks even the point of 'repacks'? it seems like at that point your just buy the most shit packs you could possibly buy.
>>51935648
>>51935716
>>51935778
Why even have a set number of proxies at that point? Let people build what they want and just play the game.

>>51940037

The point of repacks is for idiots to feel like they're getting a deal.

>>51940037
repacks are usually a hella fun draft format because they're full of jank rares. This is just someone trying to con people.

>>51940059
I used to buy repacks of older sets to draft with bros, but I'd never buy repacks of MM.

opening hand
>chancellor of the tangle
>channel
>burst of speed
>mountain
>emrakul, aeons torn
>forest
>elvish piper

>>51940782

>Kitchen Table General

>>51897961

All righty, I'm back. Report went 2-2-1

1st Game: Lands
1st Round I get steamrolled because of Life from the Loam.
2nd Round I use Lost Legacy to strip away Life from the Loam and then again I hit Crop Rotation, but he just naturally top decks the Dark Depths/Thespian Stage he needs to win.

2nd Game: Punishing Jund
1st Round: Jund manages to punishing fire me to death after many, many, many turns.
2nd Round: I use Lost Legacy to strip out Punishing Fire, then Life From the Loam, but time is called before I can find one of my answers to kill him, so it ends in a tie.

3rd Game: Cephalid Breakfast
1st Round: Unable to construct his combo because I knock out the pieces, and I kill him.
2nd Round: Play Lost Legacy naming Cephalid Illusionist and he concedes.

4th Game: Deadguy Ale
1st Round: Outgrind him and beat him with Bitterblossom.
2nd Round: First-turn Leyline of Sanctity, Lost Legacy remains dead in my hand until I can use Ratchet Bomb to kill it, but by then I'm already too far behind and lose.
3rd Game: First-turn Leyline of Sanctity again, then 2nd-turn Abyssal Prosecutor, I just get rolled over.

5th Game: Merfolk
1st game: They kept a one-land hand because they had an Aether Vial, but I had a Pithing Needle in my opening hand, so they lost as I stripped away their hand and their land.
2nd game: Killed all of their creatures with Innocent Bloods, Fatal Pushes, and Snuff Outs and we both went into topdeck mode. Eventually I grinded out a victory with Nether Spirit and Mishra's Facotry.

So didn't get a chance to face against a combo deck like Ad Naseum, but I felt like it did its work against Lands and Punishing Jund, there just isn't a way for black to deal with a 20/20 indestructible made at the end of my turn at the moment, so I'm not sure exactly what adjustments to make from here. I'm considering running Lost Legacy mainboard at this point, as I was siding it for every matchup other than Merfolk.

>>51942258
Obviously you just needed to dismember it 4 times

>>51937438
>IZ K DEI REPRINT SUM FETCHIES AND DUUUUUUMBBNATIOOOOOONSSSS!!!!!!
-Proud memedernete while soiling himself from the mental stress

>>51942812
That's pretty much it, I almost jumped the gun and bought a box myself but, luckily I came to my senses and realized the only card I might actually need from the set is Lili (if she's reprinted) and I'd rather just buy her and draft the set instead

>>51942258
You could play diabolic edict for that pesky marit lage

So I'm thinking of doing high tide crossed with Takin Turns. Thoughts?

>>51937086

I totally lost the edge this winter. Getting iced in every other Sunday is really bad for one's Storming skills.

>>51945221
>>51942501

Chain of Vapor.

That card is hilarious against Lage and Germ tokens. Stranded Batterskulls are best Batterskulls.

>>51940037

There is some unholy fuckery on Ebay; I remember seeing a listing for "MODERN MASTERS BOOSTER BOX" for $50 a few years back. If you read the entire product description, at the bottom it pointed out that the deal was for an empty box.

>>51932244

Out of curiosity, where does Legacy even fire in DFW? I lived there until 2015 and couldn't find anything but Standard or the occasional Modern tourney.

>>51947496
>chain of vapor
Dosnt work so good in a mono black deck senpai

>>51947496
I beg to differ, the best Batterskulls are the ones Dack steals and sacs to Thopter Foundry or Transmute Artifact.

I'm fairly new to legacy, plz no hate. Here's my esper deathblade 'brew'.

4 deathrite shaman
4 stoneforge mystic
4 dark confidant
4 true name nemesis
1 vendillion clique
2 liliana of the veil
2 jace the mind sculptor
1 batterskull
1 umezawas jitte
1 sword of fire and ice
4 brainstorm
4 force of will
4 swords to plowshares
4 thoughtseize

22 lands
4 flooded strand
4 polluted delta
2 marsh flats
3 underground sea
3 tundra
1 scrubland
1 tropical island
1 karakas
1 tar pit
2 wasteland

First, I know the deck is 62 cards. What should I cut?
Is stoneblade without deathrite shaman and true name better than deathblade?
Is dark confidant a mistake with jace, batterskull and force of will?
Should confidants just be another blue card?
How good is sword of feast and famine?
Do liliana and jace belong?
Should I be bant or junk instead of esper?

>>51950121
I think that the Confidants are probably unneeded, maybe cut all 4 and put in 2 Hymn to Tourachs.

>>51950121
Yeah drop the 4 confidante and add either hymn, IoK, or ponder

>>51950228
>>51950458
I was thinking Spell Pierce. Hymn might be better but is BB too greedy?

>>51950539
>I first read BB as Bitterblossom
You've got a playset of DRS and 8 fetches, you should be fine.

>>51947496

In 2015, it was pretty much only Madness in Plano on Saturdays. Nowadays we have three reliable weeklies. Madness, Boardwalk Games in Addison, and Common Ground Games near downtown.

The scene is middling, with 10-20 players on average for each of those. We've lost a few recently due to various causes.

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/575744#paper

Is this deck shit? I play traditional jund in modern and this seems cool.

Am I better off playing a punishing fire jund list?

My starting list would be this one. http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/channel-mengucci-legacy-jund-2/

Is this shit? the deck, not the shitalian

What do you guys think is the optimal build for High Tide? Any sweet sideboard suggestions? I don't really have a defined meta.

>>51952534
I'm not sure what the optimal build is, but I have to wonder if Mystic Remora is playable in it, maybe even maindeck. For the most part the first couple of turns are mostly cantripping and sculpting so paying some cumulative upkeep might not be so bad.

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>>51952142

>http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/channel-mengucci-legacy-jund-2/
>R1: The Drills

Has anyone here used deckbox.org to trade cards? Have any luck, or did it screw you over?

>>51954567
I think a lot of people on here are really cautious about trading things like Duals and other expensive cards online

>>51888787
You removed oops... put it back!

>>51956396
Oops, he made a mistake

Bump. Anyone going to the tj''s titanium series in Worcester this weekend? I might go Sunday to play the legacy event.

So after putting 2 walking ballista in my sideboard, I'm LOVING THIS CARD! Anyone else experimenting with the newer cards?

>>51960706
I'd imagine when you can make it huge really earlier on it becomes a work horse

>>51960738
Yeah, for sure. Delver and fish are rather prominent in my area. Not like 12 post needs any help against them anyways, but after sideboard the ballista just picks them off soo hard and works in tandem with ugin as well. I'm having some fun with it!

>>51952142
I think that really depends on what kind of meta you will be playing in. Jund/Junk midrange is definitely a deck I would bring to abuse a certain metagame, I would never take a deck with such weak combo matchups to a big event blind. However if you know you will be playing against a lot of small creature decks, it is a great choice. That being said, I think the lopsidedness of jund's matchups is exaggerated. Delver is certainly not an auto-win, and combo is not necessarily and auto-lose if you have the right hand. Ultimately it's up to you, if you enjoy that style of deck and are willing to take your losses to fast combo then go for it. If you want something of a similar style but more balanced matchups, there is always shardless or the more recent bug true-name/leovold lists.

>>51952534
1.become a cat-tranny commie
2. Grind (read lose) star city of david tourneys
3. Get you collection redistributed
And that is all there is about high tide

ddft guy: you're at 4 post doomsday, 3 tapped black lands, an untapped volc, trop and island; top in play; in hand you have: top, decay, wish. Stormcount is 2 after doomsday resolves. they've got 4 damage on board and they're at 19.

Is there a pile that wins that turn? I don't think I can pack enough LEDs into a pile for a double doomsday. The best I could think of wins the next turn: [IU/LED/LED/BW/BW]: tap top, IU (3), top (4), LED LED (5+6), tap top -- crack led for BBBRRR, Wish (7), drils for 16, pass, wish (1), drils for 4.

I feel like there's a labman pile that I'm just fucking forgetting

>>51961171
holy shit never mind it's so simple. I didn't mention i had a fetch pre-doomsday that I originally cracked for mana. I should have just kept it uncracked, built this pile: [IU/LED/GP/LabMan/Land]. Then I just go: tap top, IU, LED, crack fetch, play top, probe -- crack LED for UUU, labman, tap top.

>>51961276
Nigga, speak English!

>>51961171
Wouldn't DD for LED, LED, Petal, Git Probe, Labman be good?
After DD you draw with top, play LED, cast BW, crack LED. Cast Cruel Bargain/Infernal Contract. Draw Top, Led, Petal, Probe, go to 2. Play Top, play LED, play Petal. Git Probe, response crack LED, play Labman and then tap top.

>>51961171
Alright, this pile works ASSUMING:
1. They only have four damage in creatures
2. They don't have removal
3. Their creatures aren't four 1/1 goblins
4. Their creatures aren't Delver, TNN or anything else that has evasion
5. Their stuff can't be dealt with by putting a black source on top and decaying something to survive another turn

So basically if you played a land this turn or they're hitting you with a nimble mongoose or something, I'm the man for you. Ask questions with little detail and I'll write a paragraph.

The pile:
From the top, Lab Man, Ideas Unbound, LED, LED, Doomsday.

Tap your top in play, drawing Lab Man. Play him. He's on chump blocking duty.

Next turn. Draw top, play it (1) with a black source. Tap it for your IU, which you cast using Island and Trop (2), drawing you Top, LED, LED. Play your LEDs (3&4), then play both of your tops with your last two black sources (5&6). Crack those LED's (discarding that important Wish), one for black, one for blue, then, with BBBUUU in your pool and a Volc untapped, pop a top and draw your doomsday. Cast this with your black (7), making the pile IU, LED, LED, BW, X. Use your remaining top to draw IU, cast it (8) with floating blue, drawing Top, LED, LED, play the Top with your last floating (9), play LEDs (10&11), use them for BBBRRR, flip that top over to draw your Wish, and send them into the shadow realm with a storm count of 13.

>>51961171
>>51961171
What up dog, early morning tired ddft guy here. All manner of normal pass-the-turn piles work if decay can kill one of their creatures and buy you a turn. This >>51962825 pass-turn pile is unnecessarily risky and convoluted, as is the one you came up with, but you realized that. Your pile seems perfectly fine, and one of the rare instances where cracking a fetchland after doomsday is a functional line. Incidentally I don't think I've ever done that, because in this situation I'd go with >>51961777 this pile, or just kill with storm. [Led, led,led, petal, wish] kills them. Cast the top in hand, tap for led, cast it, wish for contract. If I miscounted mana or storm, you can make the 2nd or 3rd led a rain of filth and jack your storm count up by cycling tops. Storm don't die to removal. And all the piles die to bolt anyway

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Noob question: Can shocks be used as a "viable" budget option to duals?
will i be laughed at?

>>51963461
depends on the deck really, for example fair decks
will have a lot tougher time with shocks, because the game will tend to last longer and the life will end up mattering more often. Decks that use their life as a resource will also be affected by them, like reanimator.

>>51963163

Yeah I think i got tunnel-vision and wrote off some lines of play entirely (IC, etc). Labman was fairly safe here since they had a volcanic untapped in a deck that only runs swords, and didn't counter DD i assumed i was in the clear. Learned a lot of shit from this though, so that's cool.

>>51963461
I mean, they function while you're getting the real duals. But the lifeloss will lose you some games until then. See if people are ok with letting you proxy them in friendly games.

>>51963523
A big benefit of the wish->contract line is that you don't get btfo by red blast, which an open volc could signal. You'd also have plenty of mana if you untapped, so if you though your decay would let you survive the turn, you could build a lab man pile with discard if you thought they were trying to be cute and not counter dday. Pile [duress, iu, led, probe, labman], and after dday cast the top in hand and decay a dude. I think that's riskier on the whole than just trying to win, but it let's you beat a counterspell and a removal spell.

>>51963720
>>51963523
Oh wait fuck you don't have black mana to decay with after doomsday. So you have to try to win. Too early for me I guess. Ignore what I said.

>>51963163
>implying blocking with lab man isn't doing god's work

>>51963461
Most decks can't go with it. Maybe ad nauseam could, but it weakens the combo quite a bit. It's just that cards like daze and wasteland fuck you up so hard if you constantly take 3dmg hits from them.

So notable reprints confirmed in Modern Masters 2017:
>Enemy fetches
>Liliana
>Abrupt Decay
>Path to exile
>Inquisition of Kozilek
>Craterhoof
>Snapcaster
>Entreat the angels

>Magma get as common
>More sac engines
>Burning tree emissary
Who here /pauper/?

>>51963461
>Is burn/fast aggro common in your meta
You'll be laughed
>Does your deck use adnauseam or daze?
You'll be laughed


General rule is this.

>>51964705
Ad Nauseam suffers from it more, than say Miracles since it basically gives you a -2 cards during ANT(could be more).

>>51966611
One time I played against a rug delver deck with shocklands on mtgo. It was so bad. I still lost, because variance is a bitch sometimes. It tilted me so hard I quit and didn't play any more mtgo that night.

Hello, I apologize for my ignorance.

I want to do two things.

1. Catalog my cards by scanning them under a smartphone app to add them to a database.

2. Order proxies of some cards I already own, I would be playing with some of them unsleeved so they would need to be the right dimensions and feel mostly like a magic card. I have ~50 I would like to make

I would appreciate it very much if anyone could point me to any community trusted resources for these things.

Thank you.

>>51967216
PsyOps best Ops.

I want to start playing legacy, what is a cheap deck I can make and be somewhat competitive
I like white and red, can I make a good deck with only those colors?

>>51908665
>copter
lol why

>>51969336
Could do rw painter, dnt with a red splash, goblins, maybe a rw parfait if you like jank.

>>51969863
What about a white only deck?

>>51969893
DnT is the premier white deck, Parfait if you wanna durdle for 20 minutes.

>>51969935
You mean death and taxes right?, sounds good, how much money I will be spending for such deck, I have no cards
And thank you for the advice

>>51970357
I'm not too familiar with the current Dnt list, but the land base, especially Ports are kinda expensive. The creatures aren't too bad though.

>>51970655
I've seen some lists from MTGO that play Ghost Quarter instead of Port. Might be worth looking at for someone on a budget

>>51967235
Delver lens is great for scanning a collection. It also has a really nice export function. I used it to catalog my 3000 cards over 2 days

>>51971773
ghost quarter is underrated in legacy imo. Vs some decks its just as good as wasteland.

>>51973023
Vs some decks its better than wasteland. Eldrazi often plays no basics, and many of the 4c Leovold decks don't either. Strip mine is a good card.

>>51970357

You'll spend a lot, and none of the cards have any crossover value. If you want to play a deck in red or white with no crossover value but a significantly lower price, play Burn.

>>51973383
Thats not entirely true. Wastelands cross over into a ton of decks. As dose bolt for burn.

how shit is this <30$ land destruction deck?

4 Fire Diamond
4 Howling Mine
4 Iron Myr
4 Molten Rain
22 Mountain
4 Pillage
2 Price of Glory
4 Raze
2 Scorched Earth
4 Steam Vines
2 Stone Rain
4 Veteran Brawlers

Idea is to destroy their lands before they get to play anything and attack with Veteran Brawlers.
Iron Myr and Fire Diamond are due to Raze and Scorched Earth.

>>51975954
Give it a go on Xmage, cockatrice or what have you

>>51975954
Cut the howling mines. Giving your opponent free cards is bad.

>>51976321
idea was to draw me cards while my opponent is mana screwed
but i guess i dont need cards to destroy my opponents lands, if they have no lands.

>>51976968
also if they draw cards they'll draw some lands

>>51977089
yeah that's true for sure. I've never built for constructed formats so i'm probably missing a lot of things. I edited the deck but still kept it at 30 bucks, added lightning bolts, landslide, browbeat.
I like being able to refule and I think I could use some removal in case I miss on land destructions. Will try both editions and see how they go.
appreciate the feedback, i'm a noob at constructed (only play drafts)

Looks like someone is trying to buyout Carpet of Flowers. Does this see any play outside of EDH?

>>51978912
Some storm sideboards
Enchantress :^)

>>51977321
>browbeat
I don't want to start shit but Browbeat isn't a great card. Lets your opponent make the choice that is best for them, which is often the opposite of what you need it to be. You could try something like bedlam reveler. A threat and refuel. Although in your deck the cost might be a little high since you won't be filling the graveayard at a breakneck pace.

>>51963461
You can run a Stomping Ground in Belcher, but it has to be foil Russian.

>>51980506
Yeah honestly if you're on a budget belcher isn't a great choice. Russian foil stomping grounds are expensive. You're better off playing a taiga.

>>51975954
You could consider doing a cheapo mono black pox. You'd get sinkhole, smallpox, big pox for ld, but backed up with discard to give you a chance vs combo. And still have room for removal. Could probably keep it under $50

>>51980064
You're not starting shit! I'm trash at deckbuilding and don't know card pools and what's good&bad. I appreciate all input.
>>51982205
I'll look into it for ideas, thanks.

>>51984395
The denizens of this thread are generally pretty affable, until someone tries to defend Browbeat as a good card.

Anyone planning on going to GP Vegas? Would be pretty cool play with some fellow fa/tg/uys

>>51986309
I wish. A few of my teammates are. My next big tournament is SCG Worcester.

>>51973383
I dont like playing any other color other than those 2, maybe green sometimes

>>51898964
>>51927619

Dark Ritual is, easily, the second strongest of the 1 for 3s, and is only second because what the actual fuck Ancestral.

>>51988452
well you have to think back when those cards were printed, espically with ancestral. search/draw is only as powerful as what it can draw/grab. wtf are you gonna draw in alpha/beta a fucking rock hydra? Creatures were mostly dog shit back then compared to now. Its kinda funny how old cards are only broken because of new stuff.

>>51988042

Legacy Burn is usually mono-red.

2-2 tonight, rather disappointing.

>R1 vs. Food Chain Infinigriffin (2-0)
Game 1 my turn 1 duress after his turn 1 DRS sees Force, Brainstorm, Food Chain, and 2 lands. I realize what he's on and rip out the food chain, eventually set up a safe PiF kill (first infernal tutor for a second tutor, then tutor for PiF, he can't exile both with DRS)
Game 2 he lands a turn 3 food chain after having brainstormed, so I push with ad naus from 20 down to 5 (taking 3 hits against a one-outer to suicide) and finish the combo. He flips up Eternal Scourge and shows Walking Ballista in hand, ready to win the next turn.

>R2 vs 4-color Stoneblade (0-2)
Game 1 I mull to 5, he keeps a double wasteland hand and wins with jitte beats.
Game 2 I set up a possible ad naus chain but royally fuck up a brainstorm pile, preventing me from getting threshold for my cabal ritual. Two batterskull hits means I don't get a chance to recover.

>R3 vs Eldrazi (2-0)
Game 1 I duress out a chalice turn 1, play around his wasteland by fetching both my basics, and set up a natural tendrils for 8 after he ancient tombs himself to 16.
Game 2 he runs our turn 1 mimic turn 2 TKS, I hide infernal tutor with brainstorm hoping he leaves my LED alone in favor of ripping out abrupt decay. He does and I combo out next turn.

>R4 vs Esper Stoneblade (1-2)
Game 1 I set up a hand, he V cliques me in my draw step, but I have 8 cards in the yard for threshold cabal rit through DRS into draw step ad naus, drain myelf to 2 but make it impossible for clique to stop my combo.
Game 2 I run through half my deck unable to find a single ritual and get batterskull'd to death.
Game 3 He goes turn 1 Thoughtseize, turn 2 brainstorm into Thoughtseize, Turn 3 brainstorm into Thoughtseize. I manage to rebuild and Infernal tutor for Magus of the Will with LED to activate him, but he topdecks Liliana to kill magus and leave me with no outs.

I almost certainly boarded wrong for stoneblade, and it's getting more popular. Suggestions?

>>51992511
I don't think stoneblade should be that bad, and it seems like you got unlucky to some extent. They should give you a fair amount of time so you can set up safe kills. How is magus of the will working for you?

>>51995435
It's primarily in here for the sultai matchup (where he trades with leovold and keeps pace with TNN in a race) and miracles matchup (where he actually presents a respectable clock post-board)

I didn't board him in the first match, opting for 3 decay, 1 chain of vapor, 1 carpet, 1 flusterstorm and bayou. In the second match I brought in magus almost on a lark, and only 2 decay.

But yeah, turn 1 DRS is always rough.

>>51996021
What do you side out for all those decays? Also, how do you feel about the recent performing ANT lists with 1-2 decay maindeck?

>>51990749
Lotus channel fireball.

:)

>>51990749
More cards was always broken. Card Advantage is crucial to card games Sure you may get Rock Hydras not counting the channel fireball decks, but you have more rock hydras then the other people, and given you're playing blue, more counterspells and Mana leaks.

Fun fact: They originally thought the taplands that weren't painlands we're overpowered. MaRo's favorite duals are the shocks iirc.

is high tide still a thing?
if not what are some fun decks like high tide i could bring to a laid back proxy tourney
i dont really want to play sneak and show. i guess if there are storm variants like TES still id bring those

>>51992511
are you writing the course of your games down? how do you remember all this shit?

>>51996879
Plenty of storm variants still exist. If you have any idea what kind of meta game you're going into, high tide could be fine. It really just sucks so much dick vs miracles that it has become almost unplayable.

At the risk of reigniting a long-dead discussion, I've got a question for /LEG/.

Yesterday, I was hanging out at a (local?) game store doing some battles, and I was helping a friend resleeve his deck. I picked up a card, and it flexed waaaay more in my hand than I'd been expecting. Before even taking it out of the sleeve, I blurted out, "this card is absolutely a fake." When I'd first picked up the card, I'd had it by the corner; dragging it against the table as I picked it up was what tipped me off, because I'd never felt a card that was that flexible before.

Proceeded to pass the card around to 3-ish other players, all of whom felt the difference immediately. I started comparing with my own cards, and this is where things got interesting.

When I compared its flexion horizontally (long side to long side), it didn't feel appreciably different from my own cards, especially older ones that had been played presumably since '94. But when I flexed it vertically (top to bottom), it was significantly less rigid than my cards, other people's cards, and the store's cards (including ones from the same set).

Did a bend test. Pass, with less elasticity than I'd expected. Did a light test. Interior pattern looked identical to real cards. Color balance was a little off, but that's not a scientific way to test a card. But every person who touched the card (indeed, the playset) said that there was no way it was/they were real; one guy compared the flexion of the entire quad stack to a single card, and the entire stack deformed more easily than one real card.

The guy hadn't been trying to pass them off (clearly; it wasn't a card you'd forge yourself), and he was pretty upset that he'd bought fakes.

I really should've gotten some photos, but wasn't thinking of it at the time.

So what are some other techniques (in b4 the rip test) to determine a card's veracity? What's the most passable fake you've ever seen? Were we all wrong? If it helps, the card was a Mythic from RTR.

>>51997651
Which one?
It can get faulty printing/humidity m8, all cards in barcelona are bent for example

>>51997687

I'm a bit reluctant to say, but suffice it to say that it was an approx. $4 mythic. One of the things that was a surprise was that nobody would've thought it'd be a card someone would counterfeit.

Every test we did on it passed except the "feel" of the card and how it flexed. One of the people examining it said that it felt substantially thinner than a real card, as well.

>>51997753
>am RELUCTANT
B8 SPOTTED.

Thanks for the bumps larper

>>51992511

Not sure what your list looks like, but switching double-Petition to double-Past in Flames completely cleared up the matchup for me.

>>51997651
I don't think it's necessarily a fake. Old beat up cards are often more flexible, and I've had cards from different sets that I've opened out of boosters have small, of noticeable differences in flexibility. For example, i find that kaladesh block cards ate stiffer than khans block cards. There still are a lot of print quality issues with cards. If it passes the usual tests it's probably fine. Most fakes I've seen have visual differences. If you can't tell the difference visually and the card isn't measurably thicker or thinner than a pack fresh card, who cares?

>>51997853
I can anecdotally confirm this. I've plenty of cards that I know for a fact are real but vary quite heavily in terms of flexibility.

>>51997853
>>51998093

That's good to hear, I guess. For the record, though, I own actual copies of the card in question, and they don't feel the same at all.

>>51998434
I have a couple foil Griselbrands that look and feel very different. On has a high luster and normal flexibility, the other looks dark and muted, feels thicker, with a vertical bow. I've been assured they are both real by a couple vendors (neither of which sold them to me for what its worth). I can upload some pictures comparing the two a couple hours from now if you're interested.

All that said, I'm not trying to tell you not to be suspicious, rather, suggest that it may not be a clear indicator of a counterfeit.

>>51996083
Usually top, the 1-of preordain, some number of discard spells (duress first in this case). I haven't seen the lists playing MB decay but could see it.

>>51996888
iPhone voice recording. And writing down cards if they say no to recording.

>>51997822
I've been on 1 petition 1 PiF for a while now. Might try double PiF at some point though.

>>51998434

different print locations/runs probably. all of my fakes that are passable (actual printing press printed text, etc) fail the light test bc they core they use. afaik all the sellers of the good fakes get them from the same printer. Also they have a limited print list. the sellers that will print anything are very low quality and fail a visual test from 20 feet away.

Hey guys, has there been any huge updates to Elves recently? Getting back into Legacy after a almost year hiatus. Currently running GBr traditional Elves with Ruric in the main and Blood Moon in the side. Last I heard Chaos Elves was making a lot of headway.

>>51999244
I used a single mainboard reclamation sage and a single copy of shaman of the pack. They served me pretty well being able to tutor for them thru GSZ

>>52000191
I can confirm that mb Rec and Shaman are decent. Rec goes without saying and Shaman has blindsided me more than I'd like to admit when I think I'm safe behind a Bridge and Padeem protecting it. Whipflare has been good to me in the sideboard though, it wipes out a ton of stuff while leaving my thopters and strixes and only costs 2 mana to boot which is huge vs DnT.

>>52000191
>>52000467
I had been running MB Rec Sage and Scooze already. Nice to have answers against early locks. I never liked Shaman since Terminus still answers it. I learned about Leovold, who seems insane.

If you see a Pyrostatic Pillar wandering around please give it shelter, it's probably mine because I cannot find the darn thing.

I've been thinking of picking up a second deck. On 4c loam right now and while I love the deck a non grindy change of pace would be nice. I'm thinking elves or infect but cant make up my mind.

>>51997687
>>51997853
>>51998093
>>51998576
>>51999130

Thanks for the feedback, everybody. I know that printing variations are a real hard-on (esp. foils versus foils from different times, foils versus non-foils, newer cost-cut printings that are ass for all kinds of reasons, new Japanese cards versus everything else). I wouldn't have even brought it up if it weren't for the fact that everyone who held the cards agreed with me that they felt wrong; three out of three says a lot. I guess that's what I can't just overlook. I'm hoping the cards are real for my friend's sake, and I'm glad I told him to get a second (fourth?) opinion.

>>51996083

I tried mainboard anti-permanent cards myself, and I wasn't pleased. The times are a'changing, though, and I've started wondering whether the deck needs a refit. Just going by mtgtop8 results, it looks like Storm decks with mainboard anti-permanent cards are placing occasionally, but they're placing lower.

>>51998692

I've seen a lot of single-Pif/single-Petition decks get results lately. I don't know; I started playing Storm on double-Petition, single-Pif, then moved to single-Petition, double-PiF, and finally to only double-Pif.

I've felt like everything runs most smoothly on my current list, but I miss the speed of the original setup. It's noticeably faster, though Ad Nauseam's a lot harder to use.

All I can say is that I've had a much, much easier time with two copies of Past in Flames against Show and Tell, Stoneblade, Delvers, and Infect. Hatebear matchups are worse, though, even postboard (because G1 often goes to the Bears when they know what I'm playing).

>>52003309
On fakes, I went to the GP in Brisbane a few weeks back and someone offered my friend some fakes. He wasn't hiding the fact that they were and ever card had the word "PROXY" on the sleeve, but they were professional fakes. He bought a Volc for $3 and we had a good look at it. Comparing it to a card from the same set (revised), it did feel different, but I couldn't really say why, but the big giveaways were it completely failed the light test and under a loupe the black lines were crisp on the real card and very dotty on the fake. I didn't try bending it.

Anyone who's invested into this game, I really recommend you find yourself a fake and have a really good look at it. Make sure you don't get cucked when buying stuff.

>>51888787
>Sneak n Show
>Sneak n Breach

Which is more fun?

Dumb question from a Legacy newbie: What's a good/recommended X value for Chalice?

>>52006418
2 or 1 is nasty for most decks.

0's especially mean in Vintage.

>>52006540
Aight thanks

I've been checking out the Sneak lists because I'm a tool who likes cheating in huge creatures

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Make goblins great again!

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>ultra-richfag friend hosted a Legacy night
>mini-tourney he hosted with a friend
>he and lesser richfag brought their own decks
>me and the other 2 knew fuckall about the good decks in the format
>handed out decks for the tourney
>each sat down and gave a brief rundown to each player of their deck

>mfw the fucking decks in this format

I'm in love. I need to save and buy a goddamn deck.

>>52006329
I think Sneak Attack is more powerful than Through the Breach by virtue of being repeatable and having the ability to emulate the instant speed of Breach.

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>>52008298
TELL ME WHAT YOU PLAYED. NOW.

>>52008362
I played Sneaky Red. The one with Sneak Attack, Through the Breach and fuckoff huge creatures. The host knows I'm in love with red from our EDH games and basically shoved it in my face. I beat Loam/Pox, CharBelcher (that deck is cool as fuck) and UR Delver, lost to Jund Depths, Infect and Miracles.

Also god damn, sideboarding is a fucking art form. I have no idea what goes where.

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Does this Cool Guy have a place in Legacy?

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I went 11-5 at Vancouver GP a few weeks ago playing legacy side events with my home brew soldiers deck. I won every game against Miracles and in two games they only got to cast 0-1 spells. Actually played the same Miracle guy twice and he looked miserable when he sat down across from me, another Death&Taxes player got up after he lost, told me my deck was retarded and walked away.

I play 4 copies of rule 63 Jon Snow here, and the whole deck is close to max rarity. Just gota get the new invention Chrome Mox. Currently using foil unhinged for basics.

>>52003309
Honestly curious, how does the second Past in Flames help so much? Is it just being able to have a better chance to draw it, or do you actually need to use two copies?

Most of the time the way I end up winning is LED, double rit, tutor for PiF, cast it, double rit, tutor for drills, cast drills. That's 9 storm from that alone, any draw spell or second artifact makes it lethal from 20. The only reason I tutor for ad naus is if I need to play around graveyard hate.

To that end, I might try moving ad naus to the board for a single MB abrupt decay - in already playing a trop maindeck and a bayou side.

>>52009034
What kind of bait is this?

>>52011944
Sorry friend I was very much not sober when I posted that

>>52010750

Essentially, it just doubles your chances of drawing a copy. Sounds like it's not that big a thing, but it gives you all kinds of resilience against counterspells. The most basic example is that your opponent gets forked if you Tutor and sac LED, discarding Past in Flames. They can counter the tutor, but you can just keep going off. Alternatively, if they hold back a counterspell, just search up Duress.

If I think my opponent's bringing in graveyard hate (not optimal for them, but a lot of people do) I think it's probably better to cut the second Past in Flames for something else like Empty the Warrens.

>>52013543
>>52010750
While both of you are around I gotta ask, what's worse for storm, chalice on 1 or 0? I'm sure it's different for the different storm variants, but say your opponent goes Usea Ponder, Island Brainstorm and I think that puts them on storm, what do I chalice? If I know I'm vs storm usually I play it on 1 turn one if I can, but if I'm playing it turn 2-3 I put it on 0. My reasoning is that if I can cut off all of their hand sculpting it's better but after they've gotten to cast 1-3 Ponder/Preordain/Brainstorms I'm much more at risk of them going off and 0 is better to stop LED and Petal.

>>52013630

Chalice at 0 stops 8 cards; Chalice at 1 stops 19–21. So though it's possible to play around either one (possible, not probable, at least preboard), Chalice on 1 pretty much makes a third of the deck do nothing.

>>51888787
Is it possible to play legacy without the expensive original dual land?

>>52014199
isn't there free wins red and painter servant. Death and taxes. High tide. Pox, or I think it's loam pox now.

>>52014199
It definitely hurts your percentage by a bit, but you can probably get away with shocks and scars fastlands. It'll really start to hurt if you're bouncing shocks with Daze though. There are also monocolored decks that don't always need duals.
>>52014452
DnT doesn't need duals, but Ports, Karakas and Wastelands will add up.

>>52014483
shit, forgot about the mana denial part of Death and taxes.

>>52008298
That's pretty rad.

Opinions on Edge of Autumn in DDFT side for emergencies where I need a non-spell non-top draw? Also what's hot in the side vs delver?

>>52018003
Sounds like a waste of a slot to me. What situation would you ever need that in? As for delver matchups, depends a bit on what variety. I uually bring in an extra disruption spell, either the sideboard discardor a flusterstorm. Maybe xantid swarm if you have it, but delver with red will probably leave in bolts so xantid isn't as good. Against bug delver you probably need to have at least 1 or 2 decays to hit leovold.

>>52014199

The short answer is yes.

The long answer is that you'll probably have to shell out a fair bit if you're not interested in one or two specific decks. All Spells and Burn are super-cheap and don't require duals, and Dredge isn't too bad, though a bit more expensive. Death and Taxes doesn't need duals, but it needs a number of expensive cards, as >>52014483 pointed out. The same is true for Eldrazi, Pox, Imperial Painter, and High Tide.

If cost is your primary concern, Burn or All Spells is probably your best bet. There are other cheap decks (Cheeri0s, PSI), but they're not as stable as either or as fast as All Spells.

>>52014199
I just saw a SCG top 16 Elves list that was running a shock instead of a dual. It was still running two Bayous, but if the deck doesn't lean on it too hard a shock is probably fine.

>>52019835
There's an ANT list on mtgtop8 running shocks. It was in a ~40 person event though.

Is there anything similar to Grishoalbrand (Modern deck) in Legacy?

>>52021548

Closest I know of is Tin Fins.

>>52021775
I agree, tin fins is almost identical to grishoalbrand in terms of play style, but you get significant upgrades. That being said, does anybody know what kind of matchups the deck has? I was thinking of putting it together, but I was wondering why it wasn't that popular in the us, because I see it put up much better results in Japan for some reason.

>>52022401
>>52021775
How does this deck work?

>>52022968
Google exists my son..
Basically reanimator

>>52022968
tin fins gameplan is to reanimate griselbrand, hit them, mainphase two draw 14-21 cards and storm out to kill with tendrils

>>52025476
Some versions don't always have the tendrils kill. They just draw 14 and try to reanimate an emrakul and then attack with both.

So my buddy is making an infect deck.

What's the best way to counter him? I had used bogles to make him scream before and now I want to do it again.

>>52028083
Probably Delver/Canadian with Sudden Shock in the sideboard.

>>52009212

What tech were you using to protect yourself from combo, if you don't mind me asking?

>>52028466
Not him, but both Thalias are Soldiers, and Glowrider is probably also playable while not a soldier.

>>52028083

Pox. You're running at least 8 different "sacrifice creature" spells and they can do butt-all about it.

>>52014483
>>52018278
>>52019835
Thx for the answers only dual land i own is a revised badlands and i think only legacy goblins use it.

Bump. Made top 8 at tcg modern states. Playing legacy between rounds vs the noble bug deck. Seems like an OK matchup.

>>52031388
Bumpin. Scrubbed out of top 8 of modern states. Got to play a few matches of legacy hough, noble bug seems like a 50/50 match up or slightly better despite levold.

>>52028513
pox seems pretty expensive.

Is there any cheaper way to do this?

>>52032659
It depends on what you consider expensive. And weather or not you want to run cards like chains and nethervoid and tabernacle. The deck works and is significantly cheaper without. Might get a tad cheaper if the lilly reprint actually affects the price at all.

So I'm actually getting a good chunk of money from taxes. What should I prioritize picking up? Duals, LEDs, or enemy fetches?

>>52032659
fakes my friend. Seek out the china man

>>52033712
>>52032659
Ya know if china man is that stoneman guy dont bother unless you only want forces or like A set of duals. Almost everything else ive gotten from him has been garbage. And even the duals seem kinda shit. We are in a new age. Go for the german paper black cores my negro.

>>52033338
Duals first, then led, then fetches

>>52033774
>We are in a new age. Go for the german paper black cores my negro.
This is new, my china man's are pretty good. Some of them are shit, but even the worse ones are unnoticeable to the unskeptical eye

>>52034919
Most of my chinaman stuff has been kinda shit imo. Almost all of his print seem to light on the color, and on his artifacts the set symbol seems fucked. his forces were fine i guess. The duals just seem a bit to nice and finely printed. The words on duals are supposed to look all smudgy n shit right? The other guy is also inconsistent in terms of print quality, but his colors are way better.

>>52035206
I got mine the other day and the only problem are liliana of the veil's set symbol and a couple of colorless mana symbol's with numbers in it being off center. Overall the land quality is superb if not a little bit of darker color.

>>52035337
whats wrong with the symbol?

>>52028531

There are a few others. Rakdos Reanimator and TES use it universally, and a lot of related lists will often run one (I used to run one in AnT). I'm playing/tuning a Grix Reanimator list, and I'm running a singleton.

With that said, I'm running other duals, too.

>>52032659
>>52032730

There are a few workarounds to shelling out for Legends cards, but know that you'll be running below peak performance. There aren't any true replacements for Chains, Nether Void, or Tabernac.

I tried budget Pox for a bit, but it didn't go well. Bear in mind that an opponent who manages to stick two creatures is overwhelmingly likely to kill you if you don't run Nether Void or Ensnaring Bridge.

>>52033338

Depends on what you're looking to build and whether you're looking to make an investment. If you want to invest, prioritize reserved list cards (duals and LEDs). I'm happy with what I've got for the time being (seven duals and quad LED), so I'd probably go for the fetches. Maybe a third Underground Sea first.

>>52035402
can't post, but the coloration looks a little light, but in Oblivion stone the mana symbols in the rules text look too dark. Otherwise the cards are consistently good, except for some slightly dark slightly bright problems, but they aren't too noticable