Oh fuck it's Hindu Mythology

Unless your players are well-versed in Hindu mythology, it ain't gonna matter.

Just go full gonzo and don't look back.

>>51772225
>Hindu versions of Gods, angels and demons? Spirits? Fey?

I'm not an expert so I won't try to tell you what's what, but I have tried to learn about non-Western mythologies before. The biggest thing to do is throw out equivalencies. There will be things that fit archetypes you know, but there will also be some that don't. Don't look for them, you'll just get confused.

>>51772225
You should contact K6BD's author, cause theyre working on an official tabletop and last I heard was struggling to find a beta for it.

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>>51772274
That's a good point, I was just hoping to find something I was familiar with I could use as a kind of bridge into the unknown. Right now I'm struggling with the fact that each god (are there are thousands) has multiple versions, some which are other, separate gods. And again, anything I could point to and say "that's a fucking nature spirit" would help me begin to parse through this

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>>51772377
The game is struggling in general. It's just not fleshed out enough and the system doesn't really work for the setting like it should. I'm sure it works in Abaddon's mind because he knows the whole setting inside and out, but for the people who are still learning about it it doesn't really fit.

>>51772225
Brahma the all in one and one in all. Basically all gods are just expressions of one divine being.

Three primary deities that represent the cycle of karma. Brahminh the creator, Vishnu the preserver and Shiva the destroyer.

Popular other deities were mortals who became expressions of the big three through spiritual enlightenment (Krishna ect.)

Local and family deities are also a thing, usually powerful individuals in the regions passed deified by the populace ( acceptable and because of the Hindu concept of Brahma where all gods and e expressions of divine)

Karma is always central to faith because every life is assigned purpose by birth and you only climb the ladder by preforming you duty til death.
The goal is to accumulate enough Karma to become reborn as a deity (or come to the conclusion everything is a fragment of the divine). The death of ego.

>>51772401
>Right now I'm struggling with the fact that each god (are there are thousands) has multiple versions, some which are other, separate gods.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu_views_on_monotheism

Read Mahabharata and Ramayana. This should give you all the information you need.

>>51772225
>Gods
Devas. Suras. The most important ones are Vishnu/Krishna, Shiva and Shakti and all of her different forms as Durga, Kali, Parvati, Mahishasuramardhini. The creater Brahma isn't really that important when it comes to worship. Though there may be millions of gods for every little shitty village may have its own god.
>angels
Skip that. Or maybe Gandharvas and Apsaras.
>demons
Asuras.
>Spirits? Fey?
Gandharvas, Nagas, Yakshas.

>>51772481
>Shakti and all of her different forms as Durga, Kali, Parvati, Mahishasuramardhini.

This is one of those things that varies between denominations I think. Shakti does not always equal the Tridevi

>What are the Hindu versions of Gods, angels and demons?

Trying to pigeon-hole beings from one mythology into very specific roles in another mythology does tend to result in confusion, misunderstandings and utter failure.

In lieu of research, play Asura's Wrath

>>51772419
So Brahminh, Vishnu, and Shiva are all still Brahma right? I can understand that
I'm interested in regular joes becoming deities though. Obviously irl if a village decides someone is a god then the person's only power is what the village decides is a god-like, but still human, attribute of the person. But in mythology are there many instances of mortal-grown gods?
>>51772481
Thank you, this gives me something familiar to work with and google. I know trying to affix western labels like "fey" and "angel" won't work, but anything that's recognizable as a "being who inhabits forests" or "superpowered servant of the divine" is at least in my wheelhouse

You can also check Scion : The Game about the Deva pantheon

http://scion-dayone. wikidot. com/pantheon:devas

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Watch yourself some fucking sinbad

>>51772761
>I'm interested in regular joes becoming deities though.

That's not how it works.

>>51772885
Ah, okay then, I was going off of what
>>51772419 said
>Popular other deities were mortals who became expressions of the big three through spiritual enlightenment (Krishna ect.)

But again, I'm still in the google stage and trying to organize all this

>>51772885
Actually it is.
Gods are just members of the great karmic cycle like the rest of us.

If you are an exemplar as a mortal you will become a deity.

The goal is not to be in the cycle at all and become one with Brahman again (or realize you were never separate to begin with).

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>>51772225
Fuck if I know OP, just make a western setting and slap the Hindu look over everything, your players won't know the difference

>>51773015
The deity is still the same deity. You get the chance to be "reborn" in heaven as Vishnu for instance, but Vishnu will still be Vishnu.
Fun fact: a shooting star is a person being reborn on earth, who was a deity before.

>>51772271
Someone post that youtube video of a British comedian explaining why he do Christians jokes and never Muslim jokes.

Interesting fact is that villans in the epics like Ramayana are not clear cut evil. Ravana was known to be a very learned scholar and patron of the arts as well as an ardent devotee of Shiva I believe. In fact, his faith and devotion allowed him to receive a boon from him as is often the case in Hindu myth where proper religious observence will have the gods offer stuff to you (like becoming immune to all forms of damage)

>>51773125
Yeah, you can become a deity but you'll just be a new version of an old deity. New deities don't really happen.

>>51773149
That's actually a really cool villain. Educated and blessed with divine power. Just out of curiosity, what the hell made him a villain then? Just the fact that he was opposed to the protagonists?

>>51773015
Buddhism is similar as well, except they don't believe that you should wait on the karmic cycle to elevate you but you should instead strive to find enlightenment in one lifetime.

They also reject the castes and the teleology of human existence. Claiming life isn't created for specific purpose but propagated through ego an desire which deludes them into ends.

Also Buddhism is agnostic for the most part and doesn't focus on cosmology as much as
ameliorating suffering.
The goal being to literally become nothing rather than part of everything again.

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>>51772225
the only thing you need to know about Hindu mythology is that Sivetri Devi did nothing wrong and that adolf hitler was the rebirth of Kalki the Avenger champion of Vishnu

>>51773125
No you are Vishnu and Vishnu is you, and I am you and you are me and we are that cat.

We are expressions of the same thing, that's the truth.

>>51773221
Buddhism gets subverted into local religions though. Like Chinese folk religion has Buddha being higher than it's original pantheon of gods but still existing alongside them.

>>51772481
I thought angels were roughly (emphasis on roughly) equivalent to Devas. How wrong am I?

>>51773257
So in the hindu mindset, conflict is one being fighting with itself?

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Watever you do, your setting needs Vimanas

>>51773221
>Also Buddhism is agnostic for the most part and doesn't focus on cosmology as much as
Only in its early stages. Later on veneration and praying to different forms of bodhisattvas becomes common.

>>51773206

Because he kidnapped Rama's girl. There might be other reasons but thats the one that stands out to me, that and killing his buddy Garuda who was protecting her.

>>51773273
Buddhism is extremely expansionistic, like Christianity and Islam.

People interpret it different ways but the original teaching are the same.

By nature of being agnostic, Buddhism isn't atheist so people just inserted Buddha where ever was most comfortable. Making him divine in some cases.

>>51773221
>The goal being to literally become nothing rather than part of everything again
That always struck me as some sort of cult of annihilation, though.

>>51773287
Yes

What they didn't tell you ITT is that (minor) gods can also go a step down when reincarnating.

They too need to learn their Dharma.

Just to shove an elephant into the room: to what extent does Kirkbride's description of CHIM and Amaranth correspond to Hindu theology?

>>51773343
>That always struck me as some sort of cult of annihilation, though.

It's more like extinguishing the ego, which is the only thing that ties you to the cycle. The truth is you don't exist but for the belief of your existence.

"I think therefore, I am" is actually kinda accurate.

>>51773316
Believing those Mahayana pig farmers.

"Buddha was divine and he will hand enlightenment out like candy when the time is right."

Sick, they missed the whole point of the path.

>>51773443
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moksha
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalpa_(aeon)

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>>51773315
>Vimāna is a mythological flying palace or chariot described in Hindu texts and Sanskrit epics. The Pushpaka Vimana of the demon king Ravana is the most famous

Ah, so a flying fortress. Very nice.

LORD OF LIGHT
I
G
H
T

>>51772419
>>51772761
>So Brahminh, Vishnu, and Shiva are all still Brahma right?
Yes. Analogous to the Holy Trinity. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are all extensions/forms of the same God.

>>51772401
>Right now I'm struggling with the fact that each god (are there are thousands) has multiple versions, some which are other, separate gods.
Ever heard of the father, son and holy spirit?

>>51772225
Hindu mythology is metal as fuck. All I know about it is Gilgamesh, and I'm not talking about that blonde slut with the red body paint either.

>>51772225
IMO the best way to get into Hindu mythology is just to read stuff. And I don't mean wiki pages.

As >>51772454 points out, the Ramayana and Mahabharata are a great starting point. There are some very accessible translations available, and reading about it in this way is a lot more digestible than by trying to memorize some dry wiki descriptions.

Also keep in mind that "Hindu mythology" isn't one monolithic, internally consistent system. There are a lot of stories and different regions traditionally tell them in different ways, so if you're just absorbing all information you can find regardless of the source, you'll have a hard time making sense of it.

>>51773598
You might want to also include Hindu nukes and other stuff:
http://www.crystalinks.com/vimana.html

Note that unlike Vimanas themselves, half of this is made-up pseudohistory and doesn't appear in Hindu texts, but still cool for Hindu inspired fantasy.

>>51772225
Thread theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynRD5fOncFg&index=68&list=WL

>>51772761
>I'm interested in regular joes becoming deities though
An important distinction between eastern and western religions is that when you become a deity, it is not because you were judged by another to be fit for it, or because of the power you "draw" from supplicants, but it's a completely natural consequence of being a very powerful and unfiltered representation of something.

An average joe who becomes a god is someone who ends up stumbling upon insight into the workings of the cosmos that most people are not privy to, or who has such a strong character and strength of conviction that he becomes THE symbol of that conviction.

Like everyone else is saying, you have to remember that in hinduism existence itself is symbolic, so the stronger the symbol the more deific it is.

One thing I like about Hindu mythology is how to become a supervillain.
>be a super nice guy
>like seriously super nice and generous and holy and shit
>deity notices you
>"hey you're a cool dude, here's some superpowers as a reward"
>suddenly become evil
>"oh shit what the fuck"
>no takebacks allowed
>gotta reincarnate Vishnu as a superhero again to kill the faggot

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>>51772225

You realise there's 7 overlapping planes to existence right? And each plane is the exact same space but only certain types of creatures can see ones near their plane of existence?

So people can see animals and asuras, and animals can see people and ghosts, and ghosts can see animals and those suffering in hell, and the asuras can only see the devas and people.

So that's basically the core heirarchy:
Devas
>extremely powerful, don't get ill, live longest, don't suffer, but accumulate too much nice karma and are likely to be reborn much lower down the chain
Asuras
>quite powerful, some suffering, live longer than humans, still prone to accumulating too much "nice" karma and getting reborn lower.
Humans
>quite a bit of suffering, live longer than animals, not that powerful, have equal chance of accumulating good or bad karma and going either directions up the chain
Animals
>quite a bit of suffering, some have shorter lives than humans, some longer, karma is again pretty even and thus reincarnation is a crap shoot
Pretas
>Hungry dead, constant suffering, constant hunger but have various difficulties eating or drinking due to small mouths/throats, food catching fire as they eat, food and drink diminishing before they can have any etc.., live longer than humans do, likely to accumulate "bad" karma and get bumped up the chain, but can also learn magic and be wicked to animals and even humans and thus go underground in their next life
Narakas
>nothing but suffering. Underground, pain, hellish, live almost as long as devas do in their suffering, pain and suffering builds up "bad" karma that tends to get them reincarnated up the chain.

one hting to note, you know how people and animals vary quite a bit? that holds true for all the levels of being, so pretas and devas and asuras can be as varied as animals or humans in how they exactly work.

>>51773895
So, as I understand it, if let's say you were a really good farmer, and you farmed the fuck out of this patch of land, and through farming this patch of land discovered a secret about perseverance, you could become deified? With like, the hoe as your symbol? What might that look like, when you're suddenly deified?

>>51774026
Gods of agriculture are hardly a rare thing.

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>>51773598
>flying fortress

HELLO

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>>51774026
>>51774059

Though usually their symbols are general agricultural tools rather than just one specific one, with maybe a star or something to symbolise the way astrology is involved in timing when to sow and harvest your crops.

>>51774063
This is a flying fortress, that's a white elephant.

>>51774012
This is awesome, thank you. You mentioned only certain planes of existence can perceive each other. What might interactions between them look like? I know how animals and humans interact with each other, but how might humans and asuras? or Asuras and Devas? Pretas and Narakas? Or do all revolve around interactions with humans?

>>51772866
My melanin enhanced brother.

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Asuras are so awesome, take Rakshasa for example:
>A Rakshasa (Sanskrit: rākṣasa) is a mythological being in Hindu mythology. As this mythology influenced other religions, the rakshasa was later incorporated into Buddhism. Rakshasas are also called 'maneaters' (Nri-chakshas, Kravyads). A female rakshasa is known as a Rakshasi. A female Rakshasa in human form is a Manushya-Rakshasi. The terms Asura and Rakshasa are sometimes used interchangeably.
>Rakshasas were most often depicted as ugly, fierce-looking and enormous creatures, with two fangs protruding from the top of the mouth and having sharp, claw-like fingernails. They are shown as being mean, growling like beasts, and as insatiable cannibals that could smell the scent of human flesh. Some of the more ferocious ones were shown with flaming red eyes and hair, drinking blood with their palms or from a human skull (similar to representations of vampires in later Western mythology). Generally they could fly, vanish, and had Maya (magical powers of illusion), which enabled them to change size at will and assume the form of any creature. The female equivalent of rakshasa is rakshasi.

All the pictures make them look like fucking tigers, which makes sense because that's what ancient indians were terrified of

>>51774262
I meant to link this post with
>>51774012
To demonstrate this anon's point about how varied Asuras are

>In the world of the Ramayana and Mahabharata, Rakshasas were a populous race. There were both good and evil rakshasas, and as warriors they fought alongside the armies of both good and evil. They were powerful warriors, expert magicians and illusionists. As shape-changers, they could assume different physical forms. It was not always clear whether they had a true or natural form.[citation needed] As illusionists, they were capable of creating appearances which were real to those who believed in them or who failed to dispel them. Some of the rakshasas were said to be man-eaters, and made their gleeful appearance when the slaughter on a battlefield was at its worst. Occasionally they served as rank-and-file soldiers in the service of one or another warlord.

Aside from its treatment of unnamed rank-and-file Rakshasas, the epics tell the stories of certain members of the "race" who rose to prominence, some of them as heroes, most of them as villains.

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>>51774298
As with all ancient indian art, sometimes heroes are blue and green because fuck you

>>51773958
kek

But why would you send Vishnu instead of Shiva? They're both warrior gods right? And do you always got special summon, sorry, reincarnate him when you need a god to get shit done?

>>51774461
Shiva is the destroyer. Vishnu is the protector.

>>51774334
The myths describe evryone as having outrageous skin colors during the other eras (yuga). It is only because we are now in the kali yuga that men have limited skin colors.

From the william buck translation of ramayana:
"Rama had more energy than the sun and a deep voice. He had colorful green eyes; his skin was cool soft green and so smooth even dust would not cling to him; his wavy hair was dark green; he walked like a lion; the soles of his feet were flat and marked with Dharma wheels...

Lakshama was of golden skin and measureless strength...

Prince Bharata was born with red skin and rosy eyes and fiery hair red as flame. His brother Satrughna had dark blue skin and black hair...

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>>51775030
oh that I could paddle back through time and delight myself in the company and pleasures of blue-skinned women

>>51772415
I'd love to see this game come to fruition, but until then I'll stick to high level Pathfinder, no PC limits.

It fits surprisingly well.

>>51775794

Nah, what you actually want is to reskin Exalted.

Not even joking, it's literally Rammanayanna: the game anyway.

>>51777363
>Exalted
I'll give it a shot. Next time I run a Throne campaign I'll bring it up and see what the party thinks.

>>51772481
Rakshasas are demons too, the term is sometimes even used interchangiably with Asura.

>>51773206
This is rather comon.
Karna was a villain in the Mahabharata and yet he is reveared as a symbol of valor, friendship and honestity.
In fact he is a villain because one of his friends was a villain and he decided to stick with his friend and fuck everyone else.

>>51772225
I'm found of the Rigveda, specially if you use some other details and imagery from the Puranas and the Ramayana.

>>51774461
Vishnu's job is preserving the world.
He is the one who needs to come here and clean the mess

I love this mythology, and I want to translate it into a game of D&D 5e.

I want to use 5e because it's the system I and my players know best.

>>51777707
Karna is fucking great.
>so it turns out you're the eldest Pandava but were abandoned at birth
>come back and we'll make you king and you'll get the girl that rejected you
>yeah nah fuck you mom I'm still gonna kill Arjuna

>>51773759
>Gilgamesh
>Hindu

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>>51772225
i got you nigger

Can someone explain karma to me? I have only a base level understanding of it. Good karma, bad karma, it's like good boy points, right? Following the cosmic law nets good boy points to reincarnate into a better life next time? Bad karma is netted for not following cosmic law, puts you lower on the pole?

>>51774262
Most settings have these buggers and they make for awesome big bads. Their propensity for illusions makes them perfect for the deception and betrayal kinda narratives.
Any one know where that whole backwards hands thing came from? Don't know why but that was always a rather unsettling aspect of em for me.

>>51773895
The mortal-become-gods in my settings pantheon work like that.

>>51772225
I won't pretend these are actually acurate depictions of hindu mythology, but they do show how to use it for a fun story.

http://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Grant-Morrison-s-18-Days-2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIxGfs8TTQg