Spear of War: Imperium Romanum Edition

>>51874095
>"Last of the Romans" campaign
Is it going to be any different from the other Last Romans campaigns?

>>51874095
Nth for butthurt Conquistadors players are the cancer destroying this game

>>51874156
In that this one will be reclaiming the Roman Empire instead of trying to defend it, yeah.

You get some all-new units that are a fusion of the previous Eastern Roman Empire units and the Byzantine Empire units from SoW: Medieval.

>>51874182
More like the Aztecfags, you mean. On a more serious note, from the last thread I asked some very nice Anons what faction I should choose for the Medieval edition (since I mostly plat Bronze and Iron edition), and I've gone with the Kievan Rus faction. So thank you anons for helping me. Now I've got my beautiful Minoan army for Bronze, my newly updated Saxon for Iron (using the migration codex) I'm coming for you Romano-Briton lovers, get ready to be SAXONED! and now I'm going to get my new Kievan Rus army. Also, I do play the Ottoman empire every now and then, and I have one thing to say. FUCKING WINGED HUSSARS!!!! FUCKING SABATON!!!!! REEEEEEEE!!!!!!!! I STILL HAVE THAT SONG STUCK IN MY HEAD!!!!!!!!

>>51874095
>Imperium Romanum Edition
Fuck that, this is Homebrew edition.
I'm thinking bolt action style turns with the command dice order system with blocks of infantry like in WHFB.
The aztec-conquistador pseudo-shitposting kept going on about a Constitution stat, so I say we go the whole hog and make STR (strenght) DEX (how good you are at hitting, high dex gives you cover bonus?) CON (toughness/wounds) INT (fuck me) WIS (maybe morale?) and CHR (probably leaders only, shits out buffs to the men at high levels)

>>51874266
>REEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!
People keep saying that, and I keep telling them that the way to win that scenario is to just accept the loss of the commander's plunder bonus and storm the city instead of waiting for it to surrender.

>>51874279
INT could be Intrigue, like what I mentioned last thread for Belisarius (having a low one, needing Justinian to back him up) and Cleopatra (having a high one, to justify her being able to seduce Caesar and Marc Anthony).

Supposed to represent their ability to politic and plot away from the battlefield, so that you might get some mileage out of paying attention to what goes on beyond pushing models around.

>>51874310
Ah, another command only stat, that's fine.
The bulk of the army would have STR, DEX, CON and Ld while the commanders get that and INT, WIS and CHR.

>>51874333
Yeah.

WIS is obviously Wisdom, but what could that be for? Charisma too. I feel like they should influence the "Meta-game" (the stuff that happens outside the battles) like INT does, but I can't think of how.

>>51874291
It's less about being beaten, and more about the Sabatonfags singing the dam song every time the use the Winged Hussar unit. I swear, they only choose the Poland faction for the meme song.

>>51874350
>but what could that be for?
Combating enemy intrigue.
>Charisma too
Something something warlord gives bonuses to models within CHR in inches, something something if he dies 2iC rolls against CHR to take over and stop your army running.

>>51874350
Maybe wisdom should be able to spot out a trap our stealthed guys
Kind of like a roll to see if you actually knew you were going to be flanked and planned a head?

>>51874380
Ah, WIS being a counter to INT is a good one, Charisma...hrm. Giving stuff in the battle bonuses would fall under LD.

I keep thinking Augustus getting the entire senate on his side and whatisname, that eunuch preventing the Emperor's palace from being burned down by Chariot-racing Hooligans by talking half the crowd down with only his wits and a bag of gold.

Feel like it should be something you need to get your decisions through in the metagame.

>>51874421
Yeah, and maybe there's a tactics system where the better tactics require a minimum INT on your warlord.

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>>51874459
Nah, tactics would fall under Ld. WIS, INT, and CHAR are for stuff that happens off the battlefield.

How far do the stats go? 1 to 6, to 10, to 20?
>>51874498
Maybe replace troops Ld with morale, and commander Ld with INT, WIS and CHR (the stats play roles on and off the field), after there's no reason you can't have a dumbass leader who everyone loves, or a ruthless bastard who's a master of strategy, so it's a bt wierd to have them both under Ld.

>>51874537
Makes sense to me. Maybe suggest an example of how it'd work?

The Emperor Justinian, for instance, for your ruthless bastard who's a master of strategy, what would his stats be?

>>51874560
Well, I'm not an expert on Byzantine rulers, but I suspect he'd have high INT, high WIS and low CHR.

>>51874605
What about the Emperor Heraclius? His big claim to fame was how the Persians had driven the Byzantines back to the walls of Constantinople, and their leader, high on his own success, sent the Emperor a letter basically mocking him, the Empire, and Jesus Christ.

He would live to regret this. Heraclius was filled with the rage of emperors past, and lead the Empire to not only smash the force attacking Constantinople, but to reclaim all the territory that the Persians had conquered.

For that "ineffectual-to-badass" type guy, what sort of stats would he have?

And should it be possible for stats to change, depending one what happens to characters throughout play?

>>51874279
>>51874310
>>51874333
>>51874350
>>51874380
>>51874423
I want D&D faggots to stay away from my game.

>>51874370
As a Polefag myself I have no clue what song you are even talking about. But then again, I'm not into metal, and as far as I recall, Sabaton is some nordic metal band.
As for the winged hussars - there is literally nothing else to use for Poland from Sail to Empire codexes, unless you want to field bunch of auxiliaries and generic western mercenaries

>>51874182
>Still salty about spending all that money on meme Aztec faction
Mesoamerican fags are the worst. Aztecs who claim to be the best faction of the game, but have hard time beating other Stone factions from their own region and get completely rolf-stomped by Stone armies from other parts of the world. Or the Mayan fags, who actually believed there will be a massive retcon of entire lore in 2012 and hyped the event into oblivion as some sort of End of All Times

>>51874686
>tfw you've never actually played D&D
>>51874663
The tides of battle might flow without the generals. In Heraclius's time the players must have forged a narrative where he switched to using more aggressive tactic which, turns out, are exactly the counter to the Persian army.

That said, someone like Basil I would definitely need multiple statlines.

>>51874782
But you are pushing shitty D&D stats, so go fucking figure how deep this cancer is.

>>51874798
Do you have any suggestions for what we could adopt instead?

>>51874798
Well, what would you use then shitposting-kun?

>>51874715
As I stated I've got nothing wrong with the Winged Hussars, because sadly Poland is a bit lacking in those codexes. However, I seem to get the faggots that just meme the living fuck out of them. As for the song, it was catchy and not bad the first time I heard it, but now I despise it and Sabaton with a passion. Fucking faggots got to ruin everything. Oh well, I mostly stay in the Bronze/Iron/and now Medieval editions, so I should hopefully not see them again. Having to deal with Spartanfags tho is a hassle..

>>51874811
>>51874812
Depends on game verion.

The Lite version of the game, comes down with to STR, DEX, INT and HP as the only stats your units can have, putting bigger focus on skills, bonuses, attributes and of course gear.

The full version meanwhile comes with STR, DEX, INT, HP and adds EDU and CHA, but only for non-grunt characters and higher tiers of workers and scientists. There is also much bigger variety of sub-stats derived from those, like Coolness Under Fire, which is probably the most important stat of all units starting with Sail codex, where the focus on firearms increases to noticable amounts and not some elite gimmick units.

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>>51874936
I see what you've done here and I like that

>>51874936
Hm. Looks good to me, well done anon.

How does Education factor into things, and what are you thinking of with regards to "workers and scientists"?

>>51874936
>a high EDU vs high EDU game plays like a giant clusterfuck of "you activated my trap card" until someone does something the other didn't expect
>High CHA vs high CHA plays like a meat grinder as buffs start to get out of hand and moral is so fuckibg high that neither army wanting to back down

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>>51874095
Macedonian Dynasty game WHEN?

>>51874988
Probably high tech, ambushing in units, back up reserves,defenses,intel
stuff like thay

>>51874988
It affects how much bonuses you can get from a single commander, and how to cram them. You know, the smart military guy, who can get better traits for his units and shit like that. Really works well in all codexes, but is literally the only stat you need for your generals up until Sail period. Forget the Charisma meme or "frontline generals". With high Education you can get game-breaking traits for entire army, without bothering with coverage range of commander. And it does make a difference is you can suddenly use Logistics rules for unit discout or the all-powrerful Professional Army bonus, which is a big thing in Bronze, Iron and especially Medieval codexes.

>>51875058
Hopefully never. Everyone got quickly tired wit hthe obnoxious Mary Sue shit going in Macedonia. One day barbarian tribes, the next one the biggest player in Greek codex. And then came Alexander expansion, which was basically "fuck you all" shit. Seriously, now in the retrospective it almost feels as if Alexander was some sort of testing ground for the Roman bullshit conquest and Logistics tables.

>>51875227
>Logistics tables
How would those work?

>>51875227
Read the fluff, you dingus.

He's talking about Byzantine codexes.

>>51875286
They make point cost of your units lower, depending on how good your logistics are faction-wide, with specific commander and other shit. If it's combined with horde rules, you can end up with absurdly large armies for a point limit that normally would allow to get maybe a single elite and a bunch of screen for it made of basic units of your faction. Try it with Steppe Nomads codex, it's half of the fun, especially with Mongol faction.

>>51875354
>Byzantine
>It's like Rome, but in Greece!
I blame Hollywood for this

>>51875402
Uh-huh. That'd explain why good logistics are so important in the modern codices, what with most of the units having super-high points costs.

>>51875425
>thinking that the Byzantines are just a carbon copy of Rome

Confirmed for not even having read the supplements.

How would levy units function, as opposed to professional forces?

Scrub here. All of this sounds interesting, but what exactly is Spear of War?

>>51876488
Started as something like Chapter Master, where we'd tell stories of our experiences playing this cool historical tabletop game.

Now, we're actually trying to homebrew some rules for it, make an actual system.

>>51876249
Points buy you Rolls modified by recruiter charisma to determine how many you can muster. Also, serious attacker/defender situational modifiers.

Anon no

The thread was good, but don't force it

You can't relive the past.

Let the meme go

So any word about the Trade Republic expansion? I've heard there are plans to make some guys called "doges". I mean... for real? Meme dog for a leader? In SoW?

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>>51875058
How much morale damage should he give against bulgars?

>>51881612
None. He just provides his troops with flat +1 to rolls when facing Bulgars

So I imagine it would be a wargame, but one permanently keyed for campaigns?
Also, I suggest we start with making a basic ruleset for cavemen slogging it out (the original edition of SoW: Stone as it were).
Thogg tribe best tribe.

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>>51881959
>Best tribe
>Not just Maori

>>51881926
How about he give Bulgars -2 sight?

>>51874095
What the fuck is this hit historical wargame I've never heard of?

>>51877084
I never knew I wanted this until now

How would marriage alliances work?

>>51883403
Strictly background material to justify the alliance rubrics.

>>51883673
Hrm. But then you wouldn't be able to get stuff like ending the third crusade via tying Richard and Saladin's kingdoms together, and I'd like to think that'd make a really neat third option for the players to take, if they can actually forge an alliance and make it hold together.

What would a chariot racer stats be like?

How should Demes riots and hulliganism be handled?

>>51883744
You mean as in, chariot races blues vs greens Nika riots half of constantinople burned down?

Or something else?

>>51883766
Sorta random encounter-type things that you have to put down?

You know, you get a small amount of elite troops and your faction leaders (whoever's in the relevant city, anyway) against a big swarm of low-cost, low-damage infantry (peasants/rioters).

>>51883767
The burn the capital of my empire up, kind

>>51883728
The 'Spear' in spear of war doesn't refer to your dick, anon.

>>51883829
No?

Can I not forge alliances and shatter empires with it, as a regular man might use a mere cudgel?

>>51883902
A game built for front line combat and having a gang skirmish expansions has little room for suck cockery. Maybe some kind of warcrimes related moral bonus after a city sacking scenario in a campaign narrative.

Really though, that kind of thing is best left to the fluff authors so we can get back to the good stuff. Tactical Studies, not your cyoa slash-fic wank fest.

>>51883996
Slash-fic?

You stupid bastard, I didn't mean Richard and Saladin get married, I mean Richard's sister marries Saladin's brother, like what they considered historically.

Besides, I think that the tactical arena stuff would be considerably disjointed without having some kind of risk-style metagame to tie it together.

>>51884058
>Besides, I think that the tactical arena stuff would be considerably disjointed without having some kind of risk-style metagame to tie it together.

The meta-game happens in the background.

You follow the linked scenarios like in Fireball Forward.

>>51884099
>The meta-game happens in the background.
Meaning you actually play that or not?

>>51884058
>like what they considered historically.
Just because there's a sidebar in the fluff doesn't mean you should let the game support anti-canonical results at the grand strategic scale.

Why would we want to invalidate the fluff of the dozens of supplements for late eras just for your interracial marriage wank?

>>51884124
>Meaning you actually play that or not?
Not.

>>51884133
Well, for one thing, I doubt the alliance would last for very long after one or the other of the kings had died, but fine, fair enough.

Might be you could run that as a AU scenario or something.

>>51884182
>AU scenario or something.
I heard they like to do those a con's so people don't meta-game so much.

>>51884144
That'd render a lot of the stats we've been coming up with as useless, though.

Besides, I like the idea of being able to politic with the best of them as the Emperor Augustus or something.

Now that I think about it, this is why anon was talking about there being Lite and Full versions of the game.

Someone really needs to start writing this down.

>>51884261
>That'd render a lot of the stats we've been coming up with as useless, though.
What stat are you referring to that not scaling the game to include macro dynastic marriages would invalidate?

>>51884299
Hrm, I was thinking of INTrigue, but now that I think about it the anons seem to have moved away from that way of thinking.

Very well, no dynastic marriages.

>>51884379
>INTrigue

Here I thought this was a stat about more local factors and related to some pre-deployment tables about how well you knew the enemy dispositions and what versions of the deployment zones you had access to. Could you delay some units and force them into reserves. divert and redirect reserve units and shit. Cause ammo shortages. Pay off mercenary troops and junk.

Also as a partial counter to some of that stuff. Int vs. int roll for deployment zone extensions for scout and flank units?

>>51884424
That would work, actually.

We need to decide what we've agreed on so far so that I can write it all down.

What would the stats for a soldier of the tagmata be like?

>>51886509
Well, what was special about them? Why did they stand out from the peasant rabble?

>>51887626
because they were professional soldiers.

>>51889863
Well, probably significantly higher INT than peasants, because these guys actually know what to do with regards to carving people up.

I'd say a HP of 3, for the whole unit, because of their better gear...

Unsure of how STR and DEX could factor into it.

Could be that STR should be replaced with something representing the quality of their weapons.

Strike more of a difference between professional and primitive armies, that way.

>>51874095
Just play DBA/DBM and then add stuff as you like. No need to reinvent the wheel.

>>51894144
I was going to suggest this last thread, but it kind of breaks down when you get to the expansions with gun powder.